Not-So Kind Regards
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Not-So Kind Regards
How to Fast-Track Your Marketing Career: Unconventional Beginnings feat. Ebony Wareing
How can picking up rubbish at a music festival fast-track your career to becoming a digital marketing strategist at a top agency? Tune in to hear Ebony Wareing’s story.
In this episode, we chat with Ebony, a key team member at Birdcage Marketing for nearly four years. We explore the evolution of digital marketing, including the industry's response to the iOS 14.1 update, and the critical role of creativity and solid strategies. Ebony also shares her journey of balancing a successful career with motherhood, offering insights into the challenges and rewards of managing both.
Episode Highlights:
· Ebony's journey from a live music venue to a digital marketing strategist.
· The evolution of digital marketing and the impact of iOS 14.1 on paid ads.
· The importance of a strong overarching marketing strategy and continuous testing.
· Insights into balancing career and motherhood in a flexible work environment.
· The value of workplace culture that prioritizes mental and physical well-being.
· The significance of understanding audience pain points and aligning creative content with messaging.
Resources:
· Birdcage Marketing School - The Full Library™: https://www.birdcagemarketingschool.com/bundles/the-full-library | Use Code: PODCAST200 to get $200 off The Full Library™
· Marketing Boss Academy: https://www.birdcagemarketingschool.com/courses/marketing-boss-academy
· Birdcage Marketing - Work with Us: https://birdcagemarketing.com.au/
Where To Find Us:
· Not-So Kind Regards Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/notsokindregards_podcast/
· Birdcage Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/birdcagemarketing/
· Maddy Birdcage Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/maddybirdcage/
· Birdcage Marketing TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@birdcagemarketing
· Maddy Birdcage TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@maddybirdcage
· Birdcage LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/7600856
· Caroline Moss Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/caro__moss/
· Caroline Moss TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@caro_moss
· Caroline Moss LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/caromoss/
Connect with [podcast guest]:
· Connect with Ebony on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ebony-wareing-5692b2245/
To work with us, book your discovery call at https://www.birdcagemarketing.com.au/start-here
To discover the school, visit https://birdcagemarketing.com.au/
Welcome to the Not so Kind Regards podcast. I'm Maddie Birdcage and I'm Caroline Moss.
Speaker 1:We are done with the digital fluff and pleasantries and we're here to talk straight about brand building, digital marketing and personal growth.
Speaker 2:This episode is, of course, brought to you by Birdcage Marketing, the forward-thinking business growth and digital marketing brand that started this all. If you are a small, medium or large size business, don't know how to get started or need to tighten up your digital marketing efforts, we are currently taking on new strategy and virtual marketing manager clients. Let us shape your strategy, give you the action steps you need to implement and then hold your hand as you and all your team implement the exact process that will take you from where you are now to where you want to be. To get started, book your discovery call at birdcagemarketingcomau and let's do this. Now back to the episode.
Speaker 1:Today we are joined by Ebony Waring. Welcome, ebony. Hi, thank you. Ebony is our digital marketing strategist and she's worked at Birdcage Marketing for about the same amount of time as I have. I feel like we've both kind of journeyed through our roles at Birdcage on a similar path, but Ebony's about 10 years younger than me. We also had babies in the same year as each other, so Ebony has kind of done things differently to the way I have, in that I've like waited and done things traditionally. But you, I just find you are like so ambitious and so smart and you pick things up so quickly. So I'm really excited to share with everyone about our Gen Z marketer, who just like breaks all the rules and does things unconventionally but is like the smartest person. Oh so, ebony, can you tell us a little bit just about your experience before Birdcage and then working your way up through Birdcage?
Speaker 3:Yeah, so the way I ended up in marketing is actually kind of a weird story. It started by me picking up rubbish at a live music venue. So the marketing manager there she one day just like needed help with something event related. She was like the marketing and events manager, um, she was like, oh, like can you just come help me with this? And I don't know, I guess she liked me and she kind of like took a chance on me and she was like, instead of picking up rubbish, do you want to help me do some like stuff in the office?
Speaker 3:And I was like, okay, like 16 years old, like I don't know what that means, but okay, so I was doing like a traineeship through school while I was in grade 11. And, yeah, so then I started learning all about marketing and all of the things. And then from there I kind of took over a lot of the marketing. So I did a bit of email stuff, I did a bit of website stuff, a bit of a lot of social media, a lot of like photography, videography, all the different things.
Speaker 1:That is awesome, and I can totally see what she saw in you at the time, because you are just a go-getter and you're someone who picks things up very quickly. So what brought you from that role then into? I think you were trying to figure out what your actual role was when you started at Birdcage, but you were kind of the everything person when you came on. What brought you then to Birdcage?
Speaker 3:So I actually moved up to Mackay from the Gold Coast where I was working, and that's where I kind of met Maddie and we spoke over the phone because I had sent her my resume and she was kind of like oh you're so young and you've done all these different things, do you want to just come in and do a bit of a trial? So I did a trial on my birthday, so almost exactly four years ago, yeah, and I think it went well because I'm still here. When I started I was kind of like a bit of admin marketing assistant, just kind of helping out in every department whoever needed help. I was helping and kind of learning. All of the different things I've kind of touched like definitely have touched every department in the agency over my four years. So yeah, my role has kind of constantly evolved and changed as I've gained more skills and done more things.
Speaker 1:What did you see in Ebony Maddy when she, like, gave you a resume or when those kind of first couple months working for you? Was she different than other people who have been in similar roles? It?
Speaker 2:was tricky because Ebony was like, not my first we had we had a team by then, but she was my first, I think. Were you full-time? Yes, yeah, she was my. Actually I think you're my first full-time employee. Yeah, so, and not just that, but also working in the office which was our converted granny flat at the time. So it was kind of like Eb. It felt like when we hired Ebony it was like this is when we became a real business almost, and it's. I think it's cute how we say she's worked in every department, because, yes, we have departments now, but we did it back then. It was like Ebony myself in Mackay, just dipped, dipped in and out, and then it was you guys doing paid ads remotely as well. So I don't know, when she came to the office I was just, first of all, this calming energy that how old are you now? Like 22?.
Speaker 3:No, I'm 24.
Speaker 2:Oh, she's 24. In a week. So when she came to us, I think you were 20?. Yeah, I just turned 20,.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I just turned 20.
Speaker 2:She just turned nine. She just turned 20. She was born in the year 2000, which still blows my mind, because that means she's like 10, right, I actually didn't realize how young she was for such a long time, because she just has this really calming, mature energy about her and it's almost like she's like a swan and I've used this analogy before where where it's just like so calm above the water but down below like kicking and working hard to get things done, and it's just like nothing is too much of an ask for Ebony. You need help with something. You ask Ebony and it gets done.
Speaker 2:And I have to say that is a skill that like, that is a quality that everyone on the team does have. But it's just like for someone who's like technically Gen Z and we have these, you know, stereotypes of what Gen Z workplaces, people look like in the workplace and yeah, ebony does not fit that mould whatsoever. I also think she's a really quick learner and I think if you want to be in digital marketing, you have to be and you have to also be okay with adapting and just, you know, I would like I do throw her into the deep end. Hey, we've got this fashion client. Do we want to do photo shoots for her now. I forgot about that and we had a fashion shoot every week from our granny flat office and Ebony was a photographer and the creative director and the client liaison and, like everything else, also built the website at the same time.
Speaker 2:Also running paid ads as well, also, just like dealing with my mentee bees on the reg. So that's, I think that's what it. That's what it takes If you want to be in this industry. You just have to be okay to get in and get your hands dirty and not be afraid to maybe make mistakes, but just be willing to give it a go. And that's what Ebony has, and I think that's why she's, you know, been successful in her career.
Speaker 1:I think that resonates not just with, like digital marketing, but all like startups, small businesses. It's like you have to bring people on that are just willing to do everything and aren't like stuck in this little like I only do this. That are just willing to do everything and aren't like stuck in this little like I only do this, that's someone else's job, because you need everything done, Like most stages of business, until you get to a certain level, until you're like a big corporation pretty much.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and even then it's like, even in corporate it's like if you're that person that can be relied on, you're going to have a lot more success than someone who's just like no, that's not my job.
Speaker 1:So I want to go back to the day that I was in the paid ad role and I heard Ebony wants to learn paid ads and I was like somebody wants to join our like stressed out nerd team and I just couldn't believe like a young, creative person would actually want to join us. And Ebony was already like doing all the onboarding for Meta Ads and all the ad platforms. So you really knew, like how to install pixels, how to work with business manager, all of the really really annoying stuff that all marketers hate about ads. So you're already doing that. So you had a good background. And then, yeah, what did? What kind of drew you to running ads, wanting to learn that specialty?
Speaker 3:I was kind of fascinated by it, to be honest. Like I remember, at the time when I joined, kind of doing the paid ad stuff, we had a lot of clients that were just exploding. Like there was so many clients where they were seeing just like the most insane return on their investment and I was just like like how does this work? Like I see the ads in my feed of you know other fashion brands and this and that, but I just want to like understand it from behind the scenes, because I was just so fascinated. I was like how does this work? How are you just putting money into something and then it's essentially printing money for you?
Speaker 3:Like that's how I looked at it initially and I think at the time, like obviously I think you guys needed a bit of support because you just had so much going on, and Maddie was just like, do you want to give it a crack? And I was like okay, as I did all the time with many things. So, uh, yeah, I just kind of jumped into it. Uh, and, like you said, I was already doing the onboarding and I already kind of understood the back end of those platforms. It was just kind of understanding more of like the paid ads strategy side of things and making creatives and building those things out in ads manager.
Speaker 2:But yeah, I just thought it was really interesting. Yeah, and I think at that time as well, like for a very long time in our agency, 50% of our gross revenue was brought in through paid ads clients. We were managing retainers of like 25 grand management fees per month, and then ad spend was on top of that, so like up to what like 50K a month. It was a lot.
Speaker 1:I was trying to remember it. The other day I was like I can't even remember how much we were managing. Yeah, it was, that's one client.
Speaker 2:I should look it up. Yeah, the ROAS we were getting when you probably started doing paid ads. The ROAS we were doing like a hundred to one. Like for a dollar spend you'd get a hundred dollars back. Don't like, if I could go back in time, it was a heyday. Wouldn't you go back and just start e-commerce brands and just run paid ads? Spend like a thousand bucks a day? You're printing money, printing money.
Speaker 3:It was printing money.
Speaker 2:And people used to be like it's only returning 20 for every dollar spent and I'm like, if you got that result now, when competition is so much higher, capabilities aren't as stalky as they used to be would be number one agency.
Speaker 1:Yeah and then the heyday all came crashing down in 2021 when iOS 14.1, apple's tracking transparency came out and they said no, no, no meta ads, you are not going to be this creepy with everybody who has an Apple device, they're going to have options to block and not be tracked. And so we, like every pretty much everybody across the board I think all marketers kind of had a general worldwide freak out because everything came crashing down. Then it came back, but it was just never what it used to be. So what did you think we kind of learned from that, like to start prioritizing and how, how that kind of influenced like all of our strategy and what we do now and what we focus on now.
Speaker 3:I think like it all comes back to obviously having a really strong overarching strategy. So you need to know exactly, you need to understand your audience to a T, you need to get really deep with their pain points, what they kind of strive for, and then that turns into your messaging and your creatives. So without understanding your audience, none of this works. I know a way that Maddie has explained it before and it always really stuck with me is that paid ads or just anything in marketing is just a cog in the machine. So without everything else working together it's not going to work. That cog will stop if something else stops. You need everything flowing together and the only way for that to work is by having a really strong overarching strategy, and that's what it always comes back to.
Speaker 2:I love that. What wisdom.
Speaker 1:I think it came back to like the original point of marketing, which is like, okay, it's about the humans and it's about the creative you're using to reach those humans and drive them towards a certain action. It's like less about like, oh, let's like optimize this audience by like 1% and do this weird placement thing and like all these little hacks that we used to have, that we used to watch YouTube videos and, you know, sign up for like very expensive memberships to understand and get the inside loop, and now now, like meta ads, to me is like it's all about creative and the right message.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and I think as well. Back then it was a lot about like your creatives were always they had to be very pretty. Everything was really pretty and beautiful and really high quality. And after this it really changed and it became more about the more like native, organic content Still, obviously, stuff that is going to stop the scroll, it needs to kind of disrupt the person's feed, but it is just a lot more organic in nature and it just it looks completely different these days to what it did back then. It's not just about really beautiful colors and aesthetics.
Speaker 3:It's like you can just do crazy shit now.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I guess for small business owners looking to meta ads, what are some things that you think they need to take off the list before they start thinking about running their own paid ads or working, even outsourcing, paid ads?
Speaker 3:Obviously, the first like not the first first thing, but kind of the first thing is, once you've got your website live, install your damn pixel, install your pixel. It is essential. Say it one more time Install your pixel. I will scream it from the rooftops, it is just so important. The more data you have to work with, obviously, the better. It's, not only for retargeting people, but creating lookalike audiences of people that are visiting your website or purchasing from you. Those things are so vital. And then obviously, you just need to, like I said before, understand your strategy and your audience, and that's what I really love about Birdcage Marketing School is teaching people how to do that. So, like, obviously, in the school, we teach you how to create the content that is going to resonate with your audience, and once you test that on your organic socials, you can then just pop it into an ad and Bob's your uncle, you're ready to go.
Speaker 1:I love that. That's what I teach my mentoring clients too. It's like they're like always kind of antsy and they're like I just want to get to the ads part. I just want to get to this part and I'm like we can get there but like it's not going to perform and you're going to be wasting money until we really understand your audience, until we get your socials to like really strong content. And even I have some clients where the content isn't like reaching people as much as it should. But I know the messaging is on point because I have that experience now and I know it's like I'm like 99% sure it's gonna perform an ad, so I'll be that person.
Speaker 1:That's like let's just give it a go. Like how much money are you willing to? Just like let's just chuck a couple hundred dollars at it. I at it. I know that's like you know, put it in the coin slot, but it's with educated guesses and so it's an investment and most of them go in with that mindset. It's like let's just see if this works and 10 out of 10 times it does, because they worked with our strategy and they're working with with experts and they've they've done the foundational work to get there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's like I don't know why. Why is it that people just think paid ads is the silver bullet?
Speaker 3:Maybe it comes back to like we were saying before the heyday of like 2020, where everyone was just seeing everything explode. I don't know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I blame the bro marketers.
Speaker 3:Yeah 100% Cowboy country yeah.
Speaker 1:But then on the flip side, I get clients who are like allergic to paid ads and they're like I just want to do everything organic, I don't want to pay for anything. But then it's like if the sales are struggling, it's like what? There's only two ways you can get traffic organic or paid. Like that's the way you do it. So like why not use 100% of the tools that you have? So you've worked your way up through all the creative roles in Birdcage. You've kind of been a jack of all trades and now you're stepping into more of like a strategy role. Is that correct? Yeah, I am. So tell us a bit about what you think. The experience you need is to get to the role you have now and to be able to create strategies for clients and kind of like us, what like what's in our strategies as well, that people will find useful.
Speaker 3:I think it comes back to the fact that I, like you said, am a jack of all trades and I have experience in each of our departments. So I understand how ads work. I understand how organic socials work, website emails all of the things. I have a pretty good understanding of how they all work and how they need to come together to create a strategy overall that will work. So now that I'm actually writing those strategies, I've got that end goal in mind and I can really create in-depth messaging and talk about our clients' audiences with a deeper understanding of how that will apply across all of their platforms and all of their streams of marketing. That is spectacular Like.
Speaker 2:It's not like. You went to uni, you did a strategy degree. You became a strategist. You literally have learnt by actually doing from the age of 16 to the tender age of 24. That's a long time actually for a 24 year old to be doing something for Maybe you'll be a lifelong marketer, like us.
Speaker 1:I think that just shows like you just need to start doing. Any business owners who are like I need the perfect, this, I need the perfect that, I need to know everything. It's like, no, you need to be learning and doing at the same time and like testing, testing, testing.
Speaker 3:It's all about testing.
Speaker 1:It's an educated guess, so you understand your audience.
Speaker 3:You understand, you know you've got your creatives and your messaging, but it's still all about testing because once it's out there in the big wide world, you don't know exactly which part of that is going to work. So you need to keep testing different combinations, different messaging with different creatives with different audiences and you will find which one that works. But you just got to keep testing.
Speaker 1:And then you double down on what works, rather than going like I think this is going to work and I'm going to put all my money behind it. And if it doesn't work, then I'm going to blame someone else or be in victim mode, instead of like okay, I have a flexible mindset, this is all. Yeah, just a testing.
Speaker 3:This didn't work, so let's try this instead.
Speaker 1:Yeah, what do you think lends to that? That mindset mindset, maddie of like how how would you advise a business owner who's a bit nervous to just they just want the right answer straight away. Like how would you advise them?
Speaker 2:that's what the strategy does. That's that's what a strategy does. We don't take on strategy clients or any clients if we don't feel confident that we have the answers for them. But guess what? We generally have the answers for them. There are particular industries that we won't work in. I can't actually think off the top of my head Like there's no. It's mainly there are particular audiences that we won't work in, and that's purely if we just haven't had experience with them in the past. But we've had experience with most industries.
Speaker 2:Like, if you are looking for answers, the answers you seek will be in a strategy. That's the whole point of a strategy. It's to have the answers ready for when you then need to head onto the platform. So if you're staring at your paid ads account going, what should my ad say? That's telling me all I need to know, which is you haven't done a strategy, because if you have a strategy, you will then front up to your paid ads dashboard and go sweet, I know exactly. We're going to use this video over here. I'm going to use this headline here. I know that I need to target. Well, you don't even need to focus on targeting too much, because Facebook and the platform take care of a lot of that. If you're thinking yourself across anything, I don't know what to say right now. You haven't done a deep enough strategy 100%.
Speaker 1:I think the value of going with testing. It's like I think my audience cares about this, this and this. From my strategy I'm going to see which is going to make me the most money and which is the most compelling, not like these are all failures. But I have clients who test three different types of messaging and one gets them like a six return on ad spin, whereas one gets like a two or three. So it's like okay, well that they've all worked technically, but this one's working a lot better. So let's double down on that.
Speaker 2:And that's how you grow a business. You get 1% better every single day.
Speaker 1:And you find the things that are profitable and you double down on them.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So, ebony, we've talked about your career. You have just like lived so many lives at the ripe age of 24 and you're a mom now as well. Your little girl is about two-ish months younger than my son, so how have you found juggling like a career and motherhood? I know we all have had our struggles with that, but also like, what is your day-to-day look like? Because you are doing things a little bit differently than most people as far as, like, not working a nine to five.
Speaker 3:Yeah it's hard. It's very hard, as we know. Especially I am one of those mothers that does not have a daycare that I can drop my daughter off to. The daycare situation in Mackay is terrible, so I have to rely on my family a lot and I'm very lucky to have such an amazing support system around me. Honestly, that is really like an important part of it, especially my fiance Daniel. Like he, I couldn't do this without him by any means.
Speaker 3:But it also comes to Maddie as well being the perfect boss. I know she's got a few videos talking about how she lets her staff do whatever they want and it just comes down to her just being so flexible with hours and things like that. Obviously, that is a big part of it when I can't just come into the office nine to five Monday to Friday. But it's kind of strange, I think, because I love what I do when I'm working, like whether I'm working at night or during the day while my daughter's asleep. It's like a form of self-care for me as well, because it's once you become a mother like it's very much just about everything is about your child, obviously. So to kind of switch that off for a second and just focus on something work related. It's. It genuinely is a form of self-care.
Speaker 1:I know that, like I always think, like how do moms go back to work and work in normal? Like like nine to five, monday to Friday. Situations like in this new world of being a mother, like it is so challenging your kid's getting sick all the time, like they've got so many big feelings, and like whenever, like I get so stressed out when I have to stay home and my child's sick, but Maddie is always so understanding and she's like you know, let's, we'll figure this out, we'll, we'll figure out your, your client calls Like you just make it. You're not that added piece of stress which I don't think a lot of mothers get that privilege of.
Speaker 2:But can I just say, though, that these people are incredible that work for me. Like I think I I'm not going to cry because I got lots of mascara on, but the people that work for me are incredible. I get to be that understanding, flexible boss, because I know that their responsibilities are always taken care of, because they don't just well someone else's problem now, see ya, like if it came down to it, obviously, like we always pick up each other's pieces, and I think that goes for every single person in the team. But if you have such incredible, intelligent, dedicated, hardworking, passionate people who deliver all the time, you can like I'm not stressed If someone's like oh, I can't work today, my, my kid's sick, blah, blah, blah. I'm like cool, like same, like.
Speaker 2:I really want to speak to the employees here when I say this because you have the power to create a boss and a manager, you can manage your manager into being that person. You, if you prove that you can be trusted, that you have the business's best interests at heart and obviously in corporate, where there's like stricter rules, maybe it's a bit different, but especially in a small business like ours, you, like you just showed that you can create this. We've had plenty of people you know join the team and then we've had to part ways again because they are not that kind of person, because they aren't committed to getting the job done at all costs, pretty much Like it's easy for me to stand there and be like I'm so flexible and I'm the best workplace and I will say all those things, but it's like I couldn't be that if I had monkeys. I've got diamonds, I've got swans.
Speaker 1:I definitely think workplace culture is so much more than just like ping pong tables at work and beer Fridays Like. It's about understanding that, like family and responsibilities outside of work are really important, but when you're at work, you you prioritize that, but it needs to be flexible and support your lifestyle, whether you're an entrepreneur or an employee. That needs to be more front of mind for businesses.
Speaker 2:I just know myself like if I'm sad I'm not doing good work yeah, exactly right like if I'm sad, I'm like I don't want to be here, what's?
Speaker 1:I don't want sad people, I want happy people but if we are sad, maddie actually has the EPA employee EAP employee assistance program, so it actually pays for mental, physical, any kind of health support that we need throughout the year, which is really important too, so we can go from sad to happy people.
Speaker 2:Well, not even sad to happy. It's more like like. I think we have access through that program to all sorts of medical specialists, physical and mental practitioners but I think the one that most of us use, including myself, is the psychologist service, which it's not even about like getting you know, making you happy so you can do more work.
Speaker 2:It's more just like having just another person to speak to, I think feeling supported feeling, yeah, and just the other thing that really that I really wanted with that program was to, because I've been through psychology services before and it's a long wait time to get in to speak to someone, whereas we can pretty much access someone with the same week if we need it.
Speaker 2:I think it's really important. I think I know a lot of big businesses have EAPs, but small businesses, you can have them as well, and I think they're very valuable and I also kind of like I love to mentor my staff as much as possible, but there's also times where I'm like I don't know the answer to that one. Have you booked an EAP session? Like it kind of takes the pressure off me a little bit as well to not always have all the answers and it also from your guys' perspective, like you can also book them anonymously and there are obviously things you don't always want to share with me, necessarily, but you can share in complete confidence with, yeah, that person, and life is hard sometimes. We just need someone to talk to.
Speaker 1:I like what you said about work being self-care though, too, ebony, I think that's so not talked about in the mom going to work sphere. It's like all the arguments I see is like nobody can afford to have a one-income household, and that's definitely true. Is like nobody can afford to have a one income household, and like that's definitely true. But also like nobody asks dads if they want to go back to work. Don't want to go back to work, like if, like their jobs aren't treated as hobbies. So I think, like it's really important to speak to the fact that, like we get a lot of out of working, like for our souls, like it's a, it's good for us, it's self care it makes me a better parent as well, because I'm taking that time and using my brain for something else.
Speaker 3:If I was still and everyone is completely different, but if I was still sitting at home and not working, I think I would have gone insane by now yeah, so we have some rapid fire questions to finish off, ebony.
Speaker 1:So I know you're a big reader and you told me that's your form of self-care. I love that. So what's been your favorite book of 2024? Oh, this is a great question.
Speaker 3:Honestly, it's really difficult to give you just one, but I can give you my favorite series. It's called Throne of Glass by Sarah J Maas. It is the best series.
Speaker 2:Is that the one Jess reads Cheap? Jess has read it. Yes, I'm pretty sure Jack has it on his bedside.
Speaker 3:It is absolutely insane.
Speaker 1:Is it?
Speaker 3:fantasy, yes, like romantasy.
Speaker 2:Romantasy yeah it is.
Speaker 1:It's not the one with the fairies, is it? Yeah, they're like a fae, they're not fairies. I've heard about this on podcasts. Actually it's like dirty fairies, yeah, dirty yes muck books in the office.
Speaker 3:I'm just here reading about money. I was going to say that I was like, look, it's not a book about marketing, but I've got to be honest.
Speaker 1:Carol was thinking of when he was reading a book.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I don't know some like big literature book Jane.
Speaker 1:Austen. Okay, do you have a hidden talent that we don't know about? She would have 100.
Speaker 3:Like not currently. I haven't tried it in a long time, but I used to be really good at taekwondo. I was like almost a black belt what?
Speaker 2:There's taekwondo across the road, isn't there?
Speaker 1:I think so, so yeah be careful, so don't mess with us, because we got an almost black belt. I did once.
Speaker 3:Oh, my God.
Speaker 2:Well, it's our team content day tomorrow.
Speaker 1:So, Miss Gen Z, do you have a favorite social media platform?
Speaker 3:it used to be instagram, but yeah, definitely tiktok.
Speaker 1:I spend most of my time there yeah I feel like it's becoming intergenerational tiktok I don't know.
Speaker 2:But then I go and speak to like school mums and they're like oh, I don't have a tiktok, I'm like I can't talk to you no.
Speaker 3:I just love it because it's just all of my things like. I get stuff like marketing related, I get like book talks, so I can listen to things about my books.
Speaker 1:I get mom stuff, I get yeah yeah, I find with Instagram it's like, once you're one dimensional, it's just like one thing, whereas, yeah, tiktok, it's like I get so many different things that all feel relatable to me.
Speaker 2:A hundred percent. I agree with that, because on Instagram, as soon as I like save one post relating to work, or like a coach, it's like I made $50 trillion in a day. I get so many of them. And then I kind of feel like Icky, I do. Well, I kind of. On one hand, I'm like of. On one hand I'm like, oh, I feel burnt out by this. I don't want to think about work right now. Or then I feel like why are all these people making a kajillion dollars and I'm just here grinding away parasinitis?
Speaker 1:but like yeah, versus tiktok, you feel like kind of inspired or you laugh or and it's like escapism some random stuff like.
Speaker 2:I watched this thing last night and I actually like it's probably the only thing that makes me belly laugh these days. I watched this one video of this.
Speaker 3:His husband. He woke his wife up, put Uno cards in her hand while she was asleep. I saw that I didn't see it.
Speaker 2:She was asleep and he sits up in the bed and has like the pile of Uno cards and has Uno cards and puts Uno cards in her hand and then he's just like, draw four, it's your turn. He's like, hey, you fell asleep, Wake up, draw four. And he's like it just shows her like waking up and then she just starts playing.
Speaker 3:Uno Like she's completely asleep.
Speaker 2:It was like that is the most unhinged, like diabolical humor and I love it.
Speaker 1:I think TikTok does it well. It feels like everyone's in on an inside joke somehow. It's like you're like, oh, I get that, and then people post things that like you have no context, and then you go look it up so you feel cool and so like you're in on the inside joke.
Speaker 3:I just love it and like how you can like repost stuff.
Speaker 1:Like I'm like, yeah, funny. One skill you'd love to learn.
Speaker 3:As weird as it is because I'm on BookTok I see people like binding their own books. So you get your favorite book and you like rip it, like the covers, and then you like rebind it and you do like all this really beautiful stuff.
Speaker 2:Isn't that Joe Goldberg from you? Is it Maybe he makes? Have you watched, you the?
Speaker 1:series. I watched a few episodes, but I couldn't what.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I can't do like killer stuff, neither can I, but I can watch you. Yeah, I haven't watched the new season though can watch you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I haven't watched the new season, though. Oh my god, I love it.
Speaker 2:I think I was pregnant and I was just like it was too intense. No, he's, he's wonderful. I think he's so good. It's a role he was made for that guy. Yes, but yeah, he's like a. He rebinds books.
Speaker 3:Yes, oh yeah because he works in a book. So, yeah, yeah, um, I don't know, I just find that so cool I didn't know you're obsessed with books like deeply.
Speaker 1:It's become my entire personality how like she has like a whole, like a huge bookshelf, and so like I've been reading the same book since I was pregnant and I'm almost just finished it. So I was like feeling very like, oh my god, I am, I'm weak it's almost my one year book reading, oh, really okay.
Speaker 2:So it's like a new hyper focus, because I'm like I'm like, how did I like sit next to you for like?
Speaker 3:yeah, no, it's new. I've only read like 42 books in a year in a year and I've read one I'm trying to do 50 books this year 50 I wanted to read a book a week.
Speaker 1:E, Ebony, you need to start a book. Tiktok book review what no?
Speaker 2:you're not. So there's this course called Birdcage Marketing School, and it will teach you everything you need to know about getting out of your own way and creating the life of your dreams through social media. By talking about books, you may or may not get full access. You may have actually helped me write this course. You may have actually helped me write this course. You may have hosted the course before it was the course in live settings, but actually Awesome.
Speaker 1:Well, thanks so much for joining us, Ebony Thanks.
Speaker 2:Thanks for listening to this episode of the Not so Kind Regards podcast. We hope you enjoyed it. If you did, we would really appreciate if you left a review, on whatever streaming platform you are using. It helps us to grow as a brand new podcast and to help many more business owners and content creators reach their goals, just like we hope this brought you one step closer to yours. Remember, connect with us on TikTok, at Maddie Birdcage and at Birdcage Marketing, and the same handles on Instagram again, and if you really want to learn how to work with us, make sure you head to our website and book a call. We would love to speak with you.