Mountain Cog
Hosted by an enthusiast and a mountain bike industry expert featuring laughter and passionate guests.
Mountain Cog
082 - 30 Second Dance Party: seeding a passion for mountain biking and building confidence in adolescent girls and women. (Dr. Jody Bartz)
Dr. Jody Bartz is Founder and Executive Director of Gro Girl Gro a non-profit with a mission to INCREASE the number of girls and young women who BELIEVE they are capable and strong athletes and outdoor leaders through safe and supported outdoor experiences.
Additionally, Jody offers connection-based mountain bike skills, endurance, and strength coaching to women and men through the Sonoran Endurance Sports Academy.
Jody got her PhD in Special Education, Family Studies, & Human Development from the University of Arizona. She is an ambassador for Liv Cycling. She is a L1 BICP Certified Bike Instructor and an L3 USA Cycling Certified Coach. She’s a single speeder and endurance athlete. She is a mountain bike guide with Tanque Verde Ranch resort. She founded and coached for 4 years a NICA mountain bike team in Flagstaff, AZ. Her catch phrase: take the space. Her pet peeve: ‘trail Chads’ that say ‘atta girl’.
We last chatted with Jody in Episode 29 when Gro Girl Gro was just starting out. She has amazing energy and an unwavering drive for empowering women and young girls, helping them increase their confidence, and bringing them into the sport of mountain biking. We always learn much from Jody… and this episode is no exception.
Gro Girl Gro
Web: https://www.grogirlgro.org/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/grogirlgro/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/grogirlgro
Sonoran Endurance Sports Academy
https://www.sonoranendurance.com/
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30 second dance party seconds of your life too. Your girls love it is, it's still going, it's still going.
Magellan (Josh):Yeah, all right, I, I gotta no wait, you gotta wait, it's still going. If you're not dancing, we can't stop. Okay, should I get up and dance? Okay, it's all right, all right, we're done dancing all right, this one's for you, jody, this one's Okay. How do you know when a man is about to say something smart?
Dr. Jody Batz:He opens his, oh, he shuts his mouth. I don't know.
The Guru (Dane):He starts the sentence with a woman just told me or a woman once told me I screwed up the punchline. That's okay, it still worked. You shouldn't have said anything. Nobody would have known Exactly.
Magellan (Josh):All right. Today we have a return guest from episode 29, jodi Bartz. I'm going to tell you a little bit about Jodi Bartz. Jodi is a longtime educator, a passionate advocate for disability. She's got two autistic nephews. She's got a PhD in special education, family studies and human development from the University of Arizona. She's been a guide with Tanque Verde Ranch. She established and coached for four years a new team, a new NICA team in Flagstaff. She's an L1 BICP certified bike instructor. She is an L3 USA cycling certified coach. She's an ambassador for Lyft Cycling. She's a coach with Sonoran Endurance. She is an endurance athlete, a single speeder. Her catchphrase is take the space. Her pet peeves are at a girl. She's the founder and executive director of Go Girl Girl. How'd I do?
Dr. Jody Batz:Damn.
Magellan (Josh):That was good. Holy crap, that's a pretty awesome resume.
The Guru (Dane):It is that's a pretty awesome resume it is. I'm still reading it.
Magellan (Josh):So a little bit about GROW GIRL. Grow, first of all. The acronym stands for Gathering and Recreating Outdoors. Learning to Give Back and Be Responsible and Take Ownership. 100% Yep. Responsible and take ownership 100% Yep.
Magellan (Josh):And their mission is to increase the number of girls and young women in Tucson, vail and the surrounding areas who believe they're capable and strong athletes and outdoor leaders through safe and supported outdoor experiences. And their challenge is. By age 14, girls are dropping out of sports at twice the rate of boys. Girls have fewer outdoor opportunities than boys. Girls experience bullying, discrimination and social isolation more than boys. Girls lack strong, confident female athletes and role models.
Dr. Jody Batz:It's a big problem.
The Guru (Dane):Yeah.
Magellan (Josh):It is a big problem.
The Guru (Dane):It's weird, though. I totally agree with that. However, I'm just coming off a week of Olympics Right, and the girls are kicking ass.
Dr. Jody Batz:Totally Big time.
Magellan (Josh):I know, aren't they? I kind of feel like the Olympics is a level set. I feel just as strongly about the male sports as I do about the female sports.
The Guru (Dane):Is that normal? Or is that just Josh? I don't know. I just keep seeing all of the women. No joke, the one shot put guy, he's cool because I, I feel like we share a body type and then, uh right, and then. But like simone, and like, uh god, I can't even remember her name, but the cyclist, she's awesome. What about the french? What about?
Magellan (Josh):the French mountain biker who crushed it on a.
The Guru (Dane):Pinarello hardtail. I know he did, yeah, she, oh, no, hardtail. Okay, so I watched one race, not Pitcock.
Magellan (Josh):He did it on a full suspension.
The Guru (Dane):Oh did he? She did it on a hardtail. That course was crazy too.
Magellan (Josh):There's a three-foot drop in that course. She did it on a the course was crazy Lady crush yeah. Yeah, I mean shout out to the Pink Bike Podcast. If you go back a couple episodes, they interview Pinarello. I mean Pinarello designed those bikes specifically for the Olympics but for racing yeah, those are race bikes. Yeah. And they talked about her decisions coming up to what bike she was going to choose. And he chose the full suspension. She chose the hardtail.
The Guru (Dane):I can't imagine doing that course on a hardtail I know I, I saw that course and as a like a downhiller, I was like damn, because we used to make fun of the cross-country people, because it's like it's just a bunch of roadies, you know, riding their bikes and they they don't need to have much skill, they just need to have fitness. And downhillers are like the opposite. We're kind of round and and heavy and we go down real fast but nothing scares us.
Magellan (Josh):I'm not sure I could have cleared that course. It was insane.
The Guru (Dane):Some of those lines and they were changing lines. There wasn't one set line.
Magellan (Josh):Jody, how are you doing today?
Dr. Jody Batz:I'm doing excellent. My favorite besides, of course, all the rad women is Poma Horse Dude.
Magellan (Josh):I don't know what that is. What is that you?
Dr. Jody Batz:don't know the USA men's Olympic team. They had one guy who is the specialist.
Magellan (Josh):Is this hobby horsing? No, no, no, I'm totally going to do hobby horsing I am totally into that.
Dr. Jody Batz:I think we need to bring it to Tucson.
The Guru (Dane):Is this the two handles in the middle?
Dr. Jody Batz:Yeah, the pommel horse.
Magellan (Josh):And there was a guy that I don't even know what a pommel horse is. Oh my God, you need to go Google it.
The Guru (Dane):It's the thing with the two handles and they do like everything, usually with just their arms, and they're swinging their arms.
Magellan (Josh):Is it a horse? No, they just call that cause they put their.
The Guru (Dane):They straddle it from time to time.
Magellan (Josh):Is this a gymnastic thing? Yeah, it is Okay. Okay, so it's like the. It's a flat bar with, like, two handles on it.
Dr. Jody Batz:Right, but it's a. It's more than a bar I'm in.
The Guru (Dane):I just didn't know what it was called. Yeah, and they've always got pointy feet, so Well cause they're in like a Snuggie thing. A Snuggie Snuggie, that would be awesome, like a onesie. Is that the Olympic Snuggie?
Magellan (Josh):this is probably the first time that anyone's ever called it a snuggie. Oh my god you guys asked me back so it's our fault yes, I'm gonna go tonight, later tonight, so tell us about the hobby horse, we cut you off. No, it's not the hobby horse, it's the pommel horse.
Dr. Jody Batz:Dude, it's totally it's gone now it's gone just google pommel horse, dude pommel horse dude he nailed it and like usa brought home metal and all this good stuff, like that's, all he does is pommel horse, yeah, and so he's called like the specialist and and he's super cool yeah, the only other guy.
The Guru (Dane):Yeah, I know of that I can think of from my I I'm not super into the olympics, like I'm not watching all day long yeah, it's the, the, the guy from turkey that shoots.
Magellan (Josh):So oh yeah that guy. Was he really shooting with a cigarette? I don't think so.
The Guru (Dane):I think they're photoshopping that in, but he did have his hand in his back pocket and he didn't use like any apparatuses, and so that's, I think, what everybody was like chiming in on.
Magellan (Josh):But man the memes I know, so uh, jody what's new in your orbit these days?
Dr. Jody Batz:I got a new bike what'd you get oh?
Magellan (Josh):yeah, a live devote gravel bike is that the one you wrote over here is the?
Dr. Jody Batz:one I wrote, and I wrote it, yes, through the veil vortex, which didn't look new, it looked dirty well that's.
Magellan (Josh):That's like how a bike's supposed to look. Right, that's proper all right it is.
Dr. Jody Batz:I know my husband's like you put a freaking frame bag on that thing. I'm like it's a gravel bike, like yeah, it needs to go places so yeah, so I got.
Magellan (Josh):I got a new bike yeah and uh, oh, and he started this non-profit and all that good stuff oh yeah but you know, oh yeah, just that little thing yeah, it's a little thing, so, um so, tell us how things are going. So when we had you in February of 23, it was the last time we talked to you. You were like soft launching grow, girl, grow at that time. Um, how's it been going?
Dr. Jody Batz:You said we have an hour.
Magellan (Josh):Leave as long as you want.
Dr. Jody Batz:So um yeah, I know it's crazy to think um that I was getting ready to soft launch and kick it off in February 2023. I did four weeks, had a small group of families and girls just to try out logistics and kind of get a feel for the program. Since then, we have served 77 girls through programming.
Magellan (Josh):So what does it mean to serve girls? We may have some new listeners that didn't hear that earlier episode. So what does it mean to serve? I know I'm so. I'm so close to it so like pull me out of the forest a little bit and kind of keep me, you know, I'll pull you up.
Dr. Jody Batz:Exactly so. Grow, girl, grow, um is gathering and recreating outdoors. Girls learn how to give back, be responsible and take ownership. So while we are not a mountain bike club, we're mountain bike centric because mountain bikes are cool and it's really awesome to see girls out on mountain bikes. We are outdoor centric and while we're not a race team, I fully support girls that do want to race because that definitely falls under the taking responsibility and taking ownership of maybe their grades and their training and those kinds of things. But Grow, grow, grow is the after-school program and during the school year we meet.
Dr. Jody Batz:For what we landed on through the course of over 18 months is six-week programs with what we call seven adventures. So we meet once a week on, let's say, a Wednesday or or something, uh, for about three hours and then at the end of that six weeks we have a Saturday adventure where the girls all get together and we generally go hike or we go do something. So six weeks, seven adventures. Um, three or four of those adventures are on mountain bikes. Um, they, they, by proxy get um mountain bike skill instruction. So safety first, I mean, really I mean, and then the parents most certainly appreciate that. Um, we generally hike one of those days, then we are off bike and we are giving back, generally through trail stewardship.
Magellan (Josh):So what does it mean for trails? What does trail stewardship mean?
Dr. Jody Batz:Right, so it's, uh, it's, it's young girls wielding trail tools, sharp trail tools which is fricking awesome because, um, in the past I had partnered with um, the Arizona trail association, and Tasha with the Arizona trail association just really fell in love with our program and it was really rad to see a woman come out and teach these girls how to use these tools and safety. First they've got hard hats on, they've got gloves on and they're out there actually maintaining trail. And then we also, we. So we mountain bike three or four times, we hike, we give back to the trails and then we always support a local business. Admittedly, I lean into woman-owned businesses here in tucson.
Dr. Jody Batz:Right, we've done everything from um go to joni b's and learn about skin care and actually you know we give ourselves like a little facial massage and learn how to how to take care of our skin to roots. Yoga has come and done private yoga sessions for us. We've gone to Homestretch Foundation. So just really supporting the rad ladies in the community.
Magellan (Josh):How do you recruit the girls? Do you go to local schools and recruit those Like? What's your process for recruiting? You know?
Dr. Jody Batz:what I actually haven't done a lot of recruiting. When I first launched the program, I was relatively small and I needed to stop saying I only work with four or five girls. I took the only out of that Um, we're we're a society that's conditioned to shrink down as women and say I'm only working with four or five girls, and I took the only away and and I'm been really proud of, like, the depth of relationship, because I'm not just working with the girls, I'm working with their entire family. I've connected families to um, help, carpool and those kinds of things. Um, but it's been through word of mouth actually. So, and then the good old Instagram and the good old social media piece of it. What's super exciting is to see it grow in every pun intended. Um for example.
Dr. Jody Batz:So grow, girl, grow is the parent organization, I call it the mothership. Um, and that's the afterschool programming. And then last summer, um, I didn't want to just sit idly by, I uh cause we don't ride a lot Like outdoors is a little rough in the summertime.
Dr. Jody Batz:Right. Well, it's either like 4am or 5. Or 5 am, or it's at night and, shocking, like tween and teen girls didn't want to get up and meet me at the trailhead at 5 am. I don't know what the problem was, but when I tossed out the idea of riding bikes at night, girls jumped at it, so that became Shine, girl Shine, and that was like every connotation around girls shining, but also mountain biking you know, at night and using lights and whatnot and so last summer I had six girls all summer long that I rode with and taught them how none of them had been night mountain bike riding before, or if they had very, very limited experience and and uh, and so we we had six girls had a great time.
Dr. Jody Batz:This summer I had 17 girls, nice yeah. So, like, do do the math real quick. That's a lot, and so do you have?
Magellan (Josh):do you have other adults that are helping?
Dr. Jody Batz:I do. I started um grow girl, grow with one female woman, volunteer one, and I did Ashley.
Magellan (Josh):No, actually it wasn't, it was justine okay, so just like call, are you calling out ashley that she needs to help?
Dr. Jody Batz:yeah, ashley is a volunteer, she's awesome.
The Guru (Dane):Yeah, she should work harder. Yeah, she'll probably like that.
Dr. Jody Batz:I said that actually, dane dane said that jody did not um, but I started with one volunteer and um, I did not do any recruiting, just through the good old socials and and word of mouth, women started reaching out to me and started asking what is this like, girl, girl, girl, like what? What is it that you're doing? How can I help? And so I now have, at last count, I have 17, 17 or 18 women on my volunteer coach list, which is pretty freaking fantastic.
Dr. Jody Batz:And so I feel like I'm not tapping out one particular volunteer all the time. They all get like the spreadsheet blasted to them and I'm like fill in your name where you can so you know, and I'm like I can pay you with a sticker and a smile and some snacks.
Dr. Jody Batz:You know that's what I got to offer you. But the beautiful thing is, every single volunteer coach, um, just through the organic nature of it, um, I haven't had to do any explaining like this is what we do, like they have come to it organically and they love what I'm doing and so it's it's just really cool to watch. So, yeah, I give them kind of the rundown or like this is the process and you know my PhD, you're going to have a little procedure and whatnot.
The Guru (Dane):I mean, but it's, but it's safety.
Dr. Jody Batz:You know safety things, but it's like okay, you two are going to do the bike checks and this is how I do the bike checks and you know this. But then is that their responsibility, so I get to interface with the families and they're connecting with the girls and doing all those cool things. So it's pretty awesome.
The Guru (Dane):Yeah, Jilly did this.
Magellan (Josh):Oh, she did. Yeah, my two nieces did as well.
The Guru (Dane):Yes, yeah, and she just blossomed as a writer. Because you know she doesn't want to listen to me, I go tell her to shift and do things and she does not want to listen to you.
Magellan (Josh):Yeah, but with jody she listened to everything one of the things you did. A good job, because she's ripping right now.
The Guru (Dane):She's, yeah, she's great, can't wait so I can't wait to see what she can do on a bike.
The Guru (Dane):But um, one of the things she said is jody taught me not to say I'm sorry when I'm at the back of the thing, uh, not to say I'm sorry when I, you know, go slower and things like that. She said just thank people for waiting for me. So like she turned it around, you know, instead of being sorry and and I was like wow, that is awesome. You know, that is one of those little things that people don't always notice, but when somebody is like hey, thanks for waiting for me is different than I'm sorry, I kept you up.
Dr. Jody Batz:You know, it's such a positive, the rule is actually I mean, the girls know like safety first, helmets always like all those things, right I? Mean I'm like the safety monitor and I'm totally fine with that. But um, but the but. I tell them there's one rule it's no sorry, but you can say surprise, and so that's, that's the rule, and so um surprise, we're waiting.
Dr. Jody Batz:I got a flat tire right or just yeah, so, because our society is so conditioned to girls and young women and women just in general, um, just like no, I'll be at the back, I'm sorry, I'm really slow and I'm not, you know. It's like no, no, no, no, no, there's no sorry, you showed up today, you're doing your best, um, and but you can say surprise, and so, even if we have minor crashes, um, I sometimes I generally lead from behind, which means I'm at the very back.
Dr. Jody Batz:So, because I'm I'm mama hen and I want to make sure that everybody's making their way. Um, we've got walkie-talkies or two-way radios and so we're always in communication. I'll let the ride leader slow down or whatnot, but every once in a while, if we have a little minor crash, you might hear somebody go surprise. And then you hear surprise, surprise, surprise. Luckily we've had no major injuries. A couple of Band-Aids have been busted out, but it's kind of this pile-up of surprises, but it does. It totally changes the dynamic of the girls not coming to at it, apologizing for being slow or for holding somebody up or for their shoe coming untied or whatever it is. It's like no, you're here, You're doing your best, you showed up.
The Guru (Dane):It's such a great lesson for a young woman to learn early, uh, to to then ingrain into them and carry that forward, because I feel like the opposite happens too much you know, where they're. They're kind of it's and and it's not always intentional, I think, like as a parent, like I definitely follow norms that I'm just used to, and so I just really liked that and it just kind of clicked in my head so I really appreciate that.
Magellan (Josh):I mean, can I steal that as a fat guy at the back of the trail?
Dr. Jody Batz:You totally can.
Magellan (Josh):Yeah, I'm totally going to be like thanks for waiting for me. I say sorry like every ride. So I'm totally going to steal that we should all do that.
The Guru (Dane):You know we really should. It's a really good know you are who you are and don't don't apologize for who you are and it's okay and just thank people for for accepting you and that's really like applicable more than in this scenario that's like everywhere, in any 100, any case, I know I can I can get t-shirts made that say hashtag surprise, not sorry and sell them there we go fundraiser right fundraiser all right, put me down, we're in for 10 shirts.
Magellan (Josh):We'll start we'll kick start your offer, all right. Next question I have for you here what actions have you found are most effective in hooking new young female athletes on mountain biking?
Dr. Jody Batz:Oh, with energy I mean if you're passionate and stoked about what you're doing, like that spreads, and I will say that I've been told that is like um yeah, no one's accused you of having lack of energy.
Dr. Jody Batz:No, exactly, yeah, exactly, my poor husband, godspeed to him, right, so no, but it's. But when you are so passionate about what you're doing, um, that's contagious. So and, and you know the, the girls, I think, instantly feel comfortable. It does help that I've been in education for 30 years and so, um, and particularly in a special education, so I understand what we call scaffolding, which is sort of building on skills, so, and meeting riders where they're at, um, so I, I tend to have a warm bubbly, vivacious, you know what I mean, whatever word you want to use like welcome. So girls feel, I think, comfortable so right away.
Dr. Jody Batz:Um, I think and that word spreads pretty quickly energy, so energy. But I think, you know, I think it's just that, just the energy around the bike, energy around, you know, stoked, being together, just like bring in the 30 second dance party, you know, with the flavor flave necklace thing, it's like just, can you play that again for us, just I just want to, I just want to hear the dance party again.
Magellan (Josh):I think it's like a good interlude.
Dr. Jody Batz:It's the longest 30 seconds ever.
The Guru (Dane):We don't have to listen to the whole thing 40 second dance party.
Dr. Jody Batz:We're all bobbing our ass. See, see, it's contagious. Yep, it's true.
Magellan (Josh):It's like the stupidest, most awesome thing, right.
Dr. Jody Batz:Why do you think I bought it right? It's true, it's like the stupidest, most awesome thing right.
Magellan (Josh):Why do you think I bought it right?
Dr. Jody Batz:Yes, yes, yes, it's like yeah, right, and I found it on Instagram and connected with the owners, I'm totally going to buy it.
Magellan (Josh):I'm going to change our music to be that.
Dr. Jody Batz:Well, there's this one on a gold chain, yeah, and then the other one sits in my red sequined fanny pack.
The Guru (Dane):And.
Dr. Jody Batz:The other one sits in my red sequined fanny pack and if you're lucky you get to wear that one and then you just like, just hit it and like. The rule is you have to stop wherever we are on the trail safely. So, it's a good, but it's also I mean, just think about like the skills there right Cause we do have to suddenly stop on the trail. So I'm teaching that, but in a fun sort of way, and then girls are out there dancing and it's awesome all right, all right.
Magellan (Josh):What's the? So back to the question that I asked you originally about. Like what? Where are we?
Dr. Jody Batz:going I don't know this is what we do. I know I know I put it out of my mind. I put it out of my mind.
Magellan (Josh):It's been like a year and a half and you're like finally you forgot and we've got you back all right. So the inverse of the question. The original question I asked you was like what hooks them? What's the inverse? What actions have you found are least effective in hooking snakes?
Dr. Jody Batz:No, snakes are cool. We like snakes.
The Guru (Dane):I almost lost Jilly because of snakes.
Dr. Jody Batz:She liked him when she was with me. I'm just saying.
Magellan (Josh):What turns them off to the sport.
Dr. Jody Batz:Probably crashing. I mean, you know, that's, that's, that's a, that's a big one.
Magellan (Josh):At a girl.
Dr. Jody Batz:Oh God, don't do that, no at a girl, please, I know. Oh, you're so good. Oh, can we talk about trail chads, you know?
The Guru (Dane):I don't know what that is. Is that like a Karen? Is that like the opposite? Yeah Trail Chad.
Dr. Jody Batz:Trail. Chad is the. I had a girl. Oh so good oh you're doing great hon.
The Guru (Dane):Yeah, right, yeah.
Dr. Jody Batz:I know and I'm like, not the one I want to like. Smack upside the head.
The Guru (Dane):So, yeah, yeah, trail Chad.
Dr. Jody Batz:So I think I, but I it's. You know that that can kind of knock the you know wind out of the sails pretty quickly. So, um, I think, though, how we um support the girls so and we're not at a girling but I'm also not like, toughen up, let's go, you know it's. It's. I mean, obviously it's safety first and and we're all carrying our first aid kits and all that good stuff, but, um, but just kind of teaching them like the best thing you can do is get back on the saddle, get back on the horse, get back on the whatever and pedal along, and then I see them come back the next week. So, and then I've even had girls be like do you see my scar?
The Guru (Dane):And I'm like that's freaking cool.
Dr. Jody Batz:Like that's awesome. I'm like you don't want to look at my knees, you know, because they're pretty bad. Well, I think too I have to give a shout out to Tara from homegrown, who is a dear friend, total fricking badass, as we all know, but she's really become a very good friend, a mentor. I do some guiding for her at times, which is super awesome. So it was like women supporting women, like my attitude is like the rising tide lifts all ships. So in that space and I went to the homegrown women's clinic up at angel fire.
Dr. Jody Batz:No, no, I went last year um, yeah, and, and anybody that knows jody, like that's like those two never I never thought would meet downhill right downhill. And, jody, I'm a single speeder like hardtail. You know what?
Dr. Jody Batz:I mean single speeder rigid fork, you know and and um, but but that's exactly where I went. So and I went um kind of in the middle of shine, girl shine last year and was talking to the girls about doing hard things and doing things that scare you, but like also being supported in that space, like you don't just go launch it off of you know whatever a drop or a job.
Magellan (Josh):Yeah, dane, you gotta support me. You gotta support me in this space.
Dr. Jody Batz:Don't just tell meO-I boy. But Tara said I will never forget that when the clinic first kicked off, there were like 60 badass women around and she said you're going to get compliments. People are going to compliment you, whether it's on your helmet or your bike or your riding or whatever, and the only response that you can make other than thank you is I know right, and my girls damn it.
Magellan (Josh):Lacey said that to me, yes.
Dr. Jody Batz:They, they, my girls, my girls know that. So, and it's really in it. So, in this vein of like the tone and kind of maybe not necessarily what said, but how it said um, you know, so I have had my girls. You know some bro dude is like you know, on your left, you know what I mean. Oh, you know, good job girls. And then my girls are like I know, right, you know, with hand on the hip and I'm like you go, girl, yeah exactly that's that's what yep, Creating a bunch of little baddies out there.
Dr. Jody Batz:That's good, which is right, but it's but again, it's in that space of you, know, I want girls to feel powerful and I want them to feel strong and I want them to to know their worth. So in whatever space that they're in, and that they do belong there, and whether it's on the mountain bike trail or in life or wherever it is, so they, they don't have to apologize for that. And when somebody gives them a compliment, and if it's, especially if it's a backhanded compliment, so it's like that's where, like that, I know right, and I can't tell you how many times heads had turned like oh she's, she's awful confident. I'm like damn straight she is All right.
Magellan (Josh):What has been the biggest surprise that you've uncovered since you started grow, grow, grow?
Dr. Jody Batz:Um oh man.
Magellan (Josh):I love putting in the spot. I was going to send you these ahead of time. No, no, you got it yeah no, it's good.
Dr. Jody Batz:Um, um, how validated I have felt leaving academia. So I, I mean I went and got my PhD Like you, don't you know? You're supposed to go to university and you're supposed to do all these things. And guess what? I did all the things and I checked all the boxes and I wrote all the grants and I did all the publications. And I did all that and the bucket emptied faster than it was filling. Yeah, and um your personal fulfillment bucket Right Right the, the QOL quality of life bucket.
Dr. Jody Batz:And so, um, it's, it is like it overflows. So, in doing what I'm doing and it's just really freaking fantastic, so it's I I can't tell you how many powerful like, almost like, bring me to tears If not, I mean I have been brought to tears in a good way, on powerful stories that families have either told me, texted me, emailed me all of the above um of just just the, the life changing um aspect of of what I'm doing with these girls, which is pretty, pretty awesome.
Magellan (Josh):Is there a story you can share with us so you can protect the innocent and save the names? Is there one you feel comfortable sharing?
Dr. Jody Batz:Yeah, I, I, I do. Um, we had a, a, a, a girl, Um so, who joined us in spring, um the spring session, and she was, um, we had like one elementary school slot, I should.
Magellan (Josh):I should say that the program has evolved Um just originally it was like fourth to eighth grade, right, right. The third to eighth grade Right.
Dr. Jody Batz:And now I do like I do third through fifth grade and then sixth, seventh and eighth grade.
Magellan (Josh):So you've got them separate.
Dr. Jody Batz:Yeah, I do Two different perspectives, two different approaches and my Spidey sense, my, my mom, teacher, instructor, coach. You know what I mean. A Spidey sense says you know what Middle school girls have unique needs and elementary school girls have unique needs. And so what I do is I design the program that the middle school girls, once they've gone through two rounds of programming, then they can be a mentor or a junior coach with the elementary school girls. Oh, that's cool.
Dr. Jody Batz:So um, and that's like the next iteration is, it's what's going to be called shocker mentor, girl mentor. Everything's going to be something girl um at a girl Um, but um, anyway I, I digress but um. But we had a spot open in the L. I did elementary, the elementary, middle school, split um in the springtime for the first time, and so we happen to have, I think, a spot in the elementary group.
Dr. Jody Batz:So I put it out to the families and just said, if anybody knows anybody, well, yep, one of the girls. Families said oh my gosh, I have somebody who'd be perfect for it. And, um, this young lady joined us. Um, it's fair to say that she's native American, and um, and she joined pretty quiet, um so, but but like she was the one like ripping around the parking lot like nonstop, like on her bike Right.
The Guru (Dane):And so I was like oh yeah, she's my jam. Like there we go.
Dr. Jody Batz:And um and joined, had an absolute blast. And at the end of the session no, I lie, I would think it was like session two Mom sent me one of the most powerful emails I've ever gotten about um, just her daughter, um being the first in her family, um, that has ever mountain biked, um, that she was like I mean, I get goosebumps as I tell the story because she was just talking about how just um she, she went to um, or she, she, she was a little reticent to join, but when she did, she said when I saw coach Jody, the way that she was dressed in my like jorts and t-shirt- and whatever um, she said, I realized like I'm really just a mountain biker girl.
Magellan (Josh):Like like I doesn't have to be. You know what I mean. Like these are my people, biker girl. Like like I doesn't have to be.
Dr. Jody Batz:You know what I mean. Like these are my people, these are my people, 100% Like these are my people. And so, like she can show up in shorts and a t-shirt and whatever, and it's like, it's totally cool. And that's one reason why I don't like kid up.
Magellan (Josh):Well, I don't get up ever anymore. But but you know, I don't.
Dr. Jody Batz:You're not wearing the Lycra, no, exactly, and so and I do, and I and I've even shown up in like regular kind of like workish pants, you know, just to show girls that like you can ride and whatever, but um, but yeah, the the email was long and it was, it was extremely powerful and it was just just thanking me for creating the space so for her daughter and then potentially for for others in the future. Um, so that was that was. That was pretty awesome, it was. It was pretty powerful.
The Guru (Dane):So pretty awesome it was. It was pretty powerful, so that's good. Yeah, yeah, that's pretty amazing. I, I, I. I had a little taste of that when I ran a junior team and just seeing those juniors honestly do something other than get in trouble, right, you know?
The Guru (Dane):for for me, and I had, one years later, contact me and same thing. He's like hey man, I'm now working for the railroad, I make all this money, and he was at risk. At risk, he was, uh, super close to being in gangs, like he didn't even own a bike, so we had a spare bike that he would borrow and and it's just get it. You get that back and it just gives you this spark like you wouldn't believe, makes you want to do more so I've.
Dr. Jody Batz:I have um one one of my riders um. She self-identifies as a young lady with autism, but she's got some pretty severe social anxiety as well right and it's really powerful when you create a space where the girls wrap around each other without any instruction I don't know how to explain it like if she like she's had, naturally, yeah, like bikes are down, you know.
Dr. Jody Batz:I mean bikes are down. We're like literally physically, like surrounding each other, um, and I just kind of stand back, I'm like I'll, I'll, I'll be over here if you need me, like you know. But it's beautiful, it's really.
The Guru (Dane):I'm going to take some pictures. I'm going to. No, that's it. Yeah, it's like it's just it's pretty, it's pretty powerful.
Dr. Jody Batz:So I've got lots of stories, um so and, and lots colleges of girls on vacation, shredding you know what I mean Trails and stuff, and they're like you know, they so-and-so wanted me to send this to coach Jody, and so it's like you know, man, oh man, that just makes my heart just like absolutely burst. So I'm like what, what academia, you know?
Magellan (Josh):So, jody, you're, you're, you're not only do you have grow, grow, grow, but you're also coaching adults. And so I have a, I have a question, um, like what do you, um, what are the key differences that you tackle between coaching young athletes, young female athletes, and adult women?
Dr. Jody Batz:Um, what are the differences? Yeah, what are the key differences between the approach that you no, I'm being I'm being serious I brought out my 32nd dance party with, like, a group of ladies. I brought it within a co-ed group and you know, people start bopping their head and you know whatever, and before you know it, like people are laughing and they're loosening up. So I mean, yeah, there might be a little bit different tactics, but it's. It's bringing that energy and bringing that passion.
Magellan (Josh):So I started spans ages, it does 100%.
Dr. Jody Batz:I mean, I think, if, if, if, who doesn't want to be around somebody who's passionate about what they do? So I was. You know, I was mentioning listening to the podcast, dana, when you came on. So it was like you just talk about, like, I love bikes. I'm just like, yeah, like, yeah, like, and you want like, and I I mean people call me the bike lady, they call me the, you know whatever. It's like, yeah, I'd like, I love to ride bikes and I love to teach people how to ride bikes and I love to teach people how to safely ride bikes and you know all sorts of good stuff. It's like heck, yeah. So I use that same energy in my coaching business.
The Guru (Dane):So okay, I got a question. Okay, it's not on our list.
Magellan (Josh):It's okay.
The Guru (Dane):So, as a parent who's got two kids getting into bikes and my biggest struggle is and this is not just my kids, this is friends. You know, josh, we were talking about this I have a hard time teaching, like articulating what needs to be said to make it click in somebody's brain, like when you're getting your coaching certifications. Is there like a secret menu of like that you know that that teaches you that, or are you constantly evolving how to help it click with people? Does that make sense? And, yes, like the.
Dr. Jody Batz:Actually the answer is yes, and yes you get um kind of like keywords you know that you can use. I'm going to offer up 30 years in education, um, teaching down in Douglas on the Arizona Mexico border, to teaching graduate students at Montana state university and sort of everywhere in between, um has given me a pretty big tool belt of different. You know what I mean. Like, oh, all, right, we're going to go side door, okay, back window, okay, you know, front door, like we're going to, I'm going to try all the different strategies. So I think that that just comes from my personal experience, because I have seen people coaching and and I've seen it you know it's, it's painful sometimes. So when people don't come from maybe a teaching background or just there's, there's um like the nerves are coming through or whatnot.
Dr. Jody Batz:But um, I think, just having having having a lot of tools, I've got a big, pretty big repertoire of of of strategies, um, and also too, that comes from working with kids with disabilities and varying disabilities from mild to super severe. Um, so, throughout the years, so I've I've I've had to be adaptable and so I kind of feel like I have a pretty good sense of reading, sort of the reading the trail, or reading the room, or reading the writer. So an understanding, when, um, I've got some writers who, um, you know, we, we can picture a picnic bench, right, and you're putting that front wheel, I'm putting that front wheel up on that picnic bench, so and you're a picnic bench right and you're putting that front wheel I'm putting that front wheel up on that picnic bench, yeah so, and having a rider climb up on there to to just feel what it's like to climb, it's scary.
Dr. Jody Batz:At the first right it's totally scary. And of course you know you get a josh who's like okay, that little pipsqueak woman, you know, I mean she's gonna hold me up and I'm like yeah, like tara did that to me, right, right, like the first thing she did.
Magellan (Josh):She's like put your front wheel I'm like tara I Tara. I weigh 300 pounds. Are you sure you can hold?
Dr. Jody Batz:me Right, and I and I shout out to my friend Danny, who I got my coaching, my, my, uh, my mountain bike instructor coaching certification with Um, so he's, he's a big guy, so and and I know we were purposefully paired so and I was like oh shit.
Dr. Jody Batz:Like oh my God, you know what I mean. And so I mean I kept them upright and learned, you know, learned the tactics. But when I have a rider, you know, who might be a little, even just trepidatious, looking at me, going, okay, she's really got me and you know whatever. But then I also have a rider who, like is, like that's a hard. No, you know what I mean? Like absolutely not. And so we're putting our wheel up on the curb, right, right.
Dr. Jody Batz:And so I'm adjusting that way and not making somebody feel like that's any less than putting their wheel up on the picnic bench, right, because I'm meeting that rider where they're at and I think I do a really good job of doing that. So, um, and just making people feel comfortable, so in that space, and like you know what you're bad-ass cause. You showed up here, you know you're doing your best, so, um, and there's nothing to be ashamed of, no, sorry, um, so, and, and you know, damn, you put that wheel up on that curb. You know what I mean, like a boss, and and and high fives and all that good stuff.
Magellan (Josh):So, yeah, um positive reinforcement, 100%, tailoring their approach to the individual and the and the big energy.
Dr. Jody Batz:Right, I mean it's, it's yeah, it's it's. So there's not just as like a secret word that you give to everybody that makes them better, unfortunately, no, no, I get a hypothesis, although I have told parents, because I've had parents, you know what I mean they're like.
The Guru (Dane):Oh, you know my, my daughter doesn't listen to me.
Dr. Jody Batz:She won't let me tell her that, and I'm like oh, it's that magic coach dust that I sprinkle on them. You know what I mean. I carry it, I carry it in my fanny pack, you know. Or my snack bag, and you know we, we joke about it and it's like because I'm not their mom, so, but I'm you know that's, that was what I was going to say my hypothesis is that our children listen to us less than they'll listen to others.
Magellan (Josh):I mean, is that, is there a fact in that?
Dr. Jody Batz:Yeah, I mean, yeah, I mean it's, it's it's think of, think of teachers, and I'm always fascinated too and it's kind of dives into like a little more serious side of the programming, in a good way, is just creating that safe, supported space. Um, and we do that really quickly and before you know it, mostly, mostly it's middle school girls. But they will start to tell, like, about their day and about their God. I mean they've shared you know what I mean Some pretty powerful, sad, you know what I mean Stories, and so we've we've just created a space for the girls to be able to do that. But I'm always interested when they're like, oh my God, my science teacher is so awesome. I'm like, ooh, it makes them awesome.
Dr. Jody Batz:You know Right and and 100% of the time it's like, oh my God, like he loves science, like he's so stoked on science, and I'm like, okay, yeah, right, passion is the thing, like it just keeps coming through, and I'm like, oh gee, I have to be stoked about bikes and stoked about girls outdoors and normalizing sweat and you know all sorts of good stuff, so it's fricking awesome.
Magellan (Josh):I don't like riding alone in the back country. I just don't like it. I don't feel safe. Maybe it's animals, maybe it's guys with banjos, I don know, but like I don't go farther than like 20 miles out by myself. Okay, um, do you ride alone in the back country? Fuck yeah, and what?
Dr. Jody Batz:would you advise your? Female students relative to riding alone I, I do, I, I do ride alone um. I. I think I'd mentioned before maybe it was um earlier, I mean when we were on break but but I, I rode from from our house, so here in East Tucson to Patagonia, by myself, nice.
Magellan (Josh):How far is that?
Dr. Jody Batz:Like 90 fucking miles.
The Guru (Dane):Is it really 90 miles? It is Really Well cause.
Dr. Jody Batz:I was on all single track I was on the Arizona trail, yeah. So and I was on a single speed.
The Guru (Dane):I know that shocks you all, but you know what I mean. Which?
Dr. Jody Batz:really meant, which really meant that I hiked for 90 miles.
The Guru (Dane):I was going to say it shocks me, because I've seen some of the hills on the air.
Dr. Jody Batz:Yes, exactly, which means I, I did a whole lot of hiking, for you know what I mean For, for that, for that time. But that and uh, and I, admittedly, was terrified when I first thought of, thought of that, and but I'm also in a space of, and this kind of dives into, like my personal, um, you know, I lost my mom 14 years ago to the complications of anorexia, and um, and like my mom never would have been on a mountain bike like ever, and and so it's like I didn't start riding until I was 41. And so it's like wait, you're not four.
Magellan (Josh):You're older than I'm only. I'm only 42. Yeah, writing for a year, perfect, actually, I'm 26. I know exactly.
Dr. Jody Batz:I know exactly, actually, I'm 26. I started writing at 41. Go ahead, figure that, math out. No but, but, um, but I I actually started writing when my mom died, um, and it was in during my doctoral program and whatever it's like. But I I sort of like honor her by doing these like badass things that scare me a bit yeah or scare me a lot.
Dr. Jody Batz:Um. So I will never forget, when I was getting ready to do the patagonia push, um, it was the last night of our spring session, and so I showed up to to practice, or to our we don't call practice, we call it our adventures. So, because I like that word, I just think that that, just it's better than practice right well and it just like.
Dr. Jody Batz:Practice implies like the drill and skills, but, um, no, we adventure like and we just, and we might ride a mile, we, but we eat snacks and we love snacks and we do a lot of snacking. So, um, and that's, that's my love, language is like the snacking, yeah I mean just mean, just for the record.
Magellan (Josh):Jodi rode here on her bike and she pulls out. She starts pulling out all these things. I'm like where the fuck did you fit all that stuff in on her bike? And she's got like a whole bag full of snacks I have enough to keep me like if I, if I don't make it home tonight, I can.
Dr. Jody Batz:I can survive for three days.
The Guru (Dane):It's like a depression era, grandma era grandma. I got ketchup packets and all sorts of stuff in there right packed full of canned food, in case there's a depression exactly my green, my green beans and whatnot.
Dr. Jody Batz:But um, no, but I showed up to practice um with my bike fully loaded and I did it on purpose, because I wanted the girls to see, and so the girls were just absolutely like what?
Magellan (Josh):is that like?
Dr. Jody Batz:what is that? Like you know, and I'm like, well, there's my sleeping bag and there's my tent, and there or I don't have a tent I have a baby. But, like you know, and like there's my food, and they're like what? And I'm like, yeah, I'm like I'm gonna leave you and I'm, you know, I'm gonna say goodbye to your parents. Then I'm gonna ride down the arizona trail towards camino, malta, so I'm just camp on that, just on the other side of the park, so, and they're like you're going to sleep out there.
The Guru (Dane):And I'm like yeah.
Dr. Jody Batz:I am so um and so I mean, I think, just being just being that role model. So for for the girls we, um, when I was with, or when, when grow grow grow was under the Arizona trail association, um, I had the opportunity to work really closely with gear girls, which is very similar program up in Flagstaff, yeah. Um, you're thinking of girls in gear? That's yeah, and that's um. I know her as well. She's super rad.
Magellan (Josh):They do road bikes though. Yeah, Um their clothes match their bike.
Dr. Jody Batz:Yes, but um, but, um, but Mackenzie, who runs gear girls, which is up in Flagstaff, um, she's like my work wife BFF, just love her. And um, we used to call ourselves like the book and the state. We would book in the state with these girls programs and we created these girls camps and so, like, a long-winded answer is like fuck, yeah, I've been out there by myself. Have I been scared, absolutely. Have I not slept, you know? Because, like eyes are wide open, because I know I heard something.
The Guru (Dane):You know what I mean.
Dr. Jody Batz:Absolutely, but is it like the most powerful thing to like wake up and like you look and I'm like I have everything I need?
Magellan (Josh):like right here, like on, like everything that I need is on my bike sidearm with you no, no, no no yeah, I can't even like fathom that, like if I go ride just like a day ride from there because of all the things I've run into.
The Guru (Dane):Right, I carry a sidearm yeah just wow yeah you're more badass than me, jody. I'm, I'm, I know, right, josh man, I had a girl I get free.
Dr. Jody Batz:Okay, chad, now she's gonna punch me trail chad poking the bear exactly I know he's gonna get kicked, yeah so yeah, I can't.
The Guru (Dane):I can't do that like I. Night rides are my thing because of Arizona and the heat and everything, and just eat. I can't ride by myself at night. So being out in the middle of the desert camping by myself, I don't, I wouldn't find that peaceful, I'd find it like super stressful.
Magellan (Josh):Yeah, after I saw a Jaguar four miles from where we're sitting right here.
The Guru (Dane):Yeah, I'm like yeah, I think if there was two of us cause then yeah, I think if there was two of us cause, then, and as long as I could outrun the other one, I think we're good.
Magellan (Josh):Totally, you're going to win. I know he's going to win. Exactly, yep, yep, that's that's what it needs to be. All right, Jody. Hey, what would you change about the mountain bike scene these days?
Dr. Jody Batz:Ooh, I, I, we need to get more women in the industry. We, we, we do Um, and and I mean I have. I mean I, I was a special education teacher and then I went and got my PhD and then I was a faculty member and now I run a nonprofit and I have a coaching business and I coach adults and youth and men and women and children and like, do all these things and like, now I want to go to like a bike mechanic school because I want to be a bike mechanic, so, and then I'm going to go back fitting school because I want to be a bike fitter, maybe not just riding bikes, so it's whether they want to wrench or run a bike shop or be a bike fitter or all of the above. So I think, just, we need to do a better job of creating genuine space, not at a girl's space, um, not token space, but, uh, creating real space for, for girls, um, whether it be through mentorships or internships.
Dr. Jody Batz:That was with grow, girl, grow. My vision is to create mentor, girl, mentor, and I have it all mapped out. I know this shocks you, so I have it all mapped out, with research cited, you know, and all that good stuff, but um, no, but it's, but it's um just the research behind creating mentoring spaces and giving girls the opportunity to be in leadership roles, and one of the things that the girls will do is they will do a community leadership project or community give back project, and I really would love it to be related to like work in a bike shop or like a, like an internship, um, you know, in a bike shop or like a like an internship, you know, in a bike shop where girls could be exposed to.
Dr. Jody Batz:So the behind the scenes.
Magellan (Josh):She's like looking really closely at you.
Dr. Jody Batz:I know Like laser vision, Dana, so I'll be. I'll be knocking on your door tomorrow.
Magellan (Josh):She's the only person I ever met that calls you Dana.
The Guru (Dane):Oh, a lot of people do.
Magellan (Josh):Yeah, so I haven't heard it yet it's.
The Guru (Dane):It's weird because I for a while, because it was my facebook profile yeah I knew if somebody knew me through facebook they would call me dana, and if they knew me outside of facebook they'd call me dane.
Magellan (Josh):And that's just because I didn't get onto facebook later and my I've just always been called something else so I've been called a lot of things you introduce yourself to me as dane soane, so that's what I went with.
The Guru (Dane):That's usually what I get, but on your, on your, so like, while you were talking about women being included and I, you know, my brain goes through a bunch of processes, which is weird. I'm just sitting here listening to you and my brain is just like clicking here and there. And one of the first things that I remembered is one of my first bike shop jobs. I worked at um, a place called sabino cycles in town, and it was owned by a guy named mac and his wife, kate, and I remember my first week there. I didn't get anything from mac he's a great guy, by the way but kate showed me around, taught me this stuff, and I will tell you that that lady, she taught me more than a lot of the people I've worked for and I was really impressed.
The Guru (Dane):One of the first things is she taught me was don't talk down to women, don't don't talk to them any different than you would talk to your friend, you know. And then she said not all women want pink, but some do, which which confused me. But it was true, right, right and, but she was like Right, right and, uh, but she was like so good at um, kind of stressing. And this is decades ago, so this is not a new thing. You know about getting women involved in and bringing them into bike shops and I was just like hey, that stuck with me, that mentorship that she gave me actually stuck with me and I feel that I've done a pretty good job of trying to keep that forward in my life. But I will agree that there's not a lot of women in psych. The reason I bring this up is again, my, my brain is clicking. I don't have any women, but I know jen at transit of course, I know I know like I know a lot like alex, who we from Norco.
The Guru (Dane):Like there's, there's, so like they're, they're there, but I, you know, I, I, we need more Right.
Magellan (Josh):So we have the same problem in the defense industry and this is what I can't figure out Right, like the, you can tell me if this is, this is the right approach. Like, I open up a requisition and I make sure that I have a representative slate of candidates they're all qualified and then I pick the best candidate. Sometimes I pick a dude, sometimes I pick a girl, I pick whoever's the best candidate and to me that's the best approach. But I force the representative slate and if I don't have a capable, competitive female on the slate, I won't go forward until I do Nice, that to me is like the best approach and they don't always win and I'm not going to hire them just because they're a girl and hire the best. But I mean, is that the right approach? Like what? What would you recommend?
Dr. Jody Batz:I would say yes, I mean, I, I feel like that that's the, I feel like that is the right approach, the if we want to get all researchy, know, we we kind of ticked off some, some stats about girls, um, and mostly teen and tween girls, which is what I'm really targeting with. Grow, grow, grow. But um, I read this really really sad study that talked about 71 percent of women who are in the bike industry leave the industry yeah and and you can cite bro culture bro, culture, like you name it.
Dr. Jody Batz:Right, you know what I mean. It's. It's like, and so not all women have big. You know what's. You know what I mean To like. Hang in there and you know, and I'm, I happen to be one of those, like you know, whatever, like you can, bro dude, and whatever you know, cause I'll toss it right back at you. I know that shocks you, but there's no, you know what I mean. There's, thank God, there's.
The Guru (Dane):Like Melissa, you know what I mean From Ajo bikes you know, but I mean still, but there's like I think she got gears, it's just well for Leadville, she got gears for Leadville, I know, but you should have gears for level, just for the record.
Dr. Jody Batz:Right, no, um, no, but I mean but, but I mean the number of women just in the industry, you know, I mean is is so small. Yeah, so, and and when we look at the mountain biking community, it's like, you know, we've got this mountain biking community. That's a small subculture, and then you've got, like, this little group of women over here, and so I feel like, grow, grow, grow. I'm doing my part to like like, fill, fill that up and coming um group group, you know what I mean and and and get more girls, women, staying in the industry too. So, um, and I think, by giving them exposure to and I'm looking at Dana, like, but seriously, by giving them exposure to like this is, this is how we wrench on a bike and this is how we I mean my husband, god help me, or God help him, he's a bike mechanic and I went to go change from my clipless pedals to flats today and and he, do you want me to do that?
Dr. Jody Batz:I was like no, I don't, like, I would rather struggle with it. You know what I mean For a second. So, and I did it, you know what I mean, of course. Then I probably like, texted him the picture and I'm just like done, you know, now I'm at peace out for my bike ride. But you know, but I think it's that you know, I think our society does lean into like, oh, let me go help, no-transcript. So we learn how to put in tire pressure, put air in our tires, and we learn, you know, all those kinds of things because knowledge is powerful.
Dr. Jody Batz:And so I think, just just creating that space. I think also too and I know it's super cliche, but I think it's really fitting, for this is like attracts, like you know, and and and a lot of women, um, you know, can walk into a bike shop and they see a bunch of bro dudes back there Like they're turning around and walking right back out.
The Guru (Dane):Right, because oftentimes I'm not saying always not you, dana but, no, but, no, but, but, but I mean, you get somebody that comes in like you know what do you mean?
Dr. Jody Batz:one by what you know, whatever, like they you know, and like this lingo gets thrown out and they don't know. So, and whatnot. And so, um, I think just even just walking into a bike shop and just seeing another woman or seeing a young lady there, so just just instantly, would would create some comfort for people, for women.
The Guru (Dane):And then, um, and then just, I don't know just, I think your program is going to do more good than anything, Cause you have to start at that base level younger, like mentality, and and that's important. I think you know my story about Kate and and how she kind of changed the way I do. Things has stayed with me and that the more that happens, so I think it's going to always get better. Um, I do feel like there's just not enough Like we don't get like hardly I don't know if I've ever had a applicant, you know, Um, and it's not because we're not looking, it's. It's just I think there's a percentage you know of, of guys versus girls in this industry, and it's not necessarily on purpose, but there's lots of things that can change, Like, for instance, one guy working with a woman getting a different perspective because of it, and then now I, hopefully, am treating women differently in the shop. I hope so. Like, shout out, if I'm not, if I'm a total jerk, just you just tell me.
Dr. Jody Batz:But for the most part, like I'm going to come audit Dana's shop, just sit there and just watch and put a disguise on.
Magellan (Josh):She's going to come in with a mustache.
The Guru (Dane):Just don't talk to Carlos.
Magellan (Josh):Yeah, Uh mentioned.
Dr. Jody Batz:Carlos, okay, all right, all right.
The Guru (Dane):But uh, seriously, it's like it, that little interaction, that that experience with that owner, and she definitely changed me Right, and if it's not there it's harder. You know, it's not like I'm running around being a male chauvinist or anything without her, it's just that in general she really kind of clicked, you know, and that that's what we need and I we need more of that. You know, again, I'm listening to a podcast with the NBDA, which Heather Mason took on. I don't know if you guys know her or if you've heard of her, but NBDA is an organization that helps bike shops. It helps us try and get better and she is doing big pushes for that and it's really inspiring to listen to her.
Magellan (Josh):She's a great voice. You should share that podcast with Jodi, she would dig that.
The Guru (Dane):And she'd be a great one to get in contact with because, she's always trying to get more and more women in the sport, even though she's really representing this, uh, an organization that services everybody. It's not meant to be women's only, or anything, uh, but she's such a good advocate and a great example. She owned a bike shop, she races bikes, so she's great. She was one of our reps for Eddie Marks and for Bianchi. So, great great lady.
Magellan (Josh):We got this problem and I don't know if it happens in the bike industry as well. But in defense, like, there's this thing where, like, if I look at a requisition for an open job and I see a list of 10 things that are required and I can crush it on two of them and eight of them I have no fucking clue about. I'm like I'm the perfect candidate, totally, totally. And if in and I've, I've taught, I've coached like other and you've been through this too but I've coached like other women and they're like well, I only have two of the eight things I'm like, but you got two of the eight things go get it right right, and it's just a different mentality, so it's like, right, right from jody's first thing, don't say I'm sorry.
The Guru (Dane):right like that is teaching a whole generation of of girls to have a better mentality, to to be stronger and to be, um, just be able to take more of what they need, you know, from life, which is great, and that's something that we need not just in grow, girl grow, but we need it in our schools, we need it in, uh, band practice. We need, I mean, like everything, jilly's in volleyball, right, you know, like all of these things you know need those things started from the basics so that they grow up a different way Because you know the traditions and stuff like habits. What am I thinking of? So, like there's stuff that your parents teach you. I do stuff that my mom did not on purpose.
Dr. Jody Batz:And I'm like, I realize I'm doing something.
The Guru (Dane):We are our parents, right, right, and that's because, oh, I know, and so so that happened, right, so that's two generations now doing the same thing and I have to actively change that if I want my next generation I have to teach it different well, and you've got that's very slow change and then you have societal norms, you know what.
Dr. Jody Batz:So like overarching or undergirding, whatever way you want to look at it. And so, um, I, I saw this fantastic, uh, I don't know what you would call it, but somebody explained. They said, you know, here's society, and it was like a big rectangle. That literally made this rectangle and they said boys, men, young men, you know whatnot? Like society says take up all this space. Like you can be as big as you want. Like take up, take up all this space. And girls and women, like you're going to be over here and you're going to be in this, like lower right-hand corner, and, Ooh, if you're big, remind me to tell you a story about being big. Um, if you're big, then you're considered boisterous, or you're considered obnoxious, or you're considered you know what I mean.
Dr. Jody Batz:Right, exactly so. Um, and my thing is and I tell parents this when they sign up for grow grow, grow is like I want girls to know that they can take up as much or as little space as they want, like they have that choice but it's their decision.
Dr. Jody Batz:But it's their decision, exactly. And so I have been told my entire um, academic, um, life or career, um, and even as a teacher, to literally have been told to temper the jody and like, no, you know what, if you don't like the jody, then that's your problem, that's not my problem. And so I, literally, though, like all through academia, you know it's all like, oh, you need to, you need to, you need to kind of temper, you need to temper that Jodi. And I'm like, no, I don't know, I'm passionate, I'm, I'm, I'm excited, I love life, I'm like go big or go home, I mean, that's just, that's just me, that's my personality. And if you don't like that, that's okay. But you know what, there are some days when I do want to. You know what I mean. So be quiet, or whatever. And and for the girls that aren't big, you know what I mean, like what John calls me, like tiny but mighty you know what I mean.
The Guru (Dane):It's like, jody, you walk into a room.
Dr. Jody Batz:It's like oh you know, but but that's just my personality, like that's just, that's just me, and it's like, if you don't like that, that's your right way to be, but you are the right way that you.
Magellan (Josh):I'm the right. I'm the right for me, I'm the right for me, and you'd be there for you.
Dr. Jody Batz:Right, and and and and you choose. But it's your choice to take up that space or not.
Magellan (Josh):So whatever you want to do, so what like okay, we have an underrepresented under Like, if like follows like, like, how the fuck do we change it? Well, so do I? Do I give stretch assignments and put people? Do I choose the the un you know, or or maybe slightly less qualified female so I can get more representation? Like what do you do? I don't know what the right approach is.
Dr. Jody Batz:Well, I mean, dana, I think you you hit the nail on the head and it I mean I'm not saying like grow, grow, grow is like the cure all hit the nail on the head and I mean I'm not saying like grow, grow, grow is like the cure all. Maybe it is, I don't know, but but you need to have mountain biking.
The Guru (Dane):No, but I'm saying they should have they should all ride mountain bikes.
Magellan (Josh):I mean, it does build confidence, for sure, right.
Dr. Jody Batz:But it's, but it's um, but it's starting at that down to K two, before I move up to high school. Yeah, so, because my attitude is, if I get the like, if I get them, really you know what I?
The Guru (Dane):mean Really young, like I can imagine a first grader being like.
Dr. Jody Batz:I know, right, you know, to the trail, chad. He's like on the trail, you know. So I'll be like, yeah, you go girl, but, um, but it's starting them young. It's like we, it's. It's going to take a process, you know, but I think it's it's being part of that solution. It's like these women are not magically going to appear with like these. You know what I mean, all these credentials for you know what I mean For your jobs. But if we're looking at middle school I almost said junior high school, dating myself there but like we're looking at middle schools and elementary schools, you know, and creating opportunities for for girls, you know what I mean To to experience the sciences or whatever it is, um, I think that's that's where it's got to start, like that's how the pipeline changes.
The Guru (Dane):Yeah, that's kind of how society changes, like you can't just expect everybody to turn on a dime.
Magellan (Josh):Evolution. Evolution, not revolution.
The Guru (Dane):Yeah and so, but it's small little things that do it all throughout. You know their lives will make a big difference and so if they only see Jody once and then it's never supported, you know it'll go away and and. But on your point, you can't expect somebody who's lived 30 years you know 40 years, whatever to just change on a dime. Yeah, you can ask them, you know, and they can try, but you just can't expect it to happen.
Magellan (Josh):So I'll keep sponsoring.
The Guru (Dane):Yeah, you keep doing what you're doing.
Magellan (Josh):I got a representative slate and I'll keep picking the best candidate, because over time I'll have a bigger, you know, and because your awareness of trying to to make.
The Guru (Dane):That is a step and it also shows you know in the future. If you know, if your boss ever came to you and said, hey, why'd you hire them? Well, you know in the future. If you know, if your boss ever came to you and said, hey, why'd you hire them? Well, I was trying to get a little more diversity, you know, and I was working at it. Nobody's going to fault you for that, you know, um, well, isn't it?
Dr. Jody Batz:the same too Is it was it Gandhi that said be the change.
The Guru (Dane):Yeah, I mean it's like. I mean that's that's that's just it.
Dr. Jody Batz:It's like you you, for lack of better words, you know, like knowing that you are doing the right things, you're advocating you're, you know, you're an ally, you're trying, exactly Like you're trying, and so it's like you know you could just turn a blind eye and be like, oh, my industry sucks, and you know I mean it's no, you know I can't do anything about it. It's like that's the worst thing you can do. So, but, um, but also'm, you know kind of leaning into, like, even like the disability conversation, so, and and hearing people still use the word retarded or something, and I'm just like like I, you know my head spins around so and I'm like, please don't use that word. Like that is not an appropriate word, has not? You know what I mean.
Dr. Jody Batz:It's like so and don't use the do so you know and please, you know, please, please, don't use that but it's going forward but it's. But then it's, it's gotta be very cognizant, it's kind of gotta be on the refresh.
The Guru (Dane):So so I'm seeing in our society lately there's a lot of knee jerk reactions and so like and so you say something like hey, you shouldn't say that, then will knee jerk right that.
The Guru (Dane):yeah, because you're kind of attacking them and that's difficult to deal with, right, right, um, but what I? What does bug the crap out of me is the uh, the memes online where they'll yeah, they'll, be like oh, you know what I, you know, I, I'm fine and I didn't have seat belts and I drank out of a, you know, out of a hose, you know, you mean like those those ones where people are just like you know what I'm, just I'm, I'm perfectly fine and I don't have to. Uh, I, you know, I stayed at the park all night, you know, or whatever they are, and I'm just like yeah, you know, seatbelts save lives, you know, like you, you gotta realize there are some changes that you need to make. I don't drink out of the hose anymore, right?
The Guru (Dane):I did when I was a kid, but but I would you know I mean only when I'm bike packing yeah, like, but you know I mean so like, like some of that stuff. People just they need to do change, but they need to do it at their pace and they need to not feel attacked for it to be a good change and that's the hard part.
The Guru (Dane):That's the hard part we all have to deal with because, like we said earlier, it it's not necessarily what you say, it's how you say it, right, and if you're well, and people get defensive when they, you know, we can talk about.
Dr. Jody Batz:You know, maturity does not always rate to age.
The Guru (Dane):So, and, and we can definitely not definitely not in this room for sure, you know 29 and I act like you're 72.
Dr. Jody Batz:Exactly right, I thought he was 78. All right, so is the appropriate term special needs.
Magellan (Josh):Is that the appropriate accepted term? Is that okay, you know?
Dr. Jody Batz:I, I will offer up that. The appropriate term is whatever the individual chooses, okay, so, um, you know there was. There was a big, big conversation many, many years ago about person first language, and we can get into this whole conversation around um, you know the person, not the disability. You see the person, you know that's not the autistic kid.
Dr. Jody Batz:So um it's a kid, his name is Johnny or you know whatever. It is Um. But then you really like we're starting, you can start to get into the weeds. Welcome to my PhD of like, just um. Like, especially in the autism community, so people choose their identity. So as um, like, especially in the autism community, so people choose their identity. So, as I choose to identify as autistic, you know, I choose to identify as a mountain biker you know, whatever it might be and so that you know.
Dr. Jody Batz:So it's identity, and so what I will say that I have leaned into is respectful um respectful language. So it's it's. And if that person wants person, first language, that's what I, that's what I use. If that person wants identity, first language, that's what I, that's what I use. If that person wants identity, first language, that's what I use. But guess what you can ask them, like you can say hey how should I refer to this Exactly, you? Know what. I mean you know what's your name?
The Guru (Dane):I mean I'm such a uh, I don't want to say jerk, I'm such a, totally, whenever I meet somebody that has, either, let's say, a disability or, um, just in general, is different from me, I want to know more like, and I feel like weird because, uh, we, we were doing, we were wrenching on a couple of guys, uh, hand cycles, uh, so they're, they're athletes, you know, they don't have the use of their legs and we're working on them and I'm just geeking out on their bikes 'm like this is so cool, we could do this with your bike. You know, I'm trying to put wireless on their bikes.
The Guru (Dane):So they don't have these cables moving around on their hand, cycles and and, uh, you know, I just it's, it's. I'm very naive when I talk to people because I'm like oh so what do you do with your legs? Like, and that's not meant to be in right any way. I'm just curious like how does this work, or, you know, like it's just I just want to know yeah. I'm like a five-year-old.
Magellan (Josh):You know, what Don't lose that.
Dr. Jody Batz:Don't lose that Because I and I mean I think in all my years of experience. So, um like, like ask the questions.
The Guru (Dane):So you know.
Dr. Jody Batz:I mean, I've never had anybody be like you know how dare you ask? It's like thank you for you know me for asking, because that shows a genuine interest and a genuine concern for that person. Yeah, so, whether it was my student or my, you know what I mean, whoever it was. It's like, um, I'm not asking to be a jerk, I just I want to know and like what's the best way for me to?
Dr. Jody Batz:support you, so, and I mean, like that comes from a teaching background, so, but then when I then to everybody, so right, but it's, but it's. But that was what I would always tell them is is, is I? Well, and I, I, I did, I landed on respectful language and that's just what's comfortable for me, because, recognizing that some people, particularly in the autism community and the deaf community, so, um, people will identify, so, as their their identity is autistic or the identity is deaf, um, and that's a whole side conversation, another podcast, but, um, but just asking, so, just just how would you like me to refer to you? So?
Magellan (Josh):all right? Final question for you, Jody.
Dr. Jody Batz:Oh boy.
Magellan (Josh):And it's a repeat of a question we asked you in February of 2023.
Dr. Jody Batz:Oh gosh.
Magellan (Josh):But I got a little preamble here here. Okay, so like we've challenged, uh, each of our listeners and ourselves to help, um, bring at least one or more new rider into the sport. Like we want to grow the sport Right and so we're actively working and I'm spending a significant amount of time doing that myself is like bringing other people into the sport. Nice, and in episode 29, we asked you like what can we do to help get more females into the sport? And you gave us three answers. The first thing you said is I'm just getting started out. I'm just starting out. Ask me later. That was the first answer.
Dr. Jody Batz:Second answer you said get out of the way.
Magellan (Josh):But the third thing you said was help amplify our voice. Um, so I want to ask you again same question. You've been doing this now for like you know what 18 months or whatever like. What can we do to help get more females into the sport?
Dr. Jody Batz:It's funny when you said that the first thing that went through my head is get out of the way.
Magellan (Josh):You have not evolved.
Dr. Jody Batz:I know I have regressed, no, I I mean move over. So like, like you know Ron Bertrand, you guys may know him writer here in town.
The Guru (Dane):Oh, yeah, yeah.
Dr. Jody Batz:Yeah, we just have this huge joke. Whenever we've ridden together, we've we've raced together.
Dr. Jody Batz:On your left, I've, I've passed him and so, like, when I see him, I'm like on your left and he's like you know, like just jokes, I mean totally jokes, but it's like like move over so we can pass on the left, um, but also I would. I would second my statement about um creating opportunities to amplify our voices. And so when, when you hear um a family moves in the neighborhood and they have daughters, like share about grow, grow, grow right.
Dr. Jody Batz:And and you know and and and share. You know, share opportunities. My daughter was involved with you know in it. Um so or or I know of, or here's, you know, here's somebody to connect with. So I think just just sharing that and sort of that rising tide lifts all ships and so just just that to me is like amplifying the voices. Um, I can't use the excuse that I've only been doing, you know, just just getting started.
Dr. Jody Batz:Um. So I think, just to be completely honest, like when I texted you or you texted me or we were thinking about texting each other, it was like kind of this, like weird creepy sort of thing. You're like creepy last time.
Magellan (Josh):I know you called me creepy, I know you cause you are creepy, but uh, but I think this is messed up.
Dr. Jody Batz:Man. Hey, hey, hey, hey, listen, listen, josh, she's not wrong, look, look who's talking.
The Guru (Dane):dana rough day man I'm sorry, dude, I've just come back.
Magellan (Josh):That hurt me, for like that hurt me for like weeks. I'm like oh my god I'm serious, like jody thinks I'm creepy. Like what am I doing?
The Guru (Dane):like no did he like reach out out of the blue? No, she reached out first no, I reached out, I did.
Dr. Jody Batz:Exactly yeah, so that's kind of creepy Like stop her. No, I reached out, and then you said oh my gosh, I was just thinking about you.
The Guru (Dane):You know what I?
Dr. Jody Batz:mean. Like reaching out, so it was like serendipitous that we came together.
Magellan (Josh):Not creepy at all, not creepy.
Dr. Jody Batz:It's said that. Yes, did he go? I was just thinking about it. He said it in text.
Magellan (Josh):He said it, however I can interpret it. Yeah, I said I was dating. I was just talking about bringing you on the street.
Dr. Jody Batz:But I, but I think that, um, I reached out to you because, um, I had this idea, um, I called my executive meetings in the middle of the night, and so, like hello, menopause, and you know I mean and owning a business and running a business and creating a nonprofit.
Dr. Jody Batz:You know your mind, like you know, in the middle of the night come up with these great ideas. But I had this idea, um, about creating a podcast for my girls and just creating space. And I'm like, because the shit they say is hysterical, Like it is absolutely hysterical, and they will be like peddling along and they're like motor mouths and like motor legs and, like you know, you just hear all this stuff and like we will just sit there and like all just look at each other Like I don't even know what to say. You know what I mean, and so then they'll school us on like the, the words to you. Like I mean it's just, it's, it's awesome and and it's so fun, and so I thought the world needs more of that. Like they need to hear these like little snippets. So that's why I reached out to you and so maybe my first, you know, or instead of, I've only been doing this is like helping me find a way to amplify my girls voices so, so let's start.
Magellan (Josh):I mean, if you're cool with it, let's start by getting them on this show totally and go wild. You can host it.
Dr. Jody Batz:Okay, danny, and I will sit in the background.
The Guru (Dane):Okay, you guys will be cracking up. We'll put that out as long as we're not creepy.
Dr. Jody Batz:No, yeah right, no, they'll put you in your place as long as we're not creepy.
The Guru (Dane):Yeah, that'll help. We'll have to bring on dance buttons.
Magellan (Josh):Yes, but then I'm happy to coach mentor, share, coach mentor like share the knowledge that I have relative to all the stuff that we've learned and setting it up, and then equipment and the online stuff and editing and all that stuff, that would be so awesome. All right, so let me give a shout out. We have a couple of people in the room that we have not mentioned and have not talked, and so I just want to, just want to you know, say thanks to these folks.
Magellan (Josh):So we have Ryan Cook there. Ryan's a senior at Micah high school and Ryan's going through his senior year right now and it's got to do a senior exit project and he asked if he could do it on the podcast, and so today's the first day that we've engaged with Ryan and he got to sit. Probably he's like Jesus dad, why?
Dr. Jody Batz:did you do this? He's traumatized. I promise you won't have to sit through another recording again, right.
Magellan (Josh):And this is like seven hours worth of credit as far as I'm concerned. So, but yeah. So kudos to Ryan. I love your fucking shoes. Those are awesome, I know.
Dr. Jody Batz:They match the mic colors.
Magellan (Josh):I'm colorblind so I didn't notice that, but those are sick. Are those Jordan's Air Force Ones? What are those? Yeah, which one? I didn't hear you Jordan's? Okay, yeah, those are sick, I like that. And then, uh, his dad, his dad Mark, uh, and then Sonya, his mom, was here. Anyways, kudos, thanks for coming.
Dr. Jody Batz:This is awesome, jody do you have any final words for our guests or for our listeners? Oh, man, um, just just watch what we're doing. So just um, we're one. We're on the gram, so we're on on Facebook, so I, um I.
Magellan (Josh):I want to share what those are.
Dr. Jody Batz:Yeah, so, um, we're grow girl, grow G R O girl, g I R L G R O. So grow girl, grow um. Facebook, instagram, Um, we, just we, we put. Everything that we put out there is just, it's real and it's authentic. I, I, I stopped, I. I've got a whole slew of bad badass lady coaches across the country that I connect with, and a big conversation a number of years ago was about social media and man, oh man, my type, a OCD PhD personality used to sit there and perseverate on the you know what I mean like, oh, is it the right reel and is it the right song?
The Guru (Dane):and just blast it like right and I'm just like you know what.
Dr. Jody Batz:I gave up that like first of all, just for time, but also, too, I'm just like you know what. I gave up that like first of all just for time, but also to I'm just like I just put out the raw and real, and it's like sometimes I posted the same picture twice. Whatever I'm like, I don't care, it's like, it's just. This is what we're. We're 32nd dance partying, we're snacking, we wear mismatched socks, and so we do that because we can, because it's silly and it's fun, and, like you'll see my girls in jorts and mishmat socks, it's fricking awesome. So, um, we're, we're excited to grow. Um, we're going to have um three overnight camps one in October, one in November, one in December.
Magellan (Josh):So I'll get for international listeners. That makes sense in the in the climate exactly in the desert exactly.
Dr. Jody Batz:And so the girls will learn how to bike pack, which means kind of loading, loading up their bike Um, it'll be a semi-supported, but we'll go for about an eight to 10 mile mountain bike ride and then, uh, set up tents and, and they have to phone each other before they phone an adult. So, to set up tents and and set up kitchen and and and kind of come, you know, come together with the flow of the kitchen and who's doing what and cleaning up dishes and all sorts of good stuff, um, and so then we'll, uh, we'll, the next day we'll do some trail stewardship, that maintenance, trail maintenance. So I'm just teaching the girls about we use the trails but then we give back. So to the trails, you know as well.
The Guru (Dane):So, um, so, I think just, I think, just just keeping an eye, you know watching us on Instagram.
Dr. Jody Batz:We have a YouTube channel, which is like I feel so fancy pants. So I'm like wow, so, um, and God bless, like amazing women in my life who've stepped forward and just offered to help, and so, um, have had people help me with website design and and and YouTube channel and all sorts of good stuff, and so, um, we do. We try to keep keep those updated. So we're not on, we're not on TikTok and I'm just not sure I'm going to go there quite yet.
Dr. Jody Batz:But you've got to curb the socials at some point in time, right yeah for sure. But yeah, I think, just keep an eye on what we're doing. So we're always looking for donations. Of course it's a nonprofit. We keep our costs.
Magellan (Josh):Do you have a donation link on your page? We do.
Dr. Jody Batz:yeah, it's on our website so you can go straight to donate. Um, we, I'm super stoked. We got a very generous donation of a cargo van donated. So to to, yeah, which is really awesome, and it's actually like semi built out, you know, to camp in, and so, um, I won't, I won't be hauling any girls, so in it. But um, money to wrap the windows. So, with our logo and the Tucson community stepped up and we raised all the money, so to wrap our windows.
The Guru (Dane):So, cirrus, visual local business is going to do it for us.
Dr. Jody Batz:Yeah, so. So Chris and Brad have been fantastic over there and so we're going to and it's kind of like our mobile um, we're calling it like our mobile clubhouse or a mobile, you know, I mean um spot, so that way we can sort of move around Tucson. And I want it to be sort of like when the girls see the van, you know, like they see the guru bikes, you know van is like like you know, and so when it's at the, at the trailhead, the biggest thing we're having a difficult time with this coming up with the fun tagline.
Magellan (Josh):And so I.
Dr. Jody Batz:I don't think that, like where girls can rule the world, would be appropriate.
Magellan (Josh):But um you know, sure you can figure out, yeah.
Dr. Jody Batz:So we've, we've got um our board of directors, we're having some good dialogue about just some some fun things and and, uh, one of them, one of the one of the front runners, is girls rule and confidence leads, and so, um of we don't want it to be like confidence, community connection. You know cause people like what is that?
Dr. Jody Batz:So it was like we want it to be something sort of fun, you know. But but about the girls? So we'll, we'll, we'll see. But yeah, the van will be wrapped here pretty soon, so I'm pretty stoked about that.
Magellan (Josh):Awesome. Well, jody, thanks for riding your bike over spending some time with us. Good to see you again. 18 months. I know exactly my.
Dr. Jody Batz:PTSD kicked in For sure.
Magellan (Josh):Ryan, thanks for coming out. Mark, thanks for coming out. Thanks so much. I love you, man. Yeah.
The Guru (Dane):You too.
