.png)
Primal Foundations Podcast
Welcome to the Primal Foundations Podcast! We will dive into what I believe are the 4 essential foundations you need to live a healthy lifestyle.
Strength , Nutrition , Movement , and Recovery.
Get ready to dive into discussions that will guide you on your transformative journey to unlocking your path to optimal health.
Don't miss out on the latest episodes – subscribe now to the Primal Foundations Podcast.
Primal Foundations Podcast
Episode 47: Complete Carnivore with Jenny Mitich
Jenny Mitich, author of Complete Carnivore, joins us to share how the carnivore diet transformed her health and why it’s gaining momentum. From improving metabolic health to enhancing mental clarity, she breaks down the science, debunks common myths, and explains why having a strong why—beyond just weight loss—is key. We also dive into strength training, oxalate dumping, and the freedom of food choices within carnivore. Whether you're curious about making the switch or just want a fresh perspective on nutrition, this episode is packed with insights to help get started on your carnivore journey.
Connect with Jenny:
Instagram:
https://www.instagram.com/mamamitich/
YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/@JennyMitich
Preorder links for book:
Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1628605766
B&N: https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/complete-carnivore-jenny-mitich/1146838850?ean=9781628605761&st=AFF&2sid=Random%20House%20Inc_8373827_NA&sourceId=AFFRandom%20House%20Inc
Target: https://www.target.com/s?searchTerm=9781628605761&clkid=90438253N6c2f11eea9df03dae139e2fb&cpng=PTID1&lnm=81938&afid=Penguin%20Random%20House&ref=tgt_adv_xasd0002
For international viewers: https://blackwells.co.uk/bookshop/product/Complete-Carnivore-by-Jenny-Mitich/9781628605761
Coaching call link: https://calendly.com/mamamitich/30min
Own your Labs link: https://ownyourlabs.com/
Use code JennyMitich for 10% off your order
PRIMAL FOUNDATIONS PODCAST-
Instagram: @Tony_PrimalFoundations
Website: Primalfoundations.com
The Strength Kollective:
Download Kettlebell Programs (Click Here)
Book a free 30 minutes consultation (Click Here)
Today's guest is Jenny Mittage. Jenny is following the carnivore diet for approximately two years and the author of Complete Carnivore. She is active and shares her journey and insights on Instagram at Mama Mittage, and provides a wealth of videos and resources on her YouTube channel, jenny Mittage. Jenny, welcome to the Primal Foundations podcast.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much. Happy to be here.
Speaker 1:It's great to see you again. The last time we spoke was at the Healing for Humanity event with Carrie Mann, and we had Dr Kiltz, amongst many other people and guests. Tony Hampton, how did you feel about that whole meetup and getting to see some of the clips of the hopefully upcoming documentary?
Speaker 2:Oh man, I loved it. I love meetups in general. The first time you and I met was at one of Karen Miles's meetups in Chicago. That was awesome. She's always putting stuff together, so it's a really. It's just nice to be able to go and see people in your area that are also, you know, following carnivore, and I love seeing the clips from Healing Humanity.
Speaker 1:That's going gonna be a game changer when it's released. I think, yeah, I think we get really caught up in, you know, documentaries, especially the very, very well done ones, right, you know, they have the, the charts, the graphs, the stories, the people and the editing and depending on what you watch, you could go one way or the other. I, I went down the road of being two, uh, two years vegan, uh, a long time ago, because of uh. I saw forks over knives and I was like, oh, like this is this seems right to me okay, and uh just took my health for a turn and then, um, you know, there's really nothing, like you said, there's nothing really for carnivore. There's some ketogenic things out there, but i'm'm excited for this. I think this one is if this gets into the movie theaters, I'm like buying it out and I'm inviting everybody.
Speaker 2:Agreed. You know, the cool thing with Carrie is he is just so passionate about carnivore because of the just like extreme positive changes that he's seen in his mental and physical health, so he puts that passion into the documentary as well. And then his I guess cinematographer the guy that's filming it, adam, he was in still photography. He did a lot of photography and then learned how to shoot video and has done. I couldn't tell he that it's shot beautifully.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:So I his story was really riveting too, so it was really nice to to be able to see some clips and to hear all of the testimonials from Carrie's family and from, you know, Dr kilts, dr Wiedemann, dr Tony Hampton, it was. It was awesome.
Speaker 1:It was great event. I can't wait to see that whole bunch of people again. And we were talking kind of off camera, a little bit like how carnivores gain popularity over the years. There's more and more people that come into it, especially in this past year. People have just asked me about it. How do you explain carnivore diet to somebody who's unfamiliar to it? And you know, how does that compare to more of like a widely known keto diet?
Speaker 2:It's a really good question. I've also noticed an uptick in awareness on carnivore. I was at REI getting like a sweatshirt or something and the cash register lady was like, oh yeah, carnivore, I know what that is, my cousin's doing it, you know. So a lot more people are doing it. I really think we're coming to a point where it's going to be like blowing up probably this year, like in popularity.
Speaker 2:So when people ask me about it, it's really simple, honestly. It's just all I eat is meat and animal products, and they'll be like, no, no meat. I'm like, no, all meat, only meat. No, no vegetables, no fruits. I'm like, no, no, no, that's all I eat. And then I just talk about how it's kind of like just the lowest carb ketogenic diet that you can do, and a lot of people use it as an elimination diet. So if you're suffering from some really hardcore metabolic issues, it could be a game changer for you. But also if you just want to come to it to lose some weight, it's really helpful for that too. So that's kind of where I start.
Speaker 2:And then, of course, you know I have my YouTube channel, so I've been working on building a playlist of beginner carnivore videos for the past year.
Speaker 2:I think I've got about 40 now and I have a few like complete in-depth guide videos that help people to get started, like prepping your kitchen, figuring out your whys, why you're doing it in the first place, and then getting everything prepared and then going into your first month on carnivore, because the first month on carnivore is the most difficult. That's when people can run into keto flu symptoms, especially if they're coming from eating a lot of carbs 200, 300, 400 grams a day plus, you know, talking about electrolytes and ways that you can avoid or mitigate the worst of those symptoms. And then, once you're through that first month, typically it's smooth sailing. So I just try to condense that as much as possible and I only I only share all that stuff if they ask. I'm not just, like you know, evangelizing about carnivore. Oh, my God, you need to do this Cause I don't want to turn people off, but uh, but if they ask I'll, I'll definitely give them, give them the info they need.
Speaker 1:Yeah, there's. There's a lot of people going to carnivore. Again, you mentioned some of the reasons weight loss, uh, healing, uh a prolonged health issue, and people connect with stories, just like kind of healing with humanity. That's like the premise is we're just telling the stories and the listeners I know are going to be very excited to hear yours. You know what inspired you to adopt a carnivore diet and how has that transformed your health and lifestyle?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I have twins. They're now three. You may hear them screaming in the background occasionally because they're trying to go down for a nap. But I gained 70 pounds when I was pregnant with them and when I got pregnant I was already a bit overweight. So I was not happy. And after they were born I, you know, did the standard. You know low fat, lots of fruits and vegetables. I was following Noom it's this app. That's like 1200 calories, low fat, lots of carbs. You know red meats bad. And I lost I don't know 21 pounds over a year. But that was really really slow. I had a lot of weight still to lose. I was like 195 pounds.
Speaker 2:So my husband he was the one that got me started on carnivore. Actually, he had found Dr Ken Berry on YouTube and had started watching his videos that summer, before we started, and he was like, hey, I really want to try this. My husband had lost 130 pounds using keto and he wanted to kind of take it to the next level and I was just like you're insane, how can you get all of the vitamins and minerals you need just eating meat? You know the standard the standard concerns but I did watch the videos with him. I ended up watching the videos with him and did a little bit of my own exploring over the next six months.
Speaker 2:I got a continuous glucose monitor in September of that year and had seen that my glucose was not maybe moving towards pre-diabetic because I was eating so much fruit really no ultra processed foods, but just a lot of fruit and I'm like man, that's crazy. So then it got to the point where I had only lost 21 pounds. I was super frustrated and I was like you know what? I'm going to give carnivore a shot. So I'm going to do it for 30 days. I'm going to see how, like what's going to happen to my glucose levels on a carnivore diet. That'll be the experiment and that's it 30 days, just give it a shot.
Speaker 2:So I actually started the carnivore diet before my husband, which is so funny because he was the one that wanted to do it first. So I started it on December 27th 2022, and I lost eight pounds my first month. I dropped my glucose from like 100 down to 80 as my average and I didn't feel very good. I had horrible keto flu, which I now know was also a mix of oxalate dumping because I'd been eating so many high oxalate fruits and vegetables that I thought were healthy. So I committed to another 30 days. Only lost two pounds my second month, because I started including dairy again, cut the dairy, did it another 30 days and by the end of that 90 day period I'd lost 15 and a half pounds and my glucose had stabilized in the low 80s. So I was just hooked and I've been on it ever since now over two years.
Speaker 1:And a lot of people do come to this diet as a weight loss. I'm going to do carnivore to weight loss, but how did you? How did you feel?
Speaker 2:Oh, I mean, I felt so much better. So I've had mental health issues since I was like 13, depression, anxiety and things like that, and as I'd gotten older it'd gotten a little bit better. You know, I was able to deal with it better than I was when I was younger, but it almost completely went away. That's probably the most amazing thing that I wasn't really expecting. I lost 50 pounds Energy wise, night and day. Night and day With these guys. They are balls of energy. And I turned 41 in a couple of weeks, so I'm not a young mom of energy and I'm. I turned 41 in a couple of weeks, so I'm not a young mom.
Speaker 2:Um, I, I, I need, I need help, and doing carnivore has been, has been amazing for me. Energy wise yeah, that was really helpful. Um, I've noticed a lot of improvements in oral health. I used to have bleeding gums and I'd have to use a breath mint often. I felt like I did and I no longer need to. My gums no longer bleed. Just a lot of really unexpected benefits that I that I didn't know were going to happen, but that did.
Speaker 1:I hear that a lot too of you know I used to get cavities a lot. Every time I would go to the doctor I'd have a cavity or something going on. And you know for myself I'm I'm getting. I mean, I have an electric toothbrush now. I don't know if that changes the game, but I, like I, every time I go into the dentist they're like, oh, it's all good, it's actually better than it was X amount of years ago. I was like, oh, awesome, so I do think there is something to it. And plus other benefits yes, you want to lose weight, we're a little little vain, we want to look good. I mean, that's totally fine, but just the, the energy, the mental clarity and the simplicity of carnivore is is very attractive to people as well. And plus, you know you you mentioned that, like I saw on your YouTube banner, you have a like a picture from two years ago to now, like, what a what a difference. Just just in your it's only a face picture, but just in your face.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I had gone back that. Uh, the one from two years ago was from my 30 day update video and I was probably 186 pounds there, but just the inflammation in my face compared to that. The second shot was December of 2024 and I was like 150 pounds and just the clarity and everything that was crazy. I had to make a post cause I was like, oh my God, look at this and there's no. I've had a few people on on that picture be like, oh, you got plastic surgery or fillers. I'm like, no, no, I, I'm healthier.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I put no filters on it either, because I hate it when people do that. I don't want you to see filtered. I want you to see what it was on the video. That's it, and it's a stark difference, for sure.
Speaker 1:You mentioned some things that are happening when people get on to carnivore. For those interested in to a carnivore, you know, for those interested in transitioning to a carnivore diet, what essential steps or resources would you recommend to ensure that successful start?
Speaker 2:Sure, I do think there's a little bit of prep work that needs to go into it. I did not do these prep work items and I suffered for it. So I think it's really important to first figure out why you're doing it in the first place. So for me, my whys are my family, my boys. I want to age gracefully. I'd really like to do like crazy physical things in my eighties and nineties, you know, like climb a mountain or like you know just weird, crazy stuff. And then I I also, you know want to want to look good. You know I came to this for weight loss, but I don't think that can be your only why. If you're coming to carnivore just to lose weight, that's not going to be enough of a motivator. So try to figure out why are you doing this in the first place and then write that why down on a post-it or put it on your phone, like on your banner or something whatever, so that you can see it every single day, because you need to keep it fresh in your mind. Once you figure out your whys, then you need to start prepping your kitchen, because if you have a bunch of non-carnivore foods laying around, I can tell you it will be difficult, not impossible. There's some people that can do it, but I think it's better to just try to get rid of all that non-carnivore food. So pastas, breads, desserts, cereals, anything that, fruit, vegetables, things like that. You don't have to throw it away. You could put it in a box, put it out in your garage, you could donate it, you could give it away whatever. And this only works if either you're living alone or if you're living with somebody that is also doing it along with you. There are people you know that have people in their household that are not also going to be doing it, so that can be difficult. But if that's the case, where you can't get rid of everything, I would say at least try to get rid of the things that are a weakness for you. So like for me, that would be cinnamon, toast crunch and Oreos. I would not be able to have those in the house and do carnivore, so I'd get those out.
Speaker 2:Then, after you do that, you kind of have to restock your shelves. Right, you got to have some food. You don't know how many people I've talked to that start carnivore and then they're like oh, I have no food, so I have a free grocery list for anybody that wants it. They can follow me over on Instagram or send me an email and I'll get it to them. Of all the different foods that you can get. You know, get a week's worth of food. Get some ground beef, some eggs, some butter. You know pork chops are good, chicken whatever meat you enjoy, buy some.
Speaker 2:And then I do think it's a good idea to do a little bit of meal prep. You know hard, boil a dozen eggs and have them in your fridge, make a pot roast or something. Just have something on hand, because your hunger cues are going to be a bit wacky the first month as you're learning your true hunger cues and you're going to want to have some food on hand that you can eat right away. After that, I think you'd be pretty much ready to go. I do think you need to have some electrolytes on hand. Whatever brand you know works for you, just make sure that they don't have a bunch of sugar and things like that. You really just want the minerals. So sodium, potassium, magnesium at minimum I use Element. They're raw and flavored are great. There's a bunch of other brands out there that you can do. Figure out which one works best for you and have some on hand. Don't wait. Do that before you start Because, like for me, man day two was terrible, terrible, and if I would have, I didn't have electrolytes on hand.
Speaker 2:I just had to do salt and then I ordered the electrolytes. So make sure you have them beforehand. Then really, it's just kind of like picking when to start. I would not start carnivore if you're going to go cold turkey into it. Um, I wouldn't start it like before a big event. Or if you have like a work trip planned, you know, or anything like that.
Speaker 2:Um, I would pick, you know, a month where you have some light schedules going on, you know, cause you don't know what's going to happen. Some people don't have any keto flu and some people it's bad, so you kind of have to plan around that. And then there's, you know, if you don't want to go cold turkey into carnivore, you could also just gradually reduce your carbs, I think, starting by eating meat, fruit and vegetables, cutting all of the processed refined carbs out of your diet and doing that for a few weeks to let your body kind of get used to that, and then drop the fruit slowly and then drop the vegetables. That can be a way for people to ease on to carnivore where it's not as much of a shock to your system. So you kind of have to figure out which way works best for you and then and then get started.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's, it's also, you know it's a personality thing. You know there's some people that are like I'm, I need to go all in two feet, I need to jump into the pool. You know I've got a cannonball in there and get wet real quick. Or you know I'm going to ease my way into it. And then for some people, honestly, easing their way into it is, I would say, the better situation for most, because if you are transitioning from just standard american diet, processed food, you might have to do that and like, like you you even said it just getting unprocessed, you know, just real whole foods in your diet, plus have increasing animal proteins and fat, you're gonna feel better, like just that's step one, right, and then slowly decreasing. And you mentioned some things about oxalate dumpings. What are some signs and symptoms that you might be experiencing oxalate dumping?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I had no idea what oxalates were until like a year after I started carnivore. The best book to read on that is Toxic Superfoods by Dr Sally Norton. Doctor, is she a doctor? By Sally Norton, wonderful book. That's where I learned about it.
Speaker 2:Oxalates are plant toxins, so plants don't want to be eaten. They have defense mechanisms plant chemicals, phytochemicals, things like that and an oxalate is basically just kind of like a crystalline structure that is in some fruits and vegetables. Sometimes it can be like in the younger version of the fruiter vegetable as opposed to the older. In her book she has a whole list of everything you can avoid, but the highest oxalate items would be spinach, kiwi, raspberries, dark chocolate, sweet potatoes it's a big one. Tea black and green tea.
Speaker 2:So a good way that you can know if you're oxalate dumping is if you start carnivore, you go cold turkey and you after like two or three weeks you're still experiencing what you would think are keto flu symptoms, so extreme fatigue, diarrhea, just feeling out of it.
Speaker 2:I would say then perhaps you're oxalate dumping and you can check that by brewing yourself a cup of black or green tea and drinking it and then within 30 minutes, if you start feeling better than you're oxalate dumping, and if that's the case, then I would think it might be a good idea to add back in some fruits and vegetables to slow the oxalate dumping process. The thing about oxalate dumping is there's not a ton of information about it out there. Sally did a really great job in researching it, but she had to bring together like so many different outside sources and all of this stuff together to try to get a cohesive idea of like what you should do. So that's why I think the gradual reduction of carbs is a good idea for somebody. That's like making like spinach smoothies and eating a sweet potato every day, and like I was eating dark chocolate every night, I had kiwis every day, sweet potato every day, raspberries every day. I had so many high oxalate foods. That's why I suffered.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, I think that that's something to pay attention to and something that a lot of people don't really know about you know, yeah, I've had bill schindler on the podcast and he talks uh, he has the book, uh, eat like a human. He has the modern stone age kitchen and one big thing is he, he took like this group of students, uh, on some type of like, just like a foraging event or something, and some people were talking about a mushroom and they're like he just like a foraging event or something. And some people were talking about a mushroom and they're like he's like. You know what's really scary? Yeah, he's like spinach. She's like. He's like do you just said that mushroom was poisonous, that I shouldn't eat that? He goes, yeah, but somebody eats that once. Then they die. You're nobody's going to eat that mushroom again, but he goes.
Speaker 1:Spinach, he goes. You'll constantly eat that. You won't see the symptoms right away, but over time it can cause havoc on your body and you get those high, high oxalates from the spinach, from the kale. As a former vegan, I look back. I'm like I'm blending kale, spinach, banana like smoothies in the morning and I'm just making it even worse because it's liquid form at this point and I'm just gunning it down and that's why I ran into a bunch of health issues and, like you said nobody really talks about this, nobody knows it. When you say, hey, like I don't eat spinach because I think it's unhealthy People look at you like you got three heads, you know so totally.
Speaker 2:you know it's so funny. Um, I think it was Chris Hemsworth was doing spinach smoothies, like every morning and he had to stop because he was poisoning himself and and he's a big dude, he's like six three, six, four or something like that, but like a smaller person, like a five foot tall woman, you can actually die from from eating too many oxalates.
Speaker 2:If she was eating the same spinach smoothies as Chris Hemsworth three days in a row she could die from oxalate toxicity. And it's just so funny because spinach is like touted as a superfood. You know, oh, it's so good for you. It's like, oh, my God, I won't touch spinach with a 10 foot pole. Now you know, and actually it's funny, kale is actually not very high oxalate. I thought it was Um, but then, reading Sally's book, she's like no, actually kale is okay, it's the spinach. So I was like I always thought it was the kale. Crazy craziness man. But when you're doing carnivore you don't eat any plants, so you're like I get that all out of my diet.
Speaker 1:Every time my coworkers look at me they're like dude, do you have a vegetable? I go, I try to avoid vegetables if I can, and uh, for me at least. Like it's a garnish, if anything like I like. Like you know, nobody's taking my carnivore card away, but I like jalapenos sometimes.
Speaker 2:Like, I like.
Speaker 1:I like spicy, I like spicy. So a garnish is one thing, but as a main food group, I just tell my my coworkers like I try to avoid vegetables if I can, for sure I do a keto cheat meal once a month, so we'll do like Brussels sprouts smothered in cheese and bacon, or asparagus.
Speaker 2:I try to keep to the low oxalate vegetables. I love a salad. I would eat a salad every day, I love salads, but I just don't feel my best when I do that. So I do it once a month and that seems to work well for me.
Speaker 1:But for some people they wouldn't be able. I do that, so I do it once a month and that seems to work well for me, but for some people they wouldn't be able to do that. So that's that's something too, that some people might not know that if you are going to have a food that's either low, mid oxalates or whatever, if you cook it with a cream sauce or actually have a dairy with it, the oxalates will bind to that and you're able to pass through your body more effectively and not get stored up as much. So if you are going to have like a spinach or anything, more than likely, if you have it with a cream sauce, it'll lower not necessarily the oxalates, but how many oxalates stay into your system.
Speaker 2:Interesting. I did not know that. That's a really great tip.
Speaker 1:While we're on the topic of food, you know meal planning and prepping, senior. What do I eat in a week? Videos, which are awesome. You have a fantastic I told you off air a fantastic YouTube channel. You showcase daily meals. How do you keep a variety in your diet and any tips for those struggling with meal ideas?
Speaker 2:So I'm really boring. I eat beef butter, bacon and eggs 90% of the time. I eat beef butter, bacon and eggs 90% of the time. For meal prep I always have a dozen eggs hard-boiled in the fridge. I just today was filming some videos for YouTube. I did a pork tenderloin that I put ground beef and cream cheese. I made kind of like a base of that, put that in there with some more cheese and then rolled it up and baked it. That was enough for dinner, and now we've got some leftover. Chicken is so easy to meal prep.
Speaker 2:Wings I love doing wings, probably once a month, but like bone-in, skin-on thighs or drummies are so easy to just cook a whole bunch of them and then have them in the fridge to eat. I tend to not need a lot of variety, but my husband does. He likes a little bit more variety, so we've been coming up with recipes the past couple of years that we've been doing YouTube and a lot of my viewers need variety too. So I have a beef stroganoff. That's really good. I like to do taco dishes of some kind a carnivore taco or a taco ball.
Speaker 2:There's lots of really great ways you can add some variety into your diet, but for me, I eat like eggs and bacon or eggs and sausage every morning and then for dinner. I only eat twice a day. I'll do like a pound of ground beef with some butter on it or something, or I'll do like a 16 to 24 ounce ribeye, or I'll do like two pounds of chicken wings and that's enough for me. I'm very boring, but it works. It works. You know, that's one of the beautiful things about carnivores I don't have to think too much about food and I'm only eating when I'm truly hungry. So I could eat the same thing days in a row, but because I'm actually hungry, every single time I eat it I'm like, oh, this is so good.
Speaker 1:You know, yeah, right, I look back at. I was like I used to tell myself this I'm basically doing hide and go seek with the food, like I would go into the kitchen. You know this is back in just regular, standard American diet. Even when I was vegan, I would just like constantly be opening cabinets and looking for stuff Like I'm not even hungry. What am I doing? Like I don't think I'm hungry, but I am. I'm like looking. I'm in the fridge, I'm in the cabinets, I'm in the pantry. All day I'm going in and out of the kitchen. Now I'm like I ate.
Speaker 1:Earlier today I had two pounds of ground beef. I'm I'm sad I for the day, I don't need to eat. I can go about my life. I won't even eat till tomorrow and, uh, again, I am boring, like you a little bit. That's fine. You know it's ground beef, it's eggs, it's butter. You know, uh, it's cold. I mean we're, we're pretty local to each other. It's cold right now, but in the in the summer, I love grilling, I like to go outside and that's when I do my steaks. I really get into steaks. Maybe people don't like this next comment. I don't like cooking with an air fryer.
Speaker 2:Oh no, I love cooking with the air fryer. I do my steaks in the air fryer in the winter. I am not about to go outside.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly yeah. Everybody talks about the air fryer. They love it. I bought one. Did I do it wrong? Maybe I have no idea?
Speaker 2:but I tried to practice.
Speaker 1:I tried the air fryer. It takes some practice. I tried the air fryer, I did a couple steaks in there. I did the wing flats in there. It was okay, it was all right, but I was like I actually just like I ended up like returning it.
Speaker 2:I was like this what air fryer did you get?
Speaker 1:It was like a Ninja or something.
Speaker 2:Yeah, cause you know some of the. The one that I have is the tasty and it goes up to 450 degrees Fahrenheit and most air fryers only go up to like 400 or 420. And that's where I get the crispiness from. So, like on my chicken wings, I cook them at 420 for 18 to 20 minutes and they are crispy as heck. So it might just be, you know, practicing a little more, finding the one that has higher, higher temp.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I might have to. I might have to go the route, you know, cause, again, I really don't even have stakes during the winter, cause I'm like I'm not going all the way upstairs, cause we have like a little rooftop, like I'm like I'm not going up there off the lake front just freezing.
Speaker 2:We're both in the Chicagoland area it's bitter cold right now. February is the worst.
Speaker 1:And with your meals. I think you just did a post the other day. You know I love this phrase, I use it all the time Like don't let perfection be the enemy of good, do you feel? You know that a lot of people think it has to be? If you're doing carnivore, everything must be like the highest of quality. It's got to be grass fed, grass finished. It must be, pasture raised. It must be this, must be that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a great question. I just did a post about this yesterday. So I went to Jewel that's our local grocery store and I found this Oscar Meyer bacon was on sale. It was usually 10.99 a pound, it was 99 cents a pound, I don't know why. There were only three left. I scooped them all up, created a post about look at all this cheap meat that I got. And I had a few commenters be like oh my God, that's so full of garbage I would never buy that bacon. I read the ingredients label and there's nothing bad on the back of that label. The only thing that's in it is just stuff that would be used to cure bacon. If you're eating cured bacon, that's what's going to be in it Zero carbs.
Speaker 2:I think a lot of people get bogged down by the dogmatic thoughts of it has to be grass-fed, grass-finished everything, no toxins, blah, and it's like no, I eat conventionally raised meat 90% of the time. 90% of the time I get my meat from Juul or Costco. I'll get a whole ribeye, I'll cut that up myself, but it's conventionally raised, choice meat. Um, I do some grass fed, grass finished. Um, I'll do some American Wagyu. I have a have a ranch in Missouri that I'll get my ground beef from cause it's so good, but, like in general, no, and you can see profound health improvements eating conventionally raised meat, including processed meats. Everyone thinks, oh, processed meats are so bad? No, no, they're not that bad. Of course there's going to be some that are like there's this brand of bacon that's like cinnamon toast crunch sprinkled bacon.
Speaker 1:I took a picture of it the other day. I was going to post it.
Speaker 2:Yes, don't buy that, okay. But like Oscar Mayer, bacon, normal bacon, that's fine. We use Bob Evans sausage in the roll and there's zero carbs, no corn syrup. It's very hard to find breakfast sausage that doesn't have corn syrup in it, but it does have MSG in it and some people are very sensitive to MSG. We are not. We eat that stuff five days a week and our metabolic health has improved across the board.
Speaker 2:And I do blood tests, arterial scans, dexa scans, continuous glucose monitoring, continuous ketone monitoring, like every test you can possibly get. I get it done and I share it on my YouTube channel so you can see that eating that sausage isn't killing me. You know what I mean. So I think it's all about getting what you can afford, getting what you prefer to eat, because if you don't like the taste, you're not going to eat. It, prefer to eat because if you don't like the taste, you're not going to eat it. And if you can afford grass-fed, grass-finished, everything and that is what you prefer to eat, that's okay too.
Speaker 2:There are marginal health benefits to eating the grass-fed, grass-finished, for sure. Less omega-6s, for sure, in the ruminants. But it's marginal. It's marginal. And if you're coming from a standard American diet, just cutting out all the crap and eating conventionally raised meat is going to do just night and day difference. So I think that is something that as a community, we need to communicate a little bit more, because I still get comments all the time like oh, you're not doing it pure enough and I'm like I'm fine.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it just gets like dogmatic within carnivore it's. You know, it's lion diet or nothing. I don't like that, oh God On.
Speaker 2:TikTok. I've gotten comments where, like you can't use garlic powder or you're using pepperoni, that's not carnivore, People get violently angry about it. I'm like Jesus, you guys.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I'm down. If you don't want to use it, that's fine and I'll give like a nuanced response. And it's like they don't even watch it because they don't.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're not. You do more than I would. I wouldn't even be. Like sometimes I like do a steak emoji, like anytime, like somebody says something about somebody just did kids watch this. I can't believe you, whatever. And I like this has to stop.
Speaker 2:And I'm not really because I know the person that I'm responding to most likely isn't going to be changeable, but the people reading the comments might be like oh okay, you know what I mean. I personally don't read comments, like I don't go on people's feeds and read all that stuff, but my mom does. I know a ton of people that do so feeds and read all that stuff, but my mom does.
Speaker 2:I know a ton of people that do, so I'm just like Do you hear what they said about you, jenny? Yeah, I'm just, I don't really care. I try not to read that stuff for my mental health. But I always try to be kind and I don't want to turn people off, so that's kind of why I respond that way, always trying to educate. That's my place.
Speaker 1:I think yeah. And being the self, you mentioned some things, topics but being the self-proclaimed data junkie, you know N equals one, experiments, blood work. You know what are some significant trends you have observed with carnivore, like either yourself or around you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I do tons of NO1 experiments. I'm trying to gear up for a next one coming up soon of NO1 experiments. I'm trying to gear up for a next one coming up soon. Interesting stuff. So I follow Dave Feldman's work pretty closely with the lean mass hyper responders so that's been really interesting to see.
Speaker 2:A lot of people think that if you go carnivore that your LDL cholesterol is just automatically going to shoot up really high, and that's actually not true. Ldl numbers tend to track with your BMI. So people that are overweight or normal weight tend to see their LDL cholesterol stay the same or even go down on carnivore in the beginning. But as you continue to lose weight, become more physically active and all that kind of stuff, you can see where your LDL will go up super, super high. But that's just a small group of people that are lean mass hyper-responders.
Speaker 2:I've actually seen in my data my LDL cholesterol is typically between 175 to I don't know 275, but my triglycerides are like between 30 and 60. My HDL is between 70 and 100, and that would be the lean mass hyper-responder triad. But also in the N of 1 experiments I've been able to manipulate my cholesterol numbers drastically just with the food that I eat. So I did an experiment where I ate really, really, really high fat, carnivore and very high calorie for three days before a standard lipid panel and I was able to drop my LDL cholesterol by 23%. And if you're going to yeah, exactly If you're- going to.
Speaker 1:If a pill could have done that, you know people would be buying that off the shelves.
Speaker 2:Well, yeah, and that's the thing is. We're all told like, oh, saturated fat is going to raise your LDL cholesterol, and simply not true. It does the opposite. Very, very interesting stuff. I measure my blood once or twice a month with all these different experiments. I just did a 14-day carnivore bar experiment, where I just ate carnivore bars for 14 days. I just did a 14-day sardine fast experiment Same thing just ate sardines. So yeah, lots of fun data there.
Speaker 2:I just want to show people like, hey, there's ways that you can manipulate your lipids, your glucose, and I think being really cued into your numbers is important. I don't think anybody needs to test as much as I do. I'm a crazy person. I'm doing this for fun and for science and for YouTube. You know, if I wasn't doing this for YouTube, I I'd probably get my blood work checked every six months now, knowing what I know now, just because everything's so fluid, people think they get a lipid panel and their triglycerides are just, you know, whatever they are for the whole rest of the year. And no, they're constantly moving and you need to see what your range is.
Speaker 2:You know if my, if my triglycerides go from 37 to 70, I'm not like, oh my God, my triglycerides went up. That's within the range that I see in my blood work. You know, I would be concerned if my triglycerides went up to like 150, then I'd be like, oh okay, something that's a little different you know, yeah, you know it's.
Speaker 1:It's also this, this goalpost, right, like the goalposts will continuously move, you know what, as like on the doctor's charts, right, and wherever that they put that goalpost. If you don't hit the goalpost, then it's like, oh, you're doing something wrong, like we have to give you a stat. And you know, they even tried to give me a stat and I was in the midst of, yeah, uh, I was in the midst of Ironman training probably arguably the best shape I've ever been in my life and they're like hey, your cholesterol is a little high, we should get you on a stat. And I'm like, no, I'm like let's, let's, let's break apart. Like I feel great, I'm performing well, right, I have function in my, my body, everything's working the right way. What do I care if that you know, my number hits your goalpost or not?
Speaker 2:So right, Well, and, and the and the goalpost at a conventional doctor for LDL cholesterol has been continuously lowered so that they can get more and more people on statins.
Speaker 2:That's not actually accurate and LDL cholesterol is a terrible, terrible biomarker to base health-related decisions on. I would be more concerned about what's your fasting insulin fasting, glucose A1C, triglycerides and HDL. That's what I'd want to know. I don't even care what your LDL cholesterol is and, granted, I'm not a doctor, this is just from what I've learned from low-carb carnivore doctors in the space. But I can take a look at those five markers right there and tell you the state of your metabolic health quickly, and that's like I don't know. Maybe 35 to $40 worth of blood tests. It's not that much, I don't know. I feel like the world is kind of waking up to the fact that LDL cholesterol is not a great biomarker and that it really is just used to put people on drugs.
Speaker 1:And the question is usually like, just the things that you just said rattle off your head right, those like five markers or whatever they may be. The person that did mine like I could tell she was reading off a list and goes, okay, all right, do you want a flu shot today? And I'm like, no, okay, all right, see that. Didn't ask me about my diet, Didn't ask me about my activity level, my sleep, my stress, hydrate nothing didn't ask me about my activity level, my sleep, my stress, hydrate nothing.
Speaker 2:They're not trained to know anything about that. So it's not necessarily the fault of the conventional doctor or the nurse or things. They're not trained anything about nutrition and what they are trained is not good. I think that it's like 60% of your daily calories coming from carbohydrates. That's insane. That's insane Even if they're fruits and vegetables. So yeah, I I don't go to the doctor for um prevention or nutrition advice or anything like that. I go to the doctor if I'm really sick and I need some antibiotics, or if I break a leg or if I need a C-section. You know what I mean. I think that's probably the best, the decision I've made for myself.
Speaker 1:What the hospital is designed for basically.
Speaker 2:Correct. Yeah, yeah, and you know, I do think we need a complete shift in our medical schools, in our healthcare system, but right now, the entire healthcare system is literally built on prescribing medications, treating symptoms, not addressing root causes, and nutrition is a very low-hanging fruit that will take care of about 80% of whatever the heck is wrong with you.
Speaker 2:If you eat the right foods, it really does kind of strip away all of that extra stuff and then you can really start to see what the root causes are. It's not going to solve everything. Carnivore is not a magic bullet, but it will really help you get to where you need to be. Like I still have Hashimoto's hypothyroid even though I'm carnivore. But being carnivore it's much, much, much. You know better than it would be if I was eating a standard American diet you know, Um, so yeah, there's some profound shifts that need to happen in our healthcare system.
Speaker 2:I don't know if and when that would ever happen, because it would have to be completely redesigned.
Speaker 1:I mean isn't that you know Kennedy is, is taking the taking. You know he can't do everything, Can't do everything, everything, but he's a front runner.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm hopeful. You know, I'm glad that he got confirmed. Uh interested to see what he can get done. But he's only one person and there's a lot of bureaucracy, and he can't solve every ill. This is something that we have to work on as a society too, you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it takes everybody and I think, just looking at you know 70% of Americans are either pre or type 2 diabetic. That's when, 100 years ago, you had to like travel to find somebody. That was that you know. They used to be the childhood disease.
Speaker 2:Like dialysis clinics. There used to be one in every state. Now there's three in every city, right Like you know what?
Speaker 2:one in every state and now there's three in every city, right Like. You know what's changed? Well, our food, absolutely Mostly. You know environmental stuff, pollutants, microplastics, bromide in everything you know. Yeah, it's really interesting and it's just so funny because type 2 diabetes, you can completely go into remission from it. It is a curable. It is not a life sentence. Yet so many people don't know that, they just think it's it's just. You know what they have to have for the rest of their lives and with the advice from the American Diabetes Association, they will have it for the rest of their lives. You know eating oatmeal for breakfast. Get out of here.
Speaker 1:Oatmeal and orange juice. Isn't that the recommendation? Oatmeal and orange juice in the morning.
Speaker 2:Or like have, like apple strudel for your dessert with your you know high carb dinner. Like no desserts for you if you're type 2 diabetic.
Speaker 1:Well, if you need to manage your you know blood glucose. Oh, you have a pump. Well, if we're going to be using the pump and needing insulin more and more and more, it makes sense. If they're going to the more high carbohydrate foods that they recommend, the more you're using the pumps.
Speaker 2:Well, and the American Diabetes Association is heavily funded by insulin manufacturers, so of course they're going to tell you to eat foods that make you need more insulin, but that's not doing a service to humanity. That's just killing people slowly and horribly. You know it's, it's terrible.
Speaker 1:Yeah, there's this. Uh, another flip side of the coin of people pre-diabetic or type two diabetic, is it? You don't necessarily even have to be overweight.
Speaker 2:Like people.
Speaker 1:People make the assumption like, oh, they're just lazy and they don't exercise and they eat bad. Well, there's athletes out there and if I get the documentary Running on Fat 2, man, I love this documentary, I watched it twice but I can't remember the person's name, so shame on me. But Running on Fat 2 is the documentary on me. But, um, running on fat, too, is the documentary and they follow um two like ketogenic athletes, fat adapted athletes that were, you know, ironman racers and endurance racers from beforehand, but they would follow the conventional high carb carbo load and these people were arguably like the most in shape people you've ever met in your life. And they one guy goes to the doctor, the husband, and they're like, yeah, you're pre diabetic. He's like what it's like? I'm a top tier athlete. How am I? He's like well, you've been just slamming glucose and gels and carbohydrates for all these years. Like your pancreas can only handle so much. So it's not like you have to be overweight, it's the food in the quantities that we're having it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I mean the human body, regardless of your muscle size or weight or anything like that. We can only handle about a teaspoon of sugar in our bloodstream at any time. Now, if you have a lot of muscle, that is a good glucose sink. It's better to have more muscle because your body can then put the glucose in those muscles. But if you are constantly, like a lot of athletes do, like you said, carb loading, you're overwhelming your system.
Speaker 2:So you can be skinny fat. That is a thing. Skinny on the outside, fat on the inside, with tons of visceral fat which you wouldn't know unless you get a DEXA scan. Yeah, it's profound. It's profound. You can look great on the outside and be so sick and on the flip, you could be really obese but metabolically healthy on the inside, perhaps because you might have something where you haven't met your personal fat threshold, maybe your fat cells fill up really easily, or things like that. That is a thing too. So we can't judge a book by its cover. I think that's why it's so important to take a look on the inside with blood work, dexa scans and all that kind of stuff periodically, you know, just to make sure everything's you know working the way it should under the hood.
Speaker 1:Okay, and speaking of athletes, strength training yes, 5ff gets you on the podcast. We definitely could, if I get you on the podcast. We definitely talk about this. I saw some clips of you do some strength training. You know what's, what's the regimen.
Speaker 2:You know we're talking push pull, legs. So I do three to four days a week of strength training. I lift heavy. I'm typically doing legs and arms. Sometimes I'll do push pull, but typically just legs one day, arms one day. I don't have a ton of time, unfortunately, so I just try to get in and be as efficient as possible. I like to do three sets of anywhere between I don't know eight to 14 reps, and I really like those last few. I want to like lift to failure. That's what I like to do.
Speaker 2:Um, I walk a lot. I like to walk three, three or so miles per day. I like the Stairmaster machine. I do this glute routine thing. It's not just walking on it and then I like to do sprints too. That's really fun. But yeah, that's pretty much what I do. If I had it my way, I'd be at the gym like five days a week, and then when I'm there I also do the steam room and or the sauna. I like to do that for at least 15 to 20 minutes to really kind of get some toxins out, and then my gym has a cold plunge.
Speaker 2:So I like to get in the cold plunge too.
Speaker 1:Nice, yeah, I had a at um human healing for humanity. Lisa Wiedemann was sitting next to me and we were just talking about strength training. She's also in the camp of going to failure and I was like, uh, yeah, I don't think that that going to failure is the best you know. Um, and she like turns to me and she like flips over to a picture of her in a bathing suit. She goes this is what going to failure looks like. She's just she's jacked and I was like oh yeah, oh hell yeah, it's amazing.
Speaker 2:I love Dr Wiedemann. Yeah, you know it's not for everybody. I think it just depends on what you're trying to do. I'm trying to maximize the gains that I can get in the small amount of time that I have to work out, because I'm doing this full-time YouTube channel. You know I do coaching. I've got the kids. I've got the kids, I've got my husband. You know I need to like also take care of myself, you know. So it's just like trying to do that, but yeah, yeah, it's not for everybody for sure.
Speaker 1:That's, that's um and there's, there's differences too, of um, you know, that's more if you're going into failure and you're going reps, you know, and, and like you're getting exhausted in those last few, you're, you're, you are gonna build muscle like that's gonna, that's, you know, hypertrophy you're going to do that's more of the bodybuilder style, versus a functional, like strength training, which is its own thing, but that's not gonna get you the big growth, uh, long-term strength. There's other ways to achieve that. But if you're like I need to build muscle right now, quick, then yeah, going to failure is going to be your option, because that's the bodybuilding style, just having ample recovery between the sessions is the big key.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think people don't realize how important the rest days are. They're just as important as the workout days, because the muscle is built on the the rest day. That's when it rebuilds itself. You know, yeah, I, I take uh resting very seriously hardcore rest very like I'm crazy about my sleep and my stress and hydration.
Speaker 2:Nutrition and exercise yeah it, it's holistic, you know, it's not just one thing. I think people can get overwhelmed when they start and try to do everything all at once, like I've been doing this God, some form of like I learned about nutrition and keto and all that stuff in like 2016. And then I started going down that rabbit hole, really started working out a lot then too. So I I'm almost 10 years into my you know, nutrition and exercise journey. Um, so I think you know, start, just start somewhere. If you're getting started and you don't understand what we're talking about at all, just walking is enough to just get off the couch and start walking. That that can. That's what I did. The first year on carnivore was just walked, cause I was, um, the kids were still so little and I was dealing with some Hashimoto's stuff and I was kind of tired, so, but that that allowed me to lose, I think, 35, 40 pounds. The first year was carnivore and walking.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think, a combination of strength, movement, nutrition, recovery. You take all those things, things like that's why I even named my company podcast, primal foundations. Those are the four things. I think that if you do, you're gonna, you're gonna feel better, you're gonna cover a lot of bases. And plus walking and I I say this on the podcast all the time I used to I used to talk shit about walking I think a lot of people I used to talk shit.
Speaker 1:however, as I've gotten a little bit older, because I was from marathons and I did big endurance races and to me it's like I don't want to walk. Why am I going to walk for an hour when I get the same distance done in like 10 minutes, 15?
Speaker 2:minutes Right, right, right.
Speaker 1:But just being in that low zone too, being outside, getting the sun exposure, sun exposure that just in itself. And also if I'm, if I'm banged up I don't want to go run two, three, four, five, six miles. When I'm banged up I just walk and I feel like it's actually helped my health drastically more, because I'm able to recover more, I'm able to be in zone two for a long period of time, I'm not taxing my body and therefore my strength gains go up. My sleep is better. So I used to not I used to be a anti-walker. Now I'm like I get my, my mom's, walking every day. I'm doing walks, so I think that's a great step to start.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, walking it's just so low impact. You know, I'm, I'm old, I'm going to be 41 old to me, I don't feel old.
Speaker 2:I know, I know, but you know what I mean Like it's different than when you're 20, than when you're 40. There is a difference. And walking on my walks I write scripts for my YouTube videos, I answer emails, I brainstorm. We have a nice little pond right over here. I do like a mile loop and I get like look at the birds and shit. You know I love it. It's so nice, it's calming.
Speaker 1:I look at the birds and shit. It's great.
Speaker 2:I do. We have some really cool birds over here.
Speaker 1:Some sandhill cranes and some yeast and some ducks. We've got some cool birds. So that's cool. And talking about cool things that you thought about upcoming book complete. Complete Carnivore. It offers recipes, detailed guidance on how to do the carnivore diet. And can you share some unique features of the book and then how it caters to both newcomers and seasoned carnivores?
Speaker 2:Yeah for sure. So, complete Carnivore. I envisioned it as like the full reference guide, like encyclopedia, to carnivores. So, whether you've been doing carnivore for years, envisioned it as like the full reference guide, like encyclopedia to carnivore. So whether you've been doing carnivore for years or you're just getting started or researching it, it's going to have something for you. So the whole first half of the book is like a complete, in-depth guide to the carnivore diet starter guide. Um, you know how you can decide if you want to ease in or go cold Turkey, uh, meal plans, grocery lists, all that kind of stuff. Then it guides you through the first month, the first year, and then it goes into a bunch of other stuff. So, troubleshooting If you're running into certain issues on carnivore, you can go to that chapter and find the issue and it will give you action, steps that you can take to take care of it, faqs I mean having the YouTube channel has been really helpful for that, because I get the same questions over and over and over.
Speaker 2:So I just distilled that and put that into that chapter. Myths you know we all encounter the myths like oh, ldl cholesterol will cause heart disease, or like eating red meat is bad for the kidneys, things like that, addressing all of that stuff. And then I think one of my favorite chapters is the monitoring your progress chapter, where I go into how you can order your own blood work online, where you can get DEXA scans, ketones and how to monitor them, what to optimal functional ranges for all of these numbers and how you can set up your own end of one experiments. So that's like the whole first half of the book, which is its own book in and of itself. Honestly, I basically wrote two books in one. The second half is 80 plus carnivore recipes, and it's not just like how to grill a steak, although that is in there. These are more recipes for like, if you and me, if we get bored and we're like I need something different, you can go through here and get something different that's still fully carnivore and throw that into your diet. So it's going to be really helpful for a lot of people. I just kind of wanted it to be something you could put on your shelf and pull it out whenever you had a question, whenever you needed a new recipe or whatever you needed it for. So, yeah, I've worked a lot on it. It was.
Speaker 2:It's very hard to write a book. I didn't think it would be easy, but like it was a lot, just because I was also still doing the YouTube channel. So I create six to 12 videos per month long form, then the short form as well, and the coaching and all that stuff. Then also writing a book. My husband hated me. He was like you work from dawn until we go to bed. I'm like I got to get it done. What am I going to do? But man, I'm excited. I'm excited for it. I think it's going to be pretty cool.
Speaker 1:That sounds awesome. I feel like that's the one area of really tracking progress for me. I do have like a very intuitive scale that gives me a laundry list of, like, protein and body. It gives me you know body fat composition. It gives me you know trends and stuff, which is great, but I don't dive into blood work, ketones or anything like that. So I feel like I'm definitely pre-ordering. Go on Amazon, guys. Pre-order.
Speaker 2:You can already do it. Yeah, amazon and Barnes Noble both have really good pre-order deals where whenever you pre-order it until the date of release, you're going to get the lowest price that it ever is during that period of time. So let's say on Amazon they have a flash sale. Whenever you pre-order it until the date of release, you're going to get the lowest price that it ever is during that period of time. So let's say on Amazon they have a flash sale. It goes on sale for like 20 bucks, but you had already pre-ordered it on release day. You get it for that price.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and they don't charge you until release day, and then typically you get it on release day too, which is pretty cool, oh they already sent it out.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, okay.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. So Amazon and Barnes and Noble both have that kind of deal, and then I have a link to target and then for international viewers, of course you can use your own Amazon too, but I have one that's. That's for international viewers as well.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so I mean the leak I put in the show notes and then you know I always give people this very loaded question, but you're no different. With the book release on the horizon and everything like that, what are the next projects? What do you have in mind for the carnivore community?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So this year it's going to be really conference heavy. So I just spoke at my first conference, the Collaborative Science Conference in Vegas last weekend, dave Feldman's conference that was awesome. It was my first time speaking at a conference.
Speaker 2:I've done a lot of public speaking in other areas, but in May is Meat Stock, so that's in Gatlinburg, tennessee. That's like every single carnivore, doctor and influencer on the planet is going to be there. I'm really excited for that. One influencer on the planet is going to be there. I'm really excited for that one. And then the book comes out in the fall. So it just depends.
Speaker 2:I don't know if there's going to be a lot of like interviews and tours and things for that. I have no idea yet. We'll see what happens, but that's going to be pretty much eating up most of my time the last quarter of the year. So that's kind of what's going on. As far as what the future holds, I'm definitely doing carnivore for this year. We're thinking about, well, we really need to buy a house, but it's just like when is that going to happen? Lots of travel and just trying to stay consistent with the workouts. That's kind of what I have on my plate for this year, trying to keep it pretty simple because I have so many work-related things going on that could be crazy that I just want to keep my health up as much as possible.
Speaker 1:Awesome. Well, again, thanks for coming on. I'm going to put your links YouTube, Instagram and all your information in the show notes, and I appreciate all that you do, because those videos do take a long time and I think if I were to go back and you know, cause this is my fifth year on carnivore I would have loved to have something else An additional of a starter guide. You know, I had Sean Baker's Rogan episode. That was pretty much it and I just went off from there. But I appreciate all you do and for the community and taking the time to do these things. It's not a it's not an easy task.
Speaker 2:No, it's not, you know, and basically I just didn't want people to suffer like I did in the beginning. So that's why I created all these videos and I hope that they help people at least avoid some of the pitfalls that I went through.
Speaker 1:Well, hope all the listeners go check out the links and thanks for everybody listening to another episode of the Primal Foundations podcast. Thank you, thank you.