CEO within your first 10 years in sales? Impossible! Well, not for Alexine Mudawar.
In this episode, the seasoned sales leader unpacks her journey from AE all the way to the top. And true to form, Alexine doesn't shy away from talking through the good, bad, and ugly of her career. She also explores how being a CEO is actually not that different from a sales role (transferable skills, anyone?).
Alexine heads up one of our favorite communities, Women in Sales, so naturally we had to dig into that too — what made her start the community? How did it evolve from 'pajama party' to the bustling network it is today? And why the heck does she let men in? (Spoiler: there's a good reason!)
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🎵 Jam to our walk-up song playlist on Spotify
CEO within your first 10 years in sales? Impossible! Well, not for Alexine Mudawar.
In this episode, the seasoned sales leader unpacks her journey from AE all the way to the top. And true to form, Alexine doesn't shy away from talking through the good, bad, and ugly of her career. She also explores how being a CEO is actually not that different from a sales role (transferable skills, anyone?).
Alexine heads up one of our favorite communities, Women in Sales, so naturally we had to dig into that too — what made her start the community? How did it evolve from 'pajama party' to the bustling network it is today? And why the heck does she let men in? (Spoiler: there's a good reason!)
✨ Follow Ashley
✨ Follow Katrine
🎵 Jam to our walk-up song playlist on Spotify
[00:00:00] Alexine Mudawar: The piece of advice that I would leave any woman who is considering or in a career in sales, there is absolutely a place and a pathway for you. If you want to do this as a career or have this as a role, as a step in your career, you can absolutely become successful at this. There is no reason that you can't.
[00:00:18] It is a lot of hard work. But this is an incredibly rewarded career.
[00:00:22] Ashley Coghill: Hello, I'm Ashley.
[00:01:06] Katrine Reddin: And I'm Katrine.
[00:01:07] Ashley Coghill: Welcome to Ashley and Katrine's Infinite Revenue Playlist. Today we're joined by the one and only Alexine Mudawar, CEO and Founder of Women in Sales. Alexine, thank you for joining us.
[00:01:19] Katrine Reddin: Thank you.
[00:01:19] Alexine Mudawar: Thanks for having me on. I'm so excited for this.
[00:01:22] Ashley Coghill: Yay. I'm gonna read your bio really quick. I don't know that you need a huge introduction, but just in case anyone on doesn't know who you are, that'd be crazy. Alexine is very experienced, she has 10-plus years of SaaS sales experience. She's backed by numerous President's Club awards, quarterly high achievement recognitions, and a consistent track record of surpassing quota.
[00:01:46] She serves as CEO of Women in Sales with a focus on elevating, empowering and promoting women within this hills profession. She's been recognized as a top voice from LinkedIn and Salesforce, and she's also one of Crunch Base's most influential women in sales. Before we get into it, quick recap of why our podcast exists.
[00:02:10] Katrine Reddin: So, for those that are returning listeners, you know that we have a little bit of a musical twist to the podcast. It's called the Infinite Revenue Playlist because we have all of our guests select their own walk-up songs since we are often compared to athletes as sellers and other revenue-related roles.
[00:02:28] So, the walk-up song is meant to symbolize either you as a professional or kind of pump you up before you step out onto the field, or in our case, walk into work and crush your day. So, with that in mind, Alexsine, what is your walk-up song?
[00:02:41] Alexine Mudawar: My walk-up song, which may come as no surprise, is Run the World by Beyonce. So, I'm very excited about that.
[00:02:50] Katrine Reddin: Any Beyonce song is a safe bet for a walk-up song. So, and I'm surprised you're the first person actually to pick a Beyonce song.
[00:02:58] Ashley Coghill: That's true.
[00:02:59] Alexine Mudawar: Oh, wow. Interesting. Yeah, it felt very fitting. And also fun fact, Beyonce and I have the same birthday, and so I feel like there's something there.
[00:03:09] Ashley Coghill: Beyonce missed her calling. She should have been in sales.
[00:03:12] Alexine Mudawar: Yeah, exactly. Yeah. We're both Virgos, little Virgo, Virgo queens out there.
[00:03:17] Katrine Reddin: Love it. So, I feel like this song kind of speaks for itself, but we'd love to hear from you of why this was your walk-up song of choice.
[00:03:26] Alexine Mudawar: I think, honestly, it was really low-hanging fruit. Like, I love Beyonce. I did go to the Beyonce concert in Chicago a few years ago. Yes, I did cry while I was there, even though I don't think it was like a crying moment. But it was just really, I just find her so empowering, and I love her music. I love her style.
[00:03:43] I just think she's fabulous and I just think a lot of what she does embodies what we're trying to do over at Women in Sales, and empowering the next generation of women, and helping them find their own voices. So, felt like, felt like a good, a good fit there.
[00:03:59] Katrine Reddin: I feel like this is a really good transition into the first thing I wanna ask you about, which is your amazing community that both, Ashley and I, are a part of and absolutely love. I mean, you were obviously top choice for us to have on this podcast. 'Cause, as you know, this is all about elevating the voices of women in revenue.
[00:04:18] And I think you've done an amazing job of that with this community. And I'd love to hear a little bit of kind of why you started this community in the first place, how it came to be and, yeah, anything you wanna share about your amazing, wonderful community.
[00:04:31] Alexine Mudawar: Yes. So, very proud of women in sales. Thank you both for being part of the community. I'm just really excited watching people continue to find one another and connect with each other. So, I consider us in like V2 of Women in Sales. I don't talk about this a lot, but V1, as I call it, was actually a clubhouse room.
[00:04:49] And so, that was a weekly clubhouse session that was run and we got into, like, a lot of really good conversations and topics. But, gradually, over time really wanted to take this in a direction where it was more of like a true community and we had, like, a central meeting place and, and got Slack underway and started to have, like, an events calendar.
[00:05:07] And so, what I consider V2 is really what happened at the beginning of this year where we moved from the name Women in Sales Club to Women in Sales. So, not too different, but just a slight deviation, redid all of our branding and website and really doubled down on a lot of what was working and started to drift into things that we believe deeply are gonna work really well for the community longterm.
[00:05:29] So, I still feel like even though this is, like, two and a half years now into the women in sales journey, I feel like we're just scratching the surface. Like, we're just now starting to like really get into our events calendar. But the sky's the limit. Like, there's just so much that we haven't even launched yet that's, like, kind of secret or happening behind the scenes.
[00:05:47] So, I'm just very optimistic and excited.
[00:05:50] Ashley Coghill: I actually joined that clubhouse a couple weeks, like almost every week for a while there. I didn't say anything 'cause I had kids at home during COVID, but I was there stalking in the background.
[00:06:01] Alexine Mudawar: We love a stalker, we love a healthy stalker. Yeah. But it is, yeah, it was, it was really great, and I think there was something like really special, and it was kind of nice, like, honestly, we do it on Saturdays and you could, like, be in your PJs and it was just audio only. So, there is a part of me that's trying to figure out like, "How can we almost, like, replicate that same experience where we just have another like pajama party and go through like really cool tactical sales stuff?"
[00:06:24] So, that's one thing I'm kind of working on right now.
[00:06:27] Katrine Reddin: So, why?
[00:06:29] Ashley Coghill: I like it.
[00:06:30] Alexine Mudawar: Sales pajama party.
[00:06:30] Katrine Reddin: We'll, we'll have to do another pajama party 'cause I missed those. Why a Woman in Sales community, specifically?
[00:06:37] Alexine Mudawar: So, I think, for me, the reason it, and it's, it, like, I kind of like chuckled 'cause people will be like, "Oh, where did this come about?" And I'm like, "I think I was, like, trying to soft launch this for, like, many years." And so, I would always launch like the first women's group within my organizations and, like, the ERGs and I was kind of like leaving the little breadcrumbs along the way, I think, to get there.
[00:06:57] But, for me, you know, when I think back to 10 years ago when I started in tech sales, I came straight out of retail, went into tech sales, knew absolutely nothing, and was doing like 175 plus cold calls a day, like total grind. But I fell in love with it because, you know, that's how it goes. But I think about when I looked around that sales floor and at the time when I was starting, there were very few women on the team.
[00:07:20] And so, then I would look, you know, two years in, and I'd look around and I was like, "Ugh, there's still not really that many women on the team." Then eight years in and then 10, ultimately, I'm like, I'm looking around and the demographic breakdown of the team hasn't changed that significantly since 10 years ago.
[00:07:36] And then, when you talk to people who have been in sales longer than me as well, who are like 20, 30, 40 years into this, similar kind of feelings where it's like, "We've definitely made progress." Maybe there's like three women for every 10 on the team, but that, that number is still like pretty far off from where I feel like it needs to be.
[00:07:54] And that's just thinking about, like, gender. There's so many other layers to, like, having diverse teams that we aren't even getting into. So, for me, it just felt like here's a really obvious gap. And one of the pieces that I was really, and I took some heat for this early on by the way, but one piece that I was like really determined on was, "How do we create a community for women in the field of sales?
[00:08:16] And how do we keep men engaged in the conversation?" Which I think has been the piece that's missing for a lot of communities and groups that have existed over the years. I felt like I would show up to these events and we would kind of talk about issues we were aware of and they would just kind of like stay with us and it never really, like, made progress.
[00:08:35] And so, that was really a big driving force too, is like, "How do we create this community that's of course focused on women in sales, but then, on top of that, how do we keep men engaged in that dialogue and in that conversation so we can actually make changes and get some of this information moving up the,, the leadership chain as well?"
[00:08:52] Katrine Reddin: I think that's a really important piece of the conversation of how to also get men engaged in the conversation. And actually when we were first defining the purpose of this podcast, originally, we were told, you know, by our producer, "Oh, it should be for Women in Revenue." Right? And women in revenue only.
[00:09:09] And we actually pushed back a little bit 'cause we were like, "We think it should be about elevating the voices of women in revenue. But if we're just siloing ourselves in a box, how are we gonna get men to be allies of women in sales, revenue, whatever the role is?" And I'm curious, like, how does your community, or how does what you do on a regular basis help kind of get men into the conversation and become those allies?
[00:09:31] Alexine Mudawar: Yeah. I mean, I think step one is just making, like having that awareness layer, like that's something I'm constantly talking about, whether it's on social, in person at events, like I'm constantly doing a reminder of, hey, or even via DMs on LinkedIn, every day I probably send like three to five DMs at least, where men in leadership roles, CROs will reach out to me and they'll be like, "Hey, I love what you're building.
[00:09:52] Super cool. Like, I hope to have an impact." I'm like, "Cool. Have an immediate impact. Here's our Slack community." And they're like, "Well, could I join? Like, is it okay if I'm there?" And I'm like, "Absolutely. Listen, learn. Um, a volunteer to mentor where you can like help where you're able to, um, but just be, have awareness of the conversation."
[00:10:10] So, I think like, first and foremost, is just making sure people are aware of, like, what resources and communities and places exist and that, and making sure they're aware that they can show up if that's the case. And it's okay if some places that's not the case. Um, so, I think that's like kind of step one.
[00:10:25] And then, I think, you know, also like engaging, like I think about most of my mentors through my career, they've actually been men. They haven't so much been women. A lot of my mentors, especially some of my early mentors were men within the leadership team who, like, took me under their wing. I think about, like, one of my very first mentors and he was actually our company's CFO.
[00:10:46] And I used to joke about this 'cause I would, like, write these 20-page business plans every year. And I was like, "Here's how I'm gonna crush my quota. Like, here's what I'm gonna do with my year." And everybody would, like, look at me like I was insane. But I remember showing this to my CFO at the time and he was just like, "What is this?"
[00:11:03] And I was like, "It's my business plan. I'm gonna hit my goals." And so, he's like, "Okay, we're gonna sit down and go through your business, I'm gonna read it and then I'm gonna give you feedback." And he actually went through and I was, like, waiting for this meeting, so I was like, "He's gonna tell me how good my business plan was and we're gonna have a meeting about how good I am."
[00:11:19] And he was like, "Okay. Page one." He is like, "I have questions and corrections." And we're, and we went one page at a time through 20 pages over a lunch. And so, I just think about, like, things like that too, like mentorship, sponsorship, like thinking about these opportunities where you can actually work with, with women on the team.
[00:11:38] I think sometimes even as women, as well, will go to people who seem like the most natural fit. Like, a lot of times if people want me to mentor someone, they'll be like, "Here's this really bubbly and outgoing person, like we want to match you two together." And I'm like, "Is that the only pretense for that?
[00:11:53] Like, that might not be the right fit for me or for them." And so, I think like looking outside of who might be the natural choice for some of those opportunities is another good place to kind of get men engaged in this conversation and engaged in the learning and development of more women in our fields.
[00:12:08] Ashley Coghill: I think it's really an important call out. The, the thing about bubbly verse bubbly, bubbly, like matching and matching. If there's only one woman on the leadership team, which is very common, if every woman has to choose that person as their mentor 'cause that's what people see that's a problem. So, I think it's really smart that you're calling out that men should and, well, they should and are sponsors for women often.
[00:12:34] Alexine Mudawar: Yes.
[00:12:39] Ashley Coghill: Tell us a little bit about how, we, we had to decide which one of us was gonna ask the next question. You often refer to the CEO, CEO role as just another sales role. Tell us about that, 'cause I think that's pretty cool.
[00:12:52] Alexine Mudawar: Yes, the, I can now confirm I just finished my first, my first full quarter as CEO. And I have officially deemed this my hardest SDR/AE role that I've ever had. And so, it's so funny because I'll get messages or like friends will text me and they're like, "Oh, it sounds so fun to be CEO." And I was like, "Which part?
[00:13:12] Like, I'm on, like, I have, like, 40-something meetings this week and I'm, like, drowning in work all the time." But it's, it is incredibly rewarding. But what's funny is how much of a parallel there is between the AE role and the CEO role. I mean, there's nuances of course, 'cause there's like the finances, the business, like all the paperwork admin side, which I loathe.
[00:13:34] But then, when I think about like, yeah, everybody hates it. But I think about, like, when I was trying to kind of like start out like I'm building our partnerships program. I'm like managing our events calendar, I'm doing all these things. And what I realized was there is so much parody between the deal cycles,
[00:13:50] I would work as an AE and the deal cycles that I work now. Some of them are really quick and transactional. Many of them, like our most recent one, just took eight months. there isn't that much of a difference. Like, I still have to create pricing resources and supporting materials and have those available.
[00:14:06] I have to do follow-ups. I have the same, like, calendar cadence. Like, if I talk to someone, I need next steps on the books and if I don't have next steps, then I have like my follow-up task two days later. I literally have a Salesforce instance. Like, it's so, like, almost comedic how close it is to the AE roles that I had for many years, and I think something about that made moving into the CEO role so much less scary for me because I was like, "Okay, I know how to do the AE role like that I could do in my sleep.
[00:14:35] I've done it so many times, it's so second nature. Now, I just need to apply that same practice and principles that I use to be successful there to the CEO role. And, on top of that, I just need to learn how to do every other role that the business entails." So, so, yeah, it is really like interesting how close, closely knit they are.
[00:14:55] Katrine Reddin: So, our CU at Commsor, who, as you both know, is actually also my brother.
[00:15:01] Surprise, surprise. He often, hey, Mac, shout out, he often refers to himself as a glorified account executive. He goes, "Every day what I do is I sell Commsor, whether it's to an investor, to a partner, to an actual potential customer." And I think it's really cool because
[00:15:19] sales, as an industry, I feel like sometimes gets a really bad rep. As we all know, people love to hate on sales that are not in sales. Even people in sales loves to hate on sales. We all hate on sales. And the fact is, it's what keeps the company running, right? You're the CEO now, you're the top person at your, you know, your company, your community and you're deploying sales tactics in order to make it successful, which I think is really cool.
[00:15:43] And, as we know, you have been an extremely successful salesperson yourself. And I wanna go back to that, as you know, I know you're still a salesperson as CEO, but what were those tactics that you actually deployed as a salesperson to ensure you were successful?
[00:15:58] Alexine Mudawar: Yeah. There's, there's a few areas that I'm like very meticulous about. I am, I have always been notorious for my overkill in CRM systems, like I'm a diehard Salesforce user, shout out. But the, like, the amount, uh, I know, yeah, the sweatshirt, the amount of, like, details and notes and, like, follow-ups, like my task management system is tight and I like started that year one in sales.
[00:16:23] I, my very first manager, who's, like, one of my good friends now, I just introduced her to her husband, uh, and they just got married. And so, it's so funny. But she was like very meticulous with Salesforce. So, she would, like, drive home, like, all these points and make me, like, go back and, like, redo my work or redo my notes.
[00:16:40] And it drove me absolutely crazy. And now because I had, like, those skills that I really was like very meticulous, that helped me significantly. So, that's definitely like number one, like, my ability to kind of like manage my day, manage a deal cycle, manage communications, like keep things in check and keep things moving forward.
[00:16:59] That's probably like my number one where I feel like I have a pretty tight grip on. And then, honestly, like a lot of the same skills apply in terms of, like, objection handling, for instance. Like, people, like the objections are different now. Like, for instance, I could be like trying to sell partnership and a company might be like, "Okay.
[00:17:19] We don't, like, the current macroeconomic environment doesn't allow us to move forward." So, now I have to, like, figure out how to work around that objection. So, there is like a lot of that type of, like, I guess, early work that I did a lot in sales that continued with me, my whole AE career, that is applicable as well.
[00:17:36] So, I think, like, those are probably like two of the, the key areas are just kind of like those fundamentals, honestly, have just carried over really nicely.
[00:17:45] Katrine Reddin: Do you have any like specific examples for an Account Executive or an SDR potentially listening of, like, how exactly to do those two things? Like, a bullet list of like if you want to be more meticulous in keeping notes and keeping track of your pipeline, like what suggestions do you have?
[00:18:03] Alexine Mudawar: Yeah, so I am the calendar queen. This is where like the Virgo shines. I am, I live and die by my calendar, so my calendar is, like, sacred. So, I have, basically what I do is I have, like, a task management system. I have like my CRM kind of task management system, but like my must-dos are at the top of my calendar for the day.
[00:18:24] So, like, I have usually, like, three to four things where I'm like, "I'm not going to sleep until I finish these three, three to four things." So, I have those like color coded for myself and then, I have my day, which I try to, actually, one thing, I don't know if other people do this as much, but I'm actually kind of meticulous about, like, how many of which type of meeting go where.
[00:18:45] So, if I know like, hey, I have, like, four, like, I'll kind of limit myself to, like, four to five, like, introductory sales calls in a day. I'm like, anything else needs to push to, like, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday. It's like, because my brain can only do so much. So, I'm very like, I like to color code the type of calls as well, so that I can understand, like, what my day looks like.
[00:19:05] Uh, I'm not doing as much like, I guess like true demoing now. I don't have, like, a SaaS platform, but when I did same thing, I would do, like, three demos, usually, max a day. That way I wasn't like starting to, like, you know, did you, you start to forget like what you're talking about at some point when you've done it so many times in a day.
[00:19:22] So, that's another piece. And then, the, um, the other thing I do is I'm very meticulous about, like, admin blocks and having, like, specific times. Um, what I find is the more clarity you can give yourself, the better. So, like I used to do this thing where I'd just block and put, like, hold, and I'd be like, "That's my admin, email follow-up, proposals, whatever time." I found that to be, like, very unhelpful.
[00:19:45] 'Cause it was just too, like, vague. So, what's helped me a lot more is I have those, like, tasks at the beginning of the day, and then at the end of the day, I have like little 30-minute chunks for myself that are like, "Send proposals." And then I, it has, like, the list of companies I need to send them to. It says like, "Here are my email follow-ups.
[00:20:01] It needs to hit these two companies." And so, that helps me. So, I think as, as much as you can become very organized and use, like, a color-coding system. I don't like red for whatever reason, so I, I do like blues and purples, but some people like to do, like, a red, yellow, green. And then, just get really specific and start to get really honest with yourself too.
[00:20:21] Like I, like the calendar system's only gonna work if you actually use it and, and apply that. And so, if you're someone who is just gonna throw that stuff on there and then not actually do any of it, then that's a waste of your time. So, I would say like really start to hold yourself accountable. And the sooner you master that, not only is that gonna help like your SDR, AE, whatever career, but if you move into this path of CEO, it's like not a, it's a non-negotiable.
[00:20:47] Like, you have to be good at organizing your day, and you have to be really thorough with those follow-ups. So, that's probably, like, the most tactical advice I would share, even though it seems basic for some people, it's not for a lot.
[00:20:59] Katrine Reddin: I definitely do the color coding, as well and do anything that can potentially make me money green. I don't think I do red either, which I don't know why, but I also stray away from the red.
[00:21:09] Alexine Mudawar: Yeah, it scares me. It's like a, it's like a very like alert color. I don't like, yeah, I like, like dark. So, I do, like the darker the tone, like the more immediate the task is. So, my like super dark blue is like, "Okay, I have to get this done today." But, like, a red I think would give me anxiety.
[00:21:25] Katrine Reddin: I love it.
[00:21:27] Ashley Coghill: I put mine on paper, and I don't color code, so everyone's different.
[00:21:31] Katrine Reddin: Psycho.
[00:21:32] Ashley Coghill: No, I know. Such a crazy person
[00:21:34] Alexine Mudawar: Shame. I'm just kidding. I use, I do like paper. There is something fun about like checking stuff, like physically checking stuff off a sheet. So I do get that.
[00:21:43] Katrine Reddin: I do both sometimes.
[00:21:45] I worked with an AE at my last company who didn't put anything in his calendar, never took notes, never did anything. He's a top performer. Keep this in mind. I was like, "I don't know what's going on in your brain, but it must be straight chaos. You chose violence with how you handle your pipeline."
[00:22:01] Ashley Coghill: Like, not even his meetings?
[00:22:04] Katrine Reddin: No.
[00:22:05] Alexine Mudawar: Okay. Unpopular opinion, maybe, those are the worst salespeople because no, more likely than not, people are not gonna stay at their companies forever. So, even though that person is a high performer, they tend to end up being what I call, like, a CRM nightmare. Because for years, like I, I took over books for some of these people, and it's like years later, we're like still trying to decode and figure out like, "Is this person even a customer?
[00:22:30] We have, like, no record of them. We don't know how to." So, so, again, the meticulousness, it pays off, both for yourself and for your team long-term. I can, I can testify to that.
[00:22:41] Katrine Reddin: So, if you're listening, take notes, not just for you, but for your team.
[00:22:45] Alexine Mudawar: Help your team, help your sales admin person. Your poor sales admin is struggling.
[00:22:50] Ashley Coghill: Yeah, that's a problem.
[00:22:52] Katrine Reddin: Well, speaking of being a number one performer, we know that you have a history of exceeding quota, but I saw that you recently made a post about stepping away from, you know, having a quota even though you were the top performer. And I'd love to learn a little bit more about that choice.
[00:23:10] Alexine Mudawar: I, I do have a quota now though. My quota is, so it's interesting, I don't have, like, a quota that was decided by a company. Like, I had to kind of choose my own based on like historic results. So, I actually find it really interesting because previously, I would just kind of get a number, whatever it is, a million dollars.
[00:23:29] I have no idea where that number came from. I can look through, like, the database and try to like cut, like figure something out. More likely than not, it was something that was decided by the board and kind of like brought over to me. So, actually the quota thing is super interesting. Because I'm probably tracking my quota closer now than I ever have, and I have done the same thing, that I did year one in sales, for the last 10 years, which is I have my regular quota target, and then I have my stretch goal. And then, there is a part of me, because I'm almost at 50, I'm getting towards like 50% of my stretch goal and I'm like, "Okay, I feel like I could have made even this stretch goal a little more aggressive."
[00:24:07] So, there's a part of me that may launch a stretchy stretch goal. Um, so that's, that's on the, that's on the horizon, but I actually find a quota to be incredibly helpful now because it's really good to be able to, like, understand where I am at for the year. Like, I could just, like, close stuff and hope for the best.
[00:24:25] But, for me, I have, like, a little thermometer thing. It's like really, like, cheesy, but I like seeing, like, that fill up. I like seeing where I'm at. I have a lot of calculations. I'm, I'm all over in Excel, but I'll have, like, calculations that are showing me, like, percent to goal and like how much of the year.
[00:24:41] Right now I'm in the process of, like, moving some of this into Salesforce as well so that my CRM system can kind of act in a, as this resource. But I actually find the quota now probably to be more relevant than ever before.
[00:24:56] Katrine Reddin: Do you find that you're more sympathetic towards what the number for the quota is?
[00:25:03] Alexine Mudawar: I don't know. I don't know how I feel about quotas now 'cause I'm like, "Here, here's a goal that I set for myself that was honestly like a really ambitious target. And now I'm like pacing above that. And so, I don't know, I see how hungry and excited that makes me. So, there's a part of me that's just like, what a missed opportunity when these companies throw out numbers that are what I call faux OT, a fake OT basically, where it's just a number that's like
[00:25:28] almost like impo, like impossible or practically impossible or one person's hit it ever and the rest of the team never has. It kind of bums me out cause I'm like, I feel so much hungrier and more excited when I know that I can actually like pace towards this target. But I also know that I don't have like a board to report to.
[00:25:45] I don't have investors that I have to talk to. I don't want investors. And so, it's really interesting to be on the other side of it where I'm like, I'm just hyper-focused on what I'm building and what I believe in, and I have my own targets and my own numbers, and, yes, they're ambitious, but I know that I can actually have a shot at, at hitting them, which is exciting.
[00:26:07] Katrine Reddin: It's also...
[00:26:07] Ashley Coghill: That rare.
[00:26:09] Alexine Mudawar: I know. Yes.
[00:26:09] Katrine Reddin: It's a psychological thing If no one ever hits quota, right? Everyone's disappointed and gonna leave and go somewhere where they can hit quota.
[00:26:15] Alexine Mudawar: Yes. And then, it just, like, continues. 'Cause then, you know, and this is why I'm like a big fan. Like, now we're seeing more data sources and things coming out that will actually, like, help you make good decisions. But, yeah, I mean it's like, then the clock resets though. So, I'm an AE, I go to the next company.
[00:26:29] I just got my new million-dollar quota. It's like, you know, it's just, it's really hard. And I think that's something to acknowledge too. Like, as a seller, it's hard to pick the right companies. And it's even harder when the environment that we're in is so chaotic and changing every day. So, even when you think you picked the right company, like even, even those numbers, like, could have been realistic a year ago and now they're not.
[00:26:51] So, it's, it's a total mixed experience in sales.
[00:26:54] Ashley Coghill: So, this is kind of not relevant at all, but we're talking a lot about sales and I wanna pivot back to, like, being a woman in sales. And I'm wondering if there's any piece of advice that you would specifically give women who are in revenue-facing roles. Maybe just getting into it or, I mean, we've talked to a couple people who said, "It's really hard, and sometimes I fail.
[00:27:16] How do I pick myself back up and keep going?" Like, what is your advice for women who are trying to be successful in sales?
[00:27:22] Alexine Mudawar: Okay. I have, like, a softball answer, which is like, "Seek out communities, get involved, get to know other women because you'll feel less alone, especially if you're on a team where there's like two women to 20 guys. Like, it can feel very, much like you're on an island and it's, it's just really easy to kind of get in your head."
[00:27:41] And so, I highly recommend communities, of course, you know, shout out Women in Sales. But, I think, the other piece of advice, which I would've definitely given myself this early on is, "Focus on being yourself," which sounds really cheesy, but I spent so much time like that first, like five-ish years of sales.
[00:28:00] I tried so hard to, like, fit in with the guys on the team. Like I, like, I hate sports. I literally, I have a shirt on right now that says it's the NFL logo, and it says IDC for, "I don't care." Like, it just, like, I loathe sports. So, I was like, you know, and then I, you know, was trying to, like, keep up with the going out culture and, like, what everybody else was doing and the topics that they're talking about, and I just didn't, like, fit.
[00:28:23] I always felt like this, like circle in a, in a square and, and it just like never really lined up for me. So, I think just, like, focusing on the fact that if you got hired for one of these roles, whether it's an SDR or an AE, manager, whatever that role is, it's because you are good at what you do and that you have potential in the field of sales.
[00:28:42] And so, trying to like really figure out what your secret sauce is and, like, really figuring out who you are and what you're gonna do that's gonna make you a really good lawyer because that's just not gonna be the same thing for everyone else on your team. So, I know it sounds like a little kitschy, but I know for myself, like that would've been my number one thing. Would've just been like, "Be yourself and stop focusing so much on what everybody else is doing."
[00:29:05] Ashley Coghill: We've talked about this before.
[00:29:07] Alexine Mudawar: Yes.
[00:29:08] Katrine Reddin: And, and back when you were on the teams that were predominantly male, did, did you ever have any experiences where you were like, "Whoa, I really am kind of like the token woman on the team?"
[00:29:19] Alexine Mudawar: Yeah. I have like a PTSD from this, I had a manager years ago and he, every one-on-one, he would start by saying, so there were only two women on the team. There were two women, and the rest of the team was men. And he would go, "Don't you wanna be the top girl on the team? Don't you wanna beat her?"
[00:29:36] And that was like our one-on-one. And I was like, it's not, it starts off on like the worst no every week I, put me in the worst mood and this is like, and so created this, like, animosity between she and I, and I was like, "Why do we not like each other?" Like, I was like, "I don't think we don't like each other.
[00:29:50] I think we're, like, being pit against one another." And it took me like a little while to see that. And, but I watched that repeat at other companies too, where it would be like, there's only one or two other women on the team. And then, behind closed doors, my manager would say things like that, like, "Don't you wanna beat her?"
[00:30:05] Like, "I know you wanna beat her and have." And I was like, "Frankly, I don't. Because if we're like, 19 and 20 on the sales team, who gives, like, who cares? We're both sucking, so I need us to be at like, like I wanna beat her if she's number one and I'm number two, that's where that's interesting. Or if she's number two and I'm number three."
[00:30:23] Other than that, I'm not like super focused on that, but that was like one of the big moments where I would start to see that happen a lot when it was just a couple of us, and I realized that wasn't the same conversation that other men on the team were having with one another.
[00:30:39] Katrine Reddin: I think there's a bit of a scarcity mindset when it comes to women in sales where, I mean, it's, you're literally being pitted against each other, your own teammate, by your manager. And I think sometimes when we get to a team where there's not that many women, we're like, "Oh, there's only space for one.
[00:30:53] There's only space for one woman to succeed," which is not the truth. Right? And it's sad that some managers are not able to, I think, support women in the way that they should be. And the result is actually having some animosity. And I remember at a company where I started off as the only woman Account Executive globally, and then five months, months into the role, another woman joined in a different office, but her onboarding was in New York City where my office was based. And I was really excited for her to join.
[00:31:26] And I introduced myself when she walked in the door and I was like, "Wow. She was really cold towards me." And I couldn't figure it out. I was like, "Why doesn't she like me?" And then, later in the week, we ended up going to lunch. Had a really great conversation, hit it off and it wasn't until after she left, she sent me an email.
[00:31:42] It was like, "I was really scared to meet you. I haven't had good experiences with other women in sales. I thought you weren't going to like me. It really surprised me." And I was like, "What?" Her mindset coming into it was that I automatically wasn't gonna like her 'cause I was the token woman on the team that was already there taking up that space.
[00:32:00] Alexine Mudawar: Yes, the Queen Bee syndrome, like this is a whole topic that we did, like, multiple sessions around that we definitely will keep doing sessions on. But it's, it's so prevalent and I think it's hard because, it is a hard topic because I feel like the onus typically comes back on women and it's like, "Why do you hate each other?"
[00:32:17] And it's like, "I don't think we do. I think that a lot of forces kind of put us, pit us against each other, against our will." But I think, like, what you did Katrine, like that's something that I started to do, like, a few years back where I was like, if I feel that like rumbling inside of me where it's almost like this weird animosity, I don't know where it came from.
[00:32:36] There's no reason for it. I booked a lunch, so I started going to lunch with the other women on the team and started becoming friends with them. But that took me, like, years to even get to that point. And then, we'd go to lunch and all of a sudden it would just all come out. It was like, "Isn't that annoying?
[00:32:50] What? Like, does this happen behind the scenes at your one-on-one? 'Yes.' Are you getting told this as well? 'Yes.'" Okay. So, now we have like kind of reconfirmation of, like, what's happening, and we can work towards solutioning, but I think that it's just so prevalent and part of, you know, part of this journey, and the women in sales community is also me acknowledging and honoring like, "Hey, I don't think
[00:33:15] I was, like, everyone's best friend that first few years in sales. I think I kind of sucked at certain points and, and I wanna take ownership of that, and I wanna help make the future better, and I want for the next generation of women coming in to maybe not face that animosity." And so, I just think the more we talk about that, the more we get in these communities and these spaces together, the more we start to dissect why we're feeling certain ways and certain things, then we can move past some of this and move to,
[00:33:42] you know, the really good stuff. Because the other thing I think about is like, you know, a lot of times people will ask about webinars and they're like, "Yeah, we, you know, we wanna speak on Women in Sales." Or, you know, "What, what event are you hosting that's Women in Sales?" I'm like, "We also have just really badass women who know what they're doing.
[00:33:58] So, we can also just, we have a session tomorrow that's on, like, cold prospecting and messaging, like, we're gonna talk about like actual tactical sales content because that's what we're good at." And so, I think the future for, for all of this is, is, I'm very optimistic and bullish, like, I think we're moving in a better direction.
[00:34:17] I just think, I think it's taking longer than what any of us had hoped.
[00:34:22] Katrine Reddin: I think half the battle is speaking about it, which is what we're doing and which is why we're so half a year here.
[00:34:27] Alexine Mudawar: Yes, I know. It's fun.
[00:34:29] Ashley Coghill: You gotta own it. You gotta, like, voice it or it doesn't get better.
[00:34:33] Alexine Mudawar: Yes.
[00:34:35] Katrine Reddin: And I love the idea of just booking a lunch with your new fellow women teammates whenever they walk in the door. And just make it part of your routine. Get to know them. There's room for everyone.
[00:34:46] Alexine Mudawar: Yes. And you know what I learned was once I started doing those lunches and once I started to actually have, like, girlfriends that were on my team with me and we, like, had good relationships, we were like the biggest hype people. Like, we would, like, be the first people to congratulate each other, the first people, like, after a really good call to, like, say, "Nice job." We'd be slacking each other.
[00:35:07] Like, it was just a very different feel. And I wish, I wish more than anything that I had started that earlier and that that had been my experience sooner. But I do think that we are really good hype women for one another when the circumstances are right, and when we can get past some of that stuff too.
[00:35:24] And I think this community is also a testament to that. I look at the posts that people make and people are looking for roles or just resume advice, or they need help with, with prospecting technique. And I'll see, like, 10 people just volunteer immediately and it's just really cool to watch and cool to be part of.
[00:35:41] Katrine Reddin: I don't know if you know this, but Ashley and I actually met in a community. We've never even met in person, which is crazy to me. Yeah.
[00:35:49] Ashley Coghill: I know,
[00:35:49] Alexine Mudawar: Vegas.
[00:35:50] Katrine Reddin: One day, we'll get there.
[00:35:53] Alexine Mudawar: Ashley and Alexine took Vegas together.
[00:35:55] Ashley Coghill: Yes, we did.
[00:35:55] Katrine Reddin: What? I...
[00:35:57] Ashley Coghill: Well among like a, a lot of other people too.
[00:35:59] Alexine Mudawar: Yeah, there were more than two but I feel like we were key players, so that's fine.
[00:36:03] Ashley Coghill: Yes.
[00:36:04] Katrine Reddin: I love it, but, I mean, I, I think you're so right. It's like once you, you become friends your fellow women's salespeople, or just coworkers in general, are the biggest hype people that are out there. And Ashley and I don't even work together. And we tell each other everything about our deals, what's in our pipeline, how's it going,
[00:36:22] did we close something, did we lose something and we're always there to support each other, so I'm very grateful for her.
[00:36:27] Ashley Coghill: I have ugly cried on Zoom with Katrine.
[00:36:31] Katrine Reddin: That was early on too.
[00:36:33] Ashley Coghill: It was
[00:36:33] Katrine Reddin: Think that was like our, yeah.
[00:36:34] Ashley Coghill: Conversation we ever had, and I was like, "I'm so sorry. This is really hard."
[00:36:38] Alexine Mudawar: Sometimes that's necessary because sometimes you just gotta get it out. That might be part of the message here too. It's like sometimes you may need a session like that.
[00:36:45] Ashley Coghill: It's really, it's really impactful to have a friend who is also a woman who has faced the same struggles and not have the fear of like, "Our bosses are gonna hear us bitching together." And, like, we don't wanna be seen as negative because sometimes you have to ask someone if they have space for your vent sesh.
[00:37:05] You can't just do it. You have to be like, "Are you, are you good?" Like, "Is it okay if I start ugly crying for you right now?" And I feel like sometimes it's easier when that person isn't in the same org. But on the flip side, some of my best friends are women that I worked with and I think the lunches were a good call.
[00:37:22] Alexine Mudawar: Good.
[00:37:25] Katrine Reddin: Ashley, do you wanna ask a few more questions or should we jump to the, so would you rather once, I know we have about 10-ish minutes left?
[00:37:31] Ashley Coghill: We can do Would you rathers? I don't know. I, I know we wanted to talk about girl-on-girl crime, which we just totally did, so I think we can put that to bed. No more of that.
[00:37:42] Katrine Reddin: Yeah. I guess if there's, I know we've asked you this kind of in a billion different ways, but if there's like one final piece of advice or information you wanna leave women in revenue with, what, what would it be?
[00:37:54] Alexine Mudawar: I, the piece of advice that I would leave, any woman who is considering or in a career in sales, is there is absolutely a place and a pathway for you. If you want to do this as a career or have this as a role, as a step in your career, you can absolutely become successful at this. There is no reason that you can't.
[00:38:15] It is a lot of hard work. But this is an incredibly rewarded career. This has given me a pathway to financial freedom. It's given me the ability to move to a CEO role within my first 10 years of my career. And it's given me the ability to connect with thousands of people over the last decade, which I never would've had the opportunity to do.
[00:38:35] And so, all this to say, I think that, sales is an incredible career. Obviously, I'm, you know, a super fan over here, but I think that if you want to do this, you absolutely can and there is a place for you in this field.
[00:38:50] Katrine Reddin: I love that sentiment. And, with that said, we're gonna move on to our rapid-fire round of, "Would you rather?" Questions. Don't feel the need to explain yourself if you don't want to, or you can say why you picked one. But we've got, let's see, normally we've five, but it looks like we've got six planned for you, so.
[00:39:07] Alexine Mudawar: Oh, no.
[00:39:08] Katrine Reddin: You ready?
[00:39:09] Ashley Coghill: It's our stretch goal.
[00:39:10] Alexine Mudawar: It's a stretch. That's...
[00:39:11] Katrine Reddin: It's a stretch goal. Maybe I'll should add, make it seven for our stretchy, stretchy goal.
[00:39:15] Alexine Mudawar: Stretchy, stretchy. I know by the end of the year I'm gonna have a stretchy, stretchy stretch. All right, let's do it.
[00:39:20] Katrine Reddin: All right. Number one, would you rather manage a small sales team where everyone is super close but does not always meet quota or a large sales team where it's very much an individual contributor environment, but the team always meets quota?
[00:39:35] Alexine Mudawar: The first option.
[00:39:37] Katrine Reddin: Second question, would you rather have to deal with a client who constantly mansplains or one who constantly interrupts you to talk about sports?
[00:39:46] Alexine Mudawar: Those are both horrible. I think the sports one, I guess.
[00:39:50] Katrine Reddin: You can just wear your T-shirt and be like, "I'll listen, but I don't care."
[00:39:53] Alexine Mudawar: Yes, a hundred percent.
[00:39:56] Katrine Reddin: Would you rather work with a sales team that focuses on selling a wide variety of products or a team that specializes in one particular product?
[00:40:04] Alexine Mudawar: One particular product.
[00:40:06] Katrine Reddin: Would you rather have to post an embarrassing selfie in the Women in Sales community every time you face a rejection, or would you rather never be allowed to listen to Beyonce again?
[00:40:19] Alexine Mudawar: Okay. I mean, you guys are gonna just get blasted with selfies, I guess. That's fine. It might, might be a good exercise.
[00:40:28] Katrine Reddin: Would you rather give a talk about community building or sales in front of a million people?
[00:40:34] Alexine Mudawar: Ooh, that's a tough one. Sales, but it would be hard.
[00:40:42] Katrine Reddin: And then last question, but certainly not least, this was made by Ashley and very specific to you. So, if people don't know you, they might not get this one.
[00:40:50] Alexine Mudawar: Oh, no.
[00:40:50] Katrine Reddin: Would you rather have to decorate a three-tier cake every time someone says yes to a sponsorship, or tell Amy Voles you ate an octopus every time someone says no to a sponsorship?
[00:41:02] Alexine Mudawar: Absolutely option one. I still, to this day, if anybody knows Amy Voles, she is the queen of the octopus. And I, you know, behind the scenes here, I do like an occasional octopus ceviche little dish, um, and so she is not a fan of people eating octopus. So, I would absolutely not like to ever tell her that I eat it, nor do I.
[00:41:25] Great choice. If Amy's listening, no octopus is being eaten. Don't worry.
[00:41:29] Ashley Coghill: Not this time.
[00:41:30] Alexine Mudawar: Not since my octopus teacher. Yeah, no.
[00:41:33] Katrine Reddin: Well, Alexine, thank you so much for joining us. This was amazing. You're amazing, and we appreciate the community that you run and that we're a part of. I suggest to everyone listening to go and join that community. If you're not in there or if you're in there, start engaging 'cause there's incredible women in content in there.
[00:41:50] But thank you so much for being here. We really appreciate you.
[00:41:53] Alexine Mudawar: Thank you.
[00:41:53] Ashley Coghill: I'll wrap it up. Yeah. The entire purpose of this podcast is to elevate the voices of women in revenue, and we think the mission of your community aligns very nicely with that goal. We appreciate having you on today, and hopefully, we'll have some other chances to collaborate in the future. For those listening, you can also follow Alexine on LinkedIn for some great sales and community content.
[00:42:14] And join the club like Katrine said. And if you'd like to listen to Alexine's song, Run the World by Beyonce, as well as the walk-up songs of our other guests, you can find our playlist on Spotify by searching for Ashley and Katrine's Infinite Revenue Playlist. Thanks, and keep supporting each other, ladies.
[00:42:32] Katrine Reddin: Thanks, bye.