The Cameo Show
The Cameo Show is a podcast about sharing our life experiences and learning from each other. Through solo stories and inspiring conversations with a wide variety of guests, we explore the secrets and strategies for feeling confident, empowered and equipped to live the life we want to lead. Tune in to learn how to find joy and fulfillment in your life and to gain valuable insights from the amazing stories and lessons of our guests.
The Cameo Show
Feeling Frustrated in Your Relationship? How Respect, Admiration, and Humor Can Transform Your Partnership
In this episode of The Cameo Show, we dive into practical advice for couples looking to improve communication and build a stronger marriage. We’re going deep, sharing our own shameful stories of poor communication and behavior, which once made our marriage feel like a constant battlefield. Through laughter, conflict, and moments of humility, we’ve learned how respect, admiration, and teamwork can bring light to the end of your relationship tunnel.
Join us for thought-provoking insights on transforming poor communication into true connection and creating a partnership rooted in growth and lasting joy.
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Hello and welcome to the Cameo Show. I'm your host, cameo, and we are joined by my husband and co-host, honey.
Speaker 2:Honey also goes by, greg.
Speaker 1:It's always such an awkward thing. I've been saying this on the last few episodes as I introduce you it feels weird to call you Greg. I say it weird. So today I went with Honey and it still felt weird. So just welcome to the weird show. But Greg starts us with a dad joke, so do you have one for us today?
Speaker 2:I have a great dad joke. Okay, if money doesn't grow on trees, then why do banks have branches?
Speaker 1:That is a very good dad joke. Thank you for that. We all bring something special to this show, and the dad joke portion is the special part that Greg brings, because it's a huge part of who we are, how we operate and life in general for most people respecting your spouse or your partner, loving them in ways that they need to be loved and knowing how to communicate properly. All of that encapsulated, because we didn't always do it very well, and sometimes we still don't.
Speaker 2:You know we're human. I pop off, you do whatever you do. That made you laugh so hard Every part of your body was like what do I do when?
Speaker 1:I said I pop off. I imagined me running my mouth, which is what I do. And then, when I was thinking about what you do, the visual that came in my head was that you kind of you just act like a maniac Not in an aggressive way, but like you, just you lash out in ways like of acting silly or being loud or Singing. Singing like an opera singer. This morning you were singing opera while I was in the shower.
Speaker 2:What song?
Speaker 1:I don't remember, but it wasn't an opera song. It was like a pop song, but you transformed it into an opera song. I just stayed in your arms tonight, but sing it like an opera singer, because that's what you were doing.
Speaker 2:I just died in your arms tonight.
Speaker 1:No joke, that's what I hear in the shower and that happens often. And it's usually. It happens when you feel disrespected.
Speaker 2:I bust into song.
Speaker 1:We behave differently when we're upset. You act goofy and silly, and I when I'm upset. Yeah, even when you're upset, you either get really quiet, or when you're upset or we are arguing about something, you usually kind of just behave in a goofy way. I think that's your coping mechanism.
Speaker 2:Like I just go child, I just turn full child.
Speaker 1:Full grown man child.
Speaker 2:Man child.
Speaker 1:Yes. So when I said you do whatever you do and it put me into convulsions laughing, it's because I just I have this mental picture of you at usually in the kitchen doing something in the kitchen, at the sink.
Speaker 2:Eating.
Speaker 1:Eating or doing dishes or whatever it is that you're doing, singing and acting goofy even when I'm mad at you, and then I come out to pop off and you're.
Speaker 2:Maybe you're mad at me a lot more than I realize it could be, because I didn't know you were mad at me today.
Speaker 1:I can neither confirm nor deny the allegations.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:That's not none. Of. That is the point.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:That was a complete diversion from the topic, but the point is that we still have our moments, and what used to become huge explosions or problems that lasted days are now cut much shorter because, yeah, we're cheese on the wall okay, do we have to go ahead tell?
Speaker 2:the story. No, go ahead, I'm not telling the story it's in my book.
Speaker 1:I go ahead and expose myself there, you go.
Speaker 2:Plug for the book. Your book is done it is done your book is literally done.
Speaker 2:It's being final edited right now. I'm so proud of you, thank you. You've had your nose to the grindstone for the last four years. Yes, talking about it here and there, but a lot of sundays, a lot of saturdays, a lot of weeknights in your office work, work until 10 o'clock at night like someone's making you do it, and no one sees that. You haven't talked about it nearly as much as the work that you've done. So y'all are going to be blown away when you read this thing.
Speaker 1:Thank you.
Speaker 2:It's an incredible journey that we've been on, but, you know, from your vantage point and it's it's definitely going to be a helpful tool for a lot of people that are looking for something, some glimmer of hope. Uh, if they're in a dark spot or ready to make a big change in their life, this book is going to be a absolute must have top 10. And I'm not I am, I am biased, but it's also just very, very well done. So I'm, I'm so proud of you and it's going to be out like in the next. We're talking weeks. Now you people can at least preorder it. Yeah, we're getting there and thank you for all weeks. Now you people can at least preorder it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we're getting there, and thank you for all of that. You're hired. You're hired as my PR, but it's all true. Thank you. Yes, the book will be out soon. It's called the reset button and in the book I share a story about how some tiny argument ended up in me throwing white queso cheese dip from a takeout mexican order that we had that night at greg.
Speaker 1:It missed and thank god this was like so many years ago, 15 years ago but it missed him. It hit this wall that was painted red, not that red on your shirt if you're watching the video. It was like a different, deeper red than that, but it was red you know, like a cranberry apple kind of red yep. So the cheese hits the wall, the red wall, it explodes, it hits the ceiling and the crazy part is I don't even think like we wiped it down, but like it's still there.
Speaker 1:Legend has, it's probably still there, Legend has.
Speaker 2:And the new homeowner in that house in Marysville were like what is that design up there?
Speaker 1:Little do they know. And as I was writing the book and sharing that story and it kind of illustrates the point, I couldn't even remember what we were arguing about. So that type of explosive behavior was happening over seemingly inconsequential things that in the moment felt like the most important argument to win. Apparently that cheese takes flight. But I don't even know what it was about.
Speaker 2:I can guess that something so silly, but I felt disrespected and said something that made you just lose your shit. And then here comes the cheese.
Speaker 1:That's right. Not who moved my cheese, but here comes the cheese.
Speaker 2:And it was like, okay, I don't even know what happened next, but we ate our Mexican food with no cheese, probably a few beers, we probably downed a few coronas yeah, those moments no longer happen, and maybe it's because you go act goofy and I go off in my own corner and settle down.
Speaker 1:But we've learned how to communicate in a way that's effective. That rarely brings the four horsemen to the forefront. The four horsemen, we the forefront, the four horsemen. We did an episode on that Criticism.
Speaker 2:Contempt.
Speaker 1:Contempt.
Speaker 2:Stonewalling.
Speaker 1:Stonewalling.
Speaker 2:And.
Speaker 1:Okay, today there's three horsemen. What is it?
Speaker 2:Contempt.
Speaker 1:Criticism.
Speaker 2:Criticism.
Speaker 1:Stonewalling and defensiveness.
Speaker 2:Defensiveness Is it Contempt, criticism, criticism, stonewalling and defensiveness. Defensiveness Is it Okay?
Speaker 1:We'll have to fact check that, but yes, I'm pretty sure. Okay, that was our immediate go-to way to handle conflict. Initially, there was very little consideration for the other person's feelings or vantage point, for the other person's perspective and unique experiences. Leading up to that point, it was a very combative me versus you situation.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And since the cheese shellacking the wall and since some other very intense rock bottom, hurtful moments that we've experienced, which are also in the book book plug. That wasn't intentional, but it just felt right. We've learned to not allow those things to be that way.
Speaker 2:If you hear a chainsaw in the background, it's the neighbors doing their landscaping. It's Saturday afternoon during the recording of this, so just pay no attention to the chainsaw. Thank you.
Speaker 1:What was that? Were you like a guy off in the wing, or?
Speaker 2:what I'm the AM radio host.
Speaker 1:I told you this one's going to be weird. It's weird around here. Stay weird people.
Speaker 2:It's way more fun that way.
Speaker 1:Speaking of okay.
Speaker 2:I've got something to say too, whenever.
Speaker 1:I've got to say something about the situation we're handling with the neighbors and their chainsaw. It's not related to marriage respect, any of that, it's just funny. During the hurricane that we recently experienced, we had two back to back in southwest Florida. We lost power for a few days and we do not have a generator, but our neighbors have an automatic generator that kicks on, but they weren't here because they're snowbirds and so their generator kicked on and it ran the entire time. Our electricity was off so we couldn't sit outside, we couldn't have our windows open and it was coincidentally, it was kind of cool. So it would have been nice to have the windows open at night and like sleep with the cool air that we don't typically get in Florida. But we couldn't because the generator was so loud and it was one of those moments where I had to practice extending gratitude, for I don't know. It was really hard, wasn't it? It was like so annoying. No offense to our neighbors, I'm sure they're really nice.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's it's just they're not trying to ruin our lives.
Speaker 1:I know, but damn it.
Speaker 2:But damn it. Yeah, it was like four days with no power. We could have the windows all open, sleep, you know, but it was like you're like okay, and I guess, just knowing that no one's there you know, and we're over here with no power because I can't justify buying a generator. I'd rather just buy all new groceries you know than if we lose our groceries, it's just. The cost is not enough benefit there, you know. Right, but anyway yeah, it's just funny.
Speaker 1:Well, you know, the whole like chainsaws and leaf blowers happening all day while we're trying to do this just kind of reminded me of that story.
Speaker 2:Can I bring it back to the whole relationship element?
Speaker 1:there.
Speaker 2:Please do so one thing that has helped me is if someone's saying something to me or someone is, we'll just say giving me energy. There's what they're saying and then what they're really trying to say, and I think that's really helped me tremendously in dealing with the kids and dealing with customers and dealing with you and dealing with just anybody that you deal with is like you might come at me with some angst about something, but I can look at you and go. She's really just needs to express this it's not all this, it's just this one thing, you know.
Speaker 1:Yes, it's not all this, it's just this one thing, you know, yes, as it pertains to our marriage and our relationship, and I've gotten better at this. But one thing that you've learned about me because I've learned it about myself, yeah is that when I feel hurt or sad, my way of expressing that is typically through anger or frustration. That's secondary emotion, but it's usually because, underneath this hard, gruff candy shell, my softer side is hurting from something, and I'm just not, or haven't been equipped in the past with the ability to articulate that. And so, early on, not only did I not know that about myself, but you didn't know that about me, and so when I would feel hurt by something, I sure as hell was not going to be like I'm sad and that hurt my feelings, because I used to view that as weakness.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And so I would come at you like a barking dog popping off and you'd be like what the hell is that?
Speaker 2:This episode should be called popping off, popping off. You've said that a hundred times.
Speaker 1:I just that's what I do I pop off, and that might be like an inappropriate thing to say. Maybe that's like a dance move or something that happens on Cardi B's stage, so maybe I shouldn't be slinging around that. I pop off.
Speaker 2:I don't think so. Ladies and gentlemen, ladies and gentlemen, I have to take this off. Another derail this. The other night we were waiting to pick our son up after band and I discovered 2000s stripper music playlist.
Speaker 1:Is that what it was called?
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it was all the good ones, all the bangers speaking of popping, that's how you found it.
Speaker 1:It was that, yeah, khalif song or whatever, yeah all you ladies yo like this.
Speaker 2:I mean just all of them yes it was awesome. It was awesome, I mean, and it was like you were possessed, like you were just all of a sudden in a nightclub and you just couldn't stop dancing and rapping. And someone walked in front of the truck and it was like 9, 30, you know, in the high school parking lot and you're like I was it just wore. It took you right back to a club you know it did.
Speaker 1:it was a time warp to my more rogue days of my late teen, early 20s 20s. My more ratchet era. Is that offensive to say that was my ratchet era, but you just can't help it. I know if you were around for early 2000s rap in the club, and Lil Jon and Usher.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know what we're talking about Either way, any which way.
Speaker 1:I used to express myself through anger.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:That used to cause a ton of problems. On the flip side of things, if we reverse the roles here, you, you, you're on the line here. You used to deal with conflict in our relationship in a very contemptuous and defensive way. Now we both sometimes revert to those old behavior patterns. So I'm not trying to say that either of us get it perfect now or that we nail it 100% of the time, because we are human and I just think it's so important to continue to reiterate that because I think people see this as like an end result and it's just an ever evolving thing you would handle me or conflict in our relationship, or in even other relationships, with contemptuousness, stonewalling, kind of all the four horsemen, and it would come across as like passive, aggressive name calling, a little bit of like flight gripping and grasping for anything and everything that you could throw as a bomb, a hurt bomb. Then I would just get more hurt and then instead of saying ouch, I would say growl. It was just a absolute snowball rolling down, uncontrolled avalanche, mountain side.
Speaker 2:Insert money, stress. Insert having a baby, not knowing how to do all this stuff. Insert house duties, insert everything.
Speaker 2:External influence through coworkers, friends, parents, siblings, whoever your history and past trauma equals cheese on the wall, and it's like this is a journey of self-discovery. And it's like this is a journey of self-discovery. And what do I contribute to this interaction and growth Sometimes? Sometimes, the best thing to do and I've said this before is, when it's raining, let it rain. I don't need to go out and try to stop it from raining. If you're pissed off about something, I might think it's about me, because that's how we see the world is. Everything has to do with me, but it from raining. If you're pissed off about something, I might think it's about me, because that's how we see the world is. Everything has to do with me, but it doesn't.
Speaker 2:Things just happen and I might be able to look at you now and be like she's just mad about something else and I don't need to be. I don't need to personalize this and feel like it's about me, Even though you might be saying that I did something wrong. Maybe the deeper thing might be you just don't feel heard or something else is bothering you. Sometimes, time and space is all the medicine that the situation needs. Yes, that's hard to do, though.
Speaker 1:Like anything, and I swear we use this word. I wish I could trademark it and have a cha-ching every time I say it. But the word awareness it only becomes something that you can make change around if you are aware of it. Without the ability to see that perhaps my behavior is causing more problems than there need to be out of my own amygdala, jumping in and saying fight or get out of here, danger. Unless I'm aware of that, and unless I'm able to find a way to feel safe communicating my feelings or my needs, nothing's ever going to change.
Speaker 1:I'm not just going to wake up one day and say all of our problems are solved because now I know how to communicate with you. It takes practice, it takes awareness, it takes the desire to make the change, the ability to break through the ego, the guilt, the projection, the whatever is getting in the way of just being able to communicate effectively with your partner. Yeah, so sometimes time and space gives you the ability to find some awareness in the situation. Sometimes time and space also just lets it do what it needs to do anyway and that is go away. Sometimes we are arguing about something so stupid, but it's like the most important thing still to this day, an hour ago.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Where we just move on, do our own thing, where we just move on, do our own thing. And then all of a sudden, one of us will rush into the room where the other one is and be like, hey, guess what? And it's like, okay, good, we're moving forward, we're moving past what we were arguing about an hour ago and it's like, well, yeah, I haven't even. I've thought about 40 other things since that argument, but before I was able to disconnect from these things, it was about me versus you and I'm winning and I'm not giving up until I win. And now sometimes it's just like it's not a battle worth. There is nothing to win.
Speaker 2:That's huge. The thing about us is we both like to win and we're both very competitive and we like I'm more laid back in my approach and you're more direct in your approach, but the same result is desired. We want to be dominant and win. So I think on paper this doesn't really work. You know what I mean? I think it just doesn't work, and I think that was the problem in the beginning. It's like I didn't want to submit, you don't want to submit. It all changed for us when we stopped butting heads and became more collaborative in our lives.
Speaker 1:Correct.
Speaker 2:Instead of trying to compete, we collaborate more and like for our business, for example, braun Mortgage Group. Mom and dad are overseeing it, and that's why it feels good to work with this, because we're like operating from a collaborative space, same with music.
Speaker 1:And that translates into our marriage. So those things are an external or an extension of our marriage that make it easy to see that what wasn't so easy in the beginning was seeing that our marriage can operate that way as well.
Speaker 2:Our marriage is a project that we're working on as well.
Speaker 1:That we can choose partnership, that we can choose to see that each other's weaknesses or each other's strengths can be a compliment, that it isn't me versus you. It isn't about winning. And when we chose collaboration, when we chose partnership, when we chose a team attitude, we started winning in our relationship.
Speaker 2:Everything in our life really kind of changed too. I mean like when we work together and forgive the other person's like short-sightedness. You're just like, okay, let's go. This is we can win.
Speaker 1:That's right, that's the ripple effect. I also talk about that in my book. I call it the reset ripple effect. I'm sorry for plugging my book so much in this episode.
Speaker 2:Why are you sorry? You need to plug it all the time? Why are you sorry, you need to plug it all the?
Speaker 1:time. Okay, this people need to know because it's going to help a lot of people.
Speaker 2:Well, it just feels awkward still yeah, well, that's either way.
Speaker 1:One of the things that really pops into my mind about our relationship, aside from all of the conflict of trying to balance it all and figuring out how to do that together versus feeling separate entities is this idea of also respecting the other person's difference in personality or difference in needs in ways that they feel loved. And what I'm thinking about as I say that is how we operate differently in our own personal lives when it comes to how we handle relationships or the importance of friendships in our own world. So when we first started dating, I don't think either of us fully understood how to handle each other.
Speaker 2:There was no instructional manual.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no one, you didn't. You know, here you go.
Speaker 2:You should come. You'd have been like uh, I don't know about this.
Speaker 1:Do I have a 30 day return policy on this, please? You're a very private and quiet person. That was the part of you that I saw most of until we started dating and until we were closer. And then I saw this entire side of you that was extremely social and that there was this large group of friends that you have had forever, still have, and this closeness with people that I didn't know about and that I also don't have myself. Now I have great friends and people that I love and lean on in relationships.
Speaker 1:So I'm not minimizing any of the people in my life, but what I will say is that at first I didn't recognize or realize or fully understand how that element was so important to you, even just being with people or caring so much about what people think. It was so different than how I operated. I'm a very independent person, not that you're not independent, but I I'm an only child Like. I have always been very good with doing things by myself and wanting to do them by myself, and if no one wants to do them with me, fine, I'm going to do them anyway kind of person. So we were just very different in that way and not in a way that's disrespectful to our friends or to our relationships, just to be clear, but just very different in how we view the importance of those things in our life.
Speaker 1:And so it was very difficult for me to understand that initially and give you the respect and the space that you needed to continue to nurture those relationships, without making it about me and what it meant about my importance in your life and what it meant about how you considered my thoughts and feelings.
Speaker 1:It wasn't about me, it never was. It was always about you and how you valued those relationships and the time that you wanted for yourself for those relationships and vice versa. And I don't want to speak for you, so maybe you should chime in here, but I will just speak for you real quick to set this up that I think it was hard for you to understand that I was so okay on my own and so back in the day, when we would say hurtful things, you would say things like you don't have any friends or maybe you should try to hang out with these people and I'm like, why? Like I'm good, why is that a bad thing? Because it was different than how you operate, and do you want to say anything about that, or do you think, did I, did I say it properly.
Speaker 2:You've said it great and just example of growth is when we got together, you were a child.
Speaker 1:I was. I was 19. I was 20. So I turned 21, a few days later was.
Speaker 2:I was 19, I was 20, so you know, I turned 21 a few days later, just just very young. We're both very young, very immature, doing the best we could with all the all that we had, but during that time I would want to go play video games with my buddies, and it was like the end of the world well, it wasn't the end of the world.
Speaker 1:But what I couldn't understand was why you needed that time. I made it about me and thought well.
Speaker 1:I like playing video games. I always play video games back then, so why wouldn't you just invite me? I also hang out with the guys, Like also, that was my experience in high school. Many of my friends were males who played video games and I was involved in that or sports. So it was like why am I not being included all of a sudden? That hurts. So then instead of saying hey, I don't understand, that hurts my feelings and you understanding where I was coming from, I would be like a total bitch and make it about me and make you mad and make you feel bad about leaving or guilty about going and doing it, or like you couldn't without me.
Speaker 2:I think there was like something thrown at me then too, some food, I don't throw things anymore.
Speaker 1:I don't think there was food. This is making me sound like a rage monster.
Speaker 2:And I used to be. You used to be. I mean, let's go here. You definitely used to be, but I used to be.
Speaker 1:I used to be Actually I bought, I went on a rage and bought like seven books about rage and anger and controlling my you wanted to change, I wanted to.
Speaker 2:I just didn't know how I ordered all of those books.
Speaker 1:I don't think I read one of them. Honestly, that was way back before I felt like I needed to take complete ownership of my life. That's when it started, right, right it. I needed to take complete ownership of my life.
Speaker 2:That's when it started, right. Right, it was a maturity level. You were looking for an outside thing that's like oh, here's why, yep, but it all was right here, that's right. But just to, I only just bring up because it's funny and you're right. I would say shitty things, like you don't have any friends, whatever hurtful things At the end of the day, look at it now.
Speaker 2:I'm going to go on a guy's trip. I just booked a flight to go on a guy's trip to see Metallica play with all my buddies and have a few times, and that's important to me, it's enriching for my soul to like go have some guy time, you know, and it's been a while, so I'm kind of itching for you know, there's you can look at me now and go gosh, that's normal. He needs to do that. That's good for him and I fully support it. Let me help you. You know, what can I do to help? And the same for you.
Speaker 2:I don't get on you for not wanting to. That's part of the process here, of growth is. It hasn't always been this way and it's nice to sometimes be able to look at it and be like well, gosh, look how far we've come in this just one little area. But it makes me a lot more happy and a lot more loved and feel like I'm respected more. As you know, a man that has the space that I need, you know, and when we first started out and I didn't get that, I felt that's going in the negative bucket, you know. So the next time we have an argument and I'm mad and the and the gloves come off. You're going to hear all about this.
Speaker 1:Yes, I'm going to just let you have it, you know Right, that definitely was taking place, and what's changed from then to now is that I will gladly book the flight for you. I will gladly help you figure out that it makes sense in our schedule or how it can make sense in our schedule, because I respect that just because it isn't a priority for me or that it isn't something that has been the way I operate, it doesn't mean that that's not how you operate or that is a priority for you and that it has nothing to do with me. Are you looking at my hand? If you're watching the video he's looking at my hand.
Speaker 1:I get teased a lot when I hold my hands in weird positions. I don't know why I do it Now.
Speaker 2:you're all going to watch the video and make fun of my hands. A lot of times it's this when you're stirring something, I know.
Speaker 1:I got made fun of at jujitsu because I just stand and my hands just kind of land.
Speaker 1:And of at jujitsu, because I just it's like I just stand and my hands just kind of land and he said be normal, but anyway, either way, another thing that pops into my mind, in the same lane as how to respect each other's priorities or what we value as individuals, is not to project that onto each other. So I shared this with you only recently because I was so. This is an example of how this still kind of trickles into our life in real time, but having the awareness that allows us to address it. So I didn't feel confident in bringing this up for a while, but I did, maybe at the beginning of this year, recently, what's going to to be?
Speaker 1:A couple years ago now, you invited people to come to our house for a surprise 40th birthday for me and out of one, it being something that you value, having friends. I did the same for you for your 40th birthday. Having people around, having friends, the relationship, reconnecting with them you viewed that as something that, like, I would want for my 40th birthday. You even went as far as to kind of like secretively ask me if you were putting together like a girl's weekend, who would you want there? I didn't know your intention was to invite these people. So I kind of was grabbing people from different eras of my life, people that I thought would connect at this time in like a really cool way, without the thought that it would actually ever happen.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So this is all taking place and then all of a sudden it's my 40th birthday and we have a band concert for our son and we go to dinner and we come back to our house and my mom is here and she set up balloons and all these things and out walks my childhood friend, one of my best friends ever, monica. She's here from Ohio. And then here comes my cousin Cutter, who is very important to me, and those two people. That surprise was so meaningful to me and I was emotional and it was so great. And then later we were talking about like who else to do invite? And then later we were talking about like who else did you invite? You know, people couldn't make it or you would. You had mentioned, like Lindsay really wanted to come, my sister-in-law, but she couldn't make it work or whatever. Oh, and Ashley, you know, she called and she had just broken her ankle and couldn't make it.
Speaker 1:Another childhood friend, another person that I had put on that list unknowingly. And then I found out that you invited some of those people that were on that list and it was so out of left field that when I found out that you invited those people it was embarrassing to me Like I was actually. I went from being like so happy and full of gratitude about the situation to then feeling slightly embarrassed that you would invite someone I haven't spoken to in 20 years just because I had mentioned that, like she, you know, I would love to hear where she is now, and this would be a great group of girls for some hypothetical girls. Weekend didn't mean invite her to our house for my 40th birthday. That felt embarrassing to me. So when I finally felt comfortable explaining that to you, I know that you immediately went to I did something wrong because it made you feel bad. It made you feel like I didn't. Obviously you didn't mean to hurt my feelings or make me feel embarrassed or feel anything like that. It was all out of the goodness of your heart and the intention of making me happy and making my 40th birthday surprise special, all of that.
Speaker 1:But what you didn't realize was that, because that might've been something that you thought you would want to take place, it felt different to me and I bring that up because I'm not sure that that would have been a smooth transition conversation if we hadn't been where we are in this space Years ago. It would have been a freaking minefield because it just would have led to you made me feel stupid. Well, I didn't know you. I did something wrong. Well, how could you be so like? It just would have been an absolute mess. Learning how to communicate and learning how to understand that we are different in how we value or prioritize things, and that's okay. Just because we're married, just because we do a lot of things together extracurricular, professional, all of the things does not mean that we are the same person, even though sometimes I think we are becoming one person. It's getting weird, but we are not and we do still think and feel different things, and that doesn't make one of us right or wrong.
Speaker 2:Yeah, celebrating the differences. It just makes you as a group better. It makes me better that you are different in certain areas.
Speaker 1:Just because you're different, just because you want things differently than I may, does not take anything away from me, and I think that initially, in my immaturity and in my insecurity and in the newness of our relationship and our lack of ability to know how to communicate properly, I did make it that, and you too probably made it about you instead of about us who you marry and who you spend all your time with and who you decide to make your partner in life is like.
Speaker 2:I can't really think of a bigger decision than that. There's obviously some decisions that are big like that, but that is one of the most important things. It's either going to make or break you.
Speaker 1:I mean, I would argue that it is probably the most important decision that you make. Should you decide that you want to have a lifelong partner spouse, whatever the case may be? I heard something it might've been on another podcast clip or something on Instagram where someone was talking about if you don't want to be your spouse, so in our case, like if I were a man, would I want to be you I confidently can say yes, like I love everything about you, I love your abilities what, what?
Speaker 1:I had an ornery thought run through my mind when I said that, because I was going to list all of your abilities okay so keep it g-rated anyway. Sorry, freudian slip. Um boy, I'm embarrassed. Now somebody turned up the heat.
Speaker 2:I'm sweating. You can't edit this out.
Speaker 1:You got to leave this in I don't edit most things out, especially recently, like some of the more embarrassing parts are the better ones, so hopefully you all agree. But what I was going to say is that, like if I were a man, would I want to be the man that you are?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And the answer for me is a very easy yes.
Speaker 2:Is it a hell?
Speaker 1:yes, it's a hell yes, okay. Okay, it's either a hell yes or a hard no.
Speaker 2:I was going to say, whoa, that was a soft yes.
Speaker 1:It's not a mild.
Speaker 2:yes, it's a hard.
Speaker 1:yes, the answer is yes, it's a hell yes, okay, yes, question mark no, it's a hell yes.
Speaker 2:I'm Ron Burgundy hell.
Speaker 1:yes, I'm Ron Burgundy.
Speaker 2:It's a hell yes, and I thought that was so interesting to think about it from that perspective.
Speaker 1:If you wouldn't want to be your spouse, then maybe they're not the right person for you, or perhaps there's some evaluating in how you view things or how you handle situations. You should want to be your spouse based on character, based on integrity, spouse based on character based on integrity and I love you and I would want to be you. If I'm a man, wow Ditto. If you're a man, you wouldn't want to be you. Well, that's very self-serving.
Speaker 2:No, it's an interesting perspective to think about, you know.
Speaker 1:Yes, and I think that comes back to like respect and trust and building together, and I just know it was really freaking hard when we first started out, because neither of us really knew exactly who we were or how to handle ourselves or what we fully wanted.
Speaker 1:We were basing a lot of our decisions on previous experiences, conditioning what everybody else was doing around us judgment, comparison, and not necessarily what was actually best for us in a way that was mutually understanding and complementary to each other's strengths. That is a lot to digest and it takes a ton of work, but I say all of that because I can't imagine that it's anything but that for most people, after the honeymoon phase wears off, you encounter some things that you have to deal with and you either learn quickly to deal with them and respect them and understand each other, or you keep piling them up and burying them and not talking about them and not addressing them until you have an explosion. Cheese is on the ceiling, you have a rock bottom, you're almost divorced, as in our case, before you get serious about really paying attention to the things that matter.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's like that honeymoon phase explosion. And then do we want to stay in this and work or do we want to jump out and then I'll do this again with somebody else Honeymoon phase explosion. I'm really grateful that we were able to work through the darkest times. The honest truth is, it becomes more of a self journey. I didn't do this for you. You decided that I deserve better in my life and in my marriage and my relationship with my kids and my career. All that decision-making happens. You had to do all that. Luckily, at the same time, I did too. So we both basically got to work on ourselves with, like I see you over there working on yourself, I'm over here working on myself. I at no point can't rely on you to do this for me. You know, I can't just expect it. This heavy lifting is going to happen by anyone else but me.
Speaker 1:That's huge, that's huge.
Speaker 2:And over the time horizon, you come back together and it's like well, I've done a lot of healing, I've done a lot of work.
Speaker 2:I'm not the same guy that I was and then you just kind of grow together. But you both have to be willing to work. And I'm not saying that I'm going to sit back and watch you change, and I'm not. It's like how much effort am I putting into this to develop myself, to become the next level person? And really in the beginning you're not there. I know. For me I was like I have never experienced this situation. You know this kind of energy.
Speaker 1:If you're not watching the video and you're only listening what he was doing when he said this situation was a full-on circle around me with his hand. I was the situation.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's just the situation. But it's not you, it's me that has to learn how to understand what I want, what I don't want, being able to communicate that and knowing that it's not a waste of time. I'm going to do all this work, make myself better, stronger, but we'll see each other when we, you know, come back together. And it's never a magical moment. It's a journey. You're on it together and you just you're going to stumble and fall and but you're there to help each other get up. But the majority of the work is on you. To do it, You've got to change.
Speaker 1:Yes, and I am grateful that we both decided to embark on this journey of growth and self-awareness, making change that then impacts the greater good. We were on the same page. We made a decision to choose partnership. I know that not everyone is as fortunate to kind of piggyback off of what you're saying. All is not lost If you are in a failed relationship, you are newly single, you are widowed, you've never been in a long-term relationship, you've not had success. This work that you do individually only makes that relationship or, I would argue, any relationship better. Knowing who you are, what your boundaries are, how to communicate properly and that includes listening, not just talking and being able to express yourself but also hear someone else those are all things that only make a relationship stronger.
Speaker 2:Those are all things that only make a relationship stronger, because when you get to work on yourself, you're really working on your relationship with yourself.
Speaker 1:The first relationship.
Speaker 2:That's your number one relationship is if I'm a piece of shit to myself and I have horrible self-talk and I'm always cutting myself down and I never feel like I'm good enough and I'm just negative, negative, negative, how am I going to show up and be your rock?
Speaker 1:Well, that's going to seep into every relationship that you have, because if you are constantly overly critical of yourself, or putting yourself down everything that you do negative, negative, negative you're going to interpret anything that I say, or anyone else for that matter, as critical or as negative. And that begins with our inner narrative.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's where the work is getting that right and then having the strength to be like okay, she's coming at me with this heat right now, but I know she's really trying to say she doesn't feel heard, and I can accept that and be able to not engage in a quote unquote battle.
Speaker 1:Well, and what's also really interesting about that, as you're saying it is that when you don't engage when I'm falling off a cliff or vice versa, if you're upset about something and falling back into those negative patterns or habits, if I don't engage, it allows us to really get to like the root of the situation, not just between us. But then also when you don't engage with my rage monster, who luckily doesn't show up that often anymore, but when you don't engage with her, then I'm able to address her as well. So not just whatever we're having conflict about in our relationship, but when you're not playing there, I have to then go okay, what are you so upset about? And like really get to the root of what my situation is, inside the situation you know what I'm saying?
Speaker 2:All that over here.
Speaker 1:It's hard. I love you and we have an amazing life and we've built an amazing life, but we have been through the freaking trenches and I can honestly say without the awareness and the work and learning to respect each other and love each other in ways that we need to be loved, we wouldn't be where we are, and so whenever I talk to a friend who's going through anything in their relationship or struggling to find a long-term relationship, should they want one, it always begins with that or the know-how that I do now it's what I talk about in that section in my book is really getting down to the base level of what our real innate needs are in a relationship and knowing how to honor and respect those for ourselves and for the other person. So we speak very passionately about this. I know that it sometimes seems like the centrifugal theme of our episodes, but it comes up so often in conversations with other people and in any conflict that we have, when we do really being curious about it and open to it, and so it's just such an important conversation to continue to have these ideas come up, and sometimes it doesn't always resonate. It doesn't always land for you as the listener, or for you, greg, as my partner, until it's maybe spoken in a different way or until it's presented as a new idea that really makes you stop and reflect on what your part is in the situation. The situation or maybe it just hits you differently in a way that you can understand. So if you find yourself in this position where you're running into kind of the same constant conflict, I invite you to explore your own internal dialogue and your own internal responses and emotions first and then confidently communicate that with your partner or potential future partner.
Speaker 1:I actually have a worksheet it's called 10 Hard Questions to Explore with your Partner. It's about hitting the reset button in your relationship that I created when I was doing a speech on this topic for a mom's group and it's 10 questions to kind of start the conversation and I say this on the worksheet and I say this now to you listening. You don't have to be in a relationship that's struggling to do this. These questions start opening up a lot of self-exploratory conversation as well. So if you have a partner who maybe isn't into doing it with you, or maybe you are not with someone at the time, these are still things that you can do.
Speaker 1:You can download that on my website. I'll link it in the show notes cameoelisebrauncom. Or you can go to my Instagram at cameoelisebraun for more information on that as well. Thank you so much for being here. There's new episodes of the Cameo Show every Wednesday. Sometimes it's just me, a lot of times it's Greg. These days it's so much fun to have him be a part of the conversation. He brings an entirely different perspective to many of the things that we talk about, not just around relationships, but just life in general. Male versus female, 47 versus 41.
Speaker 2:46.
Speaker 1:Oh sorry, 46 versus 41. He's a little touchy about his age, way more than I am Either way.
Speaker 2:Don't rush it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I know it's already going way too fast, but thank you so much for joining us. We hope to see you next time.
