The Show Up Fitness Podcast

What's the BEST corrective exercise certification NASM CES ISSA SUF STM

• Chris Hitchko, CEO Show Up Fitness • Season 3 • Episode 309

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Article mentioned in the podcast: https://www.painscience.com/blog/corrective-exercise-trap.html

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What happens when a client shoves a scary MRI report in front of you and waits for your take? We turn that tense moment into a masterclass on scope, language, and movement by breaking down C6–C7 findings, clarifying true red flags, and showing how a quick consult with a physical therapist can transform fear into a clear plan. Instead of hiding behind corrective exercise acronyms, we lay out a practical path to real credibility: anatomy fluency, precise coaching, and a trusted referral network.

We walk through how to read common cervical terms without stepping outside your scope, why peripheral symptoms like numbness or burning change the plan, and how to use the biopsychosocial model to reduce threat and improve outcomes. You’ll hear a simple, effective session flow—brief targeted correctives followed by progressive overload with squats, step-ups, rows, planks, and face pulls—designed to build capacity without provoking symptoms. The emphasis is on clarity over complexity: coach scapular protraction and retraction, cue depression instead of shrugging, and modify load and positions based on feedback, not fear.

Along the way, we question the corrective exercise trap, the posture hype cycle, and the industry’s obsession with letters over leadership. Real leverage comes from hands-on education and an active network of DPTs and specialists who answer the phone, share nuance, and send referrals. If you want clients to see you as the professional who brings calm, clarity, and results, start by mastering anatomy, speaking hope, programming for strength, and knowing exactly when to refer. Subscribe, share this with a coach who needs it, and leave a review telling us the one skill you’re doubling down on this month.

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Want to ask us a question? Email info@showupfitness.com with the subject line PODCAST QUESTION to get your question answered live on the show!

Website: https://www.showupfitness.com/
Become a Successful Personal Trainer Book Vol. 2 (Amazon): https://a.co/d/1aoRnqA
NASM / ACE / ISSA study guide: https://www.showupfitness.com

SPEAKER_00:

The average trainer barely understands their own. And don't get me wrong, I'm not saying we're going to be practicing as physical therapists. No, you need to know your scope. And that's why Doc said if there's something going on with the peripheral symptoms such as numbing or burning, that's when you got to refer out. Welcome to the Show Up Fitness Podcast, where great personal trainers are made. We are changing the fitness industry one qualified trainer at a time with our in-person and online personal training certification. If you want to become an elite personal trainer, head on over to showupfitness.com. Also make sure to check out my book, How to Become a Successful Personal Trainer. Don't forget to subscribe, rate, and review. Have a great day and keep showing up. Howdy all. Welcome back to the Show Up Fitness Podcast. Today we're going to talk about the best corrective exercise certification. Or is there? Before we do that, let's talk a little bit about an MRI from an SUF CPT. Had a question from a client. Hey, Chris with giant biceps and awesome calves. I may have threw that in there. I hope all is well. I had a question about one of my clients in an MRI. The results were a C6, C7, minimal disc height loss, and a broad-based posterior disc osteophyte complex asymmetry to the right, moderate right osteoarthritis, severe right framal nearing. Oh my God, this would scare the holy shit out of the majority of people and probably trainers. So the question goes: how confident do you feel to interpret that in front of someone? Because if you're at a gym and someone says they have neck pain, that's what C6C7 is referring to. That's their cervical region of the spine. And then they have their MRI, they pull it up on their phone and they show you this medical records, and you go, Oh, um uh that's uh uh oh, that's oh, so what are you gonna do? I'm not saying this trainer did that, but as a teacher of trainers and the competency of the industry, the industry doesn't set you up to understand what's being said right here. We're not physical therapists, but when we go out there and seek corrective exercise certifications, in my opinion, it's because you have a hard time interpreting stuff like this. And so then you have that client, you go through a workout, you're probably not gonna do much for the upper body. And then you sit them down, you say how many times a week you want to train, and they go, I'm just gonna go do my own thing. I'm gonna do F-45, I'm gonna just do cardio. They don't see the value in working with you. And so you internalize that. Those ants speak up, those automatic negative thoughts. I don't know what I'm doing. I'm not good enough. Is this career good enough for me? And then you get an email from NASA, Ace ISA, get this corrective exercise certification. You go, voila, holy moly, that's what I need. Or you got screwed because you got some big bundle for$2,000 and they put them all together, which I think is even worse because now you're gonna waste a couple of years studying a bunch of bullshit that's not gonna help you build your book of business. I'm not gonna go off a rant on that, I promise. So we're seeking qualification via specializations and pieces of paper on your wall. In my opinion, what you should be doing is networking with physical therapists. So here's what I did this morning when the trainer texted me that. I sent it over to our team, DPT. I said, Hey, Doc, what do you think about this? Anything to be concerned about? I was able to interpret this. Nothing, you know, to me came up as this is bad. Minimal disc height loss and broad based posterior disc osteophyte. That's just a little bony growth. It's not a big deal. Moderate right osteoarthritis, arthritis, bad implement. It's not a big deal. Severe right frameal naring, it's just a whole, it's just getting a little smaller, not a big deal. But I do my due diligence and send it over. One minute later, I got a text back. This legit looks like a normal MRI to me, unless there are peripheral symptoms. What that means, if there's numbness or anything going down the arm, that's when you'd want to be concerned. So you see the difference between having all these specializations on your wall and you're really just throwing darts at a bullseye but your eyes closed, you don't even know where the bullseye is. And now you have a better approach because you've built a team. So if this was an actual scenario for me, it's show up and a client came in and showed me this, or they sent it over the day before, I would be prepared and I would say, nothing to worry about. How do you move? How does this make you feel? Because for me, when I got an L4, L5 disc protrusion, Chris, you're gonna die because you never should run, jump, squat, deadlift again. A doctor actually told me that. I felt fragile and weak and broken. So my movement represented that. And that central amplification is going to be heightened because of what you were told. We're not fragile, but at the same time, we need to know our scope. So I would do my due diligence and just check just in case. There was some important information in there, unless there is peripheral symptoms. So I'm going to chat with the client. And worst case scenario, I would get my DPT on the FaceTime, or I would schedule a call with them. I'm going to see what it irritates the most. I'm going to learn more about the client and treat them as a human, but give them hope. I guarantee you we're going to get you out of pain. Because if that's what you're experiencing, I have a great team, but there's a lot that I can do. I'm not going to do a soft tissue in the C6, C7. No, that's not in our scope. That's not appropriate for this case example. You need to learn more about really the mindset of that client, where they're at. And a lot of times when we go to an MRI, it is the last resort. You've been dealing with pain for years. You go to the doc, they give you a cortisone shot. It feels better for a little bit, but probably jacks you up in the future. Cortisone shots have been shown not to be the best long term. It may give you short reprieve acutely, but long term, it could even mess up the connective tissue later on. So what I'm doing is confidently letting the client know that it's okay. This stuff is perfectly normal. And if it wasn't, then my practitioner, a doctor of physical therapy, would have said, do not do anything. And we kind of chuckled about it because I sent them a message later just to kind of bait the doc. And I said, What are your thoughts on corrective exercise specialists? And those acronyms you see with trainers. Laughed. Fucking ridiculous. So in the eyes of actual medical professionals, we are flaunting around all these acronyms that make us feel better. But in actuality, it's doing the exact opposite. You may go home to grandma or your mom and say, Mom, look what I got. My C E S, P E S W L S. And I also got a social media specialist. Like, oh, Johnny, you little fucker, here's a little cookie, way to go. It makes you feel better. But what are you doing for your clients? And ultimately, you need to take a step back and ask yourself when it comes to your continuing education, is it hands-on? Do you have a physical therapist on your team, a registered dietitian? That's what gives you the ability to charge more and level yourself up because trainers don't have that. They want all the acronyms because they're seeking validation. But from who? I'm going to read you an article, a little excerpt from an article from Paul Ingram. Don't get caught in the corrective exercise trap. And he makes reference to some very prominent movement experts, authors Nick Tumulennel, Jason Silvernail, Ben Cormac. Those are pain scientists. Nick's a personal trainer. I interviewed him in my book. And they talk about the corrective exercise trap. And in this, it says, How are deficiencies and risk identified anyway? Can anyone actually do that? And even if so, can precise exercise prescriptions actually solve anything? In order to spot a physical flaw that needs to be corrected, one must begin by having a reliable measure of whether or not it is actually problematic in the first place. Spoiler alert: there is no such reliable measure. Corrective exercise is built on wistful thinking. Screening for movement dysfunctions has been failing one fair scientific test after another. The importance of posture has been wildly exaggerated. The importance of anatomical variation has been virtually ignored. It has a few other lines I want to read from here. Exercise in general is far more valuable from a therapeutic perspective than is often thought in corrective exercise belief circles. And then it goes on to say when clients are told such things about themselves from an authority figure, such as a personal trainer or corrective exercise evaluation, that this potentially makes one's clients less resilient and more prone to injury and pain. That's crazy. So you identify people as broken, you have upper cross syndrome. This muscle is tight and this one's lengthened. What are you telling them? That's why you have to beg the question if you were to get one of these certifications for whatever fucking reason, do they get into the biopsychosocial model of pain? Because that psychology is maybe even more important in their outcomes than the steps that you're going to take with the modalities. Yeah, doing some stretching and some soft tissue work can be very beneficial. Overload the tissue maybe for an exercise or two. But what is the rest of the workout looking like? And that's exactly what this physical therapist and I talked about. Maybe five, eight minutes on the corrective strategy, if you want to call it. And we call it that because it is a buzzword. We're going to get big organizations to reach out and say, hey, can you come teach a corrective exercise class? Because all the trainers, that's their lingo. Oh, I want a corrective exercise. That's cool. I want to add that to my tool belt. But can you even tell me the 17 muscles of the shoulder? Today I just did a post on the eight actions of the scapula. That's one and that's easy. But can you tell me the muscles that move the bone with protraction and retraction, upward rotation, downward rotation, elevation, depression, then anterior and posterior tilt. If you can't do that, then you're missing the forest for the trees. I love that ideum describing when someone is too involved in small details to understand the larger, more specific situation at hand. Do you know your anatomy? When they say C7, C6, do you know where that is? Most trainers do. But what comes out of the spine? Those are nerves. That's the peripheral nervous system. Where are they going? What are they innervating? What is that muscle doing? The rhomboids, what do they do? If you're a personal trainer and you can't take me through the basic anatomy and the actions, that's where you should be focusing your time. Not trying to get a special certification that's going to make three gold stars on your wall. It gives you internal validation, but in actuality, you are still scared. That imposter syndrome is going to be knocking you over the head because you truly don't understand movement. Great trainers understand the human body. The average trainer barely understands their own. And don't get me wrong, I'm not saying we're going to be practicing as physical therapists. No, you need to know your scope. And that's why Doc said if there's something going on with the peripheral symptoms such as numbing or burning, that's when you got to refer out. But how hard is it to say to your client, I am confident that I can get you out of pain. Worst case scenario, I make a referral over. And this was the MRI that they send over. And then when they come in in person, it's a lot worse than you think. And you say, no, I just want to continue to get your blood pressure and some basic tests, but I don't feel comfortable going through an upper body assessment because some of the things that you're telling me, it's not good, to be honest. I work with a lot of clients and I can help them get out of pain, but I know my line. So what I want to do is schedule an appointment with you and doc. I'm going to be there that day. Let me know when it is. If it's at your gym, it's a whole nother situation because that's easier. But if you're in a lifetime or an LA Fitness, wherever you're at, go to the therapy session with the client. And then you network with the therapist. You get their number, you offer to take them to lunch, dinner, happy hour, whatever it is. Pay their hourly rate. Don't pick their brain for free because therapists are frustrated with what trainers are doing. Go to social media, see all this fuckery. And that's the perception of what personal trainers are doing. So if you just say, I can't pick your brain for a few minutes, I always want to get some more information. That therapist is thinking you're going to go and start doing inappropriate things with battle ropes and bosu balls because you don't know how to optimally move. Movement is the best medicine. But this is fun because when you have a situation like this, it's great to learn more. I'm the furthest person on social media online podcast who's against continuous education. I'm all for it. But you have to ask the certifications that you're getting, are there hands-on opportunities? Do you get to ask questions to physical therapists and doctors and movement experts? Can you get a response back within the day? I'm not talking about a call center somewhere else. I saw a funny post on NASA the other day. Someone was giving them shit because they've outsourced all their communication to third parties. You cannot talk to a representative. They want your widget because that's how they survive. Ask me this. When was the last time they reached out and said, How's your career going? Is there something that we can offer you that's going to make you a better trainer? And I'm not just talking about give us money for the next certification, but maybe we can connect you with a therapist or movement expert that's going to make you a better trainer because the better trainer you are, the more people you can help. And that's exactly why you got into this. I don't think that's happening, but I could be wrong. I'm a believer in teams. Show up fitness is a believer in teams. You need to build your team. Your net work is your net worth. And you need to reach out to physical therapists. And it's okay if you're new and you're thinking like, oh my God, eight actions of the scapula. Fuck, my textbook only has four. I didn't know there was eight. And what the muscles are that move that, oh my god, protraction. I didn't know that the pec minor in the serratus anterior protracted the scapula. I'm screwed. No, that's a victim mentality. You need to think, that's awesome. I'm going to get a flashcard or I'm going to use a little quizlet within my phone and my notepad and I'm going to write out protraction. I'm going to have a QR that I can click on and I can watch what the scapula is doing. Maybe you get an anatomy app. And then you look at the muscles that are doing it. That builds your competency so you can have these conversations with therapists. Because if you went into a therapist and said, I'm looking to network with a therapist, here's an MRI. I have no idea what it's saying. What does that C mean? Does it mean like Chris? Because he's awesome and he has a giant belt buckle. What is what does that mean? What's posterior disc oste phiviat? What does that even mean? The therapist is going to look at you like an idiot, but they're not going to say anything. You're saying, you know what? I'm actually really busy right now. How about you schedule time to come back? They're going to be polite and professional for the most part, I think. I hope, maybe, maybe not. Build your team and you're going to be set up for success. Now, with that being said, I'm not bashing people that have these corrective exercise certs. I taught this stuff for 10 years at a school. And it's a textbook at home test. You literally take the test at home. So where's the accountability? It's just a multiple choice test. What is happening when your client has an overactive adductor magnus? Do you foam roll? Do you throw a med ball at a wall? Do you refer out to a practitioner? Or do you do this? Oh, it's probably foam roll the adductor magnus because it's quote unquote overactive. But think about for a second what you're doing to your clients when you diagnose them with this terminology. You have lower cross syndrome, you have knee valgus. Oh, we're going to do 30 minutes of correctives while you're breathing into a balloon. Where's the overload? Is that person even strong? What I would do with this individual, my mind goes full body. I'm taking it that they're a little older. I could be completely wrong. Let's pretend like they're in their 60s or 70s. We're going to go through a CCA. We're going to squat. Probably not going to hold a kettlebell or a dumbbell in front of them because maybe it's a little too much compression for the time being. Let's just do a body weight squat, followed by an elevated push-up. We're not driving through the traps. We're keeping the elbows down. And then we're going to do a plank and I'm going to teach them the difference between protraction and retraction. And we're not driving through the upper traps because that could irritate them. We do a couple of rounds. We move into the next circuit. We're going to do a step up into a banded row, making sure it's through mid-back, drawing down more depression and lots of protraction, retraction versus elevation. And then I'm going to get into another ab variant if that's what they want, or maybe a bicep curl. If they need some balance, I'll stand on one leg while I do a curl. In that last circuit, I'm going to do a hinge on the ground, a floor bridge, followed by a face pull, complementing what I did earlier with the band pull. And then we're going to do something that they would love to do. What's an exercise or a machine in here that you'd like to be more competent with? You make it fun. You don't make them scared, but you encourage them that you're the professional. Anytime if something feels off, just let me know. We will regress it to something more appropriate. And if they show you that they're a lot more competent with movement than you initially believed, then you will know how to progress. I'm not saying you can never back squat or do any of these more advanced movements. You start with the low-hanging fruit and then you get stronger. Today I had a client who's in her 60s and she pulled 150 pounds. That's her body weight. If we had a corrective exercise specialist working with her, the last three years we'd be doing band pull apart and fucking clams the entire time. And she'll be like, I'm not getting stronger. I don't feel any better. You need the progressive overload. So the take-home from this, I don't care who you heard it from, but mind pump said that the best certification is corrective exercise. How much are these guys getting paid from NASA? I don't know. Actually, I have a source, I have a really good idea, but I'm not going to disclose it. On the record, off the record, we can have some beers or some whiskey. I like Pappy Van Winkle and we can talk about it. I know everything that goes on in the industry. I've been here for 20 years. I have some of the best therapists, doctors, registered dietitians, professors. And I talk to them on a daily, weekly basis. We're continuing to improve and involve the industry. What is the intent from that endorsement? Those guys, are they even training? They're talking about a certification they got 20 years ago. What is the current evidence support? If you're learning from someone, do they have a team? Or are they trying to sell you their cultish following? You have to get the FMS. It's all about FMS, FMS, SMFA. It's just more of that stuff, all based off of postural analysis. And I know this is a tricky situation today because posture is such a, it's like longevity. It's very popular. When a client comes in, I don't say, oh, posture is fucking stupid, Bill. It's shut up. What are you talking about? I let them talk. I say, okay, let me show you some moves here. Let's get your posterior chain a little stronger. I'll be willing to bet a lot of that discomfort you're experiencing because we're sitting at a desk all day and we're not moving optimally. We're not taking the scapula through its eight actions that we should be doing. Let me actually show you over here on the skeleton. Let me show you on a muscle chart. And then they're saying, wow, this trainer actually knows some stuff. I feel confident working with you. And just your confidence and understanding anatomy and movement is going to make that session a lot more enjoyable. And there's a good chance if their pain's going to come down just from that placebo effect because of your confidence. Don't scare people. Don't tell them they're broken. Don't tell them they're fragile. But if they do have serious symptoms that you're not comfortable with, that's when you refer out. And in the beginning, that's okay. You can reach out to a therapist and be like, I'm going through this soft tissue course with Show Up Fitness. I'm sure you've heard of them. They got some great partners, Dr. Waterberry, the prehab guys. They work closely with Dr. Farnsworth and a lot of great therapists out there. Are you getting information from people who are in the trenches? Maybe you're going through MPTI and you have a great coach like Dr. David. He's an anatomy instructor there out of Phoenix. That's awesome. That is way more valuable than any textbook certification because you're learning from him hands-on. You need to learn hands-on. That's the takeaway from this. If you're at a gym and they say, Oh, we need CEUs and I just want the cheapest one, ask yourself, is this going to allow for you to charge more? Are your clients going to get the results faster? Is your confidence going to grow? Or are you doing it just to do it? And that's why our certification is for life, because you don't need to go chase these continued education units just for fuck's sake. You have the competency, but we expect you to continue to grow and learn and build your team. I had a great conversation with Boujan, one of our interns over the weekend while he was in New Jersey. We'll be in Dumbo the 20th and 21st, New York, a couple of weeks, and then Houston, 13th and 14th of March, Oakland, 27th, 28th. And we're finalizing our Q2 seminar, hands-on learning, where you get to ask questions. And he said he's working with a therapist right now and he's gotten a couple referrals. And he was a little frustrated because he was hoping for more. I said, No, you got to think of this. That's awesome. Why don't you have more therapists? Do you have a pelvic floor therapist? Do you have a therapist who's a girl? Do you have a therapist who specializes in hip mobility, ACL tears? Increase your network. Have 10 therapists. Because if each one of them is sending you two clients per year, that's 20 additional solid leads who should be paying you what those therapists are charging. That's why I encourage you to go to therapists who charge a couple hundred bucks an hour. I'm going to be in New York and I've reached out to a couple of therapists who charge$400 for their assessment. Those are the types of therapists who I want to be networking with because they're thinking bigger. They know their value. I know my value. I know the value in this program. And the product speaks for itself. So if you're frustrated because you have that sunk cost because you have a CES and you have to get it, I would challenge you to put it aside for now. Focus on getting a therapist and then Your time on the weekends, if you want to go through that material, click the yes, no, click the A, B, C answers, whatever. But think twice before you throw that in your bio because other movement experts are gonna roll their eyes at it. And you wanna be respected. And you're gonna be respected by mastering the basics, movement patterns, programming, assessing clients in pain, understanding the biopsychosocial model of pain, anatomy. Get into anatomy, love anatomy. The better you are with anatomy, you are gonna be significantly further away from the average trainer. Hopefully, y'all found this helpful. Get to a seminar and remember big biceps are better than small ones, and keep showing up.