S4 Ep 4 Cool Runnings- Joe Emas -Making Memories While You Make Miles

A grade school jab said he’d never be an athlete. A lunch bet said otherwise. Joe Emus joins us to share how finishing dead last at the Toronto Zoo race sparked a lifetime of running—seven Bostons, five World Marathon Majors, and more than a thousand races fueled by community and curiosity. His secret isn’t a shoe or a split; it’s choosing joy over judgment and people over pace.

We dig into the moments that make miles unforgettable: the phalanx of runners shielding each other from Arctic wind in Tromsø, a vineyard detour in Bordeaux that turned into a mad dash to beat the cutoff, and the blizzard day in Ottawa where Joe was both first and last in his age group. Joe’s stories remind us that the best finish photos don’t star a watch face; they star strangers who become teammates, a sunrise on the water, and a city chanting your name at midnight.

Along the way, Joe unpacks the habits that keep him moving at 71: adopting Jeff Galloway’s run walk method for durability, resetting PRs to zero every year to honor the season you’re in, and learning fueling by doing—from early gels without water to his notorious frozen-bottle cone stashes. We talk aging with grace, choosing races for joy rather than medals, and why your shoes should change as your body changes. And yes, there are dad jokes, kilts, Tiffany bling, and the origin of “Cool Runnings, mon.”

If you’ve ever needed permission to look up from your GPS, talk to the person next to you, and let the day be the reward, this conversation is your sign. Hit follow, share this with a running friend, and leave a review telling us the race moment you’ll never forget—then go make a new one with your next mile.

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Transcript

Cold Open And Tech Woes

SPEAKER_01 0:16

What did I tell you, friends? Did you not thoroughly enjoy that episode? Oh my goodness. We could have talked a week nonstop. It would have been an ultra podcast, honestly. He has such fantastic stories. He told me one off air that you unfortunately did not get to hear, and that was when he went up into space. He told me all about that. That was pretty incredible. But yeah, a great episode. So thank you for listening. And again, I apologize that it's not on YouTube, but you know, technology happens. My last several episodes have been that way. Thank you, Riverside. At any rate, thanks for following. Thanks for sharing. And we'll see you next time. Hello, and welcome back to Over the Next Tale Fitness Podcast. I'm Carla Coffey, your coach and host for today's program. I want to thank everybody who's been following and sharing and rating the program. That's really been helpful. If you don't know, you can also follow this podcast on YouTube, except for this episode. We had a lot of trouble with the video, so we went all audio. So enjoy it since it's actually on your podcast. So don't try to see us on video. That's okay. Just, you know, technology. That's what happens. If you need a running coach, I am a little bit more serious as a coach. Um, and you can look for me or email me, Carla, at coffeecrewcoaching.com. Of course, go to the website coffeecrewcoaching.com and and uh hit me up there. You can reach out to me there as well. Follow me on Facebook. Um, yeah, check out the YouTube, just not for this episode, but you are going to be in for a real treat listening to this episode. Uh I interviewed Joseph Emis. You all are just it was such a privilege, honestly. He's uh such a great guy, and uh, you are gonna thoroughly enjoy his uh podcast, and you'll probably want to reach out to him, I'm sure, when it's over so you can hear more stories. Or, as we discussed, I'll have him on again and hear more stories. So, yeah, enjoy and uh share this with your friends. Welcome to the show, Joe. It's so good to have you here.

SPEAKER_00 2:40

Thank you, Carla. I'm very glad to be here.

SPEAKER_01 2:43

Awesome. And it looks like everything is stable for a minute. So let's go while we can. So tell me about your running journey. When did you get started? Why did you get started?

SPEAKER_00 2:56

Sure, it's a very long journey. Of course, being 71 years old, you do get a lot of years under you. Uh, I was actually not very athletic as a child. In fact, I had a grade eight teacher that told me I was lousy at sports, I should never think of doing any sport at all.

SPEAKER_01 3:13

No.

SPEAKER_00 3:13

And that teacher did convince me. That's the downside of those teachers. In fact, I actually did the mandatory high school, you know, run a mile first. I came in second in my entire school, and they asked me to join the track and field team. And I said, Oh no, I'm I think it's sports, and I didn't do it. I wound up getting involved in theater for many, many years. Anyway, uh, I graduated from the University of Toronto, opened up a business. Uh, it was a chain of better menswear stores, which fortunately did very well. And but I was I was very young. I was still in my 20s at that point. Most of my employees, who are friends of the family and they're wonderful people, um, I think they were 40 years older than I am, 30 years older. So I was very trying to prove myself and very much out of my element. One of my managers, you know, seeing this young, cocky 20-some-odd-year-old kid, made a bet with me. There was a race at the Toronto Zoo, and I'm from Toronto, Canada originally. So by the way, that means I'm a dual citizen. Uh, I'm Canadian and American. Okay. So I am bilingual. I will translate from English to American if you ever need that. So good to know. But he made me a bet that I couldn't run this race at the Toronto Zoo. I had no idea what this running stuff was all about. I had no clue whatsoever. Uh young, male, testosterone, cocky, you know, of course you're gonna do it. It was a lunch bet, so you gotta do that. So I signed up for the race. I go in. I yeah, it's primarily male runners back then at that point. We still hadn't broken through that barrier as much as we like. And I took off with you know the front pack, and I'm I'm going with them. I am like zooming right with them for about maybe a quarter kilometer, maybe. And then I started seeing basically their backsides as they were moving further and further away, till eventually I got to the point with a so just a few miles in, I was already dying. I got to around the 17 kilometer mark with four kilometers to go, and the Toronto Zoo run back then was a very hilly race. So I was death warmed over and ready to drop. I didn't want to stop because this was a lunch bet, you don't want to lose a bet.

SPEAKER_01 5:37

Right.

SPEAKER_00 5:37

I wasn't sure how I was gonna keep going. You know, this is a horrible sport. This is terrible, I feel awful. And suddenly I see about 12 men, guys, come running towards me. These were people who had finished the race, knew there was somebody still out on the course, they came back to basically run it in with me.

SPEAKER_01 5:59

Wow. And I thought you were last.

SPEAKER_00 6:01

I was dead last. I was actually dead last. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 6:05

I had to laugh, but it's just funny because you were.

SPEAKER_00 6:08

No, it's first race, dead last. Well, they were kind enough to escort me in. I thought, what a wonderful group of people, what a wonderful lifestyle. When I finished, they were cheering as loudly as that had I won the race. You know, and I really found I had a love for this.

unknown 6:25

Oh.

Chasing Boston And Race Highlights

SPEAKER_00 6:26

And it got me, it enticed me. I started doing more and more. I started training. Um, I would do uh my sister was running at the time five kilometer races very slowly. I used to volunteer to pace her in what were the old Bonnie Bell races. Okay, I was really there to pick up the girls at the Bonnie Bell races, but I paced her as well. Um, one of the more humorous stories we have in our family was a time at York University. We were running a five-kilometer race. My sister at that point, as family tradition, was dead last. Um and I'm running beside her trying to be the good brother. And I felt I took a look, I said, you know, and her name is Taffy. I said, Taffy, we we have to pick up the pace. And she looked at me, she says, I'm doing fine, thank you very much. You know, sister Lee kind of comment. I said, No, really, we do have to go a little bit faster. I am very happy at this pace. I am doing okay, I don't care where we are. And I said, I then I finally said, Okay, I insist, we really do have to go faster. You know, folds her arms as she's running and gives goes, give me one good reason why. I said, Because the big machine picking up the cones is right behind us. We wound up finishing second last, but we finished, we finished, I'll give her credit, she finished. Yeah, so I got really hooked by the running, by the people, by the sport, by the lifestyle. I started training more seriously. Um, I was technologically advanced, something we had we had talked about before, yes, because I had a big, huge, heavy, Sony, yellow walkman, and not one but two Rocky tapes to listen to. So I was definitely ahead of the curve. By 1980, I would run my first marathon, the Orange Ball Marathon in Florida. By 83, I had qualified for the Boston Marathon. That was my first Boston. I've done seven Bostons in total.

unknown 8:30

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 8:30

Uh, my first qualification, the qualification time back then was two hours and 50 minutes. I got in with a 249.53.

SPEAKER_01 8:39

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 8:40

So um I've been successful in some of my races where I've been at the front of the pack, Mardi Gras Marathon in '82 or '81, excuse me, the um following decade, I won my age in the Brandon Marathon, Brandon Marathon. But I've also been near the back. It has never really mattered whether I'm at the front or the back. That same lifestyle that I discovered at the Toronto Zoo in my first race, that has carried me through all the way. That's really what this sport is all about.

SPEAKER_01 9:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:08

And so uh in my running journey, uh, I haven't done 50 states like you or ultra marathons, very jealous of that. But I have I have finished 50 marathons. I've done five of the six world majors, I've done well over 150 half marathons, and we estimate now well over a thousand races in total in my career. I have finished at the front and I finished at the back. And you know what? I will tell you the ones that I enjoyed the most were the ones where I was basically towards the middle to the back because I really got to enjoy the people and the ambience and everything else.

SPEAKER_01 9:45

Yeah. Wow, that's great. Well, I'm very jealous of you for having done some of the majors, so we're jealous together.

SPEAKER_00 9:52

Yes, well, yeah, I I I enjoyed, you know, London, Berlin. The only one I haven't done is Tokyo.

unknown 9:59

Okay.

Aging, Cutoffs, And Joy Over Times

SPEAKER_00 9:59

Um, I don't know if that's going to be in my future or not because the cutoff times in Tokyo are very tight during the race. Realistically, 71 years old. I'm very grateful to still be running. I know in most races I'm going to finish in the top 10 in my age category because that's pretty much all that's left in my age category.

SPEAKER_01 10:22

Right, right.

SPEAKER_00 10:23

So at my age, it's a matter of attrition and you know quality. But making those time cut the time cutoffs, I think it would be viable, it would be possible for me to do that with hard enough training. But when I run races, I don't run them really because I want the metal. I mean, of course, you want the metal and t-shirts. You never have enough metal and t-shirts, family model. But if I'm not going to enjoy myself during the race, if I'm going to be so focused on time and focused on my position and making sure I make a cutoff, and it takes the fun and the joy out of the race for me. And to me, that's where the real joy, the fun comes in. The training, the camaraderie beforehand and during the race itself, all the rest is a bonus.

SPEAKER_01 11:35

Yeah, for sure. Yeah. So when you were training, well, when you weren't training, I should say, for that very first race, it sounds like it was just over a half marathon for those of us who aren't uh diligent with our uh our kilometers, um, that the bet one.

SPEAKER_00 11:54

Yeah, there was just other just under half.

SPEAKER_01 11:56

Just under half 20 kilometers. Did you train at all, or did you just show up?

SPEAKER_00 11:59

No, I just showed up, which was really dumb.

SPEAKER_01 12:03

Yeah. And then what about like shoes and like what did you have anything like that?

SPEAKER_00 12:08

The first time around was just basic garbage sneakers. I I would eventually, my first pair of real running shoes was the Brooks Manage Supreme, um, which were very expensive shoes back then, which would not even be on the market today. Sure. But I've watched that change over the years, you know, and and we've gone through all the different uh different styles of shoes from minimalist to the hokus.

SPEAKER_01 12:32

Right.

Gear Journeys And Glitchy GPS

SPEAKER_00 12:33

Uh and I will tell you that over the years, while I have changed my shoes consistently and I have a very wide foot, so I'm more new balanced inclined, or Brooks. But I also find that your body changes over time, your capacity changes over time. So I adjust the shoes that I wear and what I'm doing to my age and what I'm capable of doing at that point. I ran at uh in the 10K when I was ranked. I was a twelve, I was um 23, 32 is my time for the 10K. Uh 332, 23, excuse me, not that fast. 23, you know, from the 10K. Yeah, that's great, but I'll never do that again. At least and live to tell the story.

SPEAKER_01 13:16

Although today my Garmin had caught a glitch and it teleported me. I ran a 616-mile during my eight-mile run today, which my eight-mile run for everybody else was eight miles. So mine was 9.86. And my 5K during that run was 17 minutes. So I mean, things, you know, those can happen.

SPEAKER_00 13:40

Well, it's like the the third mile or so in the Chicago marathon, your GPS goes all wacky, which really means when you look at your watch at the end of a kilometer while running between the buildings in downtown Chicago, it looks like you've done a Kenyan style uh kilometer. It's like, oh, good, three minutes per kilometer. I'm I'm awesome until I get to the next kilometer and realize I'm not.

SPEAKER_01 14:04

Exactly. That's exactly what happened to me today. I was like, oh, so it's giving me my Garmin's showing me all these metals. You PR'd this distance. I'm like, yeah, because I ran a six-minute mile in my dreams.

SPEAKER_00 14:16

Well, hey, you know, I'll tell you a little trick that I've used, uh I've recommended over the years because in my 30s, yes, very fast, different story. I was never intense competitive. I think if you're so intense, you're gonna lose the joy of uh the sport. But I've always I goofballed around, but I still enjoyed it and I was still competitive. When I got to my 40s, I did the first ever Disney World marathon in 1994. And I realized, you know, I was doing very well back then. I was gonna do about a three and a half hour marathon. But there's no way I would do in uh the 90s what I was doing in the 80s or in the 70s. You know, so I began to rethink my personal best and everything else. And I've gotten into the habit now, especially in my latter years, at the beginning of every year, and some people do it on their birthday, I do it at the beginning of the year, I mark down my personal best from the prior year. So I have a record of it, and I do it, but I do keep a journal, I do keep a log. But then I reset my garment and my personal records down to zero right across the board. So that year, whatever I'm doing, I am going after my PRs from that year. And just psychologically, it's a good feeling. You know, that's hey, you know what? That's this is the best I've done at this age. This is great. I can beat this.

SPEAKER_01 15:36

That is a brilliant idea. I like that. Oh, and since my Garmin doesn't have a clue, that would be a good thing for me to do as soon as we get done here.

SPEAKER_00 15:47

Well, I've always tried to do things that um really can get you more involved in the race, involved in what you're doing and around and not be so worried about your time or your specific pace, because every race is different. I've done so many of them. Times when you think you're gonna just burn the course, you don't. Other times you think, okay, I'll go in it because the medal looks cool. Eventually I'll get to the finish and you have a great race.

SPEAKER_01 16:12

You're right. You never know. No, you really don't.

SPEAKER_00 16:16

And sometimes people get caught up so much in their time. I ran a race in Florida, it's the 305 half marathon, which runs right along Kitty Corner to the ocean and starts because it has to in Florida before dawn because of the heat. And I'm running along, and I've got the ocean to my right, and this is couple also to my right, and I watch them and they're looking at their garments, and they're so intense on their time and what their pace is, and they're trying to figure out their exact pace. And I said, I said, I said, excuse me, but sorry to interfere, but take a quick look to your right. And they looked over the ocean, and the sun was just peeking up over the ocean and reflecting off the clouds, and it was gorgeous.

SPEAKER_01 17:02

I bet.

Rethinking PRs And Annual Resets

SPEAKER_00 17:03

And they said, Thank you. They love being able to see that sight in the morning. That to me, those are the things that will be the memories of the race later on. Because yeah, we're gonna remember the iconic finish lines. Um Boylston Street, always remember. My three times in New York, you know, finishing off at Tavern on the Green, finished Chicago, well uh Buckingham Palace, those you remember. The rest of them, not so much. But things that happened during the race that you'll remember. Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_01 17:34

So since you started running several years ago, what has what have you learned like with the fueling? Because I know back in the day they didn't have a lot of goose. I think all they had was maybe Gatorade.

SPEAKER_00 17:47

No, we didn't, we had Gatorade, but we really didn't know the benefits of it.

SPEAKER_01 17:51

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 17:51

We believed in past, we believed in carbo loading, which means carbo deprivation beforehand, then carbo loading beforehand, which of course now is all debunked. Uh, there were a number of different theories. One of the crazy things I did, and I still do sometimes, depending on the on the course or the race or the distance. You know, those I got some of those orange cones that you see uh when people are doing construction.

SPEAKER_01 18:15

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:16

Okay. So prior to that, I go along where the course is, picking out the location, I probably will want to have my fuel, what I particularly want to have to have for that race, and what I want to drink. Uh I freeze it the night before. I put it out in the morning underneath the cone. So when I'm running by, I pull over, pull the cone up, pull out my drink, pull out what I'm gonna eat, and I'm done. I've been doing that for years.

SPEAKER_01 18:42

So you travel, you fly with a cone if you fly?

SPEAKER_00 18:45

I don't fly with a cone, but I'll pick one up.

SPEAKER_01 18:47

You'll just go down.

SPEAKER_00 18:48

Jill Jill actually has my wife has one from Test Track that she got and she used. And then after uh when I wasn't going to use it during Disney, she wore it on her head so I could find her in the crowds.

SPEAKER_01 18:59

That's brilliant.

SPEAKER_00 19:00

So yeah, you know, there's always something you can do.

SPEAKER_01 19:03

Yeah. You know, uh I love that. At what point during your running did since you did the first one with no training, did you realize it would be beneficial to have liquids and or goos or whatever?

SPEAKER_00 19:15

Sure. As soon as I started going distances beyond five kilometers, you know, began to understand the the problems of having enough fluid, getting food. I was reading voraciously reading whatever I could find.

SPEAKER_01 19:27

No.

Fueling Lessons From Gels To Cones

SPEAKER_00 19:27

But then we had Jim Fix's book on running, we had Bill Powerman's jogging. You know, we didn't have a lot. Runner's World was really just starting off, in essence, Amy Barefoot. So we didn't really have a lot of information then and sort of grab what we can, you know, and make shift as we go along. Uh wasn't really until the 2000s and for a number of years, where I trained Jeff Galloway runners for about six years, that I really got to understand the need for better nutrition during the run. Um, I remember the first time they gave out goose, uh, which was back in the Disney race in '94. They gave it out when we were just we were passing it what now would be Animal Kingdom, but it's in that area of the race, three-quarters of the way through the marathon. And they were handing them out in just vanilla and chocolate. That's the flavors that they had. No one told us they're supposed to have water with them. Oh, it was rough for a lot of people.

unknown 20:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:27

So we a lot of things we learned over the years.

SPEAKER_01 20:32

So uh let's back up a second. You name-dropped Jeff Galloway. Tell us about that.

SPEAKER_00 20:37

Jeff's been a longtime friend and coach for for two and a half decades. Um, I had the pleasure myself and my wife Jill. My wife Jill, by the way, is my solid rock. She's my I married my best friend. Um, and she is there for most of my marathon. She is my support crew. She meets me different places along the course. She joked one time that she actually put her garment on when she was meeting me during the Madoc marathon in Bordeaux. She joked that she actually traveled uh 13.1 miles to meet me at different points along the course for the marathon.

unknown 21:15

Really?

SPEAKER_00 21:16

So she's kind of in. She's kind of my girl with that.

SPEAKER_01 21:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:19

You know, so um I'm sorry, where are we going?

SPEAKER_01 21:23

Um with uh Jeff, so you've trained for Judge Galloway.

SPEAKER_00 21:26

So Jeff, it started with with trying out the Galloway program in South Miami uh back in 2000 because I wanted to get back to Boston again. I run Boston in night. That's a big uh because I know you were not on stuff.

SPEAKER_01 21:40

I could barely see it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:41

But it's actually that's the banner from the 1996 Boston Marathon, 100th running. It was uh the street banner. So I wanted to get back, I wanted to get back, what's that? You stole it? No, we bought it actually. It was for charity.

unknown 21:54

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 21:55

Yeah, so as a lawyer, I would never steal, right? Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_01 21:58

Yeah, well, and I think if you're going to uh construction sites and stealing their cones, why would you? That's a different story.

SPEAKER_00 22:04

That's allowable. That's allowable. But um, you know, in 2000, I wanted to get back to Boston. I started training harder, and I discovered the run-walk methodology that Galloway believes in. Back then, we were doing five minutes run, one-minute walk. And I found that allowed me to go a lot further. And I started training people for the purpose of getting into Boston. We're doing our long runs. And over time, I that became my go to. Uh, that has changed from five and ones now to it's more 30 second walk breaks, which is the optimum amount. The amount you run varies depending. Depending on what your time is going to be, and it can vary during the course. But I found that's helped me with the longevity that I've had. Because the injuries that I've gone through, and we all go through injuries, are more from hitting a crack in a sidewalk and going falling.

unknown 22:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:57

Finding out that I'm not a trail runner because the roots and I do not have a good relationship. Yeah. But with intervals, the standard chin splints or other issues that you would have, I have not had.

SPEAKER_01 23:10

Yep.

Jeff Galloway And Run Walk Method

SPEAKER_00 23:11

Because I'm taking the time with the intervals and knowing I can back off. I did have some fun about a year, uh, two and a half years ago, Jill and I went to Atlanta to run Peachtree. And we actually hung around with Jeff and his wonderful wife, Barb, uh, the day after he took me on a tour, showed me some of his family history, which not surprisingly is very altruistic and wonderful. And he's an absolute sweetheart. I know that he wanted to do Honolulu this last year, could not do it because of a knee injury that he had fallen. Hopefully he'll do it next year. And if he does, I'm hoping to be there. I'll do Honolulu as the next one.

SPEAKER_01 23:50

So I was gonna ask you if you were gonna go run in Greece with him.

SPEAKER_00 23:53

I just got an email about I saw he's uh he's doing I was tempted, but I'm doing uh I've got Tampa coming up in about four weeks. Uh probably by the time this broadcast, I may have done that, but that's the ultra. I'm doing the 15 kilometer race the first date and the half marathon the second.

SPEAKER_01 24:10

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 24:11

I had won that last year. I had placed third the year before. So um, but really it's more fun pirate jokes and more pirate jokes. Because as you know from our show, yeah, I tend to joke around a lot.

SPEAKER_01 24:24

Yes, yeah. Um so yeah, I I so you actually have you taught under Jeff? Because I know he has a group of um people that do train for him.

SPEAKER_00 24:37

Yes, I I've done a Galloway, yeah. For six years I was one of the Galloway trainers.

SPEAKER_01 24:41

Wow, okay. And so you you're friends with Jeff. When did you meet Jeff? How long have you been friends?

SPEAKER_00 24:46

Well, that started it started in 2000 when when that started rolling. And how did you get it? It got to be more intense because I had gone through some heart issues, which are genetic, which everything's fine. Good. And in 2012, things changed a little bit because I got diagnosed with cancer and my odds were not that great. But I was stubborn. Uh, I got through the operation, somehow survived, which was borderline for a while. But then I had radiation for the season. And um, I was the type that would get, even with the radiation, I'd still get out of bed and I would still go for a run because the temptation to crawl under the bed is there, but you're much better off tackling it, going out, getting something in, and feeling in charge. And we're heading, at that point, uh, we were heading into the wintertime in Ottawa, where I was I go back and forth between the US and Canada and Ottawa. And I thought, great, radiation, I run in the snow, everything melts around me, easy run. I tried to convince my wife with all the radiation in me, I should go to the Ottawa airport and run by all the scanners, but she wouldn't let me.

SPEAKER_01 25:57

But I would see you here.

SPEAKER_00 25:59

But John Honerkamp from the New York Roadrunners Club, uh, I guess, in talking to, because he I communicated with Jeff about the cancer, had heard about that. He had ESPN call me to do a paragraph about my coming back from cancer. They wound up doing a full-page article, and that wound up in the internet, and that wound up changing everything.

SPEAKER_01 26:21

So wow. Well, congrats on that, on everything. Congrats on, you know, your recovery.

SPEAKER_00 26:26

That's well, I've gone through a second round. Uh, I had that in the early 2000s, 2020s. You know, um, there it was more a matter of chemotherapy, which was even worse, you know. But um, on the other hand, I kept running, I kept going. In fact, the Chicago Marathon was my victory lap for the uh post-cancer. You know, it's like because you have a choice, you can let it beat you down, and that's very easy to do. It's like anything in life can do that. Or you can go out, you can run, you can take control, and you control it. Even if it doesn't get rid of the symptoms and doesn't change that, you feel like you're in control.

SPEAKER_01 27:07

Absolutely. Wow, that's so fantastic. Congratulations for that. That's that's a triumph just in itself.

Cancer, Comebacks, And Control

SPEAKER_00 27:15

I I think there's so many supportive people in our community, and I see that everywhere. I I I joke with the cold weather. I ran uh the Midnight Sun Races, uh Marathons in um Norway.

unknown 27:27

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 27:27

So we were in Troms, Norway, which is about 220 miles north of the Arctic Circle, and you run at midnight. Now, first of all, I do have to apologize with that race because the night before I kind of ruined Christmas that year. Well, normally the night before, you know, you'll eat something light or pasta or that, but I knew that the race wasn't starting till midnight the following day because it's 24 hours sunlight. So I could have like a more normal meal. Well, I don't do normal very well because he is cool. So I thought, what's you know, what's the specialty? Reindeer. They're not endangered, they're not endangered. I ordered I ordered a reindeer steak and they served it up. It was delicious, and it was medium rare, so it was right in the center, and I thought, I'm eating medium rare reindeer. That's Rudolph. I'm eating Rudolph. So I ruined Christmas. I apologize right off the bat.

SPEAKER_01 28:24

You did ruin Christmas.

SPEAKER_00 28:26

There were two things from Trump, so well, three things in Trump so that stand out. First, my wife uh did a 10-kilometer run, and it's very tough. It's freezing cold, it's it's not easy, it's extremely hilly and very windy. And we were heading back, we were at the seven-kilometer mark into the 10. I was running beside her, and she was really struggling, and I was trying to give her all the husband positive vibes, and none of that was really working. This one lady uh came out and saw my wife coming up, and I guess she was really struggling. She suddenly like looks at us and waves her arms and waves us over and pulls into her purse. She pulled out bars of chocolate to give to my wife to get her going. I thought, what kindness! Isn't this wonderful? I mean, this is what it's all about.

SPEAKER_01 29:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:14

Then when I did my race, there were points when it was so cold and the wind was so bitter, we were running uh, because it's between the mountains and the glaciers. I mean, it's it's a very brutal race. But we were running on what was an old airport strip, so we were right out in the open. And when we turned one corner and went into the wind, you could almost lean up against the wind and not move, and it would hold you up. That's how strong the wind was. And we're thinking, how are we going to get through this? Well, there were about 14 runners around me and different languages, different places of origin, all of that. We never conversed. We just automatically kind of molded all ourselves together and formed a phalanx, a triangle, and actually rotated the wind for each other and we helped each other out to get through that. And that that says so much about what our sport is really all about. You know, we're quite willing to take our time to help somebody else because that is more important to us.

SPEAKER_01 30:16

Yeah, that's really cool. Uh in a local running group many, many years ago, um, it was a bitter day like that and really windy. And only um, I think three guys and me showed up for the group run. And it was, as I say, it was super windy. And so we were just running single file and they were rotating who would be the lead, right? So everybody could catch a break, except they wouldn't let me lead because I was so short, I wasn't helping. So I was always in the back. I got the best. Uh you had the best, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:46

You can draft off of them.

SPEAKER_01 30:47

I I I drafted for a long time. So that was smart though for you guys.

Midnight Sun And Wind Phalanx

SPEAKER_00 30:52

I can tell you that the finish at Trump so, and and I always tell people never underestimate what could happen in a race. Because the guys who had surrounded me when we had them through it, they took off ahead of me. They were certainly far stronger runners than I was. Uh, this was 2018. But um when I was getting into the main town for the finish, you know, towards the finish line, I should explain that the finish line has the four about 400 yards prior to the finish is cordoned off uh with barriers so people can be hype, you know, the spectators can be behind the barriers as we run in. They have a huge jumbotron at the finish line that pictures the runners back about three-quarters of a kilometer back. So you can see people coming. All right. And Tromso has a population of about 40,000 people, a little more if you look at the outskirts. I think everybody was there because there's probably nothing else to do in Tromso. And it's also the middle of the night, and everybody is completely drunk.

unknown 31:57

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 31:57

Yeah, totally wiped out. So I'm running on my own. I'm really towards the back of the pack at this point. There's hardly anybody, there's like virtually nobody around me. And so they have my me pictured, I guess, I'm on the jumper trial with my name and number and my bib with the name. Anyway, these two young men, one's Paul and the other was John, they jump out of the crowd, and Paul, they're both quite intoxicated. They're, you know. And Paul goes, Are you the Joe? Okay, okay. Yeah, sure, I'm the Joe. Well, they started running beside me, pumping their fists in the air, yelling, Joe, Joe, Joe, Joe. I thought, okay, fine. You know, and I'm still plugging away. I'm just trying to try to get to the finish. Well, as we get to those barriers office, somebody came out to pull those two young men off the course because they can't run in. They managed to pull one of them, but not the other. Paul stayed with me. Um, the other one went to this to the sidewalk, started running along the sidewalk, screaming my name. Paul was still beside me, screaming my name, the crowd, because they're drunk and nothing else is happening. They start shouting shouting my name. So I'm running into the finish, the last 400 yards, with the crowd shouting my name.

SPEAKER_01 33:03

That is cool.

SPEAKER_00 33:05

I got to finish with my, you know, the two victory signs up at the top. Like I was the first place finisher. Greatest finish ever.

SPEAKER_01 33:13

I'm back. It was like so cool.

SPEAKER_00 33:15

I finished near the back, but it was like the most memorable finish I could have had.

SPEAKER_01 33:19

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 33:21

You never know. You never know what's going to happen. And that's the beauty of our sport, is that you know, you try to you know predict what's you can't predict what's going to happen. But you can make a point of, I always say make memories while you make miles. You can always have these moments that you're going to remember the rest of your life and make the point of enjoying them. They're great.

SPEAKER_01 33:41

So would you say that's your favorite race, or do you have a different favorite?

SPEAKER_00 33:45

Um, besides Boston, I have an affinity with Boston because of so many. I think my favorite race was the Madoc Marathon. It's run in France in Bordeaux. And it's run between the vineyard in the vineyards. Um, a lot of it's dirt roads and rocks, so it's not an easy course. Uh, you run between the vines. For our female uh listeners, there are no porta potties. Major issue, apparently.

SPEAKER_01 34:13

Apparently.

SPEAKER_00 34:15

Um, nevertheless, they stop at each one of the chateaus in Bordeaux. Um, and we're dressed in costume, it's all a fun party, it's all very upbeat. But at each of the chateaus, they serve water, they serve Gatorade, then they compete and serve their best wines and bread and cheese and oysters and baguettes and right. No. It is like a party. So what I was doing as I was making a point at each stop, I would take a tiny sip of wine, which I would feel it in the alcohol in a heartbeat. I am not a drinker to begin with, pretty much of a drinker, so it would hit me. Um yeah, but as soon as I started running, I'd burn it right off. But I thought at least I could say that I had something in every stop. So that was kind of cool.

SPEAKER_01 35:01

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Bordeaux Marathon Wine And Cutoffs

SPEAKER_00 35:06

Uh I got to the Chateau de Roschild, one of the two of them that are there, and I had a little sip. And I went, hmm, that's really good. Maybe I'll have another sip. I took a second sip. Wow, that's really good. I think I'll have the glass. Bang, I down the glass. I am now blissed. They're playing music, they're serving food, I'm dancing, I'm having a great time. Till I looked at my watch and I realized half an hour had gone by. Now, one of the things they do at the Madoc Marathon is they close up the finish line. Uh, they have a big wrought iron gate that they close exactly at six hours and 30 minutes. So if you get there at six hours, 30 minutes and one second, it's like you didn't even run on the course. You're not even concluded. Because otherwise we spend the whole time on the course drinking, actually. So I'm at the 37 kilometer mark, knowing I'm heading towards the 42 kilometer mark. I looked at my watch and I realized I really goofed up at the Chateau de Rostschild. I am in trouble. I have got to run like almost my best 5k pace to have a shot at finishing on time. So I did the usual calculations we guys do when we're running. And I thought, okay, if I push really hard, if something happens, I'm meeting Jill at kilometer 41. So if I drop dead, someone can run, can basically identify the body. So I was ready for that. Anyway, I'm running. Jill sees me at kilometer 41. She knows the time is tight. So she starts running ahead of me. We come down this one little hill, and I see the big red arch balloon for the finish. And they're deflating it. I thought, oh God, Jill's running. Wait, wait, you know, I'm running as hard as I can. I just get my head underneath that balloon and I stop, throw both fist pumps into the air and yell, I made it, I made it. Until my wife kindly came over, lovingly smiled at me, patted my shoulder, and said, Sweetheart, the finish line's 400 yards down that way.

unknown 37:16

No.

SPEAKER_00 37:17

I have to pick myself up somehow. I was stiff as a you can imagine you know from the race, how stiff.

SPEAKER_01 37:30

Well, at least you made it. I've been holding my breath now.

SPEAKER_00 37:34

They give you a beautiful Yves Saint-Laurent style backpack. Inside is a hand-carved wine box. And when you slide open the wine box, it was a 2010 vintage porteau.

SPEAKER_01 37:44

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 37:45

Which was the second best bling I've ever seen. Second best. The best bling actually was my wife received. In 2015, my wife ran the Nike Woman's Half Marathon in San Francisco. All hills, pure hell. But uh, I love her, give her credit. She managed to get herself through it and finish it. And when you finish, you don't get a medal.

SPEAKER_01 38:13

What do you get?

SPEAKER_00 38:14

There's a fireman dressed in a tuxedo that hands you, takes out a blue bag, and inside the blue bag is a blue box with the word Tiffany on it, and inside is a specially designed Tiffany necklace. Wow. Now apparently my wife was complaining that the fireman wore a shirt. Don't get that, but okay, you know. But that Tiffany necklace was like the coolest thing ever.

SPEAKER_01 38:37

Agree. Yes, I would love one of those. We should get a choice for the women. We should get a choice of a metal or a Tiffany at every I think that would be only fair.

SPEAKER_00 38:45

I mean, she did a Tiffany run one other time in the on the Toronto Island, but then they stopped doing those runs. So of course. That was definitely the best bling, without a question.

SPEAKER_01 38:55

Yeah, wow. But I don't know. That's a that's a a pretty uh sweet uh bling that you got at that. I I am so excited that you made it across that finish line because I was I literally was holding my breath thinking oh.

SPEAKER_00 39:06

I was too, it was tight. It was well when we finished, I was so, I will tell you, Kylie, I was so spaced out because I had given everything. And we had taken a bus over um part of uh tour company, marathon tours. And I just told Jill, I said, you have to bring the bus over here. I can't walk to the bus. And she had my Diet Coke, which is my beverage of choice. I will confess to you, a little side note, every of the 50 marathons I've run, I have had a Coke or a Diet Coke during the race.

SPEAKER_01 39:39

Oh, wow.

SPEAKER_00 39:40

It has no nutritional value, there's really no benefit. It just became a habit that I kept doing, and it just carried all the way through, just for the fun of it.

SPEAKER_01 39:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:50

Anyway, she had my Diet Coke and something to eat. Um, after I had a little something, I calmed it down. She says, If you have, if I have to get the bus over here to come over here to pick you up, I'm taking you to the medical tent first. So that was enough to get me a little more lucid, and I managed to stagger back to the bus, what was left of me. But it was challenging.

SPEAKER_01 40:12

Yeah, yeah. I like her though. I think good for her for when you think about that.

SPEAKER_00 40:17

Yeah, yeah. She's she's yeah, she's everything. So and by the way, I I tell her that a lot of she doesn't like traveling. All right, once she's out of place, she's okay. But the packing and the flying and the whole nine yards, real pain. And she just hates it with a passion. But I tell her that, and we've been traveling all over the world, from Maui to Berlin to Tromso to Bermuda to Jamaica, and it's all her fault.

SPEAKER_01 40:43

Of course it is.

SPEAKER_00 40:44

Because when we got married, uh I let her choose the wedding song. She chose I Will Show You the World from Aladdin, very romantic, which I'm fine with, but we're both lawyers. So I wrote the fine print while doing races. So it's her fault.

SPEAKER_01 41:05

I yes, absolutely. Um so were you last in that Norway race, or was there somebody?

Best Bling And Tiffany Tales

SPEAKER_00 41:12

No, there were still there were still a lot of people behind me. It just that the uh the best last place finish I had um was in just after my cancer. Um they ran a race in Ottawa, Canada during in February. They're called the Winterman Races, which they normally run on the parkway in Ottawa, which is cleared off. It's cold, it's bitter, but it's it's dual, it's doable. That particular year we had a convoy protest in downtown Ottawa that nobody knew how to handle. Consequently, they couldn't hold the races at the normal location. So at the last minute, they changed the location from downtown on regular roads to the military cemetery. Because there was a 5k loop going through the cemetery that would have any of that. They can do as loops to fulfill the requirement. Well, you know, we're runners will adapt to whatever environment you put us in. But that morning a blizzard decided to come racing into the city. So the roads were all ice, they weren't able to, you know, uh change that. The wind chill was like as low as below minus 20 to minus 30. So you use glide as your method of stopping frostbite. They couldn't even pour water at the turnaround point because they would pour it into the cup and it would freeze. So they gave up on that. Anyway, so I ran the race. Uh I'm coming in and I realize there's nobody else, I don't see any, I don't see any other runners around me. I was absolutely dead last. There is a picture of me finishing, which they wound up using in Prevention Magazine when they did the article on me. Um, you know, looking like I was I was feeling great. I really wasn't, but you know, try to try to look good for the finished picture. Because the biggest problem we have with finishing pictures is the tendency at the finish to look down at our watch. I have far too many pictures of me looking at my garment. So I did have the good finishing picture, but when I finished, uh, I realized I was dead last in the race. And I staggered into the tent where they had a heater and the really bad old oatmeal cookie. And I saw the race director, and I said, I'm sure you're glad I'm here because you can get the heck out of here and go home. He says, Well, actually, Joe, uh, you won the gold. I said, What do you mean? I said, in your age category, but old guy's age category. He said, Everybody else dropped out because of the weather. You're the last one standing.

unknown 43:52

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 43:53

So I was first and last in the same race. That will not happen again.

SPEAKER_01 44:00

So, like first overall or just first in your age group. Age group. Oh, okay, okay.

Winterman Blizzard: First And Last

SPEAKER_00 44:05

It's been a long time since I've I I I've been I podied them in um in ready marathons back in the 80s. That was a different time. But that was a different body, and and I don't regret you know not being able to do anything like that anymore. I'm very elated that I can still run, I can still compete. Uh, I just did the 5K and the half marathon on Baton Rouge last weekend.

SPEAKER_01 44:26

Nice.

SPEAKER_00 44:27

Weekend, I'm sorry, 10 days ago. Um, so you know, uh the fact that I can still run, still do these these races, dilute half marathons, still delete five and ten K's, and goofball around. Um One of my favorite goofball runs that we have up north, we have that in Perth, Ontario. And actually, I um was part of the world setting the world record with that. Because they decided one year to see how many runners they could get compared to every other Perth city in the world, Perth, Australia, Perth Canada, Scotland, Perth US, how many runners they could have running a five-mile race in a uh a Scottish kilt. Okay. So they had over 3,600 runners that were able to actually run that race in kilts.

SPEAKER_01 45:18

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 45:19

Now, of those 3,600, they picked 50 women and 50 men, the really nerdiest of the nerds, to go out there and run with the shield and the sword and the brave hard paint. I was one of those.

SPEAKER_01 45:32

Oh, that's awesome.

SPEAKER_00 45:34

Because you gotta have fun. You just have to have fun. You know, and that's that's the whole idea behind this, is to have, you know, I mean, it really get the fun out of it and appreciate that.

SPEAKER_01 45:43

Yeah, because if you're not having fun, what's the point?

SPEAKER_00 45:46

There isn't. There isn't. You know, runners are one in general. Um, when I ran the marathon in Rome, uh, which has a lot of cobblestones. Cobblestones and I do not get along well, just like tree trunks. Uh, and I went flying at one point on one of the cobblestones, as many other people have. But immediately, you know, about 10 runners came over to where I was after I fell to make sure I was okay to get me up. Somebody had wipes to get the blood off. So they stopped their race, their personal time, whatever they were looking at, their pace or whatever, to help a runner. What sport does that? It's wonderful.

unknown 46:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 46:26

You know, there's such great people that we see uh all the time. In almost every race I go into, there's always people of that nature. And it's it's a wonderful, very inclusive community. Um, there's there's more inclusive we can do. I mean, you know, we've come a long way since Bobby Gibbs in 1967 and Kathleen, Switzer, but um, you know, we're getting there. At least we have the idea this is where we want to go. And it's terrific to see that in races now to see such a multicultural, multidiverse group to go out and run.

SPEAKER_01 46:59

Agreed, yes. So tell me about uh the cool runnings that I see on your shirt.

Kilts, Community, And Having Fun

SPEAKER_00 47:05

Yeah, that started off. Uh there's two sayings that I have make memories while you make miles. So I'm known for that. Cool running started in Jamaica because I ran the reggae marathon in Jamaica. Cool runnings mon, you know. I knew John Candy from way, way back. So there's a there's a correlation there. And Catherine will hear me, she rests in peace. Me, her memory be a blessing. I knew her. Um, but there's one point in the race we you tend to congregate into groups in in marathons quite often if you get to know the people around you. And some advice I always give runners towards the back part, because the funds really is at the back of the bus. Take the time to know some of the people around you because you have great running partners during the race that'll keep you going. You know, so we had a small group that were running, and we were cresting over one hill, and I should explain they this was run in the grill in Jamaica, where they closed off all the main roads. So the taxi cabs that were out that normally would be doing their fairs were not able to get out. So they park on the side of the road, pull out their boom boxes, play play some really incredible Bob Marley music that would get you, and they sit on their hoods and they would smoke gange. So we're heading up and we're heading up over this hill, and there's she this girl goes, I can't believe there's still mist this late in the morning. It wasn't mist, and it smelled very sweet. So that's when I started joking around. I said, just inhale deeply and we'll have cool runnings, mom. Cool runnings, and that started cool runnings Joe, and that's where the whole thing started.

SPEAKER_01 48:45

Gotcha. Good to know. I love it.

SPEAKER_00 48:48

So that's trademarked, you know, when we did that. So um, it's just something I've again is it's to remember and remind myself sometimes about the fun that we have, even when we're struggling, even when sometimes the runs aren't the best, just to enjoy you know from our runs together about my really weird, wacky sense of humor and the odd joke now and then that's always gonna come out. Love it, though. Because you've got to have fun with it, you've got to enjoy it. You know, and I enjoy it as much at 71 years old as I did at 27 years old. My abilities are different, you know, all that. But my motive, my reasons for being there really hasn't changed.

SPEAKER_01 49:32

Yeah, that's so great. You know, it's funny that um you say that as we run together, so uh we all, all the coaches go, huh, Joe's not here. And we'll go, that's weird that Joe's not here. We missed Joe's jokes. And it's like if we say your name three times.

SPEAKER_00 49:49

You know.

SPEAKER_01 49:50

Yeah, that that week I was in um northern Michigan and Kelly was on the mic and and she said it like three times, and then you showed up and we kind of laughed. And so I text that's when I texted in, oh, you said his name three times. And sure enough, the other morning when I was coaching, the same thing happened. I said, Oh, Joe's not here. And then sure enough, you popped in.

SPEAKER_00 50:09

So every once in a while, yeah. It's been crazy going back and forth. Um, my wife had to have a minor operation, so that took me away from it a little bit. Um, but yeah, I'll keep showing up. You know, every once in a while I'll just pop I'll just pop on.

SPEAKER_01 50:23

Yeah, we love it. We love it when you show up and tell us dad jokes.

SPEAKER_00 50:26

Oh, there's always there's there's always dad jokes. There's always bad jokes.

SPEAKER_01 50:31

Was that dad or bad or both?

SPEAKER_00 50:33

Both. It's gonna be a common, it's gonna be a combination. You know?

unknown 50:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 50:38

And again, I'm a long-distance runner, I'm not a sprinter.

SPEAKER_01 50:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 50:42

You know, and you know, sprinters, um, they have they they don't really have long careers. Well, that's because sprinters are only in it for the short run.

SPEAKER_01 50:51

There you go.

SPEAKER_00 50:52

Okay, so I got one in today.

SPEAKER_01 50:54

Indeed. Oh, is there anything that I haven't asked you about that you would like to have shared on the podcast?

Global Kindness: Rome And Beyond

SPEAKER_00 51:04

That's a good question. I I guess mostly it's to advise runners, whether they're older runners in particular, but runners in general, to take the time to really enjoy their races and joy and get to meet the people. Runners are wonderful in terms of being able to communicate to you, to being friendly, you know, constantly friendly. You can learn so much from other people. You see the kindness and goodness in them. And think about sometimes at the start of a race when you're just hanging around waiting for the start to go, talk to the people around you, because they we we all have common interests. And it's amazing how much we we have in common. And that doesn't mean just in North America. In any of the races I've done around the world, you find the same thing is that people are really very warm and welcoming and understanding and caring. Um, and I've seen compassion even during a race. In that same Rome Marathon where I had taken this flip, I was almost towards the finish part, and I was running beside this one lovely lady from South Africa, and we had passed this young girl, and the lady I was with looked at me and she's in a very heavy South African accent, but said, The girl we just passed, she's not looking very good. She's she seems pale. It was a very hot day. She's, I don't mind if I still don't run with you anymore because I want to make sure she's all right. So the two of us turned around, went back to make sure she was okay. And I think this young lady was somewhat dehydrated, normal situation. And uh, I grabbed her flask, which was empty. So there was a there were aqueducts nearby, so I can grab water. My friend from South Africa had salt pills to give her. And the three of us wound up running in together, chatting the entire time. And the finish of the Rome race is kind of cool if you ever watch it. They have gladiators at the finish with huge long, long swords that they cross over and actually provide a sort of a tunnel to run under to get to the finish line, which is really awesome.

unknown 53:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 53:11

But for the three of us to run in together after that, that was a great experience. Yet, had we not talked to this young lady from South Africa, had we not stopped to help somebody else out, I would have missed out on a lifetime memory. So if I was going to give advice to people, is take the time to get to know everybody else around you. They're wonderful people, and you can really expand your own horizons with that. You know, enjoy every minute because it's priceless.

SPEAKER_01 53:41

Absolutely. Great advice. Well, Joe, thank you so much for being on the show. I think um I'll probably have to have you on again because you're gonna have so many more experiences because you are just a traveling running guy. Um, but yeah, thank you so much for being here. We've really appreciated your time.

SPEAKER_00 54:00

Oh, it's my pleasure, Carl. It's a pleasure running with you on the air when we do that. Yeah, that's always great. And this show is I've listened to a number of your podcasts on the show, which are fabulous.

SPEAKER_01 54:10

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 54:10

You know, so um, and for those out there who think that they don't need a coach, uh Jeff Galloway's been my coach for forever. So I've been fortunate with that. But I will say that even if you are a great runner or if you're just um an average runner, or I can say average Joe, because there's actually an average Joe race, I won it won my age category. So I actually have a medal that says number one average Joe, which is so true. I am so average. Um, but having a good coach, even to just provide some background and even to provide enthusiasm, even to get you over the humps, because there's always the tough parts of training to get into what you need for course, to get into when you need to do tempos, that is so crucial to the not just the success of your race. People always think, I want to get a coach so I can do well in London or do well in the Disney race. But it's really for your whole lifestyle that coach will bring you through because you want to be able to run into your 70s and 80s. You know, I intend to run till I drop.

SPEAKER_01 55:15

Same.

SPEAKER_00 55:16

You know, so and the way to do it is to be it's to be smart about it and have a good attitude and enjoy and love the lifestyle. And always say, make memories. There's so many great memories.

SPEAKER_01 55:27

Many great memories. And and thank you for sharing yours. Yours are, I gotta be, I gotta do better.

Cool Runnings Origin Story

SPEAKER_00 55:34

Well, I I I always, you know, shyness is never one thing that that I've been accused of. Um, but I've always jumped into opportunities because opportunities, and this is true with racism, it's true, I think, in life in general. Opportunities don't come around a second time. And when you have a chance to do something, if the if there's not something monumental that's stopping you, which you know, health can, family members, work, other things can do it. You know, don't say, I'll do it at some other time. And even if you don't think you're gonna do well, there are things I'm terrible at. Don't ever go sailing with me, you'll never come back. Don't put me on a horse because let me tell you, that horse is does not like me, I can tell you right now. But I've tried mountain route, I've done mountain climbing, I've done river rafting, I've actually gone out into the stratosphere, super diving. So many opportunities came up that you would try. And even if you're clutzy at it and not great, the experience is definitely worth it. And for running, when you're out there on the course, enjoy every minute, enjoy the people around, look around you, take the time to really understand where you are, what you're doing, because it's a wonderful sport with wonderful people, and in a time that everything around us seems like chaos, it's the one area that we can find solace in.

SPEAKER_01 56:52

Agreed. Finer words were never spoken, sir. Thank you again.

SPEAKER_00 56:57

My pleasure, Carla, always.

SPEAKER_01 56:59

All right, bye bye now.

SPEAKER_00 57:00

Bye now. Take care. Have cool runnings.

SPEAKER_01 57:04

Cool runnings.

SPEAKER_00 57:05

Cool runnings.