Sleep On The Couch Or Squawk The Parrot, Welcome to Midlife Marriage

10,000 downloads later, we’re still the same two humans figuring out marriage in real time, including the messy parts we’d love to skip. We start with gratitude for everyone who listens while cooking, driving, or trying to feel a little less alone, then we pivot into a story that proves how fast a tiny miscommunication can turn into a full-body anger response.

We unpack what it feels like when you’re “big mad,” why it can take hours to come down from that heat, and how stress and cortisol make emotional regulation harder than people think. We talk about the difference between reacting in the moment versus stewing in silence, when a timeout helps, and why “over-communicate” is often the simplest marriage advice that actually works. You’ll also hear how a partner who’s calm the next morning can be both a blessing and incredibly irritating when you’re still stuck in the spiral.

From there, we widen the lens to healthy relationships at home: letting kids see conflict resolution, repair, and reassurance so they learn that an argument doesn’t mean the relationship is ending. We get into self-reflection, outside perspective, and how family-of-origin patterns, gender expectations, and even prior marriages can shape how we fight and reconnect. And because we’re us, we end with what keeps things hopeful: dating your spouse, protecting fun, and using playful resets when tension rises, whether that’s a tandem bike trust exercise, a ridiculous parrot squawk, or a Nerf battle.

If this hits close to home, subscribe, share the episode with a friend, and leave a review so more people can find honest conversations about marriage communication, conflict, and repair. What’s your go-to move to cool down and come back together?

Please be sure to checkout our website for previous episodes, our psych-approved resource page, and connect with us on social media! All this and more at www.thelylaspodcast.com

Transcript

10,000 Downloads And Listener Love

SPEAKER_00 0:12

What is I don't even know what episode it is. All I really care about is that we hit 10,000 freaking downloads. Who would have thought?

SPEAKER_01 0:20

Right. Especially whenever we start off like this, huh?

SPEAKER_00 0:23

Right? And it's almost like three years to the day that we started recording this. Mm-hmm. I want to say. Yeah, it's a little over. I think it was in February. Gosh, three years, 10,000 downloads. How exciting. Felt like really accomplished, you know? We did it. The little podcast that could. People listened.

SPEAKER_01 0:46

Right. It's so exciting. Like just to even think that 10,000 people have actually chosen, or you know, to have this as being part of their life or as part of their routine. Um, one of the ladies I was in yoga class with this morning, she just came on to our podcast and she was like, I love listening to you guys. She's like, It absolutely lightens my day. I put it on while I'm cooking. Um, I feel like I'm cooking and my friends are around me. And she's, you know, never met you. Um yeah, and it's just so sweet to hear that kind of feedback. It just feels like really nice to know that people are including that within their daily lives, their routines, yeah. Um, the messages that we get, like, hey, thanks, this was a good one. Felt seen, felt heard. It it means a lot. So thank you all so much.

A Blowup From Miscommunication

SPEAKER_00 1:31

It's a little weekly gab session here, and it does, I do feel like it has made me a better person. Kind of makes you practice what you preach and keep looking inward. Right. This is all about accountability. Yeah, absolutely. I on that note, I'll take some accountability. So I had a wonderful weekend, but I will say it started off a little rocky. Just miscommunicated with my husband, and we were just thinking different things. And the end of the night, you know, there was a little bit of a blow up, and I got I got real mad. I got big mad, as we like to say in this house. She was big mad. And I was big mad at him, and um, so mad I made him sleep on the couch. I'm glad I can let you know. No, you didn't. You never get that mad. I told you. Like, and we had just talked about this at this girl's dinner of like when I get angry, like I can't simmer down. Like when I'm boiling, like to try to get back to a simmer, like is like moving mountains in my head anyway. What you know, after I had some time to reflect and really talk to my mom and you know, work it out. Call Barb. Sweet Barb. Call Barb. Talk me off the ledge, Barb. Am I crazy? I actually say to her, like, Am I crazy? Like it like that, like I need a different perspective. Somebody that's outside, like, am I crazy here? And she's pretty, you know, she loves my husband. And so she's pretty good about like playing, playing Switzerland. But um, you know, it's just it's hard to get unmad. And ultimately what it came down to was just a miscommunication. And like I told him, I'm like, had you just said that what you just said to me when we were making up on Saturday morning, I was like, um you just said that last night. Like that could have saved me like 12 hours of stewing. But instead, I've now, you know, cortisol has been through the roof. I didn't sleep well last night, like all the things, right? And um, it just you know, it was a a nice gentle reminder to just communicate better all the way to over-communicate, even when you think you're communicating well, to overcommunicate and make sure that every loose end has been covered because that's really ultimately what 99% of arguments come down to is a miscommunication.

unknown 3:55

Right?

SPEAKER_00 3:56

Yeah, I don't know. I made up that statistic. I bet it's like 75%.

Cortisol, Timeouts, And Holding Grudges

SPEAKER_01 4:02

I mean, yeah, but uh it's still a lot. And the fact that um it just goes downhill because once we're at that point where our cortisol levels are up, we're only seeing red focusing on an emotion. At that point, I don't I don't know what else can be done except a timeout, you know, and that goes for me too, because I've noticed lately, especially whenever it comes to um feeling angry or hurt, I don't I used to just kind of like be like the hell with it and you know go ahead and start fires and you know, baby immediately, immediately, which again, we talked about wasn't the best plan that I know probably. Um now that has kind of transformed with me, and that I'm not necessarily like going off in that moment, but instead, which probably still isn't good, but maybe a slight improvement, it is like I know that I in this moment probably cannot articulate myself in the way that I want to. You know, it's just not gonna happen. I'm feeling way too much, um, too angry, upset, frustrated, hurt, whatever the emotion is. And there's just no, there's not a way at this point in time for me to effectively communicate that and feel heard. And so what I do instead now is I just like hold on to it and stew it, like put it in a little yarn, you know, or like henlin. That's what it is, because it's still high, it's still getting hot. And so I am pissed about this for, like you said, 12 hours. I don't know. And my husband is one of these people, and it's like his blessing and it and his curse, and he'll tell you this, is that he wakes up the next morning and he he's walking with the Lord, you know what I mean? Jesus is holding his hand. Yeah, he's 100% over it. Meanwhile, you're just you're just gonna still oh at this point I can probably talk about it, yeah, but I am a hundred times madder because now I've held on to it, you know, and uh and everything else. And it's just like, what are we gonna do to make this work? You know, for this whole just burning, like I heard a lot of women talk about this too, and maybe it is, maybe it is like this time period that we're in because and I did actually read a study about this is that whenever our cortisol levels get so high, whenever we get so angry, it is much harder for us to calm down than what it ever was. And so some of this is physiological. Um, some of it is probably just us holding on to things. You know, we're in that section of life where at least, like what I said, we're trying to figure out how to do it, how to talk about it, but then talking about it's not gonna work. And so stewing on it has now become the new go-to. So here we are.

Kids, Arguments, And Healthy Repair

SPEAKER_00 7:02

Well, it's hard because you don't want to nitpick every little thing, right? So you're like, I didn't bring it up the seven times that annoyed me before the eighth time I blew up because you know, in your mind, you're like, uh, it's not a big deal, like just get over it. But then like it just all like, you know, you have the perfect storm, it all hits at the wrong time, and you know, it just you know, it just becomes like gasoline. And yeah, you know, I if you're if you're kind of like me and you have a non-reactive husband, which is probably the best thing, right? Like if he was reactive, like it could get ugly pretty quickly. Um, because I tend to match energy a lot of the top. It's like you go high, I go high, you go low, I go low. Um I just I it's a good thing, but then it also kind of pisses me off when he's not reactive because it's almost like you're not taking me seriously or you're you don't understand how much this is bothering me situation. Do you care? Do you care? Is anyone there? Is anybody with me in this argument? You know? Um, but he tends to go a little just not reactive, and that you know, can sometimes elevate me as well. Um so yes, it, you know, I do feel like the next morning, very similarly, you know, just kind of like is ever it is it he knew I was mad, and so you know, when he got back from his race, he was quick to to want to talk it out. And that's good because I need, you know, I certainly was gonna go to him to talk it out. I needed him to like extend the olive branch and then I could meet him there and say, all right, let's let's do this, let's actually conversate and and have the conversation that should have happened 48 hours ago. Um but you know, you live and learn, and I think this is what they mean when they say marriage is hard because you do have to continually choose that person over and over again of like, you know, and it's not like you know, like I the kids obviously knew I was angry and uh because I don't hide it well. And um, they're like, you seem more mad than normal. And I was like, I am, and I had to say, and I could see like the look on my son's face. I'm like, this isn't like divorce mad. Like, I'm not gonna divorce your dad over this. This is you know, because sometimes I do think they worry, you know. They know I grew up with divorced parents and they just they're always like, Are you gonna get divorced? I'm like, no, that's not, no, it's just an argument. And so I think it's healthy to share those. You know, we don't yeah, we don't call each other names, we don't talk nasty to each other. But when I'm mad, you know it. And right, and uh a husband doesn't really get mad at much, so you don't really know it. But but anyway, the you know, I think it's good for them to see that too, and to see the resolve and that you do argue, you know, marriage isn't easy, it's not roses and sunshine and love and holding hands all the time. If it is, God bless you, I guess. But I don't know anybody like that.

SPEAKER_01 10:04

I don't either. And I I agree that I think that it is important for kids to see conflict resolution, you know, to know that to have realistic expectations for relationships. Yeah. And um, and what they're supposed to look like, whether that is the showing of affection, um, talking kindly, doing check-ins, helping each other out around the house, or whenever you both get fiery, how do you come back down from that? Right. You know, it's I think it's important for them to see, you know, both sides of the of the fire and the resolve that can kind of come from it. So, I mean, for them that means safety. You know, that I can have a conflict with somebody, I can argue with someone, but that doesn't mean that, you know, that person's going to necessarily leave. Yeah. Yeah. Or not love me.

SPEAKER_00 10:53

Or the relationship will, yeah. That it's um that it's just part of life, that that you have to you have to talk it out. And sometimes they probably hear us talk it out. I mean, you know, we tend to go in another room, but we're not like whispering, you know, we're talking and and we're, you know, yeah, I could have done this differently. Yeah, I should have said something. I didn't mean it this way, or, you know, I was caught off guard, whatever the situation is, like them hearing those types of things and how like arguments, you know, I just feel like that's kind of like teaching them some of that like relationship um, I don't know, balance of meeting the other person where they're at.

SPEAKER_01 11:35

Mm-hmm. No, I 100% agree with that, but it does suck. And I mean, it does.

SPEAKER_00 11:42

The rage part sucks just because it's such a deviation from my normal, what I would say is like my normal personality. Like, yeah, I mean, I tend to get, you know, I'm emotional, I have a deep feeling kind of person, but I don't get like rageful quite like I do these days. And so it is, you know, it just feels like almost like uncontrollable at times. I can even be saying to myself, like you're blowing this out of proportion, or you're you need to calm down, you need to take a minute. Like I can say all those things, but it just like it doesn't change that feeling of like this fireball is in my chest. Right? No, 100%. It's like I'm ignoring. I'm like, yeah, yeah, yeah. I know I need to do that, but I'm pissed. I can't do that right now. It's not gonna happen. Take it off the plate. Good times, good times.

Accountability Through Self-Reflection

SPEAKER_01 12:36

I know. Well, I mean, it just those things are gonna happen. And no matter how good you are, I mean, for Christ's sakes, you know, I think that people look at our professions or what we do and think that, oh, things must be perfect. You know how to, you know, the answers to everything. No, that's not true. I think that whenever it's within yourself, there's certain blinders that we all have them that we wear. And then again, we're all humans at the end of the day. Like, if you are within a healthy, a helping profession and you maintain that hat 24-7, I don't think that that's healthy. And I don't know that you are being a hundred percent genuine to yourself. Just to kind of like put that out there, because I have interacted with people at different times that I felt like they were cyborgs, like 100% robots. And I'm just I'm here to be human and not to get down with that. And I think that even within other relationships, it's important to be human. You use skills, but be a human while you do it. Um and I just I don't know. I I think it's gonna happen. We're gonna have these conflicts, we're gonna have fights, we're gonna get upset with one another. But I think it's how are how are we working that out during different phases of our life and our relationship? And is there growth taking place? And so whenever you look at that meter, if your fights never get better, they always stay the same, or you just feel that great sense of continued emotional detachment, then we could be having different conversations. You know what I mean? But if there's still that willingness to engage, that willingness to come back to the table, to talk things through, and then to reconnect and and move forward, I think that that's part of having healthy relationships. I mean, part of commitment is being with them at different points in time, and your commitment is meeting them at different points in time and reciprocity and all of that stuff.

SPEAKER_00 14:35

So yeah, I think you have to self-reflect. I think that's a big part of it. Anytime you have conflict, you have to do some self-reflection. Because if you don't, you know, I've listened to lots of people over the years, and uh even though I I've often said I'm not a therapist, you know, people tended to land in my office. You know, you just you hear it all. You hear it the good, bad, the ugly, people's personal lives, and you can fall into this rut of, you know, you're always the victim in every conflict. Like, well, this person did this, or this person said this, or they're always doing this. And if you find yourself kind of constantly doing that, like really taking a step and self-reflecting on what you're bringing to those conflicts, because it takes two to takes two to tango, and um, there's something that we can all learn from this. And I that's why I love to call my mom. Like, I think it's so important to have somebody that you can call and just say, and yes, of course she's biased, she's my mother, like a thousand percent. However, I know that I can tell her the ugliest parts of me, and she's not gonna judge me or love me any less, or you know, and she's gonna be like, Yeah, maybe, you know, well, maybe he was thinking this. So I think self-reflection is, you know, not to be um, not to be missed. And it's the hardest, you know, even like I really felt like I was in the right this weekend in this argument. And after some self-reflection, I could see how I could have communicated better and been um, you know, just a little bit more honest about my feelings and what I was, you know, planning to do and hoping to do. What I, you know, I've sort of made up in my mind what was gonna happen, and I didn't share it with anybody. And so that, you know, just that reflection was like, oh yes, like while yes, he did XYZ, I could have ABC'd and like miss the whole commotion. And I think that's where we have to look at our behavior, and that's you know, that's practice, like everything else we talk about. It takes practice and it's not always easy. Like I was a little down on myself after I was like, ugh, I could have done better. It wasn't all his fault after all. Maybe I should have let him sleep in his own bed. Um that's so funny.

SPEAKER_01 17:04

God bless.

SPEAKER_00 17:05

That's funny because my coworker got me this like bar of soap called spite. And I remember moving it and feeling like not offended, but just like, really? You think like I like I'm a spiteful person? And like I I have to laugh. Like, yeah, I kind of am a spiteful bitch. Like, you piss me off, I'm gonna make you sleep on the couch. Like, you know, we're gonna get a race and you want to do well tomorrow. Well, too bad, sleep on the couch. Uh you know, something else to work on. You still did well. Just don't want to run out of things to work on.

SPEAKER_01 17:39

Yeah. No, that's true. And I think again, hey, it's fair. And you for the love of God, we're gonna continue to make these mistakes. We're gonna continue to have these moments, we're gonna continue again because it's part of a human experience. And then it's the the afterward is where we're taking stock and reformulating and then replanning for how to handle things differently in the future. And I think the more times that you do that with your spouse or with your partner, you pick up on things that could prevent the argument from happening. Like you can see that they might be getting upset. And so then maybe you back off a little bit, you know, or maybe you approach it differently at that point. Or maybe even you wait a few days because you know that they're really stressful, they have something big coming up, and they need to have more capacity to understand what's going on before they can kind of move forward and process something like that. And right, you know, that's a great point.

Men, Women, And Different Upbringings

SPEAKER_00 18:39

Like recognizing like the capacity they have in the moment because it's not consistent, just like ours isn't. Certain times I have more capacity to handle shit than others, you know? Like, yeah, it just depends on the time and like trying to um be cognizant. What do you think though? Do you feel like both partners have to be doing this sort of like introspection and like you know, because my mom and I were talking about this, and she's like, Tinny, at the end of the day, men just don't think like women. Like, this is the age-old argument. Like, no, he's not thinking about XYZ, like that, and he's never going to. And I was like, but can't they practice just like I'm practicing? You know, and she's like, I mean, they can, but like, name me one that has. Like she, you know, she's just like, it is what some points like you just have to recognize the difference between male and females. Like, we're constantly trying to, you know, think of other people, put and I, you know, for better or for worse, put other people ahead of ourselves, making sure like their stuff is covered, but like you know, men just don't think that way.

SPEAKER_01 19:50

No, I I definitely believe that. I think it's factually true. Um and I do still again believe that we can make improvements through, you know, being very introspective to looking back at the beliefs and things that have shaped our uh communication, our experiences in relationships. I mean, whenever you come into it, you come from two completely different households, and the way that they communicate and how they articulate things is the example that you then become used to or accepting of in your relationships. And if there's a conflict between those two different types of things, then that in and of itself can be challenging, you know? Um, I mean, my family, we never yelled. We never like you only yell, there was a rule, you only yell if you're hurt or in danger. That was like the standing rule. And so that never happened. I mean, people would get upset or whatever else, but I didn't come from a household that did that. My husband came from a household where that was a part of his like upbringing. Those two things, like, uh-uh. Like, I can't, I'm not I know. You know, not to say that happens a lot, but whenever it does, because we're humans or whatever, sure, those things, you know, send off different alarms. And I think that that's what we have to be aware of whenever we're in those relationships. And how do we then work towards coming to the middle? Now, maybe we shut down and was quiet about it, and that's probably what I do is that I'll just pull away emotionally. Like I can move on the rest of my, you know what I mean? Life like that. Um, again, not a healthy, two very opposite ways of coping and dealing with things, but it's under, it's coming to the understanding point that that's maybe not so much as to who we are, but that's a learned behavior. And now that we're within our new and context of a relationship, 10 years we've been together almost, um, we still work through that much, much, much better than what it was. But I mean, when again, whenever I get upset, now it's much more of a, you know, again, I'm in the Kenlin, still probably pulling away the, you know. I'm not yelling and fussing and whatever else. But me holding that in is another type of just pulling away and not wanting to engage and shutting yourself off at that point.

SPEAKER_00 22:12

And you think about this. I mean, both of you were married previously. And like you said, you had different styles of argument of how you argued and dealt with things. And so you all practiced that for many years prior to coming into your second marriage. And so, you know, I think a lot of people probably can relate to that and find a lot of truth in that. And that, like, oh, this is how I used to deal with things. And you know, you tend to learn, right? We learn from our mistakes. And I'm not saying that divorce is a mistake. I'm just saying that, like, when you go through something, you tend to learn from it. And you think, well, maybe I would do things differently the next go around. But like you're saying, you tend to some of that sometimes comes with you too. It's like, oh, but I practiced that behavior for so long. It's not like you're just like, well, I'm not going to do that anymore. It doesn't quite work that way, right? Like you've practiced it and that's become part of your natural response.

SPEAKER_01 23:08

Yeah. I think that the that is your practice behavior. And then I think from those experiences, you also draw a hard line, too, is like, I'm not doing X again, you know, because again, you've learned from an experience and you're not going to allow yourself to kind of um go down a different road again. And so you want better for yourself, you want better for your relationship, you want better for your kids based upon that kind of a standard, a new standard that gets set based upon that. And so then it's you're working towards that while working on yourself, while working in a new relationship, all of the things. And then again, if you think that that just gets easier over time or that it doesn't happen, it just changes. And it changes as life changes, it changes as you change, he, she, whatever changes as your kids, your home environment, as all of the many thousands of circumstances that are out there, it continues to change. And that's why I think it's just really important that you have some type of um connecting line that you can kind of draw back on. At the end of the day, maybe all of these other things are true, but whenever I am still with this person, I still feel loved, valued, safe, respected, whatever, even though X, Y, and Z is happening. And as long as you can kind of come back to that, yeah, yeah.

Dating Your Spouse To Reconnect

SPEAKER_00 24:35

Things aren't always perfect and they get on your nerves or you miscommunicate, whatever it is. But at the end of the day, I was thinking that too. Like even having, you know, an argument, we don't argue that much, but when we do, they tend to be a little bit more heated, right? Because they're like they they're they're you know, few and far between. But when they do happen, you know, and then we just coincidentally didn't it just worked out this way because parents offered to take the kids and we said, okay, because we haven't had a date night in six months, and or what feels like it. And so um we had like the best time when it's just the two of us, like we have and when we have the kids, we have a great time too. But like at the end of the day, what really makes me so proud or just reminds me what's worth working for is that you can have so much fun with that person just like you did 20 years ago, 10 years ago, however many years you've been together. And that's you know, that gives me so much hope for like the future when we're empty nesters someday that like we'll still we won't be those people that look at each other and like, who are you? Because we have like reconnected throughout, you know. I hope hopefully that continues. But there, you know, that we have had those times where it's just the two of us and we we can still have a lot of fun, like a lot of fun. We're like, dang, we gotta go get those dang kids ruin all the fun. Right. Parties are. We're like, how much can we squeeze in? We got 12 hours. Go, go, go, go, go. You know, we tend to do a lot. We're like, we gotta do everything. We gotta go to breakfast and lunch and brunch and uh, you know.

SPEAKER_01 26:13

But that's so sweet. It's so sweet. Yeah. Dating your spouse is so important.

SPEAKER_00 26:19

It's so fun.

SPEAKER_01 26:21

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 26:22

It is it is really, really fun. You know, it doesn't have to be like we went to a nice restaurant, but it doesn't have to be like anything. We could have gone for a bike ride and uh had a beer, or you know, whatever it is, it's just the point is doing something that like we like to do together. So I don't know. I tell you, marriages work, it's worth it, but marries at work.

SPEAKER_01 26:42

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 26:43

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_01 26:44

It's w it's worth it when it works out.

SPEAKER_00 26:48

It's always worth it because you do learn, right? Like you learned a ton from your first marriage. You learned a ton about yourself. You raised an amazing kid together, and you know, like there's always things that you can pull from it. I mean, I think about the the dude I dated before Jeff, before I met my husband. Like there's still good that came from every relationship that you're in. And I think you have to reflect on that. And good and bad, right? That that self-reflection piece of like, I can draw both. I can draw the lessons, and I can take the good stuff with me too, right? Made me a better human on some level. Mm-hmm. For sure. For sure.

Playful Tools To Break Tension

SPEAKER_01 27:32

There we go. That's my words. Next time we get steamy. Yeah, next time we get steamy. Fun story. I don't know. We um we sometimes go down to Key West just because it's a fun, quirky place. Um makes you feel like you're far away, even though you're still kind of close. And Jeff and I um like to ride tandem bicycles. So it's an amazing trust exercise, by the way. If you've never done this, it is a hundred percent a trust exercise. It's hysterical. Um it is, yes, and we absolutely love it. We have one now at our house. We we bought one because we love it so much. It's ridiculous. Um, but this year they gave me a little um, it's a parrot, a real colorful parrot that, you know, I just use it to like squawk at people or to like honk whenever we were kind of like, you know, on our bike going through freaking Key West. Um, and so I liked it so much, I was like, I think I'm gonna get this thing. And so on my purse right now is actually like the piece that goes on the handlebar attached with this big old parrot. And mind you, my I mean, it is weighs like a pound and a half that is on there. And so every time that I say that, you know, every time that Jeff starts to get fussy with me, I squawk the ball game. So I'll just just nice reminding. Right. Yeah, it could squawk.

Where To Find Us Next

SPEAKER_00 28:53

When the kids were little, we used to do a lot of nerf gun battles. There were times like we'd be just irritated with each other and we'd get those nerf guns out, and like there's something just about like belting, you know. I don't know if that was healthy or not, but you know, by the end of it, you can you're not mad anymore. I think that's all I got for this week. We gotta, if you haven't checked out our website, it rocks because Sarah rocks and stays on top of it. So check out thelesspodcast.com, check us out on social media at Lila's Podcast. And of course, share, like, comment, give us some stars, whatever you want to do to acknowledge uh the Lila's podcast. We always appreciate you. Thank you for all 10,000 downloads. Whoop whoop. 51.

SPEAKER_01 29:39

51 countries. I looked it up while we were on the 51 country.

SPEAKER_00 29:43

51. That's so sick. Um, we're not stopping anytime soon, so reach out, chat, share, like, do all the things, guys. Until next week. Liless. We're out.