Turn Critique Into Confidence And Lower Scores By Using Feedback The Right Way

Feedback can level up your disc golf game or derail it. We unpack the art and science of getting it right—how to deliver clear, actionable coaching without overload, and how to receive advice without tilting. Along the way we connect sports psychology and motor learning to real on-course decisions, showing why timing, tone, and precision matter as much as the content itself.

We start by contrasting knowledge of results and knowledge of performance: your scorecard and stat lines reveal the “what,” while slow-motion video and form checks uncover the “how.” Then we dig into the three stages of skill development—cognitive, associative, autonomous—and explain how each demands a different cadence and depth of feedback. You’ll hear practical strategies to keep things simple: one cue at a time, concrete language, and drills like putter-only rounds that magnify feel without distance noise.

Tools and tactics take center stage. We walk through using Kinevea for side-by-side analysis, tracking fairway hits and circle percentages in UDisc, and converting data into 10-second fixes you can trust under pressure. We talk reinforcement that builds confidence, how to read the room before you coach a card mate, and why consistency in words and frequency creates buy-in. You’ll get a checklist for delivering feedback that sticks and a framework for receiving it with curiosity, even when it stings.

If you’ve ever wondered when to speak up, what to measure, or how to turn a frustrating round into a growth spurt, this conversation maps a repeatable loop: observe, analyze, act, reassess. Expect fewer vague notes, more specific adjustments, and a mindset that treats misses as information. Subscribe, share with a friend who loves field work, and leave a review telling us your best single cue that lowered your scores.

Transcript

Welcome, Gratitude, And CTA

SPEAKER_02 1:05

Thank you for tuning in to this episode of the Intentional Disc Golfer Podcast. I am one of your hosts. My name is Brandon. And I'm Jenny. Jenny? How can you turn feedback into your secret weapon instead of your worst enemy? Well, we're gonna answer that and many more questions on this episode. But first, we need to thank you guys, the fans out there. Thank you for sticking with us. You are the reason that we can do what we do and the reason we keep doing what we do. And if you love us, appreciate us, tell all of your friends, leave a comment on our social media or wherever you get your podcasts. It is something free that you can do and it helps us out. Only takes a second. And you can find us on all our social medias uh at the intentional disc golfer podcast, the intentional discgulfer. And we have an email if you want to reach out to us directly. It is the intentional discgulfer at gmail.com, the intentionaldisgolfer at gmail.com. We would love to hear from you. And at the end of this episode, any highlights, bloopers, haha's, funnies, we like to cut them up and put them on the end of the episode. So if you want to hear us uh doing funny stuff, you can stick around and listen to that. And that brings us to our community calendar. We have something special in store for 2026. Jenny, please take it away.

SPEAKER_04 2:33

Yeah, so uh when we first started playing disc golf, there was a series that ran in Washington State called the Pac X Cup, and it was fairly prestigious. You had 12 to 14 tournaments uh that you were trying to win by the end of the season, and unfortunately, uh that disappeared last year. So John Anderson ran the Great Northwest Point series to fill that space, and I've been working with him to uh kind of guide me along creating the Washington Cedar Disc Golf Series for 2026, uh, hopefully trying to fill some of that space. So the purpose is the Washington Cedar Disc Golf Series is dedicated to raising the standards of competitive play and creating events that enhance the experience for all participants. The series exists to expand access, create opportunities, and grow participation in disc golf. Each event is intentionally designed to foster skill development, sportsmanship, and a renewed love for the game while recognizing what competitive play looks like at different levels and providing conditions for all players to be successful. So I have a group of players that I'm working with right now to kind of build the framework for this series and looking forward to uh what it's gonna turn into.

Sponsor Spotlights And Discounts

SPEAKER_02 3:54

Yeah, and if you're a tournament director out there in Washington or an aspiring tournament director, you want to run your own tournament, please reach out to us. We can help support you with uh tips and tricks and uh being able to be affiliated with the Washington Cedar series.

SPEAKER_04 4:09

Yeah, so uh that's uh one of my goals is to help uh grow more tournament directors here in Washington. Uh we have a lot of courses. I've had some people reach out reach out already with some great courses that they would love for us to have an event at, um, hoping to figure out how to expand the Washington Disc golf.

SPEAKER_02 4:32

Yeah, that it's pretty darn exciting. Um it's gonna be a busy season. And we're gonna love to see all you guys out there. So yep, reach out to us. All right, and before we get started with this episode, we need to hear a few things from our sponsors.

SPEAKER_04 4:52

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SPEAKER_00 7:15

It's important you make the decision to continue to listen to this podcast. There's so much great information that is shared each and every episode that will improve your game, your life, your relationships, and every part of your life will get better by listening to the quality information that comes to you in every episode of the intentional disc golfer. I'm Debbie O'Connell, LPGA professional and golf mindset expert.

Setting The Goal: What Effective Feedback Means

SPEAKER_02 7:45

All right. Welcome back. We are ready to break into this episode. This episode, we are going to be talking about effective feedback, how to give it, how to take it, and how to use it to your benefit. Jenny, you have a look on your face.

SPEAKER_04 8:03

That sound bite. You need help.

SPEAKER_02 8:08

That's a great no, well, you don't have enough letters behind your name to give me the kind of help I need.

SPEAKER_04 8:14

M-A-E-D. M A M S E D. Sorry.

SPEAKER_02 8:20

Is it Huh? What? Oh max Education. No, it would be like a PhD in psychology or something. No, I have an MS. And you have therapy. You have M S?

SPEAKER_04 8:31

Yeah. Masters of Science.

SPEAKER_02 8:33

Oh, that's right. Okay. Um M S and B S. That's just you. Okay. Gotcha. Anyway. Off the rails already. We're off to a great start. So in this episode, we're going to be talking about understanding the psychology and effectiveness of feedback as it pertains to sports performance and hey, life performance. We're going to be able to identify the types of feedback and their effects. Learn how to enhance your skills of giving and receiving feedback. It is a skill and you have to practice it. We're going to gain tools to integrate feedback into your routine to maximize outcomes and discuss common mistakes, questions, and misconceptions when using feedback. And throughout the episode, we'll be discussing on how we use feedback to enhance our performance. No. Absolutely. Abso friggin'. Nice job, Jenny. You read that very well.

SPEAKER_04 9:37

Brandon, why don't you tell us about the background and the context?

A Short History Of Feedback In Performance

SPEAKER_02 9:40

All right, I'll tell you I'll tell you a little history about the uh study of feedback, more accurately put. But uh the study of the mechanisms of feedback started in the early 1900s. Are you starting to see a theme here, Jenny? Like the early 1900s was really kind of the birth of performance psychology, and all of this falls under uh under that umbrella. And in the 1900s, a behavior asked me a question. Oh, okay, go. Go.

SPEAKER_04 10:12

Well, answer the question. You need to give people a space if you're gonna actually ask a question. Were you actually asking? Did you ask if I noticed a theme?

SPEAKER_02 10:21

Yeah, do you see a theme?

SPEAKER_04 10:22

I guess so.

SPEAKER_02 10:23

You see, you got a theme.

SPEAKER_04 10:24

Yeah, psychologists have very difficult names to pronounce. They do.

SPEAKER_02 10:28

A lot of them were like are like German. Yeah, they're German. Yeah, that's a thing.

SPEAKER_04 10:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:32

But this guy, I don't think he's German. No. But he is a behavioralist and he produced a book called The Law of Effect, Edward Thorndyke, and also the works of B. F. Skinner in operant conditioning. Operant conditioning is a very, very uh well-known term, but uh both established that when behavior received positive feedback, it was more likely to be repeated, and operate conditioning takes it a step further, establishing b establishing that behaviors receiving negative consequences were more likely to be avoided. These two approaches began to influence the ways that coaches interacted with their athletes.

SPEAKER_04 11:18

In the 1940s began the study of motor learning, observing how individuals learn skill-based tasks most effectively. Paul Fitz and Michael Posner in 1967 introduced the three-stage model of skill acquisition, emphasizing the role of feedback in each stage. At the birth of sports psychology in the 1970s, researchers began to expand their research to study how feedback affects athletic performance. The landmark work of John Lothier in his book The Psychology of Coaching highlighted the role of feedback in both motivation and technique refinements in athletes. In the 1980s, the cognitive behavioral movement began to examine how feedback affects mental processes, such as self-efficacy, goal setting, and motivation. Albert Bandura's work on self-efficacy theory in 1986 demonstrated that feedback directly impacts an athlete's confidence and belief in their abilities. Weinberg and Gould in 1995 explored how feedback aligns with goal setting theory, emphasizing that specific, measurable feedback improves performance outcomes. Moving into the 2000s, a larger focus has developed regarding feedback. Advances in technology allowed for more precise, data-driven feedback using wearables, video analysis, and biomechanical tools. Feedback loops became a focus, with studies exploring how real-time feedback influences skill acquisition and performance optimization. Research expanded to explore the psychological reception of feedback, emphasizing the importance of how feedback is delivered to maximize its impact.

SPEAKER_02 13:20

Talking about the three-stage model of skill acquisition by Fitz and Posner. Posner? Posner? I'm not sure. So that three-stage model, first you start off with cognitive. When you're learning the basics of a skill, you have heavily heavy reliance on feedback. At the very beginning, when you are thinking thing through, figuring it out, you have to rely on the validation and the feedback of somebody that knows it and knows what they're doing, or something that knows it and knows what they're doing, say a book or a video or something of that. And then you move into what's called the associative, where you're refining the skill, so streamlining everything, and then that is when targeted feedback is necessary to reduce errors. So you're not necessarily guiding the person through it, you are just kind of troubleshooting a thing here and there. And then the third stage of skill acquisition is the autonomous stage, where you no longer need a whole lot of feedback. You can pretty much do it on your own, maybe a little nitpicky here and there, but you're pretty automatic at that point.

SPEAKER_04 14:35

Alright, so think about the first time you boiled water.

SPEAKER_02 14:40

Boiled water.

SPEAKER_04 14:42

Yeah. Like you're so you're a kid, and the first time you're asked to like boil water for noodles or whatever, like that's kind of the process. Is you're asking for help from somebody, you know, how to do this. The second time you kinda remember how to do it, and then hopefully by the third time, or fourth, fifth, who knows, you just remember how to boil water.

SPEAKER_02 15:07

Jenny, I didn't really have a problem boiling water ever.

SPEAKER_04 15:11

Well, you like to cook.

SPEAKER_02 15:13

That doesn't okay.

SPEAKER_04 15:15

I never said that there was a problem, but this is these are the these are the steps that you take to learn a new skill. Yeah. Our our son is going into culinary classes in February, so I'm kind of thinking along those lines.

Types Of Feedback: Intrinsic And Extrinsic

SPEAKER_02 15:27

Oh yeah, yeah. So yeah, cognitive, you ask a lot of questions. Associative, you kind of bounce things off of the person, and autonomous, you pretty should pretty much should be able to do it on your own, and any feedback that you receive is just nitpicking and fine-tuning. Maybe not nitpicking, but fine-tuning. Like getting that real fine edge, like honing the knife. Alright, well, moving along. There are several different types of feedback. We'll talk about them a little bit here. So, first of all, you have intrinsic feedback, intrinsic meaning internal, and that's inf uh information that's coming from your own actions. So when you know a task enough that you can kind of understand what you're doing wrong and that whatnot, and make corrections, you kind of give yourself your own feedback, that little voice in your head.

SPEAKER_04 16:22

And that's where our previous episode on self-talk really comes into play because that is your internal dialogue, that is your intrinsic feedback.

SPEAKER_02 16:33

Yeah, self-talk is the intrinsic feedback loop. It can be positive or negative, but hopefully you use it for positive. The next is extrinsic feedback, which means external outside of yourself, information provided by an external source, such as a coach, caddy, a teammate, technology, a friend. It could be the crowd. It could be statistics. It could be the dog. Could be the dog. Could be the dog. Could be a tree. Here, I got some feedback.

SPEAKER_04 17:11

And those awful is just knowing that you went and recorded that specifically. I know. I know. No, that is And it was on his first try too, and he got it.

Results vs Performance: Stats And Video

SPEAKER_02 17:28

No, that is actually like me throwing a putter at the cage of a basket and letting off a big sigh with my little recorder. It was kind of fun. That was the best one out of all of them. I made I made like 30 of them. Yeah. That was the best one, I think. But anyway. And then knowledge of result versus knowledge of performance. So this was defined by Adams in 1971. Knowledge of the results is information about the outcome where the disc landed ten feet from the basket. And then knowledge of performance is information about the movement or technique where I released the disc too early, or I didn't loosen my wrist.

SPEAKER_04 18:18

So this is kind of how um when you're looking at your scores, like if you're doing PDG live or using U Disc, whatever it is, your scores tell one story, they don't tell you the whole story, and that's why sometimes recording your stats or tracking your throws helps to give you a better picture of the story. Because I know we talked about it um like a Delphi is a ball golf course. Yeah. And there's a lot of OBs, and so for me, I looked at the score and was like, man, that's an awful score. But then I did it with the uh stats, and I'm like, okay, so I got this many OB strokes, so it tells me a little more of the story of why my score is the way it is.

SPEAKER_02 19:05

So stats would be an example of knowledge of result because you're recording the results of your throw.

SPEAKER_04 19:12

Well, no, it's also knowledge of performance.

SPEAKER_02 19:14

Knowledge of performance would be more like videotaping yourself and going through it in slow motion. Because you're looking at technique aspects and not necessarily the things that are measurable per se.

SPEAKER_04 19:30

Right. But if you are not in a place where you can record that, sometimes if you have the stats at least, you can see, okay, so this is an area like if uh you keep blowing past the basket on your approach, it's gonna show that it's a further out and you're getting that extra stroke. So it does help you to have more knowledge of your performance. But you're right, it doesn't have as much as say videotaping the whole round.

Motivational, Informational, And Reinforcement

SPEAKER_02 19:57

Yeah, yeah. I I can see where you're going at that. So the reason why knowledge of results and knowledge of performance is important is because we can associate those directly with our last episode of self-talk. So knowledge of result is a useful motivational tool. So it's great for long rounds, it's great for sticking with it, it's great for endurance and those types of activities where you have to keep your focus for a long period of time. As uh as where knowledge of performance is like instructional self-talk. Instructional self-talk is where you're saying, hey, you know, I need to step further forward on my walk-up, or I need to slow down my pacing a little bit, or I'm not doing my rhythm when I go up to approach for a putt. So that those how those two directly correlate to the uh the self-talk. So to break those down a little bit further, motivational feedback boosts confidence and encourages effort. Yay! Informational feedback provides actionable information to improve performance. And I like I like that it points out that uh it's actionable. It's something that you can do. So it's more I I guess it's kind of more concrete in a way. Informational feedback versus motivational? Yeah. Well, motivational is like the little engine. It's like I think I can, I think it can, where informational is like, okay, slow you know, slow down your rhythm.

SPEAKER_04 21:44

So informational feedback would be easier for you to dissociate yourself from, therefore making it easier for you to understand that feedback and not take it personally.

SPEAKER_02 21:56

Yeah, because it's more about mechanics rather than not necessarily.

SPEAKER_04 22:01

It's it's a very it's very specific information.

SPEAKER_02 22:05

Yeah, specific.

SPEAKER_04 22:06

Right.

SPEAKER_02 22:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 22:08

So it it could be like you know uh not reaching back or reaching back further or uh slowing down the walk-up, something like that. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:20

Yeah. Alright, next is reinforcement feedback. So this is feedback that strengthens a desirable behavior and reduces undesirable ones. So this is that operant conditioning. When you do something good, you celebrate it and you make a big deal at it. Great job keeping your wrists flat. Great job clearing the table. Great job slowing down your walk-up. Great job maintaining focus. Those are all examples of positive reinforcement. That is a behavior that you want to keep doing. And negative reinforcement is just uh just exactly the opposite. You're removing a critique when improvement is shown. So when somebody does something good, instead of saying, well, you know, it could have been better, celebrate it and turn it in and make it a big deal because any progress is pot progress.

SPEAKER_04 23:22

If you're working with your player and you're a caddy, and you know telling them you did a great job is going to make them upset, it actually puts it under negative reinforcement. So you need to know either your own internal dialogue or that person that you're working with and kind of read their body lingo, see how they're doing, and check in with them before you give any sort of feedback.

SPEAKER_02 23:52

Well, I th I think what you're saying is like check your sarcasm because if you say great job, and it wasn't like don't clap.

SPEAKER_04 24:02

No, I'm I'm saying very specifically, I remember being at Evergreen with you at the beginning of the year, and you just started going downhill, going downhill the last three or four holes of whatever tournament that was, and I'm like, dude, you can pick this up. Like, you got this, don't patronize me.

SPEAKER_02 24:20

Well, there well, there is there is the two parts of communication. You have you know, there's the commu the the sender and the receiver, and you have to have both parts or communication doesn't happen.

SPEAKER_04 24:32

Yep, and that's why I'm saying check and see where your player is at because a positive could actually become a negative reinforcement for them.

SPEAKER_02 24:40

That that makes sense. That makes sense. Yeah. That's like reading the room. Yeah. So when it comes to feedback, the purpose is to maximize its effectiveness.

Specificity: Concrete, Goal-Tied, And Measured

SPEAKER_04 24:54

So you didn't talk about negative feedback.

SPEAKER_02 24:56

Well, negative feedback. Okay. So negative feedback is focusing on errors without offering solutions. So talking about problems without offering a solution. So, hey, uh, Jenny, your shoelace is untied.

SPEAKER_04 25:14

Is not negative feedback. No, that's not negative. That's informational. That's information. Hey, Brandon, your brownies suck.

SPEAKER_02 25:20

My brownies suck. My brownies are amazing. Don't ever talk about my brownies that way.

SPEAKER_04 25:25

Brownies suck.

SPEAKER_02 25:26

They're amazing.

SPEAKER_04 25:28

That's negative feedback.

SPEAKER_02 25:31

There's so much chocolate in those brownies.

SPEAKER_04 25:34

I can't eat them.

SPEAKER_02 25:35

I know. They have way too much sugar. I gotta fix that. But anyway. No, uh, so like if you're in a coaching situation and you just start saying, hey, you know, you need to uh you'll you're early releasing a lot. You're early releasing a lot. You're early releasing a lot. But not off but not saying, hey, you know, I I think you might be early releasing because your timing is off. Like that's a specific solution instead of hey, this is what you're doing wrong. Well, I don't know how to fix it. I just I noticed this. Next we're gonna talk about how to maximize the effectiveness of feedback. One of the the the top one here is specificity. Specific specificity. So we're gonna focus on one key element at a time.

SPEAKER_04 26:27

We're gonna focus on one syllable at a time. One syllable. Specificity.

SPEAKER_02 26:33

Specificity. A fun word. Yeah. And so the reason you want to be specific is you want to avoid overwhelming your athlete by addressing multiple aspects simultaneously. And I say your athlete because that could be you or it could be somebody that you're coaching. Um the next is use concrete language. So replace uh replace your vague terms with precise descriptions. So instead of hey, I think you need to reach back further. It could be well, instead of placing your disk here on your reach back, place it over here on your reach back. And that would you know, have these results. Just give it a try. So giving precise direction, specificity, specificity, besides specificity. Yep. Uh next aspect of specificity is you want to tie the feedback to goals. You want to ensure your feedback aligns with your athlete's objectives. So I keep talking about your athlete, that could be you or somebody you're coaching again. Um just to clear up any confusion. And next aspect of specificity is you want to incorporate the use of metrics and data. Use tangible, measurable feedback like putting percentage, like fairway hits, like driving distance, like distance off of center, or we even go out and measure where your disc is gonna break and start fading. So those are all data points that we can figure out, and that that gives us concrete, solid things that we can get feedback off of. Now, the benefits of specific feedback because it's so specific, you will obtain improved retention. So you are more act you are more likely to act on precise instructions and remember precise instructions. It also lends itself to faster skill development targeting specific areas can accelerate progress and it enhances trust. Athletes who feel supported when feedback is well thought out and relevant tend to trust their trainers a lot better because they sounds like they know what they're talking about. You should actually probably know what you're talking about before you talk about it.

SPEAKER_04 29:18

Can I have that sound bite?

Avoid Overload: Prioritize And Simplify

SPEAKER_02 29:21

Maybe so some of the challenges that are provided in uh giving specific feedback is you can overload somebody with details. I know I'm guilty of this. It must be specific, but you can easily overshare information, and that could cause confusion, it could uh it could cause confusion, it can cause like what am I doing, it can cause overload and uh undue anxiety. So the solution to this is you should break it up into smaller digestible steps and prioritize the most critical points. So one example would be you know, if you do this move correctly, then this will do automatically, and this will happen automatically instead of like, well, if you do this and this and this and this and create this big chain reaction, like that that can be an overshare and it can lead to uh actually being worse than just keeping it simple. I like to keep things simple. Uh not when I'm mansplaining things, obviously, but uh that's kind of that's kind of one of my MO's is I like to keep things simple.

SPEAKER_04 30:38

Challenges in providing specific feedback. Overloading with details. Feedback must be specific but not overly complex, especially for beginners. A solution is to break feedback into digestible steps and prioritize the most critical points first. Lack of observational skill. Coaches or peers must be attentive to details to provide meaningful feedback. So use tools like video analysis to supplement your observations. Balancing specificity and positivity. Focus feedback can sometimes come across as overly critical. So pair specific corrections with positive reinforcement. In fact, most of the time they recommend you lead with the positives, and then you can talk about uh what needs to be fixed.

SPEAKER_02 31:32

Yeah. Anytime you're holding a meeting or coaching an athlete, it's important to lead with the good stuff and build them up before you tear them down. No? No. A productive coach will actually find a way to build people up, even when they're trying to solve some problems.

SPEAKER_04 31:54

So specificity in practice. Uh, these are all things that Brandon and I have talked about in some of our previous episodes. Uh, video analysis. Record an athlete's performance and review it together, pointing out specific elements to adjust.

Tools: Video, Drills, And Putter-Only Rounds

SPEAKER_02 32:10

There's a great free program out there for your computer called Kenovia, and it allows you to take a video and do a side side-by-side comparison and even add like little lines and markers and stuff, like they do on TV, to be able to measure the difference between the different forms and things. So, one thing that I did is I downloaded some videos of pros uh swinging and throw in slow motion, and I took a video of myself and I was able to slow it down so that frame by frame it was matched up with the pros, and we were able to uh I was able to measure things like my knee angle, my arm angle, like my spinal angle. Uh Kinovia is a fantastic powerful tool if you want a uh good feedback platform.

SPEAKER_04 33:03

Uh, the next thing you can work on is drill design. Uh, create drills that isolate specific aspects of performance, allowing targeted feedback. So I know that uh you can find lots of little snippets from the pros of things that they're doing right now in the off-season to improve their games. Um, I really appreciated when a couple years ago uh Brandon had me take out all my discs and be and ran me through a bunch of drills, uh Heiser straight and then Ann Heiser shots, trying to find out what discs actually worked for me. And so that drill specifically narrowing down my bag really helped me to improve my game.

SPEAKER_02 33:45

Well, now you only throw, like realistically on a regular basis, you only throw probably about four different molds.

SPEAKER_04 33:55

Well, it's like so I was talking about going to league this weekend. Yeah. And I think I would do my, you know, my couple mids and my putters because I need to practice more. And I've so one drill that we learned about is to uh take less discs, pair it down to like five discs, or even just take your putters. You have a uh overstable and an understable and maybe a neutral disc, and just take those three and practice.

SPEAKER_02 34:26

Well, you know, you know who told me that? I it was it was Nate Wallen. He's like, if you really want to develop your game, go out there and throw only putters. Do do putter only rounds. He's like, I practiced with only my putters for a month, and it is like it was probably one of the biggest developments in my game that I've I've had in a long time.

SPEAKER_04 34:47

Well, and what I've noticed is you know, uh the discs don't fly as easily when it's colder. So I'm having a harder time throwing my full weight drivers.

SPEAKER_01 34:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 35:01

But I can go out there and just huck my putters and have about the same.

SPEAKER_02 35:06

Well the plastic's not as soft, and yeah, no, I gotcha.

SPEAKER_04 35:11

Alright, a feedback sandwich. Start with a positive observation, provide specific corrective feedback, and conclude with encouragement. I hear that all the time with doing teacher observations.

SPEAKER_02 35:24

Feedback sandwich.

SPEAKER_04 35:25

Yeah. Or like it's seven positives to one negative when you have a kid that's been through trauma.

SPEAKER_02 35:31

You know, nothing's better than a feedback sandwich except for a nice BLT with some well, it's flat.

SPEAKER_04 35:37

I went straight to Oreos.

SPEAKER_02 35:38

Thick cut bacon.

SPEAKER_04 35:39

I just went straight to Oreos tomato.

SPEAKER_02 35:42

Oreos. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 35:43

But you know what? Trees will provide you with specific corrective feedback without considering your encouragement.

SPEAKER_05 35:53

Trees don't care about your feelings.

Feedback Sandwich, Humor, And Reality Checks

SPEAKER_04 35:56

All right. You need to make your feedback consistent. So frequency. Feedback should be given at regular intervals, depending on the athlete's level and complexity of the skill being developed. I like to ask Brandon for feedback between holes, usually. It's like that's the time where I can make the biggest adjustment if we're in a tournament.

SPEAKER_02 36:20

Well, it's that the 10-second fix. Yeah. Yeah, usually.

SPEAKER_04 36:24

Clarity and alignment. Feedback must consistently communicate the same message to avoid confusion.

SPEAKER_02 36:32

So Jenny hates when I do this, is if she's struggling with some aspect of her game that day, a lot of times what I'll do is I'll just keep repeating the same thing over and over and over, and it drives her nuts, but it works.

SPEAKER_04 36:49

Reinforcement of goals. Consistent feedback ties into long-term goals and reinforces progress towards them. So I know when uh we go out and play, and um if I happen to be caddying for Brendan, I'll ask him, Do you want me to record this shot sometimes and be like, hey, here's what you're seeing, here's or here's what I'm seeing, uh, this is why you're doing this, pertaining to whatever goals he's working on.

SPEAKER_02 37:17

Yeah. Well, usually we pre-plan that too. Is like when we're on our way to a tournament or a practice round, you know, what are you working on today? What are your goals? And we try to help each other uh stick to those things.

SPEAKER_04 37:30

And then maybe not in a tournament, maybe more like practice rounds.

SPEAKER_02 37:35

Well, we have done it in a tournament. Like you tell me your goals or whatever, and I'll say, I'll hold you to that. And then during the tournament, I hold you to that. Sure. I I cur I can't uh I caddy more for you more than you caddy for me, so it's like yeah.

Consistency: Frequency, Alignment, And Trust

SPEAKER_04 37:58

Positive and constructive balance. The ratio of positive to constructive feedback should remain steady to maintain trust and motivation. And we know when we get to the point where it just feels like negative feedback.

SPEAKER_02 38:15

Well, you know, there is a point where it does kind of feel uh patronizing, yeah, especially if somebody's in a particular mood like me sometimes. But uh yeah, you know, try try to make your feedback nice and positive, happy.

SPEAKER_04 38:32

Alright, so why does consistency matter? It builds trust and credibility. When feedback is consistent, athletes are more likely to trust the source and act on the advice. Inconsistent or contradictory feedback can lead to confusion and doubt. It promotes skill acquisition. Consistent reinforcement helps athletes internalize the desired behaviors and correct errors effectively. It prevents mixed messages. When feedback is inconsistent, athletes may struggle to determine which advice to prioritize. And it supports mental stability. Regular predictable feedback helps. Well, regular predictable feedback helps athletes maintain a stable mindset, reducing anxiety about performance. So this probably falls under the idea of that lack of feedback, so it becomes a negative feedback because I know when I'm playing with Brandon, he'll make comments of this and this and this and this, and then I'll get to a point where I realize he's not commenting anymore. So what's wrong? And just because I'm used to that constant chatter.

SPEAKER_02 39:44

To answer that question, it's usually because you've gotten past your breaking point and you are no longer able to receive anything constructively. So that's when I just kind of shut off and how to ensure consistency in feedback.

SPEAKER_04 40:04

Develop a feedback plan. Identify key areas to address and create a structured timeline for providing input. Align with coaching phil align with coaching philosophy. Ensure all feedback aligns with the overarching goals and values of the coaching approach. Communicate clearly and repeatedly. Use similar language and terms to avoid confusion. We have spent what, six years playing disc golf? We have spent six years trying to come up with uh language that works for us so that we can communicate with one another in those tournament situations.

SPEAKER_02 40:46

Yeah, it's almost like our own special code. And uh it's really it's really interesting because when Jenny starts doing well, people start like listening to our conversations and seeing what we're doing. And so we've we've had to kind of develop this like low-key code to you know keep that competitive edge. It's it's kind of funny.

SPEAKER_04 41:09

Like, you want me to do the Simon line?

SPEAKER_02 41:11

Yeah, the Simon line.

SPEAKER_04 41:13

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 41:13

Yeah. And she knows it's funny because she knows exactly what I'm talking about. Yeah. Yeah. As I'm like, hey, go for a Simon line, and then you'll see her head start looking around for all these weird things, and people will look at her and be like, What are you what are you doing? We did that at US Women's this year. That was hilarious.

Inconsistency Pitfalls And Personal Examples

SPEAKER_04 41:34

I'm I'm thinking of the hole right now because I remember it was uh the third round. Cato Falls. Is it Cato Falls? Cato Falls. It was right before the finals. We went out there and we played another round to practice some holes. And it's this I want to say it was eight or nine. Yeah, it's it's on the way back, it's fairly big and open, and there's like all this marshy stuff on the right, and there's a tree, big like oak tree, and uh the uh marshy stuff is not ob at all. It's not hazard, it's not ob but it's towards another hole. So, really, you don't want to take the Anheuser route and go around the tree on the left side. The best way to get in there because the basket is guarded, is to actually go off to the right and try and throw into the marshy area.

SPEAKER_02 42:33

Well, it wasn't really even marshy, it was just kind of tall grass.

SPEAKER_04 42:36

It's tall grass. You could tell it would be a marshy area, but it's it wasn't.

SPEAKER_02 42:40

But it was it was it wasn't tall enough to like inhibit your throw or your stance or anything.

SPEAKER_04 42:47

It was tall enough to keep you from wanting to go through it.

SPEAKER_02 42:50

Yeah, exactly. And it was kind of like this this mind trick, but I remember Jenny, because the wind was at our back, Jenny let this huge like hundred foot in the air hyzer go off into this thing. And like she said, the whole reason for going over there is because you had entry to the circle with no trees guarding the basket. And uh that was one of those where the rest of the card were like, what is she doing?

SPEAKER_04 43:18

Yeah, and it's it you don't line up on the teapad the right way either. You line up sideways on that teapad and you just go around it.

SPEAKER_02 43:26

Yeah, and you know uh I'll I've the next round that we played at Cato, uh some of your card mates actually like tried it. Like they started doing it. Yeah, so it was that was a our Simon line moment. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 43:42

Alright. Uh use objective measures, incorporate video analysis, scorecards, and other tools to provide evidence based feedback. I don't know what we're gonna provide would do this year, what we would add on. I think I'd love us to actually video more of our. Actual tournament rounds this year.

SPEAKER_05 44:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 44:03

But we'll see. Okay. Challenges of inconsistent feedback. Confusion and frustration. Athletes may not understand what to prioritize if feedback changes frequently. We've been through a lot of that. Yeah. Stalled progress. Erratic feedback can lead to repeated mistakes or plateauing performance. Loss of confidence. Inconsistent messages can make athletes feel unsure about their abilities or their coaches' expertise.

SPEAKER_02 44:32

Well, and I think that it's important to note that disc golf is a newish sport, and we're still figuring it out. Everybody, we we don't we're starting to understand what good form looks like and the components of good form, but everybody's so different. And there are a few basic rules, but everybody's so different. But when we were just learning the game, um, we're getting a better handle on it now, but when we were just learning the game, it was like, oh, try this, try that, try this, try that. And there is no consistency. There is a lot of trial and error and a lot of spinning our wheels.

SPEAKER_04 45:10

So like maybe let's go buy another disc.

SPEAKER_02 45:14

Yeah, the disc is the problem.

SPEAKER_04 45:16

Absolutely.

Timing: Immediate vs Delayed Feedback

SPEAKER_02 45:17

It's definitely not it's definitely not the technique, it's the equipment. Yep. Yeah. Yeah. But uh it was it was a guessing game for a while, and it did lead to a lot of plateaus, it led to a lot of frustrations. Um but eventually we got our act together. So I would, you know, I would definitely try to find somebody that uh you know is a is a good coach and knows the sport well and has yeah, I think one of the most important things is follow people that have a form and technique similar to yours so that you have a good basis for comparison. I think that's a very good key.

SPEAKER_04 46:01

And uh be willing to take the risk to uh step out of your comfort zone and play with different people.

SPEAKER_02 46:08

Yeah, you never know what you'll pick up. I mean, I really started to improve when I started playing dubs, um, because I was paired with pros and things, and playing with those different people really helped. And then team golf. Team golf was a big help, uh, big boost to my rating. I mean, it must have gave me I I I would attribute my participation in team golf to probably a 30-point hike in my rating.

SPEAKER_04 46:34

And I'm gonna say, for me, playing the women's only events um and the way that my game has changed, being able to go play in MA4, MA3 divisions, or even just watch uh the other guys on Brandon's cards has really uh i it's a different way of breaking down the course, of di of breaking down a hole. And hopefully we'll we'll talk about that in a different episode.

SPEAKER_02 47:01

Well, I'll just I'll just mention that real quick. Jenny, like you're playing in MA three these days. Uh you like you started at the tail end of last year, and you're scoring solid midfield in MA three. Like I don't think we have that's pretty impressive.

SPEAKER_04 47:20

I don't think we have a good uh showing considering uh one of them was Woodland Creek.

SPEAKER_05 47:29

The hurricane.

SPEAKER_04 47:30

I'm gonna say the hurricane was cruel. Anyways, uh back to our episode. The timing of feedback is also important. So you can get uh immediate feedback. The definition is feedback given right after the action. So an example would be a coach commenting on a throw immediately after it happens, and the relevance is that it's effective for beginners to correct errors before they become habits. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 48:00

So this would go back to the cognitive stage of the learning model, is providing that feedback right away.

SPEAKER_04 48:09

Sure. Um, I was gonna say that sometimes, especially if you're a caddy and in that tournament mode, you may not be able to provide immediate feedback. Uh, you may have to go with delayed feedback, which the definition is feedback provided after a short interval, allowing reflection. So an example would be reviewing video footage after a practice session. And the relevance is that it encourages athletes to self-assess before receiving external input. So I know for me, you talked about that sometimes I'm not in the place where I'm ready to receive information or feedback. So having come up with the uh conversation with you of hey, uh, can you give me a 10-second improvement, something like that, um, after something's been happening for so long, then you know I'm ready to accept that feedback.

Mindset: Growth, Failure, And Reframing

SPEAKER_02 49:02

Well, so usually when I'm in that is I'm looking for a something that's being repeated over and over that's causing an undesirable outcome, right? And then I try to simplify it down into a 10-second fix. And that kind of involves kind of filtering out all the chain reactions and get getting down to the meat and potato basics of the throw. Right. Now, I was gonna say, so being able to review things and kind of pinpoint different specific things, that's when you're moving into that associative uh level of the of the skill acquisition model. And also with the autonomous part of the feedback model, or the not feedback, uh skill acquisition model, that's when you get down to like the really finite details. I mean, we're you know professional athletes, they look at millimeters. They look at inches, they look at maybe one degree of angle or half a degree of angle. I mean, they are that dialed in to where it's that precise. And that's that's what it takes to be a professional athlete.

SPEAKER_04 50:18

Yep.

SPEAKER_02 50:18

Yep, is to get that that kind of attention to detail.

SPEAKER_04 50:22

Yep. We frequently say angles and inches.

SPEAKER_02 50:26

Angles and millimeters.

SPEAKER_04 50:27

Angles and inches.

SPEAKER_02 50:29

So next we move on to mindset and athlete perception and reception. So athletes with a growth mindset, we're talking about growth mindset, they can view a feedback feedback as opportunity, and it's an opportunity to improve. A lot of times, uh you know what I say one of the most powerful feedback tools we have is failure. I learn a whole lot more from having a bad round than I do from having a round where I'm going out there and just killing it. And I can once I get over my emotions, I can sit back and examine that analytically. You know, I give it my 15 minutes or 20 minutes, give it the the give it the rant of everything that went wrong, and then stay quiet for five minutes. And then you start to go in this reflective analytical mode, and you can use all of those things for opportunities of growth, and you can let your failures motivate you. In fact, I encourage you to let your feet your failures motivate you. And if you're a coach out there, you should try to frame the feedback in a way that encourages the effort and the learning. So, Jenny, what would be an example of how to frame feedback in a way that would encourage those two things?

SPEAKER_04 51:47

You know, it may not be uh the best example, but one thing that comes to mind is uh when you're playing with new people or um someone who's maybe not comfortable with tournament play, and you know, you you have that conversation of you know, it happens to the best of us, like you got this, keep going. Just it's it's not really a specific thing. It's it's it's just it's a lot of it, it's those little drops along the way, like we've been talking about.

SPEAKER_02 52:21

Yeah, a little drop in the bucket. Yeah. Something I always say is, you know, we all have to start somewhere. You know, and and I mean, man, my first round was horrendous compared to where I am now. And some people that I've seen out there and playing, uh you know, it's just uh to look back on that and uh see how much you've developed as opposed to like these other people, and that's not that's not a bad thing because everybody wants to play at their own capacity and at their own enjoyment. And if if they're happy there, that's what counts and that's what matters. Yeah.

Delivering Feedback: Structure And Tone

SPEAKER_04 52:59

Uh something that comes to mind, I said it before, I like to tell people that you know Taylor Swift it and just shake it off.

SPEAKER_02 53:06

Shake it off.

SPEAKER_04 53:06

And uh, you know, if if you get to that point where you're you can kind of joke around with the people, you can be like, man, you're really getting your money's worth today. It's like, man, I'm making every shot count. Like I'm getting and uh we also like to talk about uh playing a lot of golf, exploring new parts of the course. It's like, man, I've never been here. I've been playing for six years, I've never been in this spot. I am so excited for what I'm gonna learn for being in this spot for sure right now.

SPEAKER_02 53:39

Or uh what is it? Oh, you know what a wonderful learning opportunity. Yeah, what a wonderful opportunity I've given myself. Yes, yes, oh yeah. Yeah, hence the sarcasm. But anyway, um now feedback can act adversely too, and if it's overly if it feels overly critical and uh poorly timed, and I think timing is probably everything, it can really demotivate your athlete and actually decrease their performance. So building a trust between an athlete and a coach is very, very key. Uh you have to you have to kind of give up your ego and level the fact that they have your best interests at heart and they're there to make you better. And so you have to be able to have those hard conversations without becoming emotionally invested.

SPEAKER_04 54:36

Yeah, that's why sometimes it's it's a good thing, but it's also a detriment to have your spouse be your caddy because they know how to help and they also know how to uh push the other buttons real well.

SPEAKER_02 54:50

Well, what's what's the thing I shared with you lately the recently is like don't uh don't be emotionally connected to an idea. Or don't be too emotionally connected to an idea.

SPEAKER_04 55:03

You sent me a text about that like two days ago. I know. That that doesn't mean anything. It's because it was good. Yeah, and I asked you to send me the episode. That's a p I That's a bad thing.

SPEAKER_02 55:16

Oh, one that's the wrong one.

SPEAKER_05 55:19

There we go.

SPEAKER_02 55:21

I like the chimes better. Let's uh let's keep the chimes. I know, I know it's magical.

SPEAKER_04 55:25

All right, moving on to practical applications.

SPEAKER_02 55:31

We talked about it a little bit go.

SPEAKER_04 55:33

The art of giving feedback.

SPEAKER_02 55:36

Dun dun dun.

SPEAKER_04 55:37

Be constructive and supportive. Feedback should focus on helping the recipient improve rather than criticizing or discouraging them. You need to balance your positivity and your critique. Combine praise with areas for improvement to maintain motivation.

SPEAKER_02 55:55

So one one key coaching phrase, bouncing back real quick, is you know, that was that was a good effort. Let's maybe try this this time.

SPEAKER_04 56:04

Maybe not tone like that, but I was gonna say the way you're saying that, I I might no, you know, it'd be like, you know what?

SPEAKER_02 56:14

That was a great effort. Maybe maybe we can give this a try.

SPEAKER_04 56:17

Hey, that was amazing. Next time aim.

SPEAKER_02 56:20

Yeah, exactly. Next well, I mean, you can you can that would be great if it was in this direction. Yeah. Isn't isn't the disc supposed to go in the basket?

SPEAKER_04 56:30

Why are you in the other fairway?

SPEAKER_02 56:33

It's the it's the backdoor route.

Receiving Feedback: Stay Open And Specific

SPEAKER_04 56:35

See, but that's you know, honestly, we're joking about it. And yes, these are the things that we say and tend to say to each other, especially when you're with a group of people that you've played with before. And so getting to the point where you can laugh about it too is important as well. Plus, I wanted to say with the why are you in the wrong fairway? I've gotten to the point where I realize if I can throw that far the wrong direction, I can make it back too. Like I can throw just as far to get back.

SPEAKER_02 57:08

The problem, the problem with you is that we can with me. Yeah, we could put you on two different teapads and you'll hit the same spot from both teapads.

SPEAKER_04 57:16

Yeah, I know.

SPEAKER_02 57:17

With different discs.

SPEAKER_04 57:18

I know.

SPEAKER_02 57:18

Like for some reason you get fixed on a spot, and no matter what, your disc is going there.

SPEAKER_04 57:23

Yeah.

unknown 57:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 57:25

It's all about landing. No matter how you throw it, it's going there.

SPEAKER_04 57:28

That's that's the part of my game that changed this year, especially listening to the pros and you know, walking with them, talking with them, is the landing zones. Like, where are you trying to land? It doesn't matter how you get there, you just have to get there. Inside the circle.

SPEAKER_02 57:43

That's my landing zone.

SPEAKER_04 57:45

No.

SPEAKER_02 57:45

Oh inside the circle.

SPEAKER_04 57:48

No.

SPEAKER_02 57:49

Inside the basket.

SPEAKER_04 57:51

Be specific. That's pretty specific. Focus on clear, actionable points rather than vague comments. Timing matters. Timing, timing matters. Which button are you pushing? Oh, I love it. Alright, timing matters. Provide feedback at the right moment to maximize its impact. During practice, immediate feedback helps correct errors on the spot. Post-performance, reflective feedback helps analyze and learn from an overall performance. Avoid offering feedback during high stress moments, like in the middle of a tournament round, unless it's absolutely necessary.

SPEAKER_01 58:34

Yep.

SPEAKER_04 58:35

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 58:36

Yep.

SPEAKER_04 58:37

Tailor feedback to the individual. Consider the recipient's personality, skill level, and preferences when delivering feedback. Foster a growth mindset. Frame feedback as a tool for development rather than as a critique of ability. The feedback process. Observe and analyze. Carefully watch the performance and identify specific strengths and weaknesses. Use tools like video analysis or measurable data to provide objective observations.

SPEAKER_02 59:11

The more specific you can be, the better.

SPEAKER_04 59:14

Absolutely. Ask questions first. Encourage the recipient to reflect on their performance before offering feedback. And then provide feedback. Structure your feedback effectively. Start with a positive, reinforce what's working well, address areas for improvement. Offer clear, actionable suggestions, and end with encouragement. Highlight progress and the potential for continued growth.

SPEAKER_02 59:42

See, I guess a question on that would be like when do you use the negative feedback? Because I I think back to operant conditioning. Right? And you want to celebrate the wins and you want to I wouldn't say downplay the losses, but you want to or the the negative outcomes. You want to I think you want to like celebrate the negative things just in the in a negative way, if that makes sense. Like if you keep hitting the same tree, like, man, like that's not a that's not a good thing. Uh well. I I mean I I'm not saying this well. I'm not I'm not wording very well tonight. No, yeah. No, but I mean, so I think back to operate conditioning. Right? You want to celebrate the things that you're doing right and make a big deal out of them so that you get that endorphin rush and you get that neuroprogramming and stuff like that. Sure. Don't don't you want to use the same, you know, it's kind of the same deal for negative feedback, like something that you don't want to do, and having some sort of consequence for that that uh I I hate to say it punishes you for doing doing it incorrectly.

Integrating Tech, Journals, And Networks

SPEAKER_04 1:00:59

Well, I think that's where the next step is to encourage the dialogue. So feedback should be a two-way conversation. You invite the recipient to ask questions or share their thoughts. So being able to then have that conversation of, hey, so these are all the things that you're doing. Great. Um, I noticed this. Do you want to talk about this? Like, can you tell me about this situation? Like, why were you standing that way? What are you working on, Jennifer? Well, I'm trying to figure out how to move my hips more. Okay, that makes a lot more sense about what you were doing because to me it looked like you were blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:39

See, that's not the way it works in Guy Land. Take me to Guy Land. In in yeah, it's raining, man. I mean, you're gonna put that on your soundboard.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:48

Do not tell me what to put on my soundboard.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:51

I'm gonna put it on my soundboard.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:52

I'm going to say that we made it to the man aquarium.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:55

The man aquarium. Manquarium. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:00

Guy pool.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:00

Yeah, okay. Anyway. Um what were we talking about?

SPEAKER_04 1:02:07

So I I would say in Guy land, it's like, wow, that effing sucked. Like you just hit a bleeping tree again. No, it'll go quit, blah, blah, blah.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:17

Well, I think I think back to like two days in football, right? Or like two days in hockey, where it's like, if you miss the net on a shot, you do 10 push-ups. Right? And before you know it, you're not missing the net anymore.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:35

It's like how you told Leilani that you make me do push-ups every time that I miss. But you know what? It's worked for Leilani. She was killing it this year.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:51

Is she doing it?

SPEAKER_04 1:02:53

I don't know. But whatever she did, she's killing it.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:57

Leilani, like, she's out in the backyard, like doing push-ups and stuff. Are you texting her right now?

SPEAKER_04 1:03:02

No.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:02

Oh, come on. No. No, what you know what? We're gonna have to have her on the podcast just to ask her.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:07

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:08

Yes. Leilani, how do you how do you train for your excellent putting stroke? She's got some sort of big routine, like resistance bands and like weights, and I'm wearing like moon shoes and stuff, and you know, I'm putting off the top of a ladder. Yeah, her her rating this year went up to 848. Hey, that's awesome. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:33

Well, she's beating me. I know.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:35

She's rated higher than I am.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:37

Yeah, she is.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:38

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:39

She's better than you. And has been for quite some time.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:44

Wow. Wow.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:49

Is that negative feedback?

SPEAKER_02 1:03:50

I'm receiving some feedback right now.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:52

All right. And follow up. Revisit the feedback in future sessions to assess progress and provide further guidance. So here are some tips for effective feedback. Focus on the behavior, not the person. Avoid making feedback personal or overly critical. Avoid overloading with information. Highlight one or two key areas at a time to prevent overwhelming the recipients. Telling them they need to change the angle of their disc, they need to change where they're reaching back with their arm, and telling them they have to step differently all at the same time is overwhelming.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:33

Well, I mean, you're doing over well over 200 complex motions when you go into a disc golf throw.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:39

Don't say that. That's way too much information for me to process.

Building Positive Feedback Loops

SPEAKER_02 1:04:42

So, like Scott Stokely, he's like, you know, what we're gonna do is we're gonna break it down to five or six simple things, and that's how we're gonna break down the disc golf throw. Because everything else is just a chain reaction off of all of those other things. So if you can get those five or six simple things down, then you're in business.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:04

Yep. Alright, use positive language. Frame feedback in a way that motivates rather than discourages. Match feedback to the learning stage. Beginners provide more detailed and frequent feedback. Intermediate and advanced players offer less frequent feedback, focusing on fine-tuning and strategic elements, unless you are working on a brand new skill. And then you may need to talk to them a little more frequently and a little more detailed as if it was a beginner.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:35

That sounds like the uh skill acquisition model we were talking about earlier. Why, yes, it does, Brandon. Oh man.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:42

It's great. Be honest and genuine. Avoid a sugar coating, uh I can't say this with a straight face. Avoid sugarcoating or providing empty praise. Athletes value authenticity.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:58

This is something that I Struggle with. Not necess, not necessarily the uh empty praise, but uh I'm very crass about like I I don't pull punches with anybody, but I'm an equal opportunity a hole for everybody.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:16

Let's just say that somebody is uh very difficult to tell if they're telling the truth, they're telling a lie. So that's not true. It's uh yeah. Anyways, the role of empathy in feedback. Empathy ensures that feedback is delivered in a way that considers the recipient's emotions and mindset. And the impact is that empathy builds trust and helps the athlete remain receptive to feedback.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:44

So some it for those that want clarification on empathy, it is the ability to for you to put yourself in the other person's shoes to see it from their angle or direction.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:01

Alright. Let's talk about how to receive feedback. I think I'm going to be called out quite a few times in this section, so let's see how it goes.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:11

Receiving s receiving feedback is a skill. And you have to develop You sound like my mother.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:18

Patience is a virtue, Jennifer.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:21

Yeah, you you didn't learn that lesson.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:23

I'm still learning it.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:26

And that is what we call a growth mindset.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:29

Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:30

Because feedback is an opportunity to learn and grow. It's an opportunity to become motivated and take that next step rather than seeing it as criticism or destructive.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:44

Destructive or explosive.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:47

Explosive, volatile.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:49

All right. Stay open and receptive. Be willing to listen without becoming defensive or dismissing.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:55

So we talked about earlier. Don't let your emotions play into it. Try to come at it from a strictly objective point of view.

Common Mistakes And How To Fix Them

SPEAKER_04 1:08:04

Ask clarifying questions. If feedback is unclear, seek further explanation to fully understand it.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:11

Specificity is also your job as the athlete. If you don't understand what the coach is telling you, and I dealt with this all throughout my young career because there's you know, my coaches would say things and I have no idea what they're talking about, and they're like, oh, just go out in the field and do it. I was too afraid to ask the questions I needed to ask, so I never knew what I was doing. So when I finally gathered up the guts to be able to say, hey, um, everybody else seems to know what you're talking about, but I don't, it started to open doors for me. So don't be embarrassed by what you don't know. In fact, that is that is a strength is knowing what you don't know and being willing to ask questions.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:55

So reflect on the feedback. Take time to process what you've heard, separating emotions from actionable advice. Focus on what you can control. Direct your energy towards changes within your power rather than dwelling on factors outside of your control.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:11

And the only thing that you can control is yourself. Once the disc leaves your hand, that's it. Your role is over.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:20

Although I will say that sometimes I do pull out my little hovercraft controller and control the disc.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:27

You're not supposed to tell people about that.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:29

They see me do it all the time.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:31

Prodigy discs, folks. They have the little remote control disc.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:35

Hovercraft mode enabled.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:37

It's got a drone motor hidden in the dome.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:39

Groundplay like a boss.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:40

That's right.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:42

Apply feedback proactively.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:44

Oh, PDGA approved, too.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:46

Incorporate the advice into your training or performance as soon as possible. And show gratitude. Acknowledge the effort someone has made to provide the feedback, even if it's challenging to hear.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:00

I think that's one of the biggest lessons that I had to learn was when somebody was taking the time and the energy out of their day to try to make me better, is to just shut up and receive it instead of being like, I know. That's the biggest turnoff for coaches is I know, I know, I know. Biggest turnoff for teachers, probably too. I know, I know. Leave me alone.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:25

Yeah, well, if you know, you don't need to be here.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:28

I don't need to be here. All right, steps to receiving feedback. Listen actively, pay full attention, avoid interrupting, and absorb the information being shared. Stay off your phone. Uh control emotional reactions. Feedback can sometimes trigger frustration, embarrassment, or defensiveness. Take a deep breath and remain calm. Seek specificity. If the feedback is too vague, ask for concrete examples or actionable steps. Reflect before responding. Instead of reacting immediately, take time to think about the feedback and its implications. Commit to improvement. Demonstrate a willingness to make changes and follow through with the feedback provided. And finally, follow up. Revisit the feedback with the person who provided it to discuss progress and seek additional input.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:24

And I think this kind of goes to something that we tell our kids all the time is that your progress is your responsibility. It's not your coach's responsibility. It's not your spouse's responsibility, it's not your teacher's responsibility. It is your responsibility to make sure that you're getting the information and drawing out the information that you need to be successful. And really being uh really being assertive about that and saying, hey, being honest and saying, hey, I'm not getting what I need, and then going to that person or whatever that source and saying, Hey, this is what I need and this is how I need you to give it to me.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:05

Which it takes a while to be able to say that. Like to really truly be like, okay, what you're saying doesn't make sense to me. However, if you say this, and then also be willing to take that feedback as the coach can sometimes be difficult.

Q&A: Practical Feedback Scenarios

SPEAKER_02 1:12:19

Well, it it takes it takes a heck of a lot of bravery because you are, you know, nobody wants to be viewed as ignorant or dumb or stupid. And some of these things, they just, you know, seem like such everybody else knows what this means, but I don't, so I must be dumb and I don't want to be judged. So we never ask the question. Right? And that's why a lot of teachers, a lot of people say the only the only dumb question is one the one that's not asked.

unknown 1:12:48

Yep.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:50

Alright. Let's talk about some common challenges in receiving feedback. Defensiveness. It's natural to feel defensive, especially if the feedback touches on perceived weaknesses. Over well. Are you gonna talk? Yeah. Why? Are you gonna go through each one?

SPEAKER_02 1:13:08

No, uh, just talking about defensiveness real quick is that you know, disc golf is an individual sport, and because of the vast psychological and emotional uh aspect of it, uh it's very it's very uh personal when somebody tries to coach you or tries to pick you apart. Uh just you know, like anything, but I find golf uh golf more so.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:34

And yeah, because you're the only one on that teapad.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:37

Yeah, you're you're the only one there. It's all about you. You're the only person on the scorecard, and it's you're it's very uh isolating in a way.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:45

Overwhelm. Receiving too much feedback at once can be hard to process. Misinterpreting feedback, miscommunication can lead to misunderstanding the advice. That's why it's important to ask questions. Fear of judgment, worrying about what feedback implies about your abilities or worth. Benefits of receiving feedback skillfully. Oh, yeah. It accelerates improvement. Acting on constructive advice helps you refine techniques, techniques, and achieve goals faster. It builds resilience. Learning to accept and adapt to feedback strengthens mental toughness. It enhances your relationships. Being receptive to feedback fosters trust and mutual respect with coaches, teammates, and peers. And it increases your self-awareness. Feedback provides insights into your strengths and areas for growth that you might not recognize on your own.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:42

Yeah, it's the uh too close to the trees to see the forest. Yeah. You know, you can it's good to play with other people and get that objective eye, especially practice rounds where you can say, you go to somebody different and say, hey, you know, maybe what am I what am I doing wrong? What are you seeing here? You know, and they can give you, you know, a different, you know, they can give you a list of five things that would be completely different than somebody else's five things.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:12

So some tools for feedback integration. A self-assessment technique is probably the best way. Uh journaling post-run reflections. Yeah, I I like to talk about them. Uh the video analysis of throws, uh, Brandon rep uh Kinovia. Yep.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:31

Yeah, just Google search it, it's a free thing. But uh, like I said, side-by-side video analysis, you has all these measuring tools and measuring metrics, and there's a lot of instructional videos on how to use it too. So it's it's a fantastic free tool if you uh have the time and ability to do that.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:51

So leveraging technology, um, you can use like UDISC, you can use StatMando, uh, you can use uh what's the disc.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:02

Well, PDGA Live has the stats tech disc.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:06

Yes, you can use a tech disc.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:07

Tech disc. Know your throw.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:10

Yep, that's the one. Quit it. Uh building a feedback network. Uh, you may want to uh seek feedback from your coaches, your peers, and your mentors. And it's really important to find an accountability partner in disc golf. So it may be your dubs partner, it could be whoever you're gonna have be your caddy for the year, for the season, uh, but finding that person who's able to talk your lingo and encourage you and help you learn.

Personal Stories: Helpful And Harmful Feedback

SPEAKER_02 1:16:43

All right. Now, one of the ways that feedback is most constructively used is is as a loop. So we've been talking about positive feedback loops and negative feedback loops throughout uh our episodes here. So we're gonna talk about how to how those loops are created. And so the first step to creating a feedback loop, positive or negative, is gathering data through direct observation tools or metrics. So, like Jenny was saying, using StatMando or UDISC or that Kinevea thing and getting all that data, measuring angles and different things. And then making sure that the uh one of the biggest mistakes is making sure that the observations are objective and focused towards those goals. A lot of times our observations are emotional, and that's when you can get into that negative feedback loop, like I suck at disc golf, I'm never gonna be able to putt again, I'm you know, I'm gonna hit that tree like every single time. Like it's it's a given. That's when you can really start down a rabbit hole, is when you become emotionally involved. Next is analysis. Take those observations, those tools, those metrics, and you can put them together, compare and contrast, and identify patterns or issues that you've you've uh started doing, or compare them to old habits. And then when you're doing that, make sure that you're using a balance of positive reinforcement and constructive critique. Uh something that I do when I'm sitting there and reviewing videos, or even when I'm just off the teapad in a tournament, I'll say, you know what, that was a pretty good shot. And I'll I'll yeah, I'll I don't have a problem giving myself a little pat on the back, but I also uh I'm not very nice to myself sometimes when I have a bad shot. So uh again, keeping that uh keeping that emotion out of it is very important for creating a positive feedback loop. So emotions bad, objectivity good.

SPEAKER_04 1:18:41

Yeah, but you need to recognize that okay, you're having this emotion. It is there as a way to try and keep you alive because it's your lizard brain. So the really the best thing you can do is acknowledge it. Yep, I'm having this feeling, and then move past it.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:59

Yeah, and that that plays to the tribe part of it is that you know you're on your card, you want to perform well in front of these people because you you know you don't uh you know you don't want to be embarrassed and kind of you know not want people to play with you because then you know this girl's a whole lot f more fun when you play with people. So all right, um feedback delivery. So when you're giving yourself feedback, make sure you're being clear and specific, or a coach is giving you feedback, make sure that coach is being clear and specific. Give actionable suggestions. Actionable actionable, not emotional. So Jenny, instead of placing your hand directly behind you on your reach back, place it out in front of you. That would be specific. Even more specific would be on your reach back, make sure your shoulder is at a forty-five degree angle to your body and your disc is moving straight across your line. That would be very specific. Fortunately for Jenny, she's Mrs. Consistent, so she doesn't have a problem doing that. Yay. Now it also says to use a balance of positive reinforcement and constructive technique uh constructive critique. So I'm not really sure how to do that, so why don't you give it a shot? Positive reinforcement would be like great job.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:29

Um Brandon, you are doing a great job, but what I see is that you are uh when you're putting, for whatever reason, your left leg, you just keep twitching it out a little bit. Uh so maybe you don't want to do that.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:46

Okay. Well, that's a good example. I think. Do I really do that? I don't know. It's been a while.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:54

I don't think either of us had played disc golf since league.

Rules As Feedback And Major Takeaways

SPEAKER_02 1:20:58

Since league. Well, you know, we've had family and surgeries and all sorts of good stuff. So anyway, uh adjustment. Next is adjustment. So you want to take these changes and you want to implement them. So when a coach gives you the feedback and says, okay, maybe let's let's try a little bit of more, let's try a little more of this this time, immediately go in there and try it and do a few repetitions to kind of lock it in. You only need four or five repetitions to really try to really feel it. Any more than any more than that, I would say stop for at least a while, and then I would come back to it because if you do it a lot all at once, you can start forming bad habits around that because you're starting to think too much about it. When you're learning a new skill, and a coach says, Hey, let's make this minor little change, let's try this this time. As the athlete, I would go in and I would give it four to six reps. I would try it four to six times with the new technique, and then I will stop. And the reason that I will do it that way is because if I do more than six reps, right, six repetitions, then I'm going to start to pick it apart, think about it, and then I'm going to start forming bad habits around that new skill. So I want to do that weird thing, lock it in there, and then leave it alone so that my brain has time to make those connections rather than forming bad habits. Last but not least, you want to reassess. So go back, take a look at what you're doing differently. We kind of just kind of alluded into that. Take a look at what you're doing differently, measure the result, and see if it's getting where you want. Getting you what you want. And then, of course, based on your findings, go back through the loop and modify the strategies.

SPEAKER_04 1:23:03

Alright, common mistakes, questions, or misconceptions. Common mistakes when giving feedback, being too vague. General comments like, you need to improve. Don't provide actionable insights. So be specific and focus on identifiable behaviors or skills. Like work on keeping your wrist steady during your putt.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:24

Overloading information, giving too much feedback at once can overload the recipient. Kinda like this podcast. Solution. Prioritize one or two key points per session to focus on.

SPEAKER_04 1:23:38

Focusing solely on negatives. Constant criticism can demotivate and erode confidence. So balance feedback by highlighting strengths alongside areas for improvement.

Closing Thanks, Sponsors, And Bloopers Tease

SPEAKER_02 1:23:52

Poor timing. Delivering feedback during stressful moments, aka mid-competition, might backfire on you. So provide feedback during low pressure situations like practice or after the event. So use empathy and ask reflective questions, i.e., how do you feel about your performance?

SPEAKER_04 1:24:38

Lack of follow-up. Giving feedback without revisiting it can render it ineffective or forgotten. Check in regularly to track progress and reinforce your suggestions.

SPEAKER_02 1:24:52

Now for some common mistakes when receiving feedback, number one, and there's a reason it's number one, is becoming defensive. This is the number one killer of skill development. And that is reacting negatively or justifying actions instead of listening. So stay open, take a deep breath, and remind yourself that feedback is there for your benefit. Sometimes you need to acknowledge your strengths and build on them while addressing weakness. Give yourself a pat on the back once in a while. You deserve it.

SPEAKER_04 1:26:18

Expecting immediate results. Becoming frustrated if improvements aren't instant. Be patient and view progress as a long-term process.

SPEAKER_02 1:26:29

Another mistake is avoiding feedback altogether. Sometimes we're afraid of receiving feedback, and we avoid it because we don't want to feel that discomfort or that insecurity. One of the ways you can get over this is actively seek the feedback and treat it as an essential part of your growth.

SPEAKER_04 1:26:48

Alright, how to avoid these mistakes? For the feedback givers, use a constructive structure. Start with positives, address areas for improvement, and end with encouragement. Observe the recipient's body language and adapt your approach if they appear overwhelmed or defensive. And always provide actionable suggestions rather than abstract critiques.

SPEAKER_02 1:27:13

And for the feedback recipients out there, practice active listening by maintaining eye contact and refraining from interrupting. One skill that we use all the time with active listening is that we'll actually repeat back to the person what they just said. And that gives that person a real sense that you heard what they said. Also, you can reflect on the feedback to identify specific actions that you can take to address it. So again, actionable, not emotional. And treat feedback as a collaborative process and ask questions if something is unclear. As a coach, I'm always looking for my athletes to be able to have some buy in with their developers. Development and having a collaborative environment is the way to do that.

SPEAKER_04 1:28:06

All right. So here are some common questions about giving feedback. Brandon, how do I ensure my feedback is constructive rather than discouraging?

SPEAKER_02 1:28:17

Well, Jenny. I recommend that you focus on specific behaviors and actions, provide examples, and frame the feedback as an opportunity, not a detriment.

SPEAKER_04 1:28:29

When is the best time to give feedback?

SPEAKER_02 1:28:37

But feedback during practice or shortly after an event when emotions are calm and the experience is still fresh is usually kind of the butter zone.

SPEAKER_04 1:28:48

All right. So how often should feedback be given?

SPEAKER_02 1:28:50

So in the study, feedback frequency in skill acquisition performed by Wolf and Shea via 2002, they investigated how often feedback should be given during practice. And what it what it found was that frequent feedback is beneficial for beginners, but can hinder the advancement, uh, can hinder advanced learners by creating dependency.

SPEAKER_04 1:29:15

How can I balance positive and negative feedback?

SPEAKER_02 1:29:20

Use the sandwich method. Start with a positive comment, address areas from a p uh for improvement, and then end with encouragement.

SPEAKER_04 1:29:29

How do I give feedback to someone who is resistant to it?

SPEAKER_02 1:29:34

Approach the conversation angrily. I mean empathy. Approach approach the conversation with empathy. Um ask for their perspective and emphasize shared goals.

SPEAKER_04 1:29:46

What if I don't have enough time to give detailed feedback?

SPEAKER_02 1:29:51

Provide a brief but actionable suggestion to f and then follow up later with more in-depth guidance.

SPEAKER_04 1:29:58

How do I tailor feedback to different personalities?

SPEAKER_02 1:30:01

Understand the recipient's communication style and adapt accordingly. Some people prefer direct feedback, while others benefit from a softer approach.

SPEAKER_04 1:30:12

How can I ensure my feedback leads to action?

SPEAKER_02 1:30:15

Include clear, actionable steps, follow up to assess the progress.

SPEAKER_04 1:30:20

And what if I notice more than one issue? Like, how much feedback should I give at once?

SPEAKER_02 1:30:26

I think you should prioritize the most critical points to avoid overwhelming the recipient. More questions about receiving feedback. So the last one was giving. This is receiving. So, Jenny, how do I stay calm if the feedback feels harsh?

SPEAKER_04 1:30:43

Well, first I recognize that I'm having those feelings. Then I take a deep breath. Focus on the message rather than the tone, and remind yourself that feedback is intended to help you improve.

SPEAKER_02 1:30:56

Jenny, if you don't agree with the feedback, what should you do?

SPEAKER_04 1:31:00

Well, listen fully before responding. Ask clarifying questions and respectfully share your perspective if necessary.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:08

How can I avoid feeling defensive when receiving feedback?

SPEAKER_04 1:31:12

Approach the conversation with curiosity and view feedback as an opportunity to grow.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:18

What if the feedback is too vague?

SPEAKER_04 1:31:22

Ask clarifying questions or ask for specific examples to better understand the advice.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:27

How do I turn feedback into actionable steps?

SPEAKER_04 1:31:31

Take a moment, reflect on the feedback, identify the key takeaways, and create a plan for improvement with clear goals. You may want to, again, ask clarifying questions as well.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:42

What should I do if I receive conflicting feedback?

SPEAKER_04 1:31:46

Um, evaluate the sources and the context of the feedback, and then look for common themes and discuss the conflict with a trusted mentor or coach.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:55

How can I make sure I'm improving after receiving the feedback?

SPEAKER_04 1:31:58

Track your progress. Practice this suggested adjustments and ask for follow-up feedback to assess improvement.

SPEAKER_02 1:32:05

What if I feel overwhelmed by the amount of feedback?

SPEAKER_04 1:32:08

Well, you're going to need to prioritize the most important points and address them one at a time.

SPEAKER_02 1:32:13

How do I ask for feedback effectively?

SPEAKER_04 1:32:16

Be specific about what you want feedback on. So, for example, can you give me tips on my putting technique and choose to choose a good time to ask?

SPEAKER_02 1:32:26

What if the feedback isn't delivered constructively?

SPEAKER_04 1:32:30

Focus on extracting value from the content, even if the delivery is poor, and address any concerns about tone later.

SPEAKER_02 1:32:38

So, how about some general questions now? I mean, what makes feedback effective?

SPEAKER_04 1:32:43

Well, specificity, timeliness, relevance, and focus on actionable steps. How can feedback improve performance?

SPEAKER_02 1:32:52

By identifying your areas for growth, reinforcing positive behaviors, and providing guidance for adjustments. How do I handle feedback in a high pressure environment?

SPEAKER_04 1:33:06

Stay focused on the constructive aspects, prioritize immediate adjustments, and revisit the feedback in detail later. What role does communication play in the feedback process?

SPEAKER_02 1:33:19

Clear and empathetic communication ensures feedback is understood and fosters trust between the giver and the receiver. Can feedback damage relationships if not done well?

SPEAKER_04 1:33:32

Yes. Poorly delivered feedback can lead to resentment or loss of trust. Effective feedback strengthens relationships by showing mutual respect and shared goals. Alright, let's talk about some common misconceptions about giving feedback. Feedback should only focus on what's wrong.

SPEAKER_02 1:33:50

The reality is that effective feedback includes both positive reinforcement and constructive critique. Highlighting strengths motivates and builds confidence while addressing areas for improvement.

SPEAKER_04 1:34:03

People won't improve unless feedback is harsh.

SPEAKER_02 1:34:07

Harsh feedback is often demoralizing rather than motivating. Constructive, empathetic feedback is more likely to foster growth and engagement.

SPEAKER_04 1:34:17

Feedback should always be immediate.

SPEAKER_02 1:34:20

Timing is everything. Feedback is important, but delivering at the appropriate time when it can be received and not distract or stress the recipient. Choose the right time and context for the maximum impact.

SPEAKER_04 1:34:33

Giving feedback is about pointing out flaws.

SPEAKER_02 1:34:38

Feedback is not about pointing out flaws. Feedback is about supporting growth. It involves offering actionable suggestions to help someone improve rather than just identifying problems. Be a part of the solution, not part of the problem.

SPEAKER_04 1:34:52

Everyone understands feedback in the same way.

SPEAKER_02 1:34:57

The reality is that feedback needs to be tailored to each individual's tastes, communication, style, personality. It is a skill that needs to be practiced and uh honed in order to be done effectively.

SPEAKER_04 1:35:11

Well, if I give positive feedback, they'll stop working hard.

SPEAKER_02 1:35:15

Positive feedback reinforces good habits and encourages continued effort. It complements constructive feedback by fostering a balanced perspective. Now, the other side, how about some misconceptions about receiving feedback? Feedback is always criticism.

SPEAKER_04 1:35:33

While it may feel that way, feedback often includes recognition of strengths and constructive suggestions for growth. It's not meant to tear you down, but to build you up.

SPEAKER_02 1:35:44

If I'm getting feedback, I must be doing something wrong.

SPEAKER_04 1:35:48

Again, it may feel that way, but feedback is a normal part of improvement, even for high performers. It's a sign of investment in your growth.

SPEAKER_02 1:35:57

Should I always agree with the feedback someone's giving me?

SPEAKER_04 1:36:00

You may not. Feedback is valuable, but not all of it may apply. It's okay to reflect critically and discuss points of disagreement respectfully.

SPEAKER_02 1:36:10

So if I don't get any feedback, I must have done everything perfectly, right?

SPEAKER_04 1:36:14

Yes, sometimes feedback isn't given due to oversight, time constraints, or discomfort from the giver. Proactively seeking feedback ensures you don't miss opportunities to learn. Plus, they may not be in a place to give you that kind of feedback. You may need to search out a different coach.

SPEAKER_02 1:36:32

So can only coaches and leaders be the ones to give me feedback?

SPEAKER_04 1:36:36

Absolutely not. Uh, peers, teammates, and even self-assessment can provide valuable insights into your performance.

SPEAKER_02 1:36:44

But I feel like when I receive feedback, I have to change everything at once.

SPEAKER_04 1:36:48

Well, improvement is incremental. Focus on addressing one or two key areas at a time to avoid feeling overwhelmed.

SPEAKER_02 1:36:56

And now some misconceptions that go both ways that are shared by both givers and receivers.

SPEAKER_04 1:37:02

Feedback is a one-time event.

SPEAKER_02 1:37:03

Feedback is most effective when part of an ongoing process. You're always learning, you're always growing, allowing for continuous improvement and adjustment.

SPEAKER_04 1:37:14

Feedback is only for correcting mistakes.

SPEAKER_02 1:37:19

The reality is, is it's also about celebrating progress, reinforcing good habits, and maintaining momentum. Givers and recipients of feedback should be aware of mistakes, but do your best not to dwell on them. Feedback is about the person, not the behavior.

SPEAKER_04 1:37:38

Feedback should focus on specific actions or behaviors, not personal attributes. For example, say your stance needs adjustment rather than you're bad at footwork. Nice. Feedback doesn't need follow-up.

SPEAKER_02 1:37:55

Remember, these are misconceptions. So without follow-up, feedback might be forgotten and implemented incorrectly. Revisiting feedback ensures progress and clarifies the expectation. Only experts can give valuable feedback.

SPEAKER_04 1:38:11

That's not true. Even non-experts can provide useful insights, especially if they have a fresh perspective or observe something others might miss. Feedback equals criticism.

SPEAKER_02 1:38:24

Well, this is a common myth. The root word of criticism is critique, which means to form an assessment. Criticism is critique in absence of feedback. And critique is a tool in which to form effective feedback, not an area for emphasis in itself necessarily. But feedback should be coupled with critique if and when it is given.

SPEAKER_04 1:38:49

Alright, Brandon. You got a moment to think about it.

SPEAKER_02 1:38:54

You got a moment to think about it. You got a moment to think about it. What do you got?

SPEAKER_04 1:38:57

I want you to tell me a scenario where you received feedback and it was helpful.

SPEAKER_02 1:39:06

Oh, it was helpful. Alright.

SPEAKER_04 1:39:08

And then you're also going to come up with one where is harmful. Oh, I am how you overcame it.

SPEAKER_02 1:39:16

I think one of I think one of the things that has helped me the most is you reminding me to slow down my slow down my pace. I I like to I like to walk up fast and throw hard, but that's not necessarily the best for accuracy. I find that when I slow things down to a a slower tempo that I uh that I do much better. And I actually throw further. So yeah, I think that was some very constructive feedback that I I try to use all the time. Oh, feedback that was harmful. I think the most harmful feedback that I receive is just is things that are personal attacks. They really don't serve a per purpose, but things like oh, you know, that was that was so stupid, why'd you do that? And I I've said that to myself. I mean that's a a self-feedback loop. You know, oh that's so stupid, Brandon. Why aren't you why aren't you doing you know, why aren't you doing this today? Why can't you make that shot today? You know, that uh it's like I find myself personally attacking myself and tearing myself down.

SPEAKER_04 1:40:52

So you get into that negative self-talk.

SPEAKER_02 1:40:54

Yeah, that negative feedback loop, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:40:56

Yeah, so the harmful feedback, it puts you into that negative feedback loop.

SPEAKER_02 1:41:01

Well, it's like we were talking earlier, is that the constructive feedback loop, the positive feedback loop, seems to gravitate more towards executables and data and and concrete things, as where the negative feedback loop tends to gravitate towards more abstract concepts like emotions or uh you know environmental conditions or like you know the social effects of the card or something like that. And I I find that I think that negativity is more associated with abstract and the positivity is more associated with reality.

SPEAKER_04 1:41:45

Yeah, so I don't know uh which part of what you're talking about reminded me of this, but um the PDGA uh we are each responsible for making sure that everyone on our card is following the rules of the game as well. And I know that when somebody says, Hey, uh you just threw another like shot at the basket, you know, we do in practice, you just threw another shot in the basket. Like, I'm gonna have to give you a stroke for that because you can't do that. That's a practice shot, and it's just part of the rules, and I think that's something that we as disc golfers need to learn to separate ourselves from, too, is that that's also feedback is a hey, you just broke this rule, you're getting a warning, you're getting a stroke, whatever it is. But finding a way to accept, yep, I got called out on it, and then move past it, that's like another actionable feedback, I think.

SPEAKER_02 1:42:53

Yeah, yeah. And I'm uh, you know, I I get where you're going because like I'm a I'm a big proponent, uh I'm a big supporter, I should say, of we all have to play by the same set of rules no matter what, because if we didn't play by a universal set of rules, then we don't really have a game.

SPEAKER_04 1:43:14

And I will say that I think both of us learned that going through two major events this year. And then I mean we've I mean we've both worked at the Cascade Challenge for two years. We're both TD certified, yeah, but also going through and being participants in two majors.

SPEAKER_02 1:43:33

Well, and running our own tournaments too. Right. Yeah. So Alright, Jenny. What about a time when you received some positive feedback and how did it affect you?

SPEAKER_04 1:43:49

Um Well, I I tend to get just a lot of positive feedback just in general of hey, that's a great idea, that's awesome, and that's why I changed my name to awesome. Because people were always like, hey, that's awesome, you're awesome. So I changed my name.

SPEAKER_02 1:44:13

You just do everything, you just do everything right, huh?

SPEAKER_04 1:44:17

No.

SPEAKER_02 1:44:17

No.

SPEAKER_04 1:44:19

I'm thinking about in work, how they're like, wow, that's great, and that's such a good idea, and let's try this. Blah blah blah.

SPEAKER_02 1:44:25

What about when you like things haven't gone so well? Like what what's been what's been some of like the worst feedback you've gotten?

SPEAKER_04 1:44:32

I don't have one.

SPEAKER_02 1:44:34

Nobody has ever given you harmful feedback. Uh have you ever given yourself harmful feedback?

SPEAKER_04 1:44:46

Yeah, I blocked that out. I don't have a good example for either of them.

SPEAKER_02 1:44:50

Jenny. Did you learn anything through our did you learn anything through our ramblings today? I mean, is this gonna help you brush up on some of your feedback skills? Maybe if I listen to it. Next episode.

unknown 1:45:08

I'm just kidding.

SPEAKER_04 1:45:11

No, seriously, like we go through these conversations and I may have some aha's, but actually listening to it once it's fully produced gives me different aha's. It's like, oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:45:25

You actually listen to our podcast.

SPEAKER_04 1:45:27

Yeah, I do.

SPEAKER_02 1:45:27

Yeah. Sometimes you if you're in the band, you wear your own t-shirt, I guess. What? Alright, so from the podcast, what is the best feedback that you received?

SPEAKER_04 1:45:45

From the podcast?

SPEAKER_02 1:45:47

Well, yeah, you said you would go back and listen to it. Like, what's the best feedback? I don't know. Just say something.

SPEAKER_04 1:45:57

It's really hard for me to talk about feedback when I am really good at a lot of things. And I'm really good at dissociating myself from bad feedback.

SPEAKER_02 1:46:12

But that feedback is an opportunity for growth.

SPEAKER_04 1:46:17

Yeah. And I listen to it. You know, honestly, the the times where I get the most awful feedback is when I'm calling parents and they decide to just swear me out. Like, I get it, but I'm also to the point where it's like, you know, I appreciate you sharing all this with me because you're just advocating for your kid, and you're also upset about X, Y, and Z. So you're doing the best that you can, and I understand you expressing your frustrations. I just I don't know. I don't have a good answer.

SPEAKER_02 1:46:56

Would you like to add anything to the host discussion? Talk about your experiences.

SPEAKER_04 1:47:04

Being in a public spotlight that we're choosing to put ourselves in, even by being on the podcast, there are people out there that probably don't like us, probably don't like the things that we're saying. But that's not going to stop us from doing this because we enjoy doing this and we appreciate their feedback, and it gives us an opportunity to have that conversation and learn from it. Like it was embarrassing when Joel Turner called me out that I couldn't hold my breath longer. But you know what? He was he was right. Like, I totally got in my head and made things worse, and then I have to remember to not practice that while I'm driving and listening to the podcast because that's a bad idea.

SPEAKER_02 1:47:49

You can pass out.

SPEAKER_04 1:47:52

But it's like, you know, I'm far enough removed that I, you know, I can just let it slide.

SPEAKER_02 1:48:02

Separate the person from the problem.

SPEAKER_04 1:48:04

Yeah, but I can't separate myself from my game right there when I'm in the middle of it. I will throw my bag, I will kick my bag. I know you know all this stuff. I know.

SPEAKER_02 1:48:12

Well, you know, I will run my cart over a tree. This is a very emotional sport. It's a very emotional sport, and be because it's so physical and so mental, that I think that uh it carries a lot of emotions with it. I mean, this golf is like a mirror. Yeah. And it makes you examine the best parts of yourself and also makes you examine the worst parts of yourself.

SPEAKER_04 1:48:39

Yeah, and that's why I, you know, I keep saying that it's you have all these opportunities for success, and you also have all this quick opportunities for failure, failure, failure, failure. And what is it about finding a way to persevere through failure after failure after failure that helps make you a better person. It helps you heal from a lot of other things you may have experienced in your life. Like I was playing a tournament, and uh the lady I was playing with, she had a bad hole, a bad hole, and then got a seven on a hole. I think it was a nine, but anyways, we ended up green on seven, then she quit. I at uh what was the one we just did with the hurricane?

SPEAKER_02 1:49:24

Woodland Creek.

SPEAKER_04 1:49:25

Woodland Creek took a 12 on a hole, said, I guess that's my lesson for today, and finished the round.

SPEAKER_02 1:49:32

That was a hurricane though. You were playing in a hurricane.

SPEAKER_04 1:49:37

Yes, but it wasn't a hurricane when I got the twelve. It was nutty, it was clear skies when I got the twelve. That was just bad judgment. Six or seven times.

SPEAKER_02 1:49:50

I see what you did there.

SPEAKER_04 1:49:55

So it'll be interesting to see what parts of this conversation you keep in and what parts you cut. Out.

SPEAKER_02 1:50:01

I'll give you some feedback. And that does it for this episode of the Intentional Disc Golfer Podcast. On this episode, we aim to understand the psychology and effectiveness of feedback as it pertains to performance. You need to be able to identify the different types of feedback and their effects. Learn how to enhance your skills of giving and receiving feedback, and gain tools to integrate feedback into your routine to maximize outcomes. We've discussed common mistakes, questions, misconceptions about using feedback. And we had a discussion amongst ourselves about how they use feedback to enhance how we've used feedback to enhance our performances. So if you love us, enjoy us, appreciate what you hear, please leave a comment either where you get your podcasts or on social media. You can find us at the intentional disc golfer on all the social medias, or you can reach out to us directly at the intentional discolfer at gmail.com. That is the intentional disgulfer at gmail.com. At the end of this episode, after the end song, we will put up some bloopers and some haas. Uh if you want to stick around and give a listen, get a good laugh. And we'd like to thank our sponsors. We have Prodigy Discs, Treasures of the Forest, Salty Unicorns, and Builders First Source. We'd also like to thank the fans. You guys are the reason that we can keep doing this, the reason that we do do this. This is the Intentional Discgolfer. I am one of your hosts. My name is Brandon.

SPEAKER_03 1:51:51

And I'm Jenny.

SPEAKER_02 1:51:53

And here at the Intentional Discgolfer, we believe that Discgolf has the power to change lives. So go out there and grow the sport. You said that I'm perfect. No, I didn't.

SPEAKER_04 1:52:42

I'm gonna pick all my own sounds.

SPEAKER_02 1:52:44

That was the wrong button.

SPEAKER_04 1:52:45

I'm gonna pick all my own sounds, and you're not gonna know.

SPEAKER_02 1:52:48

I'll go get a sample pad.

SPEAKER_04 1:52:50

Feedmac m the feedmack.

SPEAKER_02 1:52:56

Feedback. That's our deaf dog. She can't hear us. She's the one that sleeps on the back of the couch instead of on the couch.

SPEAKER_04 1:53:08

I'm gonna have to put pictures of the dogs on our website.

SPEAKER_02 1:53:10

Oh yeah. The dogs are going on the website for sure. What should I do if I don't agree with the feedback?

SPEAKER_04 1:53:16

Punch him in the face.

SPEAKER_02 1:53:18

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:53:20

Gotta read it again. Feedbook the feedbook?

SPEAKER_02 1:53:28

Feedbook. Feedbook.

SPEAKER_04 1:53:30

Feedback should only focus on what's wrong.

SPEAKER_02 1:53:34

It's a social media of compliments and critiques. There you go.