Join us for a thrilling and emotional ride as we welcome Paul Wright, a former amateur world champion and genius course designer, to our Intentional Disc Golf Podcast! Paul opens up about his early experiences with disc golf, his championship journey, and his deep insights into course design. We promise an enlightening conversation as we discuss everything from the intricacies of disc golf to the importance of creating courses that cater to all skill levels. Don't miss out on the golden opportunity to learn from a seasoned pro and hear his views on the future of disc golf!
Paul shares captivating behind-the-scenes stories from his first world championship win in 2009 and his multiple world doubles titles. We also discuss the challenges he faced while designing courses that are enjoyable and sustainable for players of all levels. From the importance of recognizing and growing the amateur player base to the impact of providing players with unforgettable experiences, this episode is brimming with invaluable insights.
As we wrap up the conversation, Paul delves into his dominant backhand style, his favorite discs, and how he balances the design of a disc golf course with the terrain of the land. The episode concludes on a high note as we discuss the Paul Macbeth Foundation and the Builders Club - an incredible initiative that supports the growth of disc golf. So, join us on this disc golf journey and let's become Intentional Disc Golfers together!
Disc Golf Changes Lives <3
To support this podcast or arrange for an interview please contact us at theintentionaldiscgolfer@gmail.com
Join us for a thrilling and emotional ride as we welcome Paul Wright, a former amateur world champion and genius course designer, to our Intentional Disc Golf Podcast! Paul opens up about his early experiences with disc golf, his championship journey, and his deep insights into course design. We promise an enlightening conversation as we discuss everything from the intricacies of disc golf to the importance of creating courses that cater to all skill levels. Don't miss out on the golden opportunity to learn from a seasoned pro and hear his views on the future of disc golf!
Paul shares captivating behind-the-scenes stories from his first world championship win in 2009 and his multiple world doubles titles. We also discuss the challenges he faced while designing courses that are enjoyable and sustainable for players of all levels. From the importance of recognizing and growing the amateur player base to the impact of providing players with unforgettable experiences, this episode is brimming with invaluable insights.
As we wrap up the conversation, Paul delves into his dominant backhand style, his favorite discs, and how he balances the design of a disc golf course with the terrain of the land. The episode concludes on a high note as we discuss the Paul Macbeth Foundation and the Builders Club - an incredible initiative that supports the growth of disc golf. So, join us on this disc golf journey and let's become Intentional Disc Golfers together!
Disc Golf Changes Lives <3
To support this podcast or arrange for an interview please contact us at theintentionaldiscgolfer@gmail.com
Mom, Dad's making a disc golf podcast. Music. Thank you for tuning in to the Intentional Disc Golf for Podcast. We're excited to have you join us on our disc golf journey. This podcast explores the physical, mental and technical aspects of disc golf performance. We will also be discussing tools and techniques to improve your disc golf game as we work on improving ours. Now here are your hosts, brandon and Jenny Seprensby Music.
Speaker 1:And thank you for listening to the Intentional Disc Golf for Podcast. I am one of your Intentional Disc Golfers. The other one is sitting next to me. Say hi, hi, I'm Jenny, she's Jenny.
Speaker 2:Yep.
Speaker 1:Yep, the other Intentional Disc Golfer. We are here recording this on location with a very special guest that we will let you know about later. But while we're at it, you can become an Intentional Disc Golfer too. All you have to do is like, subscribe, follow, smash the subscribe button I already said that and tell all of your friends about us, if you want to improve not only your personal well-being but also your disc golf game. You can also find us and our family on our disc golf adventures on Instagram or Facebook. Our social media is Seprenski Disc Golf. That is CZUPRYNSKI Disc Golf. That is Seprenski Disc Golf on Insta and Facebook.
Speaker 2:And you should hit us up, send us a message, send us your address so we can send you one of the last few remaining first run of our disc golf podcast stickers.
Speaker 1:That's right. Intentional Disc Golf Stickers Season 1. We're almost out of stock, getting ready to reorder those with some different color scheme or maybe some some augmentations of some sort. Yep, season 2. And we'd like to remind you that this show is made possible by listeners and disc golfers such as yourselves. So if you would like to support the show, be a sponsor or have a topic idea that you would like us to cover, or even book us for a live event, we're capable of doing that. Now Come down to your tournament, play some music and record a podcast at your live event. Please get ahold of us at theintentionaldiscgulferatgmailcom. That is theintentionaldiscgulferatgmailcom, all right. Well, that being said, this is our first installment of the Decoding the Course series with our very special guests, and we're going to have several special guests throughout this series lending different perspectives and experiences on the course. But before we dive into that, we're going to give a couple short words from our sponsors.
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Speaker 1:Alright, and we are back. We are so grateful to have so much support from disc golfers and the disc golf community. And speaking of which, jenny, where can you find us next? If you're trying to find me and, jenny, where are we going to be?
Speaker 2:Well, we just finished. Ladies of the Lake. I believe it was the fourth annual Ladies of the Lake. This upcoming weekend, the 22nd and 23rd, we will be at the third annual Rain Shadow Open, put on by Essence Coffee Roasters and Dynamic Discs. After that we will be taking a break, we get to experience canoe journey with the Sequamish Tribe and then we will be a part of the NADGT State Finale at Stilicombe and then the 360 disc golf open.
Speaker 1:Where's that one? At Nat Park? Nat Park, that one's at Nat Park, yes, alright. So now that we are all through the business end and announcements of the intentional disc golfer podcast, we are excited to bring you the first installment of Decoding the Course, and with us today as our special guest. Why don't you go ahead and let our listeners know about who you are?
Speaker 3:Hi everyone. My name is Paul Wright. I am a senior citizen but I'm a busy one and I've been playing with Frisbees since I was a kid and really right out of high school moved into a house with some buddies and we used to play with a with a larger mold disc catch and see how far we could throw, and just really fell in love with Frisbees. Went over to Seattle, saw an advertisement and saw what blew our mind people doing freestyle and golf and it was life-changing Really. I never thought that it was going to be when I first saw it, but it turns out. It became a big part of my life for many, many years. So I started out playing object golf in about 1975, and when the national tour came around to Seattle I went over and met people and got really interested in disc golf, raised my family. So I took about 25 years off.
Speaker 3:In in 2005, when NAD Park went in in Bremerton, I started playing disc golf again and by 2009, I'd won my first world championship, I guess. In 2008, I won world doubles with Tom Bon Tempo as my partner and then in 2009, I won my MA-50 world championship. A few years later I won an MA-60 world championship, won three more world doubles championships and lots of tournaments. Hit all the majors Won to Tim Salinsky my first win. Five times out of five that I played it and the first one was when Tim was still alive. What a guy it was a great experience playing with not with him because he was busy running the tournament, but going down to California and playing the Tim Salinsky was also a very big part of my life. And then, after Tim passed away, they started moving the tournament around to different areas in the country and it's been interesting chasing it a few places.
Speaker 1:Where's your favorite place.
Speaker 3:Oh, my favorite place. You know Santa Cruz is a pretty special place to go play at Day La. I guess that's got to be.
Speaker 1:Oh, we watched the pro tour on at Day La this year. The term you got Day La'd, are you familiar?
Speaker 3:with that? Yes. I know exactly what they're talking about. I've been Day La'd.
Speaker 1:You've been Day La'd. Yes, I have For our listeners out there. Can you explain what that is?
Speaker 3:Yeah, if you throw just past the basket, there's about 80-foot drop-off that goes almost straight down. So you have to make some. When they talk about death, putts truly, if you went over that edge without hanging on to something, you would die. Oh my.
Speaker 1:So how many world championships and titles, just kind of cumulatively, do you have all together?
Speaker 3:You know I don't really pay attention. It's like people ask how many aces have you had? I've had a lot. I don't count them or keep track of them. I do know that I had two aces in the same day at the World Championships in 2009 in Kansas City.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's special.
Speaker 3:So, yeah, that was probably the most unique thing. I think it's been done by other people, but certainly was unique for me because I'd never had a tournament ace prior to that.
Speaker 1:Oh, so you never had one, and then you got two.
Speaker 3:Two in the same day, oh wow.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's really cool.
Speaker 3:So that was fun.
Speaker 1:So I saw a guy caught you at Fort Stillicum and he was on one of the Facebook pages and said that you were a living legend in the disc golf community. What do you have to say about that?
Speaker 3:Well, not from my perspective, but I'm glad I'm still living and I'll settle for that. Yeah, I've worked real hard to try to be a person that contributes and bring something to the sport. It's given a lot to me and I hope that I've been a good steward of the responsibility of giving back and growing the sport and helping people and putting in time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, excellent, I think you really have. I mean, you're the course designer for the Chief Kitsap Academy course from the Paul McBeth Foundation, so that's one way that you're definitely giving back to our local community, for one.
Speaker 1:One of many courses.
Speaker 3:Yes, yeah, I've been staying, busy. I like it, I put myself in a good position. I've done a lot of things that have made me valuable, and so I'm willing to give of my time and myself, because I know it's about more than just me. There are a lot of people out there that could benefit from having an activity that's healthy and good for you and really fun.
Speaker 1:Awesome. Well, we are super happy to have you on the show. Do you have anybody that you want to shout out to or any mentions you want to make?
Speaker 3:Well, first of all, I want to thank INEVA for being my sponsor. They've been great to me over the years and I really enjoy their brand and hope that our relationship lasts for a lot longer. Also, the biggest one is the Builders Club for the Paul McBeth Foundation. It's so important. The work that is being done through the Paul McBeth Foundation is so fantastic and I've been at a front row seat for that. I've traveled to eight different countries and done some work with design. Some of the places it's just supporting the people there that are designing their course and making sure that it's safe.
Speaker 3:Safety is the number one concern for any course, I think, but in the Paul McBeth Foundation we are really very, very safety conscious because we're bringing the sport to a lot of different places but most of the places have never even seen it and so to put them in an unsafe area. We can travel the United States and see courses that just shouldn't be in places where they're competing with other activities going on or just poor design, bad tee boxes. There's a lot of things that need some sort of person to come in and be honest with them and so going in and doing that at some places and doing a straight design or supporting somebody. I got to support Avery Jenkins while he designed a course in Montenegro and it was great, I mean, to spend time with. Avery is such a such a great guy, and the Paul McBeth Foundation in general has been great to me being on the staff there.
Speaker 3:We have so much support from the board of directors. We work together really well. The staff are all fun people but very serious about growing the sport and bringing it to places in the right way in a safe. In a safe way, but also being able to come alongside them and help them in any way we can. We'll talk more about that when we talk about course designs and how they can change in different places. It's a different set of rules when you're building a course in an area where they can't go get discs if they lose them.
Speaker 1:Like Daela.
Speaker 3:No, there's plenty of golf shops. You can go buy another disc at Daela.
Speaker 1:You may not get that one back. What's the joke that we have? We lose a disc. What time does the pro shop close?
Speaker 2:Oh yeah.
Speaker 1:I hope you didn't like that disc.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the kids, that was a huge thing at ChiefKitsApp. The kids are like what? I don't get another disc? No, you have to go get that one. So no disc left behind at ChiefKitsApp, yeah I found some.
Speaker 3:I think I talked the last time we talked about finding a couple in a very difficult to get area and the only reason I was in there is I was going in to get my disc. Yeah, well, that's a common problem everywhere, it's just the problem is is much larger when you get into areas where they have no chance of going and finding another disc somewhere. If you're in Uganda and you lose your disc. You've just retired from the sport.
Speaker 1:Well, weren't you saying that your Uganda course that you were working on, isn't that built on like the side of a mountain, or something like that?
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's the newest course, that's the one that I'm going in to install in November and it is in conjunction with Fighting for the Forgotten, another non-profit that we are. They're kind of sponsoring us into this very unique situation where we're serving a population of pygmy people that have been treated poorly for their whole lives, and Fighting for the Forgotten has gone in and built just a wonderful. They purchased 50 acres and put housing on it and teaching them to raise plants, and, yeah, you could do a whole podcast on these guys, so don't get me too started because I fell in love with these people and we found just enough space that was flat enough to be able to put in a nine-hole course, and so we're going to install that in November, early December.
Speaker 3:But yes, they could throw one and and never find it again there.
Speaker 2:You could end up finding gorillas with discs or something You're not too far from from where they are.
Speaker 1:Yeah, really yeah, that's amazing.
Speaker 3:So they got moved off of their property to make a home for the gorillas, I mean so were they previously like down in the Congo somewhere, or no?
Speaker 3:that's a. That's a different set of pygmy people. These are the Batwa pygmy people that we're talking about, but in Uganda they were nomadic people, they were hunter-gatherers and so they never lived in one spot. So when they for people that were living inside the park that they closed for the so that the, the apes could could live there, they provided property for those people, but they never provided anything for the Batwa, because they never had any. They just moved around, and there's no place to move around and live like they used to live, so they ended up living in the slums.
Speaker 3:That's fascinating it really is it's sad? It's sad, but the story has a happy ending, because they have disc golf. Well they're, they're really excited about that, but they have the Fighting for the Forgotten that has come in and given them a chance to live a really good life, and so I mean even to the point where you know we're not. We're not just talking about food and clean water and sanitation and things like that, which is what they're giving them, but now even to give them recreation. It's really is amazing.
Speaker 1:So do you? Do you have contact information Like how would we get involved If somebody, one of our listeners, wanted to do more what could? How would I reach out and contact these people?
Speaker 3:Well, I don't know how you I mean you can you can go online and look up Fighting for the Forgotten Justin Renn. He's a retired MMA fighter and just a sweetheart of a guy that just has a heart for the pygmy people. They call him the big pygmy. He's a, he's like a giant, he's a really big guy and he lived with them, the the pygmy people in the Congo. How do we get off on pygmies?
Speaker 2:I guess pygmies like this. Cough it's, they're learning.
Speaker 3:They. When we pulled out the basket and the disc, I didn't have a chance to explain anything. They just started throwing it and one of the guys made like a really long putt and did a cartwheel and was jumping up and down and it was just like you know. I looked over at the people that were with me and said I think they get it.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, that's awesome. Now you said something earlier that really got my wheels turning is you said that you've experienced a lot of different courses, courses that should be, courses that shouldn't be, safety concerns, different design aspects, and so so, as a course designer former player, well, still player but what makes up a good course? What are you looking for as a course designer?
Speaker 3:So, yeah, I get asked a lot what your favorite course and I think that I know everybody wants a straight answer. So I did say Dela, but it depends on what I'm doing, whether I'm training for a competition and especially as a designer, what is it that we're trying to accomplish with the course? Because a lot of times you'll ask people what kind of course would you like, and many times you get the answer I want a world class course. If it's going to be in our parks department, we want a world class course. They probably don't know what that means and what a world class course is has changed in the last five years dramatically. I mean, you need a huge piece of property to build what would really be considered a championship course, and championship courses aren't necessarily what is going to grow the sport. I mean it's a part of the puzzle, but it's kind of the end piece. You have to have a good base of courses that are fun to learn on, that stay interesting and teach people how to throw different shots, and that's what I look for when I'm building courses with the Paul Macbeth Foundation or designing courses or helping people design courses. Whatever my role might be, I am trying to make it so that people are not discouraged the first time they play it and yet, five years later, if they're still playing the same course, which most of them will be, it's still interesting, and so that's a big challenge, depending upon the piece of property and the the discs that they can get.
Speaker 3:Fortunately, there have been a lot. Disc manufacturers have been very generous with discs and we do provide all the places with lots of discs. But distributing the discs to people as time goes on is going to be the sustainability we've talked a lot about. How are we going to sustain these courses? It's not a matter of just going in and putting a course in and saying, oh, look at us. It's about really growing the player base, and Paul Macbeth has been talking a lot about just affecting one life, and that's been really powerful for us to look at and say, yeah, we don't have to try to solve the world's problems. But I have to say it's pretty cool to go to a place like Uganda and work with people who have not been treated well and be able to go in and bring something very special to them.
Speaker 1:That's awesome.
Speaker 3:I ended back up with the pig meets, didn't I?
Speaker 1:Yeah, it all comes down to the pig meets, so yeah and I just want to relate to you for a minute I think that's a very astute statement that the championship level courses I mean especially the experience that we had at the Cascade Challenge, watching the pros down at like a course that we play regularly down in Shelton Springs, shelton, washington the championship level stuff, or like gold at Kayak, is really kind of this very like small group, small niche of disc golfers where the large part of your body and your base is going to be your amateurs. And I think Jenny and I have talked about it with tournaments is why don't you know at like a tournament you might have 10 pros sign up, at least a local tournament or whatever, you might have 10 pros sign up but you might have a hundred amateurs sign up. Why don't we take care of our amateurs?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I know that's been something that you've been asking, and running my first tournament I was trying to cater to the pros to a certain point, I think, just because you know they're trying to make a living off of doing it too. So there is that aspect of it that we want to respect them for you know going out there and trying to make a living out of it. But for sure, you know, the ladies of the lake tournament had a killer players pack. I mean, the one that I did, I thought had a killer players pack. So, definitely taking the time to honor your amateurs for showing up it goes a long way and makes them really want to go to the next tournament, especially if it's a series of tournaments. So taking the time to focus on those amateurs.
Speaker 2:Now, what you were talking about, paul, for you it was the pygmies, for me it's watching all these people showing up. Now at Chief Kitsap, at this property that hasn't really been used for much, and just yesterday I was out there in this family with these little two year olds were out there. She was pushing her stroller around and I watched this little kid run up to I think it's six and he's got his disc in his hand.
Speaker 2:He runs all the way up and just slams it right in it is so excited and I also had Junior, our maintenance guy, tell me that some of the golfers they got their discs because I had so many left over I gave some to admin and they got discs and they're coming out and learning how to play too and so they're relating it to their golf course that they have the White Horse Golf Course. So it's really cool to watch them grow and see a whole bunch of other people out there and just see how big this community is, because we even have a guy who rides the bus from Silverdale every morning. He's there at 5.30 in the morning to play disc golf, even before Junior gets there.
Speaker 3:You know that's such a great example. That course. I love that that little course. You know it's nine holes. But we did some really good planning and discussion before I started the designing I was familiar with I'd walked the property quite a few times but I hadn't started designing the holes and we talked about keeping some holes in the open so that you could send kids out during school and still keep an eye on them.
Speaker 3:And yet, you know, we needed to use some of the wooded area to bring some interest and some shot shaping into the course and keeping it simple. But it's going to stay interesting. It has interesting shots. It forces people to make different shots. You know, is it the best course I ever designed? It's the best course I ever designed for that piece of property. Yes, so it's I. You know, all of the courses that I'm involved with are my babies and they mean a lot to me. I went and played one of the first courses I designed A long time ago. I co-designed it with Tony Beckett, and Fredrickson is the course I'm talking about and I really don't like some of the holes that I designed there. Now, I mean, I've grown and neither do we.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's our home course, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:And yet when I was done, I had a great time. I hadn't played it in a long time, but I went. Wow, I've come a long ways as a designer because I would redesign some of those in a heartbeat. And yet I have people come up to me all the time and say Fredrickson is my favorite course.
Speaker 1:It is a great course I feel bad for you. I well, as long as we got you here, I've got pretty much every other hole kind of figured out, or at least close to it. What's hole 18 about, Can you? I mean, do we go down to the road? Yeah, do we go down the gully there? Do we try to, you know, hyzer it around the top of the hill?
Speaker 3:All right when you said there were things that if I didn't want to talk about them, I didn't. No, actually that is not the same hole that I designed. There's several of the holes there that have been redesigned by someone that I'm not sure who it was, and, but you know, I was really just referring to the ones that I designed. 18 is. I think it's interesting. I think they probably improved upon my original design, but it is. Yeah, it's one of those that you know, you, you curse the person who designed it because it's it. Everything rolls away there. I don't know what about that, I think. I think that you know. Have you ever been to North Dakota where everything rolls uphill?
Speaker 2:You stopped at one of those places. That's my old stomping grounds yeah.
Speaker 3:Well, that's one of those places where every, every disc you throw rolls away.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, I've played it. I've played a couple of rounds in Fargo. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you ain't kidding, they roll, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:Well they they roll at Freddy's too. Yes, they do, but again, I'm not ashamed of of that. It was a that's a tough piece of property to design. I'm because it's so steep everywhere.
Speaker 1:There's a lot going on there. There's a lot going on there.
Speaker 2:And just for those people out there, it's really steep through the first three, try the next hole. Don't give up on three Like keep going, it gets better.
Speaker 3:Yeah, don't bring your grandpa out there to play or your stroller, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:What? We were out there, what two nights ago, Three nights ago, and we saw we had the pleasure or the privilege of seeing a guy hit his first ace.
Speaker 2:Oh wow, Unlike the whole, we were standing on the T-Box of what? Eight, we were standing on the T-Box of nine and he hit eight.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so the basket's right behind us and all of a sudden boom and all these ah, yeah, I'm sure I saw it on Facebook, because everybody posts. Yeah, everybody's on.
Speaker 2:Facebook. But we also get to see, because that communal property, there's this lady who she trains her horses, the barrel racing horses, and goes through there, and so we got to see Merlee again. Merlee was qualified for. I don't remember which competition, but good luck.
Speaker 1:Good luck to Merlee. Good luck Merlee. Merlee I almost said Merlin it's magic.
Speaker 2:It is.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Disc golf is magic.
Speaker 1:Disc golf is magic, right, paul.
Speaker 3:It is, it is. It has been very, very magic for me.
Speaker 2:So when you're designing a course, do you try and pick like one thing that's kind of like your iconic whole for that course, or like I'm thinking of the PCS, where they had that tractor at the end that they decided to put a basket on?
Speaker 1:Or the big archway with the ax and the sword.
Speaker 3:Yes, yeah, I don't. What I do is talk to the people who are going to be playing the course or whoever owns the property, and find out what they want. It's not about what I want. It's about what the people want for that course. What are they trying to do?
Speaker 3:And then you know, if I have to talk them off the ledge because they want a world championship course and they have a three acre piece of property, you have to kind of let them down you know, gently, and say that's not going to happen here, but because if you're designing it for somebody and you know it's different internationally where you're going to places where they don't know disc golf because they don't know what they want and so you get to go in and do that, but I try to really look at the whole piece of property. I want to find out where the boundaries are and then walk around that. So I know, you know, if there's things across the boundary that we have to make sure that we leave more room, Like the concern they had at Chief Kitsap about going down on the freeway. Yeah, it was like I still think that's we have some kids that are trying.
Speaker 2:That's the only reason why they're concerned.
Speaker 3:So finding out what what they want is the first, and then looking at the property and, yes, I look for amazing stuff that's already there Trees that are interesting because of their shape or their size or their location, anything else interesting about the property? I mean, sometimes you get properties that don't have a lot of trees. They have rock formations or something like they had down in. Oh, the first one that they did in the Paul Macbeth Foundation that I did go down there.
Speaker 3:La Paz, yeah yeah, where they have, you know, interesting rock formations and things like that that you play around and I try to incorporate that into a, a T area or a whole area and then if you bring in things that are interesting, I I designed a course here this last year by Deception Pass on Whidbey Island and it's around an existing nine hole executive golf course. He did not want he wanted nine holes that that went around the outside, so went in there and he had some old farm equipment and we ended up using some of that on the course just to make it interesting because of the property was. I think we brought out every interesting thing on that property that we could and the owner was really happy and I was really happy with it and the people that are playing it they're playing tournaments out there now are really happy because we ended up putting nine holes on the golf course that's only used for tournaments and I decided to follow the nine hole golf course with the nine that are on the golf course. Really interesting piece of property. If you didn't follow the course you could make the the.
Speaker 3:You could make a more interesting course, but what they've found out is that they can keep both the ball golf and the disc golf open at the same time, and it really isn't interfering because the flow is the same. And so part of me really wanted to take that piece of property and make some holes that were more interesting, but then they would never get used except for the tournaments, and now it looks like they're going to be using it for both. I don't know that that they've kept it all. I know they have kept it open. I don't know if they will continue to do that, but again, just trying to to heat. The owner did not want the disc golf to get in the way of the ball golf because it's primarily a ball golf course, but I think he's finding out now that the disc golfers are pretty dedicated to their sport.
Speaker 2:Yes, they're coming in and playing a lot, oh yeah, for sure. Yeah, I know the tribe's pretty excited to to see here how many people are playing disc golf.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and I hear that there's been two aces on the course now. Two aces so far. There'll be more.
Speaker 2:One lady, one guy, and I know everyone's trying on number nine. That's their goal and that's what I love about that course is that it's. It's short enough that you can get that ace, but it's long enough that it's not easy, Like you're not guaranteed to get it your first time.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and that's so funny because whole nine is the one I struggled with the most, because I had two different designs. I had the short one coming back and leaving you at the top of the hill, or the long there's. There's enough property there to have a long shot off the top of the hill. That went around the corner for a difficult finishing hole, but then it's a long walk back after that and I I ended up settling on the short one and I think people are really enjoying that whole.
Speaker 2:And I can tell you one of the teachers, jeff. So we went out with Jeff and Hank. Jeff is our English history teacher high school and Hank is our middle school science teacher.
Speaker 1:Shout out to Jeff and Hank.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So uh, Jeff was like oh, let me show you my whole 6.5, because I go from this T-pad and then I go to that basket and he's like and I go from this T-pad, this is like 7.3 quarters, and so if there's enough there that you can pick a T-pad and that big open place, you can pick any basket you want to go for A little bit of safari golf type of a golf.
Speaker 1:So when you're looking, when you're walking the property, looking at these different lines and things are, the different features on the on the property, what's going through your head as far as design goes, like, what are your favorite tricks to play on players? What do you like? How do you figure out what line or what window you're going to? Or, like, say, if it's an area that has many options, how do you incorporate all those different options into one, uh, one whole?
Speaker 3:Well, I always play the dirtiest trick there is and that is put a just a dead straight shot on the course, because that's the hardest shot it's.
Speaker 1:you know what a rotten thing to do to people is to make, make them be able to throw straight, or like, put a power pole right in the way of a dead straight shot, I know.
Speaker 2:Thanks, actually watch. Someone hit that the other day.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was one of our kids.
Speaker 2:No, just yesterday.
Speaker 3:That was such an easy. That was such an easy dirty trick to do. I know, and it only takes up 1% of the area you would try to throw in. But so many people, well it's mostly empty space.
Speaker 1:Yeah yeah, I mean mathematically, statistically, like it makes sense, but you always seem to find that one lone tree or pole.
Speaker 2:Yes, Well it's all about that mindset.
Speaker 3:Sometimes that's all you have to work with, so you make the most of it. You figure out how far away you set up from it and you figure out what angles and you try to make it fair for lefties and righties.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Right, right, exactly where your disc starts to tip up and go straight, that's where you put it.
Speaker 3:So yeah, I am, I am against artificial, out of bounds. I mean, I know they have to do that for, for you know, championship courses and and to make things challenging, but I like to use what's there.
Speaker 1:Like natural barriers. Yes, like that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, Not, I'm not. I'll do an elevated basket, Typically one on a nine hole, just because if people are going to go out and play competitively they're going to run into that, and so if they've never. I remember the first time I saw one we didn't have any here in Kitsap County and I was out playing and all of a sudden here's this basket that's 10 feet off the ground and I'm supposed to try to putt at it and I have no idea what to do, and so I don't. I don't try to make them ridiculous, so people are like that's so cool. I remember I asked one of my friends who I respect as a course designer, and told him. The person said you know, I'm thinking about putting three elevated baskets on my property and this guy said well, that's about four or too many, yeah.
Speaker 1:Jenny, don't you? Didn't you have a run in with an elevated basket, and all that long ago.
Speaker 2:Are you talking about Fredrickson or are you talking about North Bend? Oh my gosh. So North Bend is one of those courses where you know they have the two basket positions, and so we did three weeks of tournaments at North Bend. It was it was in the elevated on this stump, but then it was like elongated too, and would you say six, seven feet off the ground? I don't know, I can barely reach it on my toes to get to the bottom of the, to get out of my dish.
Speaker 2:Yeah, probably more like eight feet off the ground to the bottom of the basket, but I I threw it in the first time from like way far away and that one went in next round. I threw it and it rolled. And then I went to lay up against the stump and it rolled. And then I'm standing under it and I can't I can't even just tip it, toe it in, because it's so high. So then it rolled. Yeah, If you look everything I get at Fredrickson too, on the you look at the window behind you.
Speaker 3:I put an elevated basket down below so that I could practice.
Speaker 2:I was going to ask you. I was like, is that where you practice your elevated I put a little putting area down there that forces me to.
Speaker 1:Oh no, she's still putting.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you're not the first person that. That's the one thing that I went out today and went. Yeah, that wasn't good for me, but I still had fun.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so I don't you know, people want to do unique things and sometimes they end up being kind of silly. You know, I'm like it's like going through the clown's mouth, or can you give us an example? Yeah, I, I don't know it. At White River there was a hole that they called the toilet bowl and there was a little curly cue and you, the tree had grown in a circle and you could if you could get the disc through there. Then you could subtract one from your score.
Speaker 2:It's. It's the long one, I know exactly.
Speaker 1:It seems pretty gimmicky.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Exactly Well, gimmicky that that's. The thing is that sometimes people want to do something gimmicky and I'm just. That's just not my style of of creating. There is enough challenge in this game without bringing gimmicky things into it.
Speaker 1:For oh, true story. Yeah, you know it. I played ball golf for many, many years and in so many ways it's the exact same game and that's what I part of, what I love about it. And in so many ways it's not the exact same game. There's more layers and physics I think that you were talking about and I think, more to dissect than just, you know, whacking a ball.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's a complex game as well. I think, that that ball golf is has a lot of layers dependent upon what level you get to, and I think that disc golf I'm not sure we've even discovered all the levels of disc golf yet. I mean because it's still a pretty young sport.
Speaker 1:There's more to come. Yeah, you know, I wouldn't be surprised to see, you know, 1000 foot drives become a norm. Well, and you?
Speaker 3:look at the talent that's out there now compared to, you know, the people that were winning all of the tournaments.
Speaker 2:And I think it has to do with when we're watching people like us who pick up this sport in there. You know we're in our 30s but we're teaching our kids, who are young and malleable and they're just shooting things like James could kick my butt any day he wanted if he tried, but he won't try.
Speaker 1:That's James the child, not James Conrad. Yeah, I mean James Conrad could also kick your butt anytime he wanted. Yes, Anyways buddy to have a smile on his face. He would frolic from he would frolic.
Speaker 3:He would frolic. I love that about him.
Speaker 2:And since we're talking about James Conrad, thank you for signing my Nomad at Shelton Springs. I have been using it so much. It's a game changer. I bought two more. I need to have you sign them.
Speaker 1:So, james Conrad, if you're listening, there might be some Nomads coming your way, you know. So like XOXO, james Conrad get your first AIS type of thing. You know he signed my disc too and I told him I'm like, well, I need you to sign this one because I need to retire it so I can buy more. And I went out and bought two more my favorite disc by far.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, mine's really anything in of a is is my favorite I you know lightweight Mambas have been a game changer for me as I've gotten older and my arms slowed down and I struggle. I can still get some distance on on lightweight. Mamba.
Speaker 1:What my Mamba?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I took. I took him out of my bag because I keep flipping them over.
Speaker 2:No, you lost one.
Speaker 1:Which one Is that?
Speaker 2:what we need to pick up at 360?.
Speaker 1:Not to Mako, oh yeah.
Speaker 3:I like. Well, I can probably hook you up before you leave tonight.
Speaker 1:So I like. I like the Innova drivers and fairway drivers and stuff. I've really taken a liking to the MVP line of putters. I enjoy putting with MVP MVP discs. They just fit my hand in in the feeling so well.
Speaker 3:You know, I think, I think there is a hundred different manufacturers out there. Now, I heard that number somewhere.
Speaker 1:Well, matt, matt's got what? 56 of them, I think.
Speaker 3:Matt is who said there's a hundred, he doesn't buy from all.
Speaker 1:Hundred of them we're talking about Matt at 360 disc golf. Shout out to 360 disc golf. They are the best pro shop in the world Well, at least in the Pacific Northwest and they're right in our backyard and they treat us really well.
Speaker 3:So go see them. Yeah, yeah, absolutely yeah. Maybe I should make you go buy that Mako.
Speaker 2:He's already got like a direct deposit and everything. It's just right there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, my paycheck just transfers automatically to Matt's bank account and I just go in there and pick out whatever I want.
Speaker 3:So I wrote an article about disc golf in the Pacific Northwest and I described a lot of the courses coming from Oregon all the way up the West Coast, all the way up to Canada, and it was like five or six pages in there and I talked about disc golf, where to where to resupply your discs. If you're going to take that trip and you're going to lose discs at Dayla, so then you can stop. And somehow when I sent it in and I had written a really nice description of 360 disc golf and how great they are here, and somehow in the final edit I left that out. So my own disc golf thing. I really did them a disservice by writing this article and not putting them in there. So I told them I was sorry. I'll just say it again, I really messed up.
Speaker 2:I'm sure he's fine. Paul Wright tells all yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:Remember when I said I was an open book?
Speaker 1:Yeah, BC Construction Services is dedicated to growing the sport of disc golf, from sponsoring tournaments and events to volunteering with the Paul McBeth Foundation. When you hire BC Construction Services for your project, you are supporting growing the sport that we love. Get a free quote now by contacting them at bcconstructionnwcom, bccconstructionnwcom or at 360-271-3441. That is 271-3441. Serving the Greater Kits App in eastern Jefferson County area. That's good, eric Oakley here and you are listening to the Intentional Disc Golfer Podcast.
Speaker 3:Yeah. So, getting back to the design of things, I think that for me, I was able to get a piece of property that I don't think I could have designed a bad course on, and that was the Ross Farm.
Speaker 2:The.
Speaker 3:Rosses, let us build on their property and it's an unusual shape, but it was probably 50 acres, 60 acres that we were, that we covered, and it was such a wonderful course. I'd love to get another piece of property to try to build, but I think you know my sweet spot is at building smaller, interesting beginner levels that stay interesting throughout your your whole career, not for big arm, I think. I think that seems to be my wheelhouse At least that's the opportunities that I've gotten, and I'm happy with that Love to get an opportunity to do another big course sometime, but it's not that important to me.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I know that's. That's the goal at Chief Kids app. They're talking about needing to have something a little more challenging and going off into the woods too. So that's.
Speaker 1:I'm crossing my fingers and toes. You may get your opportunity. Yeah, sooner than later. I'm not going anywhere.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we know where you live, but I might yeah, definitely we'd go there for that opportunity.
Speaker 2:Yeah for sure. So I was going to say one thing we were talking about the like the big ball golf courses and like the big arm courses. One thing I really like about disc golf and it's why I stayed away from it so long as I was such a hiking junkie and I love being in the woods and I was like, oh my gosh, they totally ruined this hike with a disc golf course. But now that I disc golf like it just exemplifies the hike and it just makes that property. It doesn't. You don't have to change it as much as you do with, say, a ball golf course, because you're not trying to keep the manicured lawns, you're trying to do more of keeping it natural. And you know, going around the trees and the trees, that Chief Kids app, like they seem happier because they actually got a haircut. So it's kind of nice.
Speaker 1:When you think about it, a ball golf course is in ecological disaster and all the chemicals and pesticides and things that they put on there and you know just all the trees and just flattened land. It's really a nightmare when you think about it. I mean it's beautiful but it's so unnatural that it's almost upsetting in a way.
Speaker 3:Yeah, the ground compaction that happens with disc golf is a shame because it is the one area that we have to be really cognizant of there. We put so many feet on there, which means that people are playing and people are getting recreation and there's always a price to pay. You know there's a cause and effect and so I think I've blown a couple opportunities to put disc golf courses in because I'm honest with people up front, I think if we put a course in here it's going to get played a lot and you put, you know, 100 pair of feet on here every day. There's going to be some wear and tear, but we're very conscious of the water runoff which is the you know the compaction and you know hurting the under layer, that there is some damage. But you can mitigate that if you go in with good planning. So it's got to be an important part of planning a disc golf courses.
Speaker 3:When you're, you know, people will say why didn't you use this opening? And typically I can give them the exact reason. You know it could be because it was too steep, that we were worried about water runoff or it was a particularly sensitive area in there Would have made a great hole. I agree with people that certain areas would make wonderful golf holes, but you know we have to work together with the environment, with the people, and so sometimes people back off because of that. But I, you know, I don't. I don't feel good not telling people because I know this sport and I know when we're on a piece of property that's going to get a lot of play and we have to be upfront about that and be proactive and intentional about what we do when we're putting in these courses.
Speaker 1:So you'd say stewardship over the land is definitely a key factor when you're designing these things.
Speaker 3:First we have to protect the people, then we have to protect the environment. I mean, as a firefighter, that was pounded into me my whole career is that we save people and we save the environment, but in that order, and that that same philosophy carries over. And then in property is important as well. But sometimes property can be replaced where you can't replace the people and you can't replace the environment. And so the same thing with with our sport, not quite as dramatic as it is in the fire department, but still important.
Speaker 2:I'm glad it's not as dramatic as firefighters. I think the kids may disagree a little bit, but that's just the kids about what? That it's not, that it's very dramatic.
Speaker 1:The kids have I'll let you know when I have to carry you out over my shoulder.
Speaker 2:No, but you're talking about the stewardship and so it comes to mind locally recently is at NAD hole 15, knows it's 16, where it's the one that went up the hill.
Speaker 2:Right, they had to close it because of how much damage there's been. And so now it's over here on this hill, and then I'm noticing because Freddy's is our, is our home place Hole two, where it's up that hill and just seeing all the places where we're going to need to, you know, re put in stairs and like that basket's leaning and but in both of those cases I've been in the lasted years and years because we have done things.
Speaker 3:We put burlap down over that whole hillside at NAD years ago, but it's, you know, it's. We didn't keep up with it and then we put in tears so that the water runoff wouldn't destroy it, and over time those have rotted. You just have to keep up with all of that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, our, we've got. Jack Lorber is you know local guy that just does tons of work and really has a great eye for the areas that are getting compacted and are going to need the work, and he and he's done a lot of it ahead of time. We need, we need a dozen Jack Lorber's around.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, especially since we lost a course. So now people are using these other courses more and, as we're growing, the sport, it's just something we have to watch more and more as more and more people use these places.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we lost three courses. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:What was the third one again?
Speaker 3:Well, the two that were out to To Horseshoe, horseshoe Lake, and then the Bud Pell, bud Pell, which was getting all the play, yeah, Well, you know, I was talking to Jenny the other day.
Speaker 1:I said you know, if Bud Pell had not closed, that's probably where Silver Series would have been, because we have a far up in Kitsap, you know, shelton's great and all but Bramerton, silverdale, this area. We have far more infrastructure, far more restaurants, things to see. It's, you know, all around kind of like a more attractive place, especially for something like the Silver Series or even the Elite Series, and the Bud Pell would have been the place to do it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I would have loved to see it, but you know good on Shelton for getting ready and doing the things. They did a lot of work to get ready, they killed it.
Speaker 3:They really impressed me with how they've come together as a group. They've always had a group of very dedicated people down there and I really admire the leadership. Even though they've gone through, you know, a variety of people, everybody's kind of picked up around them and they're not. They're not a lot of people that bashed the other guys, they just take it and run with it and they've done a really great job Well and Shelton's killed it.
Speaker 1:They killed it. And the Mason County Disco of Association they nailed it. The course was pristine, beautiful, you know. Everything was cleared out, cleaned up. It was really a pleasure not only to be a part of that whole process but also see how the pros and everything reacted to it, and there's a lot of positive outlook that they're going to be there next year again, possibly even Elite Series.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's part of their goal, but they do something that I haven't seen it at our local courses is that they have a person who adopts each hole.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we tried that, and so they're responsible for that hole. We've tried that. I mean we've done it unsuccessfully over the years, a couple of times where we had people, yeah, I just couldn't believe how much they cleaned up some of those holes, like I never knew it could look so good.
Speaker 2:after being like traumatized for the first time, I put Shelton.
Speaker 3:It's so beautiful now.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I, we're really surrounded by people that have done it right. I am surprised that we haven't had more success with the parks departments than we have had. We've had some success with them, but you know, we tried to get into one of these heritage parks and they said we think you have enough disc golf already. That was prior to the bud pell closing, but we didn't have the numbers to prove to them and so we've done better at that and certainly having you disc is. I mean, they're doing so many great things for the sport and digging into places and, you know, increasing the communication so that things that have been successful in one place can be replicated in other places to help us grow our sport. Because the only way we got disc golf in Bremerton was because they didn't like what was going on in the wooded area and they were looking for anything to try to get that the activity, kind of run people out of the topotry, yeah, so I would say that's a fair trade disc golf and lower crime or whatever they're doing.
Speaker 3:I think they were happy with those decisions. But it's a heck of a way to pick your spots that you're going to put a course. I mean you'd like to be able to find locations that were far enough apart to where people could consider things their home course. And yeah, they still didn't do it because they appreciate the sport, although in our county we have a new person in charge of parks parks director that is a disc golfer, so oh, boy, yeah, I saw they just put out a new survey.
Speaker 1:I was actually just going to talk about that. I looked on the West Sound Disc Golf Association email and started taking that survey about the parks department and it was all about this, this park and that park and how often do you visit that so that they can allocate funding and stuff. And I'm sitting there scratching my head. I'm like I visit none of these places because they don't have a disc golf course. And if they had a disc golf course I would be there all the time, and so I really do think the county and the heritage, whatever, and whoever's in charge of that needs to get on the ball with the disc golf movement, because it's also a huge part of the vacation and tourism economy and we are so blessed here where we live because we were talking about this the other day we're literally within an hour of about 10 intermediate to world class disc golf courses. You know one hour every direction and we're there and it's something special everywhere we go.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we're like an hour and a half from rated like one through five. It seems like.
Speaker 3:Well, two years ago in the UDISC Bremerton, silverdale, bremerton area was considered one of the top 10 disc golf destinations in the country. Oh, yeah, well, and if you've traveled much, I've traveled a lot, have played courses all over the country and now all over the world. That's a lot of competition out there. There's a lot of places that have multiple courses, but you know, ours were always. You didn't walk on to a West Sound Disc Golf Association course and not find good signage.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you know you could follow them. I mean, there were a lot of things that we caught on too early and said you know what we want people to be able to? We didn't. Our courses changed a little bit so we didn't have the big signs that you could take a picture of and follow.
Speaker 1:But if you walked out and found a whole one, which was usually marked very well, there we had arrows, we had signs, we had, you know, worn areas and it's interesting that you bring that up, because years and years and years ago, I mean, I dabbled and went out every once in a while with a couple friends that were like, hey, let's do this weird, quirky thing, and I think it was either at Budpell or at NAD. I played them both a long time ago but we got into like maybe whole six or seven and we didn't know where to go and so we just ended up playing like five or six holes and then giving up, even though we were having a blast, because we didn't know how to navigate the course. And oh, there's 18 holes here, where are they? And now the way that the whole the parks and different courses are taking care of their things, and how diligent people have been with the signage signage makes a huge difference, especially quality signage.
Speaker 3:We'll just hang in an arrow from the bottom of the basket pointing you which direction to go to the next T box is just like brilliant. And it took us. It was years before we had that.
Speaker 2:It's one of my favorite things.
Speaker 3:It's just like that's. Why did we not do that?
Speaker 1:Well, it was a thing with the space race. I always love this analogy is that the United States spent something like ten million dollars how to invent a pen that could write in outer space, and Russia was like take a pencil.
Speaker 3:Yeah, no kidding.
Speaker 1:So alright, so now as a player, so put on your player hat. Now, how do you take apart a course Like what's going through your head? How do you evaluate the different lines and the different holes and the things that you can do? How do you, like Jenny was saying, how do you pick that gap way up there around where everybody else has or don't, yeah, yeah or don't.
Speaker 3:As a player. I look at a hole and say where's the biggest gap, because I'm much better at throwing through a big gap. I used to be pretty good at narrow gaps because that's the kind of courses we had around here.
Speaker 2:And I would.
Speaker 3:When I would travel and play competitively, people would go oh, this course is going to be the course that I got the two aces on. Played the same course twice in the same day and I got. It was two different rounds that I got the two aces on, but it was very wood and very tight and everybody was just sweating over it and for me it was like these are all big gaps. Yeah, because I play really, really tight courses and so, but I will still, even if I have to shape the shot a little bit, I will still go for the biggest gap that suits. I am dominant backhand player, so I'm going to go for a backhand shot over 99% of the time.
Speaker 3:You're right handed, I'm right handed, okay, so I will throw a forehand if I'm stuck in a bush and I have to reach out and throw a forehand. And, and you know one thing, I wish I could go back. I would have started to learn forehand early on, when I was learning to throw back.
Speaker 1:So you kind of use a forehand more of like a utility rescue shot.
Speaker 3:I use it about as often as I use a Tom Hawk.
Speaker 1:Okay, fair enough you know, or a roller?
Speaker 3:I just you know, I'm a backhand dominant player. Oh, don't get me started about rollers, paul.
Speaker 2:Okay, he's the roller king.
Speaker 3:Well, we don't. We don't have a lot of good courses for practicing a roller around here.
Speaker 1:No, they're very wooded, very lots of stumps, stumpy rocks, things like that.
Speaker 2:Our kids don't think so. They're always throwing rollers.
Speaker 3:I throw rollers, but not intentionally.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's how I throw rollers, yeah.
Speaker 3:So, um, when I I don't, I don't know that I take a part, of course, I usually look at it and think what was the designer trying to get you to do here? Because I think, you know, it's so funny being the intentional disc golfers that I think if we had more intentionality and in all aspects of our life, that that you're happier. I try to be intentional about what I do with my time and I try to be intentional with um you know how I treat my family and those things as well as be intentional when I'm putting in a disc golf course to try to make it be what it needs to be for that particular project. And so I go on the assumption that other people have done that as well. So when I look at it, I just think I don't think you know, I don't think how would you know every, every Jenkins throw this? I think what's what's my best shot, what's the one that's going to be most effective here?
Speaker 1:Do you play percentages at all and kind of evaluate that? I'm not that analytical.
Speaker 3:I get up, I'm more of a feel even in my design I don't. I know a lot of people that design courses that are measuring everything and going guys that's too easy of a par three. And then you know they're analyzing the scores, which I think analyzing the scores after you have a tournament is a good thing, but it's a you know it's it's kind of a complex because you have to look at what their ratings were to see what they did and make adjustments. But I know a good golf hole when I see one at least I think I do and I would rather make a course that has 18 good holes on it than something that I've analyzed to death and they, you know it meets all of these criteria. It's like I want people to go wow, that was fun. Did you see that hole? You know that's a tough shot there and you know the way versus putting mandos or out of bounds in.
Speaker 3:I try to throw into areas that narrow at different distances. You know, maybe 30 feet off the T box, maybe 50 feet, maybe 100 feet. So I have to throw a different disc that's going to hold before it turns either left or right. And that's one of the things that I do automatically when I do a course is is say, I want to throw something that's going to end up being right to left, that's what this whole. But how far back do I want to put the T box so that people are forced to to make a shot that's going to stay straight for certain distances? So that's one of the things that I do. And then I look and say what disc does that for me?
Speaker 3:When I'm looking, you know, like before worlds I, every world's I competed in, I went a week early and played the courses and tried different. You know I'd empty my bag just to see what shot was going to work. And sometimes that helped me. And sometimes I try I went oh that was, that was just the perfect shot. And then I try it in the tournament and go why didn't I just play that smart? And I always felt like I I was less talented but smarter than most of the people.
Speaker 2:That I played with. I don't.
Speaker 3:I don't know that, that's true, but especially the smarter part. But I had a tendency to not throw out of bounds and not try to make shots that I know that I'm not good at and every time I did it I would go. That's the reminder. So it wouldn't cost me too many strokes because I would learn from those things. Sometimes you take your medicine.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:After a bad shot.
Speaker 1:Sometimes get well, like I had an experience recently after, shortly after the Eric Oakley episode a shout out to Eric, he's a heck of a great guy and we had a wonderful conversation with him but I went into North Bend and I shot a plus 22. And I haven't done that and I was upset, putting it lightly, not having a good day. Then I went and had some lunch and I went back and I shot a plus two, which is I'm happier with a plus two, especially at North Bend, because it's a big arm course and I'm not a very big arm player. I mean, I've got 400 if I need it maybe, but that's if I get lucky. So I was. I was happy with that result. I just got 400.
Speaker 1:I haven't been throwing 400 for five years.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's one thing to have a bad round. It's another thing to ruin everybody else's round that you're playing with because you're mad at your round. That's what I've always told people. When you know they're cussing and you know having a bad round, I'm saying hey, just because you're not having fun, don't take mine away. And people will respond to that Usually. You know, I'm sorry kind of way If you say it out of love and not out of criticism.
Speaker 2:Well, that's. That's the part that he's not talking about is that he was on a card with me actually during that and, yeah, that kind of happened.
Speaker 1:Yeah well, you know, we're, we're married, we love each other and we try to come to each other's rescue, even when we don't necessarily want it.
Speaker 1:you know, because we're we're you know, compassionate towards each other and I was having a really rough day. I tried to distance myself away from and it just seemed like, no matter how positive how you know, try to get it out of my head it was. It's like every single bad break that could have happened happened like every single tree, every single out of bounds, every single hazard you know, and then you come back the next round. Don't hit any of them, yeah, and it's like I don't feel like I'm playing different. What's going on?
Speaker 3:Yeah, and sometimes you just need a little bit of space. I've been married 45 years. I mean there's times when I sit in my wife because she would come with me to some of the competitions and things, and you know, if I threw a bad shot she would try to console me and it's. And I would just say I just need some space. You know, I don't need a hug, I probably do.
Speaker 2:But that's one of my favorite things from Shelton was cat through some shot and it was pretty awful Cat merch. And you know the crowd is like applauding and she's standing there and talking to Kona. She's like just don't, don't clap, like guys no it wasn't.
Speaker 3:Don't clap.
Speaker 2:And so I just laughed, because that's how I feel sometimes too was no it was not a good shot, just don't tell me it was, don't clap.
Speaker 1:And like Eric said so wisely, is that sometimes the reward for having that is that you learn.
Speaker 3:I learned from. I listened to this tape series one time called the psychology of achievement, and the guy talked about when, when you're having a bad day like that, to just say to yourself that's not like me, you know you don't claim that as I'm, even though I'm throwing that same crummy shot over and over, that's, that's not like me, it's just an anomaly, and just forgive yourself. And that's been pretty powerful for me in my life, because I make a lot of mistakes but I don't own them. I mean, I own them if it, if it means owning up to it, but it's like that's not like me. I don't. You know that's not a typical thing for me to do, so it's just going to happen.
Speaker 1:I think. I think that's really awesome because Jenny herself put that to work this last weekend at Ladies in the Lake and pulled together three incredible rounds and three and set three consecutive personal bests, one after another after another.
Speaker 2:Well, it was kind of backwards, but yes, Do you want to talk about? That at all. I can later.
Speaker 1:You want to do it, we'll do a different one. Do a different one.
Speaker 2:But yeah, what came to mind was you know how Eric said you're going to play the game, you're going to play, and so I just kept thinking you know, I'm going to play the game, I'm going to play it. And I think what changed it for me is I'm to the point where I can actually start visualizing things, because I understand it enough now, and what really helped was being able to visualize shots and actually be able to throw lines. Yeah, lots of practice.
Speaker 1:Lots and lots of practice.
Speaker 3:And it's fun when it comes together and you're at a tournament and you're able to do that with people around and to win your division.
Speaker 2:I shot my first, even round Nice. That wasn't an ace run. You know, we're supposed to get more points.
Speaker 3:This shot from up here down to the basket that's down on the putting green down there. But you know we've had that set up for 20 some years and the other day my wife got her first ace. Oh, nice.
Speaker 2:She was like when you signed the disc and I said well, honey, I didn't see it.
Speaker 3:She goes oh you can take my word for it. I said I do take your word for it because she's been waiting and she's been, you know, trying for a long time.
Speaker 1:It's fun, I mean it's just it just you get so close yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I got close at. We went to rain shadow and it's 12 where you go down the hill and then off to the right. I've chained out on it twice.
Speaker 1:And like in like, as many times as you played there, like the last two times that we played there, she chained out twice. I was more talking about like your mindset, because I know, like you had a couple rough shots. You had a couple of things that went out of bounds, tough roles, different things. You didn't make too many of those mistakes but when they happened you didn't, you know, let it, let it bog you down. You were able to shake it off and get out of it rather quickly and you know I know you well enough, being married to you that I could tell at one point, like where you were starting to kind of unravel a little bit, but then you pulled it together and still played one of the best rounds of your life and also like 98 degrees outside.
Speaker 1:It was hot.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that was what it was as it was. The heat was really getting to me, so I grabbed a cooling towel and lots of water and ate some food.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I feel like we're on the verge of a breakthrough here.
Speaker 1:What's that?
Speaker 3:With this counseling session.
Speaker 1:Oh yes.
Speaker 2:We're almost there yeah.
Speaker 3:There's so many people listening that can relate, though. Is that you, you know, if you, if you golf with your spouse, you can certainly relate to the one having a difficult time. And then you know the other one. And how do we console each?
Speaker 1:other. You know we're still trying to figure that out sometimes.
Speaker 3:Women want you to to tell them that I'm sorry that happened to you, and men just don't want to hear anything as a general rule, you stay away from me. That never happened, just don't, don't talk right now.
Speaker 1:Just don't, don't clap, don't clap, all right.
Speaker 2:I think you need to start asking the wrap up questions.
Speaker 1:I had one I really wanted to ask and then go to the wrap up.
Speaker 3:Did, I did. I mentioned the Paul Macbeth Builders Club.
Speaker 3:Why don't I started to talk about it earlier and it's so important to me that people understand that you got all the time you need. Go for it. It is. It's such an incredible program. It's where you commit to paying whatever dollar amount that you choose that's best for you per month to the Paul Macbeth Foundation to support the growth of the sport and the ability to go into areas all over the world and have our sport more recognized. I'm such a such a good every penny. We are so careful with our spending. I mean, I I'm on staff there and I don't take a salary. I don't want to be paid because this is I worked my whole life so I could just enjoy doing something for somebody else and I don't want to take pay for that. But there's, you know, people who love the sport and really want to wonder. You know, what can I do? You can get involved with your local club, but one of the things that I would encourage you to consider doing is joining the builders club and and donating to the Paul Macbeth Foundation.
Speaker 1:I agree. I definitely know that this community has benefited from the Paul Macbeth Foundation being involved. So thank you to Paul Wright and Paul Macbeth and your foundation and Zach Zach, he's the Zach, he's the operations manager, right Yep.
Speaker 2:Yep and Dustin and Dustin.
Speaker 1:I don't know who Dustin is. Who's Dustin?
Speaker 3:Dustin Leatherman, he is the, the director, the director, and he's an awesome guy. He's a great team builder, he's a he's a wonderful leader, he's a great listener, a super smart and just you know, just the kind of guy you'd really want to work with in a foundation who listens to other people's ideas and and considers them and is a just a kind person all the way around.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that is a one part of the decoding the course series. We do hope to interview someone else from the Paul Macbeth Foundation. Yeah, he and Zach.
Speaker 3:I mean if you could get them together cause they're both, you know, they just work well together and I just, you know, way younger than me guys and I respect them so much and I love their leadership and and it's, you know, just an honor to work for them and everybody else on staff too is just fun. I mean, when we have meetings it's not like, oh, I got another meeting to go to, like it was in the fire department where it was like death by committee.
Speaker 3:Um, these are like oh like you know, I can't wait till Monday, when, when we get together again. Yeah, that's awesome.
Speaker 2:It's. It's fun when you have that same passion too. Yeah, Good group of people All right.
Speaker 1:Oh right Well maybe I'll remember what I was going to ask as we are going through the wrap up stuff. But uh, our standard questions Um, kind of covered it already. How did you get started? You said you started playing object golf. What was your favorite thing to throw at trees, trees, yeah, yeah, I live in a Pacific Northwest, so you go out like Mark a tree and say I bet you can't hit that one. I would put a surveyor tape around the tree and you'd put two pieces of tape.
Speaker 3:You'd have to hit the tree in between, and I had a dog that was a competitive. We played in the 1981 Rose Bowl not the row in the Rose Bowl, but at the World Frisbee Championships and so back in those days I'd take my dog to the park, I'd give a bunch of kids a Frisbee, she would play for hours and I would go and just play at that park. There was Evergreen Park down in Bremerton was where I played. Most of the swimming pool there that's been torn down now, but I had one hole that went over the top of this abandoned swimming pool and so you know I would throw out other things, uh than trees, but it was, it was mostly trees and uh, yeah, it was a lot of fun. I just loved the sport from the very beginning. And you say, what year was that? That was 1981, when we were in the Rose Bowl. Okay, so it was.
Speaker 1:It was kind of during the infancy of disc golf, wasn't it? Yeah, yeah, disc golf was like 1978, 79, but I was, I was involved.
Speaker 3:We just didn't have any courses over here. So I'd have to go to Seattle and and I was working, uh, in a restaurant, Didn't make a lot of money, had three kids I, you know, didn't have them all yet. We had our first one in 1980. Um, but you know, I didn't have a lot of money to to go to Seattle to play all day. So I just, you know, I found I had a couple buddies, but a lot of times I just played by myself. I just enjoyed it so much. It was like grab my dog and head on out.
Speaker 1:So I got to know because I saw this uh like kind of documentary on the history of the disc golf basket. Have you ever encountered one of those baskets that has, like the, the solid sheet of the disc golf basket, the solid sheet metal cone at the top of it and then the basket under, like the one of the first?
Speaker 3:yes, I have seen them?
Speaker 1:Have you played on them? No, I can't. I was going to say how do they work? Like I don't know, obviously not. Well, they're not around anymore.
Speaker 3:No, it's like everything, everybody's got a better idea, and then usually the the cream rises to the top.
Speaker 2:I'm still going to make a basket that when you hit it, glitter shoots out. I'm working on that?
Speaker 1:Oh, she's all about glitter. If you can add glitter to it, she will do it.
Speaker 3:Okay, I'm looking forward to that.
Speaker 2:I'm going to do it, yeah, maybe we can.
Speaker 3:you can break it out at the grand opening of the big course. What do we do? The big course, oh, there you go Be a really good time to work towards.
Speaker 1:There you go. Yeah, we were at this uh, this um celebration, uh for and they had those little party popper things that you twist and stuff that and uh, I didn't realize it but I had mine turn the wrong direction. And uh, I'll just leave it to the imagination but uh. I'm lucky I caught it before it went off, otherwise it would have had a real bad time. Yeah, all right. So what is the favorite, your favorite disc that you have ever thrown, or what's what's in your bag right now?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I like I said earlier my favorite couple, the star mamba.
Speaker 3:Uh, as far as a driver the lightweight mambas, you know, they help old people and they're really fun to give to people who are just learning, who can't throw a high speed driver cause they don't have the arm speed yet. I'm like this is going to be a good driver for you for about three months and then it's going to be a great turnover shot and then it's going to be a roller disc for you, cause as you learn, this disc becomes and then, if you hold onto it long enough, when you get old then it's going to become a driver for you again. It can, it can fill all of those spots.
Speaker 1:Now it's beat in, though, yeah.
Speaker 3:I decided early on that AVR putters were going to be a part of my game, and they've always been. I've got a putter that came from the South Pole. Um friend of mine picked it up when he was on a a mission down there to McMurdo, and so I've putted with that for 20 years, 20 years.
Speaker 1:So the South Pole putter is an AVR. Yeah, oh, that's really neat. What? What is it about AVRs that you like, that you enjoy?
Speaker 3:Uh, I don't know. I mean I like making putts if, but that can't be the criteria, cause I don't make as many as I'd like to, but I don't think it's the putter they go in the basket.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I just early on. I, you know, I looked at what all of the players back then were. We're using, all of the top players in the world and they were all using AVRs at the time and I went you know what, if that's good enough for them, it's good enough for me and I'm going to put these in my bag and I'm. I used to just switch like every week if I didn't make a lot of putts, it was like I'm just going to get a different putter. You know, so at the next tournament, whatever putter they were, it was in the player pack was like if I threw it and made it, it was like, okay, that's my new putter.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and so it was only about six months in where I went. I'm going to go with AVR. I still throw. I mean that one. I had another one that I, you know, went all my world championships with. But as I've gotten older I want something a little more grippier. So I go with an R pro AVR and I've really been happy it's. It's helped me a lot.
Speaker 1:Well, it it has been around like for a blink of an eye. It's been around, for it was the only game in town for a minute, right, you know. But then you get. You know that was supplying like high quality disc, golf discs. But then you know, you start to. I don't know exactly the chronology in it, but I know it was Innova and then, like other manufacturers, Discraft was there. There was a two horse show for a long time it was in by itself and then discraft came in and, and they both make fine discs, I mean.
Speaker 3:I make great discs.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I like Innova, I've thrown some discraft. I like you know discraft. Everybody's going off about the buzz, like every single printed tournament thing, whatever. It's always buzzes and I don't get it. But whatever I mean, if it works, it works right.
Speaker 3:Well, we used to have rock versus buzz. That's what we would play at.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:You'd grab a rock or a buzz and then we would play in, and, and so I used to throw the buzz and I won the tournament with the buzz and then I got.
Speaker 3:then I got sponsored by Innova, so I went to the rock and then I ended up winning it with the rock. Back in the day, when I could throw, you know I could take any disc and put it through a you know pretty small gap and get some distance with it, and now I you could let me play with my whole bag. I can't throw.
Speaker 2:I can't get the same score.
Speaker 3:I mean I shot 11 down with one disc.
Speaker 1:So you got a. You got a Mamba on the driver's side. Is is your favorite driver type. Then you have the AVR on the putter side. What do you got in the middle? What's? A Wombat three, a Wombat Wombat three. Three, not a Wombat. Okay, what Wombat three.
Speaker 3:What's special about the Wombat? The Wombat three Three.
Speaker 2:You should know this You're a leopard person. I call the different leopards.
Speaker 3:The Wombat goes straight and if you, if you put a little hyzer on it, it'll hold the line. You put a little anhyzer on it, it'll hold the line. So when you're throwing well, when you're, you know when you're release point and your arm and everything is working great it just goes where you throw it. The problem is, when you're not practicing, it goes where you throw it. So that's the problem.
Speaker 1:What are the numbers on the Wombat?
Speaker 3:Oh gosh, three Wombat three.
Speaker 1:I'm not, I don't know. I don't know. That's kind of like the Mako. That's what I like about the Mako.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I threw the Mako for a while and once the Wombat three came out it was like sold. That's why I've got some Makos you can have.
Speaker 1:Oh, yeah, oh, are you going to autograph them? Yeah, they probably have my name and number on them because there you go, so if I lose it, it's going to come back to me. Yeah, that thing again. It's going to be like the Mako curse.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and the Mako three is also. Love the Mako three.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I had two of them, a heavy one and light one, and well, I lost my heavy one. But it's coming back to me, paul, somebody found it.
Speaker 3:Oh good, and they were nice enough to send it. I've had people call me and tell me they were going to send the disc back and never do it, you know.
Speaker 1:I just recently had it. So, jenny, here I'm a leopard guy, right Star leopards, they're my go-to. I can do anything I want with them and they just fit me so well. And Jenny, I had like a lime green one and then Jenny took the stamp off of it and died like the old 1980s Ninja Turtles on it and this is my favorite disc. And then, after she did that, I put it in a bed, or before she did that, I put it in a bed too. So, like the rest of it is like orange and green and yellow and like these really cool colors. I call it affectionately, call it turtle power is my disc and I threw a great fairway shot down at PUD down in Shelton.
Speaker 2:It's a warm up for.
Speaker 1:Unlike hole two. Yeah, I was warming up for the Shelton Springs Open and hole number two threw an awesome sidearm and I lose the disc right in the middle of the fairway. It's gone Poof.
Speaker 2:We look for like 45 minutes yeah.
Speaker 1:Like this is my favorite disc. I'm lost without it. And a few weeks later actually just recently, kind of like the beginning of July here I get a call from a guy down in Yelm, or no, was he Yelm? I think it was Yelm, yeah.
Speaker 3:Was he.
Speaker 1:Yelm. No, it was Tumwater. It was in Tumwater. I get a call from a guy in Tumwater and he's like yo, dude, I found your disc. He's like it's super cool and it's like really special. He's like I just want to make sure that I get it back to you. I'm like are you serious? Like I will pay Pal you the money If you ship this thing back to me so I can have it for my tournament this weekend. And he's like, yeah, I'll take area and everything. And he's just like you have to answer me one question. I'm like, yeah, he's like this is a leopard, isn't it? Yes, it's a leopard.
Speaker 1:And it actually turned out to be kind of a Cinderella story in a way. Because I'm like, hey, do you listen to the podcast? And he's like, oh, is that you guys? And he's like the intentional disc golfers. I'm like, yeah, you should give her. And she's like, yeah, he's like I got the stickers. I've heard about you guys, I've heard all good things. And he's like so now it's like we know each other. And I'm like, well, next time you're up this direction, give me a call. You got my information. We'll go out and play around. But I got the disc and then we went to throw pink and I shot a personal best at throw pink. So yeah, it was kind of like a really cool story.
Speaker 3:So yeah, whoever you are done at Dayla, if you found my Roadrunner, it's not too late to send it back to me. I know you've been using it for the last 10 years, but I'd still love to get that.
Speaker 1:I got Dayla, okay, so that's a good question. What's your?
Speaker 2:long lost disc.
Speaker 1:That's the Roadrunner. That's the Roadrunner. What's so special about?
Speaker 3:this disc. It would flip up and go straight and it would die to the right at the end. And it was such a unique disc. I had lost it in the White River, at Riverside, and it stayed in the water. Somebody found it after two years. I got it back and it had. You know, it was like Spider-Man getting bit by the spider and suddenly you have these superhuman powers.
Speaker 3:So this disc. It took me a while to figure out what it did, but it would do it every time I could throw it, and it was just a consistent and I just overturned it at Dayla on this very unique hole and if you go too far, right, it's either in a tree or it went down into a gully. That was no-transcript, but yeah, no, I missed that.
Speaker 1:Do you remember how heavy it was?
Speaker 3:No, no no, I remember it didn't even look like itself after came out of the river. It was a white disc and then it had turned kind of a Brown color and I had put some red markings on it so that I wouldn't grab the wrong. It sat next to my Valkyrie in my bag and so I put little black lines on my Valkyrie, little red lines on my roadrunner, so that because I would grab the wrong one From time to time and it was like I need to do something to Kicked my memory.
Speaker 1:Don't grab the wrong disc.
Speaker 3:Yeah, gotcha, you know yeah, I think it was. It was probably 170 In the low 170s back then maybe like high 160s, maybe, maybe, but somewhere in there, but it I've never found another one, and I've had lots of them.
Speaker 1:I've had lots of roadrunners also. In fact there's one I've lost lost lots of roadrunners a red one at fairgrounds right now, off of the side of what is a hole eight, the big long one right when you go across the road.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's where my no, it's the one before that, that's where my diamond is.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, there's one, there's. There's a red roadrunner off to the left of hole number eight, if anybody finds it.
Speaker 3:I didn't see it. I was there today. I played. I played that's good fairgrounds for the first time Since the redesign. Yeah yeah, it was fun. It's nice. It wasn't fun the first round. The second round was fun.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they've done a really good job with fairgrounds. The addition of the red teas makes it not so daunting, right? So you know, we play a ball, we feel comfortable taking our kids out there and also the work They've done to clean up and move brush out of there and signage and everything has made it much more inviting to. You know, players that are of a lower, marginal skill level, yeah, no.
Speaker 3:West Sound. West Sound disc golf association is doing a great job at that stuff and, again, jack Lorber had a big part of that.
Speaker 1:Yeah it's turned into a really great course, honestly. All right, so Couple more questions, then we'll. We'll get a wrapped up and do our outro here. So in your journey is throughout life, and in you know, with the consideration to disc golf. What has your experiences through disc golf? How has that helped you develop as a person? What things have you learned? What Things have you taken with you that are still in play and helping you today?
Speaker 3:You know, I think that disc golf has just been such a great recreation for me. When I was With the fire department I was a battalion chief the last 16 years of my almost 30 year career and there's a lot of pressure in the fire department I enjoyed it. I'd love being a firefighter until last couple years, weren't that much fun? And you know, I found my my fun and my relief in my family, in my relationship with God and in disc golf. Disc golf was was really good exercise in a place where I think it did the same thing for me, that my wife said when we would go out In the canoe, out on the lake here and we, we paddle out to the middle, and then I was in the front seat so I turn around and so we could talk, and she said you know, whenever we're out on the lake, all of the lines come out of your face. You're just so relaxed Because you know you don't have and I feel that way with this golf and it's one of those things that I've always been a competitive person but I never made it like.
Speaker 3:You know, it's not like we're curing cancer is what I told a lot of people. It's like we're just playing a game and it's supposed to be fun and it's one of the few things I've ever done that even when I didn't do it Well, I still enjoyed it. It was still fun to go out and challenge. I mean, certainly it's more fun to play well and it's more fun to I've enjoyed more rounds than others, so that's more than others.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but sure.
Speaker 3:But even a miserable round, I still I still loving love watching a disc fly and I still love watching a disc fly and I still love the sound of the discs hitting the chains and I've had so many I mean, it's just created so many opportunities for me to when we had the budpell, we had the deaf disc golf association came and did their national championships at the budpell and so the people who were running it Came and stayed with me at at my house and I I don't know much sign language. I took one quarter of sign language in college and um, but you know, we figured out how to communicate and we I played a lot of disc golf with them and it was just like wow.
Speaker 3:I mean, what a great opportunity to spend time with some awesome people and to help them Get the course ready and do all of those things. And then, you know, when it when it turned into Applying at the Paul McBeth foundation and getting picked and being able to go and do that, it's just like it was just a game that I started playing and it's turned into Just a really big part of my life. And you know, I can tell you there are a bunch of mambas and a bunch of Wombat threes with team stamps on them all over the world. Now, because I bring those, because it's like, okay, you know you've worked so hard on this course. I want to give you something that's going to give you an advantage over the other guys.
Speaker 3:And so for me that's really fun to be able to give back.
Speaker 2:That's, that's uh. Every once in a while We'll put some died discs in our bag, and when we come across some kids or something, we give them a couple of those discs too.
Speaker 1:That's really cool. Yeah, I think this golf has been very serendipitous for us too. It's we, you know. We have Created this great, or become a part of this great community. We haven't created anything and and it has Shared many, many gifts with us, you know, just in the short time that we've been involved, hence this podcast. I mean, this podcast has been such a crazy ride and we're grateful for every minute of it, even the times that we've been skeptical about it, and then it's like wow, this is like a thing. So disc golf is so many opportunities and chances for community, and I couldn't agree with you more.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and the people I mean. I really love disc golfers. I, when I was playing ball golf, I was a member of a local golf and country club and you know I got disrespected as some hippie kid. You know that was what are you doing on our golf course. And, and that never happens on the disc golf course people are happy and friendly and and I mean the relationships that I built through our club and in other areas it's, you know, it's all about relationships in the end.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, well, and you're talking about how you know you've never really had a bad day disc golfing. And you know another Seattle light person, patch Adams. You know discovering the power of happiness and laughter In healing. And when you said that we're not hey, we're not healing cancer here, well, you know we are healing people. In a way it we're bringing some amount of joy and comfort to their life by growing the sport and and helping growing a community around the sport.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I, you know I follow my heart and my heart tells me what we're doing, because you know I want to do something meaningful with the rest of my life. I don't think it's all over. I mean, I've been retired for eight years. I love retirement, but Retirement isn't like hey, it's all over, and retirement's a chance where you get to give back and say thank you and show your appreciation to the world for Allowing you to live this long and to you know. Fortunately for me, I've got a nice retirement, I've got a nice place to live, I've got a wonderful wife, I got three great kids. I got six grandkids that I love more than anything.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and that's actually a fantastic lead into our last question. There is, you know Again, diff disc golf considered is. You know what are your plans and projects for the future, what, where, what do you have hope to develop personally? And also, you know disc golf wise for yourself and and the community around you?
Speaker 3:Yeah, my, my focus is very much on Going with the palm of bet. I've got two trips between now and the end of the year, at least two trips To places that are gonna you know, are gonna rock the world, I think, and um, future pro tourist stops, no probably not.
Speaker 3:No, but certainly breeding ground for future world champions. Absolutely, by by getting, by making the game accessible to other places and and meeting people. I have to tell you, you know I talked about the, the pygmy project in Uganda, but it all comes back to the pig the two other projects that we have there, once at a university which is a sports university and they held the east african games and they didn't even have the permanent baskets in yet and, like all of the other colleges are like we want that sport for us too.
Speaker 3:And then the third place, that and, and the people that are running that program and the, the person that runs the orphanage when we orphanage for 400 people, a home for unwed mothers, a home for abandoned babies I mean this guy is doing it in a school, winter school, and those are two of the finest human beings that I've ever met that I Wouldn't have met unless I was doing this sport. Plus, I met that whole pygmy tribe, but I mean that's and that's just Uganda. I mean I, the, the guy who's running the program in Montenegro is another human being. That is just like His story of how he came through and he's a pastor now but he was a criminal for a while in his life and I mean he, he, you know he let me into his life and told me his life story and now he's like I think this just golf, because he's really bringing people to Jesus through sport, and he's like I think this is gonna be, you know, a really, a, really big deal and it's like man, I got to meet this guy and hang out with him and he's just, he's got such a heart for people.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and you know, I mean I guess I could go through every country you want to hear about Nicaragua, the guy there, I mean the guy's allowing his neighbors to, allowing his neighbors to just to have a girl's school on his property for free, because the girls don't get the opportunities there To get. You know he's, he's hired this teacher to come in. It's just, it's story after story after story. It's all about relationships and it's like, man, if I can, if I can pick One little piece of their heart up each time I meet these people and it's just gonna, it's just gonna improve me as a person. So, yeah, I got a lot of growing to do. I mean, I've been around a while. I've seen a lot of things. Uh, I know what doesn't work. Uh, I'm trying to figure out what. What does work. But I know that loving people and helping them and coming alongside them you might find that it isn't disc golf that they need, but we're there to help people be better Either way. So I'm a blessed man to be able to do that.
Speaker 1:It really sounds like you're following your heart's calling. And disc golf is just a catalyst it is. It's a fun one though.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's a fun one and I got a lot of personal satisfaction out of playing and playing well for a while.
Speaker 1:No, I mean we, you know, for our listeners that aren't here, uh, you know being a part of this physically. You know, you can tell that paul's very passionate about the work he's doing, uh, through paul mcbeth foundation and disc golf and the life changing experiences that this you know I hate to say it silly but important little game has Provided for him and for us. That you know, he's uh, you can't. You can't see the Tears in his eyes, you can't see the redness in his face. He's Uh, this has moved him to a level of being very humbled and grateful for being able to, uh, To do this. I mean, it's, what you're doing is super special.
Speaker 2:And I think there's a lot of our listeners out there who are Along the same path.
Speaker 3:Yeah, there are a lot of people doing great things. I'm certainly, uh, you know, just trying to focus and be the best at what I can be, but, man, it's, it takes a village, like they say it does. It really does. And there's a lot of people I mean I've, I feel so blessed to know you guys. It's not like Sometimes you do your podcast, the people aren't neighbors like you are with me. I mean, they don't know, they don't have that friendship and that personal relationship and it's, it's, you know, I'm so blessed to, to, to know you guys and, uh, to know, you know it's funny because I talk about these courses are like my kids, it's, it's, you know, if you're gonna leave your kids with somebody for a while, you'd rather have it be somebody who cares about them than somebody who's just gonna watch them.
Speaker 3:Yeah and so, uh, you know that's you guys with the chief kids app academy. Is this like? I don't? I don't think a lot about it because I know it's in good hands and it's being taken care of and I certainly want to stay a part of its life. You know if, if it needs anything, you know that's, and and the Paul McBeth foundation kind of treats all of their projects that way, it's like yeah, I was surprised to get another email of hey, we got more discs, Do?
Speaker 1:you need more discs? Yeah, we just got another box full today to give out to the kids. Yeah, is there anything else?
Speaker 3:you need, you know and you know we're trying to get those signs, the signs done and finish off. It's not like yeah, we're not a like a one and done kind of organization. It's like we're here for you for the long run. We we want to help you be successful.
Speaker 2:And that's why we need the support of you guys, our listeners out there.
Speaker 1:Being a part of the builders club, too, yes, yeah, and and to our listeners out there you know Paul McBeth's mantra right now is you know, if you can affect one life, get out there, clean up your course, volunteer, get involved, introduce a new kid or a new person to the sport, because you never know whose life they're going to go out and change, and I think that you know I can't speak for mr Paul right over here, but it definitely sounds like he's On the train with if you can only go out there and change life, but in your situation you're.
Speaker 3:You're changing many you know, a couple of things that have happened to me in my life that made a big difference was, uh, somebody giving me an encouraging word when I needed it. That could be so powerful. And you can see kids who are out playing and just, you know, tell them how good they're doing and, you know, help them, but encourage them more than anything. I mean, when I wanted to be a firefighter, I went, I had to go to this academy to be a volunteer locally and when you, when you put up a ladder in the fire department, there's certain footing you have to do and it's it's, it's complicated, but, um, it's simple and I, I could not get it down. It was the first time I'd ever done it. And, um, this guy watched me work at it and when we were done, he came up to me and said are you, are you interested in being a professional firefighter? I said, yeah, that's my goal. And he said you're gonna make it.
Speaker 3:And I made such a difference for me because it's like this guy knows what he's talking about and he said something encouraging to me. And there's people that are gonna look up to you, even if it's just disc golf, doesn't, you know, have to be, but just to be able to, to Encourage somebody and tell them you know what you're gonna be. Okay, it's you know, and especially if you can say I'll be there for you, that's. That's the kind of experiences I'm getting From the other side when I'm going with the paul mcbeth foundation to these countries and helping people Do that is this. There's opportunity after opportunity to encourage somebody, but that's you know, at your, your home course. There's those opportunities as well and where we can affect that one person.
Speaker 1:There's so much adversely to that is people. There's a ton of negativity in the world, oh yeah, and People. When you give them an encouraging word, when you're positive and genuinely Vested, if not concerned, in their well-being and and development, it really throws them off it, when actually I definitely am of the school of thought where it needs to be the other way around.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, no, I don't know why I'm getting. You know, the longer we've gone into this, the more emotion I'm getting. We're we're getting down to those layers of of. You know how special this really is to me and uh, yeah. It's you know well you're.
Speaker 1:You're a very genuine, honest guy, and that's part of the big reason that we want to have you on here is because we knew that you were going to give your heart, and that's something that we look for in in people that you know we want to have on the podcast.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I don't know if we've cracked the design code tonight, but We've covered a lot of ground.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you've given us a lot of insight into. You know what are you looking for when you're out there on the course and it's not just the course, it's the people that are on the course yeah, yeah, I bring passion to my designs.
Speaker 3:I don't bring science as much as a lot of people do, but you know I I go out there to try to make something that's that's going to be fun and that people are going to enjoy, and in the meantime they're probably going to learn something about how to throw certain shots, that's true which which really thrills me when I watch somebody Finally be able to throw that turnover shot that gets them within a birdie pot. It's just like, yes, that's what.
Speaker 1:That's what this hole was designed to do Well, and it's unbelievable how much you learn about yourself through this experience, in this game.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, it's a. It's an ongoing process, that's for sure.
Speaker 1:Well, you know, maybe we haven't cracked the course, but you know, maybe we've cracked the player and the heart of a player and the heart of a giver and a volunteer and a steward, and you know all of the good things that that people can be and people can offer.
Speaker 3:Yeah, don't be afraid to chase your dream. I never thought I'd be a world champion at anything.
Speaker 2:Let alone a six-time world champion.
Speaker 3:Yeah, god gave me a gift and it was disc golf. I'm like I'm not sure whether I mean I always wondered, was that really a what I would have gone for if it was my choice?
Speaker 2:But uh.
Speaker 3:But I didn't have the vision to know where it was going to take me, you know, and now I'm going. Yeah, that's exactly what I should have been doing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, jump on board and hold on. Yep, yeah, for sure. All right, paul. Well, that is an excellent session. I think we're gonna probably call it right there. Um, very, very privileged to have you on board and and share with us all of those wonderful things and in insights. And you know, um, I know that our listeners out there are gonna find you and your wisdom valuable. Um, and a call to action to get more people involved in this wonderful game, especially with the Paul McBeth Foundation. They're out there doing wonderful things and I just can't say enough. So thank you so much for this time and you know, being real with us, I'll thank you guys. It was uh.
Speaker 3:It was fun taking it. I didn't know where we were going to go with this, but we took a Walk into the past a little bit and maybe touched on the future and and hopefully touched a few hearts out there.
Speaker 1:Well, that's, that's what it's all about, isn't it? Yeah, so All right. Well, this is the intentional discolfer podcast. I am your intentional discolfer, brandon. This young lady over here is your intentional discolfer, Jenny. I can't get over that.
Speaker 2:You're calling me a young lady. You keep making fun of me almost being 40.
Speaker 1:Hey, you look good for 60.
Speaker 2:Thanks, thanks, james.
Speaker 1:And our very privileged to have our very special guests over here sitting next to me Mr Paul right. Mr Paul right.
Speaker 2:Mr Paul right so.
Speaker 1:That is the intentional discolfer podcast for this episode, the first installment of cracking Paul right, it worked, yeah yeah. And uh At the intentional discolfer podcast. We truly do believe that disc golf changes lives all across the board, so don't be afraid to go out there and grow the sport.