Unmasking Greatness
Join Fitness/LifeStyle Expert & Mentor Chris Kakouras talk about maximizing your health, business, mindset, and overall life! Let's get better together as I bring on amazing guest to interview and learn from!
Unmasking Greatness
Building Muscle, Breaking Barriers: TJ's Bodybuilding Journey at 40
In this compelling conversation, we explore TJ Mersman's journey from troubled youth to first-place bodybuilding competitor at age 40, guided by Kak Performance success coach Ranzino Valentine.
• TJ shares his background, including being born on an Air Force base in England and how legal troubles as a teenager became a turning point in his life
• Tired of being called "skinny" and "toothpick," TJ began his fitness journey through self-education and building a makeshift gym on his back porch
• Zeno explains the comprehensive approach to competition prep, including blood work, food sensitivity testing, and personalized nutrition planning
• Despite being a "hard gainer," TJ managed to compete while consuming 3,800 calories during peak week—far higher than typical competitors
• The mental challenges of bodybuilding require unwavering discipline, described as "the hardest sport in the world" due to its 24/7 commitment
• TJ discusses balancing family responsibilities with competition preparation and the importance of being present despite fatigue
• The importance of mindset is emphasized, with TJ advising: "Your brain will give you so many excuses... don't let yourself negotiate with yourself"
• TJ achieved first place in True Novice division, first in 40+ division, and second place overall in his debut competition
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Welcome to Unmasking Greatness. I'm your host, chris Kikoris, a lifestyle fitness coach and mentor. This podcast is about unmasking your greatest potential, finding your purpose and crafting a life worth living. Health and fitness has been the gateway drug to all of my success. My continuous drive to keep learning and surround myself with other high achievers forces me to level up, which has developed my mind to something I never thought was possible. This podcast is here to share what I've learned and continue to learn with all of you. This is your sign to take back control of your health, mindset and personal environment. Strap in as we are recharged and always find value in the show. Please subscribe and share, as we can all get better together. Let's go. What's up, guys? Welcome to another episode of Unmasking Greatness. I'm your host, chris Kikoris, and I have two very special guests with us today. We have TJ Mersman and Ranzino Valentine. Tj is one of our clients at CAC Performance and Zeno is one of our success coaches here at CAC Performance as well, so we're going to be talking all about show prep dieting, nutrition protocols that got TJ in probably one of the best conditions of his life.
Speaker 1:Now TJ has always been in really good shape. I will say that for the most part and not everybody comes out their mama in good shape. But you had to work for something. But with TJ we got him to do his very first bodybuilding show, which got first in true novice, and then he also did first place in 40 Plus. So for all you mature muscle out there, you can still make it happen. Old muscle, that's right. And ended up getting what was it on the open? Second overall, sorry, second overall. So I really want to kind of let the listeners and viewers hear a little bit about you and then we'll kind of dig into how you even decided at the age of 40, like hey, I want to compete now. So give me a rundown. Who is TJ?
Speaker 2:I was born in England on an Air Force base. That's where my dad met my real mother out there. I think I was about three years old when we moved to the States. They were having some issues with our relationship so my dad wanted to get out of there. Grew up in South Florida, Florida boy. Had a great childhood down there, fishing all the time, Learned a lot of things I shouldn't have learned at an early age because I was in Florida.
Speaker 2:Hurricane Andrew that came in 1992, august, and it destroyed our home so we moved up here. My dad's from here so he was went to dormant high school back in the day, so he figured this would be a good area for us to go to until our house was rebuilt, so it took about a year we moved back down, and then my dad missed it a year or so. We came back, so I've been here ever since I was 16 now.
Speaker 3:Okay.
Speaker 1:So was the plan to go back to Florida, though, originally.
Speaker 2:Yeah, after the hurricane, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we were just waiting on the house to get rebuilt, yeah yeah, I mean, there were so many homes destroyed it took forever just to get the insurance company to come out and assess the damage and all that stuff.
Speaker 2:But I ended up getting into some trouble as a kid here because, coming from Florida, I learned a lot of things and I saw how much easier it was to get away with stuff here because they weren't used to teenagers doing things that I was doing.
Speaker 2:So I learned a lot from that lesson. I did about five years of probation, got off in two and a half years for good behavior and put that behind me and I've never been in trouble since. I learned a lot from my probation officer. He sat down face-to-face and he let me know that I wasn't this type of kid, because he deals with them all the time.
Speaker 2:He's like I can tell you come from a good family. This ain't you, you know, get that criminal thinking out of your head, yeah, and get back to where you're supposed to be. And I followed.
Speaker 3:I followed his lead, took his advice and became a way better person out of it. So yeah, this is a big lesson for me at a young age.
Speaker 2:I was 17 years old.
Speaker 2:Yeah, geez, it also hindered, me as well, because I got a felony on my record. So getting a job at certain places I couldn't do that, um, so what I did was I started at the job that I'm working at now. I was grinding metal all day long for eight hours, just hitting the sand paper with metal, metal flying everywhere, sparks, burning my skin, and I did that the fastest anybody anybody at that place has ever done it before. So the owner of the place noticed that he's like let's get you out of here, you're too good for this. So that's what started my metallurgical career. So I worked in the metallurgical lab let's see, probably, probably for 15 years.
Speaker 3:Oh, wow, so that's just the study of metal.
Speaker 2:So I was just checking a lot of parts, doing metallurgical studies on them, and that's what gave me my career at ZF transmissions and gray cord. And then after that I came back to the original place and now I'm the quality manager there. So, big up, I got my own office, got a huge desk.
Speaker 3:I'm like kingpin, kingpin boss man over there it feels good to come where I've come from and be in the trouble that I've been in and, you know, get a position like the type of position that I have.
Speaker 1:So yeah, yeah, that feels really good that's, um, that's a pretty crazy, I mean for you. I mean, you know you have a felony on your record. I don, if you don't want to say what it was, you don't have to say it. It was auto-breaking.
Speaker 2:Okay, we were just going around to apartment complexes opening up car doors. Never broke into a car, but I guess technically I did break into it.
Speaker 1:Yeah yeah, so that's what they're doing. We were just stealing stereos and stuff.
Speaker 2:We ended up on the top ten most wanted list on WOW For that. Oh yeah, it was about 200 cars we were wilding out.
Speaker 1:That's really crazy, you know. I mean, that's what people are doing now. They're not like physically breaking windows to get in cars. They're checking to see. If you leave car doors unlocked, yeah, and people will leave. You know, they'll leave their firearms in there watches. You know people don't think.
Speaker 2:That watches People. Don't think that's what we were looking for. Mostly was firearms.
Speaker 1:We could sell those for top dollar. I don't know if I'm going to put this in the podcast or not, but I want to say a name. I just want to know if you know who this is. Do you know someone? He's not going to listen to this podcast anyways Joey Whitworth.
Speaker 2:Do you know who that is? The Whitworth name is familiar.
Speaker 1:The reason why is because back in the day he was one of my really close friends that did skateboarding and then we all kind of ventured our own paths in life. But same thing Him and I know another two guys, that's what they were doing, and they even were breaking into cop cars.
Speaker 2:Well, we didn't break into a cop car. We found a county coroner's car and he had an issued shotgun in the back. He had a bulletproof vest in the back and I didn't touch that because I knew, oh, you didn't yeah.
Speaker 2:I saw that in the back and I was like I'm not touching this car right here. But my buddy did. He took the vest, took the shotgun and took the car for a spin because there was a key in a magnetic box in the wheel. Well, so he did a bunch of damage and just came and parked it back where it was and he ended up.
Speaker 1:He ended up getting the heat for that too oh, they ain't playing with that one for stealing that shotgun, that bulletproof vest yeah, geez yeah well, yeah, so then I guess you can, going through that, that made you kind of open your eyes up and realize like this might not be the way that I want to go.
Speaker 2:Yes, so I just wanted a better life than being a hoodlum, I guess, yeah, yeah for sure.
Speaker 1:So through that transition, at what point were you, did you decide to start working out? Was that part of it? Was that like to get you, you know, out of off the streets and things like that?
Speaker 2:Or not really at all. The thing that drove me to start working out was being called toothpick and skinny my whole life okay so after I got
Speaker 2:married to my first wife, um, had my daughter bella, and after that I was like it's time to be a man. So everybody's calling me skinny. Everywhere I went, people you know my boys are all nagging me, you know making fun of me for being so damn skinny. So I was like you know what? I'm going to do something about this shit. So I just started going to Barnes and Nobles on Haywood Road. I started reading all the muscle magazines I could find Arnold, bible, like everything Just studied them every single night. I ended up finding an article in a muscle and fitness magazine. It was for a hard gainer. I was like I got to be that guy because I'm skinny and I can't freaking gain weight. So I took that plan and I followed it to a T and put on like 20 pounds of muscle, naturally. So then everybody, everybody that knows me, they're like damn, dude, you're getting bigger. So that just fed my head and I was like I got to keep going.
Speaker 1:It's working. Yeah, because back then there was no. I mean, I don't know, at that time I don't think there was like really much social media that was like 2003-ish somewhere around there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so there's not as much information, because even I mean, when I used to look at magazines too, somebody's diet would be on there and, like I know everybody that's ever done a nutrition plan, if they saw that, they'd be like I'm never doing that because it was just, it was super bland, like very straightforward, you know your four ounces chicken breast, rice, broccoli, like and for all your meals, because they were going off of like a bodybuilder's nutrition plan. But that's, that's what I did because I didn't know any better that's what mine was.
Speaker 1:It's basically broccoli rice and meat yeah, like all day long yeah, I didn't know anything about tracking, I was just more like this guy's big, he eats this, I eat this, I want to get big, just logical, like plug and play. That's what I was hoping for. So so that got you into it. Obviously, like you getting some progress started, helping like build your confidence, you start looking a little better, hopefully.
Speaker 2:Yeah because it took me a while to even join a gym because I was. I was intimidated. Okay, all those guys were big and I was like the skinny guy. So I was like I'm not going to a gym. So I built a gym on my back porch, out in the heat. Um, I got a weight bench, got a pull-up bar, I got a dip station just got all the dumbbells I could possibly get or afford. Um, I had plates. I built my own cable system with ropes and pulleys. I just sat back there for almost two years working out?
Speaker 1:are you built it yourself, is that?
Speaker 2:what you said. That's great. There was nothing that was gonna stop me from doing that you're being secret is what he was doing guys from from work and stuff. They saw my progress. They were like, man, come over to your house and let me work out with you. And in those days when it was like 90-something degrees, 100 degrees, they were stepping in my house every five minutes. I'm like get your bitch ass back out here, man. I ain't coming in the house. Get out here and work out with me, man.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. Well, I bet you get this too, because that's kind of similar. I mean, I wasn't out on the back deck, we had it inside of a house, but I would have friends come and they'd work out with me for a couple weeks and then leave, you know, and then they'd be sparse and then just wouldn't show up anymore. And you'll run into them three, four, five years later and they'll see the progress you made like damn, I wish. I wish I would have stuck doing doing the workouts with you. So it makes you feel a little bit good when it comes to that so at that point, so you stayed.
Speaker 1:I mean, was that pretty much after you started? You was consistent all the way through. Did you take breaks? Did you stop in between any time?
Speaker 2:no, I pretty much stayed consistent. It was like it became the thing that I loved to do. It was my hobby, the thing that that feeded my mind and and fed my discipline with my one for discipline.
Speaker 2:So yeah I just stuck to it. I mean, all the years I worked at zf, nobody could ever believe that I was eating these meals the same shit every single day. They're like how in the fuck do you do that, dude? I'm like I'm on a mission, dude. Yeah, I'm gonna stop you from getting where I want to go yeah, yeah, no doubt it was.
Speaker 2:It was a good experience just doing all that myself learning it myself and not relying on a coach or anything like that, just reading and doing all the research and figuring it out myself.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it gives you a good baseline and you learn your body too. So I know Zeno is your success coach and prepped you for the show. But how? Now you guys knew each other prior to working together. Is that right?
Speaker 4:um, what with our well, my wife, his um past wife, uh, ex-wife not past, she's still alive clarify, let me clarify that. Um, so they were good friends. Uh, at that point in time, his um actually ex-wife actually did, uh jennifer's makeup for our wedding at that point in time, um, so I met tj through them meeting acquaintances, going out, a couple of dates and things of that nature. So that's how we actually met. That was what over 10 years ago now yeah, that's a long time ago, 2015,. Maybe I think it was before that. Bro, when did you get married? We got married in 2014.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it was before that, it was definitely before that. I knew you about a year before you got married maybe.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it was about a year or two, so it was about 2012, 2013,. The time frame.
Speaker 1:Heck, yeah, yeah, side note on that one Right here there is a. I mean I just recently met TJ, but same kind of deal. Zeno had to remind me how old I was this past weekend he weekend. He's like dude, you know, we've been friends for a decade and I was thinking back. I was like, oh my god, has it been that long? Yeah, uh, so it's really cool. It is cool, I think, good people you surround yourself with good people and good things happen. So this whole little podcast thing I think is, uh, it's cool for me to experience that and obviously like kind of similar to you. You trust xeno very much, so I trust xeno's word and his work ethic, so that just automatically I have trust in you and anything that you do and I want to see you win. So that's why you guys did great. But yeah, so just a little side note on that one. So you guys knew each other. And then what made you decide I think I want to do a show.
Speaker 2:I mean I've been in the gym for 15, 20 years.
Speaker 3:I've worked out with.
Speaker 2:IFBB Pro and Natron Scott. It was, I think, close to three years. Me and him worked out Every day on lunch break. We'd leave ZF, go hit the gym, just getting a good baseline from him.
Speaker 2:I thought I was like I was doing everything well, and then I started working out with nature and I found out oh shit, this dude really cries. This is what, this is what I need to be doing now. So I mean he would man, he would beat me, beat me in that gym. I mean I'd come out of there. I mean I'd walk up to him and be like dude. I don't know if I could do another set and he'd be like man, shut the hell up. So it taught me a lot. It gave me, gave me even more discipline than I had. So but everybody was always telling me in every gym I've been in, like dude, you need to do a competition, look great. You know you always look great like a lot of the guys in here want to look like you and that just I don't like hearing stuff like that. I know it sounds kind of weird for me to say that, but it just makes me think. I don't know, I don't want to get a big head about about anything.
Speaker 2:So yeah, I just felt like it was going to mess my mind up, hearing like oh, these guys want to look like you. So I was like no, you can't look like me like I'm. This is me yeah you could be your best version of yourself, but you're never going to look like me. Like you said. You know, put the work in and then get the best you can get for yourself.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:But with everybody ragging me all the time, I finally I lost touch with Zeno for a while because I went through a divorce and I didn't know who was against me. You know, your mind gets kind of screwed up and you're going through something like that yeah.
Speaker 2:I didn't know if I said something to Zeno, if word would get back to Jennifer and Jennifer would tell Laura and that they might hold that against me. I didn't know what was going on back then, so I just dropped a lot of people. And then what? A year and a half ago I started working out here and I see Zeno. I was like, oh shit, it's like it's good to see this guy right now, I haven't seen him forever. So I think we lost touch maybe five, six, seven years or something like that.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it was a while. It was a while, yeah, because Jennifer and Laurel they lost touch too, so like that was the connection there. So, and then life happens, kids happen and everything just transpires. What?
Speaker 2:transpires. I think one of the first things I said to you was like man, because you, let me know, you were a coach or something like that. I was like dude. I'm thinking about maybe trying to do a competition Like can you get? Me on that and he was like yeah, just let me know when you're ready. I got you.
Speaker 4:Side note, chris will know that for me, it was actually perfect timing when he brought it up because, like I'm one, I don't do competitors right. We've had this conversation multiple times, just because I know what it looks like and I know the sacrifice that it's going to take in order to actually just get to stage, let alone win a show. And now we never enter it thinking about winning but, like I wasn't competing, this is the first year in 10 years that I haven't competed on the stage. Right, everybody says, well, you're getting ready for a show? No, I'm just trying to get back in shape.
Speaker 4:But a lot of things transpired this year for me to where I knew, going into 2025, that I would not possibly be competing this year. Just career, family, business-wise, a lot of different things there. And TJ asked me at the end of last year about it and I was just like this is perfect timing for some reason Because, like I said once again, I don't train competitors because I was still actively competing and I felt like it would also be selfish for me to take away from my prep and to give them to their prep, because I'm going to be all in on it at that point in time and we'll get more into that part of it. But yeah, so I've helped people, you know, just from time to time around like posing nutrition workout advice, but not the full gambit.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, I think it's important to give some context on you as well. So Zeno is also an IFBB pro men's physique athlete. He's been coached by some high-level coaches as well and obviously, us knowing each other for a long time, I know he knows what he's talking about and so I think, yeah, perfect timing. Like the gym, because this gym is very catered to bodybuilding. There's a posing room, a lot of like specific equipment, the environment's a little bit different, and then both you guys come here. So that's even more convenient because everything we do is online, right. So when you get to physically see somebody, you get a lot of benefit from that, because, sure, like videos and pictures help, but with a competitor it's it's very nice to be able to see them in person and really look at the conditioning, especially as you got closer to the show and the posing, which you know you you'll get into that as well.
Speaker 1:So I think it was, it was definitely good timing in all directions for that to happen and I'll I'll kind of say this I think, uh, I going to say this just because I want to say this but you get what you pay for. All right, you know, we're not the cheapest coaching group out there and we're not the most expensive either, but I think you get what you pay for. If you're looking for a coach that's going to charge you like a hundred bucks a month, please believe that's what you're going to get. And I think TJ and and I don't want to speak for you, but I think you know what our price point is and what you got. I think it was fair in my opinion.
Speaker 2:It was well worth it, if you ask me. Yeah, well worth it yeah, so. I mean, like we said, the timing of me and Zeno coming together. I think it was meant to happen Like it was. I don't know. It sounds kind of funny saying stuff like that. I'm not some little bitch guy, that thinks that way or whatever.
Speaker 1:Let's talk about the stars in the universe.
Speaker 4:Yeah, let's just talk about that. You know what I mean. I talk about that stuff.
Speaker 2:The only reason I asked him was because when I met him I could tell he was a disciplined dude the first day that I met him. So I knew, you know this guy's on top of his shit.
Speaker 2:Like he's a disciplined dude, so he was raised properly by a disciplined dad. So so when I saw him in here, I was like man, I've been wanting to do a competition forever. The only reason I've never done one is because I was too damn scared to get on stage. I've always been a shy kid, bashful skinny. Everybody made fun of me. So once I hit 40, I stopped giving a fuck dude. It's like I don't give a shit what anybody thinks about me.
Speaker 2:I'm just going to do me and you know live the best I can for the years I have left. So but that's why I went to xeno, because I knew I knew he'd be a great person to lead the way for me, so oh cool, yeah.
Speaker 1:So let's, let's get into that, let's talk about it. So obviously you've had your previous knowledge of you, your experience, you looking things up yourself, but how were things differently and how it in xeno as well to to tj, like learning his body and his body type because he's a hard gainer kind of share that whole experience I know. But I want you guys to talk about it because it is, it is really uh, it's impressive to me.
Speaker 2:I will say that yeah, I'll let tj go this shows about him uh um, I mean the difference between what I was doing before and what Zeno had me doing. It was a big difference. It was more strict. You know just the ramping up of food. I've never done that before. I'm sitting at 4,000 calories a day. All of a sudden I'm like, fuck this, I'm going to 7,000. So I just bump up and now I understand the process a lot better now.
Speaker 2:Just taking these steps up instead of just you know, large strides up the ladder. I mean following the plan and everything. I don't want to sound like somebody with a big head, but it wasn't hard for me.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Like I'm just built that way. It's just the way my mind is Like I mean Zeno wanted me to go get burger and fries, and I'm just built that way. It's just the way my mind is. I mean, zeno wanted me to go get burger and fries and I'm like, no, that's too dirty for me, I'd rather have sushi.
Speaker 1:I just didn't want to eat anything unhealthy.
Speaker 2:And I've been that way for years. Like sugar, I don't put that stuff in my body. Every once in a while I'll have some ice cream with my daughter or something like that, but for the most part that's. It's not entering my mouth. Yeah, you know, just, I've learned. I've learned a lot about nutrition. The nutrition side of it was, you know, to um, just picking the right ingredients, picking the right foods grass-fed, grass-finished. I didn't know anything about that until I came here and I'm as you Like, I was just I thought meat was meat, I thought Walmart meat was shitty and you know, fresh Market was great.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:So I don't know what else to say right now.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, no, I mean, it's obviously like more discipline. You know side note too, because I do know this as well. Zeno is a success coach here, but he also has other business ventures that they do, and one of them is with PushMed, him and his wife, jennifer, and one of the things I think we got you to do initially was get some blood work done, and so were you doing that prior, or was this kind of the first time getting introduced to that?
Speaker 2:I would do it every once in a while at a regular medical doctor, so I wasn't getting, and then I'd have to let them know. You know they'd get my results. I'd come back, I'd sit down with them and immediately they're like what are you taking? I'm like nothing, dude. I don't know what are you talking about. I eat a lot of food, eat a lot of protein, and then he'll say something else. He'll come back to it. Right now I'm like shit, this guy knows I'm taking testosterone.
Speaker 2:I was like, all right, you know I'm taking testosterone. Yeah, most of the time I was taking more than that and that's when I found out.
Speaker 2:You know how that affects your blood work. Yeah, so, um, but going to push med was a, was a a different side of it. It's not a medical doctor saying that's bad for you, you've got to stop now. You've got to stop taking testosterone. You're not supposed to be taking that. This is what it's going to do to your heart and this, and that. I got a different side of it With Zeno and going to push mid. It wasn't. Oh my god, you're doing something terribly wrong. You're going to kill yourself eventually or something like that. I learned taking the optimal dose or a TRT dose of testosterone is way better for you than taking 1,000 milligrams a week or something like that. Things I used to do years ago.
Speaker 1:That's a lot 1,000 milligrams is a lot. I've taken more than that, yeah Well, I think the difference is because I have a primary care doctor. I go to her when I'm sick, I got the flu or something like that, but when it comes to overall health, we're not normal, nor do we want to be normal. You want to be a high performer but still be safe. So I think now that's why clinics like PushMed are around. It's like, hey, these are medical doctors and providers to look at your lab work, to make sure that you're optimal, not over the edge where you're going to harm yourself, but like let's bump it up to where you're a high normal and that's where you're really able to like thrive. Because you know, I'm sure, as you know, if your hormones aren't good, your digestive tract, your microbiome is hurting, like this all hinders, like the way that you're physically going to look, along with the lifestyle aspect.
Speaker 2:So but yeah, speaking, of the microbiome thing you know. He offered me to, or suggested that I go get a food sensitivity test, blood work.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And I was a little skeptical of it. I started researching it and I'm like man. Some people say it's like it's a wash or whatever. Some people say it's actually legit. So but I knew Zeno knows his shit and he's a good person, so I went ahead and did it, got the results back. We changed the diet up, I started following the results of the food sensitivity test and dude it's legit yeah.
Speaker 2:Digestive system bloating went away. You know, passing gas all throughout the day was what I used to do, and it's just certain times of the day. I might do a little toot here and a little toot there. That's it. So it's legit. It actually does work and you feel better. You have more energy if you're eating the foods that your digestive system agrees with. Yeah, no, 100% Food quality matters, so I would suggest everyone that's in the bodybuilding world get that done.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:No, heck yeah. So you looked at his blood work. Was it good initially?
Speaker 4:It was, I didn't look at it. I looked at it once he provided it to me. Yeah, because I don't, even though I worked there, I still don't just get it. Yeah, yeah, because I have to have the approval to have it at that point in time, and so he gave approval for me to have it. And at that point in time, and so he gave approval for me to have it, and we wanted to go through everything. So, for me, with doing this for as long as I've done it now and seeing all the good, bad and the ugly of it, like I say once again, I'm very meticulous on my process and when I go in, I go in and I need to understand, like, all right, what am I dealing with? And when we looked at the blood work, initially it was, it was decent, but it could have been better. Right, just based off of certain markers as far as, like, liver enzymes, testosterone, um, hemoglobin, a lot of different things of that nature, right, um? So we had conversations around. It went through, broke it down. He went back to push med medical provider. They went through, broke it down, asked the different questions, make sure that everything was out before we went into. We had a lot of different phases in this prep, right. So this wasn't just like, oh, we're just going to start 16 weeks out and go no, no, no, no. We had to build this up.
Speaker 4:The food sensitivity was critical and key, based off of understanding. You know, he was born in England, lived in South Florida, came to the upstate area, south Carolina, went back to Florida, came back. So it's a lot of things and variables that take place during that transformation for everybody, like the toxicity of your areas, what you're exposed to food-wise, and so really understanding the breakdown of his body and what the food was going to do. Now, your food sensitivity can change over time as well. So you can have a sensitivity, something now, but maybe not something later. It doesn't mean you can never not have it. It just understand that there are some side effects that come with you eating said food. Yeah, right, um, and even said food is not properly sourced, so that's a whole nother factor, um, so just the education around, like he was saying, the ingredients and the nutrition of food, is what I wanted to start educating him on, because it's the trials and tribulations that I've been through with food and understanding that, and a lot of people believe that your number one brain is this one.
Speaker 4:But it's actually your gut If you think about it. If your gut's not right, this isn't right. So I wanted to make sure that the gut was right first before we started. He already has the discipline. You've heard that say multiple times. Once he gets something locked in his mind, he's going to go. So I didn't have to coach to that. I knew how to coach to it if we got down that path, and how to prepare him, to prepare his family, for the journey that he was about to venture on.
Speaker 4:But in regards to him following the plan, trusting the process, that was never a question of mine of concern. I knew that going into it as a new teacher, you saw the body of work that he produced on his own at that point in time, so you kind of had an idea of what it would be. So he has the genetics for it, right? Yeah, it's a lot of guys competing the pros that no matter what coach they go to, they can be successful because they have the genetics for it. But how the level of success they can achieve now that's a difference maker. Yeah, right, so you can have some of the top coaches, but then you see one top coach, my coach Ariel Cutts. He is leaps and bounds above everybody else, I believe. Like I saw his status right now, I think like 23 to 39% of the guys competing in Men's Physique Olympia this year are his guys.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I saw that.
Speaker 4:There's levels to this and a lot of those guys have been with other premier coaches.
Speaker 4:But how did they get to this level? So, understanding that, like you said, I've been with a lot of high-level profile coaches over my time in the bodybuilding world. But coaches over my time in the bodybuilding world, but just learning different things over time childhood relationship, myself, doing a whole lot of different research around the different ways of being optimal and that's where pushman comes into play is like we get the blood work optimal, optimize your health to optimize your life. How do we see what's optimal for you, unless it's more, as my philosophy, you don't need to take everything under the sun, uh, at that point in time, and you need to understand what you are taking and what those side effects could be and the risk factors of it at that point in time. So deal with a medical professional. I'm not a medical professional, never claimed to be one, I'm just someone does a lot of research. Yeah, um, trial and error on itself, but at the same point, point time, I do that through the guidance of medical providers as well.
Speaker 3:Yeah. So I'm saying consistent blood work.
Speaker 4:You know, depending on what you're doing, you should be getting lower. I would say bare metal for anybody who's looking to compete, not even compete. You should be getting lower at least two times a year. Yeah, trt is not the Negative connotation that a lot of people think that it is. Yeah, especially when you start reaching certain ages in your life, is men, even for women, you want to make sure that you are optimized. You don't have to live said ways, and that's a lot of part of it too. But with TJ, in regards to the prep aspect of it, the hardest part, I would say, for me, coaching TJ, was the food capacity.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's what that's what I want you to talk about.
Speaker 4:That was the hardest part was the food capacity. You heard him he would go from 4,000 to 7,000 calories. I was like in what world? And I don't get that.
Speaker 4:Like I said, it's genetics at that point in time. So it was very interesting. So I had to, once we got all the blood work back, we got the food sensitivity back, restructure and rebuild the plan TJ got up to. He was up to about 5,500 calories at the highest point of the off-season building season before we started a prep. So going into prep he was already sitting well over 5,000 on his training days.
Speaker 4:So I have a carb cycle philosophy with tj because that's what works best for his body. So it's for me understanding what each person works best, yeah, for their body. It's not a cookie cutter way, because I've I've seen the cookie cutter way for myself and I've seen when somebody really pays attention to that and like for me, does it take more time? Abs are freaking loopy. It takes more time. It take more time. Absolutely it takes more time. It takes more diligence to make sure that you customize the plan.
Speaker 4:But some people and see the signs, like understand what you're looking for. Yeah, when you make said changes, making your client aware of like, hey, this is what you could possibly experience during this time. I'm prepared for it. Just want to make sure that you're aware, don't freak out. Yeah, and that concept of it and like, just want to make sure that you're aware, don't freak out.
Speaker 4:Yeah, um, and that concept of it and like he was like man, this is, I've had more food than this before. I was like, yeah, but it wasn't the right food, um, and so now teaching that, getting him to understand that, having conversations, checkpoints, weekly, um me, being able to see him in the gym is obviously, like you said, a huge benefit, because that's what I had for my very first coach, elvis, who was here in an upstate area. I never did a check-in photo with Elvis, it was always fill off, let me see, fill off, fill off, and then watching how things transpired and making the changes because I was with him every single day for the process to work out. When I say it was hard for me and TJ, I'll fast forward a little bit, going into peak week like the plan for peak week. He. I'll fast forward a little bit, going into peak week like the plan for peak week.
Speaker 1:He was at 3,800 calories in peak week. Yeah, I remember that I was just like this is and TJ's complaining his food's low.
Speaker 4:He was complaining his food was low, but obviously from 7,000 calories you probably would complain that your food is low. But I'm looking at it and it's like, obviously TJ is my first client, from beginning to end, to where I had full range control, whether it's the starting of the nutrition, creating the workout plan, going over posing, helping with board shorts, helping with setting up the show, helping planning out, tanning, everything Right. Everything was beginning to end with me, with TJ him trusting me to be able to guide him through that aspect of it. So 3,800 calories. I started questioning myself am I doing the right thing? How is he at 3,800 calories? Going at the beginning of peak week, and I promise you, throughout the entire peak week, TJ didn't drop probably below 3,500 calories. It's been now.
Speaker 4:We competed on June 21st, so it's been almost a month now. So we're in our growth phase. We're coming back out. He got down to 203. 203, yeah, 203 on stage the morning of the show, so he was 203. Brought him down from 223. Yeah, somewhere in that area. So we built up to 223. When we started prep came down to 203. So we lost 20 pounds in prep. No-transcript. Now he's at last check-in. It's just the past Thursday. He's at 211 from the show, so no crazy.
Speaker 4:20, 30, 40, 50 pound rebalance that a lot of people go through because, as you heard him say, he doesn't consume sugar, he doesn't have the craving and that was a difference of getting him to understand of, like, going to the deep end and slowly building. It's like when you go to the deep end, you gain all that weight. How much of that truly was muscle versus water versus fat. Yeah, now we know, going the route that we're going, we have pretty much a sustainable amount of muscle that we're building on. We'll go do the body scans and push to see where we are from, where we were, to get the full notion of, like, how much muscle mass we put on. Yeah, but we still are in our growth phase, so we're not going to do that quite yet.
Speaker 4:And I just did your plan for your next up it's already at 4,900 calories. Oh yeah, on his high days, his high days are his training days. Yeah, and like, once again, another thing of learning, especially with mature muscle, especially with time and understanding about your rate of recovery. Tj was only working out and this also attests to his genetics and following plan, tj was working out four days a week. I pulled him down to four days a week in regards to lifting weights and six days cardio and mind you, his cardio, chris, you would know his cardio was only 30 minutes a day on.
Speaker 4:Stairmaster. That was it. Yeah, that's plenty. That was it, right, that's plenty. I've had battles where I've had 90-minute sessions, yeah, and back in my day Eating less than 2,000 calories to really get that leanness ready. But this was our first show.
Speaker 1:But I think that comes down to a lot of experience with yourself too, because I've experienced this too, working with clients where a lot of I would say, new coaches, when they're trying to peel people down, they just want to keep cranking things more and more, and I feel like what that does is it one makes them hit a roadblock just because they stress the body out too much, right. And so if you can get results by doing the least amount of work, like, why wouldn't you do that? Why would you just like keep hammering it? Just because I was just two weeks went by, let's crank it up some more. For what? If you're still seeing like really good results, why would you crank it up more and then just make your life more miserable? You know what I mean. So if we can get you eating 3 800 calories going into peak week, like more power to you, dude, but uh.
Speaker 1:But I think that's also an important note, which is, you know, and probably why xeno doesn't like taking tons of athletes either is because we don't want to. We don't want to athlete just to come with us and say, hey, I want to compete in 12 weeks are. Are you crazy? Like no. First off, what are you eating now? Because I've had people come to me and they're like eating 1,700 calories and want to go into prep. I'm like, dude, you are going to be hurting because that food's got to come down. How far are you going to be sucking on ice cubes eating lettuce?
Speaker 1:So it's really good to be able to work with someone in the off-scene. You can really good to be able to work with someone in the off scene and do it right. Get the blood work, build their, build your food capacity up, because then you can start chipping away from that and which is why you've done really well and you're still lean. Dude, is it that your, your body type is a blessing and a curse? Because it's great, because you, you don't really get fat, but, like for you to build muscle, it takes a ton of effort, which already takes longer to build muscle than it does to drop body fat. You know, as you've have, you've seen, you know. So coming in at the right time is good. Training wise, though, like has did that change for you at all? Oh, yeah, for sure.
Speaker 2:He taught me a lot okay, doing movements, I wouldn't say wrong. But there was a better way to to move the weight um and that's another great thing that I had going for me was he works out at the same gym. Yeah, so you know I'd be doing my thing. He's over there with Yosef. You know his workout partner, and I could tell he was watching me. Sometimes I could feel his eyes burning me.
Speaker 1:He'd come over and correct me, so I'm very thankful that I had that opportunity to just have him there most of the days I was working out, it was fantastic.
Speaker 1:Yeah, should we talk about the day that was your peak week? I remember coming in so this is the morning crew, this is the breakfast club right here, because they're in here first thing in the morning and I remember coming into the office, open up and Zeno comes in and he's usually finished up so he comes in and he starts, you know, talking about whatever. But I knew that that week specifically, you were kind of doing your well, actually it was your depletion workout. Um, I remember him going out there. You was talking to somebody and he's like why are you talking, get your workout done and leave? Because a depletion workout is supposed to be like like fast, like get it done, get out, like you should be tired, you should be fatigued, you need to go rest, let your body do the work. I just remember him going out there and giving me shit for it and I was like, okay, but that's a good coach, though he didn't do it maliciously he's like, hey, come on.
Speaker 2:And a lot of people were taking that the wrong way. I enjoyed him doing that to me. That was hilarious, that was one time that you saw that was probably the first time he's like you're talking too much. Get back to work.
Speaker 1:But we all need that. We all need that, just like get us back on the line. You know so because I'm a talker bro.
Speaker 4:Like I will. No, there's really no explanation really. But like you know, once again it goes back to the notion of I know what it looks like. I've been there, I've done that and we have a great community here at Carolina Iron and everybody roots for each other and cheers for each other. But also when you're in that area, we're trying to accomplish something right, and so everybody's coming up and talking to you and congratulating you, saying you look amazing, you're looking great, but we've got to get on stage.
Speaker 4:And that's a thing for me that a lot of people I don't think talk about a lot is that you may go to a gym and everybody, or you may walk around your workplace or anything. You may look the best to everybody, but then when you step on that stage, that's somebody that's coming from a different state. You know, when you get to the different levels of national, they may be coming from a different country. So your local show competitors aren't going to be what you see. If you're trying to accomplish a pro card once in a national show or trying to go and be on a pro stage, because now you're definitely doing people from all over the world at that point in time you're trying to be. So when you're trying to accomplish something and be in a top percentile of something, it's a different type of level, and when you tell me that's what you're you might be potentially striving for, well, I gotta push you past that now. I gotta push you to there because, once again, I know what that looks like. I know what that grind entails. I know what people telling you certain things can entail and drive you off your focus. So I needed you back on. I need you back on topic, I need you back on business.
Speaker 4:In regards to, hey, get the job done, get the cardio done, go rest Right, we'll talk after all that's done. And he'll tell you the day after the show is like, hey, free day, go do whatever. And, like the people who he was talking to, that was cheering him on, his fans you know our community here they said, hey, tj, let's go work out the next day. So, like they were there, they were in support. But in that moment, in those times, it's not time to. It's time to lock in, it's time to go through and get through the suck, embrace the suck. At this point, like in prep, as you know, and now TJ knows there is a certain dark place that you have to go to and how you, how you handle that dark place, is different. So this is the place where you need to let all that out. But if it's a lot of distractions, yeah, at that point in time, then you're not gonna get out of what you can get out of it yeah, you see, I'm saying yeah, yeah, no.
Speaker 4:It was just that point up before me and I was like no, tj, you've got to move, you've got to go. Stop talking, keep working, because I'm trying to keep your heart rate up. Yeah, so one, we don't have to go on the cardio journey at that point in time, but if you have to drop your food harder because we're missing moments. So it was just a teachable moment at that point in time, and it wasn't just for him, it was for the other individuals as well, because people he would talk to they're competitors as well. It was like no, no, no. When you deal with me, when you deal with CAC and the quality of work that we've got to do, this is what to expect.
Speaker 4:This is what it is, and it doesn't change no matter who you are or what you do Like there is a requirement that's required to be in this world of bodybuilding.
Speaker 3:Yeah. You got to pay that due For sure we all have to pay that due.
Speaker 4:Yeah, and that's what that was about.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, I mean I think you know, at CAC Performance we hold a high standard, for I mean, I hold a high standard for myself, but even for our team. You know, I tell all of them, like you guys got to be on your A game, like I I won't. I mean, luckily for me. Like all of our success coaches, except for Zeno I've coached in the past. They all have credentials. Zeno, I've known him for a decade, thank you, zeno. Um, but you know, been through prep and like I know he knows what he's talking about.
Speaker 1:But if someone, if I had to hire another person that I didn't know, like they got to live the lifestyle they got to eat it, breathe it, sleep it, or you're not made for CAC performance, because that's I, I like to lead by action. I want people to follow my footsteps and if I'm, you know, eating bonbons every night and you know not not staying active, drinking, you know not staying active drinking, you know Coca-Colas and stuff all the time, they're like Chris, you're a hypocrite dude. So, like I do, I like to keep a high standard for us. But I want to shift gears just a little bit, because I'm sure you had the conversation, was you know prior to actually starting your prep and kind of what that looks like. Was that knowing going into it? It's going to be more rigid, it's going to be more strict. Was that a conversation that you had with your partner? And then I know you have kids too, so did that affect? Do you feel like that affect your time with them?
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, for sure, because I was dedicating a lot of time, with the meals being in the gym at 1.6 days a week.
Speaker 2:I got some complaints at home about it. For sure, before she met me she knew I was an avid gym goer. That's my thing. We've been together five years and she knows. For that five years I've worked out every single week, but it got to the point where we weren't getting as many date nights. We've got a three-year-old little girl too, so that kind of hinders you from doing what you want to do some weekends too.
Speaker 1:I would say a lot of complaining.
Speaker 2:I did the best I could. You get a little offensive. When you're a bodybuilder. Somebody's telling you you skipped this day or skipped that day. How about you don't work out this day? I'm like, I'm sorry, I can't like this is. I have to work out, um, but we got past it. Um, as far as being at home, I was a little bit of a different person, yeah, um, especially towards like prep week and stuff like that it was.
Speaker 3:It was rough, not as rough as most people said it would would be for me, because I was already disciplined enough um but it was more about I was.
Speaker 2:I wasn't present. Sometimes I'd be in the room yeah, but the talking I wasn't interested, I was just in a zone, a little bit of a dark place, I guess? Yeah, but I hit it as well as I could there was points where my daughter would walk up to me when I was laying on the couch and wanted to play with me. I'd just tell myself you know what? I don't want to do this right now, but I have to for her.
Speaker 2:So let me get up off this damn couch and be a dad right now and just forget about these feelings that I'm feeling in my head. It was one of the hardest. When I got with Zeno, he straight up told me this is the hardest sport in the world. Yeah, he's like it's going to be really hard for you to get through this, and he was right.
Speaker 1:I told him in the end.
Speaker 2:I was like that is the hardest thing I've ever done in my life.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Besides raising children. Yeah, yeah, that's a different world there.
Speaker 1:But I think you have a track record of being, like, committed to things that you're doing you know, everything from like committing to yourself, from, you know, being a delinquent and then getting into your work, being committed to your work to work your way up and like. I think that's one of the things that, like, I admire about you and outside of you, being, like you know, a client and a friend of mine. But I just love how you're. You're such a family man, because we've had conversations outside, outside of coaching and stuff, talking about your daughter and things like that. I have these same thoughts too.
Speaker 1:Where I work, sometimes 12, 13 hours a day, I go home, I'm tired. I've been talking to people all day long, I did my workout, I'm ready to go home and chill. It's summertime, it don't even get dark until like 9 o'clock and I get home around like seven o'clock and my son's like let's go down to the pool. I'm like, oh my God, I don't know if I can do this, but like I can't say no. I can't say no, dude. I'm like you're not going to be that person. If you can commit to all the other hard shit in the day, this should be nothing. And the minute I get up, I'm good, but it's just making that conscious decision to be like let's do this.
Speaker 2:It's that couple seconds that it takes to get your ass up. That's all it is, and then it just passes.
Speaker 4:You just got to do it. It's the mindset aspect of it that my clients, and especially TJ especially if you're competing and anybody that I talk to it's all about the mindset. We've had this conversation. I tell everybody that there's no balance. There's no true balance to be had. You can't balance your work-life balance. It sounds good, but that's not realistically. You work eight hours out the day. You're supposed to sleep another eight hours out the day. So what's left? Eight hours, right. So what are you going to do? You got to eat, right. Then you got to spend some time, but then your kids got to do certain things. Your wife has to do certain things. There's no truth. It's about understanding prioritization and what time is needed for each thing. Right, work needs eight hours. If you work a nine to five, how much time does your partner need, right? How much time do they need to really be like, satiated? Like, hey, I need a date night once a week, like TJ was talking about. Hey, I need to talk to you. At least, you know, one hour to catch up every day, okay, well, that doesn't mean I need to get them all day. It's just what they need at that point in time, right, to feel satisfied because they have their things to do. Okay, kids, what do y' right? And figuring that out, that's the part is understanding prioritization and putting that in the proper place. And then the mindset of that I have to do this. No, I get to do this. Right, so I get to spend time with my daughter because? Or I get to spend time with my son because at some point they're going to get to the age where they don't want to spend time with dads or moms right now. What do you do? Now? You're gonna be looking back on your phone, looking at pictures like, oh man, I miss these times, like tj was saying, like she was talking, like I missed all this. No, you didn't. You didn't miss it. We were present. Yeah, right, were we present? So I get to do these things. And that's the part, is the mindset everybody needs to start taking, especially when you're responsible others, that you get to do it because, because if you want to step in this world of bodybuilding, like I told TJ, it is the hardest sport that you will ever have to do.
Speaker 4:I played collegiate division one football for the University of South Carolina and that was tough, that was hard, right, going against 300 pounders, going against 400 pounders, people running 20 plus miles per hour speed, having to eat these foods, having to eat these foods, having to go to practice, having to do two days, three days, but there were breaks, it wasn't 100%. If you want to commit to being a true competitor and a successful one, it takes 100% of everything. You have to be 100% in the gym. You have to be 100% in your cardio, 100% in your nutrition, 100% in your sleep. That's 24-7. Practice, 24-7. Practice was all we played on Saturday and we get to eat whatever we wanted to because I'm burning 12,000 calories a day just going to practice.
Speaker 4:When you get out of that realm, you're not burning 12,000 calories doing anything anymore. You're no longer an elite athlete. You're not doing that anymore, understanding that this is the hardest thing you have to do, because the level of commitment mentally that you have to do to it, to say and make the conscious decision that I'm going to go into this cardio, I'm going to make these meals and eat these meals, I'm going to go and do these workouts, I'm going to go and get my rest. But, mind you, I still got to work, I still got to take care of my family, I still got to be a father. I still got to take care of my family. I still got to be a father, I still got to be a husband. That's a whole other level. That's a whole other discipline.
Speaker 4:Everybody's not meant for that. I'm not saying everybody should be meant for that, but everybody's not meant for that. It's kind of like being an entrepreneur. Everybody's not meant to be an entrepreneur. Because there's another level of sacrifices that's required at this point in time, and that was a sacrifice that you have to be willing to make, no matter how long or how temporary. You have to be willing to make and understand that your tribe, they need to understand that journey as well and be on it with you, because it is way harder if they're not on the same page or do you even care in any equal. It's a way harder journey.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, that's, I think, the balance thing. I know everybody's like. I want balance in my life. I just think it's more. You know, lifestyle integration.
Speaker 1:But also there's going to be seasons where you're going to be more focused on other things than others. You know what I mean. Like there's going to be times that you're really focused on your career. You know like you're trying at now. You know the kingpin, you know what I mean. Or you know there's gonna be times that you just really need to put a lot of emphasis on your daughter or your family. So it's not that you stop anything right, but some things slow down and some speed up, and so I think that's just part of part of life and if you don't know how to navigate that, that's where people come to complete stops. They just hesitate and that's where people get stuck and they just go down a really bad path. But I want to wrap this thing up. I appreciate you guys coming in TJ if you got something that you could advise. If somebody was thinking about competing or they just want to even get in shape, what's something that you would just suggest they do, or even give them your kind of words of wisdom.
Speaker 3:I would say just no matter what.
Speaker 2:Stick to the plan and your brain is going to give you so many fucking excuses While you're on the Stairmaster. When it hits 25 minutes instead of 30, let's just go ahead and step off 25 minutes is good enough. The whole time I was on that Stairmaster the first time I've never been on a Stairmaster. So when he put me on it for the first time I was like holy shit, man, this is rough, like I was dying on that damn thing for 30 minutes, mind you he only touched it when he was four weeks out.
Speaker 2:It's always context. One thing that kept me going on that Stairmaster is kind of stupid, but I thought about the firefighters on 9-11 climbing up all those stairs and then the World Trade Center. I was like damn, if they could do that shit and carry people down and help all these people down, I could fucking do 30 minutes on the stair master just climbing myself. You know what I mean yeah, so just things like that I thought about.
Speaker 2:Just to keep my ass going, I, my brain, would give me an excuse not immediately shut it down, like, not like that. I'm here. I'm here to reach a goal and nothing's gonna stop from that Heck yeah the mindset part is the most important part to me.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:You just got to stay strong in your head.
Speaker 1:Stay committed. Yeah, don't let yourself negotiate with yourself. Yeah, I think you're your own worst enemy many times. That's one thing I got my sister.
Speaker 2:She was 300 pounds at one time and she's been working out asking me for advice and that was the first thing I told her. Your brain is going to tell you all these excuses why you shouldn't hit the gym today or why you shouldn't do this and do that, and I said you got to block that out and do it anyways just don't listen to it yeah well.
Speaker 1:Thank you, tj, I appreciate you. Thank you, man, for the opportunity again.
Speaker 2:Yeah, alright, anyways, thank you guys for the listen. The opportunity.
Speaker 1:Zeno again, I love you. Yeah, I do. Alright, anyways, thank you guys for the listen and we'll see on the next one.