Your Therapist Needs Therapy
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Your Therapist Needs Therapy
Your Therapist Needs Therapy 147 - Does Reality Even Matter Anymore?
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When the news feels like a fever dream, it's easy to ask whether truth even matters anymore. This week we look at propaganda's long history through authoritarian regimes, dystopian fiction, and how this all affects our collective mental health. Spoiler: reality always wins. It just takes longer than we'd like. Can’t believe I forgot to mention that the literal book on propaganda was written by Freud’s nephew! I’m slipping. This nugget exists for the three people who read podcast show notes, I see you.
As always, Jeremy has all his practice info at Wellness with Jer, and you can find him on Instagram and YouTube. To show your love for the show you can pick up some merch! We appreciate support from likes, follows, and shares as well! None of my online work would be possible without my media maven Kenny, so check out their work as well at kenlingdesign.com
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Podcasts about therapy do not replace actual therapy, and listening to a podcast about therapy does not signify a therapeutic relationship.If you or someone you know is in crisis please call or text the nationwide crisis line at 988, or text HELLO to 741741. The Trevor Project has a crisis line for LGBTQ+ young people that can be reached by texting 678678.
Hey, what's up, everybody?
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My name is Jeremy Schumacher.
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I am a licensed marriage and family
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therapist.
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It's Star Wars week, y'all.
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Happy Star Wars week.
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recording very late this week uh on
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revenge of the fifth which is what i
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personally choose to celebrate uh although
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all you jedi loving may the fourthers
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would have already celebrated i forget
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what the sixth is some other sith joke
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i i've seen a meme that goes up
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to like the tenth of may for star
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wars week so if y'all are celebrating
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enjoy uh i should probably do a youtube
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video on like the cults in star wars
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but this is your therapist needs therapy a
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podcast about mental health and how all of
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us need help with our mental health
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especially in these times of crumbling
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empire um
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Yeah,
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I don't want to talk about politics every
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week,
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but I don't talk about my clients on
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the podcast, right?
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That would be a gross...
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conflict of interest and break their uh
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confidentiality even if i i didn't talk
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specifically about any of them but some of
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them do listen hey y'all and uh i
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i do talk about themes and things that
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come up not just uh in my clients
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that i see currently but you know really
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since opening my own practice coming up on
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five years
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Nothing will make you feel old like that.
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Time's been weird since COVID, right?
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Probably is five years this week.
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I should probably celebrate.
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I'm ill-prepared for that.
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Happy Star Wars week and fifth year
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anniversary of wellness with Jer.
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But what comes up a lot in session,
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not always the main thing we talk about
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in session,
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but one of the things that even in
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just our little chit chat and people are
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like, but Jeremy, how are you doing?
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Because my clients are lovely humans and
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do care about me too.
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Just the sense of existential dread,
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being aware that the empire is crumbling,
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being aware that we're not the good guys.
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we never were in history america as empire
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uh i don't know i think throwing a
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boycott with the boston tea party was the
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height of our good guyness and after that
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it's been a bunch of bad stuff so
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that's not a well thought out thought so
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history buffs don't come at me about that
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that's just off the cuff here because i
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didn't prep an intro if you can't tell
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But one of the things that's coming up
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in addition to the existential dread is
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just sort of this idea that we're really
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swimming upstream against a machine that
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doesn't care about reality.
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And that is taxing.
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That is tiring for our brains.
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We have a president who just yesterday
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went on a ramble,
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because of course he did,
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about
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what he thinks is an iq test but
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what is actually a cognitive functioning
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test for people who have alzheimer's and
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dementia so again we have a president
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who's going on live television uh talking
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about
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his dementia test.
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Anybody who's sort of been tracking
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Trump's health knows he goes for a
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medication injection,
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which is why his hands are all janked
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up at the early part of the month
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because he's getting dementia medication.
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And you know,
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we're just supposed to ignore that.
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So we have a president who's talking about
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his dementia, who's in the Epstein files,
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who's grossly corrupt and enriching
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himself along with his family members.
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who's engaging in an illegal military
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action in Iran,
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whose Secretary of Defense is lying to
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Congress, perjuring himself in real time.
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We have an armed occupying police force,
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probably illegally as well.
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existing we have the supreme court gutting
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the voting rights act and saying that
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gerrymandering uh on racist grounds is
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legal as long as you can't prove it's
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just racism which legally is a very high
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bar and immediately the state that started
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jim crow brought it back and halted a
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primary so you know like that's just this
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week
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like that's a lot of stuff uh there's
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an ongoing several ongoing genocides
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across the world there's climate change
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throughout all of this and so you know
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the question for this week that i wanted
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to tackle from a mental health perspective
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and normalize for the people who are
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struggling with it and talk a little bit
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about how i handle it how i talk
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about it with my clients how they can
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handle it and how you dear podcast
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listener can also hopefully handle it um
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does reality even matter anymore?
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And when you're dealing with fascism,
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with an authoritarian government that is
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employing a high degree of propaganda
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in unison with a capital class that has
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uh captured most of the wealth in the
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country and owns all of the media it
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can feel really alienating to be like yeah
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but that's not true right rfk jr uh
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talking about eliminating racism
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And then a senator correctly asking him,
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yes,
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but we lead the world in maternal deaths
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of black women.
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Shouldn't that demographic be studied
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more?
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Shouldn't that be a cause for concern?
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And he was just like, nah,
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we solved racism.
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And, you know, that's infuriating.
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Maha is a good example of like,
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we're making america healthy again by
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getting rid of red forty which is a
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win i won't won't fight against that uh
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and then also taking payoffs from major
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polluters so that glyphosate which is a
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carcinogen can get put back into things
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and continue to kill our crops and make
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things less healthy for us like it's it's
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soviet level propaganda of like double
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think
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and again like it's infuriating right i
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can go on and on and on and
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give example after example uh our
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president is a pedophile the richest man
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in the world who is not an american
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citizen uh did a bunch of illegal during
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the election um you know even just like
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i'm not even getting into like the
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religious stuff here of like mike johnson
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and pete hegseth and the new apostolic
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reform wilson
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Y'all have heard me talk about that
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before.
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If you don't know who any of those
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people are, hey, welcome.
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Listen to some older episodes.
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I talk about that stuff a lot because
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religious trauma is one of my specialties.
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But religious trauma being one of my
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specialties does inform sort of where this
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cognitive dissonance goes.
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And that's a bit of a bummer because
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I will tell you,
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a lot of cults don't disband when their
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leader is proven to be a liar.
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A lot of religious movements are
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continually updated and changed when
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they're proven to be false.
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And so, yeah,
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we're going to start with like belief
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systems, right?
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And when it comes to propaganda,
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a lot of times people are performing
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belief, right?
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I don't think a lot of people in
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Trump's cabinet are as stupid as he is
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or are demented as he is.
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I just think they're wealthy assholes and
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they don't really care who gets hurt as
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long as they can be wealthy.
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So they perform the belief system.
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They perform the party line while not
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believing it.
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And again,
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we have historical examples of this.
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We certainly have it with the Soviet Union
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under Stalin.
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We have it in China with Mao.
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We have it with the Germans, Nazi Germany.
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We have it with
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Reagan, you know, like at home, I'm not,
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I'm not pretending to put America on a
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pedestal here.
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Like we've been deeply propagandized as a
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country from the get go manifest destiny.
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Um,
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All sorts of bullshit.
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But again,
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we have sort of these historic examples of
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not just cults,
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because the reason cults aren't
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necessarily a good example and won't make
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you feel better right now is because by
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and large, cults are pretty small.
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Now,
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if you want to talk about Catholicism or
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mainstream Christianity as a cult,
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we certainly can do that.
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I would refer to those things as cults.
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And those are a better example.
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So we have to look at like larger
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systems, bigger,
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almost more institutional propaganda and
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what happens there because I think it
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matters.
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you know,
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spoiler alert for the end of the episode,
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but like, yes, reality does still matter.
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And the historical precedent is that
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reality does tend to win out.
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It just takes longer than we individual
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humans would like because systemic change
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and institutional shifts and cultural
00:10:14.565 --> 00:10:18.446
shifts for a entire society take longer
00:10:18.586 --> 00:10:20.206
than generally possible.
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I wouldn't say a person's lifespan,
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but what our cognition can really process
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in a particular moment.
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If you think about somebody who was a
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young person during the civil rights
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movements in the nineteen sixties,
00:10:35.011 --> 00:10:36.711
they'd be in their sixties or seventies,
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more realistically,
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their seventies now to see something that
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they fought so hard for get gutted by
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a bunch of bought and paid for corrupt
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racists from the Heritage Foundation who
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now sit on the Supreme Court.
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What a bummer.
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Yeah, I mean,
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that's just an actual bummer.
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And the Supreme Court isn't dealing in
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reality.
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Bremerton's the case that I talk about the
00:11:00.934 --> 00:11:01.274
most,
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in which a high school football coach sued
00:11:05.157 --> 00:11:06.697
all the way to the Supreme Court that
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he lost his job as a football coach
00:11:09.057 --> 00:11:13.599
because he was inviting members of the
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football team to pray in what the Supreme
00:11:16.379 --> 00:11:17.860
Court ruled was a private...
00:11:19.621 --> 00:11:24.167
moment of true faith when he was demanding
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that his players would join him at the
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fifty yard line and very publicly
00:11:28.451 --> 00:11:31.875
participate in a public prayer and the
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Supreme Court the Supreme Court likes to
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pretend that not following a leader's
00:11:35.740 --> 00:11:38.802
preferred religion includes no backlash
00:11:38.822 --> 00:11:39.724
which isn't true
00:11:40.683 --> 00:11:42.384
um but again like just their use of
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like a private moment when like there's
00:11:44.186 --> 00:11:46.407
just pictures like in the court documents
00:11:46.527 --> 00:11:48.528
of like this large gathering on the fifty
00:11:48.567 --> 00:11:50.769
yard line of a football field it's not
00:11:50.788 --> 00:11:53.169
a private moment um the supreme court
00:11:54.650 --> 00:11:56.932
since citizens united has just been openly
00:11:56.971 --> 00:11:59.033
corrupt and also like stopped caring about
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reality because they're getting paid right
00:12:02.195 --> 00:12:02.254
the
00:12:02.832 --> 00:12:06.596
made bribery bribery legal as long as you
00:12:06.635 --> 00:12:08.817
wait thirty days like they're not a
00:12:08.856 --> 00:12:11.558
serious bunch of people um so again like
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that's a good example again going back to
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like the bush administration and and
00:12:15.201 --> 00:12:17.582
weapons of mass destruction and also just
00:12:17.623 --> 00:12:19.783
like the opportunity to have had al gore
00:12:19.825 --> 00:12:22.505
as our president uh and do something about
00:12:22.525 --> 00:12:25.207
climate change and instead to get w not
00:12:25.227 --> 00:12:29.230
great um
00:12:30.763 --> 00:12:31.884
And again,
00:12:31.903 --> 00:12:33.803
when we look at these things in these
00:12:33.844 --> 00:12:34.764
moments, it can be really,
00:12:35.164 --> 00:12:36.225
that's what our brain can focus on.
00:12:36.285 --> 00:12:37.385
Our brain can focus on moments.
00:12:37.446 --> 00:12:38.927
Our brain can only process so much
00:12:38.966 --> 00:12:40.167
information at a time.
00:12:41.687 --> 00:12:44.229
I am a neurodivergent human being.
00:12:44.869 --> 00:12:48.791
I also have studied and practiced systems
00:12:48.850 --> 00:12:50.851
thinking for a long time.
00:12:51.312 --> 00:12:54.614
So I tend to think between my ADHD
00:12:55.173 --> 00:12:56.975
and the systems that I
00:12:57.475 --> 00:12:59.535
learned a lot about continue to study to
00:12:59.556 --> 00:13:02.056
this day and practice on a daily basis
00:13:02.917 --> 00:13:06.857
i can hold complex ideas in my head
00:13:07.398 --> 00:13:10.038
and i'm aware of interested in and even
00:13:10.239 --> 00:13:12.519
you know intrigued by get get that
00:13:12.558 --> 00:13:15.000
dopamine hit from the way that things
00:13:15.100 --> 00:13:18.421
connect um but the human brain is limited
00:13:18.461 --> 00:13:21.961
in capacity for that even with um
00:13:23.563 --> 00:13:25.806
divergent brains that are practiced in it,
00:13:26.105 --> 00:13:28.027
we can only process so much information at
00:13:28.047 --> 00:13:28.628
a given time.
00:13:28.908 --> 00:13:30.908
And our brain is this vast supercomputer
00:13:31.330 --> 00:13:33.051
that likes to take shortcuts to conserve
00:13:33.150 --> 00:13:33.551
energy.
00:13:33.951 --> 00:13:36.953
And so our brain makes decisions on what
00:13:36.994 --> 00:13:38.875
it is dealing with and what it isn't
00:13:39.095 --> 00:13:39.596
dealing with.
00:13:39.655 --> 00:13:41.417
So when we want to be on sort
00:13:41.437 --> 00:13:42.717
of the doomerism run,
00:13:43.322 --> 00:13:45.764
We certainly can point out all these bad
00:13:45.803 --> 00:13:48.025
things and that sort of ignores that
00:13:48.125 --> 00:13:50.668
society has progressed over time,
00:13:51.389 --> 00:13:53.910
not in these specific ways or there have
00:13:53.951 --> 00:13:56.352
been back and forth because the reality of
00:13:56.394 --> 00:13:58.735
human lived experiences is complex and it
00:13:58.836 --> 00:14:01.097
is not easy to just summarize in a
00:14:01.158 --> 00:14:02.119
thirty second clip.
00:14:04.500 --> 00:14:06.802
But it's it's something that that has
00:14:06.863 --> 00:14:07.823
progressed over time,
00:14:07.844 --> 00:14:10.004
our ideas around
00:14:11.490 --> 00:14:13.792
a lot of things have shifted and changed
00:14:14.192 --> 00:14:15.793
and will continue to do so into the
00:14:15.812 --> 00:14:16.234
future.
00:14:16.594 --> 00:14:18.235
And now I'm not an old person.
00:14:18.615 --> 00:14:20.375
I mean, I'm a millennial.
00:14:20.416 --> 00:14:23.456
So I guess that's relative to how old
00:14:23.498 --> 00:14:26.198
you are when you're listening to this,
00:14:27.038 --> 00:14:28.600
but I'm not of that old, uh,
00:14:28.740 --> 00:14:29.941
sixties plus generation.
00:14:29.961 --> 00:14:30.341
That's like, ah,
00:14:30.620 --> 00:14:32.042
the young people will solve it.
00:14:32.101 --> 00:14:34.423
Like fuck off everybody with that
00:14:34.462 --> 00:14:34.984
bullshit.
00:14:35.364 --> 00:14:36.725
You could have fixed it and you didn't,
00:14:36.825 --> 00:14:37.585
you're a bad person.
00:14:37.705 --> 00:14:38.446
You got to live with that.
00:14:39.086 --> 00:14:39.225
Um,
00:14:41.195 --> 00:14:43.316
the ageism of that commentary does not
00:14:43.375 --> 00:14:47.898
bother me uh and again like we that
00:14:48.018 --> 00:14:49.719
that's who in america is in charge which
00:14:49.759 --> 00:14:51.139
is a huge part of the problem uh
00:14:51.179 --> 00:14:53.059
we have too many old people running stuff
00:14:53.200 --> 00:14:54.921
without taking any accountability for how
00:14:54.941 --> 00:14:57.101
much stuff they've ruined for future
00:14:57.142 --> 00:14:59.043
generations and then wanting to just pass
00:14:59.062 --> 00:15:03.004
the buck and say they'll solve it um
00:15:03.736 --> 00:15:04.517
They probably will,
00:15:04.616 --> 00:15:07.499
but also a shit ton of preventable harm
00:15:07.519 --> 00:15:09.500
will be done in that time that, again,
00:15:09.559 --> 00:15:10.879
it would have been better to prevent that
00:15:10.919 --> 00:15:11.921
harm.
00:15:12.120 --> 00:15:16.263
We could have adopted renewable energy a
00:15:16.283 --> 00:15:17.602
long time ago, and we didn't,
00:15:17.783 --> 00:15:19.024
so that a handful of people could be
00:15:19.083 --> 00:15:19.423
wealthy.
00:15:21.664 --> 00:15:24.025
This is veering doomerist, right?
00:15:24.145 --> 00:15:25.927
Even when I'm trying to be optimistic and
00:15:25.966 --> 00:15:27.268
hopeful intentionally,
00:15:27.687 --> 00:15:28.908
it's hard to not be like,
00:15:28.969 --> 00:15:31.490
shit sucks right now.
00:15:31.549 --> 00:15:31.950
I don't know how...
00:15:33.618 --> 00:15:35.219
If y'all have noticed, like, yes,
00:15:35.259 --> 00:15:37.900
things are expensive, but also, like,
00:15:38.760 --> 00:15:40.001
this was on Reddit the other day.
00:15:40.121 --> 00:15:41.283
I haven't seen research.
00:15:41.383 --> 00:15:43.384
I did go and look for it in
00:15:43.484 --> 00:15:45.784
the couple of academic libraries I have
00:15:45.865 --> 00:15:47.927
access to, which, again,
00:15:48.307 --> 00:15:50.768
is a flaw of science and research is
00:15:50.807 --> 00:15:52.509
that to do it well does actually take
00:15:52.568 --> 00:15:52.889
time.
00:15:53.429 --> 00:15:56.412
Reddit is a little bit more instantaneous
00:15:56.591 --> 00:15:56.831
and fast.
00:15:57.042 --> 00:16:00.089
far less scientifically accurate or
00:16:00.149 --> 00:16:00.669
rigorous,
00:16:01.010 --> 00:16:03.576
but just as sort of a perception of
00:16:04.076 --> 00:16:05.080
living is like,
00:16:05.500 --> 00:16:07.244
have y'all noticed that food is
00:16:08.631 --> 00:16:09.991
going lower in quality, which like,
00:16:10.032 --> 00:16:10.352
of course,
00:16:10.633 --> 00:16:12.072
we knew this would happen when Trump was
00:16:12.153 --> 00:16:12.592
elected.
00:16:12.972 --> 00:16:15.614
We knew this would happen when Robert RFK
00:16:15.653 --> 00:16:15.974
Jr.
00:16:15.994 --> 00:16:17.073
was put into charge.
00:16:17.114 --> 00:16:20.274
Like they cut back a ton of customer
00:16:20.735 --> 00:16:21.316
safeguards.
00:16:21.395 --> 00:16:22.916
They don't care about regular people.
00:16:22.956 --> 00:16:24.756
They, again, care about bottom lines.
00:16:24.777 --> 00:16:25.897
They're bought and paid for.
00:16:26.557 --> 00:16:29.177
And so, yeah, like,
00:16:30.048 --> 00:16:32.429
back in the day in like the early
00:16:32.470 --> 00:16:34.630
nineteen hundreds kellogg spent a ton of
00:16:34.671 --> 00:16:36.432
money seeing how much sawdust they could
00:16:36.471 --> 00:16:37.952
put in their cereal before people would
00:16:38.013 --> 00:16:40.533
notice change in the taste like
00:16:40.693 --> 00:16:42.914
corporations that are for profit will
00:16:43.034 --> 00:16:46.277
never make good decisions for their
00:16:46.317 --> 00:16:49.138
consumer base um and again in in its
00:16:49.278 --> 00:16:51.860
current time of total wealth inequality
00:16:52.796 --> 00:16:54.256
That's never been truer because you have
00:16:54.277 --> 00:16:56.278
people who aren't even concerned or
00:16:56.298 --> 00:16:57.580
connected to the company beyond
00:16:57.620 --> 00:16:59.240
shareholders who are making money off of
00:16:59.301 --> 00:17:00.422
it.
00:17:02.484 --> 00:17:03.225
So yeah,
00:17:03.264 --> 00:17:05.526
shit's getting more expensive and also
00:17:05.566 --> 00:17:05.987
worse.
00:17:06.366 --> 00:17:08.348
Even just buying ground beef recently,
00:17:08.368 --> 00:17:09.229
I've been like,
00:17:09.250 --> 00:17:10.830
this is lower quality than it used to
00:17:10.851 --> 00:17:11.010
be.
00:17:11.371 --> 00:17:12.092
Same brand,
00:17:12.471 --> 00:17:14.493
same stuff that I look for when I'm
00:17:14.513 --> 00:17:16.055
buying it because I try and be a
00:17:16.115 --> 00:17:17.076
conscious purchaser.
00:17:18.349 --> 00:17:19.810
People can be all mad that I eat
00:17:19.851 --> 00:17:20.111
meat,
00:17:20.191 --> 00:17:23.491
but so have humans throughout all of
00:17:23.531 --> 00:17:23.912
history.
00:17:26.251 --> 00:17:27.752
That's cognitive dissonance on my part
00:17:27.792 --> 00:17:28.692
because I love animals.
00:17:29.773 --> 00:17:32.013
Also, like bacon.
00:17:34.494 --> 00:17:35.815
We'll get into the cognitive dissonance.
00:17:35.855 --> 00:17:36.295
It's coming.
00:17:36.695 --> 00:17:37.476
I'm building a point.
00:17:37.536 --> 00:17:37.935
Don't worry.
00:17:39.695 --> 00:17:40.277
Apparently,
00:17:40.797 --> 00:17:42.017
I need to rant for a little bit
00:17:42.116 --> 00:17:43.538
each week for my own sanity.
00:17:44.117 --> 00:17:44.317
The
00:17:46.892 --> 00:17:49.732
the uh performative belief system is what
00:17:49.752 --> 00:17:51.653
we're talking about right and so again
00:17:51.693 --> 00:17:56.596
like this is bobby kennedy uh junior to
00:17:56.655 --> 00:17:59.477
a t i i don't you know this
00:17:59.497 --> 00:18:01.038
is jd vance to a t a bunch
00:18:01.057 --> 00:18:03.357
of people who spoke very ill of trump
00:18:03.438 --> 00:18:06.539
now bend the knee and lick the boot
00:18:06.779 --> 00:18:09.601
so that they can hopefully take over power
00:18:10.028 --> 00:18:10.329
which again,
00:18:10.369 --> 00:18:12.894
it's pretty unlikely to happen.
00:18:13.714 --> 00:18:16.539
Um, I heard somebody talking about,
00:18:16.559 --> 00:18:17.862
I don't remember where it was.
00:18:17.882 --> 00:18:21.367
Um, maybe it was Robert Evans on, uh,
00:18:21.681 --> 00:18:22.902
don't know if it's behind the bastards it
00:18:22.922 --> 00:18:24.542
could happen here but like the white house
00:18:24.583 --> 00:18:28.066
correspondence dinner who got who got
00:18:28.146 --> 00:18:29.528
secret service to take them out of the
00:18:29.567 --> 00:18:32.971
ballroom and uh who didn't is a tell
00:18:33.030 --> 00:18:34.311
and it's a reminder for the people who
00:18:34.372 --> 00:18:36.133
are spending a ton of money to be
00:18:36.173 --> 00:18:37.835
close to power that they are not actually
00:18:37.954 --> 00:18:42.578
in power and um yeah
00:18:44.010 --> 00:18:45.673
Again, reality matters, right?
00:18:45.913 --> 00:18:47.173
In life and death moments,
00:18:47.795 --> 00:18:49.135
some of those things become clarified.
00:18:50.257 --> 00:18:53.720
But what happens in these other
00:18:53.779 --> 00:18:54.461
institutions,
00:18:54.480 --> 00:18:57.583
what happened in previous societies where
00:18:57.624 --> 00:19:02.587
propaganda was really high and cultural
00:19:02.667 --> 00:19:03.608
change took place,
00:19:04.615 --> 00:19:07.278
twenty to forty years right like it tends
00:19:07.357 --> 00:19:09.960
not to be an instantaneous thing outside
00:19:10.279 --> 00:19:12.821
of very specific instances again I think
00:19:12.882 --> 00:19:15.844
covid was like a gosh I was gonna
00:19:15.864 --> 00:19:18.164
say mask off moment but that wouldn't
00:19:19.145 --> 00:19:22.448
translate well um covid showed how inept
00:19:22.508 --> 00:19:25.069
Trump and his cronies were again
00:19:27.574 --> 00:19:31.255
uh gosh just how racist america is uh
00:19:31.275 --> 00:19:34.236
and misogynistic is then we we elected him
00:19:34.276 --> 00:19:38.176
again because people are stupid and again
00:19:38.237 --> 00:19:40.357
i i do feel not bad saying that
00:19:40.417 --> 00:19:42.219
but i also hold a lot of space
00:19:42.239 --> 00:19:44.839
for people are woefully uninformed and
00:19:45.279 --> 00:19:48.580
purposefully misled in the american media
00:19:48.621 --> 00:19:49.000
culture
00:19:50.045 --> 00:19:53.685
of propaganda run amok when, you know,
00:19:53.726 --> 00:19:57.426
you have Musk working for the government,
00:19:57.527 --> 00:19:59.787
question mark, however that happened.
00:20:00.946 --> 00:20:02.928
And you have Bezos and Zuckerberg and
00:20:02.948 --> 00:20:04.607
whoever else, Larry Ellison,
00:20:05.448 --> 00:20:07.548
sitting behind Trump at his inauguration.
00:20:07.568 --> 00:20:08.368
Like,
00:20:08.808 --> 00:20:12.528
that's not a good thing when they own
00:20:12.588 --> 00:20:15.150
most of the media sphere.
00:20:15.539 --> 00:20:15.819
And again,
00:20:15.859 --> 00:20:17.500
like this is bad in the nineties, right?
00:20:17.540 --> 00:20:19.602
Like I took as a cultural studies minor
00:20:19.662 --> 00:20:21.363
in college and we talked about this in
00:20:21.383 --> 00:20:22.523
the early two thousands,
00:20:23.163 --> 00:20:23.825
mid two thousands,
00:20:23.904 --> 00:20:28.227
I guess about the big five media
00:20:28.247 --> 00:20:30.468
corporations that owned most of the media
00:20:30.567 --> 00:20:31.249
in the nineties.
00:20:31.368 --> 00:20:31.729
So like,
00:20:32.073 --> 00:20:33.973
This is not a new problem, but again,
00:20:33.993 --> 00:20:37.734
the consolidation has gotten worse.
00:20:38.694 --> 00:20:40.316
And again,
00:20:40.355 --> 00:20:41.875
just the concentration of wealth.
00:20:41.915 --> 00:20:44.156
So Bezos can just like buy the Washington
00:20:44.196 --> 00:20:47.157
Post and regularly publish opinion pieces
00:20:47.817 --> 00:20:49.858
about how taxing billionaires is bad.
00:20:51.249 --> 00:20:53.852
can have union workers arrested,
00:20:54.353 --> 00:20:55.453
or not even union workers,
00:20:55.473 --> 00:20:57.655
people who are trying to unionize Amazon
00:20:57.717 --> 00:21:00.539
arrested while funding the Met Gala so
00:21:00.579 --> 00:21:02.821
that he can feel like he's loved.
00:21:06.325 --> 00:21:09.826
He's not.
00:21:09.866 --> 00:21:10.987
So what happens, right?
00:21:11.027 --> 00:21:12.807
We have people who are performing belief.
00:21:13.268 --> 00:21:15.489
Some of those people do actually come to
00:21:15.568 --> 00:21:17.089
believe those things.
00:21:17.230 --> 00:21:17.549
Again,
00:21:17.670 --> 00:21:19.730
I tend to think the current
00:21:19.830 --> 00:21:20.731
administration,
00:21:20.932 --> 00:21:22.613
the current regime here in America is
00:21:22.692 --> 00:21:25.693
mostly sycophants and not true believers.
00:21:26.213 --> 00:21:28.035
I think somebody like Pete Hegseth is very
00:21:28.075 --> 00:21:29.816
stupid and probably has brain damage,
00:21:29.855 --> 00:21:32.416
but also might be a true believer in
00:21:32.958 --> 00:21:35.239
the wartime Christian propaganda stuff.
00:21:36.003 --> 00:21:37.304
Mike Johnson's harder to tell.
00:21:37.944 --> 00:21:39.045
I don't think he's...
00:21:40.025 --> 00:21:41.205
I just think he's so much better at
00:21:41.246 --> 00:21:42.546
pretending to be a true believer.
00:21:45.086 --> 00:21:47.086
But, like, again, Trump is just a grifter.
00:21:47.248 --> 00:21:51.308
He's just a con man who's deeply, deep,
00:21:51.348 --> 00:21:52.689
deep, deep into dementia.
00:21:53.609 --> 00:21:53.869
J.D.
00:21:53.890 --> 00:21:55.990
Vance, again, I think, is performing.
00:21:56.170 --> 00:21:57.730
I don't think he believes much of it
00:21:57.810 --> 00:21:58.211
at all.
00:21:58.810 --> 00:22:03.673
So, you know... Not great.
00:22:04.333 --> 00:22:04.512
And...
00:22:05.026 --> 00:22:06.227
This has happened before, right?
00:22:06.326 --> 00:22:11.249
So Soviet propaganda fell apart,
00:22:11.548 --> 00:22:12.789
but like slowly, right?
00:22:12.809 --> 00:22:13.609
That's my point here.
00:22:13.670 --> 00:22:15.171
And I do tend to go back to
00:22:15.230 --> 00:22:17.112
historical precedent because human beings
00:22:18.471 --> 00:22:20.732
have evolved over time and do change,
00:22:20.792 --> 00:22:22.054
but kind of slowly.
00:22:23.414 --> 00:22:23.855
And again,
00:22:23.914 --> 00:22:25.455
like the thing with the internet,
00:22:26.236 --> 00:22:28.096
it opened a lot of doors that didn't
00:22:28.136 --> 00:22:28.777
exist before.
00:22:28.836 --> 00:22:30.357
People's access to knowledge, people's
00:22:31.190 --> 00:22:32.289
potential to connect.
00:22:32.369 --> 00:22:34.010
And then the same sort of stuff happened
00:22:34.030 --> 00:22:36.750
with propaganda and the concentration of
00:22:36.810 --> 00:22:37.230
wealth.
00:22:37.811 --> 00:22:39.392
That's the human piece of it.
00:22:39.971 --> 00:22:41.491
We're not talking about innovation and all
00:22:41.531 --> 00:22:42.252
these other things.
00:22:44.053 --> 00:22:46.814
Uber disrupting public transportation.
00:22:47.253 --> 00:22:47.814
No, it didn't.
00:22:48.314 --> 00:22:50.194
Streaming disrupting the cable industry.
00:22:50.295 --> 00:22:50.815
No, it didn't.
00:22:51.335 --> 00:22:53.255
These things are just other people want to
00:22:53.275 --> 00:22:54.035
be in power,
00:22:54.315 --> 00:22:56.296
not that they're actually interested in
00:22:58.032 --> 00:22:59.113
not even reforming,
00:22:59.192 --> 00:23:01.513
let alone revolutionizing some of these
00:23:01.574 --> 00:23:02.094
industries.
00:23:03.193 --> 00:23:06.214
So some of that stuff hasn't really gone
00:23:06.275 --> 00:23:09.895
anywhere in our lifetimes outside of the
00:23:09.955 --> 00:23:11.076
access to information,
00:23:11.096 --> 00:23:12.596
which I do think is huge,
00:23:12.616 --> 00:23:14.356
which is why these incredibly wealthy
00:23:14.376 --> 00:23:16.518
people keep fighting against it and buying
00:23:16.577 --> 00:23:19.478
up chunks of access to the internet is
00:23:19.538 --> 00:23:21.699
why right-wingers
00:23:23.125 --> 00:23:25.227
always with security, always with safety,
00:23:25.366 --> 00:23:25.586
right?
00:23:25.666 --> 00:23:27.347
Taking away your rights under the guise of
00:23:27.387 --> 00:23:27.788
safety.
00:23:28.607 --> 00:23:30.749
Are pushing for like age verification
00:23:30.769 --> 00:23:32.309
bills because like they don't want people
00:23:32.349 --> 00:23:33.951
to have free access to internet.
00:23:34.010 --> 00:23:35.570
They certainly don't want it to be free
00:23:36.011 --> 00:23:37.652
and they don't want it to be not
00:23:38.032 --> 00:23:38.932
propagandized.
00:23:39.315 --> 00:23:39.515
right?
00:23:39.694 --> 00:23:43.218
These totalitarian governments always have
00:23:43.538 --> 00:23:44.939
tried to control the arts,
00:23:45.058 --> 00:23:46.519
tried to control publication,
00:23:46.579 --> 00:23:48.881
tried to control the flow of information
00:23:49.521 --> 00:23:51.823
because that's necessary for propaganda.
00:23:51.982 --> 00:23:53.624
You can't let dissent exist,
00:23:54.944 --> 00:23:56.506
which is wildly at odds with the
00:23:56.546 --> 00:23:58.728
propaganda of America, which again,
00:23:59.288 --> 00:24:01.890
the people who cry free speech the most
00:24:01.970 --> 00:24:02.930
are the ones who are trying to take
00:24:02.950 --> 00:24:03.851
it away for other people.
00:24:04.790 --> 00:24:06.472
So, but what happens, right?
00:24:06.653 --> 00:24:06.772
Well,
00:24:07.733 --> 00:24:12.959
With Mao in China, like famine happens,
00:24:12.979 --> 00:24:13.759
right?
00:24:13.838 --> 00:24:15.421
And at some point,
00:24:16.362 --> 00:24:18.063
there is no amount of propaganda.
00:24:18.343 --> 00:24:21.526
There is no amount of performing belief in
00:24:21.586 --> 00:24:23.708
spite of your cognitive dissonance that
00:24:23.748 --> 00:24:25.549
will overcome people don't have enough to
00:24:25.690 --> 00:24:27.531
eat, right?
00:24:27.592 --> 00:24:28.451
And like, yeah,
00:24:28.613 --> 00:24:30.473
millions of people died really bad.
00:24:31.575 --> 00:24:33.436
The Soviet Union, right?
00:24:34.894 --> 00:24:39.678
Corruption, story of most humanity, right?
00:24:39.798 --> 00:24:43.421
Again, I think there are other movements.
00:24:43.500 --> 00:24:45.422
I think both socialism and communism are
00:24:45.501 --> 00:24:47.143
better than capitalism.
00:24:47.903 --> 00:24:50.945
And without the correct safeguards in
00:24:50.986 --> 00:24:52.126
place, bad people,
00:24:52.186 --> 00:24:53.827
bad faith actors corrupt society.
00:24:54.188 --> 00:24:56.690
politicians will still ruin what could be
00:24:56.789 --> 00:24:58.871
otherwise a functional system but again
00:24:58.911 --> 00:25:00.811
that concentration of power regardless of
00:25:00.852 --> 00:25:03.213
what we're calling it whatever uh ism
00:25:03.233 --> 00:25:05.375
we're attaching to it as an ethos doesn't
00:25:05.394 --> 00:25:08.778
really matter if power gets concentrated
00:25:09.417 --> 00:25:14.201
so the uh the realities there are
00:25:15.806 --> 00:25:17.906
what broke the propaganda now did the
00:25:17.926 --> 00:25:19.928
propaganda fire back up like yeah mao very
00:25:19.968 --> 00:25:23.648
specifically had not just propaganda for
00:25:23.689 --> 00:25:26.049
his regime but then he started a secondary
00:25:26.089 --> 00:25:29.671
propaganda for what went wrong with the
00:25:29.711 --> 00:25:33.012
first propaganda um the soviet union you
00:25:33.113 --> 00:25:35.093
know i did uh if you're listening to
00:25:35.113 --> 00:25:36.153
the podcast i didn't know i had a
00:25:36.173 --> 00:25:37.875
youtube channel this is my second plug of
00:25:37.894 --> 00:25:38.634
the youtube channel
00:25:39.355 --> 00:25:42.196
how unbearable for myself.
00:25:42.277 --> 00:25:43.478
I really hate talking about myself,
00:25:43.518 --> 00:25:45.299
but I did a review of the HBO
00:25:45.319 --> 00:25:46.840
miniseries Chernobyl,
00:25:46.901 --> 00:25:47.882
and I think that was really good.
00:25:48.182 --> 00:25:49.462
And I talked about a lot of stuff
00:25:49.482 --> 00:25:52.486
there about like cognitive dissonance and
00:25:52.526 --> 00:25:54.267
what state sponsored propaganda can do to
00:25:54.307 --> 00:25:54.606
people.
00:25:54.727 --> 00:25:57.390
And when it fails, like the Chernobyl
00:25:58.492 --> 00:26:00.713
Accident was a really good example of like
00:26:00.854 --> 00:26:01.094
yeah,
00:26:01.454 --> 00:26:04.695
this was a problem this was Gorbachev says
00:26:04.736 --> 00:26:07.436
Chernobyl was a turning point where people
00:26:07.698 --> 00:26:11.058
not only were like distrusting of the
00:26:11.098 --> 00:26:13.500
government and especially like the KGB and
00:26:13.519 --> 00:26:15.221
like the propaganda associated there,
00:26:15.280 --> 00:26:18.442
but also like it fell flat on its
00:26:18.482 --> 00:26:20.824
face in front of a world audience and
00:26:20.844 --> 00:26:20.903
and
00:26:22.596 --> 00:26:25.579
yeah i mean there was like pride and
00:26:25.680 --> 00:26:28.403
civil duty in the people who worked to
00:26:28.423 --> 00:26:30.223
keep that disaster from getting worse
00:26:30.285 --> 00:26:31.605
which the show did a nice job of
00:26:31.645 --> 00:26:35.710
showing but it was people not propaganda
00:26:36.329 --> 00:26:39.012
and so you know the waning power with
00:26:39.053 --> 00:26:41.255
those things shows through i think what is
00:26:41.275 --> 00:26:42.856
going to happen with
00:26:43.702 --> 00:26:46.464
hopefully the best possible outcome is
00:26:46.565 --> 00:26:50.048
conservatism in america uh goes away under
00:26:50.067 --> 00:26:51.788
the republican heading and the democratic
00:26:51.828 --> 00:26:53.971
party shifts into an actual progressive
00:26:54.010 --> 00:26:56.732
party and then splits off into a
00:26:57.133 --> 00:26:59.035
center-right conservative party which is
00:26:59.075 --> 00:27:01.656
what it currently is um i don't think
00:27:01.676 --> 00:27:03.617
that'll happen that seems unlikely i hope
00:27:03.657 --> 00:27:05.660
to be wrong because again i also like
00:27:05.680 --> 00:27:06.941
didn't think trump would win a second
00:27:06.980 --> 00:27:10.403
election so i tend not to prognosticate on
00:27:10.462 --> 00:27:11.304
politics because
00:27:11.920 --> 00:27:13.340
It's not a thing I've studied a ton.
00:27:13.701 --> 00:27:15.521
I have studied mental health a ton and
00:27:15.561 --> 00:27:17.123
I know that people change slowly over
00:27:17.163 --> 00:27:19.163
time.
00:27:19.203 --> 00:27:19.584
So again,
00:27:19.703 --> 00:27:20.924
I don't think the ideal would happen
00:27:20.944 --> 00:27:22.026
because I feel like that's too big of
00:27:22.086 --> 00:27:24.826
a shift, but what's the reality right now?
00:27:25.567 --> 00:27:26.327
Things suck.
00:27:26.708 --> 00:27:29.990
Gas prices are obliterating people and
00:27:30.029 --> 00:27:34.291
will get worse as stockpiles run short and
00:27:34.352 --> 00:27:35.732
climate change continues to be a problem,
00:27:35.752 --> 00:27:35.932
right?
00:27:36.093 --> 00:27:37.433
Um,
00:27:37.869 --> 00:27:39.670
not just because of the iran war but
00:27:39.690 --> 00:27:41.611
like the iran war will be the thing
00:27:41.730 --> 00:27:46.372
that uh dictates a huge shift in the
00:27:46.412 --> 00:27:48.932
midterms even with all the fuckery i still
00:27:48.992 --> 00:27:50.813
fully expect the republican party to pull
00:27:50.853 --> 00:27:52.513
between now and then like canceling
00:27:52.554 --> 00:27:56.355
primaries and redrawing maps um people are
00:27:56.394 --> 00:27:58.835
mad because stuff's too expensive as
00:27:59.234 --> 00:28:02.195
restrictions and regulations roll back on
00:28:02.256 --> 00:28:04.636
companies they don't make better choices
00:28:04.676 --> 00:28:05.057
they just
00:28:06.012 --> 00:28:08.473
extract wealth from the average person and
00:28:08.753 --> 00:28:09.213
run away,
00:28:09.554 --> 00:28:11.835
hopefully before the problems get too bad.
00:28:11.855 --> 00:28:12.134
So like,
00:28:12.175 --> 00:28:14.856
we do need to hold big oil executives
00:28:14.896 --> 00:28:15.416
to account.
00:28:15.457 --> 00:28:16.997
We do need to hold these tech people
00:28:17.317 --> 00:28:17.798
to account.
00:28:17.938 --> 00:28:20.219
Again, the idea that like on X,
00:28:20.318 --> 00:28:21.499
I don't know if this is still true
00:28:21.538 --> 00:28:21.838
or not,
00:28:22.460 --> 00:28:23.559
but there really hasn't been a ton of
00:28:23.579 --> 00:28:26.201
accountability for Elon Musk for letting
00:28:26.260 --> 00:28:27.301
Grok AI,
00:28:27.402 --> 00:28:29.903
his AI make a ton of child sexual
00:28:29.942 --> 00:28:30.762
abuse material.
00:28:31.502 --> 00:28:32.763
And like, that's,
00:28:33.503 --> 00:28:36.686
bad like we've failed as a civilization if
00:28:36.727 --> 00:28:38.847
we're not protecting children if we're not
00:28:38.988 --> 00:28:41.210
feeding and housing children we're bad
00:28:41.410 --> 00:28:44.512
we're bad that's bad we as a species
00:28:44.792 --> 00:28:47.996
are doing it wrong um as somebody who's
00:28:48.175 --> 00:28:50.798
you know millennially firmly into my bird
00:28:50.837 --> 00:28:52.900
watching phase like watching the birds
00:28:53.240 --> 00:28:56.041
we've got a nest on our garage it's
00:28:56.082 --> 00:28:58.003
really exciting waiting for those eggs to
00:28:58.064 --> 00:28:59.345
hatch um
00:29:00.680 --> 00:29:03.480
And yeah, the bird feeders are out.
00:29:03.540 --> 00:29:04.480
Mayday happens.
00:29:04.701 --> 00:29:05.682
Put your bird feeders out.
00:29:05.981 --> 00:29:06.821
Watch the animals.
00:29:07.602 --> 00:29:09.103
Open the door and clap loudly at the
00:29:09.143 --> 00:29:10.663
squirrels that are getting into the bird
00:29:10.703 --> 00:29:12.104
feed because they really shouldn't.
00:29:14.065 --> 00:29:15.125
These squirrels are impressive.
00:29:15.164 --> 00:29:18.246
We've got squirrel-resistant bird feeders
00:29:18.266 --> 00:29:21.507
and they still find a way.
00:29:21.527 --> 00:29:21.846
But again,
00:29:22.428 --> 00:29:25.028
just watching this mother bird protect its
00:29:25.088 --> 00:29:25.689
young is like...
00:29:26.367 --> 00:29:28.327
Yeah, that's hardwired into species.
00:29:28.367 --> 00:29:30.729
And the fact that we've protected
00:29:30.769 --> 00:29:32.568
billionaires instead of children doesn't
00:29:32.608 --> 00:29:33.689
speak well of us.
00:29:34.528 --> 00:29:36.890
My fandom of Malazan Book of the Fallen
00:29:36.950 --> 00:29:38.589
comes through here.
00:29:39.150 --> 00:29:40.210
Because historically,
00:29:40.269 --> 00:29:42.730
societies are judged not on how wealthy
00:29:42.851 --> 00:29:44.530
the richest people lived,
00:29:44.671 --> 00:29:48.071
but how well the society did taking care
00:29:48.112 --> 00:29:49.832
of the most needy.
00:29:50.051 --> 00:29:53.393
And we suck at that here in America.
00:29:53.792 --> 00:29:55.292
And that's the reality that will...
00:29:56.148 --> 00:29:59.289
pull through, the question is, again,
00:29:59.390 --> 00:30:00.829
how much suffering needs to happen for
00:30:00.849 --> 00:30:01.049
that.
00:30:01.289 --> 00:30:04.330
So while I'm trying to be hopeful in
00:30:04.371 --> 00:30:07.632
this episode, the reality is like,
00:30:07.852 --> 00:30:08.571
that's going to suck.
00:30:08.731 --> 00:30:10.532
Even if we were to have a revolution,
00:30:10.772 --> 00:30:13.373
it would suck because there's not really a
00:30:13.472 --> 00:30:15.933
pathway in America, I don't think,
00:30:16.034 --> 00:30:19.755
to revolutionize without violence.
00:30:20.315 --> 00:30:20.615
And again,
00:30:20.875 --> 00:30:22.316
I'm of the opinion like the state is
00:30:22.355 --> 00:30:23.776
enacting violence on us every day.
00:30:25.406 --> 00:30:26.907
People keep dying in ICE custody.
00:30:27.067 --> 00:30:28.449
They're killing one person a week.
00:30:29.529 --> 00:30:31.590
Just because we don't have a video of
00:30:31.671 --> 00:30:34.353
it on the news every night doesn't mean
00:30:34.492 --> 00:30:35.252
it's not happening.
00:30:35.693 --> 00:30:35.973
And again,
00:30:36.875 --> 00:30:38.675
it will be horrific when it comes out.
00:30:38.836 --> 00:30:40.656
When there is finally accountability and
00:30:40.676 --> 00:30:42.298
we go in and we see how people
00:30:42.317 --> 00:30:44.219
were living and how people were treated,
00:30:44.298 --> 00:30:45.420
it will be horrific.
00:30:45.619 --> 00:30:46.921
These are concentration camps.
00:30:47.862 --> 00:30:48.021
So...
00:30:49.778 --> 00:30:51.419
it's going to get worse before it gets
00:30:51.479 --> 00:30:51.878
better.
00:30:52.538 --> 00:30:53.419
I do think again,
00:30:53.459 --> 00:30:55.519
historical precedent is it will get better
00:30:55.559 --> 00:31:01.221
because the reality pokes through and does
00:31:01.261 --> 00:31:01.761
shift.
00:31:01.902 --> 00:31:03.982
But again, it's, it's a percentage shift.
00:31:04.103 --> 00:31:06.903
It's a majority of people shift.
00:31:07.403 --> 00:31:08.743
It's not everybody shifts.
00:31:08.864 --> 00:31:10.684
We know there are people who will double
00:31:10.724 --> 00:31:11.045
down.
00:31:12.164 --> 00:31:13.605
We know there are white supremacists who
00:31:13.645 --> 00:31:16.426
still are like celebrating Hitler's
00:31:16.467 --> 00:31:16.987
birthday.
00:31:17.227 --> 00:31:17.527
And again,
00:31:19.251 --> 00:31:22.093
finding whatever new weird corner of the
00:31:22.113 --> 00:31:24.233
internet they can get to socialize on and
00:31:24.554 --> 00:31:27.155
espouse their eugenics stuff and be you
00:31:27.175 --> 00:31:29.416
know quoting rfk it's eugenic stuff
00:31:29.477 --> 00:31:31.657
because not great that he's in charge of
00:31:31.698 --> 00:31:39.721
anything um yeah this was gonna be more
00:31:39.761 --> 00:31:40.422
hopeful i mean
00:31:42.711 --> 00:31:48.794
the the fracturing and uh of the the
00:31:48.834 --> 00:31:51.035
party line is important which we're having
00:31:51.275 --> 00:31:54.936
you know um a weird timeline when i
00:31:54.957 --> 00:31:56.998
agree with tucker carlson or candace owens
00:31:57.057 --> 00:32:00.558
when marjorie taylor greene is like a
00:32:00.618 --> 00:32:02.240
voice of reason saying like maybe we
00:32:02.259 --> 00:32:03.601
should prosecute the pedophiles
00:32:04.550 --> 00:32:06.051
That should be a really low bar.
00:32:06.491 --> 00:32:06.872
And again,
00:32:06.912 --> 00:32:08.672
she's a grifter and she's somebody who
00:32:09.192 --> 00:32:10.073
entered government,
00:32:10.133 --> 00:32:11.712
not with the good of people in mind,
00:32:11.752 --> 00:32:14.974
but for her own enrichment and just rats
00:32:15.394 --> 00:32:18.455
leaving the sinking ship got out by like,
00:32:19.215 --> 00:32:19.496
yeah,
00:32:19.536 --> 00:32:21.237
like Thomas Massey is not a good person,
00:32:21.356 --> 00:32:22.676
even though he's the one who keeps pushing
00:32:22.717 --> 00:32:24.397
for the release of the Epstein files.
00:32:24.617 --> 00:32:27.239
All of his other policies stances are bad
00:32:27.278 --> 00:32:27.919
for people.
00:32:30.012 --> 00:32:31.993
But again, people are shifting.
00:32:32.034 --> 00:32:33.555
Public sentiment is shifting.
00:32:33.714 --> 00:32:36.857
The response to a lot of these AI
00:32:36.917 --> 00:32:40.059
data centers being built is wildly
00:32:40.099 --> 00:32:40.500
negative.
00:32:41.300 --> 00:32:42.582
A lot of them are being canceled.
00:32:42.642 --> 00:32:44.002
A lot of people are standing up against
00:32:44.042 --> 00:32:44.242
them.
00:32:44.663 --> 00:32:46.345
The problem is, again,
00:32:46.365 --> 00:32:48.046
we need institutional changes.
00:32:49.847 --> 00:32:51.169
Propaganda is failing.
00:32:52.589 --> 00:32:52.849
Not.
00:32:53.248 --> 00:32:55.068
enough yet i don't think it's hit the
00:32:55.148 --> 00:32:58.250
tipping point that it needs to um but
00:32:58.290 --> 00:33:02.354
it will and because reality wins out and
00:33:02.753 --> 00:33:06.737
the corporate overlords will uh protect
00:33:06.777 --> 00:33:09.198
themselves and that will be shifting the
00:33:09.238 --> 00:33:12.119
public line on what hits the news every
00:33:12.200 --> 00:33:12.820
single night
00:33:13.701 --> 00:33:16.082
as approved by the sinclair broadcasting
00:33:16.801 --> 00:33:19.962
corporation uh which is a huge monopoly
00:33:20.002 --> 00:33:23.923
for like your local news sources so the
00:33:25.203 --> 00:33:27.765
yeah the fracturing matters and we're
00:33:27.785 --> 00:33:31.465
seeing the crumbling of that um what will
00:33:31.526 --> 00:33:33.547
come out again will probably be too late
00:33:33.567 --> 00:33:35.166
for somebody like trump like his brain's
00:33:35.247 --> 00:33:36.647
pretty deteriorated and
00:33:38.007 --> 00:33:39.567
would love love love to see him go
00:33:39.607 --> 00:33:43.270
to jail before he perishes from old age
00:33:43.330 --> 00:33:46.853
natural causes but for what accountability
00:33:46.873 --> 00:33:48.894
will look like for the other corruption
00:33:48.974 --> 00:33:51.656
the younger trumps the pete hexeth of the
00:33:51.696 --> 00:33:54.358
world like hexeth is committing war crimes
00:33:54.598 --> 00:33:57.421
on the regular so you know we need
00:33:57.441 --> 00:33:59.561
accountability for stuff like that do i
00:33:59.603 --> 00:34:01.443
feel like public perception is there
00:34:03.259 --> 00:34:04.920
no not really i'm sort of in a
00:34:04.960 --> 00:34:06.941
leftist echo chamber i'm not unaware of
00:34:06.961 --> 00:34:09.322
that so sure in the people i talk
00:34:09.342 --> 00:34:12.143
to and the things i listen to is
00:34:12.202 --> 00:34:14.762
there the push for accountability yes ken
00:34:14.842 --> 00:34:18.123
jennings put something on blue sky one day
00:34:18.164 --> 00:34:21.764
about like whoever is pushing for um
00:34:22.605 --> 00:34:24.686
prosecuting this current regime will get
00:34:24.746 --> 00:34:27.586
his vote like is ken jennings
00:34:28.688 --> 00:34:30.550
mean he's the new alex trebek does he
00:34:30.570 --> 00:34:32.731
hold the sway that alex trebek did no
00:34:32.771 --> 00:34:34.692
because again like our culture has
00:34:34.751 --> 00:34:37.653
fractured um again with one of those
00:34:37.693 --> 00:34:40.034
things with just the internet like it's
00:34:40.135 --> 00:34:43.956
harder for people to hold as big a
00:34:44.016 --> 00:34:47.639
percentage of the culture's uh mind as it
00:34:47.759 --> 00:34:49.739
used to that's even true for politicians
00:34:49.800 --> 00:34:50.981
right um
00:34:51.661 --> 00:34:53.742
but people don't get their sources of
00:34:53.782 --> 00:34:55.521
information from the same place media is
00:34:55.621 --> 00:34:58.182
fractured but then unfortunately within
00:34:58.242 --> 00:34:59.842
those fractures it tends to be more
00:34:59.943 --> 00:35:02.704
extreme we're living in a time of
00:35:02.864 --> 00:35:07.905
extremism as opposed to shared reality um
00:35:07.925 --> 00:35:10.326
which is a problem and again like reality
00:35:10.385 --> 00:35:13.547
will win out people will be harmed along
00:35:13.606 --> 00:35:16.007
the way which is a bummer um
00:35:17.467 --> 00:35:19.349
caught up in my microphone uh people will
00:35:19.369 --> 00:35:20.650
be harmed along the way which is a
00:35:20.690 --> 00:35:25.474
bummer and you know propaganda that is
00:35:25.635 --> 00:35:28.518
currently shaping not just perception but
00:35:28.597 --> 00:35:31.400
is definitely shaping policy will take a
00:35:31.440 --> 00:35:33.742
while to be undone we haven't undone all
00:35:33.782 --> 00:35:35.744
the harm the reagan administration did yet
00:35:35.945 --> 00:35:38.226
and like trump's doubling tripling down on
00:35:38.286 --> 00:35:39.208
it in some cases
00:35:40.224 --> 00:35:43.327
so um while i do find history to
00:35:43.367 --> 00:35:45.829
be helpful one of the other things that
00:35:45.889 --> 00:35:48.092
i do and and again you gotta you
00:35:48.112 --> 00:35:49.333
gotta check in with yourself you have to
00:35:49.353 --> 00:35:51.034
be realistic about whether this works for
00:35:51.074 --> 00:35:53.056
you and whether this is helpful or not
00:35:53.735 --> 00:35:56.559
but again like part of the historical
00:35:56.639 --> 00:35:58.579
reference point isn't just studying
00:35:58.639 --> 00:36:00.942
history but it's studying what the culture
00:36:00.981 --> 00:36:02.583
was putting out at the time
00:36:04.012 --> 00:36:06.315
And so, you know, reading George Orwell,
00:36:06.434 --> 00:36:08.155
understanding Nineteen Eighty Four and
00:36:08.235 --> 00:36:08.936
Animal Farm,
00:36:10.898 --> 00:36:12.318
even something like V for Vendetta.
00:36:12.438 --> 00:36:12.699
Right.
00:36:12.858 --> 00:36:14.981
And then it's worse,
00:36:16.061 --> 00:36:19.224
but more recent movie version talks about
00:36:19.304 --> 00:36:20.925
like fascism is bad.
00:36:20.965 --> 00:36:23.047
And how do people resist and what happens
00:36:23.067 --> 00:36:24.447
when the propaganda crumbles?
00:36:25.748 --> 00:36:28.751
A more modern and perhaps nuanced,
00:36:28.771 --> 00:36:29.934
because it's still going on,
00:36:30.034 --> 00:36:31.715
take would be like James Tynion's
00:36:32.036 --> 00:36:32.998
Department of Truth,
00:36:34.219 --> 00:36:36.001
in that reality is shaped,
00:36:36.121 --> 00:36:37.802
and like this is a thing Tynion writes
00:36:37.822 --> 00:36:41.989
about a lot, reality is shaped by belief.
00:36:44.246 --> 00:36:44.846
But again, I mean,
00:36:45.065 --> 00:36:47.686
that's not necessarily a new concept.
00:36:48.206 --> 00:36:49.206
Other authors have done it.
00:36:49.266 --> 00:36:51.168
I think like American Gods is very much
00:36:51.188 --> 00:36:51.668
about that.
00:36:51.768 --> 00:36:54.369
Not that I want to put Neil Gaiman
00:36:54.409 --> 00:36:57.128
on a pedestal or reference him currently.
00:36:58.230 --> 00:37:00.449
Why are such bad people in charge of
00:37:00.510 --> 00:37:01.911
things?
00:37:01.990 --> 00:37:02.431
Yeah.
00:37:04.666 --> 00:37:05.387
So yeah, I mean,
00:37:05.947 --> 00:37:08.108
if studying history is not the landing
00:37:08.128 --> 00:37:09.510
place for you, then like, again,
00:37:09.550 --> 00:37:10.250
participating,
00:37:10.570 --> 00:37:13.072
participating is the wrong word, reading,
00:37:13.211 --> 00:37:13.992
enjoying,
00:37:14.172 --> 00:37:18.974
engaging with some of the cultural moments
00:37:18.994 --> 00:37:19.815
from those things.
00:37:19.876 --> 00:37:21.976
Listen to old protest songs because it
00:37:21.996 --> 00:37:23.438
will make you feel connected.
00:37:24.268 --> 00:37:26.951
to people in the past could it be
00:37:27.070 --> 00:37:29.132
sort of a bummer to be like wow
00:37:29.211 --> 00:37:31.813
this old song is still oddly relevant
00:37:31.853 --> 00:37:34.096
today sure i'm a huge pink floyd fan
00:37:34.135 --> 00:37:37.438
like listening to the wall is a bit
00:37:37.478 --> 00:37:41.201
of a bummer that what was getting called
00:37:41.280 --> 00:37:43.481
out in the eighties still being performed
00:37:43.521 --> 00:37:45.503
today by roger waters and is still
00:37:45.563 --> 00:37:45.943
relevant
00:37:46.945 --> 00:37:51.469
i said happy star wars is about empire
00:37:51.550 --> 00:37:57.094
is bad imperialism is bad and what are
00:37:57.114 --> 00:37:59.958
we doing we had to make and or
00:38:00.217 --> 00:38:03.001
be relevant because people weren't getting
00:38:03.061 --> 00:38:06.824
it people who think star wars is cool
00:38:07.244 --> 00:38:09.405
like fucking elon musk being like you
00:38:09.505 --> 00:38:11.128
understood it in star wars why don't you
00:38:11.148 --> 00:38:12.949
understand it now when he was in doge
00:38:12.989 --> 00:38:13.309
and like
00:38:14.079 --> 00:38:15.161
The top comments were like,
00:38:15.661 --> 00:38:18.806
never was the richest person in the Star
00:38:18.827 --> 00:38:21.431
Wars universe a good guy.
00:38:21.471 --> 00:38:21.711
Yeah.
00:38:22.012 --> 00:38:22.273
Again,
00:38:22.512 --> 00:38:25.677
I think the propaganda is propped up by
00:38:25.737 --> 00:38:26.639
wealth inequality.
00:38:27.693 --> 00:38:30.215
more than public perception but uh we need
00:38:30.396 --> 00:38:32.456
we need just a little bit more on
00:38:32.496 --> 00:38:34.518
that public perception which is happening
00:38:34.577 --> 00:38:36.719
right because the propaganda can't poke
00:38:36.739 --> 00:38:39.221
through everything's great everything's
00:38:39.300 --> 00:38:43.143
cheap the price of eggs when filling up
00:38:43.182 --> 00:38:45.184
your gas tank is such a problem and
00:38:45.423 --> 00:38:48.326
and again like gas in america is probably
00:38:48.346 --> 00:38:52.148
a larger problem than eggs are um because
00:38:52.228 --> 00:38:53.469
we have no backup
00:38:55.106 --> 00:38:56.467
Trump has spent millions,
00:38:56.487 --> 00:38:58.449
if not billions of dollars canceling wind
00:38:58.530 --> 00:38:59.552
and nuclear projects,
00:38:59.992 --> 00:39:02.195
going out of his way to dismantle them,
00:39:02.235 --> 00:39:03.956
not just interrupt them or slow them.
00:39:04.538 --> 00:39:06.079
So again,
00:39:06.159 --> 00:39:08.063
letting somebody who has bankrupted
00:39:08.103 --> 00:39:10.264
multiple casinos be in charge of stuff was
00:39:10.425 --> 00:39:11.427
always a bad idea.
00:39:12.532 --> 00:39:14.253
But we have no public transport
00:39:14.414 --> 00:39:15.554
infrastructure.
00:39:16.514 --> 00:39:18.356
There is nothing for people to do.
00:39:18.976 --> 00:39:19.976
Gas prices go up.
00:39:20.016 --> 00:39:21.657
So you're driving across country to see
00:39:21.677 --> 00:39:23.257
your friends and family for the Fourth of
00:39:23.297 --> 00:39:24.679
July and you're pissed about how much it
00:39:24.739 --> 00:39:27.019
costs because you're not going to fly
00:39:27.059 --> 00:39:28.920
because that's going to be even more
00:39:29.001 --> 00:39:29.701
expensive.
00:39:30.601 --> 00:39:33.463
So there's a reality that can't be outrun
00:39:33.623 --> 00:39:33.943
here.
00:39:35.043 --> 00:39:35.923
Again, I think...
00:39:36.943 --> 00:39:39.864
the Iran war and the illegal military
00:39:39.943 --> 00:39:47.067
action in Iran and uh the way that
00:39:47.106 --> 00:39:49.646
systems change like we're I think close to
00:39:50.688 --> 00:39:53.009
a tipping point I think it will tip
00:39:53.208 --> 00:39:56.309
and allow institutions that are currently
00:39:56.329 --> 00:39:59.331
part of the problem to persist again I
00:39:59.391 --> 00:40:00.630
don't think we're gonna be at
00:40:00.751 --> 00:40:02.731
Revolutionary Point I think we'll be at
00:40:04.639 --> 00:40:07.742
reform which is better than barreling
00:40:07.782 --> 00:40:10.143
towards annihilation but is not as good as
00:40:10.184 --> 00:40:13.706
it could be um and like again that
00:40:14.047 --> 00:40:16.668
generally means progress over time over a
00:40:16.849 --> 00:40:20.170
long enough space but like you know we
00:40:20.190 --> 00:40:22.012
really do probably need revolution humans
00:40:22.052 --> 00:40:24.635
are speed running their own extinction so
00:40:24.655 --> 00:40:28.938
it's not good um
00:40:30.233 --> 00:40:32.235
So, you know, but as, as,
00:40:32.876 --> 00:40:34.916
as just voting out Trump probably won't be
00:40:34.978 --> 00:40:35.318
enough.
00:40:35.398 --> 00:40:37.639
Will somebody else be able to fix gas
00:40:37.659 --> 00:40:38.300
prices right away?
00:40:38.400 --> 00:40:38.780
No.
00:40:38.900 --> 00:40:40.661
So will more people be interested in green
00:40:40.681 --> 00:40:41.601
and renewable energies?
00:40:41.641 --> 00:40:42.563
Hopefully yes.
00:40:43.364 --> 00:40:43.603
Right.
00:40:43.963 --> 00:40:44.284
I'm not,
00:40:44.625 --> 00:40:46.085
I'm not doom and gloom about it.
00:40:46.485 --> 00:40:46.565
Um,
00:40:46.606 --> 00:40:48.907
but I do think grounding in historical
00:40:48.927 --> 00:40:50.248
precedent and setting realistic
00:40:50.289 --> 00:40:50.889
expectations.
00:40:50.909 --> 00:40:53.590
This is not, Oh, just give it time.
00:40:53.630 --> 00:40:54.952
It's not something that like time heals
00:40:54.992 --> 00:40:55.512
all wounds.
00:40:55.532 --> 00:40:57.773
That's always been a bad cliche.
00:40:57.793 --> 00:40:59.034
Um,
00:41:00.525 --> 00:41:02.827
healing takes time and there's an active
00:41:02.867 --> 00:41:05.528
process to healing right you do your
00:41:05.588 --> 00:41:08.490
exercises you go to pt you do whatever
00:41:08.570 --> 00:41:10.592
it is you take your medicine like it
00:41:10.833 --> 00:41:12.873
it doesn't work immediately and it does
00:41:12.914 --> 00:41:15.916
work over time so it's time and effort
00:41:16.376 --> 00:41:19.418
and so you know organizing um building
00:41:19.458 --> 00:41:21.000
community being engaged with some of this
00:41:21.019 --> 00:41:22.960
stuff is important work to do right now
00:41:23.001 --> 00:41:24.382
but it's a marathon not a sprint
00:41:25.311 --> 00:41:27.371
and we want it to be better for
00:41:27.773 --> 00:41:30.273
ourselves certainly millennials have sort
00:41:30.313 --> 00:41:32.255
of been shafted by a lot of cultural
00:41:32.295 --> 00:41:38.219
swings um off boomers uh but also like
00:41:38.239 --> 00:41:41.762
yeah i mean it'd be cool if the
00:41:41.822 --> 00:41:44.103
level of animals going extinct on a yearly
00:41:44.143 --> 00:41:46.244
basis dropped down so that my kids can
00:41:46.284 --> 00:41:49.146
enjoy nature when they're older that'd be
00:41:49.186 --> 00:41:54.590
fun right that'd be fun so yeah
00:41:55.275 --> 00:41:57.739
Belief systems for everyone will not shift
00:41:58.340 --> 00:41:59.081
with reality,
00:41:59.222 --> 00:42:03.568
but reality will break the propaganda at
00:42:03.608 --> 00:42:04.070
some point.
00:42:04.389 --> 00:42:06.554
There is a tipping point probably sooner
00:42:06.594 --> 00:42:07.175
rather than later.
00:42:08.224 --> 00:42:10.427
What comes of that is our work, right?
00:42:10.447 --> 00:42:11.987
Like that's the work right now to push
00:42:12.047 --> 00:42:15.751
for a more, I'm going to say leftist,
00:42:15.831 --> 00:42:17.534
but if that makes you uncomfortable,
00:42:18.474 --> 00:42:19.936
a more egalitarian society,
00:42:19.976 --> 00:42:21.998
a society that is geared towards the
00:42:22.018 --> 00:42:24.782
benefit of future generations and also
00:42:25.362 --> 00:42:26.163
aware that like,
00:42:27.673 --> 00:42:29.735
The world is a limited resource and we
00:42:29.755 --> 00:42:30.918
need to take better care of it and
00:42:30.958 --> 00:42:32.480
that will benefit future generations as
00:42:32.519 --> 00:42:32.780
well.
00:42:33.721 --> 00:42:34.822
So, you know,
00:42:36.324 --> 00:42:38.927
vote for the leftist leaning person you
00:42:38.967 --> 00:42:39.306
can.
00:42:40.248 --> 00:42:41.530
If you're in a position to burn down
00:42:41.550 --> 00:42:42.090
a warehouse,
00:42:44.592 --> 00:42:45.934
I can't tell you to do that on
00:42:45.954 --> 00:42:47.115
a public podcast.
00:42:50.458 --> 00:42:51.378
don't do that.
00:42:52.318 --> 00:42:54.481
Uh, if you're in a position to, uh,
00:42:54.721 --> 00:42:56.442
stand against the violence that is
00:42:56.483 --> 00:42:58.503
currently being enacted by the state,
00:42:58.603 --> 00:43:00.125
then yeah, let's, let's do that too.
00:43:00.164 --> 00:43:02.387
Uh,
00:43:02.407 --> 00:43:05.329
because not having an answer to the
00:43:05.349 --> 00:43:07.231
violence that's going on on a daily basis
00:43:07.391 --> 00:43:09.152
won't solve the problem.
00:43:10.393 --> 00:43:12.434
And so, you know, that, that happens,
00:43:12.594 --> 00:43:14.576
historical precedent on that is, uh,
00:43:15.403 --> 00:43:16.244
there is violence,
00:43:16.264 --> 00:43:18.385
whether it's property destruction and
00:43:18.405 --> 00:43:20.447
there's violent responses from the state
00:43:21.047 --> 00:43:23.469
and in organizing and building community
00:43:24.451 --> 00:43:27.893
that can be mitigated, but not eliminated.
00:43:28.614 --> 00:43:31.936
So people will be hurt in this process
00:43:31.996 --> 00:43:35.900
because the powers that be are already
00:43:35.940 --> 00:43:36.619
enacting violence.
00:43:36.659 --> 00:43:37.860
It doesn't bother them.
00:43:37.880 --> 00:43:38.521
It doesn't stop them.
00:43:40.784 --> 00:43:41.846
So we need to push for people who
00:43:41.865 --> 00:43:43.927
have a better idea than just,
00:43:44.547 --> 00:43:47.108
we want to keep the violence intact,
00:43:47.150 --> 00:43:48.469
but we want better people doing the
00:43:48.510 --> 00:43:49.010
violence.
00:43:49.070 --> 00:43:52.233
Like that can't be the solution.
00:43:52.333 --> 00:43:54.934
So yeah,
00:43:55.534 --> 00:43:57.456
organize and put pressure on the people
00:43:57.476 --> 00:43:59.177
who are already elected and then elect
00:43:59.277 --> 00:44:03.641
better people further and further left and
00:44:03.661 --> 00:44:06.702
people who are looking at a global scale,
00:44:06.802 --> 00:44:08.384
not a national scale,
00:44:08.423 --> 00:44:10.405
because the reality is,
00:44:12.150 --> 00:44:14.092
Those borders are just made up.
00:44:14.753 --> 00:44:15.954
They don't matter.
00:44:16.775 --> 00:44:19.637
So, yeah.
00:44:19.697 --> 00:44:20.257
Cool, cool.
00:44:21.518 --> 00:44:23.880
Happy, happy episode.
00:44:27.740 --> 00:44:28.262
I'm laughing.
00:44:28.521 --> 00:44:29.061
So that's good.
00:44:29.282 --> 00:44:30.003
Right.
00:44:30.222 --> 00:44:31.204
It's a momentary joy.
00:44:31.563 --> 00:44:32.525
No, I mean, again,
00:44:32.585 --> 00:44:34.585
this is this is stuff that I think
00:44:34.646 --> 00:44:36.347
people are really struggling with.
00:44:36.586 --> 00:44:38.889
And I think looking at the historical
00:44:38.909 --> 00:44:40.630
precedent matters and then finding
00:44:40.909 --> 00:44:43.052
actionable items you can do matter.
00:44:43.472 --> 00:44:44.152
But like marathon,
00:44:44.172 --> 00:44:45.634
not a sprint is all about resource
00:44:45.673 --> 00:44:46.775
management like this isn't.
00:44:49.027 --> 00:44:50.367
there are multiple crises going on there.
00:44:50.608 --> 00:44:51.989
We're in living in a time of the
00:44:52.068 --> 00:44:52.849
poly crisis,
00:44:52.929 --> 00:44:55.668
like you an individual can't change that,
00:44:55.929 --> 00:44:58.010
which is why organizing and having action
00:44:58.469 --> 00:45:00.650
in your own personal life matters and also
00:45:00.730 --> 00:45:02.130
resourcing yourself and taking care of
00:45:02.150 --> 00:45:04.090
yourself because these changes will take
00:45:04.150 --> 00:45:04.411
time.
00:45:06.010 --> 00:45:08.110
And it's not like let time heal it
00:45:08.170 --> 00:45:08.610
itself.
00:45:08.650 --> 00:45:09.692
It's not a sit back and let other
00:45:09.711 --> 00:45:11.711
people do the work like do the work
00:45:12.592 --> 00:45:16.893
and take care of yourself.
00:45:16.932 --> 00:45:17.052
So
00:45:19.958 --> 00:45:21.719
know don't be the meme don't be the
00:45:21.760 --> 00:45:24.202
person in the meme who isn't doing after
00:45:24.222 --> 00:45:26.443
everybody else says i'm doing my part find
00:45:26.463 --> 00:45:28.005
your part and do that and take care
00:45:28.025 --> 00:45:29.565
of yourself and then take care of someone
00:45:29.606 --> 00:45:30.927
else because that's how we build community
00:45:32.869 --> 00:45:36.612
okay i am uh in my stage of
00:45:38.594 --> 00:45:40.516
thinking about thinking about the guests
00:45:40.536 --> 00:45:41.856
that i have which is like a log
00:45:41.896 --> 00:45:43.657
list at this point so we will get
00:45:43.697 --> 00:45:45.019
back on track i don't know if it'll
00:45:45.039 --> 00:45:45.300
happen
00:45:47.371 --> 00:45:49.514
this month or next month or what uh
00:45:50.675 --> 00:45:52.737
but my my process is usually a few
00:45:52.777 --> 00:45:55.061
weeks of warming myself up before having
00:45:55.101 --> 00:45:57.903
to email people out of the blue that's
00:45:57.923 --> 00:45:59.164
the thing i don't like i just don't
00:45:59.184 --> 00:46:02.548
like scheduling um i don't like the cold
00:46:02.588 --> 00:46:06.333
calling of it so you know my introvert
00:46:06.393 --> 00:46:07.554
side uh
00:46:08.719 --> 00:46:10.561
wins out more often than my extrovert
00:46:10.701 --> 00:46:11.041
side.
00:46:11.762 --> 00:46:14.143
So I do have guests lined up.
00:46:14.184 --> 00:46:14.844
We'll get to it.
00:46:14.983 --> 00:46:16.244
I've got some cool stuff to talk about
00:46:16.304 --> 00:46:18.226
over the summer for later in the summer
00:46:18.427 --> 00:46:18.786
too.
00:46:19.847 --> 00:46:22.289
So come on back next week for another
00:46:22.389 --> 00:46:23.610
new episode.
00:46:24.590 --> 00:46:25.391
See you then.