Walk Away Without Regret: Leaving Corporate Success to Find Your True Purpose | Kathy Robinson

What happens when you've achieved everything you were told would make you happy… but something inside keeps whispering, "There's more."

In this inspiring episode, Julie Fairhurst sits down with Kathy Robinson, founder of Athena Wellness, author, and former Fortune 250 Chief Audit Executive and Chief Risk Officer, to explore what it really takes to leave a successful corporate career and create a life that's aligned with who you truly are.

Together, they discuss:

✔️ How to know when a chapter of your life is complete
 ✔️ The hidden grief of leaving a successful career
 ✔️ Fear vs. intuition—and how to tell the difference
 ✔️ Why high achievers struggle to slow down
 ✔️ Letting go of identity tied to work and achievement
 ✔️ Nature-based coaching and "walking with a question"
 ✔️ The sailboat metaphor that changes how you think about success
 ✔️ Finding clarity through stillness instead of constant striving
 ✔️ Practical tools to reconnect with yourself during life's transitions

If you're standing at a crossroads, questioning your career, searching for more meaning, or wondering if it's finally time to trust yourself, this conversation will remind you that your next chapter doesn't have to be forced—it can be discovered.

❤️ If you enjoyed this conversation, please Like, Subscribe, and Share. Your support helps us bring more inspiring stories to women around the world.

Athena Wellness
https://athenawellness.com
https://www.linkedin.com/in/kathybrobinson-athenawellness/

https://athenawellness.com/sage
(a guide that includes three practices to connect to your inner wisdom)

If this conversation stirred something in you… good. That’s where change begins.

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I’m Julie Fairhurst, and this is where stories turn into power.

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Transcript

Welcome And Why Kathy Left

SPEAKER_01 0:17

Well, hi everyone, and welcome to another episode of Women Like Me Stories and Business. Today I'm with a very interesting lady, and we are going to learn some important stuff. So hang in there and listen. So today I am joined by Kathy Robinson. She's the founder of Athena Wellness. She's also an author and a coach. After more than three decades in the corporate life, Kathy reached the highest professional success, serving as chief audit officer. No, chief audit executive and chief risk officer at a fortune 250 company. From the outside, it looked like she had made it. But the title was there, the success was there, and the security was there. But inside Kathy had a knowing, and she knew that she was finished with that chapter of her life. So her latest book, Walking with Sage, a story of leaving everything to find more chronicles that leap into the unknown. So this is going to be a conversation about midlife, courage, professional identity, and letting go of the type A version of success. So, Kathy, welcome to the podcast. Thank you so much for being willing to be here with us. Thank you. Appreciate it. Ah, you're welcome. Okay, so let's dive in. So you were a 30 years in a very important in corporate role. What were you doing during that season of your life?

SPEAKER_00 2:01

Yeah, you know, I kind of stumbled

From Wall Street To Chief Risk Officer

SPEAKER_00 2:04

into the profession. I left college with a bunch of debt and Wall Street was paying. And so I went to Wall Street, not as a trader, but as an auditor. Not something I had any plans of doing. But again, I was just trying to pay off college debt, which took me 15 years, as it does the average college debt holder. But at that point in time, I developed an expertise and I was climbing up the ladder. And after 18 years on Wall Street, one of my former bosses moved to this Fortune 250 and said, Hey, my second in command just left. Do you want to come over? And the ability to leave New York City in the early 2000s was very attractive to me. I just wanted to be back on the Jersey side of the river. And uh so I wound up going to that company. I worked there for 15 years and wound up taking his spot as the chief audit executive and the chief risk officer over time. And thought I would be there until, you know, 65. And something happened at 55, but I was just like, I'm done. It was so clear. It was just done. Time to move on. I was shocked. It was completely illogical. I had all the conversations you might think that somebody would have. Like, are you crazy?

unknown 3:17

What are you doing?

SPEAKER_00 3:19

But there was just no doubt in my heart, not my mind. My mind was going nuts, but my heart was just like, You done. And so that started this chapter of life.

SPEAKER_01 3:30

Wow. So, what did it feel like on the inside? It must have been quite a struggle for you.

SPEAKER_00 3:36

It was, you know, yes and no. The struggle was where is this decision actually coming from? Like, what is driving this? So that was kind of the struggle. What happened was I reported up to the board of directors and to the to the chief financial officer, the CFO. Both of them announced their retirement within like a 10-day period. And I knew in my heart of hearts, I didn't have it within me to prove if I was going to prove myself to another set of bosses, I was going to prove myself to myself. So I was like, this is the time. Like if you were ever going to start a business, and I didn't even know what business, but if you're ever going to start a business, like now is the time. And so that's why it happened so quickly. I did have a year to kind of wind down and to kind of work it through because they had a long tail on their the end of their tenure. But within that time, like I I knew as soon as the C the CEO of the company made the announcement, I'm like, I'm done. I wrote right in my book, retire, because I knew that I was done. But it just it took a while from my head to catch up with this heart-based decision of just like, there's nothing else here for you. Yeah, it's time to move on to something else. And then it was all the old tapes, you know, like my parents were came from the depression era. It was like, are you crazy? Like, this is this is the best job you can. What are you doing? You're throwing it all away, all that hard work. Yes. And yet there was still something that was stronger that was just like, if you were gonna bet on anybody, who would you bet on? It's like me, like I would bet on me. So I'd like, okay, this is gonna be an interesting ride. I had no idea just how interesting, but but yeah, that's how it started.

SPEAKER_01 5:16

Yeah. Well, so many, I think so many people, women and men, feel that they should be grateful for the job they have, just like with your parents, I suppose, were were were presenting to you, and and that I worked hard to be

The Moment The Heart Says Done

SPEAKER_01 5:31

here and I'm gonna hang out no matter what. So, did you kind of wrestle with that a bit?

SPEAKER_00 5:36

Oh, absolutely, absolutely. And again, my mom had passed a few years before that, but I could hear her like almost coming from the beyond, like, don't do it. Oh, I bet my dad was still around, and he was just, you know, at that point in time. I mean, he was close to a hundred at that time, and he was just it, it didn't, it wasn't even computing. So it's not like I had outside pressure. Yes, but it was more of I think we're trained, like we do all the right things, we climb that ladder, we do, and then you get to this point, and it's like, I think it I'm just kind of putting two and two together here, but it's almost like this was the first decision that I really made for myself, and that's what made it so foreign. Like I followed all the other steps and and it worked, and I wouldn't change anything, but it was that first decision of like, what do you really want to do? And it's like, yeah, wow, I'm I'm gonna have to figure this out. Going, how do I move forward in a way that doesn't have all of these things that surrounded me and gave me a playing field and one that I knew well? Now you're just gonna be going off into the wilderness by yourself and outside of that. Was the feeling of it, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:50

But how exciting for that awakening. I mean, fearful, but how exciting to be able to branch out and and say, okay, now I'm gonna do for me. Yes, not that you weren't doing for you before, but now I'm gonna do just for me.

SPEAKER_00 7:06

Yes, and that is I'm coming to understand now, like that is a new skill. So, all the skills that gave me all that corporate success, I still use them day to day, but it is more of this intuitive what do I feel is the right way forward that's kind of guiding life now. And it's just a different way of living. And I think that's what I was really desiring of I know how to live in this way. There's something that I want to live in a different way, but I didn't have the words for it. I didn't have because I never I never lived that way before, right? This was something brand new, and so it really was an adventure. What made it even more adventurous is that it was four months before COVID. So I had no idea just how adventurous it was about to get.

SPEAKER_01 7:55

Oh my goodness. Oh my goodness. Well, tell us about your book. I love the title, Walking with the Sage A Story of Leaving Everything to Find More. So, so why did you write it? What's it about? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:10

So I wrote my first book was

Writing Walking With Sage

SPEAKER_00 8:12

called The Athena Principles, and it was about getting credibility in a new field. I had just gone into the wellness field. I felt like I needed to codify my methodology, how I was coaching people. Very different experience. This one is more a reviewer called it a true-to-life parable or a true-to-life fable. So basically, it is real life experience. There's germs of that real life experience, every scene, but I had to condense it to make it a story. So I can't call it a memoir, although there's a lot of real life experiences in there. But what it gave me the ability to do was to look back at this time. What was it like to be able to leave something and step into the unknown and tell it in a way of like a Jonathan Livingston Siegel kind of a story, or a people like the four agreements, like some of those more out the alchemist, though that type of a story, but make it more so somebody, you know, this is a character who lives in New Jersey named Kathy. Does that sound familiar, right? So it was very much in line with life, but the events had to be consolidated in such a way to make it a page-turning type of story, and also include the type of practices that made the reading practical for somebody who is going through this messy middle and doesn't understand what it is that's happening. There are actual practices that the sage, whoever that is to the reader, is telling the main character how to handle some of these things. So it's very practical as well. And so it was just this hybrid of a book that kind of was birthed through this new way of living of like, what kind of book do I really want to write? Not what I should write to be credible in a business. Yes. What do I really want to say? And so this was a new experience in deepening this idea of being in daily life and following your own inner sage in writing the book about a sage. It's kind of meta, but that's that's kind of the idea.

SPEAKER_01 10:19

I love what you said about, you know, never mind what should I write, but what do I feel that I want to write? And I think so often we do what we should all day long. We're doing shoulds, should, should, should, should, and we forget about how we feel.

SPEAKER_02 10:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:38

So what did you find that you could not have found if you'd stayed in that position?

SPEAKER_00 10:45

Yeah, I think it would have been much more of the same. So I think you know, you get to a point in your career where you're repeating, like you're still going up and you're still doing things and there's still engagement. Yes, but there's not a lot of new, although I know the world has changed dramatically, the business world in the last seven years. So there would have been change, but as far as my own personal internal growth learning, I was kind of at the top of that level. I was I didn't want to go any higher, you know. I mean, I reached the top of the profession. There really wasn't any more headroom up there. So I think what I've learned in the interim is I am living much more in line with my own rhythms and my own seasons. And I'll tell you, I'm still very much like, give me a plan and I'll execute it. So, like writing the book, great. I have my plan, I have my outline, I have my schedule. I can do that. Now, like talking about it and giving it breath and letting it find its way into the world, that's a different season. That's a different skill set, it's a different way of letting it be and letting it find its way, not pushing it. So that's been a very different thing. So I think that if I would have stayed, I don't think I would be living in the way that I'm living day to day. And it permeates your whole life. It's not just the business side of it. It's how do I want to, what are some of the things I want to explore in the second half of life? And it becomes much broader and much more integrated. I think that would be the word. I was living, and so is the character in the book, very bifurcated. I'm this person at work, I come home, I do this thing, like you're you're in all of these different places. This is a much more integrated way of living. And I and you know, I always thought plan B, if this didn't work out, was I was going to go back. And it became very apparent that I couldn't go back because the world has changed, but I changed as well.

SPEAKER_02 12:43

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 12:43

And so that possibility, it's not that it's impossible, but it's improbable that that would happen.

SPEAKER_01 12:49

Yeah, yeah, it's that's just not that was then. Yeah, this is now. Sometimes you just can't go back, right? Yeah. So you talk about the journey from performance-driven type A success to a more receptive nature connected type B approach. So I love that phrase.

From Type A To Being

SPEAKER_01 13:13

What is a type B?

SPEAKER_00 13:14

Yeah. The the sage calls it from type A to type B, B E, meaning being, right? And so one of the conversations, and just to set this, set this in a bit, the stage a bit, the book is about somebody who's leaving a long-term corporate career. The pandemic hits, the type A tendencies of getting a business together, of doing all the things that they need to do has not left the character. And she finds herself in such so much anxiety that she takes to the trail. So this is during the pandemic, everything's closed down, but there are trails behind her house. So she goes out and she starts taking these long walks. And on one particular day, she's just beside herself and she just says, What am I going to do? And she hears a voice saying, Well, you don't have to do anything. And so begins this conversation with some people see it as an ancestor, some people see it as a higher self, some people see it as a future self. You can make this voice whatever you want it to be, this inner knowing, but it's this dialogue that that goes on. And in one of the conversations, in one of these walks, the sage gives an example of, you know, you're picture yourself on this beautiful sailboat. All the people you love are there. It's a beautiful day. Your tendency, she tells the character, Kathy, is to jump in and push that sailboat. Uh when you won't realize you can start the engine, you can lift a sail, you can just drift, you can drop anchor, you can go to a harbor. But your tendency is to push the sailboat. And that becomes this theme of like, are you pushing the sailboat? Or are you are you being more in line with your own nature and having the faith in yourself that in those times of lulls, that's just part of the process. And I think that's the hardest thing for us. And I say us collectively, as driven, you know, women, yes, of being comfortable. If you almost feel like you're not doing something that you should, going back to that word, like there's something I could be doing. Yes. But maybe it's not the time to do that. Maybe it's the time to allow life to unfold a bit. Like there'll be time to jump back in, but not right now. Yes. And learning that your own inner seasonality of what that means for you, and it's different for everybody.

unknown 15:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:41

Well, for women who've spent years achieving, producing, proving, we're all out there proving and taking care of everyone else. Why can being feel so uncomfortable to us?

SPEAKER_00 15:56

Yeah, it's a great word. It is uncomfortable, right? Because we're not used to it. Because that's not how we're taught. Because we think if we're not doing something, that we're being lazy, that we're letting opportunities go by. You know, we're so used to being ahead of that curve that it does feel uncomfortable. But I mean, we've learned these last couple of years, right? Like everything is uncomfortable now and everything is changing. And I think I almost think it's easier now because the world has been so turned upside down, yes, that it's easier to feel when you feel uncomfortable, it's just like, okay, like there's really no sense of comfort anymore in a lot of ways. But but I will tell you that the more that you go into this is what I've found, the more that you go inside, there is a place that you can find this inner still point that is really comfortable because it's really truly who you are. And that has been my anchor to be able to come back. And it can be as easy as just taking a few breaths with your hand over your heart. It's one of the practices that's in the book, it's one of the practices that that I have on my website. There are a few things that you can do to just connect with. You may not hear anything, you may not get a sense of inner knowing, but when you feel that sense of peace and that sense of calm, that's a real good sign that you're you're in that place. The more you can connect with that, and that's what this character starts to do over and over, the more she can connect with that, the more things just naturally fall into place. And she learns how to more surf the currents of life rather than trying to be the one who is dictating those currents. And that really is the change and the transformation in the book. And by the time it ends, she's living a very different life that she has allowed to occur rather than creating it.

SPEAKER_01 17:48

Wow. Nature. So you use nature as a catalyst for stillness with your clients. What happens when people finally get quiet enough to listen?

SPEAKER_00 17:59

Yeah. I heard a great quote the other day that stillness

Stillness As An Accelerator

SPEAKER_00 18:04

is an accelerator. Sounds counterintuitive. Yes, it does. But the the quieter, if you can find that place, that's where the real wisdom comes from. Like we're surrounded now by AI, we're surrounded by noise, we're surrounded by data. Data used to be something that was very valuable. Now it's just a commodity. Like I can type anything into a search bar and get data. Yes. When you're connecting with your still point, you're actually connecting with wisdom, with your inner GPS, with your interdirectional. That's something that you can't get in a search bar. That's something that you can't find in buying somebody's product or somebody's program. It's something that you find here. And the reason why nature is such a good catalyst for somebody like me that was wired very differently, when you're out in nature, it's almost like all of your senses are absorbed. So even though, and I call this walking with a question, you can pose a question that you want to walk with and just let it hang out in the back of your in the back of your memory, but get engaged and notice what are the trees doing? What's the bird song doing? Where am I walking? What does it sound like when my feet are touching the pay, the uh path? All of these things kind of draw you in in a way while this question is working. And I've done this over and over when I've been wrestling, even with how do I get this book out into the world? Yeah, I will walk with a question like that and then really try to be very present as I'm taking that walk. And the between the rhythm of walking plus the presence and the attention to something that's outside of myself that's very calming, inevitably I will get some insight along the way that if I was sitting at my desk trying to make it happen, it wouldn't be happening. And so that's why I think that combination, I've even done coaching sessions now. It's like if somebody is close by, or even virtually, like, let's pose the question, let's each go out on our walks and then come back together. We've done that as well. There's something about the rhythm of the walking and the the quiet of being, and it could be a park, like it doesn't have to be you don't have to be in the middle of anywhere, like just something looking at a plant, being in a backyard, on a patio, yeah, just something that is taking you outside of what is currently occupying you and making you anxious, it really seems to work wonders. There's something about that combination that's just magic.

SPEAKER_01 20:36

Yeah, wow. We hear the phrase follow your heart all the time. But what does that actually mean in real life?

SPEAKER_00 20:46

I can remember being an executive, and when I would hear that or like follow your bliss, I I it used to aggravate me because it's like I don't have time for that. Like, what first of all, what does that mean? And then how do you do it? And then why would I? You know, what does that actually mean? I think the whole idea of following your heart to me now means what do I actually desire? There's something in our desires, and I think that we're so we can we can get so disconnected from ourselves that we don't even know what our desires are. I didn't know when that decision came and said I had to leave. I had some idea, but I really didn't know. But it's like the to me, desires are it gives you that energy, that breadcrumb to follow because you just need one step. Yeah, and that's one of the lessons in this book. It's like the main character had no idea how to get to the top of that mountain, you know, metaphorically. Yes. The sage was trying to tell her, this is the next step. This is the next step. And then by the end of the book, you can see what happens when you put those steps together. So to me, that's what following your heart really is to be able to not be you're you're less concerned about what is expected and more concerned about what's really pulling you forward. And and it happens in tiny little glimpses. Like your purpose and you're following your heart to me. Was never like some billboard saying, This is it, you know, follow it this way. It was more of like, yeah, wow, that's interesting. I want to know more about that, whatever that might be.

SPEAKER_02 22:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:25

And it could be 50 different things. And out of those 50 different things, one thing is really compelling. And I want to learn more about that. Or I find myself doing that. The whole thing with being in nature, like if you would have told me that I would have had a coach-based, nature-based coaching practice out, you know, 10 years ago, I would have said you're out of your mind. But it becomes more and more, these things became more and more compelling to where it feels very natural to be in these situations. And I think that's what people get, it's a little misconstrued when you're trying to figure out like what your passion is. We get that question a lot, like, what's your passion? Yes. It's like it's not, it's less about passion and more about what do I find intriguing? Those are great clues. And and and where do I feel like I can breathe? And so part of the nature is like when I'm out in nature, and I grew up a mile outside of New York City. So I'm a city kid. You know, it's not like I was born in the, you know, someplace on the plains. It's like I was born literally in a concrete jungle. But there's something when I'm out in nature, I feel like I can breathe. If your chest expands and you feel like you can breathe deeply, that's another really good, it's another good indication that you're on the right path and to keep going.

unknown 23:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:45

Well, how can women tell the difference between fear, logic, intuition, and true inner wisdom?

SPEAKER_00 23:54

That's a great question. And so I will give you just examples from that. When

Fear Versus Intuition In Midlife

SPEAKER_00 24:00

I was leaving, when I had that that sort of like, you know, it's time to go. Yeah. I was gripped by fear. But I also had that feeling of, you know, this is the right thing to do. So the you know this is the right thing to do, that calmness, again, that sense of expansiveness, that sense of everything's gonna be okay, even if it's in a little fleeting moment. That to me is inner wisdom. That's intuition, that's that calmness. That I I don't feel that inner wisdom is ever never tells you what to do. Like it didn't say leave your job. It just said you know this is the right thing to do. It was very sage-like. You know, that's the sage, right? It was very like, you know, this is the right thing to do. You know you really can count on yourself, you know you can, you know you can do this, versus the fear, my mom's voice of like, are you crazy? Yeah, that's fear, right? If some if it's if it's critical, if it's loud, and sometimes it's telling us things, like it really did make me pause and do the pros and cons and do all the things, but even going through all of that, I knew. Yeah, you know, you're gonna figure this out. Yeah, you know, like this is the path.

SPEAKER_01 25:15

Yeah, yeah. I agree with you. I think we always know it's just that we are afraid to admit it, or we don't know what to do with it. So we push it down, we've put it in the back, and we just carry on in the ways that are not service serving us anymore. And I think eventually life says do it, or you're something's gonna happen. I don't know what, but but yeah, yeah, emotionally, physically, I for myself, I burnt out on a 30-year career, and I knew I knew I needed to, and but it was hard, of course, 30 years, right? That's a long time to to make a to make a shift, and but I knew and I did it, and it was the best thing in the world I could have ever done for myself.

SPEAKER_00 26:06

At the time, did it feel like the best thing?

SPEAKER_01 26:11

No, yeah, no, and that's usually the way it goes, yes, but but but when it comes to health, you know, I there comes a point, I think, for a lot of us where we're told, like I remember going through and thinking, like at least seven or eight years before I actually fully hit burnout, that okay, I need to do something, but I didn't know what. And that's what stopped me because I thought, well, I've been in sales for 30 years. What the heck am I gonna do? Like, how do I replace my income? What am I gonna do? And so you just carry on because you you don't really know what to do. And then I think what happens is the universe then says, Okay, well, you're really done now, so you better figure it out.

SPEAKER_00 26:54

Yeah, yeah, exactly. And and I I agree with you. I think those whispers are there. Yes, and and actually for me, the whispers were, well, what do you want to do in your second chapter? So I was thinking about it, but I just I thought it was 10 years away, not immediate. Yeah, you know, that was the difference. So while some of the thought process was there, again, you that inner knowing, yeah, I didn't think it was gonna happen so quickly. But you know, you just gave a great example of like the voice of how am I gonna replace my income? What am I? That's the fear, right? That's not intuition. Right. Your intuition was I gotta do something different. Yes. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:33

So tell us about the people you help. What is it that you're doing today?

SPEAKER_00 27:37

Yeah, well, you know, it's it's morphed over time. When I left, I thought I was going to be keeping executives well, the way I kept myself well for all of those years, right? So wrote the book,

Coaching Transitions And Redefining Midlife

SPEAKER_00 27:48

I was doing webinars, all of these different things. Going through this process, what I didn't anticipate, the risk manager that I was, the risk I missed was there is a grieving process that happens when you leave, even when you don't fully identify with a particular corporate identity. So it's not like I was, you know, a salesperson, like I do sales. I would tell people I'm a chief art executive, and they'd go, like, what is that? Like they had no idea. Yeah, exactly. So it's not like I was the chief art, nobody knew what it was. Right. So I didn't anticipate that. And that's part of what drove the character and myself out on those trails of like everything is falling apart, like nothing seemed to make sense, none of the pieces fit anymore. Like, I really was in the character calls it the goo. Like, I was in the goo. Like, what is this thing that I'm disintegrating into? Didn't expect that. So, coming out of that, I think you know, it brings you to a new way of being. And so now I help people with transition of how do no matter what it is. Some people have read the book. One woman in England said, I'm a mom who just who suffered from postpartum depression, and I saw myself in this book. I was like, really? Never did I think that that would be a possibility. So anybody who's going through a life transition who doesn't recognize themselves as they're going through this, those are the folks that I help. Interestingly enough, I thought I was going to be helping women going through midlife transition. I have a lot of men from Wall Street who feel very comfortable talking to me since I've had some of that experience, yeah, trying to figure out what to do next. And what's so exciting about this work now is that we need a new paradigm for what like midlife we used to think was like, well, it's 40 to 55, but now people are living. My dad lived almost to 102. Yeah. So that being the case, I have like 40 years ahead of me. So am I not midlife anymore? Like, what is midlife? Maybe we need a midlife chapter two or something like that. But you know, I feel like I'm helping people, I'm modeling a new paradigm for healthy aging.

unknown 30:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:03

Who do you want to be? How active do you want to be when you're 90, 95 years old? Let's retrofit that, let's make some of those decisions now. Because the days of sitting in a rocker on a back porch at 65, no more. Yeah, exactly. But we have no model saying, well, this is what you can do. So let's create that. So that's the work that I'm doing now. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:25

I love what you that you said that you're helping men as well, because I think that I think that men, I mean, of certainly we we identify with with our careers and our positions, but I think that men really identify. And I think it's it's a struggle for both men and women to leave those careers, but I think that it can be even more difficult for men.

SPEAKER_00 30:48

Yeah, and and more prone to depression, from what I'm seeing. Like if there really isn't a second chapter to find, because a lot of people who were leaving are, well, you know, I'll volunteer. I'll do part of my coaching is let's do a little sabbatical, let's come up with a period of time, even if it's one day a week. Yeah, let's make believe on that day, you have no other responsibilities. How are you gonna spend that day? Like, actually do it. And I think in working with folks and doing some of these exercises, they're like, you know what? I thought I was going to retire. These people in their 70s, I want to do the part of my work that I love, whatever that core was. Yeah, and I want all the admin, I don't want to do any of that stuff anymore, but I want this core piece because this is the piece I love. This is why I started in this profession. And so that's been really exciting to see too. It's like, I think we're gonna have a lot of people in their 60s, 70s, and 80s who are still doing their thing in their own way, yes, mentoring and doing, but certainly not sitting idle like that. That's but we have to keep our bodies healthy in order to be able to do that, which is why this body, this holistic mind, body, spirit approach is so important.

SPEAKER_01 31:59

So, what does wellness mean to you now compared to what it may have meant earlier in your life?

SPEAKER_00 32:05

Yeah, so early in my life it was metrics, right? How far did I run? What how what did I lift? All of that great stuff. I'm still very active. I just

Wholehearted Wellness And Simple Practices

SPEAKER_00 32:14

became a CrossFit trainer, I just got certified in that. So I love CrossFit. I still run, I'm a Sierra Club hiking leader, so I'm still very active, but I don't track, like I'll track my activity that I did it, but not how fast I went or any of that other stuff. That becomes it's not it's not about that anymore. It's more about the consistency. Yes. But to answer your question, so going from wellness metrics now, I think wellness more as wholehearted living. And for me, that means doing the things that light me up with the people I love, like being healthy enough to be able to do that, yeah. That's what this is for as long as I can. Like living in that way, that's what wellness is to me.

SPEAKER_01 33:00

Yeah, yeah. So, what are some simple practices? My majority of my audience is women. So, what do you think some simple practices for women can that women can use to reconnect to their inner wisdom?

SPEAKER_00 33:13

Yeah. So, in when I was busiest, my busiest executive moments, when I was flying around all around the world, I used to do this because I was so stressed out. In the morning, I would set my timer for five minutes, fall back into bed. This is like four o'clock in the morning, right? Fall back to bed, my hand over my heart, and just say for the next five minutes, nobody needs me. I don't need to make a decision. I'm just in this place. Some days I would fall back to sleep. Some days I would just be like, there's nothing to do for five minutes. Like just it was like luxury. If you do that consistently, and again, this is in bed, right? So this isn't this doesn't even take a lot of time. But what I found was I wanted more time in that place. So this is five years before I ever retired, right? This is just I'm on airplanes, I'm doing all of these things. Yeah, but five minutes no matter where I was, it's like, oh, this this is my this is my five. It was my reclamation, reclamation. And I think that that's what expanded to where like that's what life is now. And it it's only a decade later, right? But life is that five minutes now. It's and it's not that I'm not doing anything and I don't need to make decisions, yeah, but it has that kind of full breath, mindful kind of feeling that permeates life. So I think that that's a great place to start because it only takes five minutes. You can do it while you're in bed. You don't have to be anywhere else. You can do it on airplanes, I just do it on airplanes all the time. But just start there. Another thing to do is sometimes it's addition by subtraction. So sometimes it's something that you stop doing. So if you feel that things are feeling a little crowded, whether it's like, what is it that you're carrying that you don't need to carry? It could be something emotional, it could be something physical, it could be old suits that are in your closet. I have to say I still have some. I still haven't let those go yet. Like those old identity. But what are some things that you can just shed? Sometimes letting things go just opens up the energy, and that's something simple. Like you don't have to do your you don't have to declutter your whole house, no one little corner someplace, but just that reminder of like, oh, like there's this one area that's just simple and orderly, and again, that has a tendency to grow if you put your attention there.

SPEAKER_01 35:40

Yeah, yeah. I think I I I love that, you know, waking up in the morning and just saying, I'm gonna spend that five minutes just with me, nothing else coming in. Yes, we all know we have all those things to do today, but just taking that five minutes of peace because we don't get much of that, right? Yeah. So for women that are listening, if they're standing on the edge of that big life change, what are you wanting them to know? What do you what do you want to tell her?

SPEAKER_00 36:15

That it's not going to come in some complete, like the way forward doesn't happen in one complete download. It's very unusual when you just get this insight of like, oh, this is the way forward. Yes. Following that energy, that little energetic breadcrumb of like, you know what, I'm going to try this. So I would say to definitely to try whatever it is that you're finding compelling. But something that just popped into mind was there's a line from a David White poem where he says that anyone or anything that doesn't bring you alive is too small for you. I think in this time of our lives, we tend to box ourselves into the way things always were. And I would just really advise women to just what does it feel like to step outside of that in some way? You know, I found that my when I got into my 50s, it almost felt like a second adolescence. Felt very rebellious. I felt like, yeah, you know, like very jersey, like I'm gonna do it my way, you know, like very Frank Sinatra. But that just that feeling of just like I could do whatever I want.

SPEAKER_02 37:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 37:29

Getting into my 60s, it almost feels like the goalpost is a little closer. Like you can start, you're making decisions based on how much time do I have left. And that makes, in a strange way, it makes decision making much easier. Of like, do I really want to spend my time doing that? Like, time is precious. You get that feeling of like, there's 50 things I can do. What's really going to make me feel alive? What is it that I really want to do? And that's a really nice way to be able to live life of like making decisions based on what's going to light me up. What is it that I truly want to do? And that's what I would suggest, just to start to play with that. It doesn't come all at once, but it will come over time if you just try and play.

SPEAKER_01 38:18

Yeah. I think that that's um, and as you were saying that, I thought to myself, you know, when we're younger and we're trying to prove ourselves and we're building, we don't necessarily have that, which is too bad because we should have it back then, but we don't really have that back then. We we only get when our time starts to get a little shorter and we start to go, oh, I start to see the light at the end of the tunnel over there, yeah, that we realize that this is what I wanted to do. Now, all these things start to pop into your head and your heart. Yeah. And now's the time. And now's the time. Well, I want everyone to know that we're gonna have information in the show notes and how you can reach out to Kathy, grab her book. If you, you know, I think you offer a free guide, if I'm not mistaken.

SPEAKER_00 39:08

Yeah, I have something called a free sage discovery

Free Sage Kit And Final Advice

SPEAKER_00 39:11

kit, and it has three of the practices. Handover heart breathing is one of them. Yeah, there's a future self-visualization, and there's also how to take a sage walk. So uh it's just like a 12-page, there's also an audio meditation that's attached to that. So yeah, please go check it out.

SPEAKER_01 39:27

Yeah, perfect. So, all of that we'll have information how you can find all of that in the show notes. So don't hesitate to do that. So, Kathy, if a woman's listening today and she feels that inner, inner whisper, this is this chapter is complete, but she's too scared to trust it. What would you want her to know?

SPEAKER_00 39:48

I would ask her to take a walk with her questions. You know, just just take find that time, schedule an hour, think about what it is that's really weighing on her, and then cross a threshold of some sort. I actually cross a bridge, a river, leave all your daily stuff behind you, and just be present in nature and see what happens. It's amazing. I've had some insights that I've actually had to pull out my phone and take notes because they were coming so quickly. And then at worst, you have a really nice hour in nature. Like it, there's no there's no downside to this. But I would just say walk with your questions and see what comes up.

SPEAKER_01 40:35

I think that that's uh that's fabulous advice. Absolutely. And and like you say, what do you got to lose? You if nothing, you don't get a download, well, you've had a beautiful walk in nature.

SPEAKER_00 40:45

Exactly. Yeah, you'll feel better no matter what.

SPEAKER_01 40:48

Yes, yeah. Well, Kathy, thank you so much for being on the podcast. I I yeah, it's I love how you came from from this corporate success to realizing, you know what, I need I need to do me. And I think that there's so many of us who get to that stage and and you know, we don't want to burn out, we don't want to wait until our health is is affecting us. We want to make sure that we can do that and still live a good and healthy life. And I think that you've got all sorts of tools and some wonderful analogies and and uh and you've really brought that forward. So thank you so much for doing that. I appreciate it.

SPEAKER_00 41:34

Thank you. I appreciate it. And I can tell you it keeps getting better.

SPEAKER_01 41:37

Yes, yes, I agree, I agree. Well, that's it, everybody, for this episode of Women Like Me Stories and Business. Thank you so much for being here. I appreciate it. And we will see you all on the next episode. Take care, everybody. Bye bye.