The Intentional Disc Golfer
Unleash your disc golf potential with The Intentional Disc Golfer podcast! Join us as we dive deep into the physical and mental aspects of this incredible sport, helping you become the player you've always dreamed of being. We're here to elevate your game, share expert insights, and inspire intentional growth on and off the course. Support our mission by becoming a part of our avid listener community. Together, let's take your disc golf journey to new heights! Email us at theintentionaldiscgolfer@gmail.com to support or be featured on our show. Let's tee off towards greatness!
The Intentional Disc Golfer
Golf Mindset Expert Debbie O'Connell Reveals Powerful Strategies for Disc Golfers
Golf mindset coach Debbie O'Connell brings decades of experience to the disc golf world in this transformative conversation about the mental game. As an LPGA professional, bestselling author, and creator of the "Conquer Your Golf Mind" program, O'Connell shares powerful insights that translate perfectly to disc golf's mental challenges.
The episode explores how our thoughts create our reality on the course, with O'Connell introducing game-changing frameworks that help players overcome self-doubt and pressure. Her E+R=O formula (Event + Response = Outcome) demonstrates how we can't control things like weather or slow play, but our response ultimately determines our results. Meanwhile, her BLAB technique (Body Language, Language, Appreciation, Breath) offers a practical method for shifting from frustration to focus in moments when performance matters most.
Perhaps most revealing is O'Connell's perspective on how we interpret others' reactions to our play: "What you think other people are thinking of you is your business and it's very telling." This insight helps players recognize when they're projecting their own insecurities onto others, creating unnecessary pressure. Through stories from her work with professional golfers and the LPGA Leadership Academy, O'Connell illustrates how authenticity and vulnerability actually enhance performance rather than hinder it.
The conversation weaves between practical techniques for immediate implementation and deeper philosophical shifts about how we approach competition. Whether you're struggling with tournament nerves, negative self-talk, or the frustration of inconsistent play, this episode offers tools to transform your relationship with disc golf's mental challenges.
Ready to elevate your mental game? Join Debbie's free five-day mindset challenge at debbie-oconnell.com, where five-minute daily practices can create lasting change in how you approach the course—and life beyond it.
Disc Golf Changes Lives <3
To support this podcast or arrange for an interview please contact us at theintentionaldiscgolfer@gmail.com
Welcome to the Intentional Disc Golfer Podcast, the show dedicated to helping you elevate your disc golf game with purpose and strategy. Whether you're stepping up to the tee for the first time or you're a seasoned pro chasing that perfect round, this podcast is your guide to playing smarter, training better and building confidence on the course. We are, brandon and Jenny Saprinsky, passionate disc golfers, here to explore everything from technique, course management, mental focus and gear selection. Grab your favorite disc, settle in and let's take your game to the next level. Intentionally.
Speaker 3:Thank you for listening to this episode of the Intentional Disc Golfer Podcast. I am one of your hosts, my name is Brandon and I'm Jenny, and today, on this episode, we are going to have Debbie O'Connell, an LPGA Northeast Sanctioned Teacher of the Year 2016,. Golf Digest 50 Best Women Teachers in America. Lpga Prestigious Nancy Lopez Inaugural Golf Achievement Award and voted one of the LPGA's 50 Best Teachers. Also host of the Audible series Game Time. Golf Positive, the popular golf channel TV show Par for the Course and the best-selling book Golf Positive Live Positive.
Speaker 4:I do need to give you guys a warning. We spent three weeks in the Midwest so you may hear some Minnesota or Wisconsin tones coming out of Brandon's mouth.
Speaker 3:You've picked it up pretty well as well. You've picked up this accent All right.
Speaker 4:So Debbie O'Connell she is absolutely amazing and I'm excited that she was on our disc golf podcast.
Speaker 3:It's weird to hear PGA instead of PDGA, so now that we've introduced the episode, we would like to thank the fans for listening. If you enjoy what you're listening to here, please share with all of your friends. You can find us on all the social medias. Just search the Intentional Disc Golfer and if you would like to share some fan love directly, have an email the intentional disc golfer at gmailcom. That is, the intentional disc golfer at gmailcom. And after this episode and after the outro music, we usually pin the bloopers and outtakes from each episode. Uh, directly after that, about a three second pause. So do stay tuned for that and get a good laugh. And we're moving into the community calendar where you can see us, find us, come, talk to us and share your love.
Speaker 4:Next, jenny, take away well, I want to actually, you know, thank our fans that are still listening to us and the new fans that are starting to listen to us since, uh, united states women's disc golf championship and from the PDGA Amateur Major for the Masters Championship. So we have been out of the scene of the local podcasting for the past couple of weeks. I don't think we've put out a podcast in a couple of months because we've been finishing up end of school year with our kids.
Speaker 4:Uh, we have a new senior in the house hayley's a senior gonna graduate this year um I played at usw dgc and took second place for fa3 and then played the um master's tournament and tied for 23rd.
Speaker 3:So well, let's talk about those experiences real quick. No, that's a whole different episode well, and just that was a wildly good time. I mean it was. It was so much fun to get to travel, see the different courses. Uh, the people made a huge difference. If you have the opportunity to go to one of these major events, I I highly recommend it.
Speaker 4:So actually I just played Summertime Fling in the Evergreens yesterday. I took first place for FA2. Tony Morgan always puts on a great tournament over there at Evergreen State College.
Speaker 3:Yeah, thank you, Tony.
Speaker 4:Yep, this weekend we will be playing the Dip Discs 2025 South Sound Classic presented by Dynamic Discs, and this is put on by Mr Mark Hill who runs a lovely tournament. It's kind of called the three-headed monster in a way, because you're playing Delphi, shelton and Evergreen, so three of the big courses right down there in the olympia area, shelton area and, uh it's, it's a great tournament a lot of fun.
Speaker 3:Yeah, each course is very challenging and presents its own uh list of challenges all on its own yeah.
Speaker 4:So three different courses, three days, gonna be a blast. Um, ladies of the lake. The fifth of the evergreen women's series will be on saturday 26th over at uh, ralph williamson memorial disc golf course. I think you can still sign up for it if you get a hold of them real quick. And the next day is a rat city rumble, which is kind of looks like they're doing the men's tournament on Sunday to go with the women's tournament on Saturday. I'm actually playing both just because I want to Whisper, whisper, whisper, whisper. We haven't signed up for it yet, but the White River Open supported by Innova, part of the Great Northwest Point Series, august 2nd and 3rd Possibly the Mountain View Championships. We haven't signed up for a lot of tournaments. We're waiting for our trip to financially recover Kind of settle out.
Speaker 4:Yeah, yeah. So we have a few things we haven't signed up for yet, but they're coming up.
Speaker 3:Okay, so before we get started with this episode and talking to Debbie O'Connell, we need to give a couple shout-outs and thank our sponsors. Do you have any shout outs to give jenny?
Speaker 4:yes, I would like to first off thank, uh, treasures of the forest for their lovely minis. They are so wonderful. Um, I even found a butterfly on our trip and was able to hand it right over to matt at masters and be like hey, can you make me a mini out of this? No rush, no hurry, but we'll see what happens. So, uh, we also picked up a couple of really cool minis. Um, some of the trophies for masters I believe it was for the doubles and the like.
Speaker 3:The distance and putting competitions Distance putting Was there a CTP maybe?
Speaker 4:No.
Speaker 3:Or aces or something. No, I don't know.
Speaker 4:Those were all made by Treasures of the Forest, so big shout out to Matt and Shantae at Treasures of the Forest and the rest of the team. They're doing a great job making these beautiful little minis, and I now have three of them.
Speaker 3:I know I'm a big fan and I've started my collection of treasures of the forest. I think I'm especially fond of the dinosaur one.
Speaker 4:Yes.
Speaker 3:It's got some wooden stuff in it and some things that Matt's found out on the course, and then it's got a little dinosaur. So I'm pretty excited about that.
Speaker 4:It's got a stegosaurus and this thing is a thick mini, probably because of the Stegosaurus that's in there, and the Stegosaurus has, like, bloody feet. I don't know if that's intentional, but it just kind of adds that sense of drama, it's drama.
Speaker 3:It's like the buffalo at Yellowstone.
Speaker 4:Yes.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4:Anyways also to Salty Unicorn Disc Golf Apparel. I get a lot of compliments on the shirts that we are wearing. Brandon's were hidden under caddy bibs for a while, but love my Salty Unicorns gear. Looking forward to getting my bag that's coming out. So they're starting to make bags based off of any of the custom designs that they have on their website. So if you're interested in getting the hookup, let me know. I'll see what I can do to help you get one of the first Salty Unicorn bags. Mine is in production right now.
Speaker 3:Aren't they starting to make discs as well?
Speaker 4:Yes, they have a run of a few discs. There were three of them. I actually didn't buy them because they're not anything that I can throw, but they're working on discs as well, and they've got some really cute stamps on them, like one's a griffin, I think one was a unicorn.
Speaker 3:I can't remember what the third one was, yeah, but anyways well, and speaking of salty unicorns, we still have several jerseys left over from the tritons of the timbers and sirens of the springs. They're awesome salty unicorn jerseys, and so if you would like to purchase one of those jerseys, we could give you a heck of a deal on it. Just send us an email if you're interested and we will be happy to coordinate with you yeah, and hopefully I'll get our website up and running in the next couple of weeks.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that would be great.
Speaker 4:And my big news is that I am now officially part of the Prodigy Street team. So I will be repping all Prodigy discs and working to help grow the company of Prodigy.
Speaker 3:Yeah. So we'd like to thank Prodigy Discs out there for supporting Jenny and supporting this podcast, with helping our cause with throwing more discs and bringing more people to the game.
Speaker 4:Yeah, we were able to get all of our discs, for Sirens and Tritons were Prodigy Selfishly. They were some of my favorite discs and now I'm excited to get to throw more of the brand. They're very beginner friendly and actually a lot of the discs have changed just changed my game completely so I'm looking forward to helping more people find those discs, those little charms that help grow you as a person absolutely, and I've got one too kind of remnant from the uh.
Speaker 3:Sirens of the springs, tritons of the timbers need to give a shout out to builders first source in shelton, washington they stepped up big and helped us with the tournament. A nice donation to help bring more prizes and more advertisement to the uh the tournaments and, um, the players really did appreciate that and so if you're out there and you need anything for your home or your project, please visit builders first source.
Speaker 4:They will treat you right and they have the quality products to get your project done deep within the heart of the forest, where moonlight dances on moss and ancient trees whisper forgotten lore, tiny wonders are born. Treasures of the Forest brings you handcrafted resin minis that are more than just markers they're enchanted keepsakes for the course. Each mini is a unique piece of woodland magic, inspired by ancient trees, glowing mushrooms, forest creatures and the quiet power of nature. Whether you're sinking birdies or chasing the sunrise on your home course, these minis connect your game to something deeper. Resin, cast with care, infused with forest vibes, designed to stand out on the teapad and in your soul. Check out Treasures of the Forest at treasures-of-the-forestcom, or you can find them on Facebook at Treasures of the Forest.
Speaker 4:All right, let's talk about a brand that's bringing some serious fun and personality to disc golf Salty Unicorns Apparel. That's right, salty Unicorns Apparel. They started because disc golf fashion was seriously lacking in style, especially for women. What began as a simple search for better apparel turned into something bigger, and in just a few weeks they were outfitting own Scoggins, and now they've got Jessica Oleski, lucas Carmichael and Trinity Bryant rocking their gear too. Salty Unicorns is different because they actually prioritize women's apparel, something most brands don't. And they're not stopping there. Pretty soon they're launching their own Salty Unicorn bags, bringing that same energy and creativity to the gear you carry. So if you want to stand out on the course and support a brand that's shaking things up, check out Salty Unicorns apparelarel, because disc golf should be fun and so should what you wear. Find them online, follow them on social media and bring some color to your game. Use the code SALTY10 for a 10% discount.
Speaker 3:If you want to know how disc golf allows you to practice the ultimate skill of the human being, you should listen to the intentional disc golfer this is Joel Turner, with shot IQ and mind IQ. Get loud, my friends, alright. So on this episode, joining us is an LPGA golfer as well as a motivational speaker, a frequent in the golf channel and has her own radio show. Go ahead and introduce yourself for our audience if you would please.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much. Well, first of all, I appreciate you having me on your podcast. As you said, I'm an LPGA professional. I've been teaching the game for 35 years and then, when I found how much the mental game was a struggle, especially for me, I went deeper and deeper and deeper into the mindset and became a mindset coach, a golf mindset coach. I have a program called Conquer your Golf Mind and I wrote a book called Golf Positive, live Positive, and I just create so many programs that help people with their mindset, which is really the key to everything, wouldn't you agree?
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely. That's probably the biggest facet of the game that I struggle with personally.
Speaker 1:And that's not unusual. And if you ask most people about their golf game, they're like oh, I'm just a mental case out there. Yeah, it is, so it is. It's challenging how we talk to ourself, our thoughts and emotions. That happen. We're human beings with emotions, you know, and we have oftentimes limiting beliefs and they get in the way as well. Or the person who has to be a perfectionist or feel like they're in control and it's hard to relax and just let yourself play.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it sounds like you've actually been out on the course with me, to be honest, yeah, I think you nailed it.
Speaker 3:So, debbie, how did you first get introduced to golf and how did you get started and what took you ultimately down this path?
Speaker 1:I played other sports growing up. I played softball and basketball were my two main sports. I played some field hockey for two years in high school. Then I decided to focus on basketball and ended up playing basketball in college and that was a great experience Division one could be at the highest level, played in the NCAA final four. It was awesome.
Speaker 3:Which school was that when I was a?
Speaker 1:teenager oh, I went to. Western Kentucky University. Oh, okay, I was a teenager. Oh, I went to Western Kentucky University. Oh, okay, yeah. And the final four we were in was Cheryl Miller's senior year at USC. Pat Summitt was coaching at Tennessee and Texas. Who won it? Jody Conrad was the coach and they were a powerhouse at the time, in the mid-1980s.
Speaker 3:Wow in the company of legends. It was awesome, that's very, very cool. So you started to say, as a teenager, you as a teenager, my parents played a little bit of golf Not much.
Speaker 1:My dad would maybe go once a week, but not all the time. We didn't belong to a country club. We were more lower middle class and couldn't afford things like that. And one day we all went out to play so I could hit it because I'm athletic, but I had no idea what I was doing. As a matter of fact, I even had the pull cart and pulled it right up onto the green. My dad was like get off the green. I knew nothing and I maybe played four or five times as a teenager.
Speaker 1:And then one of those times was with my college basketball coach and he told the golf coach you know, debbie can hit a golf ball, she's pretty good. So after basketball season my junior year, she said, hey, I hear you play golf and I'm like, well, kind of. She said come on out. And I went and met her at the course and I'm thinking she's going to give me a lesson because, as I said, I don't know anything. And she said we're going to play. I was like we're going to play, show me how to hold this thing. I have no idea. Whatever she told me, I crushed it down the middle, so much so that one of the girls on the golf team was like coach, she's fixing to embarrass you. I remember those words fixing to embarrass you. I just laughed and of course I didn't really know how to play the game or short game, and you know so I didn't compete in terms of score, but I hit some really good shots, and then she started working with me.
Speaker 3:So what level of not knowing the game? Like maybe a basic knowledge, like get the ball in the hole but not like all the little intricacies and rules and things, or like yeah, like I'm sure I knew enough.
Speaker 1:Like there's a tee box, you tee it up there and fairway and green, and because I've watched some golf on TV. Not a lot. We weren't a golfing family but I I that was, uh, nancy lopez had already come on the scene and I was a fan of hers, so I enjoyed watching that and of course, some of the some of the famous guys you know, like jack and arnie. They were always fun to watch, but not not a lot. It wasn't't like every week we're going to watch golf on TV, it was just if we happened to catch it. So I had an idea of the game and I knew what a good swing looked like. You know, just watching golf, but that was it. I didn't know how to technically swing a club. I didn't know short game, I didn't know ball position, things like that, and certainly no rules, rules I knew no rules just hit the ball and go down the fairway, hopefully exactly that's how I play.
Speaker 1:When I played golf makes it more fun sometimes, doesn't it? Yeah, it does so about when?
Speaker 3:about how old were you when you really started to take this on? You said it was your college coach, correct?
Speaker 1:Yes. Well, what was crazy is she said to me, in three weeks we have a college golf tournament. It's the best five scores out of six players. Right now I only have five on the team. Why don't you be our sixth? And I looked at her and I said do you think I can? And seriously, what I know about golf now I think she was crazy. She said, yeah, you can do it. I worked my butt off for three weeks trying to get ready for this tournament and I was literally the talk of the tournament. I did come in last, although it was only by a couple strokes. What was funny? The one time I sliced it over to the right in the trees I have parents looking for the ball. There's a couple coaches out there looking. I'm looking, then they're all looking like it's really, really important. My thought is, I have more golf balls. Can I just drop one and hit another one?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I didn't know that if you lose it you go back to the T. I had no idea.
Speaker 3:Oh goodness.
Speaker 1:But we found it, which was nice.
Speaker 3:That's great. And you said that this is for Kentucky, right?
Speaker 1:Western Kentucky Western.
Speaker 3:Kentucky.
Speaker 1:So you're, you're going from having dabbled in the game at best to playing a regional tournament for a division one golf team. Yes, yes, and even crazier than that. I I finished my, my senior year and I decided I'm going to be a professional golfer. Well, two years after that decision, I played played in an LPGA tour event. That was kind of accidental, so how did that happen?
Speaker 2:I played that one too.
Speaker 1:Well, as I joined the LPGA, what we were called at the time was teaching and club professionals. Now we're called LPGA professionals and when you were a member of that part of the LPGA, you could try to qualify for one LPGA tour event per year. Somewhere in proximity to your home there is the shop right classic, which still goes on today, and I signed up to go to qualify and I was like this is great, it was $100, I'll play with a lot of really good golfers. I won't qualify, I'll get a great experience, perfect. The week before the event, the lady calls me and says all right, debbie, I want to let you know you're in the tournament. And I said great, yes, I'll be there Monday to qualify. She said no, no, no, we didn't have enough people sign up, so everyone who signed up is in the event.
Speaker 2:Oh like, oh.
Speaker 4:No, that's not my plan that kind of reminds me of my disc golf, because I play a lot of tournaments where I'm the only girl who's playing, so I have a lot of first place trophies just because I'm the only one that played there you go.
Speaker 1:Yeah, how come more, more?
Speaker 4:uh, women don't play so that is one of the areas that we're, you know, trying to figure out with disc golf how do we increase the amount of women that play um? A lot of the states are starting to do um a series of women's events like washington state has a series of it's events. Like Washington State has a series of it's somewhere between eight and 10 events that's specific to the women, and they're also working on growing it for juniors too, so kids under 18. But that's definitely one area that the PDGA needs to grow in and they're taking some steps, know, taking some steps forwards, taking some steps back, trying to figure out how to get more people to play.
Speaker 1:Well, the LPGA has a goal of changing the face of the game. For years it was about 20, maybe up to 22% of golfers were women and that would not move. It was always that percent. And the LPGA has a girls' golf program where we have now reached a million young girls and introduced them to the game and many have just come back year after year after year and they love it. And so there's more now women playing. There are tour players who grew up and started in the girls golf program and it's also sponsored by the USGA USGA LPGA girls golf. Our goal is to get to the next million and that is now changing the face of the game because there's over 30% girls and juniors now getting close to 40 and the women are moving up, now getting closer to 30%.
Speaker 3:Nice, that's awesome. Yeah, we have four daughters, so we're big advocates for the growth of women's sports and getting young ladies involved in athletic endeavors.
Speaker 1:And that is so key to development. I think it's. I'm so glad you're a part of that and there's been a huge growth right. Kaitlyn Clark with the WNBA and what she did in college has been incredible and it brought so much attention to the talent these women have in the game. And more people are watching than ever.
Speaker 3:Wasn't Kaitlyn Clark the all-time point scorer in college basketball, both for men and women?
Speaker 1:yes, and that's what attracted so much attention. She beat pistol pete's record, yeah, and when she passed that, it brought an incredible amount of attention, not just to her, but to women's basketball and women's sports. I mean, soccer is growing there's, so other sports are growing Softball a professional softball league is starting. There's been a huge growth in women's sports overall.
Speaker 4:I know one of our daughters is watching the women's hockey league. She's pretty excited about that. She's big into hockey.
Speaker 3:She doesn't play, but she loves, loves the sport yeah and yeah, so it's growing everywhere so some commentary on golf and just kind of a plug to the young ladies and even the older ladies out there. As far as disc golf and just golf in general, it goes is that this sport is so accessible to everybody and you can play it your entire life, both ball golf and disc golf, and so it's a lifetime sport and there's no like there is a little bit of a stigma remnants because women never historically women weren't allowed to play golf back when it first came about. But now that they are like come one, come all, play, be a part of it. It's accessible to everybody as where like, say, things like football or baseball or hockey might not be.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, you can get into golf anywhere you live, whether it's the first tee for juniors, girls golf for juniors, and courses are more welcoming. There's enough public courses. There are a tremendous amount of women's golf associations. You know the LPGA Amateur Association In New Jersey. We have the Women's Golf Association of New Jersey. I mean, if people really just take a look and you don't have to look hard, just golf near me, probably If you want a teacher, you can Google find the teacher LPGA. You put your zip code in and all of a sudden you can get some golf lessons with somebody nearby. You know, I mean, men are great teachers as well. I know our LPGA education and I'd love for people to look there and see if there's anyone nearby who could help them get into the game.
Speaker 4:Yeah, we went to. On our trip to Minnesota we went to a place called Top Golf and so we were able to take our kids and they were shooting drives and it was video gamified, because you had to get into these massive holes and the technology of tracking the ball to give you the points was just amazing and our kids by the end were like, hey, maybe I do want to do this golf thing. So even things like that, where they're gamifying it for our younger generation, that's so computer-based, technology-based giving is that there were more rounds played not on grass last year.
Speaker 1:52% of golf is played in indoor simulators. It's played at top golf type places and it's become so easy for juniors who love, like the video, the video games, and they can just see it and then in in those indoor simulators they could do soccer, they could, they could throw a Frisbee, they there's throw football. There's so many things they can do in the simulator and they're also used to it, yeah.
Speaker 3:Well, and it kind of it kind of defeats the environmental problems too, because, like we're up in Washington, it rains for eight months out of the year it rains, and so being able to play on an indoor simulator and get the same effect really not only grows the sport, but also makes it more accessible for those people that maybe don't have the money to fly down to Arizona for three or four months.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly, it makes it a year-round sport, no matter where you live, whether it's too hot in Arizona or it's too cold up in Washington or New York State, wherever you are, you can play golf year-round now, and it's become more and more popular. Indoor golf is just exploding.
Speaker 3:Air-conditioned golf. I could get used to that. That'd be sweet.
Speaker 1:It'd be too cold for me.
Speaker 3:Yeah right, and being able to order some nachos and be like, hey, I'm in the ninth hole and nachos.
Speaker 4:If you want to put nachos in your golf cart, you can. There's nothing stopping you. I played with a lady who had fried rice in her golf bag, so I mean you can put whatever you want in there.
Speaker 3:I like the bacon one.
Speaker 4:Yeah, so actually I wanted to get into the idea of the mental game with golf. I've also been studying the mental game of golf and disc golf and how it's helped me I don't know recover from things that I've been through and seeing. Going out there with a lot of the women and hearing their stories of you know, I have anxiety, I have depression, I have this, I have that and they're out there and using disc golf as their way to improve, to grow and kind of get back to who they want to be. So I'd love to hear your story of how you got into studying the mindset of golf.
Speaker 1:What a great question and such an important topic, because so many people struggle on the mental part of life, not just in these sports. What happens oftentimes in golf? It brings out the challenges that people have. We bring our whole mindset, our whole brain to disc golf, to golf, 18 hole golf on the golf course or in simulators and sometimes, if with the right mindset, it's the getaway right, it's the escape from if life is causing too many challenges or too many anxieties.
Speaker 1:But I got into it when I was a teenager. My mom would buy Salada tea bags and they had quotes on them and I would read those quotes. Every time I had a cup of tea or anyone in my family I would grab them all and I would save the ones that resonated with me. And so many of those quotes were about like positive thinking, believing in yourself. And then I got into Norman Vincent Peale. I think I saw a couple of his quotes and then I started reading his books and listening to cassette tapes to give you my age more of it of Zig Ziglar, oh yeah. And then I learned about what was called Silva Mind Control, which is now Mind Valley today, and I just was so passionate about for me being the best athlete I could be and then being the best person that I could be, achieving goals, being successful, personal growth. I was very much attracted to that. I majored in psychology. I then, after majoring in psychology, I got Tony Robbins cassette tapes personal power and did that program and even though I then went to golf pursuing as a player and then I loved teaching the game and I became a head golf professional eventually and still always teaching I was focused on the mental game and then I went so deep I became a life coach.
Speaker 1:So now I don't even just talk mental game, I talk mindset, which is the entire thoughts, emotions, behaviors, our entire being. And that's what you mentioned, jenny, because the anxiety that people experience right that, the fear that we experience, the doubts, the pressure we put on ourselves to be perfect or to have these high standards and trying to live up to trying to belong, you know there's so many things that get in the way of us just allowing ourselves to be ourselves out there, vulnerable, and all miss the disc, miss the basket, miss the shot, you know, hit it in the water, or you know the disc doesn't go where you want it to and maybe that feels embarrassing, but then go wait, I tried my best. It's not so easy, yeah, and that's why I love to dig into the mindset and really, what are the limiting beliefs? That's creating the negative thoughts, which creates those emotions? So it's incredibly powerful. I love it.
Speaker 3:I'm so glad that you said that like that, because I think the foremost emotion that I feel when I have a terrible round is that I'm embarrassed because I feel like I've let myself down, I've let my card mates down, uh, I just it's so multi-faceted, the embarrassment, that it's like I just want to go crawl into a hole and disappear for a week yeah.
Speaker 1:I. What does that represent? Right, if you have a bad round and you other people were counting on you and let them letting you, you you feel like you let them down. Like what does that represent to you? What does that mean about you? What do you think that means?
Speaker 3:um well, you know now that I think about it introspectively, like that. I feel like it's I care too much about what other people think.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so, and that's what's so important, right? Then we go deeper. And then, what's important about that? How is the problem? Is they think negatively or they felt disappointed, right? Or you know so. So we want to examine. This is what I do, is I examine? When did you decide? What other people think? Is that important, right? And we want to understand what, how, how your brain is doing the problem, because there could be someone else who finishes that round.
Speaker 1:And they were terrible. They go. Well, geez, that was really bad, but I tried my best. Let me go learn some things. I promise you guys, I'll do better next time, right? Someone could do that, or someone could feel totally embarrassed, and there's no judgment on any of it. We're just human beings and we have a certain neurology, neural connections in our brain and beliefs, and we put meaning to everything we do. There's always a meaning. So what does it mean? Oh, geez, I let them down. Well, that's why I feel embarrassed. And then what does that mean? That I really care what other people think? And then, typically, it's, and I think they're thinking negative things about me, because your teammates might be thinking well, I know, he tried his best, we all tried.
Speaker 3:love the guy, all is good, but you think they're thinking dang, he let us down but I think it's a little bit of body language too, because when, for example, I'm having a bad round and I'm playing in a tournament, I can kind of read the hand motions and the shoulders and the breathing patterns of kind of the people around me growing impatient, like, oh boy, he's taking another shot. Oh man, here we are again, like okay, this is going to be a problem and and a lot of that is just kind of my inner voice interpreting those actions.
Speaker 1:but a lot of it, a lot of it is perception and body language and he and I do also believe a lot of that is assumptions on your point, on yourself. So here's a great quote. Everybody pay, pay attention to this. You're going to love it, right? We know what other people think of you is none of your business. I've added to that what you think other people are thinking of you is your business and it's very telling. So when we put thoughts on other people that they haven't said, that means that's what we're thinking of ourselves and you're also looking for that in a way. So this is neurolinguistic programming. It's all researched.
Speaker 1:We have about 11 million bits of information coming at us every second, meaning, like in the morning when you put your socks on, you feel your socks around your feet, right? You just put them on. Eventually you don't feel them anymore, right? So there's a lot of information that we could take in that's coming at us. Our brain can only handle about 134 bits of information, so how does it decide what to notice? So, brandon, what you're saying, you notice their body language that then interpret it. Where someone else maybe in that 134, they're just noticing the trees that are so pretty, or the animal that went by, or they're so focused on their next shot that they don't even notice how other people are standing or looking at them. So that's important to you, that's what we discover, right? It's important to you what other people are thinking and you're interpreting it based on what your beliefs are.
Speaker 1:So I tell a story that can make this point. So if, if someone feels like I don't belong, right, and they walk into a party and they see a person who they know and who's really popular everybody loves this person and they see them and it looks like they're looking at and they wave to them and they just turn around and walk away. So someone who thinks I don't belong here is going to say, oh my gosh, they saw me, they're mad, I'm here, I knew I shouldn't have come, someone who feels I belong here, and then that same situation happens. They might go oh, they must not have seen me, or someone must have called them, or they don't interpret it at all. They just go oops, oh well, and they go start talking to other people. So you see what I mean how we interpret things based on our beliefs, we put meaning to things and, yes, can people read body language? I'm not saying we can't, we can, but how do you know that body language is about you and not about something else.
Speaker 4:So I want to go a little make another connection with that. So we interviewed Joel Turner about Shot IQ and Mind IQ and one of the things that he said that has helped me as of late because I just played two major events is to when something happens so maybe I think someone's talking about me, or like there's a lot of wind, or like the sun's in my eye I just have to acknowledge it and say, yep, someone's talking and move on. So for me, giving it that little bit of energy instead of letting it sit in my head, and fester has really helped me move past a lot of the problems that I've had the past three or four years we've been playing and allowed me to participate in, feel like I could participate in some major events and was relatively successful.
Speaker 1:So powerful, yeah, so recognizing and being real and honest. I have people in golf be like, okay, the water isn't there. The water isn't there. And I'm like, okay, you don't say that.
Speaker 4:Yes, it's not true.
Speaker 3:Your brain's like, okay, the water's really there.
Speaker 1:You're trying to lie to me. No, the water's there. I see the water, so don't pretend it's not there because it's there. So, whatever the truth is, yes, the wind. So here's a great formula for everyone to write down E plus R equals O. The E is the event, the wind. People talking on the golf course slow play. Does slow play happen in disc golf?
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, Mm-hmm.
Speaker 1:Okay, so slow play, right, you got your rhythm going and all of a sudden, jeez, we got to wait for everybody, right? So E is the event. And then a lot of people think, bad event, bad outcome. Oh, this is bad. And they go right to the outcome is bad. Some people talk themselves into oh, I can't play with this pace of play. I'm terrible in slow play. I lose my rhythm and tempo, I lose my focus. And then guess what happens the next time they're slow play. They don't play well. The next time they're slow play, you already told yourself that you don't play well in slow play. So E plus R equals O. The plus R is how you respond. Your response really influences the outcome. You know, take during COVID.
Speaker 1:There were a lot of people who put on what they called the COVID-15, and maybe some people put on more. Right, there was an event bad. Their gym closed, their personal trainer can't train them anymore, whatever they can't do, their Pilates or yoga, whatever they were doing, because everything shut down and they went, ooh, that's bad, I can't do this. And they did nothing. Then there's others who said, oh okay, this happened. I will respond by doing workouts at home. I'm going to find people online. I'm going to maybe eat healthier, because now I'm eating at home every meal and their outcome was they got in the best shape of their life.
Speaker 1:So it's how you've got to take the responsibility. Put yourself in the driver's seat when you blame things you know on outside of you. So the wind happens. If all of a sudden you can recognize, okay, the wind, then make a decision with a response to create a good outcome. You're taking responsibility for the outcome and when you do, you're in the driver's seat. And when you take responsibility, even if you drive yourself into a ditch because you're in the driver's seat, if you take that responsibility, you can drive yourself out. If it's everybody else's fault, you're stuck right.
Speaker 1:So I hear people all the time complaining about things that are out of their control. So one of the things for all everyone listening in in disc golf, golf, whatever sport you play in life, in work, your career, in your relationship, what can you control? What can't you control? If you can't control it, let that go. You can notice it, just let it go. And then the R is how can I respond to whatever I can't control? We couldn't control COVID. We can't control slow play, right, how do I respond to make the best outcome possible?
Speaker 2:Yeah, we're just sitting here letting it soak in, I think.
Speaker 3:So this is a thing that kind of hits close to home here, because we recently, in the last couple years, had a high school football coach that passed away and, uh, it was kind of all of a sudden and very tragic, and this was his saying all the time was the e plus r equals o, and so this, this equation, is plastered all over the side of the football field and on T-shirts, and they even have football jerseys dedicated to Coach Snyder. So, coach Snyder, if you're listening out there somewhere, this is for you, bud.
Speaker 1:Oh, that was so awesome. I learned it from a football coach.
Speaker 3:Yeah, there you go, there, you go, there, you go.
Speaker 1:So I wonder it could stem back to Coach Snyder, which is really amazing. I love that.
Speaker 4:So something that, since we've been talking, I was thinking of. You know, I think golf gives us this perfect opportunity to look at ourselves in kind of a I want to say microchasm I don't know if that's quite the word that I want to use but we have 18 opportunities to start over, try again, have an event with a different reaction and have a different outcome. And I think that's one of the things why people enjoy golf so much is because you have opportunity after opportunity after opportunity, and you have at least 18 of them. One of our courses is 27. And so sometimes it's 27 opportunities, but you have that opportunity to restart at the tee box every time, and then, you know, walking between holes, you get a chance to maybe get a breath, get some water, get some food and then do it again. So it gives you that opportunity, kind of on a smaller scale, on a rapid cycle, to go through all of these emotions and figure out how to make that quick change to have a better opportunity or better outcome.
Speaker 3:Well, and even if you want to break it down further, I mean, each and every shot is a new opportunity to start over, because it's always something different, something to adapt to. And you know, I've always said that golf is like holding up a gigantic mirror in front of your face and it really makes you examine yourself and maybe be overly self-aware.
Speaker 1:Without a doubt, golf will bring out all of the emotions, all of the challenges that you have in life. And you're so right about every shot is an opportunity as long as you take it. Too many people bring a bad hole or a bad shot to the next shot, a bad hole to the next hole, a bad front nine to the bad back nine. So as long as you take it as that, it's an opportunity and be able to let go. So one of the things I teach people is a nice deep sigh breath to let go of a poor execution, whether that's a disc golf or golf with a golf club, and then in your hand hitting a ball where you take a deep belly breath in. When you breathe in through your nose, your belly goes out and then when you breathe out, you go literally sigh it out and feel that anxious whatever leaves your body. I have a formula I teach and I call it blab, and I have people saying all the time make sure you blab, blab, blab all the way around the golf course and that's how you create a new opportunity every shot. Blab is, as you mentioned it earlier, brennan, body language. You can intentionally put yourself in a confident state by moving your body. We all know that our body reacts to our emotions. The opposite is also true. Our emotions react to our body language. So if you stand like a superhero and then put a smile on your face, you actually release your own little happy drug, serotonin, dopamine and you're standing in a confident posture. You can't help but get in a better state of mind. Then we add language I've got this, I can do this and language where when you respond and I like to say respond rather than react, because respond is a lot more to it and you can use your strategies. When you respond To a poor shot, you can say that's interesting. Or instead of being frustrated, you can say wow, this is so fascinating, I could aim over there and hit it over there, or throw that disc over there or miss by. That much Fascinating. And it pops you out of that negative state. Because we know when we get into a negative state we get so much adrenaline and cortisol, that stress hormone, that our body tenses up and it's hard to have a beautiful fluid golf swing with great timing and tempo and rhythm when you're tense. So, using language and then asking positive, leading questions, things like how can I hit my drive farther. How can I do better when there's slow play? What can I do Not there's slow play? What can I do Not? What's wrong with me? Why can't I whatever? Why can't I lose weight? What if you asked, how can I get in the best shape of my life and enjoy the process? Whatever you ask your brain, it's looking for the answer.
Speaker 1:So the L is positive language, positive words, words that can pop you out of any negative state, and then positive leading questions. And the A is appreciation. You cannot be stressed and thankful at the same time. So you can stop beating yourself up on the golf course because you're going to use positive language. You're going to say, nope, I got this Next hole, we can do it. And then look around and look at the trees, look at the water, look at anything, and be like I am so blessed to be out here, I am so thankful. Well, I can see, I can hear, I can walk, I can talk, I have, I can physically be out here playing the sport I love right and enjoying it with my friends and on the golf course the bar follows you if you like to have a cocktail Right.
Speaker 1:So it's all good. How about that?
Speaker 4:That's one thing missing in disc golf.
Speaker 1:You mentioned it. You mentioned it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, there you go, the bar.
Speaker 1:Oh, the cart you mentioned earlier the deep breaths right. So that's Blab and that's how you can create an opportunity every time by knowing I am in charge of how I feel. I am in charge of whether I'm going to approach this with a positive mindset and with confidence and belief in myself.
Speaker 4:I absolutely love this. I run a tournament. I've run it for three years. It's called Sirens of the Springs and it's part of the Evergreen Women's Series and it's held at Shelton Springs, washington, where they have the Cascade Challenge, one of the things that I do. So Shelton is windy, you go out into the field and the wind does what the wind does. So when, when I saw it doing that, I'm like you know what.
Speaker 4:It would be really fun to acknowledge the fact that, okay, the wind just took my disc and made it look like an elevator and went the wrong direction. So how can I recognize that with these women, as we're playing in a way that you know know makes these negative things positive? So what I did for one round of my tournament is I created a bingo card where it's some of those negative outcomes, it gets a positive spin on it. So, for example, one of my bingo squares is the wind takes the disc. So if the wind just kind of took it, you get a stamp on your bingo card.
Speaker 4:Or there's some hazards If they land in the hazards, they get a stamp on their bingo card. And then there's also some fun things that the women's do like take a picture of wildlife, take a selfie, take a group photo. But I started that last year and Brandon was like I'm not so sure about bingo. People started that last year and Brandon was like I'm not so sure about bingo, like people are pretty serious at this tournament, but they love it. They absolutely loved it that it took some of those negative outcomes and instantly turned it around and made it positive.
Speaker 3:so I think that ties in there thank you and it was so successful with the women that we started doing it at the men's tournament and the guys actually really turned on to it too.
Speaker 4:Yeah, we did a guys tournament this year the following day Tritons of the Timbers and they enjoyed the bingo card too.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Well, it turns it back into a game. Didn't we all love games as a kid, right, and we would play Yep. And that's what this really is. Can you be competitive? Can you want to win Absolutely? Can you also have a good time doing it? 100%.
Speaker 2:For sure.
Speaker 3:So on your, you know, doing our show research and whatnot, you speak about having a passion for developing self-esteem in children mainly teenagers using golf and these different mindsets and social structures, and this would be. I would love to hear about that because it plays so much into some of the work that Jenny's doing with her nonprofit organization, plays so much into some of the work that Jenny's doing with her nonprofit organization.
Speaker 1:This is the most important thing I do as an LPGA professional. I was very blessed in 2015. I got a phone call that said we are creating the LPGA Leadership.
Speaker 2:Academy.
Speaker 1:Would you help us write the curriculum? I said absolutely 100%. It's for teenage girls. We bring them in for a two-day totally transformational experience. We teach them things inside and we practice them indoors the best we can and really get them ready, and then we go outdoors and we use golf to implement so they learn it and they go implement it right away. They learn about leadership styles, they learn that they are a leader. They learn about blab Blab is a big thing. We teach them and they will repeat I am in charge of how I feel about a thousand times in two days. So it does empower them. For sure. They learn their own personality and personality traits, how people are different, and so they walk out different people. It's amazing to see and so rewarding. I cry at the end of every one because I know their lives were changed.
Speaker 3:So the first day is club in hand? No club in hand. Is it more chalk talk and like exercises?
Speaker 1:It's both. So we start indoors. We actually do a bingo board with questions like find someone who plays nine holes, find someone who plays the same golf clubs as you, find someone who's the youngest child or from your same state. So we have all these questions so they get to know each other. It's a whole group of people, like 40 girls, and we want them to get to know each other, get comfortable asking questions. We give them the questions Anybody, anybody, a left-handed golfer and then they sign their bingo card and they're trying to get full board bingo. So, speaking of bingo, we use that game as well.
Speaker 1:And then we get into teaching. First morning is the introduction about leadership, and then we teach them the Blab formula right away. And then we go outside for about an hour and a half and we implement it. And I'll give you an example. So we have the girls with a driver in their hand. They take a backswing and they say I am. And at impact they come up with a word, so say it's, I am confident. Their partner is standing behind them in the power pose. We like to call it the Wonder Woman pose.
Speaker 1:So they're standing there in their power pose and what they will do. Then say, jenny said I am confident she hits the ball and I'm her partner. I say yes, you are confident, jenny, and I say her name. So they said it while doing an activity, right at impact, the PowerPoint, and they, their brain hears that word. And then they hear someone else say it to them with their name and we're starting to shift neurology and the girls get so into supporting each other. It's it's a safe place. No one judges each other, we just cheer supporting each other. It's a safe place. No one judges each other, we just cheer for each other. And we know when they come in day one, they're quiet, they're shy, they're worried about being judged. What are other people thinking? Will I fit in? Will people laugh at me? I'm going to embarrass myself? All the fears are there. By the time they walk out, they're ready to be their authentic self and take on the world.
Speaker 4:Yeah, yeah, when I see other women like caddying for their husbands or boyfriends or just around the course at maybe a tournament that I'm playing that there's not a lot of women participants, I really try to get them to come to one of the women's events, because we throw those events like a party, like it's kind of like a family reunion.
Speaker 4:Everyone gets to know each other. We build those strong bonds because of the shared experiences that we have where we are, you know, being vulnerable by being out there on the disc golf course and maybe not showing our best selves for you know, all 18 holes, but we have that shared experience in it. It just it adds that additional level of you know, life skills through this game and and I'm just impressed with how much I've grown, I've seen other women grow like I keep, uh, keep trying to get them to come to our tournaments. But on top of that, there's some women where it's like I want you to come on the podcast, I want you to share your story so that other women out there who are experiencing the same things have that opportunity for you and I, that opportunity to learn from you, and I think it's you know, it may be harder for adults to get to that point where they're willing to take these risks and chances, because when we're kids, we're I think we're a little more flexible we definitely are as kids, the teenagers not as much.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and especially with social media, it's all about how you look and what you look like on social media. What other kids are thinking. These kids come in. Some of them are like you know, if someone didn't like their post and it's a friend of theirs, they're like destroyed because they didn't hit. Like One gal said I send pictures like five or six pictures to all my friends and I ask them which one I should post, right, and she's like, but I make the final decision.
Speaker 1:So they want to make sure it looks good. So we had one gal come in to the Leadership Academy who loved CrossFit, absolutely loved it, and she was getting made fun of, she was getting bullied, she was getting called a dyke. People would make fun of her because she had muscles and she stopped, even though she had such a passion for it, because of what these other kids were doing to her. When she left the Leadership Academy, not only did she go back to CrossFit, she put a sign up, said anyone want to learn CrossFit, I'll be doing it wherever it was, come and join me. She had a bunch of kids joined her and she started teaching it to them that's awesome so it's talk about personal growth, right, jenny?
Speaker 1:what when we we intentionally teach them so much? And what you said about shared experiences. You know you're vulnerable out there disc golf rather than golf, because, it's you right, it's your fault if you hit a great one, it's your fault if you hit a bad one. So I tell people all the time we're naked out there. So that's why business golf is so important and valuable because you get a deeper relationship, because you go on this journey of celebrations, of embarrassing shots, of ups and downs, and you're in the bunker, you're hitting a great shot down the middle, then you miss the green how do you handle all that? And you go on that with somebody and it develops a deeper relationship, like you said, and it's a journey and if you look at it as that, if you look at it at the end of each round as an opportunity for growth, I have another.
Speaker 1:I love acronyms. I have another one called PAL and I encourage people, after every round of golf, just sit for a moment and do PAL. P is positives. What were the positives that happened today? Because if you go to the 19th hole of a golf course, or if they gather, after disc golf most of the talk is about the bad shots.
Speaker 1:everybody hits, oh yeah, and you don't want to reinforce the bad shots. You want to gain confidence and help yourself get better by focusing on the positives. But then here we go, brandon. All of a sudden you don't want to brag, right? You're worried that people are going to think I'm bragging because now I'm talking about my good shots.
Speaker 1:So whether you can share them or you think through them positives. First the O is the opportunity. So with the opportunity is is where can I learn? How can I improve? Where can I get better? It's an opportunity. It's not me criticizing myself for a poor shot. What can I learn from that shot? And then the W is what's next. Now you make a plan to implement those opportunities so that the next time you're better. And now you can be thankful for that bad round because you learned so much and now you'll be better for it yep, I have some friends that, uh, you know you get off the course and they're like, how'd it go?
Speaker 4:and they're like that was a uh learning round for me.
Speaker 4:I learned so many things and, uh, you know one of the things, um, because I just finished, uh, the amateur world's championship. One of the things that I did is I would hear the women, even at the practice basket, talking about their awful shots, and I made a choice that I'm not going to go practice near them, or I put in my earplugs because I didn't want to hear all of that negativity when I'm just getting out there and just warming up. I don't want to set up for that negative experience. So you know one of the things, when I work with people, when we're on the same card, it's like they're like man, I thought about that tree and it's like well, next time don't think about the tree, because you know you go right where your thoughts are.
Speaker 1:So you know, don't have the negative talk, don't say the don't things like you need to keep it positive yeah, energy, energy flows where focus goes yep, or where focus goes energy, however you want to look at that, and it's because your brain has to think the not in order to then try not to think of it. So if I told everyone listening right now don't think of a blue tree. What pops in your brain Blue tree, a blue tree, the image, because your brain has to see it then go, okay, don't think of this, but you've just given it so much energy. So, yeah, you don't want to ever say don't do something. You want to focus on what you want instead, and that's in a goal-setting process as well.
Speaker 1:You know, I'll ask people oftentimes so, what do you want your experience at work to be? What do you want your experience on the golf course? Well, I don't want to be anxious. Well, what do you want? And they don't know because they focus too much on what they don't want rather than what they do want. I mean, if people would just take that information, it can change your life. As soon as you hear yourself like, oh, I don't want this or I don't want that, I don't want this, ask yourself, what do I want instead? I want to have joy, I want to have peace. I want to have calm. I want to have confidence. I want to be authentic and vulnerable. I want to smile more. I want to laugh more. I want to achieve my goals. You know, what is it that you want?
Speaker 3:What's up everybody. This is Brandon from the Intentional Disc Golfer Podcast. By night, I'm a disc golfer slash podcaster. By day, I'm a general contractor, that's right. I build houses, and if you're looking to build smarter, faster and stronger, look no further than Builders First Source, your one-stop shop for building materials, expert advice and innovative solutions. They have a dedicated team of professionals that know exactly what they're talking about. From framing to finishes. Bfs has the inventory and support you need to get the job done right, with locations nationwide and a team that knows the trades. First source is built around you. Builders First source build better, build with us. You can find them online at wwwbldrcom. That is the letters bldrcom.
Speaker 4:This episode of the intentional disc golfer podcast is brought to you by Prodigy Discs Performance-driven discs designed by the pros for the players who want to take their games to the next level. Whether you're hunting birdies in the woods or bombing drives in the open, prodigy has the plastic consistency and feel that serious players trust. From the buttery smooth PA3 to the dependable fade of the FX4, prodigy's lineup is built to perform in every condition on every course. Big arms Grab a D1 and watch it fly Need precision. The M4 has your back. And don't forget their ace gear Bags, baskets and apparel built for the grind. So if you're ready to level up your bag and your mindset, it's time to throw what the pros throw. Prodigy Discs Play smart Throw.
Speaker 2:Prodigy.
Speaker 4:This is Sarah Hocum and you are listening to the Intentional Disc Golfer Podcast. Yeah, I think a lot of people are scared to go that route and you know, I think that's why, you know, we talked about how there aren't as many women playing tournaments as you know, women out there. I think a lot of times the women are scared to go out there and take that risk. And you mentioned social media and I mean I, I work in a um 6 through 12 school. Uh, and just the amount of social media we, we don't allow our kids to have social media, they're not allowed to have phones, um, and it's just the social media is so destructive.
Speaker 3:Well, in fact, when the kids have kind of pilfered social media access in our house, we've seen a significant decline in their overall well-being and mental health, and that's why we've made that decision as parents is to severely limit their access to social media.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that's a great idea because research shows it. And I asked the girls in the Leadership Academy how many of you compare yourself to others? And everyone raised their hand and I said when you do you, what are you seeing? And everyone said something negative, except one girl in this last one. She said well, sometimes I, if I see someone struggling with something and I had it comes easy to me.
Speaker 1:I'm thinking I'm really fortunate and it was it was one out of many leadership academies that I've done, so out of hundreds of girls. Most of the time when we compare ourselves to others, we put ourselves less than, or we look for where we're less than.
Speaker 3:We don't look for where we're better right on this entire conversation about the assumptions we make about ourselves against what other people think of us and we were talking about the kids versus adults, and I wanted to backtrack a little bit on that is how do you feel about, you know, kids?
Speaker 3:They don't get quite the gravity of it and they're not judged as much because, oh, they're kids and they're goofy and whatever. But as you start to become prepubescent there starts to be a pecking order and then you get into teenage years and you're really starting to establish your social standing. And then, when you get into adulthood, people's perceptions of us they do matter and you do need to care about them, because you know it's a job interview, it's a promotion, it's, you know, attracting a partner or a mate, it's establishing a family, it's attracting a partner or a mate, it's establishing a family and the gravity of those decisions and those perceptions, they hold a lot more weight and there's not as much of a safety net. And so the connection I'm making is maybe, as an adult, we bring too much of that into our play life, whether it be on the golf course or if you're on a bowling team, or you know, if you're, you know, on a competitive cribbage team or something like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, or you're playing bridge bridge. Yeah, 100%, and there are there's moments. Right, you have to dress properly for the interview, yeah, but then do you ever see um pursuit of happiness?
Speaker 1:the movie and will smith plays the character, and this guy is broke, he's homeless, his wife left him, he has a kid and he has this job interview and something happened with his pants they ripped or something like that Like, and then he took him someplace to get him fixed, but the he didn't have time. So he goes to the interview. I don't think he had pants on, he had like jockey shorts on, and this is all based on a true story and he just was vulnerable and open. He said look, this is what happened and this is why I'm standing here without pants, but at least I have a shirt on.
Speaker 3:Or he said something, but I will work hard for you.
Speaker 1:He got the opportunity because not everybody was like, yeah, we got to give him an opportunity. But there was one guy who was so, yeah, I mean, yes, do opportunity. But there was one guy who was so, yeah, I mean, yes, do we want to dress properly for interviews? 100%, do we want to. When you're doing a podcast, do you want to be prepared? Do you want to do some research? 100%. Do you want to be an expert in your field? If you're claiming you're an expert, awesome. And there's also a vulnerability, authenticity aspect to all of it. That's important and I interviewed.
Speaker 1:My next book that's coming out probably first quarter of 2026 is called C-Suite Success, as in C-Suite and corporate America, the letter C-S-U-I-T-E success. So it has a little double meaning when you say it and it's wisdom from women at the top, and these women who reached the pinnacle of their career talked about. I wish I was just more authentic when I was younger, where I wasn't always worried about what people were thinking and trying to act a certain way. So, yes, be prepared, be professional in all areas of life and also be yourself. I have a great friend who's now the head of the foundation in the LPGA and she said look, I'm not a business person Like. If you want me to wear a suit, it's going to be pink.
Speaker 2:So just so you know, I will be myself.
Speaker 1:I will do a great job for you. I will, uh, make sure. If you want details, you'll have the details. I'll do all the work, I'll be with, I'll have my budgets, I'll do all of it. I'll organize everything, I'll run it. I will also be myself. You can't ask me to be someone else. And she got the job because she was so authentic and she was great at what she did. Right, so we can. We still have that vulnerability. But what you said, brandon, was too many people bring that to worrying about what other people think and are they fitting in well enough and what are people thinking. But what if we could just love ourselves enough, believe in who we are as people, enough that we can be ourselves, try our best. We can still have high standards that doesn't mean perfectionist high standards and then pow it out. Look at the positives. What are the opportunities? What's next, when, if it's not perfect?
Speaker 4:Yeah, uh, you, uh. You're just talking about you know, not being perfect and your book that's coming out. I have a back on my head book that I want to write on parenting and my lens as a teacher and a principal of the title would be uh, my child is perfect, but with the knot in between it, focusing on, you know, all those opportunities, those chances where we fail and how we learn from failure, and we should embrace failure and not trying to be so perfect all the time. That's one of my dream books to write.
Speaker 1:Well, I encourage you to start saying I will dream books to write.
Speaker 4:Well, I encourage you to start saying I will write this book.
Speaker 1:I'm getting glared at right now, decide you will write it because parents need it and it's important. That message is so important to deliver. I also wrote, and I did this when it's right, jenny, and it's your intuition and it's your passion and you are meant to write that book. Just allow yourself to write it. I was at a conference and during the conference I got this idea I'm going to write. I have to write my book on Blab because it's been so life-changing for so many.
Speaker 1:I teach it in corporate America. When I do my speaking engagements and I have women or men come up to me and be like, oh my gosh, I was feeling overwhelmed and now I'm just going to be in demand instead, and that just changed. I'll run into them five years later and they say wait, I heard you speak. Oh my gosh, you had the cape on. You were one. I still use the power pose before I go in for a meeting, so it's so powerful.
Speaker 1:So I thought I'm going to write a book on this. And then I woke up the next day and I said it's going to be a children's book, oh nice. So on the airplane, on the way home it was a three-hour flight I wrote the book. It doesn't have to take years or months, even when it is in your heart and you want to deliver a message. Just set some time aside at some point, use Blab, get in a really peak state of mind, jump up and down a little bit and go. You know what I'm writing this thing, not saying you have to do it that fast, I just happened to pour it. It's a children's book, so it's not as long, right, but I poured it out and it was actually my story that I used.
Speaker 1:That's why it was so easy to write, because I was really shy as a kid, painfully shy, so much so that when the teacher came in the music teacher and said, who wants to try out for the play? I wanted to, but I didn't have the courage to do it. I was so scared and everyone in the class left. I was the only one sitting in the class by myself, Even though I would have loved to do it. I was just so afraid. So it was stories like that. And then I put in a dog, um, who teaches me blab. But it was my. A couple stories about me being so shy and then having limiting beliefs and things that and that would that.
Speaker 3:I go through. Oh man, I have to tell you now you've done it, because jenny's sitting here and she's got tears coming out of her eyes because what you just said, uh, was so important and on point, especially to where she's at in life and what she's going through. And then, uh, I want to. I want to back to uh something a little bit.
Speaker 3:You're talking about vulnerabilities, and Jenny was watching Brene Brown on Netflix and I stumbled into the living room one day and something hit me that she said is that our vulnerabilities are what make us unique, are what make us stand out and what makes us human, and that our vulnerabilities are the access way for people to be able to find that common ground and relate to us. Because that's a, that's a powerful way that we can connect. Is that, if I'm, you know, scared of spiders, and then you know jenny's scared of spiders too, and that's something that we can really draw a parallel on. But it's also the thing that makes us stand out. Like you're talking about Will Smith not wearing any pants in his interview. Well, did that stand out to those CEOs and those interviewers? Hey, remember that guy that came in here. He wasn't wearing any pants. What did he say? And it's that, it's that sticking point that makes us us I'm listening to barbara streisand's book.
Speaker 1:It's it's an amazing book to listen to on audible because she'll play some of her singing and some different interviews. I mean, it's really. She did such a great job with it. It's like you're sitting with barbara streisand. She's telling stories.
Speaker 1:One of the stories I just heard her tell today was during the recording of A Star is Born. They had this live audience. She was about to sing a song. She hadn't practiced very much with the band at all, she had never sung it with a live audience. And she went out and she said I just thought I was so nervous that I would just be vulnerable and open and tell the audience. And she said hey, you know, they planned a whole rock concert so they recorded scenes and then there were other professional performers who would perform in between, so it was really a neat way for them to record this movie. And she went out flat out and said I haven't ever done this live before and I'm really nervous, so I'm going to try my best. She said the audience response was amazing because people can relate to that and the people who are influencers today on social media, the real influences like a Mel Robbins is so authentic and honest Jenna Kushner.
Speaker 1:She's an influencer who is vulnerable. She'll be on with no makeup and just say, hey, oh my gosh, I messed up on this today. Can you believe? I did this, and people relate to it and they get more followers because they are vulnerable and in terms of uniqueness, and that's what we encourage in the Leadership Academy be your unique self and we tell them. You will succeed because you're unique, not in spite of it. The world needs uniqueness. We need everyone to be themselves. So then, when we come together, we see all the different perspectives, right, we learn from each other, and if you hide your uniqueness and just to fit in, you're depriving the world of more learnings and the people around you. So be yourself.
Speaker 4:One of the teaching strategies I used to teach math. One of the kind of breakthrough ideas that was taught to our teachers was having the oops of the day, like picking out okay. So we have these four problems. What's you know? What was your oops of the day? Share your oops. What did you learn from? Was kind of an eye-opening concept to teaching math and it, you know, made a lot more teachers successful by focusing on okay, we can make mistakes, you know, and how do we learn from them?
Speaker 1:Ariana Huffington. I'm pretty sure it was her. I heard the story. She shared that every day her father at dinner would say what did you fail at today?
Speaker 1:And if she didn't have something that she failed at. He was disappointed because she didn't try anything new, she didn't put herself out there, she didn't stretch herself. Because he knew that being comfortable with quote failing, which is a learning experience, right, it's not a failure. If you learn, being comfortable with that would make her more successful. Have her trying new things and finding her true self and growing personally. And look how successful she became. Right, when you are willing to just put yourself out there, be your unique self. I mean, look at Sarah, what's her name? From Spanx, her last name starts with a, b.
Speaker 3:I am not familiar with Spanx.
Speaker 1:Oh okay, she created Spanx, incredible piece of clothing for women, and people ask she's a self-made billionaire. People ask her well, how did you get into whatever her first big store was? I don't know if it was like Saks, Fifth Avenue or Macy's, I don't know where it was. How did you get in? How did you even get to talk with the buyer? She said I called them it wasn't rocket science.
Speaker 1:I just kept calling and I said can I have 10 minutes? Can I have anything? You know? And this is what happened. And when she's talking to me she's explaining the Spanx and basically it's an undergarment for women. So this is how it started. So their buttocks looks better in pants. And she wasn't getting anywhere. She could tell. And she said would you come to the ladies room with me? And this is stretching yourself. This is a weird ask. Right, come to the ladies' room. She said look at me with these pants on. I have regular underwear on. And then she goes and changes and then she puts her Spanx on and she said now look. And the lady said come back to my office, like, literally, like, literally. So when you are comfortable being uncomfortable, you're comfortable outside and of yourself and stretching yourself.
Speaker 1:The opportunities are endless well, and it doesn't get any better than that, because you're quite literally showing your butt to somebody exactly when you can do that, and disc, when you can do that in disc golf, you can do that in any golf or any sport, and you can just be you. I promise you you'll play better.
Speaker 4:Yes, I would agree with you. So we're getting close to our time. Do you have any final thoughts, anything else you'd like to share with our audience before we wrap it up?
Speaker 1:oh, you know, I'd love to invite them to my next. Conquer your golf mind. It's a three-day program, it's 90 minutes a day and everyone gets their own personal coach. So we take the learnings that you have and you talk about it with your coach and make sure you understand how it applies to you. And all of my coaches are master certified life coaches, so we want to understand what's in the way in the golf course. Where else is this in your life, what's the root cause? And we show you how you can basically blow it out of your neurology. So that's coming up in August. It's a Monday, tuesday, wednesday and here's what they can do text the word yes to 727-339-0106. So that's the big thing. And then watch for my books. I also oh, you know what else. They might love this.
Speaker 1:Yes, I have a free five-day challenge on my website. It's Debbie D-E-B-B-I-E, hyphen O'Connell, o-c-o-n. It's debbie-oconnellcom, so debbie-oconnellcom, and just look up. It goes across. You know how you put the couple main events that are on there. Look for the one that says free five-day challenge. Click on there. You'll get an email every day for five days and there's a little challenge to do, a teaching and a challenge. They're five minutes or less these videos. I've had people do that and they've achieved their next goal that they had. It shifted their mood and it started to shift their mindset and it's really a powerful five-day program. That's five minutes a day for a mindset shift.
Speaker 3:I love it. I was looking at it as you were talking about it. It looks really nice. And I also want to side mention here I love that you're a disc John Maxwell teacher D-I-S-C, just like the disc golf that we're. It just seems kind of ironic.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I mean, it's all about understanding the personality, isn't it? And in the Leadership Academy we teach the DOPE personality test, which are doves, owls, peacocks and eagles, and it just helps everyone understand like, oh, you mean, I don't have to be that outgoing peacock, it's okay that I'm an owl, who's more like an accountant and detail-oriented and not as loud or boisterous or fast-talking as this person. Oh, I understand, and that's okay, because all birds are good birds, right? So it's great to understand our personalities and then how to relate to other people who have different personalities.
Speaker 4:I have to tell you we were listening to, surrounded by Idiots in the car, where he he, you know uses very similar personalities, and but they're red, yellow, green and blue, and the kids are in the car too, and I'm like man brandon, you're such a red kids are like man he is a red mom. I think you're a this, but you might be a this. I think I'm a this, so it was fun.
Speaker 1:How? How old are your, how old are your girls?
Speaker 4:Um, so we have four girls, one boy, uh, we have a 21 year old, 18 year old, 17 year old and 15 year old girl, and then our son is 13.
Speaker 1:Wow. Oh my gosh, that's awesome.
Speaker 3:He's the baby Now, um, while, awesome, he's the baby Now, um. Well, while we have you on here before we get to the wrap up section, uh, you know so many of the things that you were saying. When we have you know, you're in the ball golf world and maybe there's an opportunity to draw a parallel between the ball golf world and the disc golf world, because, uh, you were talking about working with kids and what instantly sprung to mind was, uh, scott Stokely. We spoke with Scott Stokely on the podcast and one of his passion projects is he works a lot with special needs kids and has a formula of kind of how to do that. And then hearing you talk about you know, this is my thing, where I take a day and we confidence and building self esteem and all of those things and, um, there's a real opportunity for some kind of collaboration there. If you would be interested, we could get you connected with Scott Stokely, um yeah, always, I'm always interested.
Speaker 1:Have you, have you ever heard of Amy Brocker steady?
Speaker 3:So, amy, she has Down syndrome.
Speaker 1:I've got this foundation.
Speaker 3:Really.
Speaker 1:It's an incredible learning experience watching a video of Amy. She was playing at the Waste Management PGA Tour event during a practice round. She played the par three hole. That's just where everyone wants to be. It's the craziest, loudest hole at that event. It's probably the most fun hole on the PGA tour to be a fan. So she was playing with um a couple of the PGA guys during their practice round. She had an opportunity to play the hole.
Speaker 1:You hear her saying I've got this, I can do this. She tees off and then she's walking down the fairway. She's looking at the crowd, which is about maybe a third full huge grandstand surrounding the hole. She's waving to them saying oh my, they love me. So she wasn't worried about being embarrassed. She was looking at the fans as they love me, they're cheering for me. And then she had hit it in the bunker. Pro says you going to hit that out and she said yes. He said okay. And then you hear her say I've got this, I can do this, I can do this, I've got this. The PGA had mic'd her up so you can hear everything she's saying. She knocks it out and she's about 15 feet away 10 to 15 feet away and you hear her again. I've got this. I can do this. She steps up, makes the putt Wow, I encourage up. Makes the putt Wow, I encourage her. Look up Amy Bokerstedt Waste Management. Let me just put that.
Speaker 3:There we go Waste Management Make sure, while I have you on, yeah.
Speaker 1:If you look up that Bokerstedt.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 4:I actually remember seeing that video. I think it was on, wasn't it? On one of the golf documentaries too, Maybe yeah or was it on social media, one of the two. It's on YouTube. It's on YouTube.
Speaker 1:It's gotten millions of hits. It went viral and Gary Woodland was the pro who was with her and there was another pro, but he was the one talking with her. He was the one talking with her. He was the one most connected. Later that year, he was playing in the us open and he had never won a major. He had the opportunity the last day to win it. He was in the lead and he credited amy. He said I kept saying to myself the whole day I've got this, I can do this. I've got this. I can do this after After hearing Amy do that what makes that even more special for me Brandon and Jenny. She was in the Leadership Academy in 2016, and that's where she learned those words. Oh, how freaking cool.
Speaker 3:So, I cry every time I watch it and it's gone viral.
Speaker 1:And this foundation helps people with Down syndrome all over the country and they use golf to empower them as well.
Speaker 3:That is so wonderful. That is so wonderful. And then you know, last last thought I have for you is man, it would be so cool to have Debbie O'Connell and Joel Turner on the podcast together and let those, let them just rattle.
Speaker 4:I don't think anyone can handle that much, that would be so cool.
Speaker 3:So joel turner is a? Um, a sniper, and a sniper instructor for, uh, it was a local washington police force um, and he's developed a system called shot iq where it's all about like bow hunting and things, and it's exactly what you're talking about. It's neuro-linguistic programming. Uh, you know blue blueprinting your shot, you know acknowledging things, and there's there's so many times I would love to see you guys bounce off each other and just have an episode dedicated to that. That would be amazing.
Speaker 4:I will warn you, though One of his teachings is to get you to hold your breath as long as possible, and I did not pass that test. It's on our podcast, but I held my breath for shorter. Debbie, I'm going to have to get off of here. I have to go to work for a few hours, but it has been an absolute honor to speak with you. I am so blessed that we had this opportunity to have you on our podcast and I look forward to speaking with you in September.
Speaker 1:I, too, am so thankful for this opportunity. You two are amazing. Thanks for what you're doing, the great information you're sharing with your audience. You're changing lives every day. So, brandon, jenny, thank you. And Jenny tell me when that book's ready for me to read Will do. I'm very excited.
Speaker 3:So that does it for this episode of the Intentional Disc Golfer Podcast. We have had the pleasure of having Debbie O'Connell on here with a golf positive, live positive, bestselling author, lpga, a professional uh coach and LPGA GA leadership Academy. And if you enjoy what you hear here, please like, subscribe, follow, tell all of your friends. We have all the all the social medias. You can just look up uh intentional disc golfer podcast. If you want to email us, you can email us at the intentional disc golfer at gmailcom and stay tuned at the end of this episode. If there are any bloopers or outtakes, we will pin them. After the outro music. We'd like to quickly thank our sponsors, which is Salty Unicorns, disc Golf, apparel and Treasures of the Forest, the epoxy minis that have all the cool stuff in them, and especially like to thank all of the fans for being here and supporting the show over the years and, like I said, we love you guys. So please like, subscribe, follow, tell everyone. And for this episode, I am one of your intentional disc golfers. My name is Brandon.
Speaker 4:And I'm Jenny.
Speaker 3:And we are here with Debbie O'Connell and here at the Intentional Disc Golfer. We truly believe that disc golf changes lives, so go out there and grow the sport.
