The Care Girl Podcast
The Care Girl Podcast
What If You Could Rewire Your Brain Without Medication?
What if you could rewire your brain without medication? In this eye-opening conversation with Dr. Candice Holmes, we explore the transformative power of neurofeedback therapy—a non-invasive approach to optimizing brain function that's been changing lives for over 60 years yet remains surprisingly unknown.
Dr. Holmes shares her compelling journey from chiropractor to brain transformation specialist, motivated by her daughter's ADHD diagnosis. When conventional approaches fell short, she discovered neurofeedback therapy, which not only dramatically improved her daughter's focus and academic performance but led to a complete shift in their family dynamic. The results were so profound that Dr. Holmes dedicated her career to making this therapy accessible to others.
We dive deep into how neurofeedback works—essentially training your brain to function optimally through positive reinforcement while you simply watch content on a screen. Dr. Holmes explains how this approach has helped patients with conditions ranging from autism and PTSD to early-stage dementia, sharing powerful stories of transformation. One particularly moving example involves a nonverbal autistic patient who reduced emotional dysregulation behaviors from 20 times daily to just once or twice monthly.
The conversation takes a fascinating turn when we discuss how neurofeedback can benefit everyone—from children with developmental challenges to high-performing executives wanting to maintain cognitive sharpness as they age. Dr. Holmes emphasizes the importance of early intervention, especially for those concerned about Alzheimer's or dementia risk, explaining how the therapy can help create new neural pathways even as we age.
Ready to learn more about this game-changing approach to brain health? Dr. Holmes offers a free chapter of her book "Transform Your Brain with Neurofeedback" to our listeners and invites those interested to book a complimentary neurohealth consultation through bookwithdrh.com.
Here is your free Chapter as promised!
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Speaker 2:Hello everybody. It's Alice, your favorite care girl and your grandmother's favorite. As you guys know, I have a home care agency here in Georgia. We take care of sick adults and children as well, and today we are on the podcast with Dr Candice Holmes and I'm so excited because again we get to talk about her. And I'm so excited because again we get to talk about she's the CEO and founder of Cora Neurofeet. She's a transformation specialist of the brain. She does wellness as well. Speaker corporate house call chiropractor. What don't you do? Tell me that.
Speaker 1:Tell us, how did you become all of these things?
Speaker 2:Did you? Just let's start with you, because it's a lot that goes into your story Did you grow up wanting to help people, make people better? Were know, were you the person like bringing in the teaspoon of car level oil? You know, like like, tell me, like how did you become you? And like when did this become a thing in your mind Like hey, this is what I want to do?
Speaker 1:Interestingly enough, I've always wanted to be a doctor. It just wasn't this, this kind of doctor. First I want to be a pediatrician, because you think of the babies, you know you want to take care of them. And then I wanted to be a veterinarian. And then I was like wait a minute, I don't like snakes, so I don't think that's going to work. And what really upset me is I didn't know until I got older that you could specialize, like, in cats or dogs. I'm like nobody told me that. Oh, nobody, listen. I wanted to be a physical therapist. Then I did a. I was a candy striper at a hospital and they put me in the wound care unit and uh, no, he said no one for you.
Speaker 2:What is a candy striper?
Speaker 1:So a candy striper is a volunteer typically a teenage volunteer and you go and do whatever they ask you to do and they wanted me to clean the wound care tub and I remember this particular patient was in and he started coughing and the whole room just had this stench that came over and his nurse was over there just doing everything it gets to get him right and he left and I was like wow, I said you know, I said that nurse is really on it. The woman said that's his wife and I was like, oh my gosh, no, no, no, no. And then I went to college and, you know, studied biology, pre-med, with the intentions on being a sports medicine doctor. I'm a former athlete. I played basketball and softball it was actually my high school classes female, you know, athlete.
Speaker 2:I love it.
Speaker 1:I wouldn't have guessed that, yeah, yes. And when I got to Xavier University of Louisiana, okay.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Okay.
Speaker 1:Xavier, I love, I love my mom. Name drop, name drop. Yes, there you go and they are in the top in place in African Americans in medical school and I remember one of the graduates came back. He was at Johns Hopkins Medical Center, he was a valedictorian and he was saying you know, he doesn't eat, he barely sleeps, his mom does his laundry, his dad cooks. And I'm like, at some point I want to get married and have children. I said that is not going to work and so I went to the doctor.
Speaker 1:He wasn't. I mean, he was somebody you were dating. No, no, no, no, no. Just somebody who came back, no, no, oh, okay.
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 1:Okay. You just see him.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:He explained like what he does and like, yeah, he was in, he was in medical school and he was not. You know, I mean he was a valedictorian. I'm like you're a 4-0. I'm a 3-5. I'm like I, this will work.
Speaker 1:Because, you know, when I was younger, I would have really bad cramps during my menstrual cycle and I'm literally walking over walking doubled over, I should say when I was like, you know, 14 or so, and I was like I don't know why you just want to take some pamphlets and mine all you know you're over here suffering and everything that's mine, I'll be okay. And so when I found out about chiropractors, I was like wow, there are doctors who like don't give medication and they move the body parts and you know, I want to stay active and physical. And I'm to answer the questions that I need to have asked and to see how they were living, if they liked the profession and which school they would recommend. And out of the three, all three of them recommended the same school and only two of them went to that school and I was like whoa, someone that didn't go here is recommending I go there. And the school was here in Marietta, georgia. So that's how I ended up becoming a chiropractor.
Speaker 2:Awesome, I love that, I love that and I. Every time somebody like has anything going on with them, I was like you need to go to a chiropractor. And they're like no, they're going to break my neck, or they're going to break my back, or you know, and it's just like no, like this is like the best type of medicine you know using your body you know, just the pressure points and all those things.
Speaker 2:So until you've done it you can't really say it's not just for people that are injured in an accident. It's actually like it helps with like allergies and all kinds of stuff, right.
Speaker 1:My children have been adjusted since they were hours old, my oldest was eight hours old. My youngest was five, was actually three hours old. Little people get little adjustments. I tell people all the time I'm not going to get in there and do all. No, that's the people. People have a horrible picture in their mind when they think about chiropractors, but they have no problem taking a drug that it may kill you. So it's interesting to me.
Speaker 2:But yeah, I love that. So how did you turn this into the brain? Like, how did you specialize? What made you specialize in neurofeedback in the brain and everything? Because, of course, the brain girl in me, everybody knows my story. Y'all go back to the other episodes. Y'all know what I do, but I'm not going to get into that because this is about the home today. But how did you get to the brain? What interests you in that, in that lane?
Speaker 1:Well, I have two daughters. My oldest daughter was diagnosed with ADHD when she was seven and, honestly, I was in denial when she received the diagnosis, even though it was from someone I trusted, because no one in my family had that, and so I literally asked everyone like cousins, aunts, uncles, like who?
Speaker 1:anybody? No, no, no. Everyone like cousins, aunts, uncles, like who? Anybody? No, no, no. And then one day it occurred to me that, you know, my, my children have a father, my ex-husband and I need to see about his genetics, you know. And so I contacted his cousin and she said it's never us.
Speaker 2:It's never us, never us.
Speaker 1:No, absolutely not. So when she said there was a high possibility on their side, I was like, okay, okay, here we are now, and my daughter was struggling for a while, just so much so I didn't think she would go to college.
Speaker 2:What were some of those signs that you saw? Just so your audience has those issues.
Speaker 1:Well, she was petite. When she was born I was extremely stressed out. I was 36 weeks and five days, so she was two days short of being full term. She was four pounds, 10.8 ounces, totally healthy, didn't have to go to ICU or anything. She was just petite and the doctor told me she had some delays and I'm like, ok, you know delays, she's a little smaller and kindergarten ended up having to hold her back and I was not happy about that because you know, I'm like it's kindergarten you know.
Speaker 1:She suggested and they said, if you're going to do it, then kindergarten, first or second grade, are the best time. So let's do kindergarten. So she would even feel a difference, or know a difference or so. And she wasn't crawling and the pediatrician that I had at that time didn't think there was anything wrong with that. And I'm like, no, no, no, no, she used to crawl. There's crawl, walk, run, you don't just go. How old was she? She was almost one. Oh, wow, before I put her on her tummy for tummy time because they talk about tummy time she would start crying and I thought I wanted to put her to bed and I'm like, no, sweet, I'm like, yay, tummy time. I'm like, yay, I'm like yo demonstrating how to do the army crawl. She was like yeah, I was like no, like, no, no.
Speaker 1:And so when I was concerned and spoke to the pediatrician, he suggested that she go to a physical therapist and I was like that, physical therapy for babies again, yeah, yeah, yeah you never, think that they might need physical therapy.
Speaker 1:No, no didn't even think that they work with people that young, you you know. And so I started doing that. She had speech delays. It was a plethora, just a plethora, and I tried to go the most natural way I could with her. So you know, as chiropractors we try to stay away from medications, and so I tried a naturopath who gave her a remedy and that worked well for a little bit. And then middle school hit and she told me, the national pal told me, you know, when her hormones change, you know, it may not work anymore. And it's like she hit a wall and I was like gosh, you know, what are we going to do? And then it just so happened, I was going through one of our chiropractic magazines and it had article about neurofeedback therapy. It said drug-free therapy, non-invasive results, can last up to 30 years. And I'm like what?
Speaker 2:was that.
Speaker 1:Okay, years. And I'm like what was that Exactly? So then I called the number and spoke with the doctors there and found out that the company is founded by one of my former professors in chiropractic school who was trying to find a solution for his nephew who has Asperger's. And so I did my research and, you know, preyed on it and I was like, okay, like we're doing this, and so invested in the system, started to work with my daughter.
Speaker 1:She went from lacking focus and attention to being the most focused in class, according to her teachers, so much so she kept her peers on task, from being socially awkward to having tons of friends, from having issues with oh gosh Homework. It was taking her five hours to do homework, do homework. And it went from five hours to two and a half, two and a half to three. And I remember when she was going through this transformation through Neurofeedback, I was like, hey, sweetie, do you need any help with homework? She's like no, mommy, I have it. And I'm like you sure? And so then I said, well, just let me check it, you know after. And she had it, and I was like, okay, and then my youngest daughter told me, said, mommy, you don't yell at her like you used to.
Speaker 1:I became a yeller you know, I'm working all day picking them up, making dinner and then working with her until midnight every night, you know, and so it was a lot. My time was at, you know, at 12, 15 in the morning, you know, and I had to get up and go to school, you know, go to work the next day.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, so I ended up. I had such great results. I'm like, you know, other people don't even know about this. It's been around for over 60 years, I think 50 years at that time and I'm like why is that? You know? So let me do what I can to make the public more aware of it.
Speaker 2:I love, because you know, I know the the growth side of it yes, all the brains up, yes, okay, so okay, here we go.
Speaker 1:So feedback is a sophisticated form of biofeedback. It is a way to retrain your brain so that it functions better. So when the brain isn't functioning so well, that's when you start having symptoms from, say, like you, like you know, autism or ADHD or anxiety or depression. So it is a computer-based program. One of the first steps is to have a brain mapping done, which is a functional assessment to see where your brain patterns are and where they're great, fine. Where they have challenges, then let's address those and we set you up on a computer, you know, similar to a, a laptop, and it has a software on it. You watch something on one of those streaming devices for 30 minutes twice a day, while you're connected with some sensors, and your brain essentially learns how to, how to do better. It's just like it's called. Neuroplasticity is what it is your brain's ability to learn how to perform differently, and the results last up to 30 years. And what I love about it is that it's easy. When you're watching, let's say we're watching, I can't. We're watching the show. I was going to say one of my, one of my favorites. We're watching the show and your brain is in, the frequencies aren't where they need to be, then your, the screen will fade and the volume goes down. When you're where you want your brain to be, then you're. Whatever you're watching will go just as it normally does. The screen is bright and you hear it well. So it's called operant conditioning. So it's that positive and negative reinforcement, except the negative just doesn't hurt. The only negative is that the screen fades and the volume goes down and the only thing your brain wants to do is watch what you're watching regularly. So it's not like you can sit there and go. You know, it's none of that. You just, it happens naturally. Like if it weren't easy, my daughter wouldn't have done it. I'm telling you right now, she would not have done it because, again, she had adhd, so her she should have been anywhere else. But you sit her down in front of a screen and she can watch whatever she watches. She wants to watch. Like she would get mad at me when her movie wasn't over in 30 minutes. My mommy, no, no, I want to keep going. I'm like. No, sweetie, like we have to go.
Speaker 1:Your brain has to rest for at least four hours so that it can recover. It's just like you don't work out all day, right, you take a break. So that's the four hour in between. And then, you know, I said we'll come back and continue. So that's what I love about it. I said what, who, what other doctor has a therapy that people love to go to? You know most of you say, oh, I gotta go, no, please. I had parents telling me my gosh, you know, if he asked me one more time for going therapy day, I'm going to lose it, because they love coming to my office Like we're going to therapy, we're going to see Okay, okay, okay. It wasn't like a kicking and screaming, they were like getting in the car, like come on mommy, let's go.
Speaker 2:So tell me about a patient transformation that just kind of like touched your heart and you. You just saw like that it changed the whole family dynamic and that child is just like still doing very well.
Speaker 1:I had a 23 year old, a patient, nonverbal autistic patient. He had what's called stemming, which is a form of emotional dysregulation. So when he had an anxious moment, his hands would flap like this and that would typically happen about 20 times a day. He was saying because he used a letter board to communicate with me. And so, after working with me in my brain transformation acceleration program, he went from 20 a day to one or two a month. Oh, wow. And so he came in and he just, you know, he was thank you, you know, just, you know all the things like you've changed my life and I'm just, I'm just, you know, like my gosh, and I remember having someone that story and like they didn't get rid of them completely. I said, 20 a day to one to two a month is a dramatic decrease. Yeah, I told you that people, you know, you know, I guess they expect perfection and perfection doesn't exist, you know, yeah, it doesn't.
Speaker 2:It doesn't like, that's like having the perfect man, right right, perfect woman, or whatever like it's going to be 80% of what you want and 20% of what you don't.
Speaker 2:I don't know. There's levels to it, right, there's levels to it. So that's me, us working with autism, children on our end. And I actually have a friend I told you she's a neurochiro particularly for kids and she does a lot of different intensives therapies and things of that nature. And we had a we had a child that I referred to her and he had a big transformation as well. So it's so. This is real, guys, like this is not something that you know is here today on Dr Oz gone tomorrow. This is something that has been around but nobody knows about it, and I feel like for for me, we are the least educated all around on how we can transform and change our brains and actually become better and just feel better. And let's talk about how could this help somebody who, let's say, has been through a traumatic experience?
Speaker 1:Sure, Sure, I can have a patient. She was in her early twenties and told me that she had severe PTSD, is what she said. And I'm looking at her like okay, yeah, like okay, you know, and mind you, you know, everybody has their you know first impressions.
Speaker 2:She just looked like was she in a war. I mean, was she in a military?
Speaker 1:No, no, no military anything. And and then she explained to me later that she had to be rescued by the SWAT team from her boyfriend who was abusive, oh, ok. And I said Severe, yeah, ok, ok, severe. And she was coming in every day when I just had to practice in my office my practice is now virtual, but she never had an episode during the training until her parents came in town and they wanted to see what this was about and everything. And so she had an episode and she's having an episode and I'm sitting there waiting for her parents to jump in to soothe her or whatever. And they were just stoic, they did nothing. And I'm sitting there like, okay, I went to comfort her because you don't know what you know touch could do, and so I'm just telling her she's in a safe space and everything's great. You know that we will. You know everything's going to be okay and all that.
Speaker 1:And what really interested me was, after that happened, I thought to myself wait a minute. You know, she was great until her parents came in, or her parents. You know the cause of her PTSD as opposed to this, this boyfriend person. So it just it made me wonder. One of the things is.
Speaker 1:Ptsd is one of those conditions where it is mandatory that my patients have a therapist or a counselor or a psychologist, whoever they choose, because that's not my, that's not my lane. I tell people all the time I said I do what I do, they do what they do. If you're in crisis, don't call me, call someone who's trained, cause I'm just going to tell you not to do that. That's all I have. Don't do it, don't do it. Yeah, don't do it, but just don't do it. So she ended up getting into another relationship while you know she was working with me and you know I was like wait, wait, wait. You know, the mom in me came out. I was like wait a minute. Now who you know, did you? Oh, he's really, he's really nice, he's sweet, you know, and I still kept keep up with her and she ended up marrying the guy and they have a child and everything's great. So I was like, oh, you know, thank you, oh good, ok.
Speaker 2:So she chose better and did she do the neurofeedback, she did the neurofeedback Absolutely, absolutely. I love that, I love that. So you know, a special place in my heart is the elderly, and you know I see a lot of families getting taken over at the last minute by Alzheimer's and dementia, where they catch it really, really late. Is this something that could actually help their loved ones, or? If they're afraid of getting Alzheimer's like, because sometimes people are like well, my mom and dad had it, I might have it, you know.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. I actually had a patient who was 29 when she contacted me and her mom was diagnosed with frontal temporal dementia at 50. The doctor home said I know it's only a 50% chance that I'll get it, but I just want to be proactive. I don't want my sons, our sons, our sons have to take care of me like my brother, and I have to still take care of my mom. She said I don't even think my mom at 50 knows how to operate a microwave oven. And I was like whoa, I'm like 50, like young 50, two brothers, and I'm like whoo, you know, like that's, that's, that's significant. And she said even at work she was noticing that she was forgetting you know tasks and numbers where it looked all you know, they were getting all jumbled in her head and she like wait a minute, what is going on?
Speaker 1:And so she started with the program and she said it's like the fog just lifted the fog and she was like, oh my gosh, like I'm just on it. You know I've had people who have contacted me afraid of losing their jobs because of mistakes or missing deadlines or you know making, you know, gross errors that you know, had their brains been as sharp as they could be functioning well, it wouldn't have happened so definitely as long as with dementia and Alzheimer's early onset. Just, you know, as soon as you notice something, I get so frustrated and disappointed when, and just sad when, people contact me. Well, how long have you noticed your mom been doing? Oh, for about three or five years? Yeah, I'm like no, soon as it's soon.
Speaker 1:I have one of of my, one of my bridesmaids is in, she's in Texas, and she said that she and her sisters are noticing that their mom is having some challenge. I'm like now, like now's the time to do something about it. You know what? You know brain tissue. Brain tissue dies. There's nothing that can be done about it. Neurofeedback is a way to like, reroute and make some new pathways in the brain. It's like I tell people it's not a cure-all, it's just a wonderful tool to have in your tool belt, another person on the team, another way of helping those in the elderly community.
Speaker 2:So it's like a life coach for the brain. Exactly so you're so busy professionals, high performers Is this something that would actually help them think clearer and make better decisions as well. I use it for stress relief, you know.
Speaker 1:So I haven't been diagnosed. You have to be diagnosed with anything. It's a way to optimize how your brain functions. So I have some executives, entrepreneurs, who want to continue working. You know, a lot of people now don't want to retire, you know, because you're tired, things tend to tend to go down, so they want to stay in the workforce. They want to make sure that their brains are, you know, just boom, boom, boom, just like they were in their 20s. You know. So they're coming to me. Hey, you know, I'm noticing a little something. You know, again, alzheimer's, dementia in the family, or they've had concussions, you know, just roughhousing. It's just a lot of challenges that we've had. That you know. I was talking to a patient the other day and said you know, I grew up in the no blood, no foul. You know, yeah, you fell down but you're not bleeding, so you're good. You know.
Speaker 2:I mean, you don't know about things that could have happened. Yeah, same, yeah, they can grow up in our times, yes, no, yeah, I love that. So even people in sports contact sports.
Speaker 1:It would be good to do this as well.
Speaker 2:So many different sides of it that can help us have a healthier brain. I would say I know you. Let's talk about your book. I know you have a book, I do, and I believe you did a book signing not too long ago, right, I did have a book I do, and I believe you did a book signing not too long ago, right I did. Yeah, yeah, tell us, like, what inspired the book, what it's about All of that good stuff. I know you have a little surprise for the audience.
Speaker 1:Yes, yes, I do, yes, I do. Thank you. So I wrote the book about a year ago actually before then, but it got published a year ago. It's called Transform your Brain with Neurofeedback. I happen to have a copy here.
Speaker 2:Okay, look at that Thank you.
Speaker 1:I wrote it because most people don't know what neurofeedback is and it kind of reminds me of how chiropractic was, you know back in the day You're doing what. So I didn't want it to be that way. I wrote it with the intention of introducing it in a manner where everyone can read it and understand it. I'm not trying to like I tell people, I'm not trying to be the you know, best research book out there. That's not my intention.
Speaker 1:My intention is someone can pick this up, read it and get an understanding of what neurofeedback is and then consider oh, you know what, maybe you know such and such a child with autism you know might benefit from this. Or you know my cousin has ADHD, or, oh goodness, you know. I know someone who you know has, you know, been diagnosed with depression and just stays in house all day. You know that was my intention. Of course, my daughter was the motivation to do it and, you know, also just to have something that most people don't have. You know, just just the way to communicate with people when I'm gone, you know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I mean, and you're educating people on what you do too. So there's some. There's always needed, because somebody might be like I'm not signing up for that, but I'm going to read the book first, and then, when they read the book, they're like wow, they have aha moments and they're able to understand, like, okay, this is why you may need this, right?
Speaker 1:Tell everybody the surprise that you have for them, so for your audience, just as my gift, I have the first chapter of my book that you all can read, so that is my gift.
Speaker 2:So, yay, yes thank you, and where can everybody find you?
Speaker 1:online. Sure, they can find me. Excuse me Instagram. I'm at BrainCore of Duluth and the same website there. If you would like to book a complimentary neurohealth call with me just to see if neurofeedback is something that you or your loved one would like to look into, you can go to bookwithdrhcom and it doesn't matter how you spell doctor, bookwithdrhcom, you'll get to it.
Speaker 2:You will get to her. And another question, because I know they're going to. I want to get this out of the way. Is this private pay or is this insurance based?
Speaker 1:Sure, it's like I tell most people all the great stuff typically isn't covered by insurance. Don't get me into the that's the real tea guys.
Speaker 2:All the great stuff functional medicine Natural.
Speaker 1:I don't even think acupuncture in some places is covered it, so don't get me started on that.
Speaker 2:Absolutely so. Private pay, guys, I'm pretty sure there's different options open, available as well, and I always end the podcast with give me three things that your family and friends would describe you as, and then leave us with you know maybe one quote one. Then leave us with you know maybe one, one quote one Bible verse, or? Or you know something that you know would motivate and inspire you every day? You know something that you may say to yourself, or affirmation Sure, sure.
Speaker 1:Three things that they would say about me, probably. The first one is that I'm high energy and someone asked me you know, do you know you're high energy? I'm like that, I'm high energy. And someone asked me you know, do you know you're high energy? I'm like this is my normal. I don't know what that means, but thank you. And I'm a nurturer and I've been called a healer. So I'm very thankful for that because I just it's something that God gave to me, it's natural to me. I don't. I'm thankful and thank you for the Bible verse. I choose a word of the year. My word of the year this year is love. It's also one of my core values and let everything you do be done in love, that's. I think it's. Oh gosh, of course, because you said that I can't remember the. I want to say 1 Corinthians 14, 16, but I'll have to please, if I misquoted it, forgive me. That's fine, that's fine. They know it's 1416. But I'll have to please, if I misquoted it, forgive me. That's fine, that's fine.
Speaker 2:They know it's 10 Corinthians it is. That's enough context right there I can't quote. To save my life I got like the normal one memorized.
Speaker 1:I was like, oh, and watch After I get up. We get up and I go. What am I going to do?
Speaker 2:Everything you do, do it out of love. That's what everything is.
Speaker 1:We're called to do. That's what we're called to do, even when I have a moment, I'm getting better. My mom has since passed, but she used to say I'm so afraid for you because when you drive you're honking at people. I'm from Detroit and I live in Atlanta. I'm like, why don't y'all know how to drive? I'm just you know. And so now I go sending love. Sending love. Help them lower, help them. That's what I say help them.
Speaker 2:I don't think anybody can help the traffic out here, but we, you know what. We can put it out there. They can come to know feedback and they're stressed from traffic.
Speaker 1:We'll be over with.
Speaker 2:This was a treat Treat everybody. I definitely enjoyed this and I hope y'all will download her chapter and buy her book and get some neurofeedback, because it's something that I feel like everybody would benefit from, and I follow Dr Holmes on all channels. And please share, share, share, share. I know there's somebody in everyone's families. There's always a friend or a child or someone that may need help and this could possibly help them have a better quality of life. Guys, we are out. This is the Care Girl Podcast. Y'all have a great rest of your day and weekend.
Speaker 1:Thank you Bye.
Speaker 2:Thank you, bye-bye.