Gatekeeping

I have had a lifetime of experience with gatekeeping from not having access to resources to opportunities that I felt aligned with, now being available to me. Coming to Seattle and getting into the community was a lesson in navigating gatekeeping and finding out who the gatekeepers are for what you want. I’m talking about my experience with Iving, a Seattle transplant and author who has his own story to tell. Join us!  

The Hot Girl’s Healing podcast is about healing in community and covers diverse topics, and how they relate to healing. 

Salenna Green (she/they)  is an organizer, creative, speaker, healer and leader. Salenna has a degree in Community Psychology and a background in nonprofit leadership and program development. Salenna is carving her own lane in the healing industry, promoting self love and relationship healing. 

The Hot Girl’s Healing podcast is one of the offerings through Salenna Green SPC (SGSPC) that promotes self love and relationship healing. This podcast is for everyone but centers Black, queer people as holding truly safe space for their community was a predominant motivator for creating this show. Salenna enjoys creating art, reading, leisure and travel in their free time. Follow them on social media to stay updated! @salennagreen #HotGirlsHealing

Transcript

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SPEAKER_02 0:04

Hey healing community. We are back with another episode of the Hot Girls Healing Podcast. I'm your host, Selena Green. Thank you so much for joining me again. If you are true and blue to the podcast, thank you for coming back and sticking with me for four seasons now. And if this is your very first episode, welcome to the space. This is the Hot Girls Healing Podcast, where I, your host, Selena Green, discuss a variety of topics and how they relate to healing. I'm talking to artists, I'm talking to entrepreneurs, business owners, creatives about what they are doing and how it's helping them heal. So today I am joined by someone that I knew um really just from the community, from the artist community in Seattle. If I'm not mistaken, we met at one of the art walks in the central district. So shout out to the CD Art Walk. If you're in the Seattle area, make sure you get out there. Um, but I am someone who vends a lot in Seattle. Um I, you know, I have a book, I have a journal, I have prints, I promote my podcast, a lot of different artist spaces in Seattle, and that is where I met today's guest, Iving, who um is an author in his own right and an artist in his own right. So I'll let him tell y'all more about that, and then we will be hopping in today's topic, which is gay. Iving, please let the people know what they need to know about you before this conversation starts.

SPEAKER_06 1:39

Um, yeah, basically, I'm an author. I love to read, I love to write. I've been writing and reading since I was like three years old. Um, basically, I dropped a book not that long ago, you know, and that's the T on that. That's basically what I want to say. I'm a writer, and you know, I'm I'm a serious writer. I'm not like those people, oh, I do this and then I do I play bingo and I know I'm I'm a serious writer. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:05

You know, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 2:08

Because not bingo catching a stray. But thank you, Ivan, and Ivan, and welcome to the show. So I know we're talking about gatekeeping, and child, this is something I got experience in. But before we get too much into my experience and yours, I want to define what we mean by gatekeeping because there's a lot of calls, especially lately, to like gatekeeping culture is one of the ways that I uh see the term gatekeeping used a lot. I'm also from the nonprofit sector, that's where my background is. So uh the camp conversation around gatekeeping in the nonprofit sector when I was there was about gatekeeping opportunities, resources, and access. So, what does gatekeeping mean to you? And then I definitely want to say what it means to me as well.

SPEAKER_06 3:00

Okay, um, do you want to start or do you want me to start?

SPEAKER_02 3:04

Oh, yeah, go ahead.

SPEAKER_06 3:06

Okay, gatekeeping to me means like for instance, when people only want to deal with certain kinds of people, and like, you know, to even get success or to even come up, you know, get support, you have to be the same as these people. Like, for instance, you know, if I'm a black man and I'm only dealing with other black men or something like that, you know what I'm saying? That would be considered gatekeeping to me of like nothing, nobody else could even like try to do any kind of business partnership or anything, they're getting shut down. And I know for my group, we're too like I feel like black men are too competitive against each other to ever gatekeep anything, but like that's what gatekeeping means to me, you know.

SPEAKER_02 3:53

Yeah, I would definitely agree. Um, for the healing community for me, y'all. Gatekeeping is like if we were to use a synonym, I would say restricting or um like yeah, I think I would just stick with restricting. So for me, gatekeeping is about who get or access, like you're restricting access. So I would attack those two words onto it. Gatekeeping is who gets to have a seat at the table, who is on the table, who gets the information? Um, as I said, you can be gatekeep from almost any um resources, right? So when we talk about access to resources, a lot of that is gatekeeped. Do you have access to buses that run on time? Do you have access to other forms of uh public transport? Do you have access to food? Do you have access to um all kinds of resources that people need? And it's actually also happens in the artist um kind of network that I'm in as well, who gets access to different galleries or opportunities to vend. As I've said, I am a vendor in the area as well. I've experienced a lot of gatekeeping, even in the podcasting community. There can be gatekeeping there as well. So um I want to talk about what our experiences with gatekeeping have been, because for me, there are things that I do feel like gatekeepers have not, you know, opened the doors for me in. And I also feel like there's some places where, you know, on the flip side, gatekeeping is good, it can preserve some things, um, especially in the way that we want our communities to be functioning. There's certain things that we do need to protect, and so I do think that gatekeeping can be a thing that done uh with some balance and with some intentionality and integrity can be a good thing, but maybe it's inherently negative. Like, who knows? What has your experience with gatekeeping been?

SPEAKER_06 6:15

I mean, it's been a lot here, especially because I've been I've honestly I feel like I've been fortunate if I haven't really experienced a whole lot of it. I've experienced some earlier in my life, but mainly after I became a writer, I experienced it all the time. Like I would be trying to get into book, I would try to get my books into bookstores. And like I could just imagine it would just be so many gatekeeping, like people trying to keep me out of their bookstore. And it's like you guys are the same people on social media talk about diversity and inclusion. Then you give me the run around, you try to make it really hard for me to get in your store. And then, or you're like, hey, I'll buy one copy of your book and see if it sells, but it's like I don't want to deal with somebody who doesn't believe in me, you know. So it's like okay.

SPEAKER_02 7:03

Yeah, I mean, yeah, there's so much when it comes to the gatekeeping that happens um in Seattle, especially. Um oh man, it's all about who you know sometimes, and getting in with the gatekeeper can also be something that you have to do to push forward whatever you're trying to do, you know what I mean? So I definitely have experience with that. I know I've been in an entrepreneur in the Seattle area for at least 10 years now. So I know there are a lot of gatekeepers uh out here, and I know that when it comes to choosing to navigate spaces where you're going to have to come in and you know work with a gatekeeper. Um I really do feel like it's not an inherently negative thing. So, yes, gatekeeping has historically been used in this country to keep black people out of spaces. Like, I just want to be real about that, right? When when I'm talking about gatekeeping, we can talk about glass ceilings, right? We can talk about being invited to the table, um, but you don't have a seat that's as high as everybody else's, right? We can talk about being invited into spaces where they've like told you, yes, diversity and inclusion, yes, honoring black and indigenous people, but then when you get into the space, they're not walking it like they're talking it. Okay, so that's a lot of the experience of gatekeeping that I've actually had. But when it comes to creating your own, that's something that gatekeeping led me to do. Like, I'm not actually, I agree with you a lot. I'm not going to convince anyone um that what I'm doing is worthy. I'm not here to convince you that what I'm doing is right. I'm not here to convince you that what I'm doing is groundbreaking or amazing. I'm here to show you that. And if you can see that and if you want to respond to that, then good. But at the same time, I'm gonna create something for myself and I'm gonna protect it. And that could look like gatekeeping to somebody else. You know what I mean? So for me, it's not something that's an inherently negative thing, but it is something that comes with boundaries, and if it's not used with community in mind, then we quickly start perpetuating the same inequalities that oftentimes we're trying to challenge. A lot of the experience when it comes to gatekeeping, I don't think is inherent, I don't think gatekeeping by itself is an inherently negative thing, but I do think a lot of the times that I've encountered gatekeeping has been in a negative way. It's often been uh a way that you know aligns with glass ceilings or having a seat at the table or not having a seat at the table. Um, being included in spaces where a dominant culture, which is white culture, is then saying we want to include and diversify and honor, you know, black and indigenous people and spaces where gatekeepers are saying a lot, but then when it comes to action, they're not walking it like they're talking. Alternatively, those kind of gatekeeping spaces is what leads a lot of people to creating their own space. And I will say that is a lot of what led to me creating my own space. And now that I have it, I'm gonna protect it, and that could look like gatekeeping to other people. So when it comes to gatekeeping, I do think that it's something that when it's done with intentionality, when it's done with community in mind, it can be a positive thing that protects certain spaces from becoming the the very thing that we're trying not to perpetuate.

SPEAKER_01 10:57

Right. Right, exactly.

SPEAKER_06 11:01

Um and yeah, basically, so yeah, what was because I heard what you were saying about uh your gatekeeping and how that starts you to do it uh to protect your space, basically. Um, because I've seen so many places where basically I've I've been I've been in a room with the people and like you know, everybody's invited to come, but at the same time, you know, my stuff isn't getting promoted the same way somebody in the inner circle is. And I feel like I'm just there as furniture or just to say that hey, at least one black person is here, you know what I'm saying? And you know, being a mascot, a token black person, that that's not who I am. I I don't take pride in doing that. So it's like that's my experience with that. Like you're you're just there, you know.

SPEAKER_02 11:56

You're not yeah, I mean, and that's the thing about gatekeeping. You might not be gatekeeped from the actual space, but you're certainly gonna be get kept gatekeeped from the benefits, from the uh privileges, from the opportunities that being in that space is supposed to afford you. And that has been um, I would say, a common experience between the two of us. Um, if that's what you're saying, your experience has been in almost every single field that I've worked in in Seattle, whether it was uh nonprofit or um healing or artistry or organizing, it always seems to be um that thing, and then there's black organizing, black nonprofit, black artistry, and it's always gonna be kept in this set separate category. And yes, that is gatekeeping, yes, that is um pushing black artists into certain spaces where I mean at to a certain extent, and I've told people this before because some people in other communities they don't understand um this kind of dynamic. But for black artists, and I'm not speaking for everybody black, but certainly myself and others that I've spoken to, if we don't see something explicitly say, you know, black and brown or indigenous or people, you know, there's there's little things that are said that tell black people this is a space where you would be accepted, or this is a space where you wouldn't be marginalized. And then so when we don't see that, when it's just networking, when it's just business promotion, when there's no qualifier there, there's a lot bigger risk that we're gonna walk into the room and whatever it is will be gatekeep from us. We will be seen as the person who is not gonna be getting the opportunities, not gonna be um getting the privilege that is supposed to be associated with that space. And I've walked into a lot of rooms where I was invited, where I was sought out and brought into that space, and then once you're in the space, that was actually all you were needed for was to count as uh, you know, sometimes a diversity count.

SPEAKER_00 14:27

Yeah, and I will say for the record, that is that function that function that function.

SPEAKER_06 14:39

Oh, I thought you said that function.

SPEAKER_02 14:43

No, the function is something that's something else entirely, but yeah, it's definitely black business, black artistry, black podcasting, and for me, that's not something that I I don't even mind it anymore. I j I genuinely don't because for me, another part of navigating these fields that I found is I actually am not here to prove myself to anyone, I'm not here to be the black person who just changes all the misconceptions that someone had about black. No, keep them, baby, because at the end of the day, I am Benigas. So I'm not here to prove anything to them. I'm not here to prove myself as worthy of being in these other spaces. I don't desire that. What I desire is you know, better, better environments, better quality of life, better life expectancy for my community. And I'm not here to convince anyone that we deserve that.

SPEAKER_00 15:45

It is a human right.

SPEAKER_02 15:53

So at the end of the day, my experience with being get gatekeeped just showed me what spaces were for me and what spaces were not for me. I'm not gonna force anyone to accept me, I'm not gonna force anyone to support my business, my platform, my brand. It's all for the people that it aligns with, it's all for the people who hear it, see it, um, encounter it, and are excited about it, you know what I mean? What has your experience been with people who, you know, aren't trying to gatekeep from you, but have been trying to kind of like let you in or or you know, put you on? Have you had experience with that in uh um in a kind of uh because this is all about access, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_06 16:48

Like whether the door is open to you or the door is closed, what has it looked like in spaces where the door was um well, like you know, like art and or um I um I'm a part of their roster of art artists, so like they send me emails telling me about opportunities and stuff like that, you know. They told me to do that. So like every time they're doing something, I get an email telling me, hey, we're doing something over here, and you know, put in an application for this, so you could be a part of this. Like that's basically like you know, being put on. That's like that's like one of the only times I can say, Hey, these people try to do something, you know what I'm saying? The few times I can say, hey, these people try to do put me on. Um I can't forget that. Shout out to them.

SPEAKER_02 17:33

Yeah, I see that too. Yeah, I will say I'm also on that same roster and others because I would say, yes, those are examples of not being gatekeeped. I would say it's it's actually an example of uh different black and indigenous institutions or businesses that have peeped the gatekeeping, right? Because if you're out here, if you're trying to make moves, you're gonna very clearly see who's trying to gatekeep you from the situation and who's willing to keep to put you on. And some people are very being very clear and upfront about the fact that they're not going to gatekeep, they're not gonna gatekeep how they made their success, they're not gonna gatekeep uh what troubles or struggles they encountered on the way and how they navigated through or around those struggles. And I feel like I'm definitely one of those people, but there's other people like that out there, and certainly people who have come before me who have put me on. So when it comes to this conversation on gatekeeping killing community, I want y'all to know it's not all, you know, doom and gloom, or it's not hopeless. What it is is a real life situation where there are pros and cons and you can navigate it and find balance in it for yourself. I really um see this conversation as us, you know, saying how we've done it. And I appreciate you um pointing out not only um an artist space, but a black-owned and led artist space that is putting you on because that's real. Um, I want to talk about some of the healing that comes with not trying to prove yourself to these gatekeepers anymore. What was that journey like for you where you realized because there were there was a time, especially for me, when I came into podcasting, I didn't know like what the black podcasting community looked like, for example. Not in Seattle, not in a larger field. I was just going to any and every mainstream podcasting event that I could. And a lot of of them were very palm colored. Okay, there was not a lot of melanin in the room. Oftentimes it was only me or me and one other person, or me and two other people. And when it comes to situations like that, I was going to the people who looked like me to learn about their podcast because I knew whatever experience they were having in that field was going to be closer to my experience. Whatever they were doing to navigate it was going to be closer to what I had to do to navigate that field than someone else.

SPEAKER_06 20:21

Um, yeah. Basically, yeah, you know, there is a healing that comes with uh not trying to be gatekeep, like not caring because I was trying to get traditionally published for like a year and a half. I got denied by all kinds of people. Some of the people were skin folk, but a lot of most of the people didn't look like me, but like I got rejected by like 200 publishers and all this, like every publisher and agent in the world uh stuff. So like, man, I'm gonna be selling this out the back of a out the back of my house or something down the street at the library outside the library. Hey, you wanna buy a book today? Like, because it's like, man, you know, I just stopped caring. I said, you know what, I gotta do this myself. I gotta self-publish this. Even if I only write one book, because I've already published other books, but like in print, this is the only book I published multiple copies. I have copies on me, but it's like, you know, I'm like, I'm gonna do this. I spent too much time writing this book to not publish it.

SPEAKER_02 21:24

You know, yeah, absolutely, and I feel like that's really like this personal power that comes back to you when you release yourself from the shackles of gatekeeping, either gatekeeping from you know, because not only does being gatekeep from something, it's like, why are you putting all this energy and trying to stop me from doing something? It's weird when you encounter it, but then also I've never found the energy in it in me to gatekeep somebody else from doing something. You know, there's a lot um of work that goes into you know building up our brands, writing a book. It takes time, it takes energy. And people have asked me, um, oh, what do you feel about someone else doing a healing thing, or what do you feel about someone else doing a self-love thing? Um, for years now I've had a self-love workshop where um it's activity-based and it's it inspires reflection and self-love and self-knowledge. And um, in the years since I've done that, you know, other people have done them too. And people will be like, Oh, how do you feel about that? And I'm like, Good, good. If every single person in Seattle starts holding healing events, good. Well, you know, everybody probably shouldn't be, because like some people, maybe you gotta you gotta take care of you first. There's steps to this, but um, I always tell people good. Everyone, if everyone spreads the message of self-love and relationship healing, I don't think that's gonna put me out of business. I there's no need to gatekeep healing, is what I tell people. So when it comes to this whole thing of gatekeeping, I don't really participate it. It's if somebody's trying to gatekeep me from something, maybe I'm going up over you, I'm going around you, I'm going to the left and to right around you. You're not gonna keep me from Nathan. On the other side of it, I'm also not gonna gatekeep you. After I started the Hot Girls Healing podcast, child, I can't tell you how many uh Hot Girls Healings podcasts there are now. Like there's a lot. Look it up, baby. The Hot Girls Healing podcast is not even just a thing that only I'm doing. You can't really gatekeep anyone from anything, and I think that a lot of the time there's this illusion of power that people have, whether it's I have an illusion that someone has more power over me than they really do, or I have an illusion that I have more power over somebody else than I really do. And I really think that that comes into play with gatekeeping a lot. Um people be out here operating on fear, and I think sometimes that can be what gatekeeping is too, you know what I mean? Because for me, I think about gatekeeping a lot on systemic levels, like I think about, you know, um, food deserts and red lining, and I think those are examples of gatekeeping too, you know. If you're trying to keep people from living in a neighborhood because you don't feel like they deserve you weird, you're getting weird already. If you're trying to keep people from good food options because you don't feel you feel like they're poor and they don't deserve but you're getting weird for me again, you know what I mean? Like these there's these weird illusions of control that is connected to gatekeeping, and then there's some real ass access that some people have and other people don't, and I think it's all gatekeeping.

SPEAKER_06 25:00

Exactly, and we could talk for hours about this. I come from Texas, mind you, it's Dallas, Texas, but that's all gatekeeping was all the way around. Like, you know, I'm saying that was everywhere. I went to a very cheap, low-budgeted school, and it's like you guys get all this tax money, you're not putting it into the school. You guys are taking a lot of that for yourselves. The superintendent got in trouble for stealing money, it's in the newspaper. I think it's allegedly, I'm gonna say allegedly, superintendent in a hospital. Maybe that was a long time ago, but these people were taking stealing that money because here's the deal. How are you guys we got 30-year-old equipment, 30-year-old music equipment? It's the year 2001 or 2000. This equipment came from like 1970. We got balls that you guys thought, or you got them used 10 years ago, they weren't even new 10 years ago. Like this stuff is old, and then you go 20 miles, 30 miles north, and these people got brand new everything. They got the latest technology, they got the best food, and we're eating prison food, and it's like everything is just you know.

SPEAKER_02 26:16

Don't get me started on gatekeeping and education, gatekeeping and housing. I mean, there was just an article that came out in Seattle about the amount of money that is unaccounted for that went towards homelessness, and then we have all these narratives about homeless people and who's homeless and why, and how none of the interventions are working. But at the end of the day, all the money's unaccounted for, and we don't even know if it went towards what it was supposed to go for, but it went to gatekeepers, they were the ones who got the money, so it's it's so layered when it comes to gatekeeping. Uh, there's levels to this, you know what I mean? The gatekeeping of information, um, it's it's it's a lot of it going on out here, and so I really do find in my own journey that I tend to disengage with whatever is trying to gatekeep me, and I find another way to do what I'm trying to do because at the end of the day, I'm gonna be successful. What I the waters that I'm seeding are going to sprout and fruit will be you know will be will bear. Fruit will bear. You know what I'm trying to say. There will be um a fruitful harvest from any seed that I plant. So I know the gatekeeping ain't gonna stop me, but at the end of the day, it is frustrating to come up against you know, these gatekeepers in whatever area it may be, and be able being finding ways to navigate around them, I will say is very empowering. It really finds um it like brings up this joy in me and this increased fight when I find my way around um a gatekeeper. So I encourage people to keep fighting. Whatever you're doing, um moving away from gatekeeping has helped me move away from competition so much. I'm not competing with other people, I'm I'm not even competing with previous versions of myself because all of those versions of myself led me to who I am now. You know what I mean? It's about collaboration. When you let go of gatekeeping, you get collaboration, you get um more innovation because you're not just out here trying to keep everybody else down.

SPEAKER_00 28:44

I feel like it just opens up a whole world for you.

SPEAKER_01 28:48

Right. I agree.

SPEAKER_06 28:52

And yeah, the thing about getting away from competition is I feel like that's everything in life. It's like once you get out the rat race, that's how you set yourself free. And you know, like if you're shooting, like for instance, if I go to the court and I start shooting that ball, there's nobody playing defense against me. I'm gonna make a whole lot of shots. I'm not stressed out and trying out to fumble the basketball. I can just shoot the ball. But if I'm got somebody guarding me, I'm gonna be it's gonna be hard for me to get baskets. So yeah.

SPEAKER_02 29:25

Yeah. It keeps us rigid, you know what I mean? We were ta when we were talking before, um, we talked about how like you don't get to like honor everybody in the room when you're worried about gatekeeping. We don't get to honor the multitudes of ourselves when we're worried about gatekeeping. Um, I think about this as a non-binary person a lot when gender roles are introduced to me because they're like, oh, you can't because people who aren't supposed to. We need to honor intersectional intersectionality, we need to honor multidimensional umness. Like we need to honor our multitudes, and when we're not worried about gatekeeping, we're able to do that. We're able to honor everyone who's in the room, we're able to honor all the versions of ourselves, and we're able to release this rigidity that I feel like really comes in when you're either focused on gatekeeping or being gatekeeped.

SPEAKER_06 30:28

Yeah, it it's very weird to me too, because um, as a person who like for me, I'm like, you know, you're non-binary. Um, I consider myself to be like heteroace. So they're just being straight, but at the same time, like, I don't know if I became ace because of life experiences or something like that. But it's like weird to me because like people are like, hey, you're black, you can't be that, and you know what I'm saying? And I already know that I would get that. That's why I'm like, I don't tell anybody, I know what you're gonna say before you say it. I'm a chess player, I beat a chess player when I was 20 years old. He'd been playing chess his whole life, he was a tri-state grand champion, and it's like I know what people are gonna do before they do, like, why would I play those games? You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_02 31:15

Yeah, and I look, I'm trying to tell you, I it's like this journey. The more I get to know myself, and I it's so funny because people be like, Oh, we have too many ways of saying shit now. Back in my day, we was just this and that, and now everybody's like I'd be like, it's so rude because obviously I, you know, I'm a queer person as a non-binary person, and so I'd be listening to a lot of queer podcasts, and being black and queer, I keep my ear to the street. Okay, if it's black and queer, I try to know about it. So I'd be watching um, you know, all these different podcasts and stuff, like shout out to Ts Madison. Um, because she's one of the people who be doing this, like they'd be like, Oh, I don't get the non-binary people, and I'm like, y'all, like, come the fuck on. We were non-binary when there was no language for it. The only thing that changed was somebody figured out a name for what it feels like when you're just a person. Like, I would be telling people all the time, I'm just a person, like that's what I identify as most, a human being who's very feminine and cute, right? But she doesn't need to be a woman, she can just be a cute feminine person, yeah. Non-body, you know what I mean? Like, and people act like it's so hard to understand. And I'm like, baby, uh, you gotta free your mind.

SPEAKER_06 32:41

Yeah, I feel you.

SPEAKER_02 32:43

I feel like and I feel like that happens because in the queer community, the queer community is already gatekeep from so much, you know. I mean, they like don't make it harder for us, don't make it even harder for the straights to understand. And I'm like, fuck the straights, they fine.

SPEAKER_06 33:01

Yeah, I mean, I come from the south, and it's funny because I've been I lived in the Midwest for five years, so like I've lived in different places, so like I have a very nuanced view on like everything because I've seen so many different places. I've been in Can I just went to Canada like two weeks ago, and it's cheap over there. I got you know, I'm going off topic, but I got a lot of food for like 75 bucks, American bucks.

SPEAKER_00 33:26

Yeah, where'd you go in Canada?

SPEAKER_06 33:28

It's across the border.

SPEAKER_00 33:30

Oh, okay, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 33:32

And like I've seen so many people, and I'm like, I see in a queer community, it's literally the queer version of what's going on, straight community. Like, you know, like I've seen the same kind of the closed-mindedness that I've experienced in the south. Oh, you can't do that, oh you can't do this. Like, for instance, even as a per most people are straight as a person who's straight and ace, because I know a lot of people who say they're ace are leaning, maybe leaning more towards being homohomosexual or queer, whatever, you know. But I feel like I see a lot of people in the south are telling me, like, as a straight person, oh, you can't do this, or hey, you can't do that, or you can't be doing this, man. It's like so much fascism and telling me what I can't do, and like everybody's trying to put chains on uh me and what I can do. And it's like, man, who the fuck are you? Did you who died and made you guy?

SPEAKER_02 34:24

Like, and they don't be knowing anyway. I'd be like, what is ace? You don't even know, shut your ass. That's how it'd be there's so annoying because I actually thought I was asexual for a while, and then I looked it up and I was like, Oh, that's not exactly what I experienced, and then I realized I'm actually demisexual, which is more about like needing to have like an emotional attachment to someone to actually feel sexual urges, and so I'm like, yeah, like people just don't know, and I feel like there's nothing wrong with having more vocabulary to be even more specific about who you are or what you desire or what you know getsy pussy wet for lack of better word. Okay, like we it's okay with having additional vocabulary, it's okay. And and and for me, it's like I feel like sometimes a lot of the times, the gatekeeping that oppressed people do or marginalized people do comes from a place of fear. We don't want to face any more persecution, we don't want to face, you know I mean, and it's it's easier to be like, no, that's that's the nine non-binary people who are making y'all think harder. Like that's not me. Like, that's what I've seen. Um, some people who are trans be like. They're like, oh, well, we're not, we are I we said, but we still said we're, you know, woman or man. We didn't say that we were, you know, doing all the shit the non-binary people are doing, trying to not trying to be genderless or genderqueer. Like they're the ones doing all that. You know, there's the there's the gate coming up, you know. So I feel like it can be fear-based when it comes to marginalized people, it can be fear-based when it comes to privileged people, right? Privileged people like to keep their privilege, they don't like to imagine what it would be like to be treated like someone who's on the other side of the of the gate that they can.

SPEAKER_06 36:22

So yeah, we know all about that.

SPEAKER_02 36:29

We was here on January 6th, but let me know.

SPEAKER_06 36:32

Hey, we all got a goat storm like house.

SPEAKER_02 36:40

Yeah, but I will say that I have released so much unnecessary limitations, fear, and just urge to mind people's business in unnecessary ways by releasing the urge to gatekeep and by releasing the urge to be in spaces that people are not wanting me to be in or are hostile towards me once I get into. Is that a space where I'm really gonna thrive anyway? You know what I mean? Is it worth the energy to try to force myself into a space and say I'm gonna be here because you know I mean? For me, it's it's a better use of energy to create my own and to invite people into that space who see value in that space. I think divesting from some of these other spaces, taking our energy away from it and leading them people to their own devices. Maybe we see what happens then.

SPEAKER_06 37:43

Yeah, I agree. I feel like I've become so much like my stem has risen so much in the last few months, uh, just because like I had an awakening January 2026. I was like, why am I doing all these things to like try to, you know, do this? And like I feel like we grew up as kids watching romance comedies, watching movies, all these freaking movies. I've seen too many movies, but I've seen too many people trying to please people who didn't give a F about them or like a dude, you know what I'm saying? This guy's a virgin, and you know, there's nothing wrong with people who are virgins or people who slow with a hundred people. There's nothing wrong with either one. I'm not shaming nobody, you know. Do you, man, you know? If you're a virgin, you're 92. Yay, good. You might live to be 120. But like what I'm trying to say though is we're used to seeing people like there might be a guy who's a virgin, he's 30 years old, and he's oh my god, you know what I'm saying? He's doing so much, and then he sees some jerk abusing a girl. And of course, she's been with a lot of dudes, and she's with this guy who's a jerk, and then he sees the dude abusing the girl, the woman, the woman, right? And then he like fights the guy, and he gets the girl at the end of the movie, and it's like, oh my god, this is so romantic, you know. That's what we're used to seeing. Somebody chased after somebody who doesn't want them and earned their approval, and this person didn't want them, not for one day. This person didn't want them for like 20 years, and then they had to do too much.

SPEAKER_02 39:11

This is giving them like early 2010s movie. Like, what's it is it's early 2020?

SPEAKER_06 39:18

That's like the entire plot line of so many movies from simp simp against the world to get the this simp fought the world to get the girl, you know, that type of movie. That nick Nick Against the World or Nick Against All Her X's. I'm just like, I'm tired of seeing that.

SPEAKER_02 39:39

That one movie where he had to be around. That's what I'm talking about.

SPEAKER_06 39:42

It's Scott Pilgrim.

SPEAKER_02 39:46

Yeah, yep, yep, yep. I'm telling you, that was a lot of movies back then.

SPEAKER_00 39:51

Um it was a it was it's a weird, it's a weird first of all.

SPEAKER_02 39:58

Don't get me started on the trope of men convincing women to be with them because it's highly problematic, okay? Like it's real weird.

SPEAKER_06 40:06

Somebody don't want me cool. Hopefully, somebody does, but like, what's the point of this? This is not conducive to nothing.

SPEAKER_02 40:14

It's weird, okay? I'm like, you don't you shouldn't be coursing someone to be with you. That's not how it's supposed to be.

SPEAKER_06 40:21

Yeah, that's not how it's supposed to be. Because if you do that, you're chasing, you blind yourself, you you blind yourself to the people, somebody who might want you for you, you're not gonna see them because you're just focused on what you want, and it's like, hey, you missed a lot of genuine people just because you were tunnel visioned on one person.

SPEAKER_02 40:40

I know that happened to me too, so and then a lot of the time in those situations, like you're not you're not even realistic about who that person is, anyway. Like, let's be real. It's none of those movies where they're actually realistic about who that person was. A lot of time you never even had a conversation with this person. In these movies, they're watching this girl from across the cafeteria, and like my dude, she is a completely different person than the fantasy you made in your head to begin with. Go go get to know somebody for real, like that person, let that person like you for real, and move the fuck on. Like, what are we doing?

SPEAKER_06 41:16

You're sure too. Are you like 25, 26, something like that?

SPEAKER_01 41:22

Yeah. Me, 26.

SPEAKER_00 41:25

Oh my gosh. They do say the black don't grab.

SPEAKER_01 41:29

Okay. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 41:33

Yeah, he said I'm 25, so I'm 25.

SPEAKER_06 41:36

I don't know. I'm 32. So, like what I was saying is I was gonna I was gonna say you're very mature, because I'm like, I feel like it took me a long time to learn this stuff because I'm not gonna lie to you, I'm that guy who just be reading books all day. I didn't really know about people, like you know what I'm saying? I stayed away from people.

SPEAKER_02 41:54

No, I love books too. I love books and I love movies. So I spent I mean, I spent a lot of time watching and I love storytelling, you know. I mean, when I tell people I love books and movies, it's not just because I like books and movies, it's because I love stories, stories, stories and stories. If you know, you know, um, it's a beauty and the beast scene because Mel also loves to read and she was anyway. So I love stories. That's the point of what I'm saying right now, and I watched a ton of movies growing up because of it. But yeah, I'm 32 years old, I've been married for eight years, so these are things that I think you know build some maturity in a person, but at the same time, like I didn't have a weird 2010s relationship with my husband, like there was no him convincing me that he, you know, I mean, like, I just I don't I never like that whole thing, and that being said, like I was a girl, not I was a girl, I'm like out of one time I was a girl, but I was a girly growing up a lot of the times looking like me, being like me, growing up in uh spaces where there weren't always a lot of black people around. I am someone who has had a lot of people be like, Oh, I thought you were I used to see you and the whole time never had a conversation with me, only saw me from across the room, but had these, you know, preconceived notions just built up in their minds. And I'm like, y'all really gotta get to know somebody, you gotta talk to somebody for real. Like, you actually have to get to know who they are. You don't decide who they are, and then get mad when they're not the person that you imagined in their mind that they were, get to know who they actually are. Decide if you like that person or not. Now, when it comes to gatekeeping, I know we have said a lot. We've said a lot about being gatekeeping. We've said even a little bit about what we, you know, view is worthy of gatekeeping and how we can do that in ways that are healthy and beneficial to ourselves and our community. But is there anything that we have not said about gatekeeping that you feel like should be said? Or are there any like last words that you have around the conversation of gatekeeping?

SPEAKER_06 44:35

Um, I would just say that uh gatekeeping is something that as humans, we fundamentally like it's natural for us to do, and it's just something that we have to like we can't just demonize because as humans we've always had that like a survival instinct, so it's in our nature to gatekeep things because we always think about hey man, I don't because like there was times in the past when we couldn't make food, we couldn't make we didn't have everything readily available to us, so gatekeeping is a survival instinct, you know what I'm saying? Like 60% of people didn't even, you know what I'm saying? A lot of us didn't even survive for the past because like there was a lot of craziness going on, and only the strongest people survived, even when we were in our mom's wombs, there was something in a woman's stomach that was gatekeeping the sperm from the egg, so you know what I'm saying. Gatekeeping is just it's ingrained in everything, you know what I'm saying? With marriage and everything, most men most men never have kids, so yeah.

SPEAKER_02 45:40

Recent signs actually did reveal that the egg chooses the sperm. So you're absolutely right, it's all gatekeeping, right? And some things are worth being gatekeeped, it's just how do we do it you know, in that way that it's about man. Um if I had to say last words on gatekeeping, um, it kind of actually aligns with what you said. I mean, I think that people need to figure out how to gatekeep in a healthy way. I think that when we talk about gatekeeping, like we s I said at the beginning of this episode, people are talking about gatekeeping blackness more. And I am one person who is actually in um in agree in agreement with that statement. I do think we should gatekeep blackness more. I do think that blackness, our culture, especially African American culture, is something that is often uh popularized to the point where people lose its origins and then they think it just belongs to everybody in anything. When in fact, no, that belongs to us. And so I think that gatekeeping in that way is very good. I think that we just need to gatekeep in a healthy way, y'all. Gatekeep in a balanced way, right? Don't get gatekeeped to the detriment of yourself and your community. And that's all that's my last words on it, y'all. Now, I mean, where can people find your book? Where can they support you and find you online and connect with you?

SPEAKER_06 47:19

At Seattle Arthur, uh at the Seattle Arthur on Instagram. I also have uh SeattleArthur.blog. That's a blog where I do like I get put free content up. Like I be having like weird articles, like, hey, well, how would it be if I were a woman? Or like how would I look at world? Like, I do like short free uh articles and just me rambling like uh post, little blog posts on there. Um and then yeah, you know, I am also on threads, I believe it's uh DC out of art. I think it's the same as my my Instagram, uh uh DC out of Arthur. Um basically I do have physical copies, so you can DM me and pick up a copy or whatever. It's only 13 bucks. I have zale and everything, but yeah, that's about it.

SPEAKER_00 48:14

Period, y'all, and support black art, support black author, and connect with IV.

SPEAKER_02 48:21

Get that book, y'all. Now, I'm Selena Green. This has been another episode of the Hot Girl Sealing podcast. You can always find me online, on Instagram at Selena Green. Um, you can always uh DM me, say hi to me if you see me online, use the hashtag Hot GirlFeeling. And as always, y'all, come back here, watch another episode, support the podcast, to share it with someone else if you like it, and I will see you here for another episode. Bye.