Making Bikepacking Feel Like It's For Everyone: Claire Sharpe

This week’s episode features a really thoughtful conversation with Claire Sharpe, a mountain bike instructor, community builder, and the founder of the Bristol Rally. It's a great listen if you’re curious about bikepacking, interested in community-led events, or if you’ve ever talked yourself out of an adventure because you thought you weren’t “ready” yet.

In this episode, we talk about:

• Coming to cycling later in life and learning by doing
• How community can be a gateway into bike adventure
• Claire’s journey into mountain bike instruction and coaching with empathy
• Why lived experience matters when helping others build confidence
• The Bristol Rally and how it’s designed to feel welcoming and accessible
• Breaking down barriers through inclusive event design
• Route planning, rights of way, and riding with confidence in the UK
• Misadventures, muddy trails, hike-a-bike moments, and why they become the best stories
• Why you don’t need to be “fit enough” before starting

All Terre (Claire’s website): https://allterre.net/

The Bristol Rally: https://allterre.net/the-bristol-rally/

Follow Claire and her bikepacking projects via the links below:

Instagram: @ClaireSharpe, her website - All Terre. 

Check out her event - The Bristol Rally

Check out Old Man Mountain's new Manzanita Handlebar Cradle 

Transcript

 No, I can't think of anything that's been an actual disaster because I think I tend to just think of them as ridiculous. This weekend, me and my partner were out and we'd ridden through this forest and I knew it was gonna be a terrible muddy mess 'cause it can be in the summer. I was just giggling the whole way as we were slopping and sliding through this mud, barely getting any traction.

And then we came across a tree that was down, but it wasn't just a tree that was down, it was like a big tree. And so we kind of had to like lift our bikes and post them through between branches and like get over. But I think that's one thing I really love about riding off road. Like you just have to be adaptable and those things are interesting.

They're the bits that make the memories, I think, because something like that. But you survived it and I think that's really where like the fun and the magic is. 'cause you've just made your way through this completely ridiculous thing. 

Welcome to Seek Travel Ride, where we share the stories and experiences of people taking amazing adventures by bike, whether it's crossing state borders, mountain ranges, countries, or continence.

We want to share that spirit of adventuring on two wheels with our listeners.

Hello listeners. I'm your host Bella Molloy, and I'm pretty stoked to be welcoming Claire Sharpe as our guest for today's episode of Seek Travel Ride. Now Claire really got into riding during COVID and like a lot of people, she quickly found herself hooked into this big world of bikes, trails, and adventure.

She's since taken on some awesome bike packing trips of her own in pretty dreamy locations around the world, and has also turned her passion for riding bikes into her job where she's now level three mountain bike instructor, helping to give people extra confidence by building up the skills they need to get out riding trails.

What really stands out to me though is how much time and energy Claire also puts into building a solid community around bike adventures. She's the founder of Altair runs events like the Bristol Rally, as well as skills workshops and social rides. Now, these are the kinds of things which genuinely help remove barriers for people and make riding feel more accessible.

In turn, it's giving people the confidence to try out new things and take on their own bike adventures. Now, personally, community has become one of the biggest highlights for me through hosting this podcast. Seeing how many friendships, trips, and conversations have sprung up around it has honestly been one of the best parts.

So getting to speak with someone who is actively creating that kind of environment in the bike adventure space, super interests me. Today I wanna be exploring more about Claire's experience with community building, why instruction and fostering inclusive events help shift the culture of a sport and how events like the Bristol Rally are helping more people feel welcome and excited about taking their own outdoor bike adventures.

Claire Sharpe, a big warm welcome to the show. 

Hey, thanks for having me. 

Oh, I'm super pumped to be speaking with you, Claire there, uh, in the evening, in your time, almost at the end of winter. Hopefully you are pumped about bike Adventures to come. 

I'm so ready. 

Claire, I've got a stack of questions for you, uh, and I can't wait to get into them, but the question I start my show with and I ask it of all my guess is Claire, do you remember the very first bike you ever rode?

I do. Um, it was a hand me down from one of my older sisters and it was a rally apple and it was a little red bike and it had, um. Like a cream plastic guard around the chain and the chain ring. And I remember thinking it was really cool 'cause it was my big, one of my big sister's bikes. 

And did you ever go riding with your big sister as well?

No. No. There's like a bit of a gap between me and my next two sisters. So by the time I had it, they were far too cool to be riding bikes with me. 

But also I feel like, and, and look, maybe I'm wrong and I've said this a few times on the pod before in Australia, we ride bikes when we're little kids and then we get to a stage where we're sort of like early teens and riding bikes isn't what we do anymore.

And then we learn how to drive a car and then that's it. And some of us come into riding bikes again. Do you feel that's a bit the same where you grew up in the uk? 

Yeah, definitely. I also grew up in a village as well, but a lot of my friends lived in town so I was very quick to be like, I need my driving license 'cause I need to be over there where all of my friends are all the time.

And it definitely. At the time, I didn't think it was a sensible cycling distance. 

How far was it? 

Uh, maybe like 20 k. I mean, it wouldn't be like a regular commuting ride. 

No. But also you, you've gotta pair that up with what you want to do at that age as well. And look, I don't want to assume, but a lot of people will say late teens, early twenties, you know, they wanna meet up with their friends, go out for a bit doing that, and then riding 20 Ks home.

I can see the barrier there a little bit too. It might be something we would happily do. Now, does your family still live in that little village? 

They don't, but they, my little sister lives one village over, so I still go back to that area quite often. 

Oh, and so you are in Bristol and I, I mentioned the Bristol rally in my intro and Bristol's a place that I've actually never been to.

I've lived in the UK before, but I've never ventured over there. So I want you to actually tell me a little bit about Bristol. If I was to go to Bristol, other than riding the Bristol rally, what should I seek out? 

Well, Bristol is kind of like the perfect mix, I think. So I was planning on moving away from Bristol 'cause I thought I'd outgrown it until I found bikes.

But now I realize that it's just the perfect cycling city, which is why we've got such a thriving culture. 

You really do. 

Yeah. Uh, to the point where when I go to other cities, I'm like, oh, it's not normal to ride in a group of 20 women on a random weekday morning. But you can totally do that in Bristol.

Whereas, um, I suppose it's the mix of like, so the city, it's just big enough to not know everything that's happening. So it makes it feel big. It could be London size, it could be smaller. You just don't know 'cause you don't know what you don't know. So there's really great music, food, culture, art. It's quite pretty 'cause it's got the river running through it.

So there's this space that can't be claimed by buildings, which I really like. But then in 10, 15 minutes on a bike, you're in the countryside. So there's mountain bike trails just like 10 minutes out of town. They're amazing. But then the countryside is different in every direction. So you can choose what flavor of off-road you wanna ride by which way you ride out of the city.

And if you want to, you can ride over the bridge and into Wales. 

Oh gosh, I love that line. What a sentence. You can ride over the bridge and into Wales, which I imagine means that terrain gets increasingly lumpier and uh, steeper as you go. 

Yeah, yeah. It's a, Wales is like a really beautiful mix of surprisingly well manicured tarmac roads, even in quite remote places.

But then really stunning. Like mountains and hills and all sorts of terrain. It's great. 

I've gotta say, I, I never, if you asked me to describe what I think the road service in Wales would be like, I never would've thought, you know, manicured tarmac would've been part of the sentence there. I would've just thought the, the roads would be just as rugged as I found them and say in Scotland.

Oh yeah. It's pretty good. Pretty good. And that's why, so for the grander part of the Tour de France, the men's race, the third stage is just basically from the north to the south of Wales. 

Oh, that is gonna be an absolutely stunning stage to watch too, actually. 

Yeah. 

The women are riding, they're riding through Yorkshire and stuff, aren't they?

Oh, that's gonna be absolutely mega. I wanna know, then you talk about the diversity of cycling options and stuff in Bristol. I mentioned in my intro, you sort of came into the world of bike adventures about six years ago with riding during COVID. Tell me all about that. 

Yeah, so before COVID I played and coached Roller Darby.

Oh my gosh. 

And I absolutely loved it. 

I need to pause you there. I need to find out about Roller. Sorry. Sorry. Listeners, tangent. Okay. Tell me all about that because I have, I viewed awesome people doing roller derby. Like how long were you in roller derby for? I 

think probably about six years. So I took that when I was 30.

I just saw a game and was like, I wanna do that. So found a place in Bristol where the team was training and they did start a session, so it was really easy to feed in and just started learning how to roller skate. 

Oh, wow. So did you not know how to roller skate before? 

No, no. The first session I went to, and it was really like telling this story because as a coach people were like, huh.

But, um, the first session I went to, you put your roller skates on in the hallway, and then you get to the edge of where the hall begins, and then the floor goes from carpet, which is very slow rolling and feels a bit secure. And then you go through the door and it's a nice smooth wooden floor. Great for roller skating, but like someone had to hold my hand and like wheel me in.

'cause I really couldn't roller skate at all. 

Oh, this would be me. It takes me back actually to when I, um, I tried to learn how to ski when I was in my mid twenties. I'd moved to a part of Australia that was close to the ski resorts. And um, actually before I learned, tried to learn how to ski, I tried to learn how to snowboard for the fact that I didn't want my husband trying to teach me how to ski.

'cause I thought that could be a relationship breaker and maybe smart decision. We're still together now, but I do remember when I did get on skis, there was someone in our ski school class, this is all adults, sort of screamed out because, and she goes, oh my gosh, I'm sliding. And the the instructor said, skiing is about sliding.

If you don't wanna slide, don't try to ski. And I just thought, oh, but I can just imagine that sort of pensiveness of having to try something new. And I guess you mentioned there about being a coach, so you sort of. Have that empathy of what it might be like for people taking your mountain bike skills on, I imagine?

Yeah. Yeah. I suppose it felt like I'd already done this thing where I fell in love with it so much that I was coaching it then that went away. But I don't, when I first started cycling, that wasn't like at all in my mind, I was just busy falling in love with this new cool thing. 

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So let's go back to that.

I, I halted you at roller derby, so, okay. Roller derby was something you did. COVID came around. What got you on Two wheels on a bike. 

So roller derby, for anyone who doesn't know is a full contact sport, played in indoors, so solid, no for COVID. So with that gone, I was like, oh my goodness. I normally spend like six plus hours a week on roller skates.

And it was really fun. And I describe it as accidental fitness. 

Mm. 

So it become part of my routine that by doing this thing that I found immensely fun. So I just happened to became a person that enjoyed exercise because the thing I found fun was exercise. 

Yeah. 

So in COVID I started just like running out of desperation because I didn't know what else to do, but I really dislike running.

So it wasn't long-term, it wasn't gonna work for me. 

I still think I've never seen someone look happy when they're running. Uh, but, but I'm sure there are happy runners out there. Listeners. Maybe you are happy runners. But, um, gosh, it, it, it always just looks miserable. 

I mean, to be fair, it has changed now because I've discovered offroad running.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 

I, running, who knew? Not into road cycling love offroad. I just had to take my trainers off road. Mm. And that's hilarious and slippery and ridiculous. Just like mountain biking. 

I default to hiking, but that's just 'cause I'm not a runner anyway. I can start seeing running's not doing for you, but you do love exercise.

I can start seeing the natural progression here onto discovering a bike again. 

Yeah. And I'd been. Skiing a few times with my roller derby team, and it basically made me realize that I like going down hills in really pretty places quite fast. Mm. So I didn't commit to getting a mountain bike, but I didn't think road cycling was gonna cut it for me.

So I thought I'd go for the happy middle and get a gravel bike. Mm. 

Okay. And so going from getting the gravel bike and then you are in Bristol for COVID, I'm imagining 

mm-hmm. 

Is that then all of a sudden, okay, you're trapping into bridal ways and discovering where you can take your, your gravel bike off road to get that little bit of enjoyment?

Yeah, pretty much. So I just started finding out where I could ride it. And looking to see what other people have been doing, how were they finding out where to ride? And then I found a group that were meeting up to go for rides as well. So I decided to go along to one of them. And it was a Wednesday night, so it was D quite dark, it was raining, it was cold.

And I went to a park on my own to meet a bunch of men, which sounds like a terrible idea, but actually I met some really amazing people that I still ride bikes with now. And that was kind of the beginning of me falling in love with it really. 'cause then rather than it becoming this solo thing of just looking at everything online and slowly learning and then had this really ramshackle but wonderful group of people who we could all just like share and learn stuff really quickly together.

Yeah. Okay. And so you are gravel biking there, but you're a mountain bike instructor. So how did that happen? 

Um, I think just the more and more I rode, I suppose you start to realize when you cycle more the things that you really love. And what I really love is super janky technical riding, and even better if I can be fast on it.

So my tires just got chunkier, my pressure got lower. My, um, first fancy gravel bike was actually very mountain bike geometry, really slack, top tube. And then I had the chance to ride a mountain bike and I just loved it. 

Mm. And 

so I did a mountain bike guiding course with some friends who run a community in the new forest called the New Forest Off Road Club and loved it.

And that kind of just unlocked mountain biking for me. So we wanted to get qualifications so we could guide the gravel rides that we were already doing. But there wasn't one that fit the bill then. So we did level two mountain bike and loved it, but I loved it so much that I carried on to do my level three and just fell more and more in love with mountain biking, and now it's gone one step further and now I deliver.

Courses to train mountain bike guides. 

Have you somehow figured out in the courses and the skill sessions that you deliver, how to get a little bit of that excitement for steep junkie technical, going fast stuff into other people? 'cause I, I've tried mountain biking. I've had some really shitty, crappy crashes.

I've had some shitty, crappy injuries. And now I have, like I, someone actually said they think I have PTSD from it because I, I have super anxiety now going downhill. I love single track that gently goes uphill. Absolutely hate it when it's about three or 4% and more sustained downhill for ages and ages and ages.

Like, it's just, have you had people like me come up to your courses and then you've been able to magically see them, just get that excitement and, and unlock that fear? 

Um, I think it's all about baby steps and it's, it's happened to me as well where I haven't mountain bike for a while. Or I was mountain biking with people where I was being pushed too hard every time I rode my mountain bike.

And I think your sense of nervous system learns that like, oh, we're doing this thing. This is the thing that terrifies me. 

Yeah. 

Um, and I had to take a step back and not ride with them anymore. You riding that allowed me to feel confident so that I could start to build that back up again and get back to where I was before, but not in a way where I felt like I was desperately hanging on.

Yeah. In a way where I was getting pleasure from the experience 

instead. Oh my gosh. Like, just hearing you say that, Claire, in my mind I'm going, I can resonate with this because I can't tell you the amount of times I would turn up to go mountain biking and then I would finish the ride feeling like I survived.

Yeah. As opposed to feeling like an ob absolute high. I wasn't that, you know, section wasn't that, you know, particular track. Awesome. It was like, oh, thank God I didn't fall off. I didn't crash. Like it was like a survivor thing. 

Mm. 

And I now pretty much, there's a few single trails that are super mellow.

People could ride 'em on a gravel bike. That's how mellow they are. You know, there's no, there's no drop offs, there's no tree route or anything like that. And I do those. But if I ride off road now, it pretty much is just big fire roads and nothing super technical. I haven't magically found my way into taking the step to, I guess, pushing myself into what I know Will, will gimme the heebie-jeebies a bit.

Mm. Yeah. That's really hard. I mean, I don't really coach like highly technical mountain biking. I do more like beginner, flowy, happy play stuff because. That's, I suppose for me when like you get to see people have that Aha 

Yeah. 

Moment where they're like, oh my, I'm falling in love with this and I love that.

Yeah. 

But also I think like the foundational skills. No matter how long you've been riding for, you can always make them better. Like, I would love for someone to just make me the best person at cornering ever. But I feel like cornering is just like a forever learning skill. It could always be better, always be smoother, like, yeah.

Yeah. It's funny. And it's all sort of like looking through the corner. I remember it was someone I used to ride with in Australia many years ago. He was a mounted by instructor too, Craig, and this is a very Australian thing to tell someone, but he was saying when you're going through like a, a switchback or or a corner listeners that I guess turns on itself, he was saying approach the corner, look at it in the middle, and then pretend you've just spotted a kangaroo that's jumped right through and then keep looking at the kangaroo to keep turning your head.

And I remember that's, I, I still think of that now, but sorry Craig. I'm still pretty shit at cornering, 

but I think a lot of that stuff is transferrable. Like so many different things as well. So with roller derby and like, so I did ramp skating as well in skate parks. And it is all to do with like, you know, whatever your head is doing, your body is gonna follow.

Like, if you try and do a 360 jump without turning your head, your body is gonna be like, no, I'm not coming. 

Yeah, yeah, 

yeah. But if you feel even slightly nervous, but you can just convince yourself to, if you're gonna throw anything, throw your head around and then your body's like, okay, we're coming too.

Yeah. It's sort of like that adage of don't look at what you don't want to hit. Yeah. Like, um, if you focus on the rock or the pothole or the tree, all of a sudden that's what you're aiming for. You sort of gotta look around at. And it is funny, Claire, 'cause I know the theory, I know I know exactly what to do.

It's just, yeah, there's sort of like a, a slight disconnect. Let's move away from me and talk more about you here. If you were to default magically. To do a ride that gives you the most sort of energy. What bike are you taking? Where are you going? 

Oh, I'm a hundred percent taking a hard tail. 

Mm. 

So it'd be my canyon Exceed.

She's called Christina Agra. Delia. 

Love it. 

Yeah. They've all got names, but yeah, she is just my dream bike. I just, if I haven't ridden that bike for a while, I'm like, oh, maybe I don't like it. And then I get on it and I'm like, no, this is the bike. Even for a road ride and the ride. Oh, so hard to choose. I think we're gonna go, it's been topical at the moment, so I'm gonna go with the Torino.

Nice rally. But specifically towards the end, there's a section called the Salt Road. Yes. The Via Desai. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. So good that on a fully loaded hard tail. So much fun. 'cause the extra weight just holds you glued to the ground so you can just descend like a monster truck and your wheels are just staying where you put them and it feels really good.

Oh my gosh, I love this because, um, Torino nice rally is, is very high on my own little personal bucket list. I remember Kamut did the women's rally in Torino Nice rally. And I talked myself out of it stupidly. Oh, because, yeah, just 'cause I was just, and this is just the fear. Oh no, how am I gonna go on the gravel?

If there's downhill gravel? I'm just gonna be a baby about it and it's gonna be horrible. Which is like a big regret of mine not doing it. But it's still high up there because it just, it's mountains and it's rugged and it's, it's not super, super accessible. I'll be in Italy and sometimes and have some great coffee at a Gio maybe.

But, but also just, just those epic landscapes. You might know what I mean. You know, when you see mountains and in the distance you see the silhouette layering of mountain after mountain and all those roads. But yeah, that, that salt road that I have seen, I've, I might, I can't tell you how many times I've just put Torino nice rally as a hashtag into Instagram and just, you know, won lusted my way through it.

So I, because Did you do it on the Ute Women's rally? 

No, I didn't. I did it the year after the first Ute Women's rally, but as part of the normal Torino nice rally. And it was really interesting 'cause at the start got chatting to this guy and he was saying like, oh, don't you think it's a shame that Kamut are doing another women's only rally in a week?

And he is like, those women could be here. And I asked him, do you know how many women were here last year? Or like before the commute women's rally was set up, like, do you know how many women normally came? I was like, it's it's about four. 

Yeah. 

I was like, there's 12 women at the start this year. Yeah. And it's 'cause we all saw the women's cam commute rally.

It's like, so you should be thanking it, not lamenting it. Because I imagine the year after there'll be more and there'll be more, 'cause more of us will watch it unfold on social media and be like, damn, I wanna go there. 

Yeah. And 

then come and rock up. 

You'll have people like me who've got FOMO for like giving up the opportunity to go there.

Yeah, no, you're right. And it is that very cliched thing of, if you can see it, you can do it. But it is just so true. Like if you, if you champion the stories and actually show what's possible, people actually see it for themselves. I wanna derail this pod for a little bit and just keep talking about Torino.

Nice rally because uh, selfishly I wanna do it myself. So you are on a hard tail for that. 

Mm-hmm. 

I think if I'm correct. There's a few little variations you can choose for yourself as well, isn't there? Like you can choose to do some sections or skip and cut across, isn't there? 

Yeah, so I think even more have been added now.

When I did it, there were three more off-road diversions you could take. So me and my partner at the time took the first two of them. We didn't take the last one. 

Yeah. Okay. Why was that? Was it just by the end of it you were ready to, to not bother with it or 

Can't remember why we were having a great time.

Yeah. So maybe it was like weather or something. 

Yeah. Did you hit some bad weather? 

We, there was only one day where there was bad weather really? We had already sorted out, descending off a mountain. So we descended off into mist and then booked into a hotel, and then there was thunder and lightning and rain.

And we were very happy with our decision. 

Oh gosh. Yeah. As someone who lives in the mountains, um, for half the year I have experienced that lovely fickle mountain weather and it all starts, well, the worst weather I've experienced sometimes actually starts on a blue sky day, and then there's like a little poofy cloud, and then that cloud gets bigger and bigger and then darker and grayer, and then all of a sudden it can be 30 minutes and the, the blue sky is now thunder and lightning.

Very, very frightening me. And how many days did you take to do the Torino East rally? Because you can, like, some people almost race it. Some people it's a rally you can choose in a way. Yeah. Your own adventure from that perspective in terms of time. 

Yeah. So we did it in six days, I think. Yeah. 

You'd go back there then obviously you said you'd go back there.

Yeah, I didn't think I would when I finished it because I was like, oh, it's all, I've gotta go see new places. Mm. I can't do the same thing again and again. But actually the more trips I've done, there's just nothing that has been like it. So I would go back again because it was absolutely stunning. And even just do the really hard hiker bike sections again.

Yeah. 

Because they were worth it. 

It's interesting 'cause I often think with the hiker bike stuff, like I'm a big advocate that, and, and we would differ here, I'm pretty sure like. I like riding my bike, not necessarily taking it for a hike. 

Mm-hmm. 

The times where I don't mind hiking a bike is if it unlocks an area that I otherwise would not be able to get to.

But if there is another option that could get me to that area and I don't have to hike a bike and maybe I have to ride an extra 10 or 15 kilometers, I'm all for riding instead of hiking. What about you then? You, you are a hiker bike, do that type of stuff. 

I wasn't, 

mm. 

And I found it incredibly hard on the Torino.

Nice rally. Yeah. To do that because I hadn't done that before. Everything, I couldn't have been rideable for me. So then pushing this loaded bike on something that was completely unrideable was really tough. And actually for the second section, I had to turn around to my ex and just say, I'm gonna set a timer on my watch and I'm gonna cry for three minutes.

Just to get it all out. 

Oh, 

and then we'll start the hiker bike, because I'd realized that it was gonna be like five kilometers of pushing my bike over rocks. So I had my three minute cry and then I was like, right, I'm Go now. 

It takes a real different mental perspective to get into the zone for that as well.

I, I recently took a little mini adventure off road and it was a last minute decision to take on a different route. So mentally I was not prepared for the enormity and the massive amounts of hiker biking at that route involved. And I just had like a real crappy, miserable time. Mm. Then with the benefit of hindsight, I would actually go back there now, because mentally I could prepare myself for knowing that we'll actually, you know, there's gonna be some hiker bike sections and there's gonna be some sections where I'm probably gonna be walking more than I'm actually turning pedals for a few hours, but mentally I can prep for that.

The unknown aspect of it. Oh my God. Like, 'cause did you know about this before you'd gotten to that section? 

I did, but I hadn't anticipated how un rideable and uncomfortable to push my bike on that section. It would be, and I think seeing that it would involve bits of lifting as well as pushing. I was just like, ugh.

The thing that defeats me sometimes, Claire, is I can, I can get with the fact of I'm pushing it uphill. It's when I'm the one with not great skills that has to then hike a bike downhill that other on sections that a lot of other people could ride. And so then I don't feel like I even get the payoff sometimes.

Like to go up here so you can enjoy that descent. Doesn't apply to me. Is there a lot of hiker bike sections on the Torino? Nice. 

No. No there aren't. And they are optional. So the first one that we did, uh, colder Peace. The road option is to go colder Finera instead. No. Is it cold? No Colder Isard. Everyone goes up Finera, which is.

Mad and amazing and wonderful 

everyone. A lot of people claim it's one of the best climbs in the world, actually. 

Yes. It's insane. 

Mm-hmm. 

When you are on it, just like looking back and looking around, it doesn't feel real. It's really cool. 

Mm-hmm. 

But yeah, so everyone else did cold wizzard, which is a road climb, but it was a hundred percent worth it.

Like loose slidey rock pushing up on one side. So really hard work, but the descent off the other side was just phenomenal. 

Mm. 

And I did have that little panic. I'm like, oh my God, what if we get to the top and I can't ride down? I was like, then I cry. But it was fine. 

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 

But it starts off as single track, but not technical.

Yep. 

Gradually the turns get wider and wider, and then that turns into double track, and then you cross over a little river and that turns into Forest Road, and then it turns into a little lane. So it just, you're just descending for like 20 odd kilometers 

and it just keeps leveling up. 

Yeah. Yeah. It's becoming more and more, you're getting closer and closer to civilization.

And then where the root converges, again, you realize you're in Italy and the converge writer, a really great pizza restaurant, so then you're in this tiny town ordering pizza, and then other people on the rally who you haven't seen since yesterday, all just start popping in and it's really lovely. 

Well, actually, I wanna talk about the rally component of it.

I mean, actually no. Firstly, I have to always mention food on the pod in some respects. So how can I got go there? Can you remember what pizza you had? 

Oh, I had a lot of pizzas. So I can't remember, but I remember them all being delicious. 

Yeah, pizza in Italy is amazing. Actually, I must say pizza in France is amazing too.

They, they do some different combinations. Um, but I was always surprised when we moved to France just how prevalent pizza seems to be there. But I, I have to take it back though. Like, ending a descent at a, at a pizzeria. Oh my gosh. What place? What place? 

Yes. 

The rally component though, that's obviously something that has stuck with you.

I know you've done a few rallies, like participated, and now you host one yourself. What is it about the rally specifically that you really enjoyed and, and what elements of a rally do you want to sort of shout from the rooftops to people? If you, if you had to tell someone why join a rally, what would you say?

I think it would be that you will meet people. 

Mm. 

And it will all be fine. I think that's the hardest thing to impress upon people if they haven't done one before. I feel like everything before, before a big bike ride is the hardest bit. Yeah, you're right. All of the nerves, the anxiety, the planning, that's when you give yourself a million reasons not to do it.

Once you are there and pedaling all of that just kind of goes away. 

Yeah. 

So I think just like pushing through all of that and getting to the start, first off, and I dunno how it does it, but every rally I've been on and every edition of the Bristol Rally, you can turn up on your own and you will find people to talk to and you will find people to ride with and people to camp with because everyone else wants to do the same thing too.

They haven't, I mean, maybe a few people have. Come there to show off how great they are at riding a bike. But no one else is there for that reason. So they just end up looking a bit silly. Um, no one wants to hang out with them anyway and then everyone else just wants to hang out and have a great time with other people who like doing the same weird things that they like doing.

Yeah. And it is that sort of like, if I think back on it, I've still got great friends that I met at, well, I've not done a rally, so if I was to equate it, because something you said there, actually, if I wind back, something you said there really struck with me how the nerves go away when you start peddling.

I have found with things that I have done, a lot of the nerves are in the lead up and then sometimes that's where like, can I actually do this? And that's your own self-talk. But sometimes even the signup, the registration and the before you start, like at the start, like. Pre-start, that can be the most nervous time as well.

Like the real nerve wracking. Yeah. Because you see how other people have turned up. You think, oh gosh, did I make the right decision here? Is my bike gonna be right? Did I overpack? Did I under pack? Ooh, they look really fit. Or you know, it's all those sort of doubts come in. 

Yeah. 

Is that something that you've had before and I guess to equate it into a better question, how do you address that side of things at the Bristol rally?

Um, I've definitely had that. 

Mm. 

I think everyone has really, unless you've got God-like levels of self-confidence, good 

on you. Power 

to, if you 

do. Yeah. 

So yeah, I've definitely like scanned a start line and just been like, oh my God, everyone looks so pro. Even though you are probably wearing the same kit or something, you've just decided that everyone else must be more pro and it's really hard to fight through that.

It's always worth it when you do. And I always think that like things, how's the word? Things are always way more sweeter if something bitter has happened. So like if you've had to push through something to get to a place, then it makes the really good feeling feel amazing. Whereas if everything was just lovely all the time, then that would just, even out to everything, just feeling normal, push through that horrible moment to then have the really amazing moments.

Um, and it's that combination of things that's really good as well, I think. I think. Um, so you are like training people to become guides. One of the things we talk about is transformational leadership and it's like. How can you create a space where someone is challenged but just enough to challenge them but they can still succeed, so that then you create a moment where transformation can happen.

Mm. 

And I think it's about like creating those moments for yourself as well. Like how can I challenge myself so that I know I can grow from this experience? And it probably means pushing through something uncomfortable. And a lot of the time that is just even getting to the point where you started peddling your bike.

Everything after that does just kind of feel way easier. But everything up to that moment's so tough. 

Yeah. It really, it takes me back if I think of stuff. I've done myself. I remember I did an ultra in France, in Normandy. Oh my gosh, my goodness. It'll be four years ago now that, that's hard. We just, you know.

Anyway, that's when it was. Haven't done one since. And I wonder why. But I remember there were two things that stuck out in my mind about the start line and let's not go into the anxiety. I had training for it for months beforehand, but I remember going there and it was one where you had to connect eight checkpoints and it was a free route.

You, you figured out how to do it. There's a logical order, but you could go, it was all around Normandy, so you could go clockwise or anti-clockwise. That was up to you, but you were sort of smart in looking at how the weather was. And I was too scared to bivy. Like that was a step too far outta my comfort zone.

So I was going to be in hotels and I didn't realize this at the time, but the event also took in a French public holiday, which fell on a Thursday. And I didn't know I was a really new in France, so I didn't know that when a holiday in France falls, it takes them so 

seriously. 

Yeah. But when it, when it falls on a Thursday, a lot of like office type businesses and a lot of people in France will also take the Friday off and, and this is the same for a Tuesday.

They'd take the Monday off and they call it the punt. And I didn't realize also that a lot of Parisians choose Normandy to go on their holiday. And so what that meant was that my hotels were a really far distant, like I was really limited on where I could stay. There were no other options. And I was locked into having to go the way that I chose.

'cause I couldn't just go, oh, go the other way. So I was gonna go clockwise. I go to sign up. First of all, it's all men pretty much. At the sign up and then we are sort of chatting and in my broken French, I say, oh yeah, no, I'm, I'm not vying and I'm going clockwise 'cause of the wind. And they go, no, you've gotta go the other way.

The wind has changed. And I'm like, well I can't. He goes, well you're not gonna finish. Like that is what they told me. And I remember going back to my car where my husband was helping me to get my bike ready and I'm saying I was nearly in tears like I should be going the other way and I can't, and I dunno how I'm gonna get this distance, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

And then I remember when you said, everyone looks so pro. I remember looking at it going, I don't belong here. And then I saw one person who's since become one of my dearest friends, Stevie, she's an awesome person who lives in Frankfurt in Germany. And she was there and I remember thinking, gosh, she's got it so switched on.

She's gonna be amazing. And we sort of. Had a great little friendship spawn from that. She's gone on and done bigger, amazing things. She did TCR last year. She's, she's, she's doing amazingly, but I remember she was going the same way I was going and then thinking, well, she can do it. I can do it. So it was sort of like I had that discomfort and I had to push through it.

And I did finish by the way. So I did, did pretty well. But yeah, I can just really, you what you said just takes me right back there. It is amazing when we reflect on those sort of things, like it, sometimes you, you sort of think it's silly how we think about stuff in the time, like in hindsight. But in the moment it's, it's totally normal to be nervy, right?

Yeah. And even though that's happened to you and then, you know. From experience that actually that's not the case and everything's gonna be fine. And then the next event you go to your brain puts you right back in that space again of just like, oh, no, no. But this time everyone is really pro. Mm. And you have to be like, shut up brain, it's gonna be fine.

Yeah, 

yeah, yeah, yeah. And like, yeah, no, you're right. And it's sort of, gosh, it is amazing how we do that. Oh, I wish we could unlock that skill where we can just turn that, that inner voice off and uh, maybe turn into those really super overconfident people we were talking about who turned up. Oh yeah. We're gonna it.

Yeah. 

I'd love bit of that. 

What prompted you to start Bristol Rally? 

Um, I think I just loved the rallies. I'd been in so much that I wanted to bring a bit of that back home. 

Mm. 

I said before that Bristol's got really great riding and a really thriving. Cycling community. There's all different kinds of riding.

So many people, so many women, like new communities still popping up, but there wasn't really many things that invite people from outside of Bristol to come in as well. Mm. So I set myself this challenge of, right, I'm gonna make a rally and it's gonna have all these great wholesome feels that I love from the rallies I've done.

I'm like, but I'm gonna show off why it's so good to ride here, and it's gonna feel like a holiday for someone from Bristol. But it'll have loads of interesting stuff on it. So it'll make people who don't live in Bristol wanna come and do it. 

Oh, so tell me about some of those elements, like this year's rally, like tell me about it.

Yeah, so it's a fixed route, 300 kilometers over three days, and I call it the best of the Southwest. So we head down to Cheddar Gorge, which is like a, a famous road climb. So it's like nice for people to tick that off. And then it goes across to Wells Cathedral and through Longley, which is a famous British like old estate that has a safari park on it now.

So you climb up through there and you see camels 

in, in their natural habitat,

and then it goes across the Wessex Ridgeway, which is stunning through to Stonehenge. And it's the, it's always on the summer solstice weekend. So there's lots happening at Stonehenge. Then over Salisbury Plain, which I think is Europe's largest live military training area. So there's two routes at that point.

So there's one for if the red flags are up, which means 

shootings on. Yeah. 

Yeah. And one for if they're not, but annoyingly every year so far the flags have been up during the rally weekend. So I think I'm the only one that's ridden the version for when there is no military training. 

Oh, well, fingers crossed for this year.

I know. They really do if they're not doing it. 

Yeah. 

Quite angry last year. 'cause it wasn't on their website as well, and then they just decided to do training that weekend. It's like, it's summer, guys have a weekend. It's fine 

putting it on the weekend of the solstice. That's by design, not by accident, I imagine.

And that's just like maximizing total amount of daylight for people. 

Yeah. Yeah. It's just another way to kind of make it feel. Less intimidating for people. 

Yeah, 

because you've got so much daylight that you may as well just spend it riding with nice people. 

I guess if we go back to the concept of a rally, everyone's turning up to ride the same route they, you're not obligated to ride with other people.

You probably will. You might make some new friends. You ride it at your own pace. Ultimately, is it a rally where you are camping or bing or are you in hotels or is that also something that's free for people to choose? 

That's free for people to choose, but before they get to the start line, they'll get a route briefing document and that includes information on where or how people chose to sleep last year, as well as good places to stop for resupply and any stretches where there might not be any.

Mm-hmm. 

People can ignore that if they want. It's definitely not exhaustive. So they're encouraged to do their own research, but it just helps people who are new to it to kind of learn and understand a bit about what I might look for if I was doing a longer route and to help me plan how I was gonna ride it.

We do a route planning workshop with commute so that then people can look at how they would split it up and how to use the software to do that and understand the route in the way it's supplied to them as well. 

Yep, yep, yep. 

And then for anyone that doesn't have access to bike packing bags, tailfin partner with us and they offer five sets of bike packing bags.

Completely free for anyone who wants to do it, but currently doesn't have bike packing bags. 

Oh, wow. That's, that's, and again, that's helping to break down barriers because I, you know, if I take you back to COVID times where you were saying you were getting into stuff and you had that meetup in a, what was it, in a park and it was just all men.

Yeah. But they were very, very fostering and, and you know, you obviously got you right into it. So they're awesome people. Yeah. Clearly I don't know them, but obviously they've helped you con continue on. 

Mm. 

But what you are really looking at doing is helping to make, really make events much more inclusive and more diverse as well.

Yeah. So, breaking down those barriers and stuff, can you talk me through. I guess in a way, if you think of very first rally you set up to now, what are the extra things that, that are being done? 

So for the Bristol rally, 50% of the tickets are ring-fenced for Flint riders. 

Awesome. 

Um, so that, I think I really love the commute women's rallies and they've been amazing.

But I'd also done a rally called the Pennine RFA Pennine Rally quite early on. And Louis, the guy who organizes that is done by a ballot. So he finds out what people's experiences, gender, sexuality, like all sorts of information, and then gave places to make sure that there was this really varied, interesting mix of people.

Mm. 

And I really enjoyed them. And I suppose like I want to create spaces and events where women feel super welcome to join women and marginalized genders. But to kind of show that that doesn't always need to be an exclusive space. 

Yeah, yeah. That, that it can coexist. Yeah. 

Yeah, definitely. 'cause that was my experience from doing those rallies.

Mm. 

So that's why Ring Fence tickets. And also Louis shared some really interesting information. He's quite open with it when he does presentations and things as well, and it all makes sense. But you do need to ringfence spaces if you want more women and marginalized genders at events, because you know they're more likely to be a primary caregiver.

They'll look for social proof before coming to an event. They might need to organize with other people, or they might wanna organize to go with someone. So if you always sell events out to the people who can put the money down the fastest, you are going to predominantly get men. 

Yeah. 

So by creating a delay and holding space for those people, they can still come.

Yeah, and I think you, you had a really valid point there as well, 'cause there's two, well there's a few aspects to it, but some that clearly spring to mind is that sort of primary caregiver, other responsibilities, also financial stuff as well. There is a gender pay gap. It's very, very real. It does actually, it is a barrier and it's one of those key things that if you are not in the minority, you don't see those barriers.

Like everything is fine. So you'll have someone who, who can afford to pay, who can afford to commit to a random weekend in three months. Yeah, sure, I'll go to that. But there are all these other things that, that stack up. And I'm not saying that there are, you know, men out there who don't have these barriers as well.

Some people do, but it is just a fact that they exist much more for women in marginalized genders. How has that been received? Like have you had, like, I like to think of our bike adventure space as a really open and welcoming and um, inclusive space. I know that it isn't a hundred percent there, but how has that aspect of doing that ring fencing stuff in the Bristol rally been received?

Generally it's been fine, but I think I've only had two bits of criticism about it. 

Mm. 

But I think everything I've done with Altair has been through a lens of making it seem more welcoming and inclusive for Flint riders. So by proxy it appeals to men as well, but who share those values. 'cause it's just like a clear message of like, Hmm, you're probably not gonna like this.

Mm-hmm. 

But I think one person, the best bit of criticism I had, and it's always from people who can't be bothered to read, and I put up about the tickets and then they said they thought it was terrible that I was letting biological men join the event. So then I got to have great pleasure in pointing out to them that 50% of the tickets were for anyone who wanted them.

So the event was very welcoming of biological men. 

Yeah. Uh, the, the people having to read part, never. Yeah. You, you can't assume people read anymore or, or ever do. Yeah. It's that whole thing of common sense being a superpower in, in a way. 'cause it doesn't feel so common anymore. But I think as an event organizer is a diversity of the event on show.

Like, do you see that with participants in the past and has that been increasing? 

Sorry, can you say that again? 

As an organizer, from the very first event you've done, and you've done a few since, have you seen amongst the participants there. A level of inclusivity perhaps and diversity amongst your participants?

Is that sort of increasing, like, you know, when we were talking about, you know, some events you go to, ultras are a really great example of this. You know, I went to my first Ultra, I think there were four women all up. Not much. I, I think if you, if you know, there's, it's quite common for a lot of ultras you might get five or 10% women.

Some do amazingly, some it's amazing. If they get 20%, for example, you know, TCR are trying to do heaps to try and get, you know, a hundred women on the TCR start line. And, and that is something that, you know, they gotta really work hard for. Do you see with your events a diversity amongst participants and have you seen that diversity grow?

Um, I think it's always, in terms of gender, it's always been pretty diverse, which is great. And so it's one thing that it isn't and I, I dunno how to fix that, but it's something I'm thinking. A lot at the moment is racially, it's not very diverse. 

Yeah. It's a, it's, it's the biggest one that comes to my mind.

Hugely. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. 

It's really interesting because I think actually in Europe we are really good at sexuality and gender awareness and making that the thing that we think about in terms of inclusivity. And then one of my previous jobs I worked, um, for a cycling encouragement platform. And we worked in Europe, New Zealand, Australia and the us.

And I kind of feel like in the US actually having ethnic diversity is super important and they're really hot on that. And I kind of, um, I've actually had some calls with some people in the US to be like, right, how do we break down that barrier? How do we share what we're doing? Or what are you doing that is working that I could be doing?

So yeah. That I don't know yet, but that's a, a really glaring inequality to me at the moment. 

Yeah, I see it heaps. Um, like at the host of this podcast, um, it was one of the things when I first created at Claire, I really wanted to advocate and show really champion women. For example, in my show, and it's one thing I'm really proud of, more than 50% of my guests are female, which is certainly not a percentage of the bike adventure community that we're unfortunately not represented at those levels.

But I took pause recently, um, I've just celebrated literally three years of running the pod, and I took pause to sort of go through. I've got like a, a little spreadsheet where I have all of my guests listed out and I have different, I guess, categories of how I could categorize people and you know, there's gender, there's sexuality, then there's type of bike adventures.

Are they bike packers? Are they cycle tours? Have they, you know, are they ultra cyclists? Are they ward record breakers? Are they riding continents, countries, whatever. And the thing that's given me pause in, in over 165 guests now that I've interviewed, there isn't really much racial diversity there at all.

You know, I can count on three fingers what my diversity people who aren't just white Caucasian. 

Yeah. 

And it's not that I'm not trying to seek those people out as guests. I'm, I'm really trying, but I'm still finding barriers there. 

Mm-hmm. 

I don't know the answer to that listeners, and I'm more open to welcoming and championing that.

I'd be really keen to hear what you are doing, Claire, and maybe team up and, and figure some stuff out with you. But yeah, it is a, it is a category that's really Sharpe in my mind as well. 

Yeah. 

Hmm. Oh, where do we go with that? How do you find that? Do you find that you are seeing it because Bristol rally is one thing that you do and we mentioned Altair.

Which you, which you run and you run other sort of social rides and events through that as well throughout the year. 

Mm-hmm. 

Do you see more racial diversity in those events? 

No. 

No, 

no. I think it's, yeah, just a, a general issue across all of the events. 

Mm. Yeah. Listeners, I'd be really keen. If you are hearing this and you've got ideas and thoughts and insights, please get in touch with me.

Let me know. Share some stuff with me. 'cause I, I'd love to in our community building and we've got such a great community here, and Claire, you've got an amazing community. I'd love to understand how we foster and make that more diverse in this space too. 

Yeah, for sure. 

Yeah. I sort of think of it back in my corporate days, you know, in the HR land, we'd, we'd workshop it and we'd get, you know, thought leaders in and, and we'd talk about it all.

But, you know, actually seeing the results of it is, is what you wanna see, you wanna see on your start line. More of that. 

Mm-hmm. 

I wanna go to what a typical week looks like for you, Claire, in your bike, adventure community space. What sort of things are you typically filled with? 

Well, I mean, at the moment it's quiet 'cause it's winter, so, um.

Not so many community rides at the moment. I'm just deep in rally prep because tickets go on sale on Monday. 

Ooh. So 

there's a lot of that. 

Yep. 

Which I'm really excited about. Um, so having some calls with sponsors, so Canyon and Ute, who've come on board this year, making plans with them, which is really exciting.

Getting some promotional materials out so that people actually know it's happening. Planning, uh, other events. So, have you heard of the, you must have, uh, breakaway Femmes. 

Oh my gosh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 

The directors are Australian, I think, 

but yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no, no. I know exactly what you're talking about.

Yeah. So I watched it last summer and fell in love with it. I was just like, this is. Amazing. These women are so cool. So just arranged a screening of it at, um, a big cinema in Bristol for just after International Women's Day. So been sorting that out. 

Oh, fantastic. 

And then setting up two courses to train mountain bike guides as well.

So one in the New Forest, um, one in the Peak district, uh, which will be really great. And then, yeah, I like once, once I've got to the other side of the Bristol rally tickets, then I'll start planning some community rides. 'cause they were a bit light on the ground last year. I did a lot of traveling. So this year I'm gonna do a lot of training, which will mean being at home more and so more community rides being back on and just showing off all of the best bits of riding we've got around here.

Yeah. Actually I think one of the community rides you did, I'm trying to think. Is there like, um, oh, is there like a, oh, I'm trying to think of the name of it. It's like a, a trash, um, like, like a picking up litter sort of ride. Am I, am I thinking of the right thing or? I have, I totally, 

uh, I think you might be thinking of trash free trails 

possibly.

Yeah. So they're, um, no, the Bristol rallies a trash free trails approved event, uh, and they're a really amazing organization based up in North Wales. Um, but doing lots of work in mountain biking and beyond now about how to make sure that like trails are free of single use pollution, but also putting the responsibility back on the brands that create the trash as well.

Mm. 

So they do a lot of like scientific surveying, um, and they report on who the biggest polluters are each month. Uh, they go and lobby them as well, but then through that they started to do work with young people, not under reach audiences. And kind of figuring out how do you make someone who has no connection to nature feel like a steward of nature?

'cause you know, we've got a whole generation of people who are gonna grow up not giving a crap about the outdoors. So how do you get them to have a connection with the outdoors? 'cause you can't just give them a litter picker 'cause that just feels like homework or forced labor. So that, how do you make them fall in love with the outdoors so that then they want to care for it?

Yeah. 

So they're really interesting. Love everything they're doing. 

That aspect of it, it goes back to something, I think we spoke about it before we pressed record about how. People don't realize necessarily the access to nature or the diversity or how to use the nature that's near them in the UK as well.

You know, I've mentioned things like bridal aways and, and whatnot, and hand up not from the uk I dunno if I've ever been on a bridal away. Um, but also where the bikes are allowed on there or stuff like that. That that's something that you sort of found as, I guess did, is that something you've had to learn for yourself and now you're trying to pass that knowledge on as well?

Yeah, yeah. Something I learned for myself so that I could start planning route, that I could comfortably take people on them and also know that I'm not gonna get shouted at by a farmer. 'cause if you're on a footpath of a bike, they do like to yell and you know, if you're on your own, that can feel like an intimidating situation.

Mm-hmm. 

Whereas if you understand what right of way you are on, if someone challenges you, you can feel confident in how you deal with that challenge. 

Mm. 

Understanding rights of way also empowers people to use those rights of way. 'cause some farmers wouldn't like you to in the uk 

Yeah. 

Yeah. Ride, ride away for example.

So knowing that you are completely fine to do so is also really important because if you don't, and someone shouts at you, you're just never gonna go back there ever again. 

No, exactly. And it, I mean, I must, you must have had situations where people have done that, where you have got every single damn right to be there.

What's your, what's your default in like d like toning down the confrontation of that type of moment? 

Um, so sometimes there's someone that I just won't bother engaging with and I'll just carry on about my day. But, um, normally I'll use OS maps, so ordinance, survey maps, and that is like the most comprehensive mapping of the uk.

Yep. 

So got a subscription. I can access it on my phone. I know. Very comfortably. What different colors mean? What, because you have to teach it when you're training guides. And I'll just get up where we are on my phone and be like, Hey, this is a byway and that means this, or This is a bridal away and that means this, and.

Just have a conversation with someone about it. 

Do you find that works? Do you find that if they're confronted with facts, they sort of back down? 

Um, I don't think it deescalates it much, but there's no arguing with it. 

Yeah. Yeah. 

You can be angry, but we both know you're wrong. 

Yeah. Yeah. There's a saying I learn, uh, in my family is convince a man against his will.

He will hold the same opinion still, and it That's 

brilliant. 

No, I know. It's sadly true. Yeah. There you go. Passing the knowledge on. Yeah. Um, but yeah, like someone's blue in the face about some color being red and you prove to them that actually that color is blue. They will still believe it's red, you know, and the argument will be over, but in their mind you haven't actually changed it.

It's sort of like, what do you focus your energy on and stuff as well. 

Yeah. 

I wanted to talk about myth busting with you, Claire, if that's all right. And from the point of view of looking at getting people more into taking a bike adventure on and looking into the barriers that stop people like, and, and the, the sort of things that we tell ourselves of why we can't take something on, what do you think one of the biggest things would be that, that people stop themselves for?

And, and how would you get people to go beyond that perceived barrier? 

I think the biggest one is probably, um, when people say, ah, I'm I'll, I'll join, but I just need to get a bit more fit first. 

Oh gosh. Yeah. 

Because I think if you are not already fit enough to join in your head, like, but you haven't. Done anything independently to get fitter.

Like you just won't. 

No. 

And that sounds boring. What are you gonna do? Go for a run or go to the gym on your own when you, all you wanna do is go and ride your bike with people. It's like, come and ride your bike. You'll have a lovely time. You'll wanna do it more. It won't feel like exercise because you'll just be having fun.

So I think just go for the ride. 'cause that's a great way to find out. And if it's a social ride, people just wanna hang out and chat. They don't wanna ride five meters in front of you because that's not social. 

Yeah. And, and I guess my other thing to add on to that is, 'cause I have, I have turned up to these type of social rides.

Where it's under the premise of being social. And it's, uh, you know, there was one that we used to call the anti-social social ride where it was all about, let's see how fast we can go and who, how many people we can drop. And it was like, what am I turning up for this for? And if you do accidentally turn up to one of those, like, you know, you know, excuse the Aussie friendship, but piss it off.

Like just, just go, yeah. And find a different ride because there are definitely rides where you can just be yourself and enjoy yourself as well. That's definitely one of the, the bigger barriers is that perception of, I don't have the skills, I don't have the fitness, I don't have the ability to do that fun thing that I really want to do.

And so sometimes, yeah, it's through the active just. Do little bits and then you'll realize that you actually can do that. 

Yeah, definitely. I think it's easy to say, just go and do it, isn't it? But I think it's, in the grand scheme of things, it is probably easier to go on the ride and find out if you like it, and then be motivated to get fitter if you do think you need to than it is to try and get fitter on your own with the carrot on the stick being this thing that you've never experienced before.

Mm. Something else you talked about, which I think can be a barrier to people and whether that's on a rally or on their own, is actually the idea of, well, I'd like to do this right from here to here, but how on earth am I gonna figure out where to go? And planning a route, like planning a route, is something that you do help people and you assist people with.

What would be your big route planning tips? You were talking there about in the UK you use os. Os Maps. You, you know how to read the map, but if you've got a complete novice, they know they love riding their bike and they've done it, say in a group setting, but now they wanna take their own little adventure.

What, but they, they feel stuck at the route planning thing. What would you, what would you recommend? 

I'd say have an ask around and see if there's anyone like in your gang who loves root planning, because they're probably dying to talk to someone about it, because no one ever says they're keen on root planning, but as soon as they do, it's like we latch on and we're like, oh my God.

I love root planning too. And I also think just play. So it's really easy or really easy to think that someone explaining how to plan a route is just gonna stick in your head first time, but it won't, doing it is gonna help as well. So, you know, whatever platform you wanna use, just have a play with it.

Maybe plan some local routes and then go and ride them and seeded what you thought was gonna happen from the map matchup in reality. And it's actually how I discovered so much stuff around Bristol that I didn't know was there. 'cause I just look at the map and then be like, I don't actually know where that is or where it leads to or what it's like.

So I just plan route that road down bridal ways that I'd never seen before. 

Yeah. And I guess in that aspect of it as well, it's sometimes it's sort of like try by doing in a way too. 

Mm-hmm. 

And I guess be prepared for the misadventure in adventure of, you know, we were talking about earlier how going through the struggle makes the achievement feel so much better.

Mm. You know, in the time you might have to set a timer for three minutes to let yourself cry, but afterwards you'll be talking. Hours on end about the magic of getting through that to get to the raw at the other side. Right. Sometimes with route planning is, even if you think you've got the best route planned, misadventure happens, you might miss a turn off.

There could be roadworks or something could be cut off and you've gotta figure it out. 

Mm-hmm. 

That could be stressful, but try and just break through that. I'd love to hear about a misadventure of yours 'cause I'm sure you've had a few, right? 

Yeah. Well I think, I dunno, it's, there's so many ways you need to be adaptable to love offroad in the uk I think because the weather completely changes how something rides constantly as well.

Yeah, absolutely. Like it's frozen over great. If it's been raining loads like it has at the moment, what you expect to be a two hour ride could take three and a half. Yeah. Yeah. Because you might be stuck in the mud. Literally. Trees down would be another one. Yeah. Yeah, definitely. But, uh, what misadventures have I had?

I mean, they're all just, I just think of them all as funny really. 

Yeah, 

no, I can't think of anything that's been an actual disaster because I think I tend to just think of them as ridiculous. 

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 

And there's nothing like that springs to mind. I mean, I made a video this weekend.

Me and my partner were out and we'd ridden through this forest and I knew it was gonna be a terrible muddy mess 'cause it can be in the summer. I was just giggling the whole way as we were slopping and sliding through this mud, barely getting any traction. And then we came across a tree that was down, but it wasn't just a tree that was down, it was like a big tree.

And so we kind of had to like lift our bikes and post them through between branches and like get over. But I think that's one thing I really love about riding off road, like. You just have to be adaptable. And those things are interesting and they're the bits that make the memories, I think, because something like that.

But you survived it. And I think that's really where like the fun and the magic is. 'cause then you go and have like a bit of cake or a snack or something and it just tastes so good because you've just made your way through this completely ridiculous thing. 

Situation. Yeah. You know, it takes me back to, it wasn't off road, but um, oh, a few months ago we were riding, this was in France and we had friends that were visiting for a, a cycling holiday from Australia.

So we, it was there I think last day or second, last day. And, and we'd committed to meeting them, but the weather was beyond grim. Like it was almost biblical amounts of rainfall. And we were sort of looking at the weather window going, well, we might be able to get in here and only, and they were a, you know, 35 minute, 40 minute ride away.

We, we should be okay. We won't get too wet. And you know, we'll dry out having a coffee and, you know. Copious amounts of pastries 'cause Hello France. Anyway, um, it then proceeded to rain super heavy that entire morning. And so catching up for maybe one coffee or two turned into, I think we had about three or four.

And then it turned into, oh, well given we are still here and it's still raining, maybe we should just have lunch. And so then we are having lunch and then it's getting even worse. And then we're like, oh my goodness. And so then we had this thing that was meant to be an hour long. We'd ended up being with them for I think about four or five hours trying to avoid the really soggy ride home.

And then the heavens looked like they had cleared and the radar looked like there was like a window of let's do it now. So we get on and within about, you know, this is a classic, five minutes later, I don't even think it was five minutes, it was probably 500 meters from when we left. It was the wettest roads, wettest, everything I'd ever ridden in like, it was complete hilarity.

Like everything, you know, you know when your, your shoes have like swimming pools in them from all the water that's run down There was that. I wear glasses to see and there was, I could not see. So, you know, I was effectively riding blind, my gloves, 'cause it was freezing cold as well. Were were like totally sudden there was constant spray coming up.

You know, your, your brakes are squeaking. And I remember getting home and I've got a little video of this where I get my gloves off and I just squeeze them and, you know, half a liter just tumbles out of each glove and then, you know, you can pour the water outta your shoes. But it's just hilarious and funny.

Like it's the wettest and most I should be damn miserable. But both of us during that ride home, were just in hysterics laughing at the hilarity and stupidity of it all. 

There is something special about like surviving the weather as well. 

Oh yeah. 

If you are out. On a bike and the weather's real awful. I think there's a little bit, it makes it feel that bit more adventurous and that bit more epic.

Yeah. I also get this like little like smug feeling. Mm. Where I'm just like, I could just be indoors and I'm like, but I'm out here doing it. 

Yeah. There's also elements of where you get past the grimness in a way, and don't get me wrong. Mm-hmm. Like, um. Actually one of the best parts of that day was getting into the shower after, and it was hot.

If I was on a multi-day, multi-week long distance bike adventure, that would've been misery, especially if I was having to set up camp or something, like having to do that day after day. The, the fun probably would have evaporated and maybe not existed. But yeah, there is something about getting through something like that as well.

It's funny, I was talking about my great friend Stevie that I met in that ultra. I remember she came to visit us and this is just the, the happiness of bike friendships, right? Like you, you meet people, you, you sort of have fast friendships and they become really dear to you. And she and her husband Tom visited us and we live very close to the, a lot of Tour de France climbs and probably the most famous one, the cold of Tomay.

And so she was like, oh, we, we have to ride the tomay. And the weather was grim with a capital G. Like it was horrible. I've ridden it many times, so the desire to maybe have to ride it in that weather was, you know, wasn't hitting peak levels for me. And the climb went about as much as we would expect it to.

You couldn't see. And we get to the top, they just opened up a new museum and it was absolutely pouring with rain cats and dogs. So we, we are hu huddling in the museum trying to sort of like, delay the descent because it's a, you know, from that side it's 19 and a half kilometers of descending and in wet weather is not fun.

And, but we all shared this horrible grim moment, which we we're almost hypothermic at the bottom. Like we were physically shaking and we had like a four person group hug. And we often talk about the four person group hug. We've got a WhatsApp group called the Tions because, you know, and, and so it's sort of that bonding over, you know, again, it's that getting through the miserable stuff right.

Definitely. And it has reminded me of one thing actually. And it was on a commute rally, uh, the Montana FAS one, which is absolutely stunning route. And we climbed up this mountain and I'd said to my friends, like, I just wanna see what I can do. I've never climbed up a mountain before. Like I'm just gonna do this at my own pace, but we'll reunite again where we're staying tonight.

So I like set off and I was trucking up the hill and like caught up to some other people on the rally, had lunch with them. We carried on trucking. And I was really lucky with my timing because we hadn't really hadn't even entered my head to look at the weather for the mountain, which now seems bonkers.

That's just experience though. That's experience, right? Yeah. Like you don't know what you don't know. 

Yeah. And I got to the top at the same time as this other woman called Diana and took a picture of Diana by the sign, beautiful clear blue sky day. Then by the time we'd swapped positions, like my picture is gray, rain is hammering down, like clouds would come in just like full on complete switch up of weather.

We just both put on everything we had very quickly and we're like, we must descend. And so we were traversing for a bit and I just remember like pulling my buffer up more and more. 'cause the wind was so strong and the rain was so cold and there was hail as well that it was just like daggers at my face.

Wow. I 

can feel that. 

Yeah, it was brutal. And then we just ended up doing this, what would've been such a fun ascent and I was still kind of enjoying it. I mean, I do like going fast and I do like it when it gets lumpy and I was on my gravel bike. But I could only tell I was breaking because I was slowing down.

My hands were so numb, I couldn't feel how much pressure I was putting on the brake. It's a 

scary feeling. I know that feeling. 

Yeah, 

yeah, 

yeah. Yeah. So we were just hammering it, hammering it, hammering it. Picked up someone else on the way, like you okay? And they're like, I dunno. I'm like, right, get on. We're gonna get down.

And we're all just like wiggling our way in. And then we got to this hotel and there were some women who'd gotten there already and everyone's stuff was just everywhere and the file was on and like a few people were crying when we got there. 'cause it had been quite scary. And then other people were still on the mountain.

But I just remember that feeling of like a group of us had got there together and we had a big hug. And then I just changed. I went to the bathroom and I was like, I'm gonna put dry socks on. 

Oh, isn't it amazing? So 

good. Like, didn't put my shoes back on again. So. I wasn't gonna ruin that feeling right away.

And then, yeah, just like the pure luxury of putting dry socks on was just amazing. And then getting a cup of tea and yeah, then it was, it was, we were still waiting for other people to like get down and everyone got down eventually. But I just remember that feeling of like, Ooh, am I out of my depth? This is a lot to then surviving it and how good it felt afterwards.

Yeah, and you know, I sharing these stories, again, it's through sharing the uncomfortable and showing that you can get through it. People hear that and realize that, you know, things can get uncomfortable then, but they'll get through it. But I think there's an important element here. You're probably aware of it, but if you're not, it'd be something that would naturally come across like you are a coach.

Like having these experiences, Claire allows you to be able to put yourself in the mind of someone who hasn't yet had it or is dealing with those moments themselves and being able to coach the through. So I think it's, there's a I, I would call it an extra level of empathy that happens through that experience, because if you know what it's gonna be like for someone, you can adjust and help coach them through because you felt that discomfort yourself.

Mm-hmm. Yeah, and I think for me, it's really important to remember what it's like and how it feels to be new to something. 

Mm. 

I think a lot of, maybe like the old guard or the old way of doing things would be you are the expert and everyone must know that you are the expert and that's why you can pass on knowledge.

Whereas I think it's kind of more about like, I can understand where you're coming from and I can help you move through this. 

Yeah. And not have to be the expert necessarily in moving through it. Like, like you can also be the expert that, holy crap, I'm descending and I don't even, I can't feel my breaks, I can't feel my hands.

Like, I don't know what the situation's gonna be like in 10 kilometers. But, you know, sharing that vulnerability with someone also shows that, you know, it's okay to feel that vulnerability yourself, which is I think, really, really empowering too. Oh my gosh, Claire, I could talk to you for hours. I won't because I have to wrap it up.

Uh, this episode is going to go out just a few days after you have opened up your tickets for Bristol Rally. Um, so I will, I will say that I hope that it's sold out, but if it isn't and people are keen to join listeners, I'm gonna put a link to it in the podcast description, show notes. As well as to Altair and Claire's social so that you can follow along and see all the awesome stuff that she's creating.

Um, it's definitely putting Bristol on the map for me, Claire, so maybe I'll, I'll have to come and and join. Do you still roller derby? This is so random, but do you still do roller derby anymore or have you Totally all bikes? 

No, I'm all bikes now. It's, it's really hard to go back to a sport that's played indoors.

Yeah. 

In sports. Discovered how fun being outdoors is. 

Yeah. Do you ever go watch a game though? 

I've been to a couple of games. 

Yeah. Yeah, I, I was sort of thinking I might need to have that on my bucket list. If I come to visit you in Bristol. Maybe we both need to go catch a roller derby and then you can, you can help me get over my downhill fear.

Brilliant spectator sport. 

Yeah. 

I highly recommend. 

Oh, a hundred percent. Alright, Claire, I've got three questions which I use to wrap the show up. The first is music related. You're a guest of the podcast now, which means you get to choose a song that's gonna be the soundtrack to your adventures. It goes on the seek travel ride music playlist on Spotify and Apple.

One song from every guest of the pod. What song are you gonna pick? 

Oh my goodness, that is too hard. It's 

gonna be the first song that comes to mind. 

Why can I not think of any songs now? I've been put on the spot. It's 'cause I've been making playlists for Z Swift. So now I have five songs in my head. Um, ah, actually Ultimate vibe song.

There's a remix of, would you go to bed with me? 

I don't think I know this song. 

I'm gonna have to send you the link to it 'cause I can't remember who remixed it, but it's so good. 

Is it a remix, like a a dance type of song? 

Yeah. Yeah. 

Oh, okay. So it's gonna get as GED up and excited for the trails. Oh yeah.

All right. Would you go to bed with me? That's not a question. Yeah. Alrighty. Next one. You've got a decision to make one day, Claire. You can choose to go left and you are gonna be on the most corrugated washboard bumpiest road of your life. There is no lit up. It's not fun bumps, it's just endless. I'm even gonna say it's flat.

Or you can go right and you're gonna be in the most brutal mother of a headwind. Which one are you gonna choose? 

Oh, washboard. 

I thought you were gonna say that. 

Hey, a headwind. 

Yeah. 

Nothing invisible. Should have that much power. 

Yeah. Yeah. I was actually joking with someone on the pod the other day that the thing that's not great with photos is two elements, actually.

One is you can never show the gradient or the steepness of a hill up or downhill. It always looks about two or 3%, pretty flat, even if it was 20% and terrifying. And the thing is, the wind is never in a photo. Like you never see the wind. 

Yeah. That's it. We're all just gonna have to start wearing like flowy scarfs and things.

Mm-hmm. So the 

appreciate, 

yeah. I do have a photo of me with my hair actually straight up.

Like see? 

Yeah. See. Yeah. Yeah. And listeners, I, this is not a video podcast, but if you could see my hair, you would realize it's quite hilarious. Um, oh gosh. Where's the windiest place you've ever ridden? Hmm. 

Um, I thought it was gonna be Arizona, but it wasn't. Um, oh, actually Bristol. 

Mm. 

Only this weekend, but I was riding at like 45 degrees.

We had a crazy storm come through and there were 50 mile per hour gusts. Whoa. And it was one of those moments where we're like, we're not gonna let the weather win. So me and my partner thought we'd go out for a silly ride and we went up into an area called the Cotswolds, and parts of it are quite high and exposed.

So there was a bit where we're just like trundling along 45 degrees, just like giggling. 

Oh, I'm glad you're giggling. 'cause see, I find that 

into it. 

Yeah. I find that on edge actually, like, intuit in that is, is horrible. But, um, the cross winds like, I hate, like having to, especially a big gusty cross wind, like there's something with, you know, constant blowing wind.

But if you've got a massive gust coming you side on, on a bike. You all of a sudden, you know, get pushed all on the road, but you do sort of lean into it, don't you? 

Yeah. So an off-road, fine, but yeah, if I was on a road, I'd probably have a different feeling about it. 

Mm. I have had really strong winds actually force me to get off and walk my bike.

Down a very, very calm road, um, because of the winds with just that vicious and, and nothing is worse than that. Having to walk down something you could easily ride, but the wind is gonna blow you off. Yeah. Yeah. It's, 

or when you're on a really cruisy descent and you've been working for that and you're like, this is the moment to coast 

and you can't, 

and then you're pedaling 

Yeah.

Because the head winds like we're pedaling 

Oh. 

With, to go downhill at a very sedate pace. 

Yeah. Welcome to the mountains, because the way the weather systems work, often it's a headwind in the morning because all the cold air from up high is sinking down and in when you turn around often it's a headwind going back the other way because of the way the weather has shifted as well.

Ugh. Yeah. Story of my life. Especially like having to pedal on something that you shouldn't. Mm. It does make us feel like we've missed out. All right. Final question for you, Claire. I want you to finish this sentence for me, and the sentence is, the best thing about taking a bike adventure is 

just going feral and eating like an absolute pig for days.

Oh my gosh. I love it. I love it. What's your go-to, um, in terms of like, you know, we talked about pizza in the show, but say you're mm-hmm. You know, on the third day of an adventure, you're super hungry, you've pulled into a resupply. What are you, what are you looking for? 

I mean, always Haribo. I haven't, I haven't found that I've ever got tired of them on a trip yet.

Sweet 

or sour? 

Uh oh. Both. 

Ooh, wow. 

All of it. Even better. Mixed with some salted nuts in a bag. I like, just like random stuff in the same bag, so I dunno what I'm going to eat next. 

Yeah. 

Oh yeah. Maybe some like beef jerky. Definitely some yogurt. Bits to make some sandwiches so that you can eat somewhere really pretty in the middle of nowhere.

'cause I do get annoyed when you always end up eating in towns and I'm like, but we should be sitting down where the best views are. 

Oh my gosh. Yeah. But you always end up with like a pavement picnic. 

Yeah. So I like getting sandwichy bits and then heading out probably some kind of like delicious drink as well.

Hmm. Well see I'm a, I'm, I'm a, I'm a coffee person so that's my mode of delicious drink. I don't know whether you are with me there as a Brit. Maybe you're a tea person, 

like a coffee whilst, whilst you're there. 

Mm. 

But then something fruity and nice to put in your bottles. 

Mm. Rather than just the water 

chocolate.

If it's not summer. 

Oh, chocolate doesn't work in summer. No, 

no, 

no. Chocolate milk does. 

Mm. Yeah. That's a great show. 

Oh, chocolate ice cream. I love that we have somehow magically finished on the note of food. 

Oh, always. Like if you haven't spoken about snacking, were you talking about riding bikes? 

Yeah, we will.

See, I I, I live for food and um, I can never eat enough. Funnily enough, though, I crave salt more than sweet when I'm on longer rides. Mm-hmm. And I actually learned that in my ultra. I had packed feed bags full of nice sweet things. I had, I had packets of Percy pigs, which were sent to me from dear friends in Scotland.

Love you, people, you know who you are. And, um, my little nugget of like, I have a theory that you should always have something to look forward to in your feed bags like to eat. And my mood lifter I thought was gonna be like, uh, peanut chocolate coated peanut m and ms. 'cause growing up I loved them. Didn't want any of them win on my ultra.

I was like, I don't want any of this. I was really disappointed and sad. I think I had a whole packet of Percy pigs unopened. I had about four Snickers bars. This is, this is an insight into the mind of someone who's never done something before. You just think you need to eat heaps and heaps and you pack heap.

I probably had like two kilos of snacks on that pike, but all I wanted was something salty. I think it was Emily Chappelle actually. She talks about the benefit of like cheese and like dried cured sausage or something like that for those of us who aren't vegan or vegetarian. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And like just having, and you were talking about beef jerky.

Hmm mm-hmm. 

Also, highly recommend a cucumber. 

Oh, with salt on it too. Have you ever had salt on a cucumber? 

Yeah. Yeah. 

You know, there's people in this world that don't know about this. Sorry. I learned about that. 

But like a cucumber's great because it travels really well and it's just delicious and refreshing.

So when you're bored of eating, I always think it's good to like keep in the habit of eating. 

Mm. So 

I find like a cucumber, a really great way to like keep it going, but just have something refreshing and hydrating, really easy to carry. Like my good friend Gail, she's an amazing rider and like her tip was to always have something that suits every type of craving.

So like, have something salty. Have something sweet, have something carby, or like have something refreshing. But like, you know, when your body's looking for a reason not to eat, which not experienced yet. Like have something that it can't say no to. 

And for you that's a cucumber. 

Love a cucumber. 

I love them.

But I don't know that I could say, I think I could say no to it. Hmm. Maybe I need a try. Maybe. I dunno till I try. Yeah. Okay. I'm gonna put that in my back pocket and think about it. Alright. Claire, what an awesome time I've had chatting with you. I've loved every bit of it. Like I said, you got me intrigued to come to Bristol.

I knew that I had an awesome bike adventure community. I've interviewed a few people from Bristol before and uh, I've always been intrigued about it because I never got there when I lived in the uk. 

Yeah, well when you're in France, you're not million miles away. 

No, not at all. And I can take my bike there.

Have a little adventure in between. You can show me bridal ways, the ones that I'm allowed to be on and, and also I just, yeah, I just love the idea of what you're doing, what you've created there. And I hope this year when you're at the start line of the Bristol Valley, you can think of this conversation and put yourself in the mind where you are watching everyone who's rocked up in all their gear about to have an amazing time and think, this is something I've created.

And these people are gonna go home in three days with so many stories energized about this, and it's just gonna keep growing and growing. And. It's one of the biggest gifts, like I said at the start of this pod, is people tune in, get an it's inspired to do something and then let me know when they've done it.

And so with an event like yours, you get the beautiful gift of actually seeing people at the finish line. So, uh, I love that. I love everything that you're doing. I love the steps you're taking towards inclusivity in our awesome adventure community as well. I've had a great time chatting everything from Grim Descents and Weather to Cucumbers is a perfect snack, all is to say.

Thank you so, so much for sharing your stories and experiences here on the pod for Seek Travel Ride. 

Yeah, thanks so much for having me. It's been great. 

Listeners, I am super pumped after chatting with Claire. I absolutely loved everything we talked about there. I love how she sort of happenstance to fall into this sport and something she said right at the start was the idea that it was just always fun.

She fell in love with exercising because it was something that just went part and parcel with something fun that she was doing, and so she stuck with it and it sounds like she's got a really great community there in Bristol. Bristol sounds amazing, doesn't it? It sounds like it's got nearly everything there for us if we want to take a bike adventure.

But I also love that she sort of. Actively taking steps to broaden and diversify the bike adventure community there. Looking at what some of the barriers are and looking at how to actively try and break them down for people. I loved my chats with Claire also about her coaching and how taking lived in experience has helped her understand the perspectives of people that she is coaching to help them break down barriers.

And of course, that very notion that the things that we struggle to get through are often the ones that we remain more proud of. Probably more happy to recollect. They're the stories that we share. Sometimes the hilarity of a misadventure will live on for years to come, and it's something that you should try and embrace whenever you go out on your bike.

Adventures. As I mentioned, I have got links to the Bristol rally and all of Claire Socials in the show note. So be sure to check them out. And if you do end up going on the Bristol rally, please get in touch with me. I'd love to hear what it was like all about for you as well. And a big thank you again to Claire for coming on the show.

Listeners, if you love this podcast and you love the inspiration it's giving you with guest stories each and every week, you can show your appreciation for the show. By becoming a super fan and buying me a virtual coffee each week, these virtual coffees come in and it allows me to interview more and more guests and keep these episodes pumping out.

So head to buy me a coffee.com/seek travel ride. Buy me a few virtual coffees and let me know what is it that you love about this podcast, and where is your next bike Adventure gonna be taking you. And until the next episode, I'm Bella Molloy. Thanks for listening.