S6E24: A Call to Arms by Spiritual Anarchist Tara Sullivan Part 2/2

What happens when a woman stops behaving?

In Part 1 of this wide-ranging, fire-lit conversation, I’m joined by Tara Sullivan - Spiritual Anarchist, High Priestess of The Church of Tara, and proud W.I.T.C.H. (Woman in True Celebration of HerSelf).

We talk about spiritual anarchy, internal oppression, and the quiet (and not-so-quiet) ways women are trained to become obedient, palatable, and self-policing.

This episode moves through Tara’s path from actor to healer, the power of language to clarify identity, and why reclaiming sovereignty begins by dismantling the inner jailer.

We explore:

• Spiritual anarchy and blowing up the boxes we’ve internalised
• Language, naming, and how clarity sharpens purpose
• How obedience, “goodness,” and self-monitoring become internal oppression
• Healing as remembering the original blueprint beneath conditioning
• Why reclaiming pleasure, body, and intuition restores power
• Community, ritual, and creating spaces where women can speak freely

🎧 Part 2 continues with embodiment, pleasure as protest, political conditioning, and the creation of Elements of W.I.T.C.H.

Mentioned in this ep:

Listen to Tara's Call to Arms on Instagram here.

Elements of W.I.T.C.H. | A Crash Course in Spiritual Anarchy, Self Sovereignty, & Sacred Insurgency
🗓 February 15–22, 2026
🔥 8 days. 5 elements. 1 revolution.
💥 $88
👉 Join the revolution at www.churchoftara.com/elements 

PLEASURE | A Life-Lubricating Soul Soak

An on-demand pleasure-packed masterclass for women ready to fuel life, leadership, and liberation with aliveness.

👉 Say yes to pleasure as protest here 

___


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Transcript

Tara Sullivan: [00:00:00] Like we went from being matrilineal tribes, , where everybody shared all the goods and everything like that.

Tara Sullivan: And all of a sudden you get, , the patriarchal tribes coming in and conquering and suddenly the sky gods are, marrying the goddess and walking on, , walking on us. And also like it becomes a whole thing about how we have to own, like we own land and we own.

Tara Sullivan: And so all of a sudden our pleasure becomes something that has to be for one specific person. 

Kylie Patchett: Welcome to Wild and finally fucking Free the show for disruptors, rebels, and revolutionaries who know they're here to change the damn world. I'm Kylie Patchett, your voice and visibility catalyst, and here we dive into unapologetic truth, magnetic messaging and visibility. That actually feels good. In your body, your bones, and your business.

Kylie Patchett: We share the stories of the out of the box, neuro sparkly, creative, [00:01:00] witchy, wild ones, rewriting how we live, love, learn, and lead. This isn't about being louder, it's about being rooted, resonant, and regulated, so you can be real raw and ready to raw. If you're done, contorting yourself to fit the mold and you're ready to own your voice, your power, and your place in the revolution, welcome home.

Kylie Patchett: Let's dive in.

Kylie Patchett: Hi there. Welcome to the podcast again. This is part two of a two part podcast with Tara Sullivan, who is a spiritual anarchist. We are talking about her release of her signature program, elements of which all about her journey into self sovereignty, pleasures, protests, spiritual anarchy, and coming home to yourself under the layers of conditioning.

Kylie Patchett: If you're a woman who. Has at any point in your life thought, how the fuck did [00:02:00] I get here? How have I come so far away from who I am underneath all the layers of conditioning? This is an episode for you. This is a call to arms. I'm so excited to share it. If you haven't listened to part one, go back and listen to that and let's dive in.

Kylie Patchett: Because I think that extremism, it's like pick a camp and it's like I'm an individual human and there's lots of nuances about how I think and feel about lots of different things. And to have communities like what you have with Cove and what you're creating online, where people are welcome to come as they are with whatever opinion that they have.

Kylie Patchett: And exactly like you said, yes, I may not agree necessarily, and that may not be my choice, but I'm not gonna make you the enemy if you don't align a thousand percent, because then that's just more oppression. Like, we're just creating more of the same.

Kylie Patchett: Can you tell me, I, I, I remember you saying to me like you had a moment in time where, and I think it was when you were writing the book, which, or I would also love [00:03:00] for you to talk about, because it's coming back to the rules and the commandments, right?

Kylie Patchett: Where you had the idea for the program that you're just about to open in February, which is called Elements of which I'm super excited about. I feel like the timing is perfect. How did that come to you? Because I, for someone who is so connected to energy and the flow of life. I, I really would love to know how that kind of fell into your awareness.

Kylie Patchett: Yeah, 

Tara Sullivan: it was like two year, I think it was two years ago in like October. Mm-hmm. So just a little two year mark and I, it was right before Halloween here. And of course, already being deeply into coven and deeply into ness and like all of that kind of stuff. I was like, sort of like walking along on my way to work.

Tara Sullivan: And like I was thinking about there, there were those songs out there about like women, women in total charge of herself Yes. And women in total control or com, mm-hmm. A true, all of that kind of stuff. And I, , I like those, but I [00:04:00] was like, I need a better c like, 

Kylie Patchett: control 

Tara Sullivan: and charge just doesn't work for me.

Tara Sullivan: Like, and so like, again with that, like, I feel like I, I'm often like tumbling ideas around in my 

Kylie Patchett: head. 

Tara Sullivan: Mm-hmm. Like, and all of a sudden it was like celebration a woman in true celebration of herself. And that was just like. It reminds, I don't know if you've ever seen the movie Hell Raiser with the Puzzle Box, um, but there's this moment where the puzzle box twists and everything like that, and when it gets to the right place, it's like all this light pours out.

Kylie Patchett: Yes. Yep. Yep. It's 

Tara Sullivan: like that kind of moment, like the pieces slotted together was like a ha 

Kylie Patchett: It's like Yep. Universal download. And, 

Tara Sullivan: and again, with this whole idea of like, when we are in true celebration of ourself, when we are accepting of all of our parts, when we enjoy who we are, like yes, of course.

Tara Sullivan: That's when we become magical. Yeah. That's of course when we find out all of our gifts and talents. Yeah. Like of course that's when that happens. 

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. And [00:05:00] so 

Tara Sullivan: like that sort of tumbled around and then it was like, oh, now we need to do a, a, like now, like let's talk about like how we like align with the cycle of the universe and like we, we as women particularly, right?

Tara Sullivan: Like we are cyclical and so is the world. Like we, , days and weeks and months and years and like around the sun and like, so the first version of which was very much about aligning with the energies that were going on in it. So like, I made these amazing workbooks for everybody who participated, where every day there was a daily prompt that like lined up with the moon cycle.

Tara Sullivan: Mm-hmm. And like we're at and how do we eat in alignment and all of that. Amazing. And like lots of people got, a lot out of that. And, but then somewhere along the line in the sort of like aftermath of that, as I was thinking about it, I was sort of in this place of like, oh wait, I put the cart before the horse, 

Kylie Patchett: which [00:06:00] you and I have in common.

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. Like, 

Tara Sullivan: I'm ahead, I'm ahead on this. Like, the first thing we need to do is actually reclaim our witch. 

Kylie Patchett: Yes. 

Tara Sullivan: Before we can get our witch. Like we gotta, we gotta do the work in here of alignment before we do the workout there for alignment. So. That's when this new elements of which started bubbling. And that in of itself, like as we were talking about it and I'm, I'm one of those people who always likes to structure for a workshop and I, , I was thinking about sort of like how long I wanted it to be and was thinking like 70 days, something like that.

Tara Sullivan: And then I was like, oh, well witch, I'll use the pentagram. Of course that makes total 

Kylie Patchett: sense. Yeah, of course we 

Tara Sullivan: would. That's earth, air, fire, water, spirit. Great. 

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. 

Tara Sullivan: And then somewhere in the process of working with that, I was like, oh, thank you. Because earth, air, fire, water, spirit, pleasure and passion is fire.

Tara Sullivan: And yes, earth is [00:07:00] body and water is emotions and uh, air is thoughts and spirit is connection with higher power. Those are. Absolutely the tools of spiritual anarchy, like these are the things that we need to reclaim in order to actually blow up those boxes and become sovereign in our own lives again.

Tara Sullivan: It's 

Kylie Patchett: reconnection to our power because as above, so below, like everything that's happening in the cosmos is happening inside of us, but we've been disconnected from it. 

Tara Sullivan: Totally. And, and just that again, like it was one of those gifts of the universe, it was like, yeah, of course I'm gonna use the pentacle.

Tara Sullivan: Like that makes sense as a structure. And then it was Oh, 

Kylie Patchett: oh 

Tara Sullivan: wow. That's brilliant. Thank you for that. Like, 

Kylie Patchett: so good. As you were saying, the elements, I, I have this picture in my head of like this beautiful golden thread going down each of the, I love drawing stars. I've draw stars all over everything.

Kylie Patchett: Always have, [00:08:00] I always looking at a workbook from like grade five when I was chucking things out on the weekend and there's like stars all over it. I'm like, oh my God. There was literally signposts back then when I was 10. But yeah, that like. The golden thread of the, and it also reminds me like echoes the, the five element theory is like understanding that there is a flow of all of these elements inside of us and that it is the harmony.

Kylie Patchett: It's kind of back to that, like what needs to kind of quiet down a little bit, what needs to be invited to its full expression. How do we get into more flow with our own cycle? With the cycle of the moon, with the cycle of, yeah, everything. Oh, I've got goosebumps. I remember when we, we first started talking about, um, elements of wi well, which in general, and you're like, and I can do this and this and this, and I was like, oh, this is like a whole series of magical like work, I don't, what do we call them?

Kylie Patchett: We didn't end up calling them workshops. It's like an experience is what I wanna say. 'cause I feel like it's like immersion. Go in and then come out. Tell us a little bit about the [00:09:00] structure of the actual online program. So it starts on February 15th, goes to the 22nd, so very, very soon. 

Tara Sullivan: Yes. And I actually took a page out of your book, um, with scene in that the opening and closing circles are live on Zoom.

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. 

Tara Sullivan: And one of the things I loved about scene was that because you were putting up the days in between those circles, like. In, , they, they were recorded and there was an opportunity to do them whenever it actually worked. Yes. For your life. 

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. 

Tara Sullivan: And I'm really aware that my soulmate clients are women's who to-do list is never done.

Tara Sullivan: Yeah. , we're give women, we're out there, we've got big lives and we're doing a lot of things. And so to find the time to do our own personal work, I wanted it to be something where people could like drop in. In their own timeframe as opposed to like, you have to show up on Zoom at this time every single night for a week, which doesn't work for anyone.[00:10:00] 

Tara Sullivan: Um, not well anyway. Right. At least in my experience, it doesn't work for me. Let's say that. 

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. Well, and, and I would say that as an indication it doesn't work for all my clients. Right. Um, and having done activations where it has been, , five days every day, it's too much for people. It's too much for me as a facilitator as well.

Kylie Patchett: I love the fact that you've taken like this beautiful coven community space and translated it to an online experience where people get to marinate in your energy to open the circle. Then they dive into the five elements each day, or there's two days for one, there's 

Tara Sullivan: two days of pleasure because one day is not enough.

Kylie Patchett: Exactly. And they get this beautiful experience. And when we were kind of like. Talking about the key takeaways, it's like it's spiritual anarchy, it's sacred insurgency, because as we were talking about, it's like we can't change the world without actually clearing out the shit. So this is like step one of not only, it's not just clearing out the shit, it's becoming aware of [00:11:00] what's under there.

Kylie Patchett: Because so much of this is unconscious and it's not until we come into spaces like this. 

Tara Sullivan: Yeah. And I think there's a, it's not only the clearing out, but it's also about allowing ourselves to be resourced. Yes. Right. When we are disconnected from our pleasure, when we're disconnected from our bodies, when we're not paying attention to everything our emotions are telling us.

Tara Sullivan: When our inner critic is running the, and when we think that we need somebody else to interpret the universe from us, like that SAPs our energy. And, , I always come back to Audra Lorde and the uses of the erotic, and she says, for women, particular for feminine energy, like one of the greatest resources is pleasure.

Tara Sullivan: It, it fills our wells. It helps us to define who we are as humans, and it also gives us a directional single a compass. 

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. 

Tara Sullivan: To operate in the world. And like, so yes to the, like clearing out the shit, but also like, let's. Plug ourselves [00:12:00] back into the truth of ourselves and the truth of the universe so that we actually have all the energy that we need in order to go out there and build the revolutions Yes.

Tara Sullivan: That we want. 

Kylie Patchett: And that's why I've got my, I've got a jukebox in my head as , 24 7. And I've got children of the revolution playing in my, because we are in revolutionary times. Like there is a huge shift happening and we, the, those of us who are here to be part of the change are being called to arms.

Kylie Patchett: And that's why that rally cry was such a, actually we'll link to anyone who hasn't seen the rally cry on Instagram absolutely fucking needs to go. And just like, I feel like it should be everyone's homework on the daily. It's like you cannot listen to what you say in that clip without having this like.

Kylie Patchett: Cellular response to the call, to your own power and magic and sovereignty and saying no to the systems of oppression. I wanna talk about pleasure for a second because which is the [00:13:00] 15th, the 22nd elements of which to use the whole title, which we'll put in the show notes. You also have an on demand soul soak called Pleasure, which is something that people can access whenever they want.

Kylie Patchett: So tell us about that, because you said to me in a call, you were like, pleasure is protest. And I was like, fuck yes. 'cause I have such a. I've talked about this on the podcast before. I'm very much a, like, I have to get the things done before I get the joy or the pleasure. And I'm really, and that's actually thanks to a lot of the conversations and exposure to you and your work where I've gone.

Kylie Patchett: No, I've gotta ask about, like, this is about filling me up so that then I can turn up. But yeah, when you said pleasure is protest, I'm like, oh, hello. That's one of those chiropractic adjustments of the soul moment. So tell us a bit about pleasure as well. 

Tara Sullivan: So pleasure. I mean, it's a three part workshop.

Tara Sullivan: Yes. Um, and like you said, it's on demand, so it's right there. There's a, the, a little bit at the beginning, which is sort of the history of how we went from worshiping the goddess and pleasure being a [00:14:00] sacrament 

Kylie Patchett: Yes. 

Tara Sullivan: To the place where we are now, which is right, like you might be allowed pleasure after you've done everything else, but even then, pleasure is something that we should be suspect for.

Kylie Patchett: And it, it can only be a certain, a certain way for good girls, which is the vast majority of gender socialization for females as good girls or people pleasing or caretaking or whatever. Yeah. 

Tara Sullivan: And, and there's a direct line. It again, it's, it's politics and it's 

Kylie Patchett: Yep. 

Tara Sullivan: Right? Like we went from being matrilineal tribes, , where everybody shared all the goods and everything like that.

Tara Sullivan: And all of a sudden you get, , the patriarchal tribes coming in and conquering and suddenly the sky gods are, marrying the goddess and walking on, , walking on us. 

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. 

Tara Sullivan: And like with the feminine gets, and also like it becomes a whole thing about how we have to own, like we own land and we own.

Tara Sullivan: And so all of a sudden our pleasure becomes something that has to be for one specific person. Because if you're gonna pass on your [00:15:00] goods to your children, you need to know that your 

Kylie Patchett: children's 

Tara Sullivan: be, so now we gotta lock women up in chastity belts and, and , the idea of women is as chaotic pleasure machines.

Tara Sullivan: Gets, is born in all of that. And then you get Plato, who he Play-Doh. Yeah. Lots of good things as far as scientific method and all that kind of stuff. Yes. Critical thinking. But his whole thing about the body being a trap for the soul, , the duality of that. Like, we wanna get away from the body, .

Tara Sullivan: The body is like evil and where, like it can lead you astray. It's like, uh, no, it is the one source of truth 

Tara Sullivan: it away from spirit. Yeah. Because that's where we're supposed to be. 

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. 

Tara Sullivan: And then the early church fathers pick that up and run with it. , which is where we get the concept of original sin and the idea that, , that's born through women and all of that kind of stuff.

Tara Sullivan: And then it gets picked up again by Martin Luther and the Calvinists and all of that. Yes. [00:16:00] Which then becomes the whole puritan work ethic, , where we're just supposed to be grinding and that you're allowed to have pleasure when you get to heaven, but pleasure here. Absolutely not. ? And then, and now we're here where, , we're in a place where, where you're starting to see a little bit of rebellion.

Tara Sullivan: Like a couple years ago, I think it was the first summer of the, of the COVID lockdown. Yeah. Where suddenly like there were all these news stories about CEOs pitching a fit about people quiet, quitting. And the idea of it was like, oh, I'm only going to do the work that you're paying me for the hours that you're actually paying me to do it.

Kylie Patchett: Yes. Horrendous, horrendous boundaries. You're bad. 

Tara Sullivan: And the idea that, what, I mean, what that made clear to me, the fact that they were having such a temper tantrum about it was like how much of the world economy is being run on unpaid labor? 

Kylie Patchett: Lots of it in homes and in corporations. Yeah. Yeah. 

Tara Sullivan: And , but the person who overextends [00:17:00] themselves, , and I, you see it in mommy culture everywhere.

Tara Sullivan: Like the person who's baking those organic cupcakes while running the dance mom circuit and getting the kids to baseball practice 

Kylie Patchett: and looking like a supermodel 

Tara Sullivan: and being a CEO, ? Mm-hmm. 

Kylie Patchett: Mm-hmm. 

Tara Sullivan: Mm-hmm. That then she wins. Even though, and you can see it like we do this sort of like humble brag thing that we do where we talk about like, oh my God, I'm so tired and I'm so Lee low resource, but like, look at all these cupcakes that I made, right?

Tara Sullivan: Like it's just. Whoever is able to produce the most Yes. While taking the least out of the system. 

Kylie Patchett: Correct. 

Tara Sullivan: Which 

Kylie Patchett: is exactly, yes. Yeah, exactly. That's what I'm, when I was watching the pleasure introduction, so like the history of where like the pleasure has been taken away or stripped away or made wrong or whatever, I was like, oh my God.

Kylie Patchett: And I get like this, like I just did about a year ago, a whole heap of interviews that I've never released, which I am going to, but it was about disruption in all different industries, right? And then as I was having the conversations, [00:18:00] I'm like, oh my God, it all goes together. All of the systems of oppression.

Kylie Patchett: And I dunno why that was surprising, but when I was watching that workshop with yours, I was like. Oh my God. Like, I think that I'm a fairly self-aware person, but I was like, I have not made any of these connections or most of those connections before. Um, and then after that, like going into the actual, so what's part two and three in the, in the pleasure 

Tara Sullivan: part two is finding your own compass, like understanding, like feeling it in your body where your yeses and your nos are that, , to, to understand how your body responds.

Tara Sullivan: Yes. Like you can use that as a compass, right? Like we wanna move towards the things that feel good and move away from the things that don't. Always with discernment, of course. Because right there are going to be those things that are absolutely right for us, where we're pushing up against our own limitations that feel terrible.

Kylie Patchett: Yes. 

Tara Sullivan: Yes. And so you have, there gotta be those things that like. Feel like safety and security. And so there's a sense of home in them that are absolutely the wrong [00:19:00] thing. So there's always discernment in it. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. But we have to know how we actually feel about it. Yes. And like not only emotionally feel, but like what's the actual sensations in our bodies and how do we use those in order to navigate our lives?

Tara Sullivan: And I truly believe , people are talking about like, oh, what's the secret to life? Like, I truly believe it's do more of what you love and less of what you hate. And find a way to make that happen. Hundred percent. Like that's simple. 

Audio Only - All Participants-1: Mm-hmm. 

Tara Sullivan: Mm-hmm. 

Kylie Patchett: And yet that is like doing what you actually desire, leaning towards your desires, doing things that feel good, has been so demonized, particularly for good girls, good women, good moms, good bloody blah blah, that it like we are just about to, like, in my personal life, we've just decided to do something massive that is a lean towards a huge desire.

Kylie Patchett: Oh my God, Brian, the fucking fear committee in my head is going absolutely to town. And like you were saying with Brittany before, I'm like, oh, hello my [00:20:00] friend. Welcome in. You absolutely have a seat at the table. You're not driving the bus. But I wanna know what is so scary to you? And so much of it a societal expectation.

Kylie Patchett: It's not my desires, it's not my values. It's not my, like you say, the yuck and yum in the body. Like when I'm really in the feeling of doing this thing, I am, I feel like I'm lit up from the inside. That is my, yes, it's very clear. Yes, I am fucking terrified. But that is like, , the fear is there to keep us safe.

Kylie Patchett: And safe means what we've known. And when we are here to create revolutions in our own lives and in the world, like we are not doing known, that's scary shit. Like that's why, , call to paradigm shifters. 'Cause I'm like, if you're a paradigm shifter, you are. And sometimes we haven't owned it yet.

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. Like your work in the world is rubbing up and challenging so many different systems of oppression. It's like, oh yeah. And it, that's scary. 'cause we are pioneering, we are going first. It's [00:21:00] never been done before. But I just, I so delight in the fact that you are like, no pleasure is protest. Like all of this is connected, healing and politics.

Kylie Patchett: Pleasure and protests. Like actually being sovereign is insurgency. Like they're all connected. You can't do one without the other. 

Tara Sullivan: Well, and like, like Audra Lord lays that out in that essay was Yes. One of the reasons we've been cut off from our pleasure is because it is such a source of power. Yeah. It is a, a, a compass for us in the world, a way of defining ourselves.

Tara Sullivan: Mm-hmm. It has been deliberate that we have been cut off from it because, and again, like when we were talking earlier about what's happening in the world and the homogenization and all of that kind of stuff, you don't work this hard to repress something unless how powerful and how dangerous it is to your control.

Kylie Patchett: Correct, correct. Scary, scary. I mean, you don't want the people to have their own sense of what's right and wrong for themselves. 

Tara Sullivan: [00:22:00] Well, and imagine if women stopped uh, I think about the beauty industry all the time, like the obsession that we have with like looking younger and with being thinner and like all of those kinds of things.

Tara Sullivan: And I think about the amount of money that we, and time and energy that we spend trying to be like some version of perfect. That is absolutely unachievable. I mean, right. Like even the 20 something yoga bodies don't look like they do in the magazines. Yeah, 

Kylie Patchett: exactly. 

Tara Sullivan: Right. But if we took all of that time and energy and money and everything like that and refocused it like we could take over the world.

Kylie Patchett: Correct. That's 

Audio Only - All Participants-1: why 

Kylie Patchett: No. Like 

Tara Sullivan: we have the resources for that. Yeah. And so it like keep us obsessed with God, if I eat this, am I gonna gain a pound? , like, well the 

Kylie Patchett: easiest way to control someone is to say, there's something about yourself you need to fix. So then all of the energy goes into, oh my God.

Kylie Patchett: You're right. I need to. And of course, us humans are very good at [00:23:00] thinking there's something wrong with us and not the world. Um, I am really, really interested too, when we are talking about this pleasure end of things. One of the things that you have often said to me is like, moving the body is like moving the trash compactor of like, which I love.

Kylie Patchett: 'cause every time I get like sluggish in my head, I'm like, Tara would be telling me to start moving. And what has been wild for me, it's only a very short amount of time, but I have just committed this year to moving in ways that feel pleasurable. Mm-hmm. So I've always moved, uh, I'm, I'm a long way away from what I used to be, which was like controlling the size of my body.

Kylie Patchett: That was definitely where I, , was in my early life. But now I'm like, how could I move today in a way that honors myself, moves the trash compactor, keeps my energetic state? Well actually one of the things that I'm really noticing is like, I've been doing yoga just in my backyard. So whilst two dogs are trying to get me to throw a ball, and it's quite chaotic, [00:24:00] but just choosing to be in my body with no.

Kylie Patchett: Person leading me, no particular time I'm outside. I'm usually in the morning sun. So I'm literally like, , saying good morning to the sun and grounding and I'm like, oh, this is wild. Because A, it doesn't feel like hard work, but it is opening up a day in a pleasurable way and all of a sudden it's like possibilities are endless.

Kylie Patchett: Whereas when I go to the gym and I'm only doing that sort of very structured, it tends to like tighten and narrow my point of view. And so that's like, oh, how could I open? How could pleasure be? Like the whole purpose 

Tara Sullivan: and 

Kylie Patchett: I, 

Tara Sullivan: yeah. Well, I mean, yes, please. And I think you could go to the gym in that same sense of openness.

Tara Sullivan: Yes, you could definitely, , if that was what works for you, but like paying attention. Where is the joy? Where is the, what is the thing that we do that makes us go like, oh, thank God I have a body. [00:25:00] 

Kylie Patchett: Yes. , 

Tara Sullivan: I mean, it's such a gift, this amazing vehicle that been given in order to explore this plane of existence.

Tara Sullivan: Mm-hmm. , I did this meditation at one point where you like went back in, like it took you back through your life to, before you incarnated this time round. Mm-hmm. So that you could find out what your purpose was in coming back. Yeah. And I came back and I was like, I am reincarnated because I really love having a body.

Kylie Patchett: Yes. 

Tara Sullivan: And I everyone else to really love having a body too. Like I just. Can't taste chocolate if you don't have a body and you like hear are the waves and you can't like, smell a baby. Like things that are so joyful. Yeah. And we, we so often don't give ourselves any permission to have any of those experiences because we've got our head down, we've got the deadline and we've got 

Kylie Patchett: the grind, right?

Kylie Patchett: The grind, the grind. Worshiping at the altar of extraction as I often say, which I'm very good at. And I'm like, oh, [00:26:00] how about we just change direction here and worship at the altar of sacred self reclamation, which is exactly your work in the world. 

Tara Sullivan: I mean, I call it the cult of self deprivation. Yeah.

Tara Sullivan: ? Yeah. 

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. That was, um, that was a moment in time. I had, I've spoken about this before on the podcast, but this moment where I was listening to a podcast with, um, Glennon Doyle. So, um, we can do hard things, but she was talking to someone. I can never remember who it is. And if I cared enough, I'd go backwards, but I don't.

Kylie Patchett: Um, but the question was where have you been self abandoning? Like how many ways and means have you been self abandoning? And this was in an era where I was still in a corporate job. I was crying every morning before I went. I was undiagnosed A DHD had all sorts of trauma coming to the, and I was just a fucking basket case.

Kylie Patchett: And I was like literally every single area of my life, I'm abandoning at work, at home, in relationships, parenting, friendship, like everywhere because I'd been so well trained to do [00:27:00] it. And this is why I'm so passionate about helping people like you amplify their work in the world because it's like we need all the help we can get to come back to who we actually are underneath all of this shit.

Kylie Patchett: And 

Tara Sullivan: we need everybody's. Truth. Right. Like I, in the beginning of the book I talk about, there's a zen cone that says that truth is a mountain and all of life is standing at the pace of it. Yeah. And depending on where you're standing, yes, you've got a particular view. Mm-hmm. But if we want to have a, a bigger, more comprehensive view of what truth is, we need everybody's Yes.

Tara Sullivan: Truth to be shared. Yeah. Which it was one of the things that gave me permission to write a book was it's like, all that imposter syndrome stuff coming up and like finally come to the place of like, okay, nobody's else has got my view of truth mountain. 

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. 

Tara Sullivan: So I, like I can say I'm an expert in my view of the truth.

Tara Sullivan: Yes. And so like, here it is and do with it what you want. And if it works for you, great. And if it doesn't, that's also fine. Hopefully it gets you closer to whatever [00:28:00] your version of the truth is. 

Kylie Patchett: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And I always love, like when I, like I, I totally get the imposter syndrome like I used to book coach, so I've heard, I've heard it all before and I'm like, no.

Kylie Patchett: But we need all the sources of the ways to come home to ourselves because different people are gonna resonate with different people. And that's why we always talk about being your whole self. Because if you're not being your whole self in the marketplace, as someone who is here to lead. People can't even see you and your magic.

Kylie Patchett: So yeah, that's a massive, massive part. Do you wanna, let's tie up in terms of, I wanna talk about the commandments in the book, and then we'll give people the verbal URLs to everything that we've talked about, but also they're gonna be in the show notes. So tell us a bit about like the, the concept of the commandments in the book.

Kylie Patchett: I love this. 

Tara Sullivan: Yeah. So, so the story comes in two parts, right? Mm-hmm. So when I first realized I didn't wanna be an actor anymore mm-hmm. I, I, like I said, I'd been acting since I was six years old. Yeah. And it had been this like, especially once I decided it was going to be my [00:29:00] life, like it became this sort of like homing beacon for me.

Tara Sullivan: Yes. Right? Like, I made decisions based on does this get me closer to being, doing eight shows a week on Broadway, or does it take me away? So my life was sort of very black and white in that. Mm-hmm. And when I realized. I, being an actor didn't make me happy. So that beacon went off. Yeah. So what all of a sudden my entire life was gray and like how do you make a decision in that?

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. 

Tara Sullivan: And thank God I was in therapy, thank God. Um, and my therapist had only recently like outed herself to me as an intuitive. After like three years of work together, she finally tells me she's psychic. And I had just gone through this thing where I was considered considering stepping into the ministry.

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. And I would've been a Unitarian minister because Yes, they don't. Yes, of course. Yes. Like, you believe what you wanna believe and I believe what I wanna believe. Mm-hmm. And, uh. I had realized, like for me, I often have to try on ideas like you try on clothes. Yeah. Like how does it, and it's literally like, what's the sensation of it?

Tara Sullivan: Mm-hmm. In my body. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And it didn't [00:30:00] fit. Yeah. It didn't fit. Was like this just does not work. And so I showed up for therapy and shared this and, , I was kind of hoping to have a, , next right. Decision, like right there. And, um, so I told her this and then I looked at her. I was like, so what do you see for me?

Tara Sullivan: And I, I didn't know if she would actually like, use that intuitive gift, but she did. She sort of like looked off into the corner for a minute and then she says, , I can't really ever see you joining any kind of organized religion. Yeah. And I thought that, that, that feels about right. Yep.

Tara Sullivan: And then she looked at me like right in the eye and she said, however, I can see you starting the Church of Tara and inviting other people to come. And like in that moment I went like, huh. And just clearly filed it away somewhere. Yeah, 

Kylie Patchett: yeah, yeah. 

Tara Sullivan: Like we just sort of moved on to other things.

Tara Sullivan: 'cause it was not like this revelatory, like, you, you should go into whatever, , I wanted something concrete. Get this thing. [00:31:00] So then fast forward I don't know, 11, 12 years, something like that. 

Kylie Patchett: Mm-hmm. 

Tara Sullivan: I had just gone to see a friend of mine in a show. It was my first time seeing him on stage.

Tara Sullivan: And I mean he, it was a revelation. I mean, he stepped out and he, he's a person who like is pretty closed off in life. And when I, he stepped on stage, he was like wide open. Mm-hmm. Like his, I mean, he was so expansive and so radiant and like every part of me was like, yes. And so after the show we went out and, , did all of the postmortem stuff.

Tara Sullivan: Finally we're like at his place, it's like three o'clock in the morning. We're both drinking like bullet rye out of water glasses, ? 

Kylie Patchett: That's 

Tara Sullivan: right. And the, and he says, finally the conversation turns back to me and he says, you keep talking about wanting to have a larger platform. Mm-hmm. What does that, and in this very like half tipsy drunk on his light kind of place.

Kylie Patchett: Yep. [00:32:00] 

Tara Sullivan: Yep. Fell outta my mouth. In that moment was, well if I'm really honest, I'd like 5 million people to come to the Church of Terror. And his eyes got about this big likes, big bold expressions. And he said, alright, tell me what the Church of Terror is. And I was like, fuck if I know. 

Kylie Patchett: I dunno, but that feels like truth.

Tara Sullivan: Totally. And then a friend of mine said to me, I told her this story and she said, . You keep saying you wanna have a larger platform, that's what you have to call it. And I was like, what? She's like, you have to call it the Church of Terror. I was, no, no. I can't call myself a church. Like, not even the craziest cult leaders call themselves a church.

Tara Sullivan: No. People are gonna think I'm an egomaniac. And she was like, you keep saying like, we know as thought leaders, we need to put our stake in the sand and say this. Yes, we 

Kylie Patchett: do. We're 

Tara Sullivan: and so, and she was like, oh look, and Church of tara.com and the church of tara.com are both available. You should buy them.

Tara Sullivan: And so I did, but I never expected to use them. But like, I'm a good [00:33:00] New Englander, and like once we start paying money for something, then it feels like we need to do something. 

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. 

Tara Sullivan: One of those, it was like, they were like sand in the oyster, those $26 URLs. Mm-hmm. ? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. 

Kylie Patchett: Um, 

Tara Sullivan: and so again, tumbling.

Tara Sullivan: Tumbling and one day, like it was, this thought sort of washed up like, well, the, the. There's the 10 Commandments that are part of the Abrahamic religions. Yeah. What would be the church of what would be the 10 commandments of the 

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. What would be mine? 

Tara Sullivan: Yeah. Yeah. And then I was like, Ooh, that's what the book is, but what are my 10 commandments?

Tara Sullivan: And so that was, that was how that was born. And the, , for a long time the title of it was like the Church of Tara 10 Commandments for getting out of your own way and allowing your Best Life to unfold. Really long title. 

Kylie Patchett: I like Spiritual Anarchy much better than that. 

Tara Sullivan: That spiritual anarchy might be the next book.

Tara Sullivan: 'cause at the moment 

Kylie Patchett: I'm, well yes, that's true. 

Tara Sullivan: At the moment I'm running with like, operating instructions for being human. The 10 Commandments of the Church of [00:34:00] Tara is sort of 

Kylie Patchett: where, yeah, I like that. 

Tara Sullivan: And it's all about how do we reconnect with ourselves and how do we, , and, and it's things like, , obviously prioritize Your pleasure is a big one.

Kylie Patchett: Yes. 

Tara Sullivan: But it's, , it, one of them is embrace ecstatic experimentalism, right? Like the idea that instead of trying to make the right decision all the time, that the goal of any choice is more information. 

Kylie Patchett: Yep. Yep. , 

Tara Sullivan: be your own best advocate, right? Like, if you are not willing to stand for yourself and your own needs And your wants.

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. 

Tara Sullivan: Like how can you expect anybody else to, which is exactly. I have to learn over and over again. 

Kylie Patchett: Yeah, I know, right? It's the edge. 

Tara Sullivan: Right? It's like, wait, what about me? 

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. ? 

Tara Sullivan: Yeah. Yeah. And of course the big thing, the big revelation or, and it's right there at the beginning, is like, we're all churches.

Tara Sullivan: Every single one of us is sacred space. If you call yourself a church or a temple or a mosque or a synagogue or a sacred grove beside a sacred river, like whatever it is, you [00:35:00] are holy in and of yourself and you, like you always say, right. There's never been a you before and there never will be again. And if you don't bring the full expression of yourself to the world, like all of us miss out.

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. Every single one of us. And my addition to that is it is not the fuck about us when we are called to deliver things to the world. We need to get outta the way because it's not for us. I mean, it is for us. It's deeply satisfying to be in your life purpose, but also. Us choosing that we are not, not good enough, or that we've got an imposter syndrome and no, I can't do that, or whatever.

Kylie Patchett: It's stealing from the rest of us and that is something that I just can't stand for anymore. 

Tara Sullivan: I truly believe like we talk about purpose and it's always that thing that's outside of ourselves. Yes. But I truly believe like in that star trekky kind of way, like the prime directive for each and every one of us is to be the most fully expressed version of ourselves.

Tara Sullivan: Like that's what we came here to do. 

Kylie Patchett: A hundred 

Tara Sullivan: percent. And we came here to do it. Being [00:36:00] human, which means being imperfect and having a body. 

Kylie Patchett: Yes. Having a body and all the deliciousness that comes with that. So good. So good. All right. I wanna say to people that have been listening to you and just like either nodding along or going, oh fuck, okay.

Kylie Patchett: I have just been called out, called to arms. When you think about like elements coming up. And, and, or like pleasure you can get anytime. So that, and actually we should sh share that it is at church of terror.com/pleasure for pleasure. Um, and slash Elements for Elements, which is a live program that's coming up 15th, the 22nd of February.

Kylie Patchett: Someone's listening and they're like, oh, there is something here that I am being called to lean into. What would you say to them about coming to Elements? 

Tara Sullivan: Oh, I mean, right. If there's that part of you, I'm, I'm all about empowering people to listen to their own inner voice. Yes. Like, people will say to me like, [00:37:00] after a session, so like, when can I come back?

Tara Sullivan: Mm-hmm. And my thing to them is always like, , unless there is something like, unless we didn't do all the work that could be done today. 

Kylie Patchett: Mm-hmm. 

Tara Sullivan: Or there's something going on where I'm gonna be like, okay, I, it would be great if I could see you back next week so that we could like, finish this 

Kylie Patchett: out.

Kylie Patchett: Yes. 

Tara Sullivan: Continue. Yes. What I am going to always tell people is please listen to yourself. Listen to your own body. Like, see see how this, the work settles for you. See how this conversation settles for you. Mm-hmm. And then make a decision from your own wisdom. I can't tell you what to do. You are the only authority on you.

Tara Sullivan: And so if you are feeling that yes. And you please come play. Please come be part of the Yeah, 

Kylie Patchett: please 

Tara Sullivan: own your own witch. Like, I, I would love to have you. And if it's not right for right now, or if you wanna dabble in either pleasure or the other one that I have embodied, which is all about, coming back into relationship with our bodies, um, dabble in that or , if none of this resonates, like go find the person who does.

Tara Sullivan: [00:38:00] 'cause there's so many. 

Kylie Patchett: Exactly. Trust 

Tara Sullivan: yourself. Yeah. 

Kylie Patchett: So good. Oh, I always love chatting with you, but thank you for bringing your magic to this show and yeah, I just, it's such a beautiful experience for me to be like in the presence of someone that's stepping into the bigness of the vision and. Yeah, actually surrendering to their magnificence.

Kylie Patchett: Like I use that language all the time, but it's like I am going to feel the fear or hear the Britney and I'm still leaning towards it because I know that this is part of my purpose. So thank you as well. 

Tara Sullivan: Well, thank you for your inspiration and for doing that same work, because if you hadn't stepped, if you hadn't told Brian to sit on the beach, shut up last year for sake.

Tara Sullivan: Like I wouldn't be here right now, so. 

Kylie Patchett: Yeah. Crazy. Hey, 

Tara Sullivan: I appreciate that. Yeah, 

Kylie Patchett: so 

Tara Sullivan: good. 

Kylie Patchett: Thank you my friend. Big love to you. All of those links are [00:39:00] in the show notes. And thank you so much for coming. 

Tara Sullivan: Big love. 

Kylie Patchett: Bye-Bye.

Kylie Patchett: Thanks for tuning in to another episode. If this episode lit a fire in your body, in your business, deep down in your bones, please take a moment to drop a rating and review. So more rebels just like you can find us. And don't keep this goodness to yourself. Share it with your disruptive, rebel, and revolutionary friends who are ready to roar right alongside of you.

Kylie Patchett: Until next time, stay wild, stay unapologetic, and stay fucking free.