Episode 54 - Managing People (Part 2)

Graduation weekend has a way of messing with your sense of time, and we lean into that right from the start. We talk family flying in, the emotional hit of watching a stepdaughter walk across the stage, and the perfectly timed chaos of a School of Rock recital landing on the same weekend. Along the way we nerd out on prog rock, laugh at how “everything’s spensive,” and reflect on how parenting milestones force you to see your own life differently. 

Then we make a hard turn into the real topic: managing people. Both of us sit in leadership roles, and we get candid about what happens when team culture becomes a strength and when it starts to feel like a union. Snow days, PTO decisions, power dynamics, and the moment someone says “we all talked about it” become a crash course in authority, accountability, and communication. We also wrestle with Gen Z workplace expectations, why some of those expectations are fair, and why leaders still have to set standards and course-correct early before small issues turn into big ones. 

We dig into onboarding and training systems, the 30-60-90 day ramp, and the truth that you rarely “hire them dead” because culture drift is usually a leadership problem first. From there we talk the stress you carry after you clock out, including financial pressure, payroll responsibility, and the struggle to shut your brain off on the drive home. We close with the hardest leadership move: letting someone go, doing it cleanly, telling the truth, and protecting the culture you are trying to build. If you got something out of this, subscribe, share it with a fellow manager, and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:06

What do you mean by the media is not a green guns?

Catching Up And Graduation Weekend

SPEAKER_00 0:45

Hey everybody, it's me, Jeff. It's me, it's me, David T. And there can only be one.

SPEAKER_01 0:50

There can only be one. How are you doing, buddy? Oh my God. Buddy, I yeah. I've had I've had a weekend and we haven't seen each other in a couple of years. It's been a while. Like since the last recording. I'm actually kind of pissed off about it because I love you. But it's just been one of those things like life happens and there's been a lot going on. And so where we're at, we're at the end of May, or getting the middle of May, which I have no idea how the fuck that's happening. I don't even know how we're here. Yeah. Like I have no idea. Long days, short years, just like holy fuck. But here we are. So it's graduation weekend. It is indeed. Yep. So a year ago. I experienced it firsthand. Yeah, a year ago, I was fucking like emotional as fuck. Dylan was graduating high school, and here we are, and he's finished his first year of college, but then I turn around and look at you, and like, here we are. Like you got you had what I had last year. We've got a graduation to celebrate.

SPEAKER_00 1:50

Yeah. Yeah. We um this we had Max's uh my stepdaughter's uh graduation yesterday for the MNN STEM STEM academy at the Bearden High School. And um and it was nice, it was a very nice, and we had um uh Virginia's mom and dad and her sisters flew in from Seattle and it was kind of that. Yeah, no, it was we didn't tell Max that they were coming, and so that's even better. Yeah, so it was nice. So and it was a full weekend. We had a little gathering um at uh the Friday morning for a brunch, and then we had and some parents were there. Actually, the only parents were there was Max's friend Red.

SPEAKER_01 2:32

It's so it's so emotional.

SPEAKER_00 2:33

It is, yeah. And then and then um and then we then yesterday, yes, Saturday was just, you know, well, Max had their school of rock performance too that day, to which I would like to say to the people who run School of Rock here in Knoxville what kind of dick move is this that you decide to hold a recital performance on the same weekend as graduation. Are you completely out of your fucking minds?

SPEAKER_01 3:03

I swear to God. So I will say this. So when they do it, always the weekend before Memorial Day. So when they do these things, it's a surprise. Okay, it comes every year.

SPEAKER_00 3:15

Right, exactly. Like, fucking look at the It's like I want to tell parents when they schedule their next exams and like, oh, we have to cancel because it's TCAP week. You know what the school schedule is ahead of time.

SPEAKER_01 3:27

They put out a calendar.

SPEAKER_00 3:28

They put out a calendar. I've been back for 25 years. Yeah. And it's just I've got to program my team to say now, okay, you understand TCAPs are coming up. Like, are you sure you're in the clear for this? I gotta just program them to say that. But we'll get to managing

School Of Rock And Growing Up Fast

SPEAKER_00 3:42

people in a minute. Oh. Um, but um Part two. So, yeah, so the with the School of Rock performance, it was they do themes for their performances. Like it'll be like Funk and Soul for one time, or it'll be one one time it was Guns N' Roses and Aerosmith. All right then. So this time it was prog rock.

SPEAKER_01 4:01

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 4:02

So we had songs like Aqualung, Have a Cigar.

SPEAKER_01 4:08

Aqua Lung, I automatically think of Anchor.

SPEAKER_00 4:10

Max sang lead vocal on that. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. And I'm like, and then the sad thing is I go, you will have no appreciation for this band the way that I do.

SPEAKER_01 4:22

Does she do well?

SPEAKER_00 4:23

Yeah, she does pretty well. She I there's a I I wish they would help some of them with stage presence, you know. But there were a couple of where was the recital? It was at Wild Wing Cafe in Farragut. The reopened Wild Wing Cafe. The reopened. Did you not know this had happened? I didn't know that it closed. It became something else, like it became a place called like Daddy Max or something like that. I know I just while it was that it kind of became a shithole. Yeah. And then I was so thrilled when Wild Wings came back because like I I I really loved that place. Yeah. And uh and uh it's a great location, it's a fantastic location right there on Campbell Station, right?

SPEAKER_01 5:00

Yeah, right off Campbell Station behind the cracker barrel. Yeah, okay, yeah. That's exactly right. Right behind the cracker barrel with its great location right behind the barrel.

SPEAKER_00 5:09

We brought back the original logo because we couldn't handle any kind of change. Um but anyway, so they also did like so they did Pink Floyd's Have a Cigar. They did um okay, so I gotta say, like, they did Kansas's carry-on Wayward Sun, and they had three of them doing the harmony vocals at the very beginning. All right. They really kind of nailed it. Okay, like I went in with such low expectations. Like when I saw their opening, one of the opening songs was Carnival number nine by Emerson Lake and Palmer. You know, welcome back, my friends, to the show that never ends. So, you know, and so like I'm like, I'm thinking, oh god, like the organ parts alone are like it's Keith Emerson.

SPEAKER_01 5:44

He's there's a lot going on there.

SPEAKER_00 5:46

Yeah, there is, and so, but like, no, they they nailed it. They really did, they did a fantastic job. They wrote, yeah. Awesome. They did a tool song. Um, what else? Um, a graduation thing too, or no, I think there's I've learned that there is one more performance because I do keep hoping this will wrap up, because this whole thing is spensive. Um everything's spensive, everything expensive. What do we say?

SPEAKER_01 6:15

Everything's spensive. No, the rent is too damn high.

SPEAKER_00 6:18

The rent is just motherfucking high. It's too damn high. Yeah, but we can't talk about affordability. So we'll that'll be another episode. Um so, but yeah, so yeah, graduation weekend. So we did that, and then we had the graduation at uh six o'clock at the Beardon football stadium. Go Dogs. Go Dogs. And uh and over there, I saw the soccer field. It's called it's the Jim Bru uh Jim Bruner soccer field. And uh Jim Bruner I know because his daughter's like best friends with Jaclyn. Okay, yeah, they played soccer together and hung out and everything. So yeah. He was he and his late wife were big supporters of the soccer team over at Webb.

SPEAKER_01 6:59

So uh it was very weird for me going into Beard and High School. I graduated from Beard and High School. It was very weird once I got when Dylan was playing for Marivol, playing basketball, and walking in there and like and seeing the guys that I went to high school with on the like their athleticism on the wall, like they're dead. You know, I all of a sudden it's like, man, this is this is bizarre.

SPEAKER_00 7:22

Yeah. So now this morning, they all got uh Joan, my mother-in-law, um Virginia, Max, and Max's friend Red, all got on the plane this morning to go to the UK for a 10-day they're gonna touch base with Jeffrey up in Scotland for for uh I think a dinner or something like that. And uh and so yeah, that's what they're doing. Uh so I'm I'm batching it for the next 10 weeks. Not 10 weeks, 10 days. Oh good lord. I couldn't do 10 weeks. Oh my god. It would not be good.

SPEAKER_01 7:56

I'd be doing spot checks.

SPEAKER_00 7:58

We'd be I'd go beyond hookers and blow. We'd bring a full-blown heroin by ten weeks.

SPEAKER_02 8:05

Black tar is good.

SPEAKER_00 8:08

You know, be mounting the dog by the time it's all over. So peanut butter. Just do it. Just don't just don't make eye contact. So that's about us.

Pilot Training Pride And Big Goals

SPEAKER_00 8:27

So now what's what's your son doing for the summer?

SPEAKER_01 8:30

He is gonna veg out because he, I honest Christ, asked him, like, man, have you set a land speed record of what you've credentialed? It feels like he has. He is finishing up his instrumental, yeah. So he's got his pilot and finishing up instrumental before he comes back home in his first fucking year of school. Damn, that's awesome. Yeah, and I was like, That's incredible. So you've set this, and he's like, Nope, there's another guy that he's trying to catch. Yeah, that's already somehow, some way got his commercial in a year. Oh wow.

SPEAKER_00 9:07

So is that then the like what? Because I always looked when I was flying, it was okay, private pilot.

SPEAKER_01 9:13

You're probably gonna ask me questions I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 9:15

But because I looked at it as you do private pilot, then you do instrument rating, and then after that you kind of a la carte it a little bit. Like, do you do retractable flaps? Do you do retractable landing gear? Do you do um and you mentioned commercial?

SPEAKER_01 9:27

So yeah, well, that's his goal. Okay, he wants to be a commercial pilot. So whatever the fuck that is in that direction.

SPEAKER_02 9:34

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 9:35

But I mean, like after one year, I just started laughing, man. I was like, man, you're gonna come back home. Because he's he's gonna come back home in in a couple weeks. And I'm like, man, you're gonna run into people that you went to school with, and they're gonna be like, hey, how are things here going? And then it's gonna be one of those things, like, yep, you're gonna be like, hey, let me take you up to 18,000 feet. Yeah, I'm not working at Sonic, bro. Because that came across as dickish. But I'm just saying, like tracks. No, but I mean, like, he's done a fucking no, yeah, exactly. He's exactly he has achieved a lot, put the work in, glad that we can finance it, but just done the work in a year. Like, kudos to you, man. Yeah, that's awesome. Fucking cap.

SPEAKER_00 10:29

My my uh I would say he's probably my one of my best friends in the dental community, uh, oral surgeon friend of mine, Brock Evans. Um, his son is gonna be going down there starting baseball, yeah. So I told him about Dylan and Yeah, I mean, why not?

SPEAKER_01 10:44

Like, I I mean, truly, and I I am the next level of it. There has never been a time to where I have said this university is shit. Yeah, like dump dump dap, like nothing. Anyone and everyone that I've ever talked to is like, yeah, embryo's the real deal.

SPEAKER_00 11:01

And it is, and that's what I told Brock the whole time. I'm like, you everything that I've heard from you is just like it is just top-notch, nothing but impressed, and yeah, right, and even walking on campus.

SPEAKER_01 11:11

He's just like, okay, I I fucking get it. Like, hell yeah. Like, if if this is your beacon, right, and you land here, wow, right, good for you.

SPEAKER_00 11:22

And did I see, is it did his girlfriend graduate?

SPEAKER_01 11:26

She, yeah, he's a year ahead, so she just graduated. Right. She just graduated.

SPEAKER_00 11:31

It comes out a little weird when you think about it. Like, how do you know about his girlfriend? Well, he and I are connected on Instagram. Yeah. He posted it in his story. Yeah, yes. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:43

But yeah, no, she she's and she's going to UT, and that's her that's her path. Yeah. Um, yeah, that's her path. Good for her. Yeah, excellent. And she, I mean, I've known that that girl, like Dylan. You know what? I'm not even gonna go into it. But it's been I'm so glad they're happy. Yeah, they're following a dream that they have established at a very young age that I did not. Yes. And they are 100% following through with it, and I will give them, what do they say, the flowers. Right. I will give them their flowers for it. Yeah. 100%. Yeah. Like, wow. Blows my mind. That's great, blows my mind.

SPEAKER_00 12:36

Awesome.

SPEAKER_01 12:36

Yeah, I know. Uh yeah, shit. I'm uh like, yeah.

College Basketball Fandom And Expectations

SPEAKER_00 12:39

Did um did you watch the rest of the tournament after our teams were out?

SPEAKER_01 12:44

The basketball tournament?

SPEAKER_00 12:46

Yeah, I know. It's we're like, yeah, that's March Madness? Yeah, I'm talking about that's six weeks in the past. I know, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:51

No, no, no, no. Uh no, I didn't.

SPEAKER_00 12:53

I didn't either. Like, I just I just boycotted it. I just boycotted it.

SPEAKER_01 12:57

I can't. Every time. Not Duke is always like growing up, I was a Duke fan. You know this. Growing up, Duke fan, Duke fan, Duke fan, because I didn't have anyone to pull for besides Duke. And I just I love Duke. And but as I, you know, once I started at UT, it was like, well, that's my team. Like, no matter what, we suck. And you know, this is coming from uh Atlanta Hawks. But I'm telling you, like, I'm a I'm a devoted fan.

SPEAKER_00 13:24

But you're but the Tennessee team has been an it has been a journey to watch.

SPEAKER_01 13:29

Absolutely, you know. Rick Barnes is unreal.

SPEAKER_00 13:32

I'll give Bruce Pearl his kudos too. I think Bruce Pearl got the ball rolling.

SPEAKER_01 13:36

Yes, you know. Yes, it it allowed everyone to it allowed everyone to be like, okay, this is legit. Right. And to even say about what we got going on now. Everyone knows I I think Barnes has finally said, like, this is my last year. Like, this is it. Like, he's told the administration, like, man, I'm I'm gonna give you one more ride. And the administration's like, okay, because they have they have flat out told this guy, pick your team. Yeah. And it's and it's happening.

SPEAKER_00 14:08

We'll find the money.

SPEAKER_01 14:09

Right. Yeah. Like, you pick your guys, and here you go. And so kudos to UT for all that shit and and all that stuff. But when when my team goes in the tournament, I can't watch it. I don't I don't even know. I don't know the last final four I've watched.

SPEAKER_00 14:28

I can tell you, it was it was Villanova Buzzer Beater against UNC. That's the last one I watched.

SPEAKER_01 14:33

That was an unreal one. Yeah. But I didn't watch it live. I mean, I saw it, but I never watched it. Because like Tennessee's right eventually, like somehow, some way have lost. Seems like they lose always lose to the the champion. Right. Or the close to it. Like the Purdue, when they lost to fucking Edie, that fucking game made me so mad.

SPEAKER_00 15:00

Yeah, I don't even want to go down that road. Not as mad as I was when we don't know what to do with 10 seconds left in the game. Oh, that was brutal. So here who here's who we got coming back. We've got uh Kaden, boozer. My comment was so I imagine at first practice our conversation is going to be what do we do with the ball when there's 10 seconds remaining in the game and we're up by a basket. Hold the motherfucking ball at the time. It's valid.

SPEAKER_01 15:32

It's it's valid. It's valid to talk it out.

SPEAKER_00 15:36

So so you got him coming back, you got um uh Dame Dame Tsar coming back. That that's huge that he's coming back. But who do you have coming in? That's that's I can't even I can't even follow. Like again, it's being touted as probably the best recruiting class, which we always somehow we seem to get that. And so it will be pick ourselves up, you know, and let's we'll just try again. And this time the expectation will will be the national championship.

SPEAKER_01 16:07

So I don't even if you ought to even if you'd have beaten Yukon, I don't think you would have beaten that Michigan team. We beat them before. I know, but I not where they were. I mean, obviously you have to play the game, but man, that was a hell of a tournament run.

SPEAKER_00 16:25

You know, we're playing Yukon in the pre pre-conference next this fall in the fall. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:30

I enjoyed fucking us going and seeing game was actually at Thompson Bowling. That was fucking awesome.

SPEAKER_00 16:38

That was fucking awesome. It was a good time. Yeah, it was a really good time.

SPEAKER_01 16:41

Like out of nowhere. Yeah, yeah. You know, the fact that UT was just like big enough to have like because I remember when I mean it was truly a tomb when Wade Houston was coach. I mean, it was nothing but that that whole arena, you know. I I will always say it's the place that Pearl built. Like Thompson Bowling on the inside is way better than what it ever was.

SPEAKER_00 17:06

Is it like a gold-gilded ballroom now? Yes. Where the East Wing used to be. But it's still under budget. Now we have the Food City ballroom.

SPEAKER_01 17:21

No mind the name on the outside. It's the Trump Center for the arts.

SPEAKER_00 17:28

Now we're doing it because we're gonna have the pretending we love the Burns. We love the Burns. So let's managing people, part two.

SPEAKER_01 17:38

Yeah. All right. 40 minutes in.

SPEAKER_00 17:41

You're right. Yeah, just about. It feels like is it really? No, it's 17 minutes. We're 17 minutes in. We probably should get to the top.

Managing People And Culture Drift

SPEAKER_00 17:47

So this we're gonna pick up where we left off with regards to um managing people, as David and I are both in supervisory managerial positions, and um we were talking about where we left before then. We did this. So you said something about the high there can only be one in Highlander, and then we did this whole Marvel Cinematic Universe sidebar, which we always seem to do, and we probably will before this episode's over. Um but we were talking about you know the the culture that can be established by some of your employees, and I talked specifically about my clinic coordinator who on the plus side has established this family family type dynamic amongst the advantage of the team and then but but there have been times where it has crossed over to the dark side and it feels more like a union. Yeah, well

Snow Days, PTO, And Team Power

SPEAKER_00 18:38

that's a problem. So I dealt with that last year we had a snow day, and what does that mean? So again, uh mind you, I grew up in eastern Pennsylvania, so what constitutes snow days and panic around here makes me laugh.

SPEAKER_01 18:56

Oh, yeah. It has a lot of it could possibly just be the threat, right? Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 19:01

And everyone gets a French toast gravy. It's bread, milk, and eggs, and the French toast gets made. I don't know why. You know? I don't get it. Um whoa. See, you're touch those that's what you touch those arrows, and the desk goes up and down.

SPEAKER_03 19:13

Oh no shit.

SPEAKER_00 19:15

There you go. See, right? Did you not know that? Wow.

SPEAKER_01 19:17

So I could we could stand here for four years and not have noticed that before.

SPEAKER_00 19:22

So um anyway now I'm scared. Don't touch the buttons.

SPEAKER_01 19:29

I've been told that my whole life. Right.

SPEAKER_03 19:33

Quit licking the glass, Dobson.

SPEAKER_00 19:37

No, but anyway, so we had a snow day, and my my gauge for snow days has always been if City of Marival schools closes, then it is bad because we have seen actually on Facebook charts like Marival City is the last school in the state to close. Yep. So if they close, it is bad.

SPEAKER_01 19:58

And I'm like, okay, because their their radius is very small.

SPEAKER_00 20:01

Right. After that, it's kind of I have no Blunt County, like I get. I have no parameter for my Morristown office. I have no parameter for the hard. It used to be for Harden Valley. I would do what Webb would do because the kids were in school then, and but then Webb started just doing whatever Knox County did. Webb used to be a bigger holdout. Sometimes I'll look at Oak Ridge City Schools.

SPEAKER_01 20:27

Yeah, because yeah, they're very similar to the city. Because they're kind of like kind of like Marival.

SPEAKER_00 20:30

They're very similar. But um other than that, like I have nothing else to go on. So it was this was not this past winter, but the previous winter where I made the call to we will we were gonna be open, and then I get a call from Gresha, and she's like, if you're planning on being open today, we're not gonna be have a team. And I said, What do you mean? She says, Well, I've been notified that from you know the clinic coordinator. Well, we all talked about it. That's always bad when it when that when that's the opening sentence. Oh yeah, that's not good. Like a union, huh?

SPEAKER_01 21:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:03

And so, okay.

SPEAKER_01 21:05

Yeah, I just have images of Sally Field holding up with the street. Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_00 21:10

Yeah, it's like norma Norma Ray, you know. Um and um so then, and what added then insult to injury is everyone used PTO days for those snow days. And I'm like, All right then. So, okay, with with that, and and so the thing is you let that incident happen and you let it slide, and then you're just like, okay, we'll take this and we'll prepare for next year. So then it happened again. We had two days that we closed down, people use PTO days, and that's fine. But I made sure Gresha got the word out, like, okay, guys, you understand, like, it is not until late June that his vacations all start. Like, if you want to burn out your PTO before he's even gone on a vacation, that is on you. But nobody's gonna come crying to us about it when he's gotta take a week off. For his son's graduation in Scotland, and then he's got a week down at his mother's house in August, and then he's got two weeks off.

SPEAKER_01 22:06

He's already telling you.

SPEAKER_00 22:07

And he I'm I've already let you know you have plenty of advanced you need to prepare, you know, accordingly.

SPEAKER_01 22:13

And and that's which I find like wild because like for me, like even though I take PTO, whoever takes PTO, our world doesn't stop.

SPEAKER_00 22:24

Well, exactly. See, but that's the difference, though. Your world can go on if you're not there. Yes. I I don't by law, my world cannot go on if I'm not there.

SPEAKER_01 22:33

So, but I mean that's that's the argument. It's like how cool is that? Of like, all right, I know for a fact that like this is my vacation time.

SPEAKER_00 22:42

Like that's that's I've always tried to have my vacations for the next year locked in by Thanksgiving. So it's pretty impressive.

SPEAKER_01 22:52

You know, you would have because you're thinking about other people.

SPEAKER_00 22:55

Yeah, exactly. And you're managing but also for but also for me, too. Like it it helps with me too. Well, yeah. So so there's just the kind of this year has been a little bit of me trying to get back some of the control that I feel I've lost

Gen Z, Course Corrections, And HR Limits

SPEAKER_00 23:10

over time. Um I was listening, one of the podcasts. What are you talking about? What controls? I just kind of feel what I run into with with some of my team is that you know, they have like sometimes you work for an older doctor and they've kind of just given up the control. Like they've put you, you just do whatever you want, and I'll sign off on it. I'm not there yet. I'm still very wired into what we're doing, and I'm dealing with individuals that have worked in that other culture, sure, and it's very hard to break them of that habit, you know. So it's it's a little bit of a power struggle that I deal with at times. I gotcha. Then you also have the element of the Gen Z mentality where they want to tell you how you as an employer should employ them. Am I right? It's very difficult. It's very difficult. It's really difficult, you know.

SPEAKER_01 24:08

And you know what the most difficult part of it is? Is they're not wrong with their argument.

SPEAKER_00 24:15

Not always. Not always, but there are you know, but it it Yeah, not always.

SPEAKER_01 24:23

So I try to be mindful. If I live my life the way that you're talking about living your life, if I lived if I lived it the way that I did it during the time that I did it, I would have been left behind. Right. Left behind completely. But now it's just like I I don't know, it's like it's a a normal thing, which is it's it's awkward.

SPEAKER_00 24:50

There's like an acceptance that is I do too. But and I'm glad I have five and a half years left because of that.

SPEAKER_01 24:59

Yeah, you know, I hate it, but then I also I appreciate it, but then also if I reprimand it, I am a I'm a bad person.

SPEAKER_00 25:11

And that's also the other part of it, like when you have to so I I always call it a course correction. Um, like in piloting, um, you know, it's like they get a little bit off the path. I like to jump on that just as it happens because it's easier to steer them back on in the very beginning than it is to like let it go for a few months and now they're all the way over here, and you have to do all this work to get them back onto the path. Um, and so and and again, I also make it very clear, you know, like from the Godfather, this is business, it's not personal. Yeah, this is all business. Like, you know, don't come out of here saying fucking I don't hate you or anything like that, but we have a problem and we need to fix it.

SPEAKER_01 25:54

Yep. But unfortunately, don't you do you feel well you're you're different because you are your own HR, right? Or not?

SPEAKER_00 26:02

Me and Gresha.

SPEAKER_01 26:04

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 26:04

Yeah. More more Grescia. I I I actually prefer Gresha to handle all of that stuff because I think it's easier coming from a woman.

SPEAKER_01 26:12

I I have a I have a corporate HR that I have to report to. Okay. So anything that's like goes off the path, you've got a whatever documentation or whatever correction I need to make, like I gotta call the ivory tower, and that's you know, that can be extremely frustrating. Yeah. Because what you and I would think would be like hands down, boom, guillotine, right, you're done. Nope. Like you gotta you gotta live with it for about three to four more strikes. And that is uh that's a ooh, it's a it's so I have not been I have not been in a position where I've had to fire anyone lately.

SPEAKER_00 27:00

Now I was back in the game.

SPEAKER_01 27:01

I don't fire anybody, they fire themselves. Well, that's true.

SPEAKER_00 27:04

Yes, yes, yes, and so we'll talk we'll get to that in just a second. Um, actually, we'll get to it now. Because so one of the podcasts that I listen to is called Orthodonic Pearls, and it's by these three orthodontists, and there are times it feels like a bro session and whatnot, but then then they'll have on somebody good, and they just the most recent episode they had on this guy who also is a marriage counselor, but he's used his abilities as a marriage counselor to bring it over to like coaching practices and like you know, interstaff harmony and what have you, and he had a lot of interesting things to say. What makes it difficult to me listening to it is like this would have been great if if Jeff 25 years ago had heard this. Yeah. But Jeff is now three and a half, is is now five and a half years from retirement, you know.

SPEAKER_01 27:49

And here's the thing though, too. Like, even if you heard it, if you weren't doing it, yeah, it it doesn't matter.

SPEAKER_00 27:56

And I think there are also X factors that are involved that they make it sound really easy. Yeah, it's not always like that, you know. I can't I can't begin to tell you how many directives I give my team, and then I feel like I'm just summarily blown off, you know. And it's like, and then and then I get angry about that, and all of a sudden I'm the asshole. And I'm like, how am I the asshole in this situation?

SPEAKER_01 28:20

You know, I I I get that talk me through that. Yeah, no, it's a it's a it's a thing. So it's a it's it's actually what I also love about leadership of establishing that culture of being able to walk around and see and smell and and like look at people and know for a fact. Like so every so every day I I do my best of just saying eye to eye contact, hey, good morning. How are you? I am not I'm not giving you a directive, I'm not looking at you for my own personal gain, I am genuinely looking at you. Like, hey, are you good? Like, you got everything you need to do your job? Like, what is it? More often than not, hey buddy, I'm I'm alright, I'm alright, I'm alright. But if you continuously doing that, you will know immediately when you hit that person, it's like, yeah, I'm fine. Like, oh, oh, nope, you are not.

SPEAKER_00 29:27

My response to that will be, I almost believe that.

unknown 29:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:31

But you have to be in tuned. Yes. If you always if you're not that in tuned, your culture, whatever you're trying to build, is shit.

SPEAKER_00 29:43

So, and I always try to maintain, like, I feel I've got a read on the team that I know if people are off. But let me ask you this, because they brought this up in that in the that podcast episode, where have you had employees where you come in and you look at them, you're like, God, I really wish you weren't here. Oh, yes. And so that's on you and me if we still have if it's a month later and those still those people are still here, you know. No, and so there's a difference between a performance-related issue and a personality issue.

SPEAKER_01 30:11

Yeah, so what is it, the 80-20 rule?

SPEAKER_00 30:14

Like something like that, yes.

SPEAKER_01 30:16

It's like, you know, yeah, the 20% of the people are doing 80% of the work, you know. Yeah. Yes, there are people that I would wish to go bye-bye, but also we didn't hire them dead. And I don't know where I've heard that. I know that's a leadership podcast or whatever the hell I've I've heard where it's it stuck with me. It's like we didn't we didn't hire them this way. Right. Where did we fuck up? Yeah, we brought them in. We we we had the interview, we felt like you were a good dude. Like, where did we fuck up to where you became a piece of shit? Because I feel like that's that is a big thing, right? Yes, your work ethic is ingrained in you. It's an it's your DNA. Like, I I know no matter what I'm gonna do, whether it's this podcast, well, I don't want to say this podcast, but like no matter what, like job-wise, like I'm gonna I'm gonna give you my 100%.

SPEAKER_00 31:25

You're not giving your 100% here, dick.

SPEAKER_01 31:28

I am, but like I feel like we should do it more often than that's where I fucked up. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. You got a promotion, it's all changed now. I know, I know. I love you. I love you too.

Onboarding, Training, And Protecting Standards

SPEAKER_01 31:42

But but like we we hire them to be a certain person, yeah. And so often we get so busy and doing other things that we don't orientation in your culture is the biggest piece, and I don't think we any of us do a good enough job with it.

SPEAKER_00 32:05

Yes. Um, I also think whatever your training program is plays a big role in it too. And there were just there have been years where I was just like to the clinic coordinator, I'd be like, okay, get them up to speed, you know. And so one of my most recent hires, um, wonderful woman, love her to death. Uh, she just fantastic. Um, but like we originally hired her just to be the sterile tech, and and I'm kind of like, as as and this was when I was possibly having an associate join me this year, and what I'm like, well, guys, we're gonna have to bring her clinical skills up to your level because there's gonna be a day where she's gonna be a part of all this because the team's gonna double in size. And I feel like her training has gone really epically slow. I do not blame her at all for that. I blame the people who are training her. And that's like when I say that I'm trying to get control of the practice back in my hands, it is because it's about my values. My core values are what dictate this practice at the end of it. It's my culture. And it used, and because we have done this in the past, we hire a new assistant. I say you have 30 days to learn most of everything. And in 30 days you can. There's no reason why you should not.

SPEAKER_03 33:21

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 33:22

Um, and then you have an additional 60 days to refine all of that and work on your speed and whatnot. And by 90 days, like you should be able to go toe-to-toe with absolutely most everyone else. I mean, there will be procedures you do not get to learn along the way, and they will come up when they come up, and that's fine. But at the but so somewhere we got off that path a little bit, and and I know I'm going to have to hire somebody probably in the next few months, um, just because of the the the volume of what we're dealing with right now. So when I just want to make sure that when we do that, we're back to you have 30 days to teach them everything they need to know, and then they have sit and culture's a big damn deal.

SPEAKER_01 34:05

Exactly. So here is a real life situation that's popped up that will hone in on this. We've we've been established in where we're at for fucking 47 years. We have a new hire. Comes in, starts reevaluating. It's a a high-end hire. Like, hey, this is wrong, this is wrong, this is wrong. But it's like, hey, buddy.

SPEAKER_00 34:35

That sounds like when Virginia moved in.

SPEAKER_01 34:37

No, but it's like, hey, buddy, shut the fuck up. Yeah, improve what you want to improve, however, don't present like everything that has been built before you has been shit. Like, stop. Like, like you do not want to project.

SPEAKER_00 35:00

Like you're like, you're like God talking to Job saying, Where were you at where were you when I created the world?

SPEAKER_01 35:08

Maybe not that serious, right? But but but it's just one of those things is like, hey, we're a contract company. If you come in and say, Hey, this is wrong, this is wrong, in front of the wrong people, it looks as if the past 47 years has been wrong. It hasn't. It's an evolution. Like, understand where you're at, who you are, and take a look around before you start fucking talking.

SPEAKER_00 35:37

And that's a that's a problem too. Yes. Thankfully, I don't run into that a lot. Like, there are people who I have taken over.

SPEAKER_01 35:45

I think with you, if you ran into that situation, it was like as if somebody took over your just your spot completely. Like, evertine's out, I'm the new orthodontist. Right. And then how long have you been running your business? Me? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:02

22.

SPEAKER_01 36:02

All right. 2020 25 years. 25 years, and then that person is like, well, everything is this is wrong. This is bullshit. Like, no motherfucker. It's been running for 25 fucking years. Like, you may improve it, yeah, but don't be degrading the past 25 fucking years. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:20

And that can happen easily. Well, and I mean, for me as an owner, you know, my values have changed. What's important to me has changed, changes over. You know, like one for a period of time, it may be this is the most important thing. So, like when I was texting you earlier today after I was coming back from the Scottish Highland games, and I was saying, Oh, don't worry about leaving just yet. I'm like over by Heritage High School. And the reason I was over at Heritage High School, I wanted to see who had banners and who had scoreboard signs. Because that is something that I have really moved away from doing like a lot of market. I mean, when you're the only 10 care provider for orthodontics in a 75 mile radius, you do not need to advertise anymore.

SPEAKER_01 36:59

Yeah, I thought you were just like looking at the like people that got retired, like, yeah, I did their teeth and I did their teeth.

SPEAKER_00 37:06

No, no, there's no other. I do I wanted to see who and it turns out we have a banner hanging up on the fence into the entrance of one of the so that's always a weird surprise.

SPEAKER_01 37:15

Because I'm like It was Dylan's junior year that we just got we CJ and I just got tickled seeing your yeah yeah on the scoreboard and everything.

SPEAKER_00 37:25

But at one upon time, it was like I was, you know, I had signs on Alcoa and Marival, like in the center at the top on the scoreboard, like the eye of Sauron overlooking the entire state. And I loved it. So one time, one time my daughter is at an Alcoa game and she's walking around the track and her friend looks up and she's like, Oh my god, and sees sees my Eberting Orthodonics when we were called that back then. And she's like, Richie Rich, huh? And I'm like, Well, yeah, to pay for that, you know, that was a lot of fucking money. You know, and uh, but I don't I'm now at a point where I just kind of there's no need for me to do that. There's there's no need for me to go out to lunch with dentists, there's no need for me to like do deliveries of goodies, you know, because it doesn't anyway. So back to not anyway. No, wait, just back to back to what we were talking about. Well, no, I'm just gonna say the culture changes over time.

SPEAKER_01 38:16

Yes, but I'm also now just gonna switch gears on you.

New Hires Who Trash The Past

SPEAKER_00 38:20

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 38:21

So we clock out. You and I clock out. We're managing for the day, week, or life? The day. You and I have clocked out. We have left managing people all day long, and now we're coming home. And that is a difficult situation.

SPEAKER_00 38:43

Not when your wife greets you wearing black thigh highs. Well, you gotta get CJ on board with that.

SPEAKER_01 38:50

If this is a daily thing, I know it's not. No, but wait, what I mean by that, not uh not a spouse thing. Uh, because that's a that'll lead into the divorce episode. Right, which but that's a whole other thing. But like coming home, it's it's rough for me to shut it off.

SPEAKER_00 39:18

What is your you you can't shut it off on the drive home? What is your decompression?

SPEAKER_01 39:23

Well, that's what's been interesting for me. My long drive, I didn't have that much stress. So, like me, when I was working at Methodist, I had that motherfucker dialed in, coming home. It was fine. But now my my 20-minute drive from Marivolt to UT and back, it's always, you know, like I'm starting to now like dream about work scenarios and stuff, like I which I never have experienced before, but but it's uh like I don't know how to it's been difficult. It's been difficult to shut it off, it's been difficult. I've done it for a year now, and it's it's it's aggressive. And I I like it. I knew that I was signing up for it, but it it's just been like okay, all right. This is uh this is a thing. So what spins you up? A little bit of all of it, but it's more the finances than anything.

SPEAKER_00 40:30

You know, I personal or b or corporate.

SPEAKER_01 40:32

Oh no, not personal, right? Just corporate. Personal, like hell yes. Like, like I thank you. Like, no, like personal is like okay, you have like I I personal.

SPEAKER_00 40:46

I'm yeah, good. Okay. That's always a good that's a good start.

SPEAKER_01 40:51

No issues. Like I am able to take care of everyone that I'm wanting to take care of and pay for Dylan's flight shits, and I I'm good. Like I'm I'm fine. No worries. But financially with with the corporate stuff, it it's it's it's a bear. Because that's that's what that's what I'm there to manage. But I'm also there to manage like fucking a lot of sh other shit. Right. You know, uh I'm managing $18 million worth of volume between revenue and salary. Like it that's that's my managed volume that I'm dealing with on a daily basis.

SPEAKER_00 41:41

So, like you're saying your balls are constantly up in your stomach every fucking day. Jeez, I hate that. It is. No, truly. I deal with that on a lesser level because But I'm gonna interest it. Go ahead, go ahead, go ahead. Go ahead.

SPEAKER_01 41:56

The reason I say that you're not on a different level is

Clocking Out And Work Stress Home

SPEAKER_01 42:00

because I'm a part of a major corporation dealing with those finances. I am reporting to the board of directors. You are the board of directors. Yes, like that amount of stress, and I understand it, and I look at it and I appreciate it. Like that's a big fucking deal. When you say that you've lost sleep at night about paying salaries and shit, that's a real fucking that is a real fucking statement. Like, I understand it, I see you, like, Lord.

SPEAKER_00 42:40

Yeah, that's a big deal. Yeah, no, it is because the it you are more directly involved in you're you're responsible for everyone's livelihood at the end of the day, like you're paying them. And you know, and also you have to make and and you're dealing with overhead, and you know, where's that line between, well, we don't need to be so cost-cutting that like it it affects quality of work, you know, we have to find that balance. Um, we you know, and and you know, and you do you have you're right, you do have to check in with your team members and see how they're doing and where you know how you know and I do that. I mean, I've had a number of team members who have had health issues or family members that have had health issues. I had a team member who just lost her um her father, you know, and whatnot. And so there's been a lot of time where we talk about that, and and you know, I mean, having it helps if you have that life experience also under your belt, you know. Um, so I feel with this, I I have always said when I have done talks at the dental assisting school that I my history is such that I'm not the world's greatest employer. I am better now than I was twenty years ago.

SPEAKER_01 43:56

Um that's with anything, right?

SPEAKER_00 43:58

I was I was a Like no matter what you look at, I'm I was a fucking asshole 20 years ago. I will make no bones about that. Um it was very dictatorial what I was like back then. It was very, you don't fucking like it, then leave. There are days I still want to go back to if you don't fucking like it, then leave.

SPEAKER_01 44:15

But I'm like I would love going back to my Gordon Ramsay days.

SPEAKER_00 44:19

Yes. And and I'm like, but I'm like, now I'm just like, you are five and a half years away from being done with all of this. Now, when I first came here, I had lunch with another orthodontist who just kind of got started the same time I did, a few months before I did. And he had bought someone else's practice that was kind of a 10 care practice. And and you know, he's like, you know, and talking about team and you know, do you change people out? Yada, yada, yada. And he said to me, I don't think he's even aware that like how I've carried this around a bit as a mantra. He said, It all comes down to what can you live with. And yeah, it's so a lot of now it's what can I live with? And at the end of the day, like I said in the last episode, we finish the day, I walk out the door, my clinic coordinator says, I love you, says that to all the team members, she says it to each each team member and everything like that. I am willing to put up with a lot if that's the culture we can maintain. Yeah, um, but anyway, what I was saying kind of earlier, I was like, have you had that employee where you walk in the door and you're like, God, I really wish you weren't here. Oh. And according to this guy, that's on us that they're still here. And you have to find that delineation between is it performance, hire them, is it is it personality?

SPEAKER_01 45:33

Um and and sometimes people are gonna come into your environment and your culture, and it just doesn't work. Right. My first office manager that's why I always love the probation period.

SPEAKER_00 45:48

Yes, yes, it is just that.

SPEAKER_01 45:50

I got 90 days to tomfuckery with you, right?

SPEAKER_00 45:55

That's become our new buzz thing. Oh man, I'm nervous. I love Tom Fuckery. Tom Tom says, Tom says all the tomfuckery going on. I said, I hate fuckery, especially when Tom is involved. Fuck Tom. Fuck Tom.

SPEAKER_01 46:06

And um so, but but back in the day, my I knew you were gonna be the only one to appreciate the Tom Fuckery comment.

SPEAKER_00 46:16

Um, sorry. That's okay, it's all good. Um I uh my first office manager, Missy, my first Missy, um, she I mean it'd be like on the first day, she would like kind of have this feel I don't think this girl's gonna work out. Now I hate that. She and I, yes, yeah, and I'm like, what the fuck is wrong? How are we assessing this already three hours in?

SPEAKER_01 46:41

If I'm getting within a week, this person's not gonna work out, fuck you. That's your problem. Yeah. You fucked up. Right. Embrace them, right, coddle them, they are a newborn.

SPEAKER_00 46:56

Train them.

SPEAKER_01 46:57

They are a newborn flat out. You have they are not up to speed on anything, and if you're judging them now, granted, I get it, sometimes you like if you're always constantly bringing them to drink, that's a problem.

SPEAKER_00 47:17

Right, right. Yes. You know, like that's a whole other listeners that couldn't see that.

SPEAKER_01 47:24

Yeah, you didn't see that? So, but I mean, truly.

SPEAKER_00 47:27

We're not on YouTube yet.

SPEAKER_01 47:28

Yeah, yeah, not yet. But if you're not able to do that, that's on you. Like, that's all part of the culture stuff. Like, anyone that comes to me within a week and saying this person's not gonna do this, this like, okay. I'm listening, but you better give me some hardcore data. Yeah. Like, hey, this person's not gonna work out because they like to shit in their hand and eat it. Like, okay, yes, get them.

SPEAKER_00 47:59

Can we like post that on TikTok before they leave, though? How many hits can we get for that?

SPEAKER_03 48:10

Probably a lot.

SPEAKER_00 48:11

Yeah. Oh, let me tell you, you know, sidebar. On like we so I have one of my assistants do marketing. Like, so on Thursday, she doesn't come to the Harden Valley office and she goes to Maribel and does marketing and like puts together content and stuff like that. And she does it really, really well. She's 23 years old, she's like five days older than Jeffrey, and um, and she does it really well. But she put this one together where like she has another assistant play a patient and she leans her back, and the title says, When the last patient of the day tells you that they have a broken bracket. And and so Jada, J it's she's lip-syncing to some music track, and I think it's Michael Jackson that she has plenty. She's she's like, Don't don't say that. We have gotten 55,000 views of that clip. Oh my god.

SPEAKER_01 48:59

You know, how quickly.

SPEAKER_00 49:01

Uh over I want to say No, no, no.

SPEAKER_01 49:04

I'm just saying, like, how quickly, like, wow. Yeah, that's yeah, that's incredible.

SPEAKER_00 49:09

So, you know, it's um, but yeah, anyway, that's it's funny shit.

SPEAKER_01 49:14

Yeah. That's amazing.

SPEAKER_00 49:16

So I forget where we how we ended up on that. Um, but like, no, when it's time so so let's segue over because I kind of have brought it up

Saying Goodbye And Letting People Go

SPEAKER_00 49:26

a couple times. When it's time to say goodbye.

SPEAKER_01 49:30

Oh, do you want an employee?

SPEAKER_00 49:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 49:34

So in my world, I have to I I really truly have to nudge it. I have to say, like, hey man, this is the road we're going down.

SPEAKER_00 49:48

You you gotta feel like I'm trying to course correct you, but you're staying on this path you're on.

SPEAKER_01 49:52

I I am I'm course correcting you, but one, you're giving me more work that I don't want to deal with. Like, all I've asked you to do is the fucking thing that I've hired you to do, and you're fucking it up, which is will piss you off, right? But it happens, you know, for whatever reason. But it's just one of those things like, hey, here we are. You got a choice. But saying goodbye, you got you all with my I'm gonna go back in time. It was much better for me to just be like, hey, the guillotine. Get the fuck out. Yeah, yeah. There it was only one time in my career that I got the green light of like URHR David, do it, fix this kitchen, and I was full Gordon Ramsay, and it was amazing. Yeah, it was just awesome.

SPEAKER_00 50:54

But I don't have that. I can count on one hand the number of firings that I have done myself. What do you mean by that? What do you mean by you've done yourself? That I have brought the person into my office and said that we're not doing this anymore. Oh. We need to talk about your transition out of this practice. Oh, no, I yeah, I have fired many a people. Normally I kind of punt it over to the office manager. So over the over the history, there have been days where it's been like I have reached my fill with an employee, there's been problems, it's not fixable, and I have said to the office manager, I'm going to lunch when I come back. I want to know that this person's gone.

SPEAKER_01 51:34

So legit reason, like I have I have worked myself up over like, oh my god, this firing's gonna be terrible. This is gonna be like I have mentally fucked myself. Yeah. And then once it once it goes, they're like, Yeah, okay, thanks. And got up, like, left. Like, yeah, I knew I was gonna get fired. I'm surprised it's taking you this long. Yeah. Every single time, really, which is wild as shit.

SPEAKER_00 52:01

Like, so do you feel like their whole employment though is like passive? It's been this passive aggressive employment. Like, how far can I stretch the leash? How long can I fuck with the system until they finally get wise enough to get rid of me?

SPEAKER_01 52:12

I have fired many of people and like, man, all right. I don't know if that leads to unemployment. I don't know. But I have had a plethora of people who are like, man, we're not working out. This is this isn't us. Like, I'm sorry, but you gotta go. Right. Okay. Appreciate it. And like, I have been fired once and I'm still horrified over it. Yeah, I've never been fired. Yeah. I got fired over some bullshit client shit that I won't go on to onto on a podcast, but but truly, like you sit me down and you say, David, you need to do this or you're gonna get this. Okay, I will make sure I am not gonna get fired. Like, no matter what it is. Like, I that's just who I am. Like, tell me what I need to do. But there have been many of fucking people like, okay, listen. It's not working out, man. Right. Like, you're you're this isn't you. Okay. And every single time. I've never had anyone that I have fired that have looked at me and be like, okay, no. I'm not sure.

SPEAKER_00 53:28

No, I I'm lucky that I've never had a wrongful termination suit or anything like that.

SPEAKER_01 53:33

Oh, yeah, no.

SPEAKER_00 53:34

Yeah, we're I mean, what's nice about what's what's what's nice is that we're an at-will state, you know. And um there have uh you know, so I I do the most re the most recent reference of the c the class of 23, the mass exodus of 23. And that was there, I think out of that whole batch, there was there was only one that I fired. And it was because she was just had this sass and attitude about her, and she my my associate was still with us at the time. Now, I think he had already given me notice by then, but she like went up to him in front of a patient, like was assisting him. Mother was standing there by the chair, which I hate. Um, managing parents, and um anyway, I don't even have a chance. Anyway, she said to him, she goes, So, doctor, have you ever cheated on your wife? What yes, right, right, right. What are we doing? She's one of those girls like and I'd heard like about this the day before that she had been at lunch with they'd all done a group lunch, and she's like, you know what? That just what my face says, that's just the way I am, and I'm not gonna change that, and yeah, and so on and so forth. And and he's going, so you know you're being an asshole, and you're just gonna go ahead and continue being an asshole. And then she did that, and I found out about it like a few days later, and I'm like, Oh, that's it, you're gone. No, I'm sorry. There is no assistant that gets to do that kind of shit. You know, I mean, I I don't want to get all highfalutin about it or anything like this, but I'm like, we have gone through college, we have gone through dental school, we have gone through residency. In my case, I went through three years of the military. I am not gonna put up with that shit from a 21-year-old who doesn't know her ass from a hole in the ground. I'm sorry. I am just not going to do that. And and so here's the irony now is that the practice that he ended up going to work at, she got hired a year after he went to work there. And I just wanted, I almost texted and say, What'd you do? Did you piss off the the owner that that she wanted to punish you this way? What the fuck, man? So, but that's the kind of and and it's always there is no introspection when you have fired any of them, like that they have done anything wrong. It's always I'm the dick, I'm the dick. Yeah, you're the I'm a horror to work for. That was my younger years. I was a horror to work for, I was very demanding. And I mean, I can tell you, I have full it's not a horror. I have on my laptop a file, a folder that's called former employees, and I have a file for everyone that used to work there. 170. 170 people have gone through my practice over 25 years.

SPEAKER_01 56:25

That's very small.

SPEAKER_00 56:27

Uh just for a practice like mine, but you know.

SPEAKER_01 56:29

So what is that percentage-wise? What what would you say?

SPEAKER_00 56:32

Well, right now I have a staff of 12.

SPEAKER_01 56:34

No, I yeah, so I don't know. Have you ever like looked at it?

SPEAKER_00 56:39

No, because I don't care. I no, I hate to be that flippant about it. Like, like when it's time for someone to go, it is time for someone to go. And when they leave, I have learned as I've gotten older, just let it go. Like, even the ones that we end up on good terms with as they go out the door. Like, I just had I'm gonna brag on this one for a little bit. I just had a team member of mine, she just left. Um, well, she gave us notice, gave us about eight weeks' notice, which was nice. Eight weeks is wow. She was she is that employee that came into my life when I needed her most. And this was 2015 when she joined up with me. And I had these two employees that I think I talked about them last episode, that were the I call them the Halls Gibbs Millennials from Hell. And uh and they were they were just awful. They just like I felt like the the the pay brought them to the office. Anything else beyond that was like I had to pay them extra to like get them to do their jobs right, and one of them is no longer in the business, thank God. Um and then I think I don't know if the other one is still in, also, but then during that time I had another employee that had been with me at the time for 10 years, and it just got the the the personality problems. My first missy who had retired, um that kind of made this employee feel like, okay, now the oversight is gone and I can do whatever the hell I want. And I saw this ugly side of her so much so that at our Christmas party, like she got shit faced drunk and everything like that, and she's seeing the ugly side of spot, yeah. And it just got to it came to a point where, like, literally the day after our Christmas party, the whole team came into my office and said she has to go.

SPEAKER_01 58:39

Oh no.

SPEAKER_00 58:41

And I said to them, Okay, I said the tribe has spoken. Yeah. And I said, So this is how it's gonna go. So the we're gonna put down for the record that this is what you guys wanted. Yeah, yeah. And I I'm telling you now, after I do this, if any one of you You ready? If any of you goes, Oh, yeah, Eberting's such an asshole, what a motherfucker he is, you know. Yeah, I you will be the next person to go. So we are united in this decision. Yeah. You know, it was the only time This is a tribal thing. It is the only time I had a democracy make a decision for me. And it was coming to this, but I'm kind of glad that they did it because it took a lot of the responsibility off of me. So on the heels of that, then uh and I'll just say chastity came into our lives, and she had had experience working in another Orthodonist office, and and she's quiet. She's always been the least of my problems. Like, I can count on her to do the work.

SPEAKER_01 59:37

I mean, I love her dearly, I do, and then the fact that you have your own ability locally and doing it, and like you are the yeah.

SPEAKER_00 59:48

She I love it, had to leave me at the beginning of 21 because she'd had a child and then quite literally had two others dropped on her doorstep, you know. Yikes, and um, and then I was like, I I totally get it. And this is what I will say to some people that leave, if it's we're leaving on a decent terms, I will leave the light on for you. Absolutely, and that is you can you can come back if you need if life, if your life presents itself in such a way that you want to come back, the door is open for you to come back. And and there are employees over this 25-year history who will say he has always he has always believed that. You know, and um and I've also always said this is that what I say about you when your future employer calls for a reference is the truth. It will all depend on how you go out the door. Well, you could be an A plus employee for the whole run. And if you flip me the bird as you're going out the door, you're an F. And I will, and I will, I do not care what the law says I can and cannot do. I will I will editorialize. Yeah, and and uh because what are you gonna fucking do about it?

SPEAKER_01 1:01:07

So um in this one, and let's start a new one.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:12

Oh, you got tired of this episode already? No, I'm not tired of anything. Okay, all right. I just wanted to get we're done talking about managing people. So we're gonna now we're gonna do You're saying that in a negative tone. No, so I'm gonna I'm gonna battery. I don't know if I was done yet. You you're I know you're trying to rein me in because I could easily go off the rails on this. I'm not reining you in. No, you are. No, I'm not. No. Actually, I'm better, I'm better to this episode than I had to do edit jobs on the first part of this because uh, you know, I kind of I got a little emotional about some people. No, I mean, here's the thing. When it's time to say goodbye, it's a rough gig, and and I have learned as I've gotten older to just let it go and let them leave and and do what they want to do. Well, we were just talking for an hour, that's all. Well, okay. We have some episodes that have gone for like an hour and a half. You're the one that has a schedule that I can never I can't see you more frequently.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:06

Oh, don't even. Are you about to hit me with my schedule? I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:11

There we go. Okay, there we go. Oh shit. Uh oh heck. You're gonna hit me. Okay, I retract that statement. My apologies. My humble apologies for that. You know, I love you. And um, but anyway, so no, managing people is a rough gig. It is not for the faint-hearted, for anybody that's in a supervisory or managerial or business ownership position. It is it is hard, and it has not gotten easier as the years have gone on.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:42

And I think I even but part of this, what I was thinking that we were going to go into, which will lead to whatever, like how do you manage yourself when you get home? Like managing people, managing your spouse, managing your kids.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:57

Well, yeah, and we didn't even touch on that. Like, we I was hoping like we would touch on how do you manage like the people you do business with or the people that you know, your family or or what else like be a whole separate world. Yes, you know, it's brutal. And maybe we'll touch on that at some point. Maybe. I think we need to get past the divorce episodes. We're building this up into something that's huge. Like, like, like so the next episode CJ doesn't even want me to do it. Really? Yeah. We're gonna we're gonna really have to have to put some guardrails on it. We're gonna have to make some agreements on like what we do and don't talk about.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:35

CJ would appreciate what you just said. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:38

I mean, but we do have to have some because it would be just as easy for me.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:40

But I want to do it. Can we do a normal episode?

SPEAKER_00 1:03:42

Yeah, we're going to. So so the next episode that we do is gonna be kind of like the next Spider-Man movie before we do Doomsday. Am I right? That's gonna be about right. You know?

SPEAKER_01 1:03:55

And only you and me and two other people understand what the fuck you just said. I know.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:01

But they're the only two that we're fucking listening anyway, you know.

Wrap-Up, Reviews, And Be Decent

SPEAKER_00 1:04:06

So anyway, guys, listen, first of all, when you listen to us, like we really do appreciate it. It seems like we have a core base of like 20 or so people that listen to us, and it kind of varies depending on like we do have one episode though that like we've had a million listeners. Like it was the post-election episode, episode four or something like that. That we've got like nine million listeners on that one.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:27

I uh might hey if you're listening, my niece flat out like wants to be a part of the show.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:35

So I've had like in my neighbors so one of my sisters-in-law asked me last night, do we interview people? And I said, We've only done one.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:43

And and I think we should yes, that was a that was a slow lobbed softball. And uh and we're being kind. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:58

Um as we normally are.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:00

We try to be always decent. We try to be well, we say be decent to each other. I mean, we end that all the time. I'll try to be decent every time, every time. I picked up that line from the movie Bonfire for the Vanities. Morgan Freeman says that towards the end of the movie. Of course it's Morgan Freeman. Right. It's always Morgan Freeman to each other, you know? And in the end, yes, he was decent to everybody. All right, so yeah, we'll just go on to the next episode. We're just gonna probably do a lot of bullshitting for an hour, is what we're gonna end up doing.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:31

We just did a fucking bullshit.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:33

We talked about some serious shit, man. Yeah, but no one wants to care. Yeah, I know. They kind of like it when we just bullshit. Yeah. So, anyway, so when you're listening to our podcast, like go to Apple Podcasts and like get leave us a good review. Like, you know, we don't have an email. I thought about setting up an email for us, like we could have people you know send us and we could like do a mailbag episode or something like that, you know, and and say, Hey, this is what this person has to say. You guys. I suck. Well, fuck you, motherfucker, you know. That's what it's all worth it. Anyway, so like if you could just go leave us a bag, oh I'd love to do a mailbag.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:24

Fuck you, mailbag!

SPEAKER_00 1:06:25

Fuck you, mailbag. Fuck you! So, mailbag, more like teabag, you know? And uh so we appreciate anything that you say about on any platform that on which you listen to us, leave us a decent review, and that will like help the algorithms say that we are a podcast of merit, and uh and we appreciate all that. So, look, at the end of the day, we we stick by it, be decent to each other. Love you. Love you.