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Sound Off #68 - Rethink or Sink: Revitalizing Your Brand, and more!
Sponsored by Intercard!
The entertainment industry faces a critical turning point as venues struggle to update their brands and offerings in a post-COVID marketplace that looks dramatically different from before.
• If you haven't started revitalizing your brand, it may already be too late for 2025
• Supply chain issues, tariffs, and warehouse limitations are creating additional challenges for operators attempting renovations
• Albatross is setting a new standard with their upcoming New Jersey venue featuring bowling, mini-golf, and attractions targeting the over-21 demographic
• Sandbox VR continues their expansion and is adding hospitality components to become a social entertainment destination
• VR is evolving from simple shooter games to story-driven adventures with higher throughput and better economics
• Illuminarium's Chicago location closed after delivering a subpar temporary structure that received harsh reviews
• Immersive Gamebox continues licensing expensive IP despite this strategy contributing to their previous financial troubles
• Theme parks are increasingly incorporating gamification elements into attractions, but creating truly replayable experiences remains challenging
Join Kevin Williams at London Experience Week where he'll be presenting on the future of competitive socializing, and at Amusement 360 in May discussing how to future-proof entertainment facilities.
Are you on the edge of your seat Because we're about to sound off with Kevin Williams covering today's latest trends in location-based entertainment brought to you by the LBX Collective your community to connect, engage and inspire. All right, everyone, let's buckle up.
Speaker 2:All right. Well, welcome everybody to the latest SoundOff, number 68, for April 8th. All right, so we don't have to worry about any April Fools this time. So we're good. No April Fools jokes. We didn't have any, actually, last time either, so it was all real.
Speaker 3:Well, you just made an April Fools joke. It's 69.
Speaker 2:Well, so that's the thing, I think, my number numbering is wrong somewhere, so we'll figure it out.
Speaker 3:Either this, we'll figure it out, that's. That's the april fools, is it?
Speaker 2:but uh, yeah. So we don't know which number is it, because I think I said 68 last time, but then when I was looking at the numbers, anyway, long story short, it's 68 or 69. We will figure it out, uh, and make sure that the correction will be made next. Sound off yeah, put it that way. Yeah, yeah, it's the next sound off, so it's all right, all right. So, that being said, what do we have to change our mind today, kevin?
Speaker 3:Well, it's the difficult one, it's the hard one, especially for people that have attended the exhibitions. At the beginning of the year they have to make that decision about whether it's too late for them to revitalize their brand. You know, the undertaking of the work needed to bring your facility and your brand up to code to meet the modern trend of possible future competitors should have started last year, if not earlier, started last year, if not earlier. So now people are faced with the daunting you know realization, especially if they have a facility that's over three or four years old, that has weathered the storm of COVID, shall we say, and is now out the other end. They're looking at a market that is totally different and if they haven't started the process of revitalizing their brand, their offering and their facility, then it may be too late and their competition, whoever they are, may be getting the lead upon them.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So a couple of thoughts. One, it is funny that you chose this picture, given the fact that this is not an old venue that needs to be revitalized, but it's a brand new venue that does need to be revitalized. But anyway, we won't say the name of the venue, it's okay.
Speaker 2:We won't say that, yeah, but we did talk about them, though, in a previous, so you could go back and find it. But anyway, I would Tell us in the comments which place it is. Yeah, exactly, but while it is probably too late for 2025 to have an impact in 2025, it is never too late to revitalize your brand if you are in a place, if you are in need of revitalization. So, basically, this is one of those where it depends on what's required to revitalize your brand. It's just coming with the brand. If it's changing your attraction mix and doing significant overhaul to the layout and to the guest flow and to the furniture, etc. Then, yeah, it may be better to just sit on the sidelines for a minute while some of the tariff stuff shakes out.
Speaker 3:Just sit on the sidelines for a minute while some of the tariff stuff shakes out. But yeah, your warehouse availability is going to be second pick and you know, if the product isn't on its way already then it may be taking longer than you've expected. All of the dates that we were quoted at Amusement Expo for when products will be available that were launched at the show will obviously be pushed now courtesy of the developments regarding the tariffs and the such like the trade war that seems to be brewing in the background. That said, you can turn a brand round within six months.
Speaker 3:I've done it myself for a client who had never-ending pockets of cash and were prepared to do whatever it took to be able to defend themselves against the prospects of a Dave Buster's opening up in their backyard. So they then did pull their finger out and rebrand themselves, make sure that they were fighting match fit before they threw open their doors. But again, not everybody would be in that position. I would point to Hollywood Bowl, who have methodically gone through their chain, considerable chain of bowling facilities and facility at a time, has managed to go and bring all of those sites up to the next level of competitive boutique socializing environments. It can be done if you have the right amount of money, as well as the right amount of information about what you're trying to achieve.
Speaker 2:Anyway, all right, well, before we move into man waking up here, all right, before we move into the next set of trends, let's uh, let's take a quick break. Intercard is the only cashless system designed, developed and manufactured all under one roof. They introduced cashless technology to the amusement industry and have been leading the way for over 30 years. Cashless systems to the amusement industry and have been leading the way for over 30 years. Cashless systems from Intercard increase customer spending, guest satisfaction and boost revenues by up to 30%. Intercard is so proud to be serving the amusement industry and if you aren't already part of their global family of customers, they hope you will become one soon. All right, well, let's dive into the latest trends, kevin, shall we? Yeah?
Speaker 3:let's get into it.
Speaker 3:So the trending in the biz talking about bringing your facility or your brand up to code and making it match fit and making it suitable for future proofing and all of that.
Speaker 3:I would point a lot of people to go and have a look at what our friends at Albatross are doing at their facility. The video of the rendered walkthrough of their facility that opens its doors in New Jersey in a couple of weeks' time is available and you can really see that they have created a bowling mini-golf, that they have created a bowling mini golf, selfie bar, karaoke environment and amusement component that is really going to try and attract the core audience that they're looking for, the over 21 edgy crowd, the kiddos, obviously. This is the test case. A number of very smart people have been involved, offering consultancy advice on the development of this, and I kind of use this as a yardstick of where the standard of the market is. It'll be interesting to see what the ROI is of the facility after they throw the doors open. After they throw the doors open, but the build quality and the presentation quality is kind of a good metric to use as a development.
Speaker 2:Oh, thank you, brandon. Yeah, and this is just obviously a rendering of their. I mean, this first of all has a very Andretti carding feel, instead of building into the exterior design, but at the same time, an elevated, definitely an elevated experience that they're trying to go for, and just by the cars that they've chosen to put in their parking lot, I think they are going for a much more elevated audience as well.
Speaker 3:They're going for a prosumer market. The video goes into a little bit more detail. The people that are milling around the bowling and the bar are all in night attire very expensive night attire. It is going to go for the FOMO, as Randy would beat into my head. The fear of missing out is important. They want it to be a high salubrious location. It is high on the boutique and low on the amusement and I look forward to actually getting a chance to go there and seeing what is actually parked in their parking lot when the doors are thrown open. But I think they're going to give it a very big push.
Speaker 3:Talking about a very big push, we talk about our friends at sandbox vr. They had a very important milestone as they opened their sixth venue, of course, part of their franchise business rather than their self-owned uh and uh, as we talked about in open shots, their dublin facility had, which is under the franchise uh for that territory. It has Tony the robot there serving cocktail drinks, and all of the new rollouts that they're beginning to promote now all seem to include a hospitality component to them. So they are pivoting the brand to be more social entertainment than just drop-in VR attraction. That said, they've also announced that they will be developing more experiential VR adventures being able to travel to various far-off locations, be able to navigate those virtually. They're also talking about maybe some scientific-style experiences created. I don't know if that's because they're thinking of doing a steam kind of approach, where they open the facilities up in the day for the school groups and then in the afternoon it's aimed at the usual players. I'm not sure if that's the model they're going for, but it is clear that they are broadening their franchise now that they have reached this particular point of their investment. And again, the information that we had from our sources some time ago was that the plan for the operation was that they wanted to float on the market at some point in time, and I think the magic number of 80 or 90 facilities will allow them to achieve that.
Speaker 3:More VR and a well-known development facility, this company I think it's best to say that they are a broad church when it comes to interactive entertainment, but Baninjay, as I'm trying to get it out properly, baninjay Live Studios is part of Ban Inje Entertainment and they do live performances, they do content creation, I think, they do music events, but they also do video games now decided to pivot into the location-based entertainment market and they have partnered with Innoverse, the developers of the virtual adventure systems. So, the same way that we saw with the Paul, I'm trying to think the Canadian space project, victor and Paul yeah yeah, senior moment there. But anyway, we've seen other artist groups look at pivoting into location-based live entertainment experiences. Philip and Paul, no, felix and Paul.
Speaker 3:There we go, finally. Brain finally got there. Felix and Paul did their space immersive experience and they have a background in live performance and entertainment content creation. Now we say Ban and Jay doing the same. I would expect to see other studios such as this also look to pivot where they can do high-end experiences. They don't have to cut back on the experiences to do consumer VR, with the limitations that that has. They can go all out with these kinds reality adaptation where it moves away from the zombie blasting more towards the immersive adventure for large groups and the revenue model becomes much more believable.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, this. This seems to me to be Benajai dipping their toe in the water into location based, immersive, location based entertainment, but also into a partnership with Universe, where I can see very easily a Benajai group you know bringing Universe underneath their banner and actually acquiring them, and you know making having Universe be a key part of their LBE play. I mean, this seems to me to be something that, look, they're going to partner now and fast forward a year or two from now and they could be working much more closely together or in some sort of M&A.
Speaker 3:I agree, collaboration for now, though it could lead towards greater things. I'm interested, of course, being close to where their operation here is. Here in Spain. I've had contact with the guys. I know their operation a little better than most and they have some interesting plans for North America coming up, but at the moment they're really motoring along with the rollout of their adventures or their immersive experiences. And we talked about the competitive socializing hub that had opened up in London at Canary Wharf, competitive socializing hub that had opened up in London at Canary Wharf. Well, one of those exhibitions going into the space next door to the Friends exhibit and the Formula One exhibit, is a Tutankhamun virtual reality and physical immersive attraction. And you know, these are the type of things that that VR component, with people in groups of 40 putting on their headsets and, you know, migrating through the villa in Pompeii or, in this particular case, being able to navigate through the tombs of the pyramid.
Speaker 3:You know they do offer a unique experience that takes this to a new level and offers a much wider audience to approach, to.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I think this is one of those where you know you have universe, who seems to be moving in this, this newer trend we've seen which is a virtual virtual reality adventures versus purely like just just free roam or obviously zombie shooting or some you know first person shooter games. This is more like I'm gonna go and I'm gonna have, uh, I'm gonna experience an adventure and a story driven experience with friends or family and I think that the you know they mentioned the, the nightmares. This is the hotel dracula, which is probably the studio live studio is doing, but then they have you know this one as well for Dreams, but again, much more adventure, story-driven types of VR experience in a large free roam environment.
Speaker 3:Right at the boom of this phase of virtual reality, I was pushing something called experiential, which was away from just trying to create a game narrative. You create a adventure narrative which has components that are interactive to it. Uh, one of those, uh, you know, jumping back, uh, there's a company called led reality. Uh, that created the war of the worlds experience, which is a you know, it's a linear, linear walkthrough, but it has VR components to it. And then Dive Labs with their Gollum experience. Again, it is a historically accurate virtual adventure, but with an interactive element to try and encourage individuals to come back and find all of the hidden elements and achieve all of the puzzle pieces. And I expect to see this kind of immersive adventure popping up a lot more, purely because you have a much higher throughput cinema-level throughput but at a much higher price point because of the experience you're offering. And then suddenly, the mathematics of running VR look a lot more favorable than just running twosies and foursies through your facility.
Speaker 3:Talking about VR again, and our friends at Universal Studios Japan they have a dedicated flat ride attraction using VR and they have been re-skinning this a number of times over the last few years. So the headset stays the same. The ride machine stays the same, it's just the programming of the experience and how the ride vehicle is activated has changed, and they've been using this for a number of high level IP properties over the time, and the latest one that they've been using this for a number of high-level IP properties over the time and the latest one that they've created content for for this system is Spy Family. I think that is a Netflix series. It's the anime series. I haven't watched it yet. It's unbelievable.
Speaker 2:The streaming service is Hulu, but it is anime yes.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so I've seen it pop up on our feed here. I know our feed isn't normal compared to the American stuff. I've been watched in Mr Sarmanto's Corner Store. That anime has been interesting me at the moment. But again an example of really what we expected this type of technology to be, which is, rather than rip the whole machine out and start again, you would just change the content and change the branding and then get another bite out of the cherry and universal studios. Japan has succeeded in achieving that.
Speaker 3:So we talked about it in open and shut, but we can go into a little bit more detail the sad news that Luminarium in Chicago has closed their facility. It's been a devil of a time to try and find out confirmation of the situation on this. We had to actually wait for the local Chicago media to report on the legal battle between the Navy Pier facility owners with Illuminarium taking them to court over damages for what they perceive as the non-appearance of what they were proposed. To get Long story short, you know 30 million was proposed as going to be invested into the development of a unique Illuminarium. For those that haven't done Illuminarium, this is the projection wall experience which you walk through. We have a number of their sites. We have four facilities now down to three facilities one in Las Vegas, one in Arizona, I think I'm right and one in I can't remember where the other one is. We can look that up later.
Speaker 3:But the issue is that what was delivered at the Navy Pier site, which is a very prominent site for tourists as well as locals for entertainment, was a temporary structure with projection inside. We received some very harsh reviews, very harsh reviews from people very disappointed for the value of money and the experience. They felt that they were wonkered by what they received. And then the site closed once opened again, then closed again in January and has not reopened. And so the owners of the venue have now taken to legal action again, trying to get confirmation of what will happen to the site. What the state of the other Illuminarium businesses? They are operational at the moment. They're all saying that they're open the other three sites that I checked on but at this moment in time I also expect that Illuminarium is going to have to go through quite a major restructuring to try and, shall we say, exorcise those bad reviews that they received originally.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, this is going to be a tough one to overcome, certainly in the Chicago market anyway. I mean, they can't come back in the Chicago market for a number of years and tell people's memories of the terrible experience they received here. But just to clarify, they are in Las Vegas, which we've been to that location multiple times, you and I Atlanta, as well as in Toronto. Toronto, canada is the other location. And yeah, I mean we've talked about these guys.
Speaker 2:This is the very early model business model, both business model and technology model of the immersive experience. This was a formalized version of the pop-up Van Gogh experiences that we all had to experience 10 plus years ago, and so they've tried to formalize it into an actual attraction. I think the difficulty is both, as we said, is the repeat visitation for something like this, unless they're continually switching out their experiences, which requires enormous capital. But then also, you know, reading the broader story about this Navy Pier installation. It just didn't meet the pitch that they had given to the Navy Pier and it was a pretty subpar version of the Illuminarium in general. It's not like they just didn't execute. They delivered a subpar version of what they've delivered in the other locations.
Speaker 3:It was a pop-up version of what they delivered Exactly.
Speaker 2:Beyond what is in the existing Illuminariums. They overpromised beyond and then yet delivered below even the current locations.
Speaker 3:If you would describe an Illuminarium as a boat, they have a hole in their boat and they've had that for some time and it isn't helped by them digging a bigger hole by doing an over-promising on a pop-up, if that is the case that that was done in this particular legal action. I have a list of companies that are on the watch list regarding the state of their businesses, and Illuminarium has been there for some time because if you look at the reviews that their venues get, they're very harsh. When we last visited the Las Vegas facility, um, you know it was empty, but we were there at about three o'clock, four o'clock, so they could argue that their business doesn't kick off until five, six, seven. But then, checking the reviews over the week that we were there there, was very harsh. You know, one star kind of for TripAdvisor placement, harsh one-star kind of trip advisor placement.
Speaker 3:I know how difficult it is to do an operation, and especially an operation that is trying to break the mold. I think they hindered themselves by trying to create the content themselves as well as doing the facility themselves. The first two experiences that I tried of theirs they're African and their space experiences were subpar. The projection quality and the narrative, didn't quite understand the medium that they were working on, and a level of arrogance from the original management team hindered them in warming themselves to the market. Now I think maybe restructuring, rebranding and refocusing on what they're offering is needed if they're going to survive in a very crowded market.
Speaker 3:Moving from the business to the trends and tech, and speaking of a company that is an example of bouncing out of chapter and still fighting our friends at Immersive Gamebox, up to 33 installations of their operation, as we said previously, they've been acquired by a fund who's changed their board and looking to refocus their business and as part of that, they've made a major announcement that they've signed a licensing agreement with Warner Brothers. Or should that be Amazon? Warner Brothers? I think. Is it yes?
Speaker 2:Amazon and GM Studios.
Speaker 3:Oh yes, I'm getting my studio. I've been typing up all my stuff from. Yeah, Amazon's at GM.
Speaker 3:Yeah, sorry about that. So Warner Brothers brothers discovery there we go. That's good. Uh, they have licensed the batman ip and they've created an immersive experience within their projection mapped, body tracked or camera vision. Uh, enclosure. I'm looking forward to giving that a go to see how they do that. This is one of many IP content that they have done. They've done everything from Squid Games oh, let's see. They've done Peppa Pig. They've done many, many, many IP-based game content. I think partly because the content that they created themselves, based on original designs, didn't really cut it as much. It didn't draw in the audience where if you have a big IP like Rebel, moon or Squid Games, then people kind of know what the property is and then want to come in and experience that. Again. This is a very interesting point for the company's history because we're at that stage now where they've gone through quite a turbulent shakeup and now the new management and the new infusion of cash will have to drive down the path for them to stay relevant in a very changing market.
Speaker 2:So this I just feel like they haven't learned their lesson. You know, one of the things we talked about when we first announced the, when you first announced their administration going, you know, filing for bankruptcy. I was wrong. I was told a thousand times I was wrong.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, well, one of the reasons that you know we were, we were saying, okay, what, what were some of the things that may be broken inside the company that drove them to this point?
Speaker 2:And there's, there were really two that we called out, which is one, was the fact that they majority of their technology is non-proprietary, is as expensive, heavily licensed, uh technology that they use for their system, and the fact that they continually work with expensive IP for games, and so, therefore, their profit margins on both their platform that they're selling as well as the content that they're selling, are very compressed because of the fact that they're licensing those things and their operators, as a result, have to charge more for the experience as well because of this, uh, the fact that they don't uh own their own content.
Speaker 2:And so, just as a quick you know you mentioned squid game they also have done ghostbusters, angry paw patrol for the younger kids, um and and uh, they've even just recently released a florist lava, but this is the uh, this is the netflix show, so already a concept that Valo Motion has done very well in their Valo Arena, the same Flores Lava style gameplay, and yet they went and actually licensed the actual Flores Lava name from Netflix. They didn't need to do that. They could have created a game that provided the same Flores Lava gameplay and concept without calling it that.
Speaker 3:I think the previous management may have actually felt it jilted by the success that the camera vision tracked projection experience that Valor Motion had developed seemed to find popularity. Over what they were doing, I'm not putting words in their mouth, I'm making an assumption, and I think that's the reason why they were doing. I'm not putting words in their mouth, I'm making an assumption, and I think that's the reason why. They were hoping that if they had the property that they could then maybe pivot into the market. But that was nipped in the bud, obviously by the changes in the management after the restructuring.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Now, to be fair, it's likely that the Batman project was probably already underway when this all happened, and so they're like well, we're already down this far, we might as well release it. We've already got the game under development. So it may not be the new management that's making the decision no, not with this one. But I would sure hope to see them start to do more of their own attractions and cutting out the licensing. We know the licensing can drive initial interest, but if the gameplay isn't there and if the overall experience isn't there, and if your pricing, your price points aren't there, then you might as well like there's no reason to do the IP in the first place.
Speaker 3:The new management structure has got three things that they're going to have to sort out. They're going to have to look at their game experience, their audience and their rollout plans. Their audience needs to come back. They need repeat visitation. If they cannot be a one and done operation, no matter what people say, they are going to have to generate some loyalty, some repeat interest, as our friends at Valor Motion have achieved. They're also going to have to look at how much they're spending on the IP and what the value of that is.
Speaker 3:As you've touched upon, it is very expensive and it's both ends. It is both expensive in licensing the content, but it's also very expensive in it's both ends. It is both expensive in licensing the content, but it's also very expensive in developing the content. You can't just use simple indie developers to develop a batman experience, because our friends at warner brothers will expect a very high level of representational accuracy from the the experience that is being created. And then, finally, placement. We know that they were pivoting heavily towards franchises like our friends at Sandbox VR, but the difference here with the immersive game box experience is that it is really a standalone entertainment experience. It is much more like an attraction, a laser tag or an immersive enclosure system, which I'm a big fan of, and the level of cost that's there. I think they're using the bio camera tracking system, it's that or it's OptiTrack, I can't remember which. But whichever one they're using, they're very expensive. Maybe it's time for them to reinvest in more cost effective technology, the same way that our friends at Zero Latency have gone back on a regular basis to make sure that they're using the most cost effective and effective technology for their experiences. But we will have to wait and see. I think we'll have to wait at least six months to see what the new management is actually bringing to the table.
Speaker 3:Talking about projection-mapped environments and a company that Immersive Gamebox, indirectly is competing with is our friends at Helloio. They have about 50 of their multimedia parks. What these are are projection-mapped environment rooms aimed at a very young audience, and they're now beginning to readdress their operation, reinvest in the technology, looking at the experiences that they're offering, and they're pushing a hello-fidgetal approach. They have defined fidgetal to be more about the attraction space and the enhancing of the entertainment and children's learning. So they do have a very strong edutainment bent to their mix and we know that this company has been in the shadows, rolling out their facilities under-franchised, very successfully, and we can expect that this new approach from their operation is going to try and accelerate that. And I would say that anyone developing immersive enclosure businesses are competing with companies such as these, looking across at the application of new technology into the attraction and entertainment market.
Speaker 3:We talk about digital, we talk about immersive. Gamified or gamification is important. Now all of the major parks are looking at new attractions that have some level of gamification to them. We start off with Disney, who have been toying with gamification or interactive entertainment elements to their attractions for a very long time. You know, back to the 80s. You know, as an ex-Walt Disney Imagineer, I worked on a number of concepts for attractions that would have had a game level to them, because even back in the 90s it was clear to the Imagineering team that it wasn't called gamification but interactive entertainment was going to be our future. And so we see this with the new Buzz Lightyear experience, which is kind of the shooting gallery kind of game experience, not so much streams but with physical prop works but still with a shooting gallery motive to it.
Speaker 3:Then our friends at Europa Park, macrides they just launched their new interactive experience using the seated flat ride, mounted gun system and screens. This particular attraction has had a little bit of a bumpy start, some negative reviews and suffered some technical failure, but nothing that the Mac team can't fix. It's part of the reason you have an early launch process is that you can go back and do some tuning of the experience and as MacRide owns Europa Park it's really easy to go in there and do the fixes, as it were. And then our friends at Alterface have installed an attraction in again with mounted guns shooting at the screen and generating a score. So you know we're seeing a wide swath of deployment now of mid-range what I would call C-ticket attractions, not E-tickets but definitely C-ticket attractions that now are gamified. We can blame a lot of that on Nintendo and the Super Nintendo World attractions there, but also this is a natural progression for the industry. And then we see Triotech, one of the leaders in the shooting screen theater experience, opening up an XD Dark ride in Japan content onto the screen where those previous attractions I would say are C ticket. I'd call these D ticket because they're more theater, more crowd collector theater experiences, but again that level of interactivity allows us to have quite a placement in the park's attraction.
Speaker 3:Anyway, to round off what we're talking about and just to repeat, we've got two sessions coming up in the next couple of weeks. I'm at the London Experience Week event presenting on competitive socializing the future of the sector, courtesy of the World experience organization of WXO. And also in May beginning of May I'll be presenting at amusement 360 on how to future proof your facilities. And for all of those that are interested to fall asleep during one of my presentations, give links so you can get your tickets.
Speaker 2:Say Kevin sent you anyway, brandon, anything I touched upon there that you want to reiterate on no, I would just say that the uh you know the the latest thing that's going on at candy world uh, you know, for example, one of their their rides at candy world is the action league popcorn revenge has a very similar ride vehicle to uh you know, something that triotech has done and um and even doff robotics has put forward, but is the? Uh like sort of dark mini, like somewhat dark ride, but shooting gallery experience. It takes you from one screen to the next, to the next and you're shooting and experiencing different things s Sally Darkwright really has done that as well.
Speaker 3:yes, they champion the concept and it's been iterated upon more screens, less animatronics, less physical. So the Disney experience there, the Buzz Lightyear, is more physical, prop work with targets to shoot at, which can have drawbacks to the fluidity and the repeatability where the other games now the ones that were listed, especially from Alterface and from Triotech are media-based attractions and very heavily dependent on the content created.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I mean, it's very much like the Toy Story Midway Mania that's available at California Adventure in Anaheim and it's very similar. You're moving from one side to the next. That's available at California Adventure in Anaheim and it's very similar. You're moving from one side to the next and, yes, you're popping a little court gun, basically like an old school court gun, and you're shooting at screens and you're moving to another screen, shooting at screens with some physical characters in transition, but your actual gameplay is focused on the screen and we're definitely seeing much more of that pop up at the LBE level, beyond just the theme park level.
Speaker 3:Yes, as soon as the price of the projection and the flat ride equipment can be scaled down both in size, operational needs and pricing. We've now seen this move from being a C ticket to a D ticket to now being considered as a location-based entertainment product. I'm not sure how many LBEs will be parachuting in a flat ride rather than a laser tag maze at this point, or replacing their go-karting for a mid-scale attraction, but it is an option if we can nail down the. You know we need to address the elephant in the room, which is this is media based for many of these, and if you're just buying one film to or one game experience to play on this particular attraction and then in 24 months or in five years time you just rip the whole thing in and drop in another, then you're missing the point. The hope is that you would treat this like a 4d theater.
Speaker 2:You would have a slew of different experiences that could be played on this system yeah, and, as you, as you alluded to, this isn't like we talked about the dingles fun park as a shut on, open and shut the last of the x show, where they just dropped in a bunch of midway games and a bunch of carnival games and to a big space and said, okay, we'll come and play all of these things. And it wasn't. There was no narrative or story that really tied everything together and like, why are these all here the same when you were dropping a flat dark ride into an LBE or FEC venue. It isn't meant to be a replacement to laser tag or bowling or to be an anchor attraction. It's meant to augment every story you're trying to tell inside of your venue and it should augment that experience overall and not try to be some standalone attraction. It's, you know, really the main driver of foot traffic.
Speaker 3:As we were touching upon in the open and shut. The danger is that if you have too many attractions and too many experiences, you can overwhelm the audience and just you know the taste. You know, if you put too many colors on the palette and then apply them to you know, apply them then it's just a brown, gray, blackish mess and there's nothing vibrant that comes out. You've really got to work out the narrative of your audience, not on the first visit, but on the second and the third.
Speaker 3:I am a big fan of media-based attractions. I'm a big fan of interactive media-based attractions. I am still waiting for a media-based attraction that really achieves a strong repeat visitation and has a game experience that surpasses all of the other dark ride, uh shooting gallery kinds of products that we have out there. You know, as I said, sally uh, their men in black experience, uh, as well as um, their oh well, of course, uh, their joker um uh experience they did in australia, which was part of their DC characters. You know award-winning animatronic heavy shooting gallery, but it's still a one-and-done kind of approach and we are now at that stage where our industry cannot accept one-and-done. If you're going to be dropping this into a mid-scale resort entertainment or into a location-based entertainment facility you're here, all right.
Speaker 2:So while we've been on the show, I did confirm this is episode number 68. We did get off in our number along the way, so we have episode 69 coming up next week, but it it is episode 68. Again, also because of my mistake earlier, several episodes earlier, when we did skip episode 66 and went right into 67. So you know, whatever, it's still my fault, but this is episode 68.
Speaker 3:What's your fault? It's Groundhog Day. We get to do this again.
Speaker 2:All right, Perfect, All right. Well, thanks everybody for joining us for another SoundOff with Kevin Williams. We'll see you on the next one.
