Where's Doris?

Sarah and Rachel discuss "Doris", the person who- unbeknownst to many- holds the organization together. What happens when Doris is left out of the information-gathering and decision-making process? 

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Hey, they're beautiful people. Welcome to NOVL Takes, the podcast where we lift the veil on business. As usual, join us for our novel takes on business culture and the art of getting things done. I'm partner and principle, Rachel Gans -Boriskin. And I am founder and principal, Sarah Patrick. It's time for this week's NOVL I wanna set the scene for you. All right. Let's do it. Okay. In a small office, maybe down a slightly darkened corridor. Mm-hmm. Or maybe down the hall from the CEO sits Doris. Doris is in her late fifties or sixties. Nobody knows when exactly Doris started working at the company. She's just kind of always been there. Now Doris doesn't have a fancy title and she doesn't really sit prominently on the org chart, but if you want anything done, Doris is your go-to. She knows how everything works. She knows which forms to use, which ones not to use, and she knows where all the bodies are buried. Doris gets things done. Right, So today. We're talking about Doris. Right. We're calling today's show."Where's Doris?" Because today we go in search to the one person that holds every organization together, unbeknownst to many, Doris or her equivalent. So. Who's your Doris? I mean, I can think of many, right? But the first person that comes to mind is Kim. Kim, was probably my first introduction to a Doris equivalent. Kim was the operations manager at the first organization that I interned for. She never asked for any limelight. She never was part of any of the events that we ran. She was not part of the kind of glitz of the organization that I worked for, but she knew how to run everything- from how to fix the vending machine when it shut down to how to process all of the P&O's, to how to process literally any element of the organization. And when she was out- and she wasn't out frequently- but when she was, all business came to a halt. Yeah, yeah. For me it was Bev. She was the coordinator, at my grad school, and she knew everything. You know, and she, she knew the dirt too, right? It wasn't just that you got things done, she could tell you who should be your advisor. Mm-hmm. If you wanted to get things done, who you should take, who you should avoid, and you know how to navigate the endless bureaucracy. So, you know, I think for most people, if you got through, it was like you were gonna thank your advisor. You were gonna thank your, your parents, your partner. and you were gonna thank Bev. Mm-hmm. She's, she's my Doris. Right. and I think, you know, everyone has that person and, you know, and probably many of them, right? Yeah. Every organization has a Doris, right? Yeah. And I think Doris is often that person who's in accounts receivable, or she is a C-suite executive assistant. Right. She's usually in some sort of like support or operations position. She has all of that institutional knowledge under her belt and she holds it all together. Right? Right. If she's not there, nothing gets done. Right.. And so I think for us, you know, We had some fun coming up with the name, but like we, we landed on Doris. We like that, that spoke to us. You know, decide for yourself what the name is, but Doris, Kim, Beth, we know. Yeah. Um, So I think for us, you know, partly. I think a lot of people take Doris for granted. Mm-hmm And they don't even realize the extent to which she's making things work. Right. I think it is, you know, you mentioned she's almost never out. Right. But if she is out, it's like, then you know, you've gotta go to Kim. And if Kim is out, well you gotta go to Bev and if Bev is out, you might as well just shut down the company for the day. Nothing is gonna get done. Right. Right. And it may be, by the way, that there are multiple Dorises in your organization. The larger the organization, the more likely you'll have. And, and you know, let's be honest, there can be some rivalries. You know, different divisions, different departments, warring Dorises, right? Each out, you know, maneuvering that's a whole other episode. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe, maybe stay tuned for the War of the Dorises, . But I think, for us, you know, in our conversations, you know, what we've been concerned about is that too often when a business is trying to decide what's next, or figure out what's going wrong, they bring in consultants and the person who is never consulted, who probably has, if not all the answers, some really important questions, Right. Is Doris, Right? Right, right. So, you know, for us it's about how do we bring in Doris's knowledge. Right, right. And and why is that important? Right. Because I think what we wanna do is make sure we're stepping out of that echo chamber, that knowledge echo chamber, that perspective echo chamber, that's often created, especially when you're bringing in that consultant, when you're trying to bring in someone who's gonna help get a fresh perspective, get help an organization, find a fresh perspective. Part of what actually ends up happening is you just create an echo chamber of already known existing perspectives for the folks who are paying the consultant. Right? It's the folks who are often, yes, the decision makers who are critical in, in, in being in the room, but you're not bringing in the other people who are also making sure the work is getting done. Right. And making sure that, they have all of that additional institutional knowledge about how the work gets done. Right. So you're bringing the Dorises, the people with all of that operational knowledge, all that institutional knowledge, into the room with you or at least into that decision making process on some level. Right. And I mean, I, I think, you know, you, you raised an important point, which is sometimes it feels like with consultants who are brought in, there's a conflict of interest. It's, it's sort of, they've been set up to fail because they, they come in and they're given a list of people to speak to, and that list is, you know, all of the important decision makers who themselves have ideas and those ideas aren't working and they don't know why. Right? But because those are the people who already don't know why, right the consultants aren't speaking to the people lower down who you know, may actually have some insight about why things are stuck. What are those barriers? They'll come back with answers that, you know, just match what's, what's in that room. And they, so they don't have all of the information. Or even, if they're talking to the people below, they aren't really empowered to deliver that message because they know- or they think they know- that the company only wants to hear a certain set of answers. And it actually, I'm gonna like, you know, call back to our first podcast where we were talking about real talk. I think for us, you know, for you and me, Sarah, in our business, we just really think that that real talk is important with clients. It's so important for us to talk to Doris, right? and for us to talk to all of the people who have those pieces of the puzzle. that can help us build something better. Right? Right, right. Well, you're talking about creating a culture of perspective. Right. Which is also something that we refer to in, in our first episode. Right? Right. And so I think, you know, the real talk is one element of creating that culture of perspective. That's one thing that we are trying to do when we come in to an organization -we work in tandem with an organization- is making sure that we are helping to create the foundation for that culture of perspective. But also that in our own work, that's what we are doing, right? So we are gonna make sure that we talk to everyone who has a perspective to offer- doris included, because we know her value, we know the value of her knowledge too. Right. And it's not just the knowledge of what has worked in the past or not worked right. It's that unless you have Doris's buy-in, you know, no plan is gonna work. Right. Doris will fight you. Doris will come with workarounds, Doris will subvert those plants. Right. Doris is gonna take it down. Right. Right. Because, you know, it may be that, you know, Doris is actually a little mad that she didn't talk to her. But also because Doris knows it's not worth her time to learn this whole new system that isn't gonna work because she remembers the last five times somebody tried this. Right. And it didn't work. Right? Because the leadership, she's gone through, you know, four different sets of leadership. Right. And there isn't any institutional memory because I mean, I think that's the other part too. Right. Right. Right. Doris holds institutional memory. Mm-hmm.. Mm-hmm. And I, I think it's important for organizations to figure out not only how to utilize that Right. But in some ways to, to write it down. Right, right, Right?. If, if, if Doris says, you know, I've always wanted to travel. I'm gonna go travel through Asia for, you know, the next year, the company's in trouble. Right? Right. So how do we make sure that that knowledge, there's, there's somewhere we have it. Right. It doesn't exist in one person. Right, right. But also to your point, you know, Doris's buy-in is critical because the only thing that's gonna get Doris to change, is Doris. Because Doris has been working just fine for as long as Doris has been working, right? Mm-hmm.. And so Doris needs to decide Right. Doris has been doing this work. She's gonna teach, she's probably gonna be the one training half the rest of the new folks to do the work. Right. And do it successfully. Right. And so whatever her process is, is a process that's working. Right. So getting information on that process is critical. And if there's going to be a new process, making sure that she is ready to take that process on too. Right. I mean, I, I think the other thing is that she can tell you, you know, there may be processes that are working right? That to, you know, the administration to the C-Suite, this is working. But Doris knows that the reason it's working is rubber bands and duct tape and some, some bubble gum. Right? But the bubble gum is from four years ago and it's starting, you know, it's, it's getting a little brittle maybe. And and so she knows that. Right. And you know, in organizations we always have those lean times where folks say, let's make do mm-hmm right? Like, make it work. And everybody pulls together. You make it work. And then because you made it work, it just sticks, right? Mm-hmm., like that's left. Yep. And you don't get the resources there, but building on that mm-hmm. can be dangerous and Doris remembers that that's what it is. And in those conversations, you know, she can tell you, Hey, we are woefully understaffed right here. We need some more support here. And things are gonna be so much more fluid if we have more support here. And by the way, you have six layers of, you know, things here that probably could be done with two. and, and that is something that you only get, you only get that information if you seek out Doris. The perspective. Right, right, right. Like she's the oracle. Right. Absolutely. Right. Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. No, she's critical to helping build something better. Right. And, and she is one of the critical elements to this process. To our process. Right, right. And, and I think. You know, we, we've talked about Doris, but you know, it, it's that every division has those, those people. Right. And I think it's important, to recall that everyone has knowledge. Mm-hmm. Some part of the organization that you know your department. You know how things are running. You know about the culture. Right and that when we're talking about strategy, when we're talking about teams, when we're talking about implementation, you can't have these conversations unless you're doing the listening. Right. The best laid plans don't go anywhere unless you get buy-in. Right. And, you know, you get buy-in, partly because, you know, people have, feel like they've been part of the process. There's trust, there's part of the process. I think back at one point, my daughter wanted to have a bakery. Okay. And she, she is budding entrepreneur. and she was talking about how her bakery would have a contest every week mm-hmm where people would submit into a jar what they wanted the bakery to make. Okay. and that, you know, on Friday they would draw one from the jar and they would make that. Right. And then on the weekend people could come and see if their, you know, recipe was selected. And that, you know, that could be a way to build connection. And she said, and "you know, it doesn't matter if we get it right because people wanna know you tried." Yeah."People want to feel that you listened. And it doesn't have to be perfect but they, they wanna feel that." Right. So that is, you know, the wisdom of, of my then, you know, 10 year old.. She'll run the world eventually, but, but I, I think that there's something to, that. You're going to have so much more buy-in from people, so much more grace for making mistakes, right. if they feel that you've authentically listened to them. Right, right. Right. Right. Absolutely. And I think it's important to note that it's not just for their own sake. Right. we don't do that in their interest. Right.? We do that because it actually offers us important diversity of perspective. Mm-hmm. right? That then informs, how we can help problem solve. When you have a diversity of perspective, you remove yourself from that echo chamber, right? And, and, you know, maybe, maybe the bakery starts offering, you know, cookies you didn't know existed and that there's a market for, right? Right, right. Exactly. You know, that, that kind of listening matters. It absolutely matters. Right. and, and you know, we, you know, again, we, we think about, you know, DEI work, right? Who are the people who we are not listening to? Right. Whose voices can we amplify? What do your frontline workers know that your C-suite doesn't know? And what does the C-suite know that isn't, you know, being communicated? Being communicated right. In a way, right that you know, frontline workers can hear. Right. So, you know, there's all of this and there's Doris in the middle. Right. Who's talking to everyone. And she's the key, right? so I, I think for us, we are always on the lookout for Doris. And you know, Doris, if you are listening, you know, come talk to us We're looking for you.. So if you're Doris, okay. or you know, a Doris and you found that this conversation piqued your interest and you wanna hear more, about what we have to say. stay tuned for other episodes. Please subscribe, rate, and review us, and give us some love. Right. And if you're curious about what we do over at NOVL, you wanna learn more, or you think we could help your organization check us out and send us an inquiry over @thinkNovl.com. That's T H I N K N O V L.com. That's it for us today. Shout out to everyone who helped us make this show. To Mira, who helps edit and produce this podcast. And to Alva, who is forever an inspiration. This is NOVL Takes.