EP #90 - Sam McGowan - Muay Thai Fighter & Ex Infantryman

What an absolute banger of a guest to start the new year! I had Sam McGowan, who is a Muay Thai fighter and an ex-Infantryman, who came and shared some wild yarns. We talked about his experience in Thailand and training out of Bangtao, his crazy experiences while being in the military, his last wild 6 months, geopolitics, and much more! 

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https://www.instagram.com/_sammcgowan/

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Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

And I'm here with Sam McGowan, my Thai fighter, ex-infantryman from the military. How are we going, dude?

SPEAKER_01 0:08

Yeah, yeah, not too bad. Not too bad.

SPEAKER_02 0:09

Hell yeah, bro. So I've uh I did a bit of a deep dive on your on your profiles and that. And uh, man, I was as we were talking about before, you've you've lived a lot of lives.

SPEAKER_01 0:18

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 0:20

You lived a lot of lives. A lot of dad. And um I think it's like it's always quite unique when uh I don't know how many people transition from the military into fighting. I mean, I know there's a the most famous one I can think of is like BSD from um UFC. Yeah, yeah. But I know there's probably a couple, but does it happen often? Do you dream other people who you went to military with or you met people who then transitioned into the sports?

SPEAKER_01 0:43

Yeah, like a lot of people do like leave the military and it's they're and they're attracted to combat sports, like, because you just spend like your whole life in the military. Well, like not your whole life, but a a large part of it, and then um they indoctrinate you with like that combat mindset, and it's like kind of hard to let it go. So a lot of I know a lot of people who leave the military, either they get a missus or they do combat sports, but like I I just like stuck to it. But I was do I was also fighting well when I was in the military, but not as often as I was now just just because of uh like training exercises and whatnot. The army had me just doing whatnot, whatever.

SPEAKER_02 1:22

You used to fight before the military as well. You had a you had to fight.

SPEAKER_01 1:26

Yeah, one I had my first fight like literally three months before I left, or maybe a month before I left for the military. Um and I was like 20 or 21. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:38

What was your I did hear on that bladency podcast said you you wanted to join the military because of your father, is that right?

SPEAKER_01 1:44

Your dad Yeah, yeah, my dad was military, yeah, and you wanted to do that as well. Yeah, uh I don't yeah, yeah. Yeah, I'll just say that.

SPEAKER_02 1:53

Yeah, but that's um but just to go over like your experience, because you've done a like a I don't know your the whole fight record, but um you won your first spell at Lights Out fight series, became an NZ champ.

SPEAKER_01 2:06

Yeah, yeah, that was last year.

SPEAKER_02 2:07

That was last year, right? And then uh you moved to Thailand in June, yeah, and then you won your first pro Thailand, uh your first fight in Thailand by knockout at the um Banglass Stadium. Yeah, yeah. Fuck man. Fought on 24 hour nose a month later and won second round by a KO in your next fight. Yeah, yeah. And then um you did heaps of other crazy stuff. I was like looking at I was like, what this done has done more in like six months than having five years. He's like charity work, you did some charity work in Cambodia, you raised money for um a tuk-tuk driver, yeah, and then um and then you won your second title on national Thai TV, bro. Yeah, well done. Cheers. Cheers, right? Yeah, damn, and then come back to New Zealand is like so slow. Yeah. That must be something else, I suppose, after you you such a whirlwind six months of life really fast, and then coming back, and then it's just like New Zealand speed, which is uh quite slow.

SPEAKER_01 3:00

Everyone everyone will always say, like, oh, that must have been like sh like time must have flew by for you when you're there, but like when you're like experiencing it, because every day is new, so it doesn't actually feel like in the moment it doesn't feel like um it's going slow, but until it's done, and then you're like, wow, fuck. That was last day, but yeah. Like in the moment, you're like, every day is new, you're doing something crazy, you got like side quiz on side quiz, right? You're training Muay Thai, doing whatever it's made. Were you training every day? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Always. What was the gym? Twice a day.

SPEAKER_02 3:32

What was the gym you're at?

SPEAKER_01 3:33

So I was at um Bang Tao Muay Thai and MMA in Phuket. Uh shout out Frank. Um, he's the owner. Uh connections were syndicate boxing and Frank Hickman, but I was in the Muay Thai team and I was getting trained. Because uh when you're over in Thailand, like the because labour's so cheap there, they can like hire heaps of people. Like the they had their own Muay Thai team and they had like maybe 10 or 12 like Muay Thai coaches. And yeah, and that so like if you show up into like a Thai gym or whatever, a lot of the time like a Thai will just attach himself to like a a fighter. And I was thankfully like uh I got uh Yold Witcher Pumbas that he attached himself to me and I was like, oh you know what mean because he's like a goat, he's a bit he's a bit sand shy, super blonde, oh wow non uh yeah yeah yeah sand shy. He'd been on when he was 17.

SPEAKER_02 4:27

Wow, yeah, and he was he was he was your mentor and covered. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:31

Oh dude, like yeah, the only problem thing, the only problem was uh he like barely spoke English.

SPEAKER_03 4:37

Oh bro.

SPEAKER_01 4:38

So a lot of the time when he's like training me, he'll like he'll hawk over me when I'm sparring and he would have like a paddle or something, and it'd just be like because I have like a real CKB style, my hand was out there, yeah, yeah. And a lot of people at the gym now have like noticed that my my stance is like completely changed, but like that's because he was like smacking my hand bro every time I'd be like trying to faint or whatever, he's like, No, no, no, you not do, you not do, you not do, and I'm like, okay, please don't and Muay Thai, because I know that they you put the hands up here, but a lot of people do that.

SPEAKER_02 5:08

Is it in because I've with the CKB, I guess in New Zealand and Australia, if you're not doing specifically Muay Thai, it's kickboxing, right? Yeah, yeah. So you want that. But in Muay Thai it's different, it's like the close combat.

SPEAKER_01 5:18

Like I said, if you so the difference is because in kickboxing and muay thai, if you keep your hand out like like that, you go for the kick. In Muay Thai, if you like punch someone over the top, like over the top, you can almost always get a right elbow right after, and elbows are so like viciously dangerous. And like um Muay Thai is just like you you you want to do more vicious strikes like knees and elbows, like they're the most and they score more as well in the judging sure same with kicks as well. But um, yeah, if you're like that, like you're almost guaranteed for like a an album elbows, yeah. You do not you do not want to get out of here. You had to unlearn some things. Um or just that mainly. I just put I didn't unlearn it, I just put it in the vault.

SPEAKER_02 6:04

I see.

SPEAKER_01 6:05

That's what I do, right? I I'll whip it out, I'll whip it out every now and then. Like when the coaches ain't looking, I'll be like, oh shit, yeah. Paint them out and discombobulate them. Yeah, but like once they start looking at me, you know, I'll be like, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 6:21

Nice. Um, yeah, so like I I I just had a thought as well, like, because uh you're saying that some of the things you learn CKB may not apply when you're in trading Muay Thai. I remember um and the points as well, the Muay Thai points. I actually didn't know that the punches don't count for that much.

SPEAKER_01 6:35

No, no, the knees, the elbows, and um and kicks count. So in uh in Thailand, the whole entire scoring system's different. So we score in Wisdom uh kickboxing, kickboxing Muay Thai, we score per round, but the the Thai score the whole entire fight. So I had f uh like a five-round fight, and the uh most important rounds is are the third and the fourth. And um, yeah, punches, like the judges don't even care, like because uh like you can smack someone's head back, but if you're not knocking them out, like it doesn't it doesn't look too good to them and they are whatever they they so the judges they look more at like control and and your like composure, you like you you can't like if you look like you're getting hurt, like that's why you always see like uh like ties, I'll be like, nah, it doesn't hurt because it's that they're just showing the judges like no nah nah. I'm fine. His technique is shit. My technique should be able to look at this, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 7:30

I see, yeah, yeah. Because if you shit no, obviously showing you hurt, but then that's interesting with the punches. I know in um uh Sambo punches don't mean much either. Yeah, that's obvious my MMA, kind of like a Russian style MMA, I think. But that's another sport where like the punching actually doesn't get you any points, you can do it, but yeah, the takedowns and whatever mean more. Interesting. I didn't know that. Maybe they'll end like a mean hook and it's just like uh yeah, yeah, because there's like a lot of energy behind it, and just like uh fuck, alright. Yeah, so you were learning more to throw more knees and elbows when you were there and like better at that?

SPEAKER_01 8:03

Almost like no punches, and I'm like uh back in back here in New Zealand.

SPEAKER_02 8:07

You do boxing, like you like, like I'm known as punching, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:10

I'm known as uh more of a puncher. Like everyone's like, Oh yeah, Sam Reality's got like good boxing, but then I had to like kind of put it put that in the vault, and then I had to learn all these other techniques. But like now that I'm back at CKB and I'm like testing it with the boys, and I'm like mix brought it back out of the vault and trying to mix it, find a find a new style here. Yeah, yeah, it's been fun. It's like that's cool, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 8:33

Uh that's cool. What about um like uh because it might tie as well as all the clinching? So did you just obviously because you put down heaps of clinching, but was there anything new you learned when you were training there compared to out here?

SPEAKER_01 8:43

So Yodwitch uh he's a Moy Cow fighter, which is a clinch fighter, and that he that's exactly how he beat Sanchai. He was like literally hopping on one leg with his hands up and and then engaging into a clinch with Sanchai, and he just broke him down in five rounds with by clinching him. Damn. Yeah, and he's clinching. Basically, he's I think he's got I don't know how many knockouts, but it's like probably over 80 knockouts with knees. That's fine. How old is this guy? He's younger than me, he's 28.

SPEAKER_03 9:14

Starting at the age of five or something.

SPEAKER_01 9:16

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Exactly. He started very young. Um because he doesn't even fight anymore, and like as crack up as because like he's retired at 28. He had a fight last year, okay, and he's like retired, but he came out of camp and he only trained for like two weeks, and then he f got flown to China, and then he knocked out a dude and won a world title. And Bo, he doesn't train, like he might like fuck around on some pads here and there, but like even after like the morning sessions, you just see him like because there's like a smoker pit next to um like the Moy Thai section at Bang Tao.

SPEAKER_03 9:51

Yeah, and like all the Thai trains are just go there like start smoking or vaping, and the bo is just like fucking go there like baby, and I'm like, man, and he's just like just when I will tired, he's like coming back like smoking a babe, and I'm like, bro.

SPEAKER_02 10:09

It's such a contradiction to what we learn. It's like diet, no smoking, no drinking, but that's just natural day out the wound, bro.

SPEAKER_01 10:18

Just fucking void, right? So they're just so good at it, just clinching out the wound, just nonchalant, like oh yeah, whatever. I'll train two weeks and beat this guy out, knock this dude out. Yeah, shit.

SPEAKER_02 10:28

Yeah, that's wild, dude. Wow, yeah, that's um yeah, that's that that that do be fucking doobie out there. Um one thing I want to ask you about, and I had to look at the photo of uh you, you got a crazy back tattoo. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So what so what what's the story there? And this episode is sponsored by me. Do you struggle with sleeping and particularly struggle with light and sound while sleeping? I think it's time you get the sleep that you deserve. My business, Infinity Sleep, specializes in sleep well-being products to enhance your sleep quality. I've been using sleep masks and airplugs for the past three years to help improve my sleep, and I'm so stoked to finally have ones that have been created for my own sleeping needs. If you would like to learn more about my business, InfinitySleep, please visit our website, www.infinitysleep.co.nz. By making a purchase, you are directly not only supporting a local Yiwi business, but also this podcast. Use the promo code only scotfifteen percent and receive fifteen percent off your first order. Go to www.infinitysleep.co dot nz to get the sleep that you deserve.

SPEAKER_01 11:33

Because I'm half I'm half Cambodian, so um I thought uh a lot of like you'll see like all over the internet, a lot of like Thai boxer, more Thai fighters, mostly Westerners nowadays though, but um they all get like their whole back tattooed security. It is actually it's like uh it's Travada Buddhism, but um like the they're like you get like a monk to enchant it, and that they're actually like it's meant to give you like more authority, more power, it's meant to strengthen you, give you good luck good luck for the rest of your life. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Basically it's like it's kind of like playing a fallout game, and then you get an item and it's like plus five and but you like get like a tattoo and it's like plus five this plus five of that.

SPEAKER_02 12:15

You have to talk to the month be like, bro, I want better elbows, like something like that.

SPEAKER_01 12:20

But yeah. Um I got got it done in Camboda because I'll because this is um it's old Pali Sanskrit, so it's not it's not actually second tattoos, it's not actually Thai, it's not um, it's not like uh it's all it's the language that they used to speak in the era 2,000 years ago, Sanskrit, Pali Sanskrit. Okay, um old Khmer, um yeah crazy. But um I went to the temple, like the ancient temples in Ankhowat. Uh I think Ankhot was built in like the 12th century, but it's got the same um script writing that's tattooed on my back, like the same language. So I was like, oh that's that's cool. Because I got the tattoo, and then I went there and I was like, oh yo, that's cool, bro.

SPEAKER_02 13:03

That's interesting. Yeah, it's like um, yeah. I I remember when I was in uh Taiwan, um, they have the uh you heard of Taoism? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, so and there's so they have a lot of different gods, and um has one god uh there's like the god of brotherhood or something. So you just remind me that because there's nine gods, eh? Um I can't remember how many, but I just remembered that um like all the like guys, I think fighters and guys and gangs and stuff, you don't get that tattoo because it's too powerful. It's quite interesting.

SPEAKER_01 13:29

I don't know if there's something within the same same sort of thing within the I don't know if you saw my Instagram, but you saw that video of people like putting swords through their like cheeks. I didn't see that one. Oh, so there's like this festival in Phuket. I'm boosting around on my scooter doing you know, side questing, and then um I just like boost past this road and I see these five guys sitting in a chair, and they've like pissed their cheeks and put like swords through it, and they're just like sitting there on the side of the road, like doing this, and like one dude's like put all these needles through his arms, and they're all like just like like just self-mutilating, or not self-mutilating, they're getting the bros to like push it in. And I'm like, what the fuck's going on here? Pull up my scooter, and then I like saw a white guy who had like a camera, and I was like, What's going on here, mate? He was like, Oh, he's like, Oh, this is the um, it's called the vegetarian festival. Okay, um, I I chat GBT'd it because I was like, What's going on here? But apparently 200 years ago, there was like a towel tells them, like I don't know what it was, but he there was like a plague happening there or something. Right. And apparently like self-harmed himself or something, or any and he didn't eat any meat for like nine days, and um, and apparently the plague went away, so now that they've been doing it for like 200 years, and like the whole entire city of Pukit is all like all the there's because it's there's heaps of like tower shrines everywhere, and they're all doing this shit. And I was like, what the fuck? But um, I was like, uh I was like to the bro, I was like, have you gone in there? And he was like, No, no, no. I was like, oh white dude, and I'm like, I'll go in there because I look tired. You'll be alright, yeah. So I did.

SPEAKER_03 15:05

I walk in there like, oh my Sonicup, Sonicup, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:09

So they let me in, bro. I I went into the shrine and they're doing a full-on ritual, and this girl, like, she just starts freaking out and starts screaming, bro, and like goes up to the shrine and just starts banging on it, like looking at like these instant scandals and like all these fucking um statues of like their gods. Drop possessed or something, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then and then once once they got possessed, that's when they just started like getting like uh like shit like put through their cheeks and just crazy shit. So are these people sick? That's not no they're not. No, they just apparently so I I looked deeper and um the they they actually looked at as like the people that are going through this ritual, they're actually looked at us as like heroes because apparently um the self-harm um they gain merit for um the community and they're like ridding the sin of the community community, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 16:04

Interesting. So they're like all the sins of the community becomes they bear it.

SPEAKER_01 16:09

Yeah, yeah, and then they just like do the ritual and like yeah, and like and like kind of like gets rid of like the bad yeah, bad UJ but yeah, I was like, man, I love this country, this is crazy.

SPEAKER_02 16:22

All the superstitions are so crazy, yeah, yeah. I I mean haven't been to Thailand, I've been to Bali and um I don't know too much, but um my missus is Taiwanese and I was in Taiwan, they've got heaps of superstitions as well. But one of the things they do there in Towsia, they possess like the gods will possess them, but it's really popular amongst gangs.

SPEAKER_01 16:39

Yeah, yeah. It's really out of it looked like most of the dudes are getting like like swords through their cheeks. They look like gang members.

SPEAKER_02 16:47

Yeah, it's like it must be uh some kind of yet like rite of passage, sack like you sacrifice yourself for the greater good of your community or the gang or something. That's such a crazy way to do things, but again, like yeah, coming from little old New Zealand, we're just like, oh what the fuck? Yeah, exactly. We don't um all right, sweet. Um I would like to talk to you about um something with the military. So you joined in 2017?

SPEAKER_01 17:11

Yeah, yeah, at the start. From the start.

SPEAKER_02 17:13

So you what, six, six months basic training, is it?

SPEAKER_01 17:16

Uh six months basic training. This is actually ages ago, so I need to Yeah, you've got to remember. I've done I've done eapes, I've done eaps. I think this was yeah, it's like nine years ago I joined the military. But um, yeah, so six months basic training, and then you do three months after that combat core training. But like basically your whole year, you're just you're working all weekends and whatnot. It's pretty full on.

SPEAKER_02 17:38

Yeah. So then after that, you did a year of training, maybe like a year, yeah. And then a few years later you had COVID. And then did you where are you doing the Uber Eats and the hotels and stuff?

SPEAKER_01 17:47

Nah, nah. So I you managed you out of it? Yeah, I I managed to get out of all of it because I was um training for fights at the time. And I'd always be like, nah, I need to be close to the Muay Tai Jim and like um smart. Because like I was saying, uh like I was saying to you before, like uh the military is just like pro-combat and like pro-combat sports, so they're like when I was like training for fights and whatnot, a lot of a lot of the hierarchy would be like, oh yeah, let McG my nickname was McGee, oh let McGee like go about his day. And I was like, Yeah, I never I never had to do one, but all the other boys had to do them.

SPEAKER_02 18:21

Yeah, because I was thinking like I was like in my head, like, man, like yeah, I'm gonna go with the RV door for training, and then I'm just at a hotel giving out Uber.

SPEAKER_01 18:28

Yeah, yeah, but that is yeah, but I was like, I was like, I'm not doing that shit, man. I'm not here to. But the boys were getting paid more as well when they were doing it.

SPEAKER_02 18:39

So some of them because it's COVID, right? So you're the risk of making it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Get like deployment pay, but fuck, it wasn't a deployment.

SPEAKER_01 18:47

It was glorified to look over here, drive. We did um when that outbreak happened in Auckland, we and we had the cordon off um Auckland, which is like just put block off all the roads, and like that was pretty funny. But we were like working with the police, and like we're all like infantry soldiers, and we're like basically between the ages of like 20 to like 23, immature, like guys working with the police, and the cars are always just looking at us like what the fuck are these guys up to?

SPEAKER_02 19:15

Because the military is such a different, there's such a different purpose, you guys. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:19

You know the movies, you know, like they're they're immature, but it's funny, it's funny. It's the boys being the boys, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 19:25

Yeah. So no like little squabbles between the police and the military, or guys alright?

SPEAKER_01 19:30

Nah, we had um I don't get pissed off at the cops once because um there was a dude, we we put a cordon off, um, and the dude lived just like 50 meters down from the cordon, and the cop wasn't letting him through. And we're like, bro, just let him through, man. And then um he like the cop did more um like investigation and whatnot and found out he was a disqualified driver and he was with his missus, and he was like, No, you're not allowed to drive, you're not allowed to drive. Um and then he was like, bro, we just like live down there, and then and then um the cop made his missus drive the 50 meters, and they swap swapped around, bro. And the chick was like, No, I don't know how to, like, I don't like I'm not comfortable driving his car, but and the chick just fell into a ditch, bro. Like, man, we like watched her drive off, fall into a ditch, and we're like, oh shit. And like me and the boys, army boys, we like run up, we're like, over the car, we're like, fuck, are you guys alright? You guys alright? The cop car comes up behind us, and they hit like one of them like road signs, and the cop just gets out and starts taking pictures of the road signs, and we're like, bro, are you gonna check that these people are right? And they're like, he's like, nah, the the van like started running the ticket for damaging property.

SPEAKER_03 20:47

And I was like, bro, fuck you kind of gun's pay.

SPEAKER_02 20:51

It's such different thinking. If the government property's been damaged in there, but the person's dying, but it's like, but they're a crooked water thing. I was like, bro.

SPEAKER_01 21:00

Crazy thinking. That was like my only experience working with the police as well. I was like, yeah, they would be come on, bro. Have some compassion. But I like you know, it was only one cop. It was only one, we're only with one cop, and there was like three infantry soldiers. So um, I don't know if he was just uh like a penis or because you know you get good cogs, you get bad cogs.

SPEAKER_02 21:20

Of course, the same with anything, right? Yeah, but that's um, yeah, it's that that distinction, like and what you care for in that role. Yeah, I think yeah, it's interesting with some police, but I always believe half of them are just like school bullies who need to like. They need power, the power tripping. Pull someone over for a speed and they're like, Yeah, yeah, can't wait. But then you get awesome ones who like, yeah, just pretty chill. That's society, isn't it? Same with like the military. I imagine you get people like, yeah, like I want to like do some cool stuff. And you get people, I just want to kill people. And you're like, alright, bro. Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 21:57

You get indoctrinated to it, like The army you're you're there to like train like infantry soldier.

SPEAKER_02 22:03

Let's just be real, right?

SPEAKER_01 22:04

That's what so we have like the infantry model and then we have um the role of the infantry and the role of the infantry is like what they make you scream out like when you're standing like still like this full of like combat call train for like three months straight. And like in the in the role is just like to kill or to capture, yeah, to seek out and close with the enemy, to kill or to capture him, to seize their whole ground, to repel attack by day and night, regardless of season, weather, or terrain on wood. And you have to like yell that out.

SPEAKER_03 22:33

I can't believe I just did that. I was like freaking out, but I uh I said a voice.

SPEAKER_01 22:41

Yeah, well, if you get it wrong, you used to get like punished like heavily. I haven't said that in like maybe five years. True. So I kind of was like scared when it goes at the problem.

SPEAKER_03 22:53

BDT or I'm gonna get the drong. Now we get avoids onward.

unknown 22:58

Onwards.

SPEAKER_02 22:58

Yeah, kill or be killed is um to kill or capture. To kill or capture. That's uh yeah. Wow. Um oh yeah, actually, speaking of like also with uh with military, um uh what was I gonna ask? Uh uh so speaking of war and that, do you reckon at the moment we're kind of on the brink of another world war? Well, I I ain't gonna lie. Do you think we are? Uh if you think about the geopolitics, right? It's so out of control. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Do you do do you think that we're at a boiling point?

SPEAKER_01 23:32

I honestly I can't say because every time I have thought something was gonna so my whole entire militar military career, we just thought something was gonna pop off and we were like, really? But that's how you also get stuck in the military because you're like, oh no, wait, I've been training all these years, like because everyone wants to get deployed in the military. That's like everyone wants to, and then because you're it's imagine like training for a fight, but then you're doing all the training, you don't get the fight, you know? Yeah, it's like oh what am I doing this shit for? Yeah, yeah. Especially because the military training is really fucking hard. And um the whole time I was in the military five years, so it was like that we called it like dangling the carrot. So like the hierarchy would come over, tell talk to us about geopolitical situations that happening in the area, whatever, and like, oh yeah, but then like after five years you get real jaded with this conversation, bro. You're like shut up, yeah. But you're like, shut up, bro. You've been saying this for five years.

SPEAKER_03 24:34

Where's it gonna happen, bro?

SPEAKER_01 24:36

But like since I've left the military, I'm just like, because like I I I keep up with it a lot, but like in terms of New Zealand, what uh what I know about New Zealand, it was like we we ain't getting deployed nowhere because like our military is only like maybe 4,000 troops strong.

SPEAKER_02 24:52

Yeah, it's right, and we've got and we've got one navy ship at one sunk, so in the navy, bro, and I was just like, the fuck are you guys doing? This is embarrassing.

SPEAKER_01 25:07

I spent I spent a week on a navy ship, I forgot which one it was. Um there's only like two, right?

SPEAKER_03 25:13

Yeah, yeah. Well what I think there was two back then. Yeah, look at that one.

SPEAKER_01 25:20

Um we're just boot like going around by the fuck, the navy dude. Fuck all but I opened up like one of their doors and shit, and like they were just chilling there and I looked at me and I was like, I was like, What is it? Like, see ya not much going on. Well, we'd have to be training because they apparently on the ship they they have like a massive like uh place un underneath the ship where they put all like the LAVs and whatnot, and then they can like an LAV? Uh like I'm a vehicle, like the our little tank things that we have. It's not actually a tank, because yeah, I don't want to get to that. It's all good, yeah. But um like all the vehicles, whatever, and we we're every morning on the on the boat, like we'd have to go down the mall and do PT, and then we'll go up, have lunch after, and then we'll have lessons and whatnot. And like from what I was saying, I was just like, but where are all these navy dudes? Because apparently it was a joint like PT session, and like maybe we saw like five like navy dudes join us for PT. We're like yeah, bro.

SPEAKER_03 26:24

I barely saw any Navy dudes there, and then when I did it, I was just like watching TV or something.

SPEAKER_02 26:31

And nothing much happened out in the cities.

SPEAKER_03 26:33

Yeah, bro.

SPEAKER_02 26:34

Yeah, I remember like years back. I used to work as a technician and they um at the Navy base, they had this like uh kind of virtual reality, like I don't know what to call it. Like they had all these like big video wool there, and like you had this like pretend boat or something like that. It's like a sim uh simulator, simulator, that's what I'm looking for. The witch, I think we call it the witch, yeah. It's a simulator, and I remember like helping out with that, and I was like, this is fucking cool, that's pretty crazy. But yeah, when I when I went to the Navy base, it's funny as uh when I went there as well. I had a mate at the time there, and I went there and I was like, there's no one here. Yeah, yeah, but that's that's a military hero. Yeah, we got far when I'm a military. Not much going on, but yeah, so because I always wonder, like, um, for example, at the moment you geopolitically got put in being like, Yeah, we're gonna attack Europe. Even if it's empty frets because he's on the back foot going with like Ukraine and that. But I'm always like, yeah, like will he? He is super delusional and crazy, but it's like, would he?

SPEAKER_01 27:29

Yeah, fuck.

SPEAKER_02 27:30

Don't know.

SPEAKER_01 27:32

You think he would? Ah, fuck. I can't get in too much depth with that that that fucking situation because it's it's still ongoing. Yeah, yeah. So fuck uh, yeah, I just I can't. No, it's fair.

SPEAKER_02 27:44

That's fair, we're getting deep. I might die tomorrow. Um okay, since you've been in the military now and you've used lots of like weaponry, um, and obviously you've very trained in combat sports as well. Uh, what are you doing in a zombie apocalypse? How are you like uh well in like a situation like now? Yeah, like what if like a zombie apocalypse broke? I guess it depends on the zombies, but let's say they're like no, I haven't really thought of it. Well I thought that'd be the biggest conversation in the I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 28:14

I know where like a case of like some serious firearms are, but I'll I'll definitely like try and make my way to that. Yeah. Because then I'll be fucking I got a a lot of weapons, but I can't tell who who it is because it's actually um but yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:31

I I don't ex uh like I'll get those weapons and then uh get the weapons? What do you reckon? Get some high ground? Um or are you gonna be out in the out in the city just ending a blast killing everybody?

SPEAKER_01 28:43

I'll probably like do I'll probably just like love how I'll probably just love like how I was living in time and just go with the flow though. I'll just make sure I'm strapped up though, and I'll just be wandering around like oh here you go I'll do this today, I guess. Psychwest here, psycho is there. Yeah, fuck.

SPEAKER_02 29:01

So what about uh okay? So about supplies, you wouldn't have a base or anything? Nah, no, he's gonna be a wanderer. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:10

That sounds fun.

SPEAKER_02 29:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:11

If you're like cooped up somewhere, like, right, you're you're pretty much fucking yourself, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 29:16

Paranoid, right?

SPEAKER_01 29:16

Because like it depends on the like you don't want like thousands of zombies to hoard your like little and you got fuckle supplies or whatever. Like I'm more of like just cruise around, get some supplies, and then just be like rich with supplies.

SPEAKER_02 29:32

Just steal all the supplies, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:33

Yeah, and because there's not much firearms in New Zealand, like I definitely will be like the goat, and I'm also trained with them as well. So that's true.

SPEAKER_02 29:43

Well, what if they could swim? I guess I would imagine they could swim because I know I don't know the movie they say they can't swim, but I don't know. Depends on the zombies. Um well, interesting. Yeah, I've I'm I thought that'd be a hot topic in the military, but obviously not. Nah, nah.

SPEAKER_01 29:57

We talk to deal with real we can we talk more about real life situations, but like we we have like real conversations about like killing people about zombies, like don't put us down in front of you.

SPEAKER_02 30:10

Don't worry about that.

SPEAKER_01 30:11

Yeah, like I don't think that's ever come up in the military. Not one.

SPEAKER_02 30:14

That's actually quite fun. I'm actually a bit surprised, but also at the same time, I'm not surprised. It's like it makes sense, but we can kill real people.

SPEAKER_03 30:23

We talk about like fucking girls going to war, but that's all we talk about in the military, bro.

SPEAKER_02 30:32

That's fair. Um have you um seen any um uh drones in action, like military drones?

SPEAKER_01 30:37

Nah, so before drones started becoming like an effective like weapon like in combat, I I like literally left the army just before the whole Ukraine situation started popping off. Like literally a couple months before, and I was like kind of pissed off because some of the boys went over to England just to train some of those troops. Um, and like that's a deployment, and that's all I wanted with my military career to just be deployed. That wasn't Uber Eats on fucking COVID. I wanted to do something fucking real with like my military career, but I like left, but I was like, well, I've already left, like, I'm not gonna get back in, like, that's too much admin. And plus, I like wanted a chase fighting anyway. But um, all the drone stuff happened. I have like talked to my mates and whatnot about it, but like they've just like changed a couple of like the SOPs or whatever. Like we basically just like get on the get on your back and you just start shooting the fucking drone. Yeah, but unless you got like some something else, but like apparently I can't get too I can't get it, I can't get into it with the I mean I used to allow to talk about it.

SPEAKER_02 31:43

Yeah, that's fair. Yeah, no, that's alright. I wasn't I'm not was I wasn't sure how much allowed to talk about it. But yeah, that's alright. We can just edit bits out, bro. No, no, so no, that that part's all fine. Like I just can't get in too depth. Yeah, and I I understand. Yeah, you've seen you've seen some shit. Can't give away the yeah, that's true. Um what else? Oh yeah. Um one of the in the basic training, I remember like years ago I had a guy who went to school, he was a bit of a crazy dude, and then he went to the military and he told me about this exercise they did where they like uh you spend is it a week or two getting chased or something? Like through like like you.

SPEAKER_01 32:21

You don't do it in basic for a week or two. You do it like that.

SPEAKER_02 32:24

Is it in basic or is that like later on? I just remember him telling me this is so long, I was like scratching.

SPEAKER_01 32:28

So that's escape and evade. Usually special forces do it, like the SAS dudes.

SPEAKER_02 32:32

He must have been talking shit then.

SPEAKER_01 32:34

Uh I I'd say he is, yeah. Like uh infantry definitely don't do it, and they're the only dudes who do like the um like all the fucking combat. Like uh, because like they're the they're the main they're the main role for the army's combat. So they do all the crazy shit like that, but not even as crazy as like the SAS dudes, they do some fucking hectic shit, which I can't talk about. I got a few mates in there and they're just like telling me some of the things they're doing. I'm like, fuck, this is actually like double oh seven type shit.

SPEAKER_02 33:03

I imagine the craziest thing would be the torture part, yeah, yeah, yeah. I've only heard I've read things, but I can only imagine how fucking crazy that is. Like chopping off things, like I don't well, they don't do that, obviously. Yeah, no, they try and yeah, like you know, give away the secret so you gotta like try and create the pain. Fuck. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:22

They basically just keep you like awake and like just fuck with you.

SPEAKER_02 33:25

Like it's like more of like a psychological torture for like a week or something, right?

SPEAKER_01 33:29

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 33:30

Damn, yeah, that would I would go insane. I would yeah, I mean, yeah, if you want to get like the they usually do it after the escape evade as well. So like you pushed it a little bit, then it's like you're not done.

SPEAKER_01 33:41

So I I believe this is um this is a black roll. So you when you do the nine-day selection course before the SAS, you you're not actually in, and you got like a year of like SAS training before you're actually in and qualified. Um, and um, I know that they do like the escape and evade for like two weeks, and then they trick you once you get to like the end and you haven't been caught, they trick you and be like, Oh yeah, and then you get captured and then they torture you for like a week, and you thought you thought it was done, and you're like, Oh, I can't wait for a wall beater.

SPEAKER_02 34:14

That's crazy. That's savage, yeah. And they just get like tortured for like a few days, yeah, no sleeping, like waterboarded or something. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's yeah, that's I can't imagine because I think the only thing for me I stayed up, I did I did like I wasn't partying, I was actually working. I was actually gonna say super not interesting. But I was doing I was in events and I'd I stayed up for like how long was I awake for? 30 hours? Yeah. And that's probably not really I mean, compared to that stuff's not long, but for me that was long. And I was starting to lose my shit at the end.

SPEAKER_01 34:46

Yeah. I thought I was a lot of a lot of the military trainings, they uh they they always make sure you've like haven't slept for like at least a night or two before they start fucking with you and doing some crazy shit.

SPEAKER_02 34:57

I've got to push you so to like your psychological edge. Peter, have you seen people break? You must have you must have seen people.

SPEAKER_01 35:04

Um a lot of the times when they pretend to like roll their ankle or something, when they're like at a breaking point, they'll be like, and they'll be like, oh I can't walk. And then like because it's a training exercise and they're they're pretending that they've fucking broken their ankle or whatever, but like it's super like you do not do that. Inventory about it, you will be called a pussy. And like you know, that's a very like hard like environment. So you're like, if you pull some shit like that, it sticks to your name.

SPEAKER_02 35:31

Um I guess if you're going out into like battle and you pull some shit Oh like the gunfires, oh no, I hurt my ball.

SPEAKER_01 35:38

You become if you like if you're a weak person, you become a liability to the rest of the section. And then um everyone else can die. Exactly, because you everyone's got a role. But also because you you got like a pack, you got their pack, their food, and their water. So if they can't carry it, then you you got a dude car carrying two packs, and the packs are 40 kgs each. So you got a guy like and then he can't properly operate because he's trying to fucking help this other guy, and then you got another guy, so like yeah, you just gotta weed out the the weak kinds. Yeah a lot of a lot um when you first get in the military, yeah, there is a lot of weeding out. You'd you'd call it workplace bullying, but like it needs to be in the military because like exactly for that reason, like it's this is a serious job where you have to fucking kill cunts, so like you can't have a weak person there because then all your other mates are gonna die because you haven't fucking told this guy to fuck off. Sometimes they don't fuck off, so you gotta bully them.

SPEAKER_02 36:34

You gotta bully them, you gotta make them quit. Yeah. Damn, bro. But no, it makes sense. Like, I mean, yeah, I I I would I would hope that. Yeah, you know, it's like it's like if you put our front lines on, everyone's like, you know, all kind of being coddled.

SPEAKER_01 36:50

It's like well, like workplace bullying is like saving lives in the military if you think about it, because you're saving the dude's life, because it's a liability. Yeah, you save everybody else's life.

SPEAKER_02 36:59

I was gonna say, since you quit and you got a normal job, that might yeah, you must have must have had a you must have had a shock, yeah, a work culture shock. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Like, yeah, I can't imagine going from like the military and doing that kind of stuff in the work environment to then like going into like an office and like Sam. You can't punch people when they tell you no.

SPEAKER_01 37:18

Yeah, I had uh the transition's pretty hard, but like luckily I I was a fighter because I I knew because I was military five years and I'm pretty I'm self-diagnosed ADHD. But um I just need that constant stimulation. Hey, so if I'm like that's why I'm such an active fighter because I'm working 40 hours a week as an electrician. Yep, so I need that. I need to like leave my job, hit some pads, get some stimulation, beat some people up in it. Do you get much satisfaction from your job or not really? Uh there's not much fulfillment in it, you know? Like working like my boss is a good good dude and whatever, but I've always liked it. Obviously, compared to fighting, yeah. It's much more like firing, yeah, very fulfilling. People fighting. And even the military was like, it just gave you so much purpose, and I'm just constantly searching for both. Now I'm now like stuck in a loop and I'm like, I need purpose.

SPEAKER_02 38:14

What is my purpose at that would be weird? I imagine that would happen if you leave like leaving uh such a brotherhood of the military and stuff because everyone's so close, you know everything about those guys, and then yeah, about you. Like it's hard to get I think in real life and normal life, especially in jobs, you can't have that relationship now with most people.

SPEAKER_01 38:31

It's the it's you're forced to bond. Yeah, yeah, it's a trauma bond. Trauma bond. But like you can get those trauma bonds in fighting as well. When you just when you go through something hard with some with someone, you create like a stronger bond with them because they like know they've seen like that other side, that vulnerable side of you where you've had to like overcome something. So that relationship like strengthens, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 38:56

It's also the honesty, I think. Yeah, I mean, I don't know about the military haven't been in it, but in like yeah, combat gyms and stuff, like people are just a bit more down to earth. Yeah, yeah. Or like far away.

SPEAKER_03 39:06

Yeah, or the other side on different orders.

SPEAKER_02 39:08

I think I might be the on the other side, or just the full-blown cycle. There's either one or the other, I suppose. That is true.

SPEAKER_01 39:14

Yeah, but I know exactly what you're talking about.

SPEAKER_02 39:16

There's but there's there's a couple of those, but you get the hippies, you get the hippies.

SPEAKER_01 39:19

There's hippies at like um CKV, like, and then there's like you know, the the generates.

SPEAKER_02 39:26

Yeah, some people but I I'd it's also great that people can find that though. Yeah, you know, having the avenue to go to do a sport like that to release a lot of that anger tension or yeah, you know, inside because a lot of people sometimes don't find those things and they end up in dangerous environments or you know, hor doing horrible crimes or giving themselves a lot of shit.

SPEAKER_01 39:44

Yeah, no, the gym's good good for the community, right? For sure. Yeah, it's interesting where it like I don't know what I'd do without a gym and I had to work my 40-hour job.

SPEAKER_02 39:52

I think some people like uh um what was I gonna say? It's like it's like they um I think where they look at combat's because combat sports come a long way, I feel like these days, maybe even in New Zealand, like the perception of it, it's like oh it's just violent. Yeah. But it's so it's like so mainstream now. Yeah. So people are just more accepted of it. Yeah. Uh which is great, but it's um yeah, I I just uh find it interesting, like the transition from some people's like thinking of like, oh, it's just a bunch of like meat, meat and stuff. It's like you got you got some, but yeah, so you got some very, very smart, very well to do, very good.

SPEAKER_01 40:28

I I'd find I find like everyone who is like super successful, like Israel and Nav, like when I talk to them, I'm like, wow, these dudes are actually really fucking smart. And I lived with Navajo Sterling for like four or three years. Oh, cool. So I saw how he operates in life, like super clean dude, but also very like intelligent dude. And I'm like, that's why he's successful in fighting. But it's also from my conversations with Israel, I'm like, oh yeah, this dude's obviously very intelligent. You obviously he's picking up you know, you see him fight, like he picks up the tiniest details and like makes you pay for it, you know. Like his um that takes intelligence, and like every every everyone at the fucking very top has it has has that intelligence, right?

SPEAKER_02 41:11

Yeah, the fight IQ of those guys like um watching um Blood Diamond at the last um King of the Ring uh that he did the light heavyweight and he and he won it, which was oh, was it light heavyweight that he was in? I think so. Yeah, yeah, I think so. And that was amazing. Like, but again, it was I was like as soon as I saw his name, I'm like, this is a bit unfair. Yeah, and the record as well. I was like this isn't fair, but a blood diamond and king of the ring, like not all these years later. And obviously, I just you could just see the fight IQ, and I'm just like just the experience shine. That was a mean, that was mean as well. But he's a but he's amazing, but just yeah, shows you know, but just all the time on the mat. So would you say are you training six days a week, seven days a week?

SPEAKER_01 41:50

Yeah, six, six or five days a week off camp, but oh no, six days a week, yeah. Six days a week. So primarily do like a morning class and a night class, sparring? No, just um when I'm out of camp, like I'll just train in the Avo and then maybe one or two in the morning as well. But when I'm like in camp, I'll do most most mornings, most Avos. When I was training in Thailand, or that was a different fucking story. Or fucking the tires make you like run 10Ks in the morning, like hit the bag. No, you wait. This is I'll tell you the whole day. This is the whole training day. I'm interested, I'm interested. Yeah, yeah. So they make you run 10Ks in the morning, you get to the gym at 8 a.m. And then um you skip for like 20 minutes, and then you shadow box for like 10 minutes, and then you wrap your hands, and then you hit the bag for like five rounds, and then you spar for like five rounds, and then you might hit the um the pads for like another five rounds, and then that's your morning session done, and you're already like maybe fucking like 4,000 calories deep, like in the day, and you've only reached like 10am, and you're already burning like 4,000 calories, like all the you're like, bro, it's just like what the fuck? Um, and then you you rest for like six hours, and then you get to the afternoon session, and then it's a repeat of the morning session, but then you add like uh like 45 minutes to an hour of clinching, like afterwards, and yeah, but like if you're a western, like you get fit really fast, like maybe a week or two, but like if you're a westerner, bro, you just burn. I like I've had like extreme Thailand burnout, like where I'll just be like, where because that's six days a week training twice a day, and like there's not much like sports science behind it, bro. Like the Thais, like they believe in like just training hard all the time. Yeah. And there's no like foot off the pill. And um even if you tell them like, oh, I'm I'm feeling a bit fucked. I need like a day off, they'll be like, Are you weak? You weak. You're not strong, you're not strong, and you're like But come on, man. Like and you'll and then you'll just go to the singing session. Whoa. Sometimes I was like, fuck, this is fucking hard. This is coming from like me from the military. I was like, this is fucking hard. And then um they make you train like that all the way up to the fight, but usually in Thailand they have same-day weigh-ins or no weights. So those two fights at Bangla, yeah, like there was no weigh-ins at all. Wow. Yeah, it was like you shop to the stadium and they um they just size you up and well there's both uh similar.

SPEAKER_02 44:35

Let's go.

SPEAKER_01 44:36

Yeah, yeah. My first fight at Bangla, like I had three opponent changes in the first hour. And I was like, coming from like someone who's like just fought out on lights out, I was like, on a really official promotion. I was like, what the fuck is going on? And like the adrenaline dump, and I was like, Am I fighting or am I not? Like, am I chilling or like my hands are wrapped?

SPEAKER_02 44:56

I was like, what the fuck's going on? Just waiting around for your fight to happen. Or not. Yeah, that's just chaos. Yeah. Yeah, it's just so different from um how we are here. Oh, absolutely. Um, there's one of the quote I actually I saw um that you you put uh like one of your Instagram uh posts about your time in Cambodia, and you said uh you said watching how people live there made it click. When you expect less, you stress less. When you need less, you're freer. Happiness doesn't come from having more, it comes from not constantly wanting more. Yeah. So you really found that when you were people just don't have much, I suppose.

SPEAKER_01 45:32

Yeah, yeah, like they have like fuckle, but like when you go, it's the same place with Thailand as well. But people are just happier, but they're genuinely more happier, and they've got like fuckle, they like live in like a tiny room like their whole family in like a tiny room like this, and like I just saw it and I was just like, bro, this is actually crazy. Cause like it's called the land of the smiles of Thailand, but Cambodia's the same as well. Like I saw people like living in shacks, like, and they were just like happy kids like play, but it was like raining. The kids are like happy as playing in the bottle on the side of the street, man. And I was like, what the fuck? Okay, but um, yeah, this is something I picked up, but I was like, why is everyone more happier than Aucklanders? Well, like when I looked deeper into it and I like went to like all the temples and whatnot, I was like, I found out it was just basically Buddhism. It's just like um because that's the fundamental religion of their society, yeah. 95% of the population. I think it's 92 in Thailand, but like everyone almost everyone you meet is Buddhist. But um the main this is like the main thing of Buddhism is uh the root of all suffering. Oh the root of all suffering. Oh my god, I can't remember. That's alright. It's like what attachment is the root of all suffering.

SPEAKER_02 46:48

Oh yes, actually I've heard that too. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 46:50

So attachment. So and then um and if you lock in deeper, like it's just attachment to everything, like if you're attached there, the the more you let go of everything, you the more happier you're gonna be. And it it is very true, like but it does teach like uh it does teach that like detachment, like kind of and you become very like nonchalant if you go too far.

SPEAKER_02 47:10

Like everything's like everything means nothing, kind of yeah, yeah, yeah. But yeah, yeah, I guess I guess it just all depends on on your the on the mindset of it, right? Because I think if you're attached to nothing, it depends on who you are, but you might get a bit like nihilist or shit. You'd be like, eh, the world is whatever, it's gonna end anyway. Yeah, yeah. But it's interesting what the different religions teach you. I always find it fascinating, like looking at like Christianity and like Muslim. So many similarities um between them both, and a lot of like fundamentals, but they're just people just kind of like still clash a lot on it, and I'm like, guys are pretty similar. Yeah, but Buddhism is the one that like it's like very stands out.

SPEAKER_01 47:49

Um what I like about Buddhism is it's like very close to Stoicism and Oh yeah, stoicism, yeah. Yeah, it's very close to it. It's like you know, just detaching yourself from stupid crap that like is gonna affect your ego, like it's better to just fucking walk away. Like, who gives who cares about your fucking ego? Yeah, it's not gonna serve you, so like just leave the situation, and like that's what I really like uh about stoicism. And then I saw a lot of relation to Buddhism, and I was like, Oh, that's that's pretty cool. And then that's why I like kind of got attracted to like finding out more about it, and I was like, Oh yeah, see.

SPEAKER_02 48:19

No, that's really awesome. Yeah, I feel like um it's easy, like at in the presented like in West, like it's just like climb, climb, climb, want more to you know, yeah, have more. And some of it's alright to have drive and to have uh I think um determination to get where you want to, but at times you get you get like you get stuck in the in that. So it's in but yeah, it's just like so the life is balanced, right?

SPEAKER_01 48:41

Because like my whole fucking fighting career is just like oh fuck, I need a belt. But I've like kind of been like thinking like that. I'm like not really being prison, I'm just like trying to like look for that next thing and then like oh yeah, if I have like a few belts, then I'll be finally complete and I'll be happy with my kickboxing career. But like, yeah. But would you? Well, I've had I've got two belts, and I'm like and I'm like, uh fucking we can like look at it like just the belt. Well, that's mean, like spent so much hours of my life trying to get those.

SPEAKER_02 49:13

I mean it is super, it's the it's the it's the journey, not the destination.

SPEAKER_01 49:16

It's a status thing, but you're like fuck like if you look if you look like deep deeper down into it, you're like fucking really kidding. No one's gonna care in a hundred years.

SPEAKER_02 49:28

It's the journey, not the destination, yeah, isn't it, with those kind of things?

SPEAKER_01 49:31

Yeah, you gotta be, yeah, you gotta learn to be more prison for sure.

SPEAKER_02 49:35

Something I've been trying to do a bit more. Like similar to the case. Well that's what I like to use. I've been trying to build on that.

SPEAKER_01 49:40

Yeah, yeah. When I was living in time for six months, that's like every day, like I just really learned how to be present, and like that actually gave me so much happiness. But like I wasn't working a job.

SPEAKER_02 49:50

And unfortunately one of my cameras decided to um stop working during the the podcast. It's really annoying. Um but I've uploaded the rest of the audio episode uh to this, so yeah, sorry about that, guys. But you can still listen to the episode um after this. And it gets really, really good. Sam starts talking about his time in Cambodia. Um, he starts talking about his favorite artillery weapons, so it's still a lot of fun, um, but yeah, very frustrating. And thank you guys for listening. Appreciate it very much. So if you're unemployed, you're happy.

SPEAKER_01 50:28

You are for sure. But then you got to go.

SPEAKER_02 50:39

But life costs, sadly. Yeah, yeah, unfortunately. Unfortunately, yeah. If that is only the way we could all be, but um oh um, I'd like to talk to you more actually about the charity work you did in Cambodia. Oh I know you raise money for your tuck tie driver, but what else were you doing when you were there?

SPEAKER_01 50:55

Yeah, so so my oh this so my mum, my mum's half Cambodian, um, but she was adopted to New Zealand at the age of 12. But uh in the 70s a massive genocide happened there and four million people were murdered.

SPEAKER_02 51:11

Oh is this the pole? Yeah, pole pot the Mayor Rouge.

SPEAKER_01 51:15

Yeah, it is Bay Rouge, yeah, yeah. My mum was like l living in Badambong region at the time as an eight-year-old, but very poor family, um like living in frickin' Hutts bro. Um and then that whole fucking regime took over the country, and all the people got moved out of the cities and then went to work on the like the farms or the killing fields. And uh bro, my mum's seen some like more death than like I've met some some people who actually kill people in the military through that network system, but my mum has seen like more death than anyone. Like she reckons she's like walked through fields of just bodies laid everywhere. Oh man, and um but some of her stories as well, like cause one because uh when I went over there I actually visit the killing fields in Cambodia, and I actually got like pretty like emotional for me because like I got raised by her and like she was pretty fucking hectic, like raising me, but like and like as a young kid you don't really understand, so you're like why like why are you gonna be so hectic and whatever? Yeah, yeah. And like uh and you're like blaming your you'll blame her or whatever, but like after going there, I'm like fuck my mum could have cur came out so much worse, right? Like she was actually a very good mother from a situation that happened and how she dealt with it or whatever. But um yeah, some of her story is crazy, bro. She reckons she's seen, well, she was an eight-year-old, and um this lady got caught the pregnant lady got caught stealing rice, and they got her got her like on the stage, and they just cut her open alive with a knife and pulled the baby out. Was like, this is what happens if you steal from pole pot, if you steal from the Camaro Ridge. And like, bro, even crazier shit, like um fuck these like dudes ran away from the camp, they got caught, um, they chopped them up and they cooked them, fed them, and then they tricked everyone back in the village and they all ate ate the person. Like, and they're like, Oh yeah. My god, and they're like, This is what happens again. If you run away, like we'll fucking kill you, and then we'll trick you into eating next level crazy. Like crazy shit like that. I've I asked my mum if I could talk about this, and she was like, Yeah, yeah, sweet. I wrote, bro, fuck. I'm like, bro, someone should get my mum on a fucking blog, bro.

SPEAKER_02 53:34

I guess it's like but it's kind of like reliving trauma almost.

SPEAKER_01 53:36

Yeah, well, whenever I talk to her about it, bro, shit, like it the whole fucking room gets very dark, bro.

SPEAKER_02 53:42

Of course.

SPEAKER_01 53:43

Oh shit.

SPEAKER_02 53:44

I mean walking over dead bodies and stuff and being like, how are like eight eight? Eight, yeah. How do you even process that shit?

SPEAKER_01 53:49

Yeah, so um the Khmer Rouge was in power for four years, so she saw this whole shit happen over four years until she was twelve. And then um what happened was once so when when I was in Cambodia, I found um I found out like heaps of shit, but um, because um what happened when the Khmer Rouge fell, the Vietnamese actually like uh took over in power, but because everyone was trying to escape, including the Khmer, they were trying to escape to the Thai border. Um the Vietnamese were actually bombing all the civilians when they were trying to escape. So you got the Khmer Rouge and the Vietnamese all just trying to kill you when you're trying to get out of the country. And she walked from yeah, she crossed country into Thailand, and then she lived in a refugee camp for two years in Thailand, which apparently the living conditions was like probably just as worse as the as they are like the camps that she she was like working in. Yeah, but and then um she so she lost her her basically her whole family in that process, and it was just her and my uncle and um the uh what happened from there so we were at the camp. Oh yeah, so they attached themselves to uh like another older family because they're just kids. Uh but apparently they were just treating like my mom and her uncle and my uncle like uh just slaves, like basically like you do this, like whatever. And then because at the time immigrants couldn't immigrate to New Zealand if they didn't have guardian uh guardian oh no, they if they didn't have parents. So they um those that the people that enslaved my uh my mom and my uncle, they said that they were their parents, got to New Zealand as soon as they got to New Zealand, my mum was like, nah, they're not they're not my like uh mum and dad, like and then and then she got adopted into a Christian family. And now we're going back to that charity work. So in that Christian family, um they had a brother, uh who's a little bit oh yeah, so Christian family adopts my mum and my uncle. Um and then yeah, so the Christian family had like a few kids, one of them uh Craig Grey uh Craig Greenfield's super Christian family though as well. So um they grow up, whatever, and now he he found like a Cambodian missus like at school, um Craig, and now he lives over in Cambodia and he's been running for like over 30 years uh NGO, which uh basically recruits people in the community to be like social workers for kids, and they also get funding because you know you can run like an orphanage or whatnot, but like you need to create connections with people to like make sure that they're like growing up good, you know, like and a lot of the times um these kids in these like uh villages and whatnot, like they're not orphaned, but but their dad, like one of the stories I was talking to this uh guy in one of the they're called um what are they called? I can't remember, but uh he was like a community worker, but he like he was helping this one kid and the kid only had a dad with one leg and super poor family, and like the government doesn't help anyone, that's why there's a lot of NGOs over there. Um very corrupt, eh? Yeah, very corrupt. Something I saw over there was like bro, I've never seen more supercars in a city in my life than Cambodia. All these Farai's Lambos, and then you just get like you'll look at a Lambo the same same vision, yeah, and you have like fucking kids sleep, like homeless kids sleeping on the sidewalk, and you're like, bro, you're a fucking piece of shit if you're driving a Lambo around this place, like you're an actual fucking piece of shit. But like it's it's it's a Chinese mafia, they have like a massive ball, a massive ball game in um Cambodia.

SPEAKER_02 57:45

They've got one and uh did it have a lot of influence in um Mayanma? Myanmar, yeah. Myanmar, yeah, yeah. It's the scam center, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 57:52

It's like a billion dollar industry. Yeah, I watched a crazy kind of like drama about that, and um that's fucking do awful stuff. But anyway, so I talk I talked to so with when I was so my uncle owns the he's like my foster uncle, but he owns that NGO, he's had it for like 30 years, but it's also expanded to like 20 other countries as well, the whole system. Because it's a good system, you just k uh like get Christian Christians and you recruit them to like help these kids or whatever. But that that one kid who had like uh his dad who had uh so that one kid, his dad had one leg and there was the only family member, but he was pulling the kid out of school to like help him with the fishing, and look lucky he did one day because the kid actually saved his dad's life because he fell off the boat and constantly he's got one fucking leg, but um with a bit of funding, and then with that community worker, like they've like raised the kid now, and he's like you know got education or whatever because this community worker is like talk to the dad because the dad was trying to pull him out of school just to like fish and he's like an eight-year-old. The early development's so important, but like that's what they run, it's called Alongsiders anyway. Um But I I went and visited that and I was like, oh, this is fucking eye-opening, like just talking to everyone, even like looking at the system. I was like, fuck, this is crazy. But um, yeah. But uh I stayed with I stayed with them for like two weeks in Phnom Penh in Cambodia, and um they they they know all these other international, like, but they uh like a lot of people that help with like the scam rating and whatnot. I I met a lot I I met some people like them and I took their stories and whatnot, and I was like, this is like cool as I I know I I I watched this, I forgot this.

SPEAKER_02 59:37

That's a it's actually a Taiwanese like drama show, and they um it's because it's it's based on like a I think like loosely on like a true story, like the daughters get like uh like they like uh Taiwanese and Chinese if they travel or whatever to like Thailand or Cambodia and that and they get like kidnapped, yeah, and then they get taken to those scamps like it's like a giant warehouse of just people on phones or computers and stuff and you get beaten if you don't make enough money. You gotta make a quota every day, but like there's just all ages of I think mainly kids. I think is it mainly kids? I think some of them are, and then yeah, people get like beaten, raped. Like it's fucking horrible. Yeah, but there's a lot of people. I think right now a lot of those, though.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:14

I think right now like the statistic is like 100,000 people are kidnapped in Cambodia right now.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:19

Fuck my god, that's so scary, man.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:23

But you got hands, bro, so that's all good. Yeah, well, um, so there's like Chinese like operated like cities for my research, and I think it's Sunukville. Like if you're going to Cambodia, everywhere else is safe. Like if you go to Cim Rip um and then traveling along to Phnom Penh, that's all safe. Bad and Bong's all safe, but it's like those outskirts cities. Probably like being careful running around. But like if you're like someone like me, you'll you're pretty safe. Like, I won't be targeted. Like one thing I learned when I was in Cambodia is that everyone's like 5'8 by his legs. Like everyone's six foot. But if you're six foot man, like you're a giant, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:01:04

Yeah, got two belts, you have the belts as well.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:06

It's funny because when I was in Thailand, everyone was like assumed that I was Thai, and then when I was in Cambodia, and all the Khmer people were like, no, you're not Cambodian. Um they're like, You're too tall, like that. That's crazy, you can't be it's impossible. I was like, well, but like I know I know exactly why everyone's so small in Cambodia's house because like every time you buy food like at a restaurant, bro, the protein portion is so tiny. I'm like, fuck, if you're eating this much fucking protein in your life, you're gonna be a fucking midju.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:37

Damn. Oh, that's a wild, that's uh that's a hell of a wow, what a story about your mom, pole pots thing. That's crazy. I've actually never you're I've never met anybody who's got a story like that of like especially someone whose parents or yeah isn't for that because that I know a little bit about it, um, but fuck, that's yeah, that's hef that's heavy. Yeah, and then um, yeah, what an experience, man. Fire out six months of your life is like wow, impressive, dude. Um all right, dude. I think we're kind of like uh yeah, kind of uh nearing the end. Um maybe I'll just do some uh do some quick fires for you, and then we'll um we'll we'll uh we'll um we'll end it there. Alright, let's go back on the fighting. Um you can't answer this before, but okay, what's what's your least favorite thing about fight camp?

SPEAKER_01 1:02:27

Um anything that ain't smiling. I love smoking. Let me fight. Yeah, yeah, but um probably like uh because I'm just getting old and I've been doing this fucking years now. Um like the can't and now that I've experienced like being unemployed and running a fight camp, fuck, which is just fucking luxury, and you can do way more work, and the more risk you get, the more work you can do. But if you're working like a full-time job and you're like waking up at fucking 4 30 to do some training before work and then you finish work and you got some more training, like and then you get home at like fucking nine and you got you gotta eat your food and go straight to sleep, you got like absolutely zero time of yourself. Uh that that can like yeah, that that probably sucks. Now now that I've like had because I when I was in Thailand, because I've been running all my camps like that for like fucking four or five years out of New Zealand. And then now that I've like experienced, I've like actually enjoyed fight camp mode.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:32

I was like, wow, you can actually enjoy fight camps. That's not a big chore.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:37

Now I've got like a different perception of fight camp. I'm like, oh man, like you can actually enjoy this shit. If you're just like, yeah, if you're just unemployed and you can rest like fuck, it's actually so like fight cams can actually be fun.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:50

True. Um, what's your um military question? What's your um favorite uh what's the favorite gun you've shot? Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:58

Mag 58, baby. Mag 58, so that's multi-purpose machine gun, baby. That's like uh so it's a 7.62. Um it weighs 12.8 kgs, and but like that that's actually how many rounds in it? How many bolts can you still have? So it's it's belt fit, it's a machine gun. I'll just keep going. Yeah, yeah, it's a machine gun. Um, it's almost near impossible to like fire out of like you can if you're a hearty cunt. Like you'll like you'll hold it out like this, and like some people even hold the tripod because it just like kicks like that when you shoot it if you're standing. But a lot of the time, bro, you gotta like just fucking get on your guts, bro, and like just lay that tripod down. But once you start getting that thing purring, bro, it's fucking mean. And then you get like your mate who's a gun too, and he's he's just starts clipping more rounds on. And then if you're like efficient with the drills, like like doing a barrel change is like change change barrel, and like if you do it real quick, like you're like, oh, but like, yeah, it's a it's a fun role, except for carrying it, because like um a lot of times they make you carry a thousand rounds, and I think that's like round like 30 kgs on top of your 40 kg pack. And the gun. And the gun. Fuck. Yeah, so you're like, and like I'm not even a big dude. They like because um when I joined the military, I was I got put in gun route just because I was a foot person.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:16

I was like bang, and I'm like I was like, I never sniper, and I'm like, nah, spray brain, baby.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:30

I don't know if you got the patience to be a sniper, do you?

SPEAKER_01 1:05:33

Nah, so actually I was a marksman, so I was uh machine gun the first two years, and then I was a marksman for the f for three years afterwards because like I was actually a real good shot, but um usually you gotta put the new guy on the gun because it's actually the hardest fucking job in the in in the country, I reckon. It's fucking hard, bro. My back is still feeling them. It's just like the encumbrance of like everything that you gotta fucking carry. Even the spear barrel. So the barrel weighs, I think like uh fucking s like around six six or seven kgs, and you gotta keep a spear one on you because it after you go through 200 rounds, you've got to change the barrel because it's fucking hot, bro. Uh and then you just you just gotta keep so much shit on your eyes. Yeah. Yeah, and I've I've but it's fun, bro, once you like once you set up a like a firing position, bro, and you just got fucking all these rounds, right? You just go for it, bro.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:26

It must be fucking loud. Huh?

SPEAKER_03 1:06:32

What?

SPEAKER_01 1:06:37

Oh, that's good. That's good. Yeah, but did you uh you have to like uh like some of the um like assault for live fire assaults, like sometimes like your shit will fall out. But I know this one guy and he tried to because we were like posting grenades and he didn't have air pro in. So you're posting grenade is like imagine you go up to a trench and you just throw a grenade in and you like just let it blow up like a meter away from your face. This guy didn't have air pro and he was a dumb cun though, drops at him, blew out his eardrums, left the army, tried to come back in, and they were like, did the hearing taste like he like did he like we can't let you back in because you can't hear him?

SPEAKER_03 1:07:19

He was like, You guys did this to me.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:22

And the hearing taste was not a good look. Damn, so yeah, alright. Magnum 58, damn, alright. No, Mag 58. Oh, Mag 58, no Magnum, sorry, Mag 58. Um what was um what was the hardest military exercise you experienced?

SPEAKER_01 1:07:40

Oh this is actually pretty fucked up, but it was actually a training accident. Um it was uh we're doing riot training, and actually it it made the hero and whatnot, and um our OC at the time got fired for it. Um because we're doing riot training, they got a bunch of like the artillery dudes to play play role um like a fucking like a riot, but in riot training, it's like almost it's it's super realistic. It's just like if you're it's a riot, yeah, it's a riot, it's a fucking riot. Like you've got like we you don't have phone banners, we have real banners because like if you fuck around with the phone banners, like they keep fucking like they're throwing rocks at you, they've got like massive poles, they're like throwing ropes over the shields to like pull you back, and they've got mollusholes and they're like smashing molly holes at your feet. But um, yeah, I don't know what the fuck happened, but we think someone was like pouring petrol because it was going through this like container village, and also we we haven't slept for two days, so we're like we're like we're going through this container village um we're the riot team and like I forgot what our task was. It was like to get something, I don't know. We walk down, they're pouring fucking pretty sure they're pouring petrol like on us, but um one of the fucking dudes throw a Molotov at the feet and the boys just catch fire, and um one of the boys is like engulfed in fire, and he's right fucking next to me, bro, and I'm freaking out, and I'm like, oh shit, and I drop my shit, I'm like, oh fuck, and I s I start trying to like pat him out like because I don't know what the fuck I was doing. Yeah, but then I thought I was on fire because he was so fucking hot, and I was like, oh, and I'm like freaking out going off him. I'm like, oh fuck, and bro, the bro is screaming, and I can still kind of hear it now, but it just sounded he was in pain, bro, like full fucking and then there was another person who was on fire completely engulfed in fire, and what he did was because we were in gas masks, he pulled off his gas mask and he was on his knees and it like burnt his face. And these guys were like, there's they're scarred up and shit now, bro. Like from the whole fire.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:44

Just a fucking exercise.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:45

Yeah, yeah. And then like they called off the exercise, and everyone's like, oh my god, like this is fucking crazy. And then I don't know what the fuck the boy was like, if he was all good or not. And I was just like, fuck. And then I saw one of the boys like crying as well. I was like, Oh fuck, this is actually pretty fucking hectic. It's because he just he bro that he couldn't stop screaming until the ambulance got there, and where everyone's just quiet, just hearing him like 50 meters in the distance, because there's fucking heaps of us, no one's saying anything. We just hear the bird just screaming, bro, constantly. But like it was a training accident as well.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:19

It's just training, it's just an exercise.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:25

That's what the military does. They they try to make like your training as realistic as possible. So like which is like good and whatnot, and you do have to like sometimes cross them health and safe safety boundaries to like achieve that like um feeling. But maybe not getting burned alive, yeah. But fuck we are pretty sure like some of the someone was like pouring petrol on us because a lot of us took off our clothing, we had to give it to the military police smelled like pitch, and we all just stunk of petrol there. Yeah, so we don't know what the fuck's going on. I don't know what happened after that, whatever, but yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:59

Damn bro, that's hectic. Uh okay. Also do something a bit lighter than this. Uh what uh what food? Uh um what what what's your favorite food during fight camp? Do you have favorite food? Food. During fight camp? Yeah, like what I was doing. Yeah, yeah. Do you have a go-to? Like for for for your end camp.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:22

Uh I just eat rice, veggies, and meat, bro. Like, I don't every day? Yeah. I cut fucking heaps of well. I cut like eight or nine, not nine, yeah, nine kgs. If I had my weight class, I walk around.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:36

Because you're you're in welterweight, right?

SPEAKER_01 1:11:38

Super welterweight, which is 70 kgs, but but I walk around at the moment I'm like 80. But like, that's because I've been fucking eating good. But like, once I start like training and shit, I drop like maybe two kgs. Well, like if I just so I have like a rule, I always I sh which I haven't been doing, which is why I'm like two kgs heavier than usual, is I always eat at like 80% full. But like I don't even I barely ever scale and weigh my food when I'm cutting weight. I just like know how much I used to, but now now I've like done so many so much. Yeah, I I just look at something and be like, that's that much, and like I'm usually always right.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:20

Uh alright, last one. Any um if anyone's like listening or watching and uh they're wanting to get into fighting, do you have any uh advice?

SPEAKER_01 1:12:29

Yeah, just send it by send it. Yeah if you if you're thinking about fighting, like like definitely I I think it's very good for character development, and everybody should like have good character development and like it's a good path to achieve that and like yeah, because like once you get like good character about yourself, like life gets a little bit bitter in my experience.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:53

Uh yeah, no, that's that's it's good by words. Oh, thanks, Sam. That was an awesome podcast, man. Learned a lot, crazy experience. Yeah, you should change. Did you ever fight nicknames? Could like live life in the fast lenses. They used to call me the dog. Oh well, they still do the dog. The dog. Yeah, oh you got the merch as well. Buy Sam's merch, guys. Buy the shirts, yeah, yeah. Yeah, fucking hope. Awesome, dude. Hey bro, awesome chatting with you. Uh learned it there. Uh, thanks everyone for listening.