The Intentional Disc Golfer
Unleash your disc golf potential with The Intentional Disc Golfer podcast! Join us as we dive deep into the physical and mental aspects of this incredible sport, helping you become the player you've always dreamed of being. We're here to elevate your game, share expert insights, and inspire intentional growth on and off the course. Support our mission by becoming a part of our avid listener community. Together, let's take your disc golf journey to new heights! Email us at theintentionaldiscgolfer@gmail.com to support or be featured on our show. Let's tee off towards greatness!
The Intentional Disc Golfer
The Art and Science of Bringing New Life to Degraded Disc Golf Courses
What happens when a professional agroecologist with a passion for disc golf decides to tackle a deteriorating course? The answer is a revolutionary approach to course restoration that could change how we think about disc golf sustainability nationwide.
Kris Pendleton, project lead for the NAD Restoration Project, joins us to share how his team is transforming the Naval Ammunition Depot Park disc golf course in Washington through ecological principles and community engagement. With an estimated 40,000 rounds played annually, NAD Park was showing clear signs of degradation—exposed roots, compacted soil, and eroding fairways. Rather than accepting this as inevitable, Pendleton saw an opportunity.
Through creative applications of mulching, pathway development, and native plantings, the NAD Rangers are demonstrating how courses can actually improve with use rather than deteriorate. Their approach goes beyond simple maintenance to incorporate wildlife habitat, artistic elements, and educational opportunities. Most remarkably, they've achieved all this without municipal funding, instead leveraging community partnerships, volunteer labor, and innovative fundraising.
The implications reach far beyond a single course. As disc golf explodes in popularity—with over 500 new municipal courses added nationwide last year alone—the need for sustainable approaches to course design and maintenance has never been greater. The NAD Restoration Project offers a blueprint that other communities can adapt, potentially transforming how we think about our relationship with disc golf courses everywhere.
Whether you're a course manager, club leader, or simply a player who loves beautiful courses, this conversation will change how you see the ground beneath your feet on your next round. The future of disc golf isn't just about playing courses—it's about becoming stewards of these special places.
Disc Golf Changes Lives <3
To support this podcast or arrange for an interview please contact us at theintentionaldiscgolfer@gmail.com
Welcome to the Intentional Disc Golfer Podcast, the show dedicated to helping you elevate your disc golf game with purpose and strategy. Whether you're stepping up to the tee for the first time or you're a seasoned pro chasing that perfect round, this podcast is your guide to playing smarter, training better and building confidence on the course. We are Brandon and Jenny Saprinsky, passionate disc golfers, here to explore everything from technique, course management, mental focus and gear selection. Grab your favorite disc, settle in and let's take your game to the next level.
Speaker 3:Intentionally, intentionally and thank you once again for joining us on this episode of the intentional disc golfer podcast. I am one of your intentional disc golfers.
Speaker 3:My name is brandon hi, I'm jenny and we'd like to thank the fans for sticking with us, being fans, being involved in the show, following us. Listen to our episodes and if you would like to support the show, please like, subscribe, follow and tell all of your friends. You can find us on facebook and instagram at saprinsky disc golf, or just go ahead and search the intentional disc golfer podcast, and also we have an x, a tiktok and a youtube all at the same place at the IDG podcast. That is the symbol at the IDG podcast. You can also send us some fan mail on our website. There you just go up to the upper left-hand corner and click on fan mail. You can text us right from your phone or you can email us directly at the intentional disc golfer at gmailcom. That is the intentional disc golfer. At gmailcom. We also have a Patreon, so if you'd like to support the cause in any way, get a hold of some exclusive content we are in the beginning phases of it, but it is always growing. You can visit us on Patreon at patreoncom backslash theintentionaldiscgolfer. That is patreoncom backslash theintentionaldiscgolfer.
Speaker 3:And after the episode we like to take our outtakes and our bloopers and things and tack them to the end of the episode. So if you stick around after the outro music, you might be able to hear some bloopers and get a good laugh in there. So we would like to thank our sponsors real quick and give them a shout out. We are sponsored by Treasures of the Forest. There's the guys that do the epoxy minis. Sponsors real quick and give them a shout out. We are sponsored by treasures of the forest. Uh, there is the guys that do the uh epoxy minis with all the cool nature stuff in them from the different courses, and you had one that you needed to give a shout out to, didn't you, jenny?
Speaker 2:to the salty unicorns disc golf apparel. Yes, how about our new one?
Speaker 3:our new one, yeah for the tournaments.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's for the tournaments.
Speaker 3:Well, we'll. That's for the tournaments. Well, we'll talk about that when we get to the community calendar. That's a big one and, speaking of the community calendar, we are ready for that. So take it away, jenny.
Speaker 2:All right. So I'm just excited, I keep getting notifications about our tournament. Just excited, I keep getting notifications about our tournament. So we have, on March 2nd, shiver at the River. We're both doing that one. We have Team Golf on Sunday the 9th, the first of the Evergreen Women's Series. The Fierce Flight Showdown is on March 15th and Brandon will be at the West Sound Invitational on March 15th. Then we have Team Golf at the west sound invitational on march 15th. Then we have team golf on the 16th, the fourth annual christopher reeves memorial and fundraiser for autism speaks, sponsored by dynamic discs, on march 22nd, and then we wrap up with team golf on march 30th and then we have a couple tournaments coming up, don't we?
Speaker 2:Yes, our tournaments just opened, as of half an hour ago Sirens of the Springs I believe it is the third of the Evergreen Women's Series this year. And then we have a brother tournament, Tritons of the Timbers, on May 4th. That is also open for the men.
Speaker 3:Yeah. So, ladies, come on out, play the Evergreen Women's Series, get your points, have some fun with a women-ran, women-supported event. And then, because the guys are in town anyway, we decided that we were going to throw just a companion tournament and give them a chance to play too. So please come out, register for those tournaments. We'll be there, you can meet us, and we had the big announcement of a key sponsor for those tournaments. Who's the big sponsor, jenny? Tech Disc, tech Disc. Yes, yes, so Tech Disc. They're the guys that do the discs with the little meters and things on the bottom of them, and then they connect to your computer or your phone and they give you a readout of the distance and the spin and all the different aspects of your throw, so you can really get to know your throw. Tech disc. So Sirens of the Springs and Tritons of the Timbers, powered by tech disc. So that's exciting news. Yes, very cool. All right, and we are on fire with having awesome guests on this podcast lately, and we got another one for you. It's a special guest.
Speaker 2:Your favorite word.
Speaker 3:Special.
Speaker 2:I'm going to get you a thesaurus.
Speaker 3:So, thank you Father's Day. Is that what's going on? Uh-huh, yeah, okay. If oh, sorry, thank you father's day, is that what's going on? Yeah, okay. And so if you have a disc golf course or a park that needs a little help, needs a little love, we have a guy on here that is going to be able to tell you exactly how to get that going and what can be done about it right after these sponsors all right, let's talk about a brand that's bringing some serious fun and personality to disc golf Salty Unicorns Apparel.
Speaker 2:That's right, salty Unicorns Apparel. They started because disc golf fashion was seriously lacking in style, especially for women. What began as a simple search for better apparel turned into something bigger, and in just a few weeks they were outfitting own Scoggins, and now they've got Jessica Oleski, lucas Carmichael and Trinity Bryant rocking their gear too. Salty Unicorns is different because they actually prioritize women's apparel, something most brands don't. And they're not stopping there. Pretty soon they're launching their own Salty Unicorn bag, bringing that same energy and creativity to the gear you carry. So if you want to stand out on the course and support a brand that's shaking things up, check out Salty Unicorn's apparel, because disc golf should be fun, and so should what you wear. Find them online, follow them on social media and bring some color to your game. Use the code SALTY10 for a 10% discount. Big news Disc Golf fans. Treasures of the Forest just dropped something special their Mile Marker 63 Minis. These unique pieces were crafted from materials collected with the help of Simon Lizotte straight from the course he designed. That means you're not just getting a mini, you're holding a piece of disc golf history. And guess what? They're hitting the road. The Treasures of the Forest Tour starts this week. You can find them at a Florida event or the next month at a Texas event. Stop by, say hi, grab your mile marker 63 mini before they're gone.
Speaker 2:This is Sarah Hocum and you are listening to the Intentional Disc Golfer Podcast. I don't know about you, but I've been going to NAD Park lately and seeing the difference going up to the tee pad, where, where the teapad before it was fine, it kind of had like a cliff off to the left on the back, and all of a sudden, like we went there and I think it was when it snowed but it was all level, like you had to step up, like it was beautiful and there was, um, all the bark so you could walk around and figure out where you were going and I wasn't walking in the mud.
Speaker 3:It really threw me off.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was like a whole new hole. It's like how do I throw this?
Speaker 3:I'm so like thrown off by how amazing it is, so we have on the podcast today the guy, the man that char in charge of throwing off your game, the course beautification expert. Go ahead and introduce yourself, sir hi, my name is chris pendleton.
Speaker 1:I am the project lead of the nad restoration Restoration Project.
Speaker 3:Yes, excellent. So the NAD Restoration Project how long has that been a thing Like? Did you guys just start this year? Have you been working on it for a while?
Speaker 1:That's a great question. Actually, we just celebrated the anniversary of the what is going on at NAD question in the third Thursday of February, so I went to a West Sound Disc Golf Association board meeting I think it was February and we had a discussion about maintenance out at NAD Park and I decided to do something about it using some of my past professional experience, and so this has only been going on a year, but we've made, I think, in that time, a couple of pretty good steps towards making NAD Park something really, really special.
Speaker 2:I'm surprised it's only been a year, Like you've done a lot for a year.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you have done a lot for a year Now. I always liked NAD Park, like it was one of the better courses in the area. I guess what you know. What were some of the specific things that were needing attention?
Speaker 1:Well, so I fell in love with disc golf at NAD Park. This was, this was like my home course, and I started playing disc golf in 2021. Definitely like a COVID baby when it comes to, you know, disc golf and, as a former landscaper, so I used to do agroecology and edible landscaping professionally I have a couple of degrees in that and I would walk through the course and just ogle at the what what I call the bones of the park or bones of a landscape, what I call the bones of the park or bones of a landscape. And NAD Park just has so much diversity to it in terms of environment we're not talking about like ecological diversity, but it's got so much elevation to it. It's got some really great shots to it.
Speaker 1:So you have your stock hyzers, you have your straight shots, which are, of course, the hardest shot in disc golf. You've got your fade shots and which are, of course, the hardest shot in disc golf. You've got your fade shots, and all in a par three. And so, for somebody like myself, when I went to NAD Park as a beginner, I mean I was getting 30 or 40 feet off the tee, thinking I was pretty hot stuff, and then grew into my game and I watch people who are just early beginners going out there with their kids, intermediates honing in their game and pros honing in their technical skills from the blue pads to the long baskets and things right. So I enjoyed going to Nat. I think I was playing four or five times a week with my dog, really enjoying it.
Speaker 1:But over time this is over the course of a couple years, right, I'm watching how many people are going through the course and during the explosion of covid and the popularity of disc golf during covid and it was, I actually started to see notable degradation in the course. Um, from the time that I started and that kind of just piqued a question in my mind like what's this going to look like in 10 years if we continue down this road? Right, and it was that. So there was noticing the degradation. There was also noticing like the tripping hazards and things with the routes that were popping up in the fairways. I have a friend of mine who is peripherally blind and can't hear very well and when we would go golf even now, I mean, if we go to a fairway that we haven't gotten to yet, he trips and he always has a stumble in there and it was a bummer to see right. So I wanted to do something that would help make the course safer for everybody to play, make it more beautiful and and kind of highlight the bones and some of the the things that I was seeing in the park I want to say that, um, I was noticing, like you said, the roots coming up and that's
Speaker 2:something that I was noticing was that there are more and more roots, and it was specifically what is it? Is it fifth, no 16? Is the the old hill one? Yeah. Watching how that just started to wash away, especially with having Bud Pell gone, you could tell where people have been walking more and more.
Speaker 1:Getting that increase in traffic?
Speaker 2:at.
Speaker 1:NAD, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:So I don't have a trained eye for this type of stuff. What are some of the things like you talk about the course degrading and also for our listeners, like what are some of the telltale signs and the things that you look for as a trained?
Speaker 1:professional Sure. So I am trained. Just to be really clear, I am trained in agroecology, which is the study of the ecology of agricultural systems. However, a lot of those things transfer over, and one of the things that is very notable is what Jenny was just saying is that the roots popping up through the topsoil is actually a really bad sign, because that means that the topsoil has eroded enough that a distance from the tree we're not talking about like roots, just kind of popping up right next to a tree Roots will come up and they'll go into the ground and they'll anchor down. But the feeder roots of a tree are right there around the surface. We call it a drip line.
Speaker 1:So if you look at a tree canopy, where the tree canopy comes to its terminal diameter, like its circle, and and it drops down, that, where it drops down straight down from the farthest reaches of the branches that's called the drip line and in from there to the trunk, is the primary, uh, feeder roots of a tree. And this goes, generally speaking, for all trees. Okay, very generally speaking. Um, if you start to see roots, anchor roots, which are these thick knobby roots that you can see in in nad park right now, these thick knobby roots popping up, that's an indication that those anchor roots, which tend to be a little bit lower, are now higher than your feeder roots. So generally, generally, they'll be about parallel, but if they're higher, that means the feeder roots are going down lower. And in NAD Park in particular, we have a high water table, which means the water is really close to the soil surface and there's a shrinking depth of soil that the trees can get nutrients and a shrinking depth in which they can anchor. And that's why in some of the windstorms that we had, like a couple of years ago, big trees were coming down because they were getting blown over, because they don't have that anchor. So that's one thing to watch for. I know that was a bunch of like stuff and we can get into a little bit more if we want to, but generally speaking, you don't want to see roots coming up. Okay, so that's one thing.
Speaker 1:Uh, another thing that I was noticing is there's a lot of noxious weeds in there that are taking root. Um, there's things called buttercup. Uh, there's stinky Bob, there's a couple of, like Ivy Holly, um some other invasive species that are are taking hold in that park, and um other than that, I mean it's looking at the park itself. There is a good diversity of trees. It's still a pretty decent forest and we're catching it right at the right time, I think, to restore the park. It's not too far gone, right. This isn't a landscape that is past its prime and it's never coming back. We can absolutely restore this, and we have plans to do not only soil restoration but planting in the park and bring the diversity of plant species back.
Speaker 3:It's a gorgeous property.
Speaker 1:It really is.
Speaker 3:And Nat Park's also many, many years ago I think, where I went and played like one of my first rounds of disc golf ever and I only played one and it was kind of hokey in this weird sport and I never really came back to it but I had a lot of fun. And then, like you, uh, the COVID dawned, the uh, you're really getting into the disc golf and bonding over disc golf. So kind of a fun little sidetrack story there well, I was gonna say so.
Speaker 2:I grew up in the area and I actually used to play on the playground at nad park as a kid that sandpit area there was that little playground, whatever.
Speaker 2:And um then, when I had my kids back in 2008 2009 area, um, my former mother-in-law worked at the scout shop, which is right across the way right, so I spent a lot of time at nad park and, you know, avoiding disc golf, but one of the things I remember about the scout shop was that people were studying the ecology of the the creatures living on the roof, because it was like its own little ecosystem and that's why they never repaired the roof interesting yeah and there's still a bunch of what we call in um the.
Speaker 1:The term for that is epiphytes. So you have these ferns that are coming out of tree branches and things. Those are called epiphytes, and that roof is absolutely covered in moss and epiphytes and it's.
Speaker 2:It's awesome I love it too.
Speaker 1:It's a beautiful roof, yeah yeah, it's unfortunately, I think, actually rotting through now. Yeah so the city may have to do something about that. I'm not. I'm not gonna speak for the city. I'm not sure exactly what they're gonna do, but they're gonna do something about it eventually so talk about, uh, soil restoration, because I have no idea about that.
Speaker 3:What are your plans to do the soil restoration?
Speaker 1:yeah. So, um, let's, let's talk, uh, let's talk what plants need, okay. Okay, so, the a plant generally, like, as I, as I was saying earlier, their feeder roots are generally in that top, let's say, foot or two feet of soil depth, and that's because there's a lot of microbe activity. So you have a lot of bacteria and you have a lot of fungi and you've got all sorts of little macro creatures like worms and things that are pooping and giving plants, uh, nutrients that they can suck up, right, and so that's all in, like the top foot of the soil, generally speaking. Then the trees, which are incredibly efficient. Uh, I like to think of trees as entities because I'm that kind of hippie.
Speaker 2:It's because you play disc golf.
Speaker 1:It's because I play disc golf and I've seen them reach out and grab my disc.
Speaker 3:Don't tell me otherwise when you're not looking. They move, they do, they do, they do.
Speaker 1:And there's the little elves underneath those ferns that pull your disc in. Those little fern elves, they steal discs. And the elves underneath those ferns that pull your disc in as a little fern elves, they, they, they steal discs. And the squirrels are the disc golf gods. Yeah, the squirrels, right, the squirrels, the squirrels. So there's a bunch of nutrients in the top, that top, uh foot or so, and so the way that uh most forests will produce that those nutrients is they drop their leaves right or they have they. The tree will fall over and it will eventually uh rot away and go into become soil.
Speaker 1:Okay, so that's a forest right um that is primarily made up of like woody debris and leaves that's it.
Speaker 1:It's just that, and then that feeds the microbes. The microbes like um, the, the, the degrade that and then they make it available to the plants as nutrients. So what we're doing for soil restoration here is very different than you would see in a manicured landscape Like you would a home. If you're doing manicured landscaping, you're bringing in compost, you're bringing in top soil, you're putting on like thick layers of different kinds of mulch, you're acidifying the soil, you're doing all sorts of different things to like micromanage it. What we're doing is just putting down mulch from native trees in the area. That's it. That's all we're doing, and by doing that we're protecting the soil from being eroded by foot traffic and rain and allowing those microbes the chance to start to eat away at those. At that mulch, which is a woody it's just woody debris, right and it's got some leaves in it. It's got some needles in it pine needles in it, not needles syringe needles, pine needles, right so it's all safe and all that is will be degraded down into what's uh called humus, not hummus.
Speaker 1:You don't want to dip your bread in it and eat it, it's humus. I don't know.
Speaker 1:You might want to, you might want to Definitely take your toddlers down and let them eat like native soil. It's great for their immune system. That's well documented. For myself, I find a lot of joy in getting muddy, but yeah, humus is this kind of like microbial soup that allows um trees and plants in a forest to absorb nutrients. So all we do to make that happen is mulch and, in our case, and then, and by directing people um in the fairways, by using paths, we keep them from going off just wherever in the forest and wherever in the fairway, and that allows those areas that have generally just been trampled on to rest and rebuild the soil themselves natively. And we're going to be doing that with replanting too, which we can get into a little bit later is there a way you can get my disc to stay like not so all over the fairway?
Speaker 1:No, no, that's all you, Brandon.
Speaker 2:So, with that in mind, as part of the restoration process, would I mean some courses, yes, but like for Nat, would you consider saying like this area is OB, Like if it got bad enough, would you say we have to put in an OB over here so that this area can be restored.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and just to clarify, I will answer that question from my own point of view. But just to clarify, the NAD Restoration Project. We're actually only focused, strictly focused, on the restoration side of things and we're leaving. There's another organization in our area I know majority of our listeners for this podcast are in the Kitsap area and some nationwide but in our area we have a great organization called the West Sound Disc Golf Association and they are really responsible for how the course plays. So where they put the tee pads, where they put the baskets, you know how, if they do any course, actual, like fairway changes, they'll do that. And then we'll come in and, you know, mulch that fairway Right, and so there'll be the ones that will decide whether or not a certain area is is hazard, ob or out about, like you know, off limits entirely or whatever. I personally think that, depending on the fairway, hazards will play one way and OBs will play another way, and if it's difficult to see an area where a disc has crossed a line, just call it a hazard right.
Speaker 1:And play it from where it lies. Don't do a drop zone Right and play it from where it lies. Don't do a drop zone or anything, just play it from where it lies. So let's take hole two at NAD. Excuse me, hole two at NAD is, I think, a 268 foot throw. It drops 20 feet from a ridge down into an area. That's got a lot of sensitive soil to it right.
Speaker 3:It's kind of a wetland down there when it rains especially yeah, so wetland is uh, it's not a perennial wetland okay, yeah excuse me, it's, uh, considered an ephemeral stream.
Speaker 1:What that means is that it it comes in with the wet season and then during the summer it's gone right, it's dry in that area. So that's, that's the ephemeral nature. It's, it's there and it's not our intermittent stream, and that area in particular used to have a trail that like walked right through it, right, remember that I remember that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and it was just sloppy and slippery and it was actually not. It wasn't unsafe, but it wasn't super secure soil, right, yeah, and so that area in there which is at the bottom of the fairway is super pretty and, I think, making that section a hazard. I have a YouTube video that we just did for the project in which I kind of show it off a little bit. It's hard to see because it's in the snow, but there's a graphic that describes it, and in that video you can see the area that I would think would work well as a hazard. Now, that again is up to the WSDGA, but the way that it would work in my mind is a hazard. It would go in there, you would take a footbridge into that area, you would get your disc with retrieval stick and then you either walk it out and throw it from where you walked in, or you throw it from one of the foot bridges or something like that. You know you just can you treat it like a hazard, um, and then the access road at the end, right.
Speaker 1:So there's that access road right behind, like 30 feet or so past the basket yeah man, if you overshoot the basket that far on that hole and you go into that access road ob right because you know where that went out, does that make sense?
Speaker 2:He knows right where you're talking about, because he's over there often, or he ends up at the B basket for four sometimes.
Speaker 3:Somehow I managed lately to flip up a zone and it went to B basket. On what is that? Five, Four, Four. Dial it back bro it's weird man, it's weird you live by the power, you die by the power. I guess so man, you know I'm not bragging about it. It took a lot of hard work and a lot of dedication to get to that point, and I'm just grateful to be able to play like that. Um, however, the control and the you know, learning the different touch and everything, because it's so much different.
Speaker 2:Uh, that's been a little bit more of a task and not knowing you can throw that far and having the kid with us trying to find it. We eventually found it under some leaves way over there and it's like, oh, my disc could be anywhere.
Speaker 1:I saw a guy throw a fairway driver out there today while I was working in the park and we actually it was a dark fairway driver with an orange rim. Oh goodness.
Speaker 1:Oh man, it went into that. I think it's salmonberry and thimbleberry that are back there. It's kind of like a big hedge of mystery plants that are just kind of all jumbled together like any kind of Northwest forest, and it went back in there and it took us probably 15 minutes to do it. So one of the things that I think would be great and I want to put this to a vote to the community, and the community here in the Kitsap will see a lot more graphics that are votable in the future, right now we're just laying out the pathways, but as we get into planting and as we get into things that will actually kind of change infrastructure and or design.
Speaker 1:That would change the play in minor ways. We'll be putting that to a vote for the community. Vote for the community. What I would like to see is like thicker plants like that are perennial and evergreen, like a rhododendron, like a hedge rhododendron at the back end of that, right next to the access road, so that you're not having to go and lose your desk.
Speaker 3:Yeah Right, kind of like a geo fence type of thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah and that's yeah. That's a great way of looking at it Eco fence. Eco fence yeah sure, that would be a great way of looking at it. Eco-fence Eco-fence yeah sure, that would be a great way of looking at it, and having something like that at the end of the fairway would, I think, help play, you know it would help the golfers along and it would also keep.
Speaker 1:There's another planting that I would like to do that would protect, actually, the blue pad on hole one. So we have red pads and we have blue pads. In that park we also have a long basket and a short basket and that the blue pad is considered the more technically difficult pad to throw from. But it's also if you get a little bit of a turn on a disc and it doesn't fade out and it goes dead straight down the down the gap of the fairway when you flip up a zone when you flip up a zone.
Speaker 1:When you flip up a zone, it could end up going to that blue pattern endangering somebody that's on that pad. Now, I've never seen that happen, Like where somebody's actually had to duck, but the point being there that you know it improves safety of the park and you know that's how we're thinking about designing this course and, I think, ways that, as courses develop over time and we're going to see a lot more of this need of restoring parks, maintaining parks, using ecological whether that's plant or some sort of change, like water in a course to help the play out.
Speaker 1:So it's not like just saying here's an open ball golf course, here's some whiskers, that's your fairway. You can see the fairway, but it is made up of ecological and natural barriers or natural targets to throw at, and I would love to see disc golf moving more in that direction. So it's more of a natural experience.
Speaker 3:Well, yeah, and that's more enjoyable for the player too, because there's more to look at, more to experience, more to be around, and a lot of people go disc golfing to have that time with nature and reground themselves.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I was going to say that. You know, I keep saying this. I think it really honors the space too by, you know, taking wherever it is and finding what is that thing that I want people to be able to see. How do I honor this and keep this so that people can see it years and years and years down the road too?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and it'll develop too. There's actually a you know that stump at like right dead center of the fairway on hole two. It's like burned out now yeah.
Speaker 1:So that apparently used to be a large maple or something and it looks like a maple stump. It doesn't. It looks like hardwood because it's been like that for a long time. Right next to it is a mound of soil and that soil is all eroded down. You can see the rocks coming up through it. It's very compact. I would love to put a crabapple tree there, because in the spring it would be beautiful. It'd be all this pink flowers and everything just popping, and it's a nice dense tree. So if a disc goes in there, right, it's gonna drop out, it's just gonna drop flat.
Speaker 1:It's not gonna kick in there, right, it's going to drop out. It's just going to drop flat. It's not going to kick off. Funky right. And that would be the one that would be right in front of that blue pad.
Speaker 3:I think that would look beautiful. I'm picking up what you're putting down. That's cool.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I am going to put in a plug though. So on hole 17, right in front of. So there's the weird stump that's kind of laying down with the tree behind it. So that's stump.
Speaker 1:So are you talking about the tea? Are you talking about what?
Speaker 2:From the teapad of the red when you walk past it. The leaning tree, the leaning, big leaning tree. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, We'll talk about it. Oh yeah, let's get into it that little stump right there.
Speaker 2:I call that my dragon because it looks like a sleeping dragon to me. So I always pet it on the way by. I love that. Yes, I love that.
Speaker 3:Can you put it on the front of the course?
Speaker 1:so that we hit less trees, or she can rub it for good luck for her round.
Speaker 3:Yeah, exactly yeah. Yeah. Before we tee off yeah, yeah, that tree.
Speaker 1:So NAD Park has a lot of natural obstacles to it trees that have fallen and the city of Bremerton, which has been an incredible partner in this project. They have, for the last 20 years, really been treating that park like a forest and in a lot of ways, that has been a great benefit. It's also the thing that held the park back from being maintained.
Speaker 1:But, now we're like full on into into it and I think we've seen this great marriage so far in our uh partnership of having a forest, but also recognizing that we have 40 000 rounds played there a year. That's like and that was 2023 numbers. We're 108 rounds a day this year, in 2024, we dropped a little bit, so get your u-Discs out and your app and mark your rounds, but we were down to 93 rounds a day still.
Speaker 3:That's still a lot.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's like what 35,000 rounds a year or something. I mean that is a ton of traffic going through that park.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh and they're recognizing that there's so much foot traffic going through there. So we're working with them to acknowledge and identify trees that may be a risk, trees that are leaning, that aren't a risk, trees that are staples of the course, that are obstacles and if they were gone would completely change play of a whole. And that one on 17 you're you're talking about. I mean we're talking about a what? 80 foot or something tree it's huge, huge tree it's a huge.
Speaker 1:The root ball on that thing is six feet tall. No, maybe it's not. Maybe it's like four and a half no, no, no, you're on, am I?
Speaker 1:you're on track, oh man it's huge right huge and that thing fell across the the fairway, shot the tee shot of the blue pad and has made that hole one of the most technically difficult tee shots that I've and not. I've played maybe about 50 different courses in the four years that I've been playing and I have never seen a tee shot more difficult and more nuanced than that shot. You got to beat it, you got to beat the tree, you really got to beat it. Do you go under it or do you go over it?
Speaker 3:Oh boy, I hit it, you hit it. It depends on how I'm feeling that day. I don't know, hey, if I could put a plug in. You know, on 17,. There's that little itty bitty one that's maybe two inches around, that sticks up in the middle of the fairway the one that's stripped of all its yeah if that one just happened to win away, I wouldn't be sad about it yeah, so um no not I can't do that I've actually I've had, I've had directed from the city, like we will not touch any tree that's standing, even unless it's an absolute uh risk to the that's good players yeah that's good though yeah, and I like it.
Speaker 1:I like that, I there are. There's a one on 14, right in the middle of the backhand t shot oh man, it has robbed me of so many good shots.
Speaker 1:Yeah, oh yeah, yeah, no, I feel you and there's the one that I think is going to be. The city said they're going to take this down and I I hope that they do, just because I think it's actually a very unsafe tree, is what we call the tree of shame among my friends, and that's the one on hole nine. It's the big dead snag right in the middle right in the middle.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:The city and I went out there and we were reaching in and grabbing chunks of wood out of it.
Speaker 3:You can see where we were. We were like oh, that's what that was, that's what that was, that's what that was we were. We were somebody was messing with it, yeah well, we were, but we were.
Speaker 1:we were exploring to see how rotted out that thing is just punky. But in Arborist talk is called punky. It's just like rotted out wood. Pull it out and squeeze water out of it like yeah, yeah it's punky, so um that whole, that whole tree, eventually will have to come down. Um, if it doesn't come down, in some of the winds we've been having around here, yeah, you know, yeah, I just keep thinking that someone's gonna hit it with a disc.
Speaker 2:Just the right way, and it's just gonna I want to be that guy.
Speaker 3:I really want to be that guy. Yeah, wouldn't that be something to see, though it's like you hit the disc just right, and then the whole freaking thing.
Speaker 1:I've seen somebody take a limb out doing that. In my first year disc golfing, my buddy and I went out to fairgrounds and he had a limb and it just hit it just right and this whole thing just came falling out of a tree. You're like, wow, man, put a little power on it.
Speaker 3:Hot tip, though, on hole. What is it, seven? That tree on the right that guards the fairway, that is hollow in the middle, and if you get somebody to get up in there, you can probably find a bunch of discs down in the middle of that tree.
Speaker 4:You think, oh, we know, oh really, we've seen it happen.
Speaker 2:Oh wow, is that where mine got lost Down in the middle? And Rochelle, are you talking about fairgrounds?
Speaker 3:Yeah, fairgrounds, oh, you're talking about fairgrounds.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that was Michelle Lynch.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's who it was.
Speaker 2:There's a maple on the right. It's that before you walk across the street, that hole. Yeah, so there's a big maple here on the right, that's split and she caught a disc right in the middle of it and it went down in there. It's hollow, it's hollow oh, no way.
Speaker 3:So there's probably some discs down in there. Yeah, yeah, if you get to take a ladder out there.
Speaker 2:So you know you've got about 40 people gonna get it yeah, michelle's favorite favorite river is in there if you're, if you're listening to this podcast. Michelle would like her river back.
Speaker 3:But just a quick descriptor for the listeners out there that aren't familiar with this course. So NAD Park is the Naval Ammunition Depot. That's what it stands for.
Speaker 1:Correct, yeah, naval Ammunition Depot yeah.
Speaker 3:And it's a very popular place for disc golf, of course, and it's very noticeable because the landmark is the big jet that's out front of it with the teeth and everything. A classic fighter jet.
Speaker 1:That's right. Yeah, If you're from the area, it's at the intersection of Austin Drive and Kitsap Way.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and for our listeners out there, it's a really really cool disc golf course, if you're ever able to get out there, and it's my understanding that there are what four different layouts that are playable there and I I mean, I think you could say the four different layouts, so you have the red short, red to long, blue to short, blue to long, but then you can do alternating holes and stuff like that. Like you know, red to short there's a lot of combinations right yeah, I think I did the math on it.
Speaker 1:There were like 72 combinations, which is stupid, like it's just like nobody's actually going to play 72 different combinations of that course.
Speaker 2:And then there's the short pitch and putt up front.
Speaker 1:Right, the discovery course, yeah.
Speaker 3:Now I heard once upon a time that this course was designed so that like red shorts was like easier, beginner-friendly course, and then the Blue Longs were supposed to be like the 1,000 rated. It was supposed to hit the full spectrum, from the easiest course to the most difficult course in the county. Is that?
Speaker 1:accurate. I mean at my level of playing disc golf, yeah, I would say that's accurate. I think the Blue to long is so technically difficult. It's, it's hard. Yeah, there's tiny, tiny gaps and and if you like wooded disc golf, you're in the Washington state area and you want to make a trip out to nad park and just do it. It's so worth it. Bremerton. But the park itself.
Speaker 1:You can warm up. If you're a thousand rated disc golfer, you can warm up. I've got a great story about LA Hanson, don't let me forget. You can warm up on reds and then to short and then you can really challenge yourself on those blue to longs, because some of the like we were talking on 17, or the blue to long on two, oh my Lord, that is a tough shot.
Speaker 1:It's a hard hyzer. So it's not stock hyzer, we're talking like a spike hyzer. But you don't have the ceiling. So you've either got to thread it like a straight shot down the left side of the fairway or you shoot off at a 45-degree angle and it's got to go around an entire area into a gap and then miss all the ghost trees, all the guardians, and somehow land within putting distance of the blue basket, the long basket With nothing in the way. With nothing in the way, and if you manage to do that you can get a birdie. But this is a par three and it would be an easy par four. So it's a great par three, but it's hard, it's really hard.
Speaker 3:Yeah, oh yeah, I know exactly. Yeah, yeah, oh yeah, I know exactly. Yeah, yeah, I like playing the blue to longs. Every once in a while I like the challenge. But you say that you're in Washington Woods Golf. It's like we don't really get a choice If you're in Washington, you're playing Woods Golf.
Speaker 1:There's some growing ball golf courses out there and you have like Kayak Point. You have down in olympia. You've got um delphi, delphi right, you know, and I I think those are fine, but I think the joy of disc golf and the disc golf experience in the woods is something completely. It's a totally different beast. And when you're good at that kind of golf and you can then go to translate that to accurate shots, you know, on a on a golf course, I don't know about that right like you've got the distance you've got a full game.
Speaker 1:But if you're playing in somewhere like iowa, no offense to ganaber, but if you're playing in a place like iowa and you've got no trees, you don't have the experience to work around trees. Here in washington state we have so many in the northwest in general we have so many trees that you have to know your release points, you have to know your angles, you have to know your discs and what they're going to, how they're going to thread you know, through all these, these gaps it's so bad that when we get out to the ball golf courses, we don't know what to do because we play in the woods and it's like I think, all right.
Speaker 2:so if this was similar like I'm playing hole one at Delphi and I'm like I'm thinking, oh, it's kind of like you know one of the shots in the woods. How do I get my disc to go this way? Well, I could do it with the trees, but in the open field I end up going all the way over here to the left, past the OB. It's like my disc never does that when it's in the wood. It's just like it's a mental block for me that.
Speaker 2:I have a really hard time with the big open courses.
Speaker 1:I've had a hard time personally with distance management and depth perception in open courses when, when I I leave the woods I'm like, oh yeah, no, that I've got that. That's 100, you know 100 feet. Or 125 feet. Oh no, it's 250 feet from where I am, but I can't tell because I don't have the trees to tell me.
Speaker 3:You know the background and the foreground will play tricks on your eyes. That's for sure you know, when I get out to those open courses I get all excited and I'm like okay, I can finally bomb. You know, it's not. It's not 18 uh, 200 to 250 foot shot shapes. It's let's wind up and let her rip and let's get those. You know 300, 350, 400 foot shots and uh. But then I end up losing all my control and end up going ob anyway so?
Speaker 1:so you're saying so basically, that when you throw in the woods it's the tree's fault, but when you're throwing in the golf courses.
Speaker 4:it's the course's fault. It's always the course's fault. Yeah, it's the wind.
Speaker 3:Those OBs you know there shouldn't be there. Agreed, it should just be a free for all. Agreed. All right. So what else can you tell? What other initiatives do you have going with the NAD Park Restoration Project?
Speaker 1:Yeah. So I'll go over our goals a little bit. Yes, please. So the way that we see this project is we see it as a and I say we because it is more than myself. So I'm the project lead, I'm the guy that started the project and got it going. However, I am working with a great crew of guys who we call ourselves the NAD Rangers and go NAD Rangers. That's our little carrying call during our meeting. So the NAD Rangers, we are kind of the work party planning and the thinking group and it's really open. So we're not a 501c3. We're hoping to be soon and I can talk a little bit Now.
Speaker 3:is that the NAD Rangers being the 501?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and I'll talk about that a little bit because it does diverge from the NAD restoration project itself, but we are seeing a real need for restoration, of course, is all across the Northwest and the country. But the way that we are approaching it is our planning and thinking about what work parties we want to do, what kind of fundraising we want to do, who do we want to partner with, how are we going to go about doing things, and we're kind of a sounding board for each other. But right now, the way that it works is if you want to be there, you're welcome, and if you don't want to be there anymore, that's totally fine. It's all based on your excitement and enthusiasm around the project, and if life gets busy, you're not obligated to be there, and if life gets busy, you're not obligated to be there.
Speaker 1:We really want, you know, the four of us it's myself, chris Pendleton, matt Melanson, jay Reeves and Ian Williamson the four of us are the ones that are yeah, the four of us counting my fingers are the ones that are, you know, kind of spinning ideas with each other, and we always I think we do a pretty good job of checking in with each other and saying like, hey, you know how are we doing. Can you be here for this? Can you not be here for this? What's going to work for you, what's not going to work for you? Like, we had a February 8th work party set, it snowed.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah.
Speaker 1:And it was a rain or shine work party, didn't say anything about snow, so we canceled it and we moved it to now, march 1st, and that was because Jay and Matt were available to run it. I just happened to have the day off from the hospital. It's usually my weekend to work. I'm a nurse by profession and so I'm going to be able to join the guys and I've been working out there this week kind of getting things ready for it. But that's kind of how we work together as a group. So yeah, so that's the NAD restoration project, the NAD Rangers, and I lost track of the original question, but you want to repeat that and maybe I can get back on track.
Speaker 2:Kind of, what are your goals like? Oh yeah, the goals yes.
Speaker 1:Okay, on track, kind of. What are your goals like? Oh yeah, the goals, yes, okay. So our goals are based on the designs that I did last year for the city of Bremerton, and our number one goal is our foundational restoration. Now, when I say foundational restoration, what I mean is the restoration or renovation of all the T-pads to be of a similar aesthetic, and the way that we're doing that right now is that we have retaining blocks on a perimeter that hold in what I like to refer to as a warning track of gravel and that if you're throwing, you don't have to be thinking am I going to fall off this tee pad? You know that if your foot goes past the tee pad a little bit, you're going to be on gravel and you're going to be okay. So there's that renovation of the of the tee pad, didn't somebody?
Speaker 3:some years ago on hole 10 fall off and break their ankle.
Speaker 1:Yeah, there's been a. There's apparently been undocumented cases of people hurting themselves on the tee pads. It's that and that's. I don't know the details of those kind of that, and I know there's a lot of people who are very tentative about that, about saying anything regarding injuries on the tee pads, because they don't want the city to shut down the golf course. I want to state this for the record the city is not shutting down NAD Park, okay.
Speaker 3:So it sounds like they're investing in it.
Speaker 1:They are. They're investing in, in, like, just with with so much enthusiasm and I say enthusiasm as it was a very solid word choice when I present to the the parks commission the designs for you know, the next upcoming holes, they're always like oh, we're so glad to see you again and this is so great, Glad you're doing work out there. They're really into it, so that's great. The foundational goal for us, and that is the pads and the fairways. Mulching of the fairways is a 24 month goal, right. So all 18 holes, um, and that's 18 tee pads, from red to the red tee pads and then the fairways to the short. Okay, so the reason that we did red to short is because red to short is what 90% of people play, according to UDisc.
Speaker 1:So, we want to make sure our foundational work addresses the majority of the play and just gets people thinking about. This is where I walk when I play NAD Park. We're focused. What I like to say I play NAD Park, we're focused. What I like to say is focusing the fairways. We're not narrowing the fairways. I originally said narrowing the fairways. What I mean is that we're giving you a area to walk, a path to follow. It's called wayfinding in landscape architecture and that wayfinding allows us to just protect the areas, the native areas, from being trampled on Because, like on hole four, it's a wide fairway. You can just walk seven people abreast and trample through it and just chatting, which is fine. I do it all the time myself. I'm not, you know no shade to anybody.
Speaker 1:I'm always walking with my the card of four and you're just walking four abreast. That's 16-foot fairway right there, right. But if we narrow it down to six feet and then we start putting in logs to protect planting areas and beds and things like that, not only does it make it a little bit more technically challenging and a little bit more technically fun, but then we don't have people just kind of willy-nilly walking anywhere, trampling on potentially young plants that'll be sprouting and regrowing the forest floor.
Speaker 3:Well, and speaking of hole one, I mean I appreciate the fact of being able to walk up the fairway and my shoes and my feet will be dry for the rest of the round.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:Then there's that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and that's the other thing that we wanted to address is the safety of that, because when your feet are wet like that and you're in mud, I mean there's a good chance you're going to slip right. I've done it a couple of times myself and when it comes to that, there's a mud puddle that we have. It's a seasonal mud puddle. It gets nice and sloppy during the winter and then in the spring it's a total mud pit.
Speaker 2:I was going to say you're taking a lot of liberties by calling it a puddle, like I call it a lake.
Speaker 1:I know Well the reason I don't call it a pond is because that's a whole different ecological category which perks up the ears of ecologists who are like a pond with an ephemeral stream. Tell me more. Are there salmon in there? And there's not.
Speaker 2:There's not, that would be hilarious if there was just one random salmon right there right?
Speaker 4:no, somebody should take like a salmon beanie, baby or something oh god on a stomper tree belly up
Speaker 3:jay could knit one for you. Oh yeah, you could.
Speaker 2:There we go, I'm gonna uh knit what's called yarn bomb the course. Oh, I would love that. Yeah, personally I would. I think that's amazing all right and that's actually so.
Speaker 1:Um the okay, ella, hansen yarn bombing. Um, we'll get. I love this, I want to get.
Speaker 1:I want to talk about artists too, because I think there's such a ripe opportunity for artists to come in and like beautify, the course, but that, that mud puddle, that that mucky area, the, the pit, the, the place where nobody likes to end up, on hole one that is. I've seen older disc golfers go in there and have very close falls or have falls, and there's, there were limbs in there. So last summer I pulled out all the limbs in that mud pit so that nobody can really fall or trip or grab their foot in any funky way and hurt themselves. What we're planning on doing, and what we've had approval from the city to do, is actually have a series of three foot bridges that go over and around that pond and then have a dock that goes out to the middle of it.
Speaker 3:Oh, that's so cool yeah.
Speaker 1:So now, if you're on Facebook, you go to the NAD Volunteer Stewardship Group. That pond schematic that I drew up and presented to the city is what our profile. What's that landscape shot that?
Speaker 2:you have at the beginning, yeah, your cover page.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the cover shot, that's the pond schematic that I drew. So that's gives you an idea of kind of where we're shooting for now, speaking of hazards and all that kind of thing, if you land in that pond it's going to be a stroke, right, like just even if you're playing casually, your friends are probably going to say, oh, that's, hey, have the drop zone, be that dock, that would be cool, right? Yep, you're putting from the dock. You know what I mean. Like fun stuff like that. This is how I think restoring disc golf courses could go where it's. It's not about, like putting up the like the wind sock things that you see outside of a car dealership to make it more difficult or, like you know, putting up fake obstacles. You can use the natural environment, you can use the natural topography and the movement of a natural movement, of course, to make it more challenging and more fun now you're doing all this stuff to uh, regenerate the vegetation and the soil and everything.
Speaker 3:are you doing anything to attract wildlife? Are you putting in birdhouses and things of that nature? Man, I'm really glad you asked that, tell us about that?
Speaker 1:Yeah, so I would. Right now we have a couple, I think, just replanting and providing food for seasonal birds and then stacking up some of the debris intentionally the wood and fallen logs and branches and things and stacking those in piles that provides rodent cover, rodents not necessarily being rats, but squirrels what squirrels yeah, oh, squirrels, squirrels, we got this, we got this um, so have you could have squirrel habitat.
Speaker 1:Um, you can have other habitat in those areas. Uh, it's a great place for nerds not nerds for birds to nest all the nerds and for nerds to best there's. There's nerds in the trees and uh, yeah, our plantings are going to include things like snowberries and thimbleberries and red isure dogwood and, um, the crab apple and stuff like that, so there will be habitat and uh, food for uh, the, the, the birds and for, you know, any kind of other rodent stuff.
Speaker 1:We really don't have any deer, but we have incredible owls there in the park and I actually want to get an owl tattoo, um, for nad park, because I just I love the owls there. If you watch that YouTube video I just posted, this is February of 2025. I did a AI generated image of, or video from Sora and it was the owl in a rain slicker pulling a wheelbarrow full of wood chips, which is pretty awesome. I love the owl out there and that's our mascot for NAD Park.
Speaker 3:But yeah, and then eventually I would like to get to the point where we're putting up bat boxes in the area I was just going to say, with the moisture and the wetness around there, having some bat boxes to kind of control the insect population would be very beneficial.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I think so and I think it would do. Yeah, yeah, I think so and I think it would. It would, uh, it would do well too, I think, if we had some bat boxes and some other intentional like habitat that we we built Some owl boxes maybe. Yeah.
Speaker 3:To attract more owls to the area.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, exactly Exactly.
Speaker 3:Cause I mean you're got to have the natural predators in there correct, correct yeah, gotcha yeah, so we're.
Speaker 1:We are thinking along those lines in terms of all sides of the ecology. So everything from you know flora and the fauna, the plants and the animals, and um, and yeah, uh, wanting to also make it a interesting experience to uh walk through with art, whether that's doing sculptures out there, if you're not familiar with Andy Goldsworthy work, andy Goldsworthy is a nature artist. That's so incredible. And as we get into the 14th, 15th, 16th hillside those three holes they share one hillside there's a lot of work that needs to be done with terracing and slowing down the erosion on that hillside and I think doing that in an artistic way and not a sterile industrial way or a civil engineering way, but really thinking about it carefully, could be super cool, like really, really interesting and fun.
Speaker 3:Well, and that's something I would love to see more of, just in general, is the marriage of art and nature and disc golf together. Because, I think that'd just be super cool. You're walking through the woods and stuff and then you just see this cool little art piece that just fits in so well and it'd be like bam, you know, it make the whole thing pop yeah, you mean not when you're walking through evergreen and there's a random doll's head or there just happens to be like this is
Speaker 3:creepy bunch of little like there was a woody there's creepy stuff out there, yeah, yeah it's art.
Speaker 2:I call it art.
Speaker 3:It's fun well I mean, if you duct tape a banana to the wall, I mean I still can't believe. How much did that sell?
Speaker 2:for a few million I don't know, I didn't buy it it sold for a few million dollars.
Speaker 1:Some yahoo it's less than what you spent on discs zing yeah, you, you know, and the guy that bought that banana yeah took it off the wall and ate it. Yeah, it was like dude, you just bought a 30 cent banana that had been yeah you know, going brown up there and ripening and who knows how many, for four million dollars or whatever.
Speaker 3:Well, and we then we also live through the nft thing, the non-fudgeable token thing, online.
Speaker 2:It's like yeah, yeah, like why, but huh yeah yeah I will say, though, that one of my favorite things and um I always go out and I take pictures of every single trillium that I find and so finding the little pockets where there's trilliums on like whole um. Eight has a lot on the hill and then there's some hidden between the walkway in 6 and 14 there's a couple of trillions she's got them gps, and you wonder why our rounds take four hours yeah, I have to take a picture of every single, every single one of them.
Speaker 3:Yeah right and then she gets this notification. Her cloud is full and it's like what have you been doing all day?
Speaker 1:you know, and that's actually really cool because they're actually are, they're indicator species of a healthy ecosystem and trilliums are one of them.
Speaker 1:So if you haven't, um, if you have a forest, that isn't necessarily old growth. This is not an old growth forest, but it's. It's established itself and it's a healthy ecosystem and it's got healthy soil that is not disturbed. Certain species, like Trillium, that are tender, will be able to establish themselves there, and I love that. When I go through NADD 2 and I see this Trillium, so I'm like you know, it's like seeing the gumption of the park, like it's got it. It wants to be beautiful, and I'm not saying that NAD isn't beautiful. Okay, I want to go back to that a little bit.
Speaker 1:What I'm saying is, with the eye that I've had trained into me, I can see that the park is missing some major components that are not there, that used to be there the reason that I say that is because, if you look down and hole two is again a great example of this and this is why hole two is the icon of the NAD restoration project it's ferns, and those ferns have a foot between each one of them, right. What that indicates to me is that that's like your, that's your base plant palette.
Speaker 1:The ferns are there, but that's because those things's your base plant palette the ferns are there, but that's because those things will live forever, right, and they, they just establish themselves and they're super hardy plants. They have a role in the ecosystem, a lot like alders they will. They will drop their uh, the ferns every year. If you look, if you look under those ferns right now, those ferns have the old fern fronds from last year laying on the ground, protecting the moisture and building soil underneath those ferns from the decaying matter of the of the fern fronds. Right, that's how they establish themselves, that's how they keep themselves and that's where they house the elves that steal your discs true story dirty elves, those elves, dirty elves.
Speaker 2:They took Kaylee's disc within four feet at fairgrounds. Like those, elves work extra hard over at fairgrounds.
Speaker 3:They do, oh my gosh, they do Over time. They really do Over time but.
Speaker 1:I think fairgrounds is actually a really good example. If you look in that gully, off of what hole.
Speaker 3:Five, five and six, yeah, whole five and six. Yeah, five and six.
Speaker 1:Right that gully that gully is a really good example, if you look down into that, of what the natural forest would look like. Now, we can't disc golf in something like that. That's just chaos. But you can take the elements from the natural forest and space them out and make them look beautiful in the fairway so that you have the same experience. But you're not like walking through and trying to manage a monstrosity of a forest. It's managed for height, it's managed for distance, it's managed for where it lands, so like on hole two.
Speaker 1:I'm thinking about this a lot right now because we have this is the work party that we're working on this weekend If you, if you plant dense stuff like salal salal is a native plant up here, that's evergreen, it's very dense and you plant that close to the tee pad, you can prevent erosion and you can. It looks gorgeous, right. But as you go farther down into landing zones, then you get plants that are a little bit hardier, maybe more like a tree, more like a shrub, single stem, something like that, like even red-nosed. Your dogwood, it's got some space into it. You can land in that area and then, if you do, you could go to throw over it. You're not getting blocked by like a forest of trees or a large shrub.
Speaker 3:So you said you had a great story about Ella Hansen. Oh yes, yeah, do tell.
Speaker 1:Okay, ella's. I love Ella, she's so sweet, so she came out for this is. I love to do things right. And I met Ella at the 2022 yeah, I think it was the 2022 Portland Open. Okay, I went down there and she was working with Uplay, which is Uplay discs with um, her and um and Dustin and oh what's her name and Ike.
Speaker 3:Oh, oh, oh. Van Dyken no, and Ike and.
Speaker 1:Ike. Anyway, we're going to cut that part out. So, anyway, she was down there with Uplay Discs and they were doing a demonstration and Cole Rodolin was there and Gannon Burr was was there, and they were all like the young guns, right, but they were like not quite known yet and, uh, so they're showing us, they're demonstrating how far they can throw cole riddallin through like a 600 foot, 600, like five foot, nearly black ace, this practice basket. That was way at the end of this, like ball field and stuff, and Ella was hanging out and I actually didn't know Ella very well at the time, like as a player, right, I haven't, actually I had not heard of her.
Speaker 1:And I just walked up and I said, hey, excuse me, I see you're part of this, like this group, yeah, and she was like, yeah, yeah. I said, hey, I'm looking for coaches in the seattle area. Do you know who I would talk to? And she goes, oh, yeah, me. And I was like, okay, yeah, so you're some random person I just talked to why. You know, like what's going on? This is somebody just trying to sell their services, right? Or she's like, oh, you know, I'll suck this guy into 50 bucks or whatever. And she's like, no, no, I used she tells me about herself.
Speaker 1:She used to be the captain of the ultimate uh you know team and I at a ufo and and stuff. And she was like, no, I, I'm, I can actually. Uh, I live up in the seattle area and I'd be happy to give you a lesson. I was like sure, you know what do you charge? And she told me what she charged. I was 50 or 60 bucks or something for an hour. And then she said, you know, we can play around afterwards. I was like, oh, cool, that sounds fun. And then I of start go home and a researcher. And wow, holy smokes. So I did, I did two lessons with her, I think that fall this was like October, after the season ended in October, november and I said, god, she's so good at being an instructor so good, I mean, she's a great golfer, but she is such a great instructor and I said would you like to come and do a, uh, a clinic in bremerton? She goes, of course. So she comes up, she does a clinic.
Speaker 1:We went to this indoor uh soccer field in our area over at pentagrass yeah, yeah, yeah and had a great time and afterwards, um, myself and a couple local guys, we said hey, do you want to go play around? And this is January and it is dumping Like it's. It's one of those days where it's like an inch and a half of rain, you know, over the course of 24 hours, or maybe an hour, I don't know.
Speaker 1:It was it was dumping and she's like, yeah, sure, we're like you're crazy, but let's do it. So she signed her discs and everything and we ended up um packing up and we went to nad park. Now we're on hole one and um the two guys go first and then ella goes and then I go right. So we t off and ella four hands it and she hits this tree that is just past the mud puddle and she it the way that it hit. I said, oh man, that's, that's bummer, those guardian trees get you. And she's like, yeah, that got me. I was like you know, if you were like three feet higher and like two feet to the right, you would have pinned that long pin, cause you were shooting the long pin Right. I think it was the only pin at the time. Yeah.
Speaker 1:And she goes oh okay, it was just totally nonchalant like sure, kid, whatever. Three feet up to the left she pins the basket and I was like I mean, if you need a caddy, I'm here for you, right on the bag. Oh, it was amazing. I mean, she is such a talented like. That is talent on a different level. It's one thing to watch a local pro be like yeah, you know, I had a, uh, you know a 10, 20 rated round or whatever, and but to have that level of accuracy and intention in your throw and and it just execute it, whether she did that on intentionally or not, or just happened to be this great coincidence that she nailed exactly where I told her to throw, which I believe she really did.
Speaker 2:Oh, oh yeah.
Speaker 1:She's just incredibly accurate. She's such a good, yeah, so we got.
Speaker 3:We got a chance to pal around with her at the uh cascade challenge in 2023. You were the scorekeeper and I was crowd control or something like that.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Just super nice and she also did. Uh, they did a women's clinic, her. And yeah, yeah, yeah, Just super nice. Yeah, and she also did. They did a women's clinic, her and Holland.
Speaker 1:That's right.
Speaker 2:yeah, the next year, yeah so she was really really good at teaching.
Speaker 3:Ella, if you're listening, we'd love to have you on the podcast.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I need another lesson too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think we all do, all three of us.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, the intentional.
Speaker 2:Ella Hansen podcast.
Speaker 3:And Holland, bring Holland. Bring Holland with you. We love Holland too.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I think that you know NAD Park, as this project grows, it is our as the NAD Rangers, as we grow into a 501c3, we want to be doing more stuff like this, but the focus of nab, because this is our home course, this isn't just, you know, hey, we're restoring the, the golf course, right, it's not just about putting down mulch.
Speaker 1:That's all fine and well and and and a lot of courses need that kind of work, but our goal is actually to make this park a national attraction and one of the more beautiful courses in the entire country. Like, not, it can be, it absolutely can be. Oh, absolutely, it's got so many great bones. Like we're going to be putting wood bridges, uh, wooden foot bridges, throughout whole one, two, three and, uh, especially one, two and three, but into five as well, I think potentially and and just having those kind of like fun little aesthetics and things like that will make it such a cool course. And when it is I'm sure you've heard this, simon lazotte is like there needs to be a like a really technical par three on tour for the pros and I think and I'm not saying this lightly I think nad park actually offers pro level difficulty from difficulty, from the blue pads to the long tees.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think so too. Nothing against Shelton and Mason County, but I am very convinced that if Bud Pell was still open, that that's where the Cascade Challenge would have been, because it's long enough. It had the mix and the difficulty, the elevation change, especially the elevation change. But not only that, but it's closer to a lot more infrastructure like hotels, restaurants, businesses, things like that. I mean, shelton's a great city, but compared to the conglomerate of Bremerton, silverdale, poulsbo and even Port Orchard, it can't compete with it, right. So I'm a firm believer that if bud pell is still open, that the pro tour would have been there, and you know who knows. I mean, we have two available courses within the proximity of each other.
Speaker 2:We might have been able to even have a bit at worlds or something yeah, I was gonna say, if you look at the bigger tournaments, like uh the women's tournaments, they're at different courses. So even right here I mean you have frederickson, you have fairgrounds, you have uh nad. I mean they're all really close to each other. So it it would be a good place to have a bigger tournament because it offers so much variety.
Speaker 3:Well, even even a was Washington State championship would be pretty rad, yeah, and play different courses, I mean because they're so close to each other. I mean it could happen, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think the only thing that NAD is missing in fairgrounds and Fredrickson are missing is those par 4, par 5s.
Speaker 3:Well, Fredrickson has par 4s on it. Oh, that's right. Yeah.
Speaker 1:They're like 280 feet, but they're tight right, tight, tight par fours. So, yeah, um, I think that you're, you're right, I think that, um, it could. You know, a lot of these courses around here could grow and could be really something special. I think that lends to where the nad rangers see ourselves potentially going in the future, or at least seeing a need for that, and that is that there are a lot of courses that are coming into operation across the country and across the world and if it goes by American standards of growth in 50 years, we're going to run into issues with maintenance, right, and we're going to run into issues with maintenance right, and we're going to run into issues of restoration. We're going to run into issues of too much traffic, too little direction, too much erosion and degradation of the landscape, because there is, you know, the basket and the tee pad were put in and then you let the people find their way. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Which can be fine, but then you got to follow that up right To maintain the beauty of the course, or then you lose it, right? So I think in the future, as things grow, as we're looking into these courses that we love so much, I would love to get into working with other municipalities to help them take the same approach that we have with the NAD restoration project in the city of Bremerton and apply it, because what we're doing with our project is at no cost to the community or the city. That's our goal, absolutely financially independent from the city or the community. There's two reasons for that.
Speaker 1:One is our city doesn't have a big parks budget, and the parks budget that it does get usually goes to emergency restorations or repairs for our parks. Right, this is not a growth level budget, we're just not that big of a city. The other side of that is that our community, in particular in the Kitsap, we're tiny, we're transient and we can't tap ourselves too much for funds. Right, if we do that we're going to burn ourselves out. So we can't tap ourselves for funds. But there are a ton of box stores around here, there's a ton of philanthropic organizations around here, and with a bit of creativity and a bit of salesmanship, I guess we can sell this project and raise money for our group and for our park and for the restoration and furtherance of disc golf in our area without ever asking for a dime for our community.
Speaker 1:Now, I say that with all awareness that we have a fundraising tournament coming up, but with that tournament you're getting a player pack, you're getting an opportunity to play the course, you get to have some fun on the course. So this is, like you know, you're paying your standard fare. I think we're doing $45 as a fundraiser. You get trash panda discs. You get to come out, you play one round to take them all and have some fun and experience the course. That money, whatever we get from profits for that, all of it will go into the course.
Speaker 1:None of us in the NAD Restoration Project are taking any kind of funds. As a matter of fact, we put in a thousand of our own dollars into the restoration project so far and have spent countless hours working with arborists and working with local material suppliers to get us materials that we need for the park. That kind of contribution and energy into the park, I think, is what is needed, and so all we're asking from the community, all we're asking from the city, is permission. All we're asking from the community is for time, labor and fun. Right, come, hang out, move a couple wheelbarrows of wood chips, eat a slice of pizza, play around and then come back to the park and enjoy yourself. You know, see the work that you've done, take pride in it, get to know the course because you're working on it. It's a cheat code for playing at NAD. I mean, you get to know the nuances of it. You're like, oh yeah, there's a good landing spot up here because I've been working up there and I know if I land up in this area.
Speaker 1:I've got a clear shot to the basket. You start to see new lines, you start to think about the course in a different way. So, to see new lines, you start to think about the course in a different way. So that's the way we're trying to think as the NAD Restoration Project. We're trying to think about this project is how can we do this creatively, how can we do this and bring everybody in without having to worry too much about tapping people for money and asking them for things we want to give back to the community that has. I know it was a. It was a lifesaver for me. Um, when I first started, it was. I really needed something to do and and you know, I know that a lot of people are just wanting to get into it and have some fun, and that's what we're doing.
Speaker 3:Well, two things, uh, no, no salesmanship necessary If businesses in the community could get in tune with this. Disc golf has a big draw, I mean just for me and jenny alone. I mean we travel all over western washington to go play disc golf courses, uh, even when we're not playing tournaments. And you know, hey, new course, I haven't played that before. Let's go out there, not to mention frequent the local courses. And these people have to sleep, they, they have to eat, they're going to shop, they're going to pick up their groceries and things.
Speaker 2:While they're there, they're going to buy gas for their cars, they're going to pack the wrong clothes and have to go buy all new clothes Because all of a sudden they have the wrong clothes.
Speaker 1:They came to Western Washington and forgot their raincoat in Eastern Washington. Yeah. The Columbia outlet, by the way, right now is having a killer sale If you're in the area.
Speaker 3:Oh, that's good, that's good to know, but no salesmanship necessary. Disc golfers come, and the thing about disc golfers is disc golfers will spend money on disc golf, no matter how much disc golf stuff, gear, whatever they have, if it's disc golf, they will spend money, and they also spend money in all the peripherals too. So if you're a business, investing in disc golf is investing in your own business. Really, yeah, yeah, that's a really great way of saying it.
Speaker 2:I want to advocate for, like the families out there. So I'm really focusing on what it is about disc golf that you said you know it.
Speaker 2:You found it at a time where you really needed it a lot of people found disc golf at a time where they really needed it, and one of the things that we did that wasn't too popular, necessarily was we took all seven of us out to the course at the same time, so it was us and our kids and, yeah, we got a lot of looks.
Speaker 2:But then it was like, oh, it's that group, like they're out there learning and watching the kids and like the kids would have a killer shot every once in a while. But a place like nad like I always see little kids there, I see families there, and it's one of those parks where you can bring the kids. It is a community and it gives. Even if you have a kid like we took our friend Brian and Bridget with their kid Phoenix out there and not to nad but to fairgrounds, and Phoenix would just throw the disc giggle, go pick it up. Throw the disc giggle, pick it up and being able to have kids that maybe can't communicate well or whatever, having them out there like nat, is a really great place for that.
Speaker 1:oh, yeah yeah, I agree with that 100. I was when I was. For the last couple of days I've been laying out the pathways for two and if you, yeah, you're pink and purple, yeah, yeah, pink, orange and yellow yeah, it's a great combination. Originally I was like, oh, I'll make the beds're pink and purple. Yeah, pink, orange and yellow. Yeah, it's a great combination. Originally I was like, oh, I'll make the beds in pink and I'll do the pathways in orange. I just ran out of pink and now I need an orange.
Speaker 1:But I've been really enjoying seeing families some I don't know, some I do know just come out and enjoying the park. I was watching one family at the end of the intermittent stream. There's that big pile of logs on two and there was a father, a mother and their son and they were seesawing one of those logs. And they were just having fun.
Speaker 1:They didn't have discs with them. They were just walking through the park and enjoying it, didn't have discs with them. They were just walking through the park and enjoying it and watching families of like, like you know, you have four or five kids with their, their parents, you know. So there's, it's a group of seven, or you know six or seven, walking through and they're just like you said, they're having fun, they're, and that's what it's all about. It's just having fun. Uh, dan glenn.
Speaker 1:I did a video with him on, uh, the family-friendly doubles that he ran for 16 years at nad park and he said it's all about having fun and it's that. The way that he said that just hit me so hard. It was like, dude, you're right, it's not about the. You know. Of course the fun part comes into like pinning the t. You know pinning the basket, you know from the t, and it comes from hitting that great flex shot eventually. But in the beginning we all have that raw experience of just like throwing the disc and it goes wherever the heck that disc went. You know. You're like, oh, so that's what a beefy disc looks like. Yeah, it's way off to the left now, um, and then you know, and you don't care. You know you're just out there having fun with your buddies and you're throwing plastic in the woods and you know hearing the chains bang against the pole. It's just a blast and it's so fun to see kids do that.
Speaker 3:There's something about that sound that is addicting.
Speaker 1:What's that sound? Sound like.
Speaker 2:That is the wrongest basket. Like was that our Costco basket that you recorded that from. I swear it was our Costco basket.
Speaker 3:No, that was actually a sample that I downloaded off of some royalty-free website.
Speaker 2:Oh jeez, I thought you went outside and recorded it.
Speaker 1:It was the best one they had. What it sounds like to me is like those sleigh bells oh yeah, you get the sleigh bells like onceigh bells. Oh yeah, Like once, oh gosh.
Speaker 2:So I wanted to jump in real quick and say we were talking about the corporations around here. Yeah. Another thing I experienced is you know, if you go out there and put in a little bit of time, if you're looking for a way to build your rapport with your workers, take them out disc golfing shoot a couple holes together. Yeah, like that made such a huge difference over at chief kitsap when we would go out and play, when we got our course like it made a huge difference.
Speaker 3:So take your, take your group out there well, and it's funny that you mentioned corporations too, because disc golfers will support other disc golfers. It's that kind kind of community. So if you have, you know, if you sponsor a tee or something at one of these local tournaments or you know, sponsor a tee sign or sponsor the NAD Park Restoration Project, for example, the local disc golf community will respond to that and favor your business over others. And that's just the kind of people they are, is they're?
Speaker 1:they're loyalists I think that's actually a great segue into one aspect of things, uh, with this project that I think can really grow this project in a clever and creative way. I I thought about this originally in my presentation to the city. The city recently brought it back up to me as an idea that they would like to see. And this is unique in Bremerton city history Typically the way that our bylaws are written. Private entities are not supposed to be sponsoring or buying any section of the park. Right, because it's a city amenity for the citizens of Bremerton. However, when it comes to a project like this, we can actually have local businesses, small businesses, uh, independent businesses for sure, sponsoring a fairway. Right, as an independent citizen, a player of the course, you can sponsor a fairway as well, with a contribution of money or time, kind of like an adopt a highway, like adopt a highway, exactly, exactly, yeah, so then you have your name on like.
Speaker 1:Then we'll eventually have new t-signs out there um if, especially if they do any kind of changes with hazards or obs or anything like that, and you can have what I'd like to see is a business, a monetary volunteer or monetary donator, right, and then somebody who has volunteered their time.
Speaker 1:So, you have three major sponsors and that way we can get and this is an ongoing contribution, right? So it might change over the course of a year like 2025,. Let's say DTG Organics, down the street on Wheaton and Bremerton, they would say they offer us all the gravel we need for the year right.
Speaker 1:And we put their name up there permanently because that is something that isn't changed. But we have somebody else who gives a $1,000 one-time donation. We put up their name on a new kiosk that we put in for the year, or up on a tier platform, right. So they say you know $1,000 donation from I don't know a haircut salon, you know a hair salon, or something like that right, whatever, big Apple Diner, yeah.
Speaker 2:And now that?
Speaker 1:could that, could that could. What was the one that, oh Sherry's just closed on? Yeah.
Speaker 1:But we can do things like that creatively now because the city has given us permission to do that, which I think is so cool, like the city is just really thinking outside the box now, which is really fantastic. It allows us to see new opportunities for this course. I think another opportunity that, as disc golfers, we really need to start thinking about it I'm very serious about this is I understand that disc golf for years has been free. I get it, but when I'm spending $500 a month on discs alone, just plastic oh, don't get me started, dude. I know I have 450 discs at home you see that right there that's a college education right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I know players who have that level of collection discs. They've got like 300 collectors discs those are like and I know players who have that level of collection discs, collectors discs, right.
Speaker 1:They've got like 300 collectors discs. Those are like 40 or 50 bucks a piece or whatever they were when you bought them and they're signed by whoever. We put so much value on the things that we carry through the free course that we're playing. I know there are people in the audience right now listening whose hair is starting to bristle. I'm not asking you to play this course. I don't think that, as a municipality, it would be fair to say you play as a city amenity, right that you pay like $10 every time you play. You play the course, but if we had a qr code that went to a designated bank account in the city?
Speaker 1:that said this is a nad restoration or nad park disc golf course donation and you donate anywhere from a dollar a t right to twenty dollars or fifty or hundred dollars, whatever you want, I mean if you want if you want to donate $100, great for you. But let's say you go every day, Every day that I have off. When my arm was feeling good, I was playing one to two rounds four days a week. I think it's kind of within my wheelhouse of obligation to give back something. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Right, and that could be time or money. But if you don't have the time, maybe you know five bucks, ten bucks, every time you play to the maintenance of the park gives back to the park. Because if we don't as disc golfers, I'm just telling you right now, if you don't as disc golfers, you're putting that on the city and you're putting that on the municipalities that that maintain the park. You're paying for it in tax dollars anyway. You're just helping out, like really focus that money on on the park and making your park something really beautiful. And this can be for nad park, this could be for, uh, you know, a park in north dakota, it could be a park in ma, wherever.
Speaker 1:I don't know why, I just chose the coldest possible states in the country, but Tanzania, right, I think we're kind of getting to that point now for spending $500 a month on discs, even $40 a month on discs. You can give a couple of bucks every time you play, and we're not there yet with that, but I would like to see a QR code for donations in the future.
Speaker 3:And as a city administrator, I would look at that account, that bank account that you're talking about, and if I saw money flowing in there en masse, I would say, hey, you know, this is a big economic driver and we need to do more of this, and would? It would ultimately not only help that park in particular but help grow disc golf around the county and around the city. I mean, install more disc golf courses. So it would definitely have that bleed over effect.
Speaker 1:You have a really good point there, brandon, because I think if they see that too let's say, you have one disc golf course in the area the city is more likely to say all right, the community came through and we raised $20,000 over the course of the year. We'll match half of that. We'll give ten thousand dollars to, you know, do things that you need for the park, and that could be. You know, we're not just talking about paying for people like myself at all. What I'm saying is like we could be putting in plants, we could be building cooler infrastructure, we could be commissioning artists to come and do really cool stuff in the park I was gonna say.
Speaker 2:one of the things that would be really cool is, since I've worked with tribal schools for a couple of years now, giving them the opportunity to put Lushootseed language signs Like if you're putting the. Salal out there and giving them the opportunity to say, hey, this is what we use it for, cause I'm pretty sure I've seen some of the cedar trees where they've stripped off the bark.
Speaker 1:They have all through Ned, all through Ned.
Speaker 2:And so you know having them put a sign there of okay this is why we did this, you know it would be really cool to do that.
Speaker 1:That that's. I'm so glad you said that, jenny. So in my ultimate five-year plan. So we talked about the first 24 months, right? So the first 24 months is like establishing the tee pads and the fairways. The next, like 24 months or so, would be planting things out and allowing the plantings to mature. And then in the fifth year, what I would love to do and this is in my original presentation is to have those kinds of educational signs. So it's for that family.
Speaker 1:That's seesawing on the log. They're out there and they're like oh, we're seesawing on this log. What's this big pile of sticks and timber and shrubs and stuff behind us? Oh, that's habitat for rodents. That's so cool. And look up, there's a bat box or an owl box, you know. And what's the relationship between the two? It's no longer just a disc golf experience for the disc golfers, it's an educational experience for disc golfers and visitors alike to go through there. And I'm so glad that you brought up the Salish tribes in the area, because I was asking Matt, actually we were out there marking out some trails or something yesterday two days, three days ago, and I was like who's a tribe that was in this area?
Speaker 1:And he's like I don't know, they were dead before the white people even got here. And that broke my heart, Like it wasn't like he was saying that flippantly, it was just this like I have no idea, and I could feel within him that it was like damn, because he grew up in this area, right, and that he didn't know. I think that I could feel like that was kind of affecting him. It felt like you know, because it definitely hit me I was like how do we not know?
Speaker 3:yeah, it's sad.
Speaker 1:It's sad, it's tragic it's our, it's our history as well as inhabitants of this land, to know and I know there's a lot of people who have issue with like acknowledgement of, you know, the tribal people that were here before and those land acknowledgements and things. But you know, just as a, as a common courtesy, you know this is, this is the history of the land. This is just from an educational point of view. To know the, to see the, the written lichensi language that was not, it wasn't written right, it was an oral language but to see the beauty of that language and the complexity of the language in written form.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like that's cool, it's crazy, it is.
Speaker 3:Native American history is American history. You know through and through and and you know they have, you know the native Americans, they have their own special part of that. But also it's also part of our history as well, because, well, we, it's also part of our history as well, because, well, we're here and you know a lot of us don't really have a choice.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah and one of the things that really ties in the disc golf for me with the native community is honoring the land. Yeah, and we actually had a guy come to the school and he talked about how when he went to like a forest or something, he would leave an offering of like the tobacco sage, a couple other things. And so when I heard him say that, I'm like huh, I wonder if I'm like nicer to the trees, if they'll be nicer to me and I'll have a better game. So it's kind of that's why I pet the dragon every time I go past it and you know, I hug a tree and it's like how do I honor the land? And so doing the restoration is also taking that time to put back the good energy and to honor that land, that place.
Speaker 1:I can't wait to see you. I can't wait to see what you think about the way that the pathways are laid out. When Matt and I were out there on I guess this was Sunday morning or maybe Saturday or something, whatever day it was we were walking through there and we have done, I think, a really cool job of utilizing the natural topography and the natural movement of the forest. I was out there transplanting today ferns that were in the fairway. Yeah.
Speaker 1:And that whole of hole two, all of hole two, I transplanted, uh, three ferns and one little grouping of crocus that came up. That was it, that was it, and that I think, if we can continue to do that, honoring and listening to the land and and thinking just what's the natural movement, how does this net, this land naturally flow and hone in our eyes, for that, being able to take that kind of restoration mindset to other courses would be so cool, like you're, you're, so I'll just, I'm going to say it right now, I'm just going to announce it right now I want us to become a 501c3 called Discourse Consulting. Discourse Consulting Pretty clever, right, disc course, uh-huh, but it's also the conversation, thank you.
Speaker 2:Can I get a?
Speaker 1:squirrel, you want a squirrel, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:It's an angry squirrel. I'll tell you about the squirrel on hole 12. That would not leave the tee pad. There was a squirrel on hole 12.
Speaker 1:Are you serious?
Speaker 2:Uh-huh, it would not leave the tee pad. We were at a tournament. It would not leave, we'd shoot away and come back.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and it just looked very indignant, Like what are you doing?
Speaker 1:on my tee pad. Yeah, I marked this out this is mine.
Speaker 1:Well, I think I want to just finish this one I would love to call discourse consulting, because I think discourse consulting says to. It's a play on words, but it's a conversation between the, the restoration effort, the course design, the city, the community, and it's discourse is an art form right. It's the dialogue of going back and forth and being able to listen to each other and reply to each other and have this flow right. Like good discourse, right Is consideration, it's awareness, it's respect, and so discourse consulting would be a 501c3 that helps other municipalities and other communities restore their courses in ways that respect and have conversations with the land that they're building on. So it would be design, maintenance and restoration.
Speaker 3:So what I was going to say is something that's coming to my mind right now is that education breeds familiarity and familiarity breeds stewardship, and that's really kind of the evolution of it is. You got to get people out there to see it, experience it, be curious about it, educate themselves about the land, the plants, the history of the land, and then, once they're educated and familiar with it, they take ownership and they take stewardship and pride in being a part of the restoration and development of wherever you're at.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I love that you brought up the word stewardship, because that's the essence of where we're at and there's stewardship groups in our area. There's the Friends of Madrona Trail stewardship group, there's Forest Ridge stewardship group, and they do take that pride in that. I guess the word that it's the caretaking, it's the giving back, it's the support of the community for this area, that stewardship. Stewardship really is its own word. There's nothing else like it and it doesn't really have a synonym. You can't. I would love to see what the source says about stewardship.
Speaker 3:I think when you invest your time in something, you're more reluctant to see your efforts and your knowledge and concentration go to waste, so you're more willing to keep it up and more willing to maintain it. It becomes part of you. Yeah, you internalize it. Yeah, you really do.
Speaker 1:That's well said. I haven't been out to fairgrounds in a long time. I haven't been out to shelton in a long time but I go out to his nod on a multi-week, multi-day basis any given week because I enjoy. I enjoy it at a different level out there, like I throw my, I bring fozzie my pup. He's got a bite aitude, 64 bite A lot of days. That's the only disc I'll bring for him. It's his disc. I almost hit the basket of hole, two from like 150 out with that today. It chained out. I was like ah. Anyway different story.
Speaker 1:But the point is that the just being out there is is that the, the just being out there and and listening to the, the fairway, listening to the land and watching the stream go through its season, it's become a friend at a different level. You know I to the neglect of my own garden at home. You know I, I, my wife and I love to garden and I'm spending more time thinking how am I going to get wood chips for Nat? You know I want to lay out these pathways that make sense for the people that are playing the chorus and it just becomes a relationship between you as the steward and the land that you're stewarding.
Speaker 3:Now I've been dying to ask you this for like 45 minutes now. I'm gonna, I'm gonna take my opportunity right now. Jenny, are you ready? I think so. How do you feel about tanzania?
Speaker 1:um, I, I don't know, I've never been to tanzania. I mean, it's I I've I've heard music from tanzania. I used to listen to a lot of like tribal African music and drumming, uh, but I don't know what you're talking about.
Speaker 2:So, uh, we got a guy yeah so, um, we just uh released the podcast today.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we just have a few hours ago a few hours ago, before you came over, we we just released the episode. This guy, his name is Ryan Scaife. He is the president of the Hope.
Speaker 2:He's the founder of the Hope in Tanzania Project.
Speaker 3:Hope in Tanzania Project.
Speaker 2:From Wisconsin, starting back in like 2001.
Speaker 3:Oh, wow, and one of the initiatives that he is trying to get off the ground and he kind of spoke it into reality on the podcast actually is the uh sister disc golf club uh relationship. So he was, he was talking so tanzania uh like a sister city kind of thing.
Speaker 3:Yeah sister city for a sister disc golf club. Yeah, and he does these service and safaris where you go for two weeks and you build a disc golf course and do conservation and stuff and then you go out on safari and get to see the animals in Tanzania, like right underneath Kilimanjaro.
Speaker 1:Oh wow, oh wow, that'd be cool. Yeah, that'd be really cool.
Speaker 3:And the only thing it costs you is some elbow grease. And airfare to get out there. I imagine too, he made it. I don't know, I don't know, I can't speak for it. Yeah, yeah, but we were looking at airfare and it was only like $1,200.
Speaker 1:Wow, but it's like 22 hours. Yeah, it's a 22-hour flight, but it was only like $1,200.
Speaker 3:And the people are wonderful, I guess, and the food is wonderful, and you just walk up to a tree and pick off a guava or a passion fruit or something and see a warthog and a couple lions, maybe some monkeys, I don't know.
Speaker 2:And it's also Project 4.6 with the Paul Macbeth Foundation.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and you work with the paul mcbeth foundation yeah, and you work with the paul mcbeth foundation too yeah, because that's kind of where I thought you were going was that you had a podcast with paul, because he's doing so much great work in the foundation at least he's doing so much great work in in uh, in africa yeah, yeah and paul wright yeah, is you know. Former wsdga president is now working with paul mcbeth foundation out there, so I thought that's where you're going but that's really interesting. So what's his name?
Speaker 3:again, his name, his name is ryan scaife and he he used to be a journalist with, uh like cbs, sports, espn, all sorts of different places, yeah. And he got out of the industry and found himself in tanzania at this study abroad program, the semester at sea, and just fell in love with the place and he's really creating disc golf as an economic driver for sustainability in Tanzania.
Speaker 1:That's cool.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and he was wanting to do some sister disc golf clubs. And by everything you're talking about here the stewardship and the restoration and the conservation and everything you guys would be just hand in hand with each other.
Speaker 1:I I, I definitely want to get hold of them. That sounds like a really cool. That sounds like a really cool connection. Yeah, you know and and potential opportunities. I think, um, in Tanzania, like this is the kind of thing that the, the nad rangers, as we talk about this stuff, we dream about, like how cool it would be to like grow out into you know, designing and working with communities and what better kind of communities to work with and communities that that need I don't want to say need.
Speaker 1:This actually feels a little weird. Um, where we can, we can actually find cultural, you know, intersections and and and, come together and like, learn from each other. And we can take disc golf, which is clearly a very american sport, um, and we can bring all of our quirkiness and our nerdiness out there and, and you know, share this really fun sport, which I I have all sorts of thoughts about ball golf versus disc golf but um, and then be able to see the land in tanzania and meet the community and learn from them. Oh, they're all their world perspectives too. I just love that, that's just yeah.
Speaker 2:So talking with um paul wright, who I actually grew up across the lake from him, oh, no way.
Speaker 2:So yeah, I didn't realize it until, you know, a couple years ago. Um, but having him talk about going over there and actually getting to watch him go through his process at Chief Kitsap, watch him as he's walking through the woods trying to figure out, ok, well, where are safety hazards, like all the hills and stuff in Tanzania, like how do we keep people away from that? But then how do we? Also, what do I want people to see? So watching them go through that whole process yeah, it's just amazing there's.
Speaker 1:I think there is a lot of consideration that the I would love to get into design, but I really want to study with somebody who designs courses, because it's it's one thing to come in and read like we're gonna mulch the fairways, you know what I mean. There's like one level of it it, but the course is already there. Yeah, it's just kind of like me and the group. We're kind of like designing highlights, highlighting what's already there. But being able to walk through a forest and know how to bend the fairways so that that highlights the land, highlights the views, gives that experience so cool.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's really. You were talking about listening to the forest and reading the forest. So the area is going to tell you how it wants you to throw the disc, because it's going to have either the bigger trees or smaller trees and kind of tell you well, this is the way that our land flows and you know when in doubt, follow the way the water would flow.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so it's yeah, yeah it's cool.
Speaker 2:It's something I'm hoping that we'll be able to do in the future too, and my uncle was a ball golf course designer and that's a completely different, because you're, you know, completely destroying, yeah, the the land and changing the land, versus the disc golf, where you're trying to keep it as much as possible even though ball golf courses, they're beautiful, for what they are, I mean, they're an ecological disaster.
Speaker 3:They're a complete disaster on the environment around them in so many chemicals and pesticides and taking out all the native brush and everything to make these clear, immaculate fairways. I mean it's in a different light.
Speaker 1:It's just disgusting yeah, being so far removed from it, yeah yeah, my dad was actually went to portugal um in the 90s as part of the Audubon Society to go to work on ball golf courses to improve bird habitat.
Speaker 2:Wow.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, it was really cool. It was very out of his wheelhouse. He was a vice president of a cruise line but had a lot of connections and he has a marine biology degree, but he ended up somehow with the smithsonian and the ottoman society going on this trip. I think he worked with them for about a year and a half. It was really, yeah, a really cool thing that they were doing. But you're right, brandon, and they have ball golf courses, I think in large part, as far as I'm aware, which is not very, but, as far as I'm aware, don't have a real ecological bent, at least even superficially. You know, it's not something that they advertise and there is a lot of opportunity for. I think there's a lot of opportunity for that with ball golf courses as well.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, I could see that.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:One of the things I love about kayak is watching how they're letting parts of the course grow back and, you know, seeing where okay, this is where you know this used to be the t area. This used to be where they would probably put to like it's. It's interesting to see how they're kind of rebuilding it and letting some of it you know repair are you talking about?
Speaker 1:like the the blue layout?
Speaker 2:I'm oh, I've never played the blue I played red but like I'm, thinking of like one of the ones where it's really oh, because it's a ball, of course, right, yeah, and so the parts where they're kind of letting it grow back and watching as it's, you know, becoming whatever it's going to become right some of the for our listeners out there.
Speaker 3:Uh, kayak point is the big like disc golf resort out here in washington. That's private resort, right? Uh, I sort of is it sort of yeah.
Speaker 2:So what did it play? Yeah?
Speaker 3:some of the back story to it is, I guess it was a municipal ball golf course that the city had just kind of given up on. And then they were approached by this disc golf outfit. I'm not quite exactly sure who they are, but they said hey, you know, let us, let us take this over, turn this into a disc golf place. And they came up with a deal and we're able I don't I'm not sure if they were able to purchase or lease the land, but they were able to acquire it somehow. And so they took this ball golf course. It was just a nine-hole ball golf course and they transformed it into well, it's got three or four disc golf courses on it, right?
Speaker 1:now, yeah, it's definitely got three. It's got like the red, the blue and the gold, and then they have a purple one too.
Speaker 3:Oh, really, yeah, they have a purple one too. Really yeah, they have a wood, a wood course. That was that. I think it's purple or something like that I think you're talking about the blue one, the blue is the blue, is the wood one the blue is the wood course, yeah yeah, but they, they have a red, they have a green, they have a gold, uh, and then they have the blue, and then they have a 18 hole pitch and putt which is like 100, 120 foot approach shots, the whole time.
Speaker 2:You know, I wish like had they not taken apart bud, pell and the the little mini golf there. It would have been fun to make it into a little pitch and putt that little mini golf area. Yeah, yeah, that would have been fun yeah, um, so going.
Speaker 1:I want to go back to what you were saying about like listening to the land and the flow and stuff like that and what watching Paul Wright do his work. There is a episode shout out to Simon Lizotte and beyond disc golf. I don't know how many episodes they did. I think maybe like four or five episodes total, but there was. One.
Speaker 1:Of the original ones was at Lake Tahoe it was like the second episode and it blew my mind. This guy created an entire disc golf course. Go back and watch this video. It's cool. It's like a half an hour 35 minutes long, something like that and this guy created an entire disc golf course without taking out a single tree.
Speaker 2:Nice Whoa, yeah, that's cool, yeah.
Speaker 1:And it's like legit lines. It's not like poke and hope stuff. It's not like hole 11 at nat, like he really considers thoughtful, very thoughtful design, and I think there's so much room for that in in this sport as we start to mature and evolve our designs absolutely so.
Speaker 3:We we were talking earlier. One of the things that I wanted to dive into is that if I'm a local club or a local organization and I want to start a project like this for my local disc golf course, what's the process? Where would I start? Who are some key players and different resources that I can get involved? Just kind of walk us through where you've been with that Sure.
Speaker 1:So I think, first of all, it really depends and this is one of the reasons that I want to move the NAD Restoration Project into something more general, because I think the way that I'm going about it requires a little bit more nuanced approach to each locality right? So you could say, first of all, what you need is a group of passionate people that want to restore or design a course, and let's just start with restoration, because that's where we are right now, right? So, hey, our disc golf course is falling apart, right? Or it just needs some love? What we started off with was the stats. How many people are utilizing this disc golf course? What does this disc golf group and the community bring to the economy? Cities and municipalities want to know the economic impact of anything in their city and they also want to know the social impact of that as well.
Speaker 1:One of the difficulties that we had with this, with NAD park, for the longest time, is that the, the parking lot is what, like a quarter mile from like, the first tee, maybe something like that. I mean, it's at least 500 yards. You got to walk through the park, then you walk, you know, down into the forest. Walk through the park, then you walk, you know, down into the forest, yeah. And then you, you come up on t1 and you can't see that from the road.
Speaker 1:You never know how many people are throwing discs in there, unless you happen to drive by austin drive and catch a flash of a disc in the air yeah and I think that was a unfortunate, um just situation with nad, that the city didn't know and had no idea how many people were actually in there on daily basis. When I put together my presentation, the first thing I did was here's the history of the park. This park used to be a forest. It's now got 40 000 people playing in this in this park every year and it's growing. Um, in 2000,. Since 2019, disc golf has increased by 76%. That sounds like, oh, really, that's from what? 1975 to 2001. 1975 to 2001,. Let's go with an easy number of like 10, right. We're now in a five-year period went to 17.5, right. That's the growth that we're looking at, right, and so, if you can point that out to a city, start there.
Speaker 1:Start with this is how much traffic we're getting in our area. Okay, that's one. The next is what's the ecological impact of this? What's the maintenance looking like?
Speaker 1:Now, a lot of municipalities that don't have wooded disc golf courses. They have grass, and grass is really easy to budget out, right. Very, very easy to budget out. You can budget that out down to the square centimeter if you want to.
Speaker 1:Wooded disc golf courses are a little bit more difficult, but I think in the long run, they're actually a lot easier and more ecological to maintain, because all we're looking at doing is putting down wood chips. Wood chips can be found for free, so you start with the how much is this? How much impact is this having on the community? How much does this cost the community to maintain? What would it look like if we could use some creative thinking? And and you're going to want to connect with somebody who knows ecology you're going to want to connect with somebody who knows the local area and resources available. But all across the country, there are arborists who will provide you with wood chips for free, and you can at least put wood chips down and mulch down in the circle right for most municipalities a mulch circle is just going to be fine.
Speaker 1:You might get into some issues with like on a pro level they're going to want, you know, certain kind of ground play or whatever, whatever. But for most municipalities, just for the maintenance being ecological and being cost-effective man chips are easy to get. Once you do that, start to look at how you can fund your course and that was the way that we presented. We redesigned the course. In the restoration design we're not changing any fairways or baskets or anything like that. We're just looking at like, what can we do to bring this course back up to speed?
Speaker 1:So for reference, nad Park was neglected for 20 years. The city would not allow under the former city director would not allow us to do any kind of maintenance in the park. That includes putting up like they got. The WSDGA went and asked if they could do some maintenance. This is the thing that sparked me off this one point. One of the WSDGA board members asked if they could put, or not even asked. He said we've been doing some basic maintenance in the park and kind of the ears perked up with the commission and he said yeah, we like you know, but nothing like you know bad or anything. We just we like you know, but nothing like you know bad or anything. We just, like you know. We put like a log up on its end. So we put our bags on it and they were like, did you get permission for that? That's city property. It was that kind of attitude, right. So we went for 20 years and had this park neglected because nobody could see it.
Speaker 1:It used to be a forest and the approach from the city was well, just let it be a forest, don't have to do anything to it, don't have to maintain it. If you go to Olympic National Park you can see a forest will restore itself. But it's different. It's a park now. It is a traffic of a park.
Speaker 1:So knowing what you have, knowing how it needs to be maintained and showing the city the economic benefit and the cost of it and how the community can help pay for it and help make it work and continue to steward that disc golf course is a really good, I think, formula for going about maintaining and restoring a course. When it comes to design, I'm going to leave that to Ryan Scaife, paul Wright, people like that who have worked with municipalities. Northwest Disc Golf Association has worked with municipalities in designing and installing courses. There's other groups that are more experienced in that and how they would go about that, but I think the process would be relatively similar. You're showing the economic impact and the community and social impact of having disc golf in the area which, let's be honest, you want to talk about a basketball court or a pickleball court or a baseball field. You're clear cutting, you're grading, you're like putting in grass.
Speaker 1:That's expensive Parking lots, millions of dollars in these facilities.
Speaker 3:Don't even get me started about pickleball.
Speaker 1:Yeah right, I know we got disc golf. You're gonna get me in trouble with my mother-in-law.
Speaker 3:Be very careful, you guys all wanna go and play pickleball like come on.
Speaker 1:I know, I know no, and that's it. I think it's easy and clean. You go in, you can play a quick game and that's fine. I mean whatever. I think getting people outside and off the screen is number one that's always good.
Speaker 1:That's always good, right. Disc golf is a uniquely beautiful sport and it's usually in uniquely beautiful areas. I think there is so much room for the growth. The thing is you do need a lot of land. Like for 18-hole course, you typically need about 20 acres. That's a chunk of space and that's why nine-hole courses are growing at twice the rate of 18-hole courses across the country and we're seeing. I brought some stats with me today. There were in the United States. There were 516 new courses added in municipal parks alone. Wow, that's 10 per state, wow.
Speaker 1:Over 10 per state that's within a year timeframe, that's in 2024. Data Wow yeah.
Speaker 3:That's rapid growth.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Now let's say that there's twice as many nine-hole courses than 18-hole courses. That's still like 150 or something, you know, 18-hole courses and like 350 nine-hole courses.
Speaker 3:Well, I mean, just put in an extra tee pad and you got an 18-hole course, and you got 18 holes.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's it, and that was just municipal parks. I mean, there was courses on former ball golf courses, 51 new courses added. That's one per state. There's now, by the way, 514 of those across the country, and even worldwide. I mean it's growing Like Tanzania. We're talking about Tanzania right now.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:With disc golf Tanzania. We're talking about Tanzania right now. Yeah, with disc golf, like and my wife and I were talking about about this the other day how undiverse disc golf is. It's a very white sport, right, and bringing this to Tanzania and getting a whole new talent pool from around the world is super cool, like I think that's just that. Just that just just explodes the potential of the sport. When you get it into not just different hands, but you get it into a different culture. You're going to see people throwing discs in ways that we've never seen before, because it's coming out of somewhere like Tanzania.
Speaker 3:Well, and what you have with disc golf is you generally have a working class population, so very inclusive, they just want to get off of work and blow off steam and then you get the cost of entry is not prohibitive. No, I mean you can go and get a disc for $10.
Speaker 1:You can get a whole starter pack for $30 off Amazon or at your local disc golf course.
Speaker 2:You can find them at Goodwill too. Yeah, you can find them at Goodwill. Or you just go up to a course and someone will probably give you a disc yeah, or just walk the course in the on the sides and find one yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3:So I mean you can get into it for next to nothing and most of the courses are free, right, and so like it's, it's really a no-brainer if the land is there.
Speaker 1:It's a no-brainer for um, for municipalities.
Speaker 1:It really, it really is, and and the thing that's very unintrusive on the land, because you got a basket, you got a pad to a degree as long as, as long as there's a way finding and a way to get there where you're not just like I mean it's not intrusive. But that was the heartbreaking thing of nat. I actually was playing around. I came up on 18. I met a guy who is an arborist and I this was at the beginning of the nat restoration project, so this was like last spring or something and the guy was saying we were looking down there, I was telling what we were doing, he goes.
Speaker 1:You know, I've been watching this course for the last couple of years with everybody now kind of playing disc golf and I can see it kind of getting eroded and and degrading a bit and I was like I know me too and it when you have an eye for you can see it. Most people playing no shade at all, um, aren't trained with that eye it's like I was like walking into a space with an architect and being like no, it's fine to me.
Speaker 1:And they're like oh my god, let me tell you all about it it's not great yeah, right, you know you give me the death glare over there.
Speaker 3:I know what. Yeah, yeah, we, we go anywhere and I'm looking at how the building's built. What's your role? What's your profession?
Speaker 1:I'm a general contractor yeah, yeah, there you go yeah I can't walk by, I can't walk by an open door without looking at it, because I'm a nurse.
Speaker 4:Like it's just like oh, there's a patient in there. You know what I mean.
Speaker 3:Like but yeah.
Speaker 1:I mean I think there's, if you're a municipality municipality out there or a community out there, a group out there, a nonprofit out there that is involved with disc golf or wants disc golf in your community, feel free to reach out to me. We're the NAD volunteer stewardship group um. Nad Volunteer Stewardship Group. Nad Park Volunteer Stewardship Group on Facebook. It's a long name. My name is Christopher Keen on Facebook. You can find me there, christopher, with a K. You can also email me at projectleadnaddgc at Gmail and we'll put those in the show. Can we put those in the show notes?
Speaker 2:Yes, we can Okay.
Speaker 1:Because I was not great at brevity when I was coming up with these names, but I I would be happy to chat with you about it. We have some. We have some great talent on our team for the nad project and we're happy to work with any municipality that that has some ideas, because we really want to grow the sport, but grow it in a sustainable way. Um, that is that is easy on the land but great for your community.
Speaker 3:Well, in taking this to the next level is you know, you have that creative discourse thing that you want to do and this is your proof of concept.
Speaker 1:Yes so this is.
Speaker 3:This is kind of your beta test and see how it all works out, and work out some of the bugs and things. Until you, until you take it up to the uh, oh, I mix this up all the time 5031 c, 501 c3, 501 c3, that's the one yep yeah yeah, letters and numbers. It's the, it's a thing and you're a gc I can read a tape measure.
Speaker 3:All right, Do you have anything else you want? Oh, I have to ask this. Well, first of all, do you have anything else you want to talk about? You know?
Speaker 1:I do actually Go ahead. I mentioned briefly earlier, we have a tournament coming up this April April 19th for Earth Day. We're partnering with Trash Panda.
Speaker 3:Earth Day, that's amazing.
Speaker 1:It's Earth Day weekend. So Earth Day is on the 22nd, which is, I think, a Tuesday or Wednesday this year. So we're doing it on Saturday so everybody can make it, and we're doing this as a Trash Panda challenge. So Trash Panda if you're not familiar with Trash Panda really fun disc Great company doing sustainability work for disc golf. They're making their disc completely out of recycled plastic. It's not like a manufacturer who makes new plastic and they've got a couple of recycled discs or they're recycling their, their uh seconds or whatever. Like um, like mvp does trash panda focus is specifically on finding plastic that they can recycle and make into discs and they've got right now four discs on no five discs in their lineup. They have a putter called the Intercore. They've got a mid-range called the Dune.
Speaker 2:They've got Is it taking pictures of you?
Speaker 1:No, it's the gesture. The hand gesture is on. So I'm filming this for our YouTube channel and I put the two sign up and hand gestures turned off the recording. Okay. So they've got the intercorder. They've got the dune. Yeah, they've got the ozone. The ozone is this like fantastic super flippy fairway, but really great and very if you can get it on a good hyzer and have a good hyzer flip fantastic disc that's going to be in the player pack this year. And then they have the et2, which is an off-center uh uh bevel. So you have like a, a, a wing change, so it goes from like a seven speed to an 11 speed all-in-one disc. And then they uh-huh yeah, yeah, the et2 has an off-center bevel.
Speaker 1:So so, if you look at it from the top, it looks like a normal Frisbee. It's just or normal disc excuse me, sorry, frisbee and so it's circular, right. But if you look under it, it's circular Right. It's not like octagonal or oblong or anything like that. But then if you flip it over, what would normally be the under part of it where you create the wing and the bevel, that's off center. So you have a thinner wing on one side and a wider wing on another, and it is a wild disc.
Speaker 1:It is so much fun to throw. It's not going to be in our player pack, but it will be in our raffle. What does it do? So it can be really beefy. It can also be like really straight. I've seen people throw them like tomahawks and they they'll corkscrew and um. It's based off like the, the aero b, uh, or the um the aero b disc that came out, uh, in the early 90s I'm trying, I'm spacing on the name of it at the moment uh, but they worked with gateway, the part where it partnered with gateway discs, and they, they created the et2, huh, yeah. So that's a really fun disc.
Speaker 1:And then they have the canyon, which Huh yeah, so that's a really fun disc. And then they have the Canyon, which is their new beefy mid-range.
Speaker 3:Well, and I just want to add an anecdotal thing to that is, trash Panda is also involved with cleaning up plastic efforts in Africa as well. Oh cool, we just learned. Yeah, so they're a big proponent of that, and the Paul Macbeth Foundation and things over there big proponent of that and the Paul Macbeth foundation and things over there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, there, they do some really good work and I'm I'm hoping that we can return to a partnership with Transpanda Disc moving forward, whether that's just promoting them and they're, you know, working with us to create more opportunities for restoring disc golf courses across the country. We are going to have an awesome raffle for this, for this, this tournament as well, we're going to have I want to for this, for this, uh, this tournament as well, we're going to have. Uh, I want to make sure I'm saying this right, we have a cart that's going to be in the raffle and I'm not going to say what kind of car yet. I'm going to let ian williamson, our td, announce that. But we've got discs, we've got bags.
Speaker 1:We've got roller it has to be, it's I, it's, it's a name that you'd be like oh hell, yeah, I'm gonna jump into that, that, that raffle.
Speaker 2:So I'm gonna put an offer out there for you. So, since we are sponsored by treasures of the forest, we have a couple of tubes coming to us and we can get some custom minis made with materials. So if you have like some materials from nad and you want to do like some picture video of where it's at and send that to us, we can get some minis made for you and I could bring you some forest floor treasures for sure, yeah, we could get you some minis for your projects okay, how long?
Speaker 1:how long was the turnaround on that?
Speaker 2:uh, I don't know.
Speaker 1:I'd have to find out you may not have it for the tournament, that's fine but definitely for like fundraising there's some super cool lichen and stuff like that and like flowers and all sorts of cool stuff. That yeah awesome. Okay, I love it, I love it.
Speaker 3:That's great yeah okay, so go out to the trash panda versus the owl at uh yeah nad park.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, it's trash panda versus owl. Um, it's one round to take them all. Uh, this is a one round challenge and it's something that we're planning on doing every year, with trash panda as our uh, as our sponsor, as a sponsor.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, so that's going to be super cool. Um, other things that we have coming up we're going to be, um, putting up all of our work parties for this upcoming year. I want to call it the tour of NAD, like a, you know, like a rock band or something like that. Right, but like, I want to lay it out so that if you're in the area, or if you're in Western Washington and you want to get your hands dirty on what is going to be an absolutely historical and and really killer project, um, you can come up and you can plan a trip to Bremerton, or you can plan a weekend to be working in NAD, and so keep your eyes out for that. So that's what we have coming up and I appreciate you asking me. Brandon, thank you Absolutely.
Speaker 2:We need to get MXPX to change their song, the Move to Bremerton song.
Speaker 3:It's like come work at.
Speaker 1:Bremerton at NAD Park. Move to NAD Park. Okay, fun tidbit on mxpx. So when we moved to the the area, my wife used to like punk when she was in in high school and so did I. Um, mxpx was kind of in that, that mix of like punk and skater kind of scene. And so, uh, when we moved into our house we were chatting with our neighbor and he goes yeah, you know the band mxpx. We were like, yeah, yeah, he's like. This used to be the rehearsal house right next door to us.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's cool.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's their old rehearsal house up there in Manhattan.
Speaker 3:Well, the lead guy used to work at the shipyard.
Speaker 2:Mike.
Speaker 3:Yeah, mike, before they reformed MXPX and went on tour. Oh cool, yeah, they got back together, but he was working at the shipyard for a long time and I guess he owns a big house down in Chico right off the water.
Speaker 1:Oh, okay.
Speaker 3:So he's still local. I mean, they're still around here, okay.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, another shout out speaking of cool people in the area. I would love to work with local businesses on the park. I would love to work with pros national touring pros to bring attention to the park. So if you're a national touring pro listening to this podcast and you want to get involved with ecological restoration, madison, are you listening? Madison. Walker, are you listening who?
Speaker 3:Madison Walker, madison Walker, I know Madison Walker Honk.
Speaker 1:Honk Yep. And Erica absolutely Yep. Erica St absolutely Yep. Erica Stinchcomb If you do like I'm talking to you guys, I'm talking to any pro disc golfer that has a bent towards ecology and restoration and would like to come play NAD, do a video with us for our YouTube channel. We're a fledgling YouTube channel. It's fun, it's quirky. We'd love to have you out and in the future, when we kick this off, we kick this park off, we want to be doing a pro pro-am tournament, maybe two rounds. Oh, that would be cool, Wouldn't that be fun? Man, that would be fun, Like, really show off the course you get to raffle yourself into playing with a touring pro and have a great time out in that park.
Speaker 3:We could do pro-am dubs and I could contribute absolutely nothing.
Speaker 1:Right, basically. That's where. I'd be too.
Speaker 2:So there will be two hot geese at the Cascade Challenge. So maybe, maybe, maybe.
Speaker 1:I think I'm going to have to slip down to the Cascade Challenge just here and say hi, oh yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we'll be there, for sure, yeah.
Speaker 2:I already took the days off work.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 2:Me too, oh my gosh, oh my gosh.
Speaker 3:So, all right, something I ask of everyone. Yeah, what do you got in the bag?
Speaker 1:I am all gyro right now Gyro gyro let's go all right. So for my putters I got two pixels. They're special edition. Uh, electron pixels. Right now, love the pixel. The pixel hands down made my improved my putting game like hands, yeah, hands down what is it about the pixel that people love so much?
Speaker 3:because I I can't.
Speaker 1:We have a few you can take with you, okay, no, no, they're in the practice bin um, the reason that I love the pixel is for I'm kind of a push with a slight spin at the end. If I put a little bit more spin on it, it is a, a shoot and go like putter. I've been able to hit putts from 85 feet that I've never been able to hit with any other putters. And I threw anodes for a year. I threw judges for about six months. I threw avrs for about a year. Um, and I can depend on the Pixel. The Pixel is my putter. It has improved my game so much. So I've got my Pixel, then I've got my Spin. Ohm, I've got then the Proxy Envy, sometimes Glow Envy. In particular, I throw a Watt in there as well, and sometimes that replaces my proxy.
Speaker 3:A ton of low-speed stuff then, huh.
Speaker 1:Well, I'm playing the Par 3s around here a lot, oh, yeah, yeah. But I also use them. I'm a heavy disc-carrying person, so I have 27 discs that I carry for the Par 3s around here. Go on, yeah, all right, which allows me my reasoning that I need to have 450 in the basement to replace all the discs right Times 400, that yeah, to make sure, yeah.
Speaker 1:That's only 16 potential bags. It's disc golf math, yeah, exactly. And then I love the tempo. The tempo is just absolutely fantastic approach disc From my tempo. Then I go up to oh, I have an entropy in there, which that's a get out of jail disc for me. I have two different hexes. I have a neutron hex and I have a fission hex. I have an echo and I have a detour. The uplink was the detour replaced the uplink?
Speaker 3:Okay, okay, yeah, I can see that.
Speaker 1:And then I have my, my Kali pyro, so the Hindu goddess Kali. I died onto my pyro and that is my. My go-to forehand disc has a really nice predictable fade on it. We like are one in the woods. I have then a. It goes to my crave and my rhythm from there. So if you can see what I'm doing with my bag, I have different flight patterns.
Speaker 3:You're up to like 17. Yeah, so you have 10 more to go.
Speaker 1:Right, I know you wait, it happens. So you got 10 more to go. Right, I know you wait, it happens. Um, but I have, I have my varying speeds, um, in here and I have within that the different flight patterns of each speed, because I like to try to keep my arm the same. So my, my, my throw is the same each time stock shot and allow, yep, stock shot and allow the disc to to do the work, and then, if I make an adjustment, it's a very slight adjustment. So, um, that's that's been kind of my approach.
Speaker 1:From there. It's my rhythm, my crave, um, then my tesla wrath, uh, fireball, I love the motion. The motion is what I'm starting to kind of get into a lot, uh, the inertia. And then if I and that's pretty much uh it for the local wooded courses, because they're all par threes, when I get out to like shelton or I'm going to the longer courses, then the waves come out and uh, um, yeah, pretty much, my, my wave is has been really a go-to and I'm trying to think of what else I might throw in there. Um, I've been, oh, the time-lapse. Oh, my gosh, the time-lapse, I love the time-lapse. Everything, I've got everything, simon, right now, like I've, I've have you played the trail?
Speaker 1:I love the trail. The trail is a yeah.
Speaker 3:I just don't. Yeah, you really have to get out to open course, to open up and rip.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but man, it flips up and just flies straight. It's actually replaced. So I haven't been able to throw a full round for about six months because of my arm. But when I was out at Shelton and able to really open up a bit, the trail was starting to replace my wave because the waves were getting flippy. I was having to do hyzer, hyzer, flips with the waves. But yeah, I'm all gyro.
Speaker 1:I love gyro for a couple of reasons. One is their discs take a really long time to beat in. Um, once you start throwing them, you start to understand gyro and throw you it's. It changes the way you throw. But MVP is a really I really like MVP as a company, like their ethos in disc golf to me is great. They're not trying to sign the top players, they're trying to sign the people that have a good heart and that's documented. That's what they're always saying, is that we're trying to hire the good people in disc golf. I mean Eagle Simon, james Conrad Are you kidding me? James conrad's basically a monk. And then you know, and then, and then they just signed jerry coaling and for me that that just sealed the deal. Like they're signing the, the, the people that you're like. Yeah, man, you make me feel good about disc golf well big germ big germ.
Speaker 3:He is tearing it up now that he's on mvp yeah, because he's throwing gyro.
Speaker 1:What happened? He's throwing gyro.
Speaker 3:Man, I'm telling you, you want to throw you want to prove your game, throw gyro oh my god mvp, streamline and axiom oh, they make, they make great discs, they really do I've really I've started throwing the insanity. I really like the insanity. Uh, the insanity is a fun disc yeah yeah, I get a very consistent flip with it, with a little bit of Annie. It travels one side of the fairway to the other fairway and has a good, reliable finish on it. It's one of my go-to distance drivers.
Speaker 1:I think the Wrath and the Inertia in that nine-speed category are sleepers.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the Inertia man, it's a super like it's a hyzer flip for me for sure. But it's a super like it's a hyzer flip for me for sure. But I can use it to bend a corner with a turn, and the wrath is between a Tesla and a Fireball. So the Tesla on a forehand, you can get a little bit too much turn on it and it can kind of, you know, get over to the left on a right-hand forehand, but the wrath it'll just go dead straight and then, right at the end, has this nice, predictable and reliable fade Nice Now.
Speaker 3:The one downside, if any, that I've seen with the gyros, though, is, if you hit a tree, pretty good they're gone Because the rim is so hard they just take off on you and go whew.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, like I said, it makes you a better disc golfer.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it just don't hit trees.
Speaker 1:that's the answer, yeah oh, and then shout out to to um, to latitude 64 in europe. You have to order them from europe now. But the the glow bite is fozzie's. Uh, that's his bag that's his, that's his entire bag.
Speaker 1:He only he's a one disc golfer. He's opposite of his papa, but yeah, he, um, he loves his bite. And the thing I love about the bite the Glow Bite in particular is I was going through the standard premium bites every three months. They would just get flippy and I would lose them or whatever. And the Glow Bite has started finally, after about a year and a half, getting flippy, but it held its flight for a good long time that's awesome, all right.
Speaker 3:So what is your absolute favorite disc ever so? For example, I have my ninja turtles disc that I call turtle power, and everybody knows the ninja turtles disc I see, so it's a dyed ninja turtles disc or something, or yeah, yeah yeah, jenny dyed it for me.
Speaker 1:Oh cool. Yeah, I've seen your work. By the way, Good stuff, Custom dyed, yeah, yeah yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:but like, no matter how many discs I throw or whatever, I mean, they're useful, sure, but that one's always going to be my favorite.
Speaker 1:Okay. So if we're talking individual discs, a stock mold, it's the pixel. The pixel, yep, yeah, and and the thing that I the reason I I'm picking my putter is because I can get to the basket 100 different ways. Right, you could choose your forehand, your back and your what when you're in the circle, when you're in circle two, and I can rely on my putt. That that is the foundation of my bag, right and and the pixel. Um, time and again, I surprised myself, like if, if I, if I knew better, or if I didn't know better, I guess I would think I was a great disc golfer well, but it's just like it just finds its way to the basket.
Speaker 1:I mean, I've hit like around tree limbs, like so. I was on 18 of nad park. I was in the fairway, I was like 85 feet out and I had to go over a cedar bow and then had to have a hard fade. Now this is a straight shooter disc, right, yeah, on a putt, and I just threw it up and that, and this is a putter, it's not an approach disc 85 feet out. A lot of people will say oh, that's a putter. But when you're going around a cedar bow and you've got to have a hard fade into basket, you're usually using an approach disc. At least I am, and I found that. I found um, about 80 feet out on hole seven. I've like consistently I'm hitting rim or hitting chains from like circle two.
Speaker 3:I love that disc well, when you consider, uh, statistically, that upwards of 60% of the game is played from within the circle. Yeah. I mean, you think about it, you know a one putt, two putt, maybe a three putt if you're not so lucky, but that's over half. The game is played within, I would say, 100 feet of the basket. Yep.
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely, and that's the thing, right, your t-shot will get you there, but if you, if you have a good game and a good putter, that's going to help you out. And you know, circle two and in well that's the biggest opportunity for strokes gained.
Speaker 3:Yeah, is right there, because that's the majority of the game yeah, yeah, how about you guys?
Speaker 1:what's your favorite?
Speaker 3:mold, my favorite mold, oh boy. Um well, I'd have to say for putters it'd have to be the envy. I'm okay, I'm an envy guy. I like electron envy or, uh, premium. I think it's a fission soft you have a fission I have a fission. It's a fission soft.
Speaker 3:I know it's a fission soft it's not soft, okay, well, maybe my other one is but anyway, um I have about 10 different movies, but yes, um, he does the thing I like about it is because I'm very much a line drive, kind of putter, yeah, and I like how crashy it is because it'll it'll sink into the ground and stop instead of go 25 feet or even out of the circle, right, yeah, and that's the same way with throwing it for approaches is I can really get precise distance control off of it and that's what I like about the Envy. My favorite approach disc is by far the Cascade Challenge UV Glow Zones.
Speaker 2:He just lost one, so he bought two.
Speaker 3:Well, yeah, you know how that goes.
Speaker 2:I do Put your name on them.
Speaker 1:I just got a grave back that I lost a year ago.
Speaker 2:So did she, I just got a hex back that I lost a year ago, oh nice.
Speaker 3:It's at a totally different course than what I lost it at, but the zone for me is a Swiss Army knife. I can use it for anything. I can sidearm it, I can flex, shot it, I can, you know, I can throw backhand approaches with it. It's just really good for everything. I can even putt with it and it works great.
Speaker 1:You're gonna have to watch a big germ and uh, uli got together and did a zone versus tempo, hex versus buzz round. Oh, really yeah yeah, uli just put it out on his YouTube.
Speaker 3:I'll have to check it out. Yeah, yeah, I'll have to check it out.
Speaker 1:How about you, Jenny? What's your favorite mold?
Speaker 2:My go-to right now is my F9 from Prodigy.
Speaker 3:She says that so bashfully. Well, I just threw two in a river so I'm kind of you know, yeah, how many did she?
Speaker 2:buy, I'm not getting in the middle, but then, uh, he got me the pa5, which is a understable putter, basically, and it's just amazing absolutely it's kind of.
Speaker 3:It's kind of reminiscent of almost an understable berg.
Speaker 2:Oh, no, it's not that it's it's bergy.
Speaker 3:It's a little bit bergy, but not much, but it's.
Speaker 2:It's a soft plastic and it does these amazing turnover lines to the point where we were playing at evergreen and people were like what are you throwing? Really yeah it was one of those discs, it's like yeah, you're. What is that?
Speaker 1:well, since I'm throwing a all gyro. By the way, mvp, if you're listening, and I'm happy to be on your, your street team or whatever, because I'm already I'm already pushing your discs anyway.
Speaker 4:Yeah, don't you have any other favorite molds, because I'm already pushing your discs anyway.
Speaker 3:Don't you have any other favorite molds? You pretty much only throw those two.
Speaker 2:Well, I'm thinking of the four that I took with me. There's those two, and then my Envy.
Speaker 3:You've been throwing the mana really well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't throw it that often. I throw my soul.
Speaker 3:I throw all understable stuff, but you throw it well, the mana from Thought Space.
Speaker 2:I just never like I don't have a chance to throw it, because it's like driver putter, driver putter.
Speaker 3:Well, when you get good like you. I mean she doesn't make very many mistakes. She throws up to the basket and then she putts. She throws up to the basket and then she putts. She throws up to the basket. She very rarely approaches. It's ridiculous to watch her play.
Speaker 1:That's an awesome game. It is it gets boring.
Speaker 2:So then I have to change it up and like go a couple months of not playing, so well, she'll be out there and be like let's try something really stupid.
Speaker 3:now All tomahawks in the woods yes oh man all right, all right, so, um, you got anything else you want to cover, or are we getting ready to wrap?
Speaker 1:I think we're, I think it's a wrap. This has been a. This has been a really fun time all right.
Speaker 3:Well, hey, we appreciate you having you here, so we'll go after six months. We've been trying this for six months.
Speaker 1:I know we've been really excited back and forth.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we'll have to do it again sometime, yeah, so, and maybe we'll have Erica Stinch come with us yeah, yeah, I'd love that Madison Walker too yeah.
Speaker 2:Simon Lazat will be at Cascade Challenge right now.
Speaker 3:Well, I'm gonna need to get some more microphones build me a shed studio.
Speaker 2:Yes, we'll be a cascade challenge. Right now, I'm going to need to get some more microphones. Build me a shed.
Speaker 3:Studio. Yes.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 3:And that does it for this episode of the intentional disc golfer podcast. We're here talking about the NAD park restoration project and trying to help other clubs and community members be able to start a project like this. And maybe you're a city or locale. If you appreciate us, like us, can't live without us. Please like, subscribe, share, follow, tell all of your friends. You can find us on Facebook and Instagram at Soprinski Disc Golf or just search the Intentional Disc Golfer Podcast. Also, we have an ex TikTok and a YouTube at the IDG Podcast. That is at the IDG podcast. That is at the IDG podcast. You can also visit our website and send us some fan mail. You can click the upper left-hand corner where it says send us a text and we will get that fan mail. Or you can email us directly at the intentional disc golfer at gmailcom. That is the intentional disc golfer at gmailcom.
Speaker 3:And if you would like to support the cause, please visit our Patreon. Get some access to exclusive behind-the-scenes content. It's very in the beginning stages right now, but it's growing constantly. That is patreoncom backslash theintentionaldiscgolfer. Patreoncom backslash theintentionaldiscgolfer. And please stay tuned after the episode. If we have any bloopers or outtakes, we will pin them to the end of this episode, so do stick around for that and get a good laugh. We would like to again thank our sponsors. Big shout out to treasures of the forest. They do the epoxy special minis and so get your uh epoxy special monies at treasures dash of dash the dash forestcom. And we'd like to givea shout out to our other sponsor jenny a salty unicorns disc golf apparel salty unicorns.
Speaker 3:That is correct. Salty unicorns is, uh, a proud sponsor of jenny.
Speaker 2:Yay, I like sponsors of me.
Speaker 3:And we'd like to thank our fans for sticking with us and being with us all this time. We really do love you. You guys make it so we can do what we do and really keep this show going. So for the Intentional Disc Golfer Podcast, I am one of your hosts. My name is Brandon and I'm Jenny.
Speaker 3:And we're also here with our special guest, Chris Pendleton, and here at the intentional disc golfer podcast. We truly believe that disc golf changes lives, so go out there and grow the sport. Thank you for listening to this episode of the Intentional Disc Golfer Podcast. These are the bloopers and outtakes from this latest episode. We do have to warn you that profanity may be used and sensitive topics may be discussed. Listener discretion is highly advised To avoid this. Please stop listening and move on to the next episode now.
Speaker 2:Are we doing calendar?
Speaker 3:Yes, you want to get that ready. Get the calendar out. We're always doing calendar.
Speaker 1:Are you going to admit while we talk? Yeah, I love it. That's awesome. The intro is always the same. All right, I expect talk. Yeah, I love it. The intro is always the same.
Speaker 2:So all right, I expect to fully complete a project by the time we're done.
Speaker 3:I have one that's done, so I can just slide it over and be like oh nice, yeah, I love it. She's turning into the leg warmer girl and this will all go on the blooper reel. So have you listened to the podcast at all? I have, yeah, cool, I have. I haven't listened to the podcast at all I have.
Speaker 1:Yeah, cool, I have. I haven't listened to the Oakley or Stokely one yet, but I am so happy that you got Oakley and Stokely.
Speaker 3:We just did, sarah Hogan.
Speaker 1:And you did, hogan. Oh, you're really going for the Oaks, aren't you?
Speaker 3:Yeah, those are the only people that yeah, I guess.
Speaker 2:I didn't think of that, it of Brandon or the.
Speaker 3:Oaks. There's only like four of them in the entire PDGA Tour.
Speaker 2:Now you're done.
Speaker 3:I know Well, chris Dickerson said he would. Oh, he's not an Oak, I know, but he said he would interview in November, once the season's over, so touch base with him when that time comes around. Alright, well, let's get her going. Oh f***.
Speaker 1:I feel like you need to have like a After these messages, we'll be right back. We just recorded that. That's right.
Speaker 3:That's getting soundbited.
Speaker 1:Wasn't that from like the cartoons from the 80s.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it is Like the Saturday morning cartoons. Saturday morning cartoons Saturday morning.
Speaker 3:Cartoons and tutorials.
Speaker 2:Yes, oh, we found them all on all the Nickelodeon ones on Prime Video, so we've been watching them with the kids, like Guts and Double, Dare and Nick Arcade.
Speaker 3:Every kid wanted a piece of the aggro crack and I actually went on to Etsy or something and they sell them for like 200 bucks. Wow, I need to go through my mom's garage and see what I can find.
Speaker 1:Yeah, were you on Guts at some point Etsy or something, and they sell them for like 200 bucks. Wow, I need to go through my mom's garage and see what I can find.
Speaker 3:Were you on guts at some point.
Speaker 1:No, but I'm sure there's something in my mom's garage from when I was a kid.
Speaker 2:You know it's worth 200 dollars. Falls in that category, yeah.
Speaker 1:Hi, sweetie, I got a dog in my lap right now.
Speaker 3:You made a friend I did. I know he's just a sweetheart, I think, oh man.
Speaker 1:So what I've said to the, sorry, I'll pet you what I've said to the, yeah, we don't pay attention to him ever, Ever.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I can tell Poor neglected animal.
Speaker 1:He knows exactly where the hand is. Just. He knows exactly where the hand is. Just put your hand on my head, monkey Pet me Um the uh.
Speaker 3:And then you Um.
Speaker 2:The train has left.
Speaker 3:The train has you need a choo choo train.
Speaker 1:Squirrel, it's a mad squirrel.
Speaker 2:Like the dog's Intrusive. Oh my gosh the dog is intrusive.
Speaker 3:You have a friend I have, I have a friend indeed.
Speaker 4:Um yeah, baker's my new buddy fozzie's gonna be super jealous of you when they go home it as long as they're.
Speaker 3:I think that's oh, you just want to snuggle, don't you want to snuggle?
Speaker 1:okay, for for reference. When I was giving a baker baker like treats earlier he was running away from me and now he's like staring me deeply in the eyes like we're friends, we're friends um, but baker get down I have a new.
Speaker 2:I have a new uh he wants to be on the on the podcast go lay down go lay down poor baker I know this is normally our sit on the couch and snuggle time yeah, this is my usually my sit on the couch and snuggle fozzy time too.
