The Fearless Warrior Podcast

105: How I Became a Full-Time Mental Performance Coach - Wins, Mistakes, Lessons Along the Way

• Amanda Schaefer

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In today's episode, I share my unfiltered journey from softball coach to full-time mental performance coach, revealing the struggles, mistakes, and pivotal moments that shaped my business success. Joining me are fellow mental performance coaches to ask questions and create a transparent discussion about the realities of building a mental performance coaching business.

Episode Highlights:

• The transition from leaving the 9-5 job to owning a business
• How I discovered mental performance coaching
• Marketing strategies
• Overcoming imposter syndrome as a mental performance coach
• Gradually building systems and hired a team to help the business



If you loved this episode and want to connect with me about the Mental Performance Coach Mastermind, send me a DM at https://www.instagram.com/fearlessfastpitch or reach out by email hello@fearlessfastpitch.com. There are only a few spots available, and our next Mastermind Cohort will start on October 7th!


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Speaker 1:

Welcome to the fearless warrior podcast, a place for athletes, coaches and parents who know the value of a strong mindset. I'm your host, coach AB, a mental performance coach on a mission, former softball coach, wife and mom of three. Each episode, we will dive deep into all things mental performance, mindset tools and how to rewire the brain for success. So if your goal is to gain the mental edge and learn the secrets of mental performance, mindset tools and how to rewire the brain for success, so if your goal is to gain the mental edge and learn the secrets of mental performance, you're in the right place. Let's tune in to today's episode. All right, welcome to the Fearless Warrior podcast.

Speaker 1:

This is a atypical podcast recording, and the episode is how I became a full-time mental performance coach the wins, the mistakes, the lessons, all the embarrassing stories, and this is an episode I've been wanting to record for quite some time and, to be honest, it's really hard for me to do solo episodes, and so I've invited some other mental performance coaches that I've gotten to connect with in various ways, and I just never want to sugarcoat my journey. I get a lot of questions in the DMs and people that I connect with, and I do. I want to share the good, the bad, the embarrassing. As I was preparing we have a Google doc I posted a question to my fellow mental performance coaches in the NPM group with Brian Kane and I loved these questions that came up and it really helped me to reflect on. It's easy when we arrive at a goal that we've worked so hard for, and going back down memory lane and remembering when it was hard. And please laugh at some of the behind the scenes.

Speaker 1:

If you are a client of mine and you're in the fearless warrior program or you're a one-on-one client or you're a school that I work with and you're like, oh, why should I listen to this episode? It goes to show that I am not immune to struggles and frustrations and I love what I do. So today's going to be a fun episode, especially for my fellow mental performance coaches, and we have some of them here live. So I want to introduce to you. I have with me Kirstie McMillan of elite mindset, and we're also going to post this to YouTube so you guys can give a little wave. I have Jason Wesseldyke of mental performance mentors he runs that with his brother, lucinda of peak Flow, lucinda Snyder, and then I have Janet McCormick of Mind Over Talent. They're going to be asking me some really great questions, and so welcome everyone, so glad that you guys are here. Live, it's going to be fun. Okay, so I think we decided Kirstie, you were the first one to respond with your questions let's fire away. Let's do it.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, oh, Amanda, I'm so happy you're doing this. This is awesome. So my big question is I work full time at a hospital and I'm slowly building my mental performance business and my goal is to retire from the hospital and switch over. So my big question for you is how did you know that you could do it full time and count on the incoming count that the business is there?

Speaker 1:

I love this question, first and foremost because I think that there's a lot of myths out there where, um, you know as mental performance coaches, have you guys heard of burn the boats, burn the ships, right, and I think, as much as that's tempting, I don't. I don't post about this on my social media, so I'd love to share and take you guys all the way back to 2017. It was never a moment of burn the boats, and I'll explain my burn the bones moment and how it was the biggest mistake that I ever made. So in 2017, before I even knew what mental skills training was, I had a really great marketing job. I was young, I thought it was my. I made it job right Like a big girl job. I made really good money, I had health insurance which what is that now? Um, and then my dad got sick, and so my dad was my bucket dad, my hero, and I had this realization of like I am literally trapped in a nine to five. I had a graphic designer under me, I had a marketing team, I was the head of a department, and so, truly, it was like, how could I have this job that I loved so much, that I was really good at and still feel so conflicted.

Speaker 1:

And so, in 2018, my alma mater, my high school, a coaching job, a head high school coaching job opened up and I thought well, I've this whole time I've been giving pitching lessons, I've been coaching travel, I've been coaching all these other teams. How cool would it be if I could coach. This is what I had before I even knew about mental performance. I thought how could I make coaching full time? And in my mind it was I'm going to give lessons at night and on the weekends and then I'm going to coach a team. I went to my boss and I said hey, this job position is open. I know. If I apply for it, I have a high confidence that I'm going to get it. I'll come in at 7. Work through my lunch, change in the bathroom. Can I leave at 3pm, start practice at four? And my boss, without even considering it, said no. And I was so angry, I was so mad and I had this moment of like okay, I'm going to do it, I'm going to figure out how to do it. And at the time, I had my firstborn, who was, I think, at the time, april to August, may, june, july, august a four month old and so I thought well, I can pull my four month old from daycare. I have a couple thousand dollars that I make with pitching lessons and I'm going to make five grand coaching. Hallelujah, like that's really good money. And so I will never forget this.

Speaker 1:

Rhonda Revell, the head coach at Nebraska, came up to me as I started. I got the head coaching job. I quit my nine to five. She said you did what? And even my athletes and my families were like you quit your day job to come coach a three month season. I had no plan, nothing lined up.

Speaker 1:

It was actually a stay at home mom. I made it six months before. I was like I need more income. I'm not a good stay-at-home mom. I actually worked at the YMCA because you could drop your kid off. I was teaching three-year-olds how to do. It was called Jumpin' Juniors. I was teaching them how to do Olympics.

Speaker 1:

Anyway, in 2019, that following year I applied for a marketing job. So I said, okay, I'm not too prideful If I'm going to figure this out, I need an income to take that pressure off. And so I worked for an orthodontist doing marketing. Build my resume, figure it out. The fall of 2019, I was still coaching.

Speaker 1:

It was my second season at Waverly and I just kind of kept seeing these themes of like how do I help them with their confidence? And after losing my dad to cancer, it was this moment of like oh, you can teach mental skills, you can teach resiliency. And so, as much as that was a really hard time in my life, it led me to discover mental skills. So I started using it. My high school girls, I started using them as guinea pigs and it was like, oh my gosh Lucinda is going to laugh at this I taught them breathing techniques and I taught them how to regulate their nervous system. And uh, jordi came up to me and she goes oh my gosh, coach AB. It worked and I was skeptical. It's like okay, maybe this stuff works. So I actually sat on research for a full year before launching anything and hired a couple of grad students, was learning about mental skills At first it was supposed to be a workbook had no idea it was going to be a program, and so I the other turning point and I know that this is kind of vulnerable of me to share, but I have permission from the mom was also working full-time giving pitching lessons, coaching a high school and I was trying to launch my business and every week I saw my pitching lesson girls and one of my pitching lesson girls attempted to commit suicide.

Speaker 1:

And that was my moment of like what am I doing? I see these girls every single week. Somebody's got to help them and so I called that mom up. I went to a business conference in the fall of 2019 and I called her up and I said hey, I really want to help your daughter. I think I can help other athletes. I can teach them mental skills. I don't know how to teach it or what's going to happen. There's this thing called zoom. We were zooming before. Zoom was cool.

Speaker 1:

And then, in the fall of 2019, I was standing on a beach after a business conference. I held up my phone super shaky and I went live on Instagram and I said, hey, there are these things called mental skills and I want to teach them to your daughter. I have no idea how we're going to do this. We're going to meet for six weeks. If you're even remotely interested, dm me.

Speaker 1:

And my first round ever of the fearless warrior program, I had 10 girls and one scholarship, so we had 11 warriors in the fall of 2019. And this whole time I have a nine to five. This whole time I was working nights and weekends and I say this because it's not that I was brave or that I didn't have fears, like it was taking that messy action. You know, while you're working at the hospital, while you're doing these other things, and then we all know what happened in 2020, and overnight it was like my business exploded and I just kept launching and making it better. And then, in 2021, after I had been doing it, I had imposter syndrome, which is one of the questions today and so I signed up for Brian Kane's NPM certification program, realized that there's a whole bunch of mental performance coaches out there. I'm like, oh my gosh, I can do this, I'm not alone, and it was the confirmation that I needed that you know, we're teaching the right things, we're making an impact, making an impact.

Speaker 1:

And then you know, was it the fall of 2020? I had realized that my nine to five I had whittled my hours down so much that the money that I was making was matching barely, was matching my nine to five income. And, um, the night before I was supposed to put in my two weeks notice, my husband's car broke down. So talk about like are you sure you want to do this? Like you're a little crazy, so it doesn't come without struggles. And I know there's a lot of stories weaved throughout that, but I don't. I don't. Who posts this on social media? I don't share these stories. And so I hope, by sharing these stories, that, like there's been a lot of crazy moments and thank God, my husband has believed in me because that night he's like you're sure you're going to do this. I now need to fork out money for a new car. We can do it.

Speaker 2:

That's so helpful. I I see a lot of what I'm dealing with right now very similar stuff, so it makes me feel a lot better.

Speaker 1:

It makes me realize that how easily we forget. I think it's the same as like having kids of like we don't forget, or we forget what it's like to have a newborn. We forget what it's like to like go through those really really hard, grind it out Like I used to take vlog videos in my car, of like it's not working fast enough. I'm never going to be able to quit my nine to five. I literally have a video at my day job in the parking lot. I'm so mad. I'm like wearing scrubs during the pandemic, working in an orthodontic office, I'm tired and I'm I'm like I'm so glad I took those videos because I'll never forget the struggle and I think it's easy to like. You see these successful people. Someone else who's really good at this Jesse Yellow Tux. Jesse with the Savannah Bananas. If you have not followed his story, he documented when he had no money, he was sleeping on an air mattress with his wife and hardly anyone was going to Savannah Bananas games. And so it's like be unapologetic, like document the struggles, document your process.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I love that. That's a really great idea and it also just shows how much you wanted to do it Right Like that's. That's a lot to deal with.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I think for me. I think for me, this idea of nobody else is helping and I think that's the bedrock of my niche is I'm here for the youth athletes because I've had pitching lessons and girls that I've coached that have gone on to college that don't have access to a mental performance coach, that have very tiny psychology departments, and even at you know Nebraska, their sports psychologist is assigned to multiple sports and it's like where, how are we feeling our kids? And so my whole mission is to make mental skills training accessible to the youth. You know, 100% 100% Same here.

Speaker 2:

I'm in Canada and it's the exact same thing here. It's like how can I make this accessible to people who would not otherwise have access to it?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I think that gets rid of a lot of the imposter syndrome and that's why I signed up for Brian Cain certification. It was like I want to make sure that I'm teaching yeah.

Speaker 2:

So did did doing Caner's program just kind of reaffirm everything you were doing, or was there some new stuff in it?

Speaker 1:

for you. Oh yeah, I. What it really opened my eyes to is you can do this research. I had no idea how many different breathing techniques I mean, like you can do a six to eight breath, you can do a box breath, you can do a belly breath. I mean, if you can do a six to eight breath, you can do a five, one, seven breath. You know, like learning that, and he teaches the ball method for visualization of like at the core of it. If you stay in education mode of like, we're always learning things. I've never stopped reading, never stopped researching. Um, I have a story for later and I could I might as well just tell it now.

Speaker 1:

But I actually got called out by someone on Instagram before I got certified and I used to teach put your emotions aside, or like let's reframe those emotions, and I'm sure I've deleted it since then. But it was like a I have sticky note posts that I post for athletes and it was like you can always control your thoughts and your emotions. And it was like you can always control your thoughts and your emotions. And now I know, but that's wrong, like that's toxic positivity. We want to allow the athlete to feel what they're feeling. You cannot reframe an emotion. And I actually had a coach DM me. Actually he commented publicly he's like you're teaching the wrong thing, please stop spreading false information. And then he DM'd me he's like very angry, and kept commenting on my posts and while I don't agree with his approach, I was receptive to it. I was like, okay, then please educate me, cause you know something that I don't. And now I realize, oh my gosh, our society is telling us to not feel the feels. How often our parents and our generation I'm a millennial, especially my fellow Gen Xers we were raised in a generation of suck it up, you know. So it's like learning those things, admitting when you're wrong.

Speaker 1:

And, um, I went and did a camp in Florida and there was actually a dad that came up to me and he goes I'm a licensed mental health therapist. Obviously he's got like way more academia than me. I'm like, oh boy, here we go. Like what did I? What did I say wrong?

Speaker 1:

He actually came up to me and he said I just want you to know that, like what you're teaching is right on par. I was like, well, that's great, cause I've done a lot of research with CBT theory and like that's what I follow and he goes oh my gosh, that's what my, that's what I teach and everything you said is is on par, and it's just like those moments of like I'm not doing things maliciously, I'm going to do my research, I'm going to try to make sure that I'm teaching the right things. So, and it's nerve wracking when you see other influencers. There's a lot of influencers, especially in the softball community, that are teaching pitching, are teaching catching or teaching some of these other things that need the education, they need to be educated. So, if I can help empower more coaches, it's really nerve wracking to like DM, somebody who has way more followers than you, and you're like, hey, what you're actually teaching is spreading toxic positivity.

Speaker 1:

So if we can grow the space, amen, but it's awkward sometimes.

Speaker 3:

But I feel too, that's what you know, brian Kane's group, and what you have created is a space like this.

Speaker 3:

When I first started out, I felt lonely because I didn't know of others, and so I think that what has benefited me so much is like, again, spaces you've created and like that I found, through Brian, that helped us share these thoughts and ideas and begin to develop a much deeper understanding of not only the things that, again, we've seen in real life, that we have studied, but then how it applies across the board, you know, literally across borders, and and that's been so strong.

Speaker 3:

And so these questions you know you being willing to share your story, to talk about the hard times, and those pieces I think resonate with so many people, and for me, this question actually came from Paige Frazier in the group, but I know I asked you the same question 13 months ago. That was just, you know what were the first steps that you took when you were finding clients and you were building your business and what did you think about and what kind of like marketing strategies did you use and what things failed and what did you learn from them and how did you get going again.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I love this question. So shout out to Paige Frazier and shout out to Janet Love that you're here. I think what we forget is the power of our immediate circle and when I first started I charged the same amount that I was charging for pitching lessons, which I think at the time was 30 bucks a session, which apparently in the realm of the softball world is really cheap. I'm from Nebraska, so, um, don't discount your current relationship. So if you coach, you have coaching friends, you have your circle of families that if you come to them and say, hey, I'm here to provide value, how do you provide value with the other things that you're doing, you know of? Like, I'm going to teach your daughter how to play lacrosse and field hockey and how to pitch and how to hit and how to paddleboard and all of these things. That, if I can teach them the physical side and I can educate parents on the mental side and I can show that value. I just started showing the value and for the first year of my business I was terrified to launch. I sat on the research for a year. I had a newborn, I was coaching. I just didn't have time to launch anything yet I selfishly just started providing value on my Instagram. My Instagram is my main platform that I've grown, which is wild to me and so the first thing is who, who's your connections and who's your contact? And don't just go to your contacts and say, buy my stuff. Nobody wants to buy your stuff. They want what your stuff can give them, the value, and so I would just encourage you. This is a really great exercise. We do this in the mastermind is. I just want you to make that list and you'd be surprised at how many coaching connections you have, and some of my greatest clients used to be people that I like hated as a strong word, but like. I was a competitive coach and one of my school districts that I've worked with. We were in the same conference and we hated playing each other. Like we had this, like mutual rub of like I want to beat you. And now I talk with Jen and she's like oh, this is so crazy. Now you're working with my team and helping us to win, so, um, don't discount that. And then you know social media. I think the biggest thing is 80% serving, 20% selling. So if you're just on your Instagram constantly selling, people can feel that energy and especially nowadays people are coming to social media to be entertained, not told to. So I did that probably for a whole year, and I think that's why I got the Waverly job, because at the time when I applied for the head coaching job, I had 6,000 followers on Instagram and the girls thought that was the coolest thing of like. Oh my gosh, she's Instagram famous.

Speaker 1:

So think about it from your client's perspective. There has to be a piece of authority there of like. If you're not posting anything on social media or you don't have your website, why would a parent trust you? And so there has to be an element of like show up. It doesn't have to be perfect. Um, and long gone are the days of the grid.

Speaker 1:

I used to be very like meticulous about white post black post white. I had, like this beautiful black and white grid on my Instagram. It's like we don't need. It's not aesthetic. Gen Z doesn't care, they don't care about your aesthetic, they just care that you care or you care. Um, and then the other note that I had on this and we're working from a Google doc, which I'm so thankful for is when I was giving pitching lessons, I had a pool of families that I had already created that no like and trust, and I had been doing that already for seven years.

Speaker 1:

And so there is this trust factor of like okay, if you have another friend that's a coach, that's giving lessons, how can you leverage that relationship to build more trust? Like, I've offered workshops for other friends, like, hey, I want to come speak to your parents at no charge, I want to educate them and then we can make that offer. So that's kind of what I did for the first two years of my business. And then, um, we'll talk about this. But I actually did not take my first one-to-one client until three years in it. Like didn't even dawn on me that that could be a thing. And now it's like 30% of my revenue. So, um, that's kind of like how I started. The first three years of my business was literally just the fearless warrior program 12 weeks, get a group, get a group, get a group, get a group. Um, we switched it to evergreen. So I don't know how many times 24. We've launched the program 24 times, which is pretty cool. We're just bouncing all over.

Speaker 4:

Um, I think this this is a beautiful follow-up question to to Janet, and I think you know, when you're first in it and you're by yourself, it is lonely. I mean, I think I found you on Instagram and I was like I want to be her friend. How can I be, how can I like get in that space Right, um, and and finally had like the courage to, to connect and it and it was out of this like this is hard and I'm on this island by myself, um, and you sharing this even today, is just a. It's just such a good reminder for me. From where I am. I'm like, oh, I can't wait for our one-on-one call. Um, what was the hardest part like of building your business Right Cause it, it? It comes in seasons and phases and sometimes, when you're in it, you're like this is the hardest thing ever, and then you look back and you're like, oh, that actually wasn't so bad. So if you had to like capture it into one thing.

Speaker 1:

So this applies to today just as much as it applies back then. Full disclosure I have a team and you know you guys in the mastermind, you know that that's like the next phase of like, once you scale past six figures or multiple six figures, at some point you got to hire a team and so I will never kind of like say that I do it all. I don't. I have a team of three and then I also have three assistant coaches that take calls. So, um, I would say the hardest part is letting go and like delegating, because I think back to working a nine to five. The weirdest thing is is like I remember this, before we even got married, the priest was, like you're doing lessons, you're coaching a high school, you're coaching a travel team and you're working a nine to five and you're about to get married and have kids. Like we literally put sheets of paper on the coffee table and my husband and I were like sliding things around of, like well, you love this too much and you love this too much, so what are you going to take off? And like, even today, if you would have told me that I wouldn't really be giving pitching lessons anymore I am down to probably eight families that I give lessons to And're all in high school and in the fall, that it's season right now. And so if you would have told me that six years ago you would not be giving pitching lessons and you wouldn't be coaching a team, I would have laughed at you and I think I was so tightly gripped into, like in order to be a good coach, I have to coach all these things.

Speaker 1:

And it wasn't an overnight success and it was just like a gradual progression of like I'm just going to keep doing this thing. There was a moment where I, my husband, was going to like throw the computer out the apartment window where I think it was team two, team two or team three. Literally 30 minutes before I was supposed to hop on live, I'm typing out the document worksheet that I'm supposed to give to them. Do I recommend that strategy? No, but because I had said I'm going to provide worksheets, I like built it in real time, and my husband's like helping me format it. He's like, why didn't you do this before? But once that cohort was done team three I think it was like, well, now the worksheets are built. So for team four, now we just reuse these worksheets, and so I just have always had a hard time like trusting somebody else to do it as good as I've done it, and so and I coach clients one-on-one on this in the business too and you know, I hope Charlie hears this episode and laughs at this because when you get to a point where it feels like I have to create the program, I have to serve the program, I have to take these zoom calls, I have to record the podcast, I have to record the replays, I have to manage all of my social media. Once you build some of those assets and, lucinda and Janet, you've experienced this Once you build those assets, it will never be that hard again.

Speaker 1:

So, for example, one of the things that I wanted to share is I have a funnel set up where I've had so many people DM me asking for a coaching call and I'm talking about athletes that now if somebody lands on my social media, they can go to my link in bio, they can click I want a one-on-one session with coach AB. It takes them to a checkout and then it auto sends them my calendar, they book their session with me and then the parent can put the athlete's name, their cell phone number, whether or not they want to be on zoom or FaceTime and then what they want to talk about in the session. In the last 48 hours I've had three of those book without me lifting a finger, just from social media, and part of that is I had to let go of the idea that I had to be the one selling them, that I had to be in the DMs. Once you let go of that and you create those automations, those funnels, or you delegate it to somebody on your team, like what are those things that you could delegate? So, for example, social media was very hard for me to delegate because I love the picture, I love creating the yellow sticky notes. If you're on my Instagram, you've seen my yellow sticky notes. I don't want those yellow sticky notes to be in somebody else's handwriting. That's weird. Who's the Lucinda? Who's the Colorado? Coach coach prime, yes, coach prime, yeah. Remember when coach prime, I'm like that's my thumb, that's my thumb on the sticky note that he put. Like obviously that's not Coach Prime's thumb. And so the reason I tell this story is like if you can figure out like I'm going to batch and make three to four yellow sticky note posts and then I'm going to text those pictures to my social media coordinator and then she's going to write a caption and then I'm going to approve it. I don't hardly touch any of the scheduling of my social media, but I batch it.

Speaker 1:

So it's like how can you ask these questions of like, how can I remove me as the cog to scale my time and to scale my business? Funnels have been amazing for me, processes have been amazing for me and team have been amazing for me. And so again, like this wasn't an overnight thing, I started with a contract, a couple of contract employees, probably in 2020 and 2021. And then, just last year, I now run payroll. So, like, in the eyes of the government, like I'm, I'm a little bit more legit than I have been in the last years. Am I doing everything perfectly? No, but I have the back ends legit.

Speaker 1:

So that didn't happen in year one. But now, looking back, it's like, okay, well now how can I automate more? And there's so much more that I could probably automate with Jeez. My team uses chat GPT more than I do. They like chat GPT, like this podcast episode. My team will put the transcript into chat GPT and find the sound bites and then what you see on social media. My team does that all. I don't even lift a finger. She's like so cool.

Speaker 5:

Hey, amanda, I was just going to ask you I know you've kind of answered this a little bit I know you were in the softball community and everything and so that made sense for you to go ahead and really focus on those players and those teams. For coaches starting out, like me and my brother, we've had the opportunity to work with a few high school and some middle school teams and we haven't we're just kind of going wherever we can, wherever we can go and practice, basically. But what are your thoughts on focusing on? Like you focus on a certain sport, a certain age group? What are your thoughts in terms of where we should focus?

Speaker 1:

yeah, I think my message on that is like go where you naturally feel comfortable. I was not a multi-sport athlete. I sucked at all the other sports. Really, honestly, I liked softball the best, so I just naturally felt comfortable with softball. And so you know, if you're comfortable speaking to specific sports, like, for example, what what would you say your top three sports would be?

Speaker 5:

Baseball for sure. Um would be top without a question. And then I never would have thought this, but my kids have all been into running, so like cross country, which that's been kind of a challenge because it doesn't have a lot of the stops in it a lot of the other sports do, to kind of mentally reset. So that's something I've been kind of working on with some different runners so, and then probably basketball would be third.

Speaker 1:

Yeah. So, based on those three, if you were to say, hey, we're going to hone in, we're going to throw a target at baseball, what happens is, if you work with one high school, it's so much easier to go to another high school and say, hey, I'm working with Ralston baseball, I'd love to help your program. You can start to kind of create a name for the space name in your space, and what I've realized is just simply by showing up and serving one of my largest contracts to date. I started with the softball program because her daughter, the head coach's daughter, had gone through the fearless warrior program, didn't even know it because I didn't realize the last name. Then she contacted me and said hey, I want you to come speak to my softball team, worked with her for one season, then the next season she brought me in more. I think I went three times.

Speaker 1:

And then the next season, the basketball team it's a small school. The basketball team, the volleyball team, the cross country team they were all like what are you doing? Cause they made it to the state tournament after three years of working with them, or technically two. And then the third year, all these other teams started asking now, what am I going to turn them away. But if I said, hey, I don't necessarily know basketball, but I know mental skills, I can do for the basketball team what I did for the softball team, what really created that authority, is like I knew that I could help the softball team. And so if you can start to throw a target and say, okay, we love working with baseball teams, if, as a by-product, other teams come to you, you're not going to turn them away, but you're really going to speak to the baseball athletes, baseball families that, like, you're really going to speak to the baseball athletes, baseball families that, like, I get you I know you by the way, I played your sport and that's huge with Gen Z. Gen Z want that relatability, they, they care about that relationship. And so, jason, honestly, I would just really try to hone in and say, like we really serve these sports.

Speaker 1:

And then you know, as a by-product, I work with a basketball player and a soccer player and I feel really dumb because and again, like, if my clients listen to this, you know exactly who you are. I have a basketball stud and a soccer stud and they're going D one. I know it. They're in the recruiting process and on calls. They're explaining to me like what a wing is and what you know, she's, a, what a PK is and like all these things. But what that gives me is a connection point of, like, I'm not your coach, I'm not writing the lineup, I just care that you get to succeed and love your sport. And that's been really eye opening for me where, jason, honestly I would have said, stick to a sport, don't coach any other sports. But that's just been my experience of like, yes, mental skills transferred to all sports. But if your marketing speaks to all sports, it's not, it's going to sell to no one. So just because your marketing is honed in doesn't mean your client base has to be honed in.

Speaker 1:

Gotcha so even in like Facebook groups, like there's a softball mom Facebook group and a couple of other Facebook groups where I just go into those Facebook groups and answer questions for parents that are struggling. I'm not selling, I'm just answering questions and saying, hey, she might need a break, she might be facing burnout. Have you discovered mental skills? And like I'm giving away really good advice and then as a by-product, I've become known in the softball play space as like the go-to for softball. It's also helpful. So, um, let's see, jason, you have another awesome question that we had in the Google doc um packages.

Speaker 5:

Yeah, yeah, can you just go into a little bit of that Like obviously pricing? I at least, like I think you mentioned, my brother and I are kind of starting this business together and I mean that's something we've kind of struggled with, like first of all, how much do you charge? But then what kind of packages did you offer? Like cause I know some coaches that I listened to or say, hey, you should three months minimum, or six months minimum, or this or that, say, hey, you should three months minimum, or six months minimum, or this or that.

Speaker 1:

Just what are your thoughts on that? I have literally sliced an onion 27 times, like I've made mistakes. You want me to start with the mistakes first. You want me to start with the good first?

Speaker 5:

Let's go with the mistakes.

Speaker 1:

One of the worst things I ever did. One of the worst things I ever did is I sold it. Do you guys know what AR is? Accelerated reading program? It's like a reading curriculum. So it was a school district and I was like, okay, how many athletes do you have? And then we're going to price it per athlete. The number was astronomical and they're like, why would I, how would we pay this? They ended up paying it and then it was a nightmare because I now had all these athletes in my system with school emails that were getting flagged as spam, so I couldn't even email them when the zoom calls were. And then we had kids transfer into the school district. We had kids quit their sport, we had new kids and then it was like, oh well, I'm a multi-sport athlete, so do I have to pay three times? It was just crazy messy. I would not recommend having orgs pay individually. On the other hand, the orgs that I have worked with, the simpler the better. So if you said, hey, I want to work with your team one of the best things and again, like I'm, I'm telling it all because I want you guys to know this People pay me thousands of dollars to coach them on how to build this, but this is going to give you a great starting point. The best thing I ever did was charge for a team workshop. So one team workshop with me is $500. Now, if it's in person, it might be more expensive because I'm traveling, but the benefit of an in-person is that I'm going to stay for practice, I'm going to stay after and talk to the coach, I'm going to come early, and so a lot of my contracts now is the coach then gets to decide. Oh man, like we don't have the budget, we can only afford to bring her in once or twice. Some of my other schools who are really hungry for it and have the budget for it will say, like one of my schools that I work with, I come in six times, so I'm touching the team every other week. I have that touch point with them where we do a pre -season and we do a right after tryouts happened, then we do mid-season, mid-season right before post-season and then we save one for post-season. Now I feel like I'm an extension of the coaching staff and then that's a really juicy contract that I can renew every year. And if they say, hey, we don't have the budget to do six, but we can you know, maybe we only need one to two this year. It then becomes a relationship versus hey. Here's my package, right, and I think also as a benefit to you is you know what you're in for as far as time commitment. Two years ago I was probably traveling three to four days a week and was charging $500 and was not charging for travel and then also going to their games. And my husband looked at me and he goes what's the difference of this of you coaching a high school team, cause you're gone four nights a week and then you're watching games on the weekend. I had like worked myself back into being a full-time coach and so I think really like showing the value of hey. Like, if you can't afford in person, let's talk about virtual and having that price point. But the simpler the better, and I teach this in the mastermind do not give them more than two pricing options, because when you start adding a third pricing option or four or five, a confused buyer will never purchase. So honestly, I would. My best advice is what does it cost for you to work with a team? How long do you want to work with them? Typically it's like an hour, maybe 45 minutes. Make that your package and then stand in your authority and say you know, anything less than 45 minutes is probably not going to be enough Anything longer. We don't hold their attention span. This is what it costs to bring me in. Now you get to decide and ask them a question hey, how many times do you want to bring me in? And then you're not fighting budgets. Does that make sense?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and so at one. At what point did you feel comfortable raising your prices and not scaring?

Speaker 1:

people away? I can answer that two ways. With the fearless warrior program it was $179 for six weeks of zoom calls and so that's about 30 bucks a session. I felt comfortable doing that. But then once I started adding like the worksheets, the portal, the extra resources at one point we had like a team group texts where you can start to show people the value, then it alleviates my imposter syndrome of like no, this is worth it, because I know that I can get them the transformation and then, as you start to get more testimonials, that's also going to show the value.

Speaker 1:

So, um, the fearless warrior program as it stands today I've got, you know, my names on the board on a sale or in like a promo period. They can get access to three months for $300 or lifetime access was $500. So I'm right in that sweet spot of like, think about the price objections that you might also face in the softball world a bat, which is insane, it's $500. And so if a parent is posed with that choice, they don't have a choice. They have to buy their daughter the bat. You can't play lacrosse without a lacrosse stick, you can't play field hockey without the field Like. You have to have the bat. And so, time and time again, if you're, if they're, presented between choosing, they're not going to choose the mental skills program for $500, unless you can show them the value is worth more than the physical back. Now keep in mind my worst launches, my worst most like I'm sobbing my eyes out Cause I've paid for Facebook ads my worst performing launches are in January. After doing this for six years, I know now why because that's when their dues are due. All of these families are literally right after Christmas they're chunking out thousands of dollars in dues. It's like we are not launching in January anymore. So it's like know your audience, know what they're already spending, and then can you show them that value.

Speaker 1:

So, um, the $500 offer of the program when we increased it to lifetime access we've sent in Jana, you guys have seen like the behind the scenes of this is they don't know what they don't know. And so if you're trying to show them like you get lifetime access to a mental performance coach, if they've never said yes or experienced my coaching, that means nothing to them. And so if I can lower that price and say, hey, work with me for three months, which we're changing our marketing to 90 days because people want results. What is the? They don't want access to all your knowledge. They want point A to point B. How can you help my daughter? I can help your daughter in 90 days. Is that worth $300 to you? And our next launch that's coming up. I'm so excited because it's it's very simple, yes or no? Do you want me to help your daughter? Here's how I can help her inside the fearless warrior program and as it stands right now, six years later, I'm back down to closer to $200 and I'm really happy with it. So that's where I'm at as far as teams go.

Speaker 1:

I don't, jason. I don't think I started out $500. I think a zoom used to be like 250 or 300, but again, like as you get better at what you do, I think here's another benefit for everyone listening and everyone on this call what I have loved about creating a community of talking with other friends and other mental performance coaches. You know I have spoken with friends and other mental performance coaches. You know I have spoken with friends that have contracted with UCLA. I've had friends that have contracted with Florida. I've had friends that have contracted with huge corporations and what you start to realize is, if we can all elevate the space, there's a going rate. If we can all elevate the space, there's a going rate.

Speaker 1:

And if we undercharge, people aren't going to perceive the value to the point where we've seen it in our mastermind. There's a myth out there of like don't charge anything, get your feet wet, don't charge anything. I don't agree with that, because what happens is the word gets out of like oh, you know, she's gonna go talk to your team for free. They're not gonna value what's free. And then when they refer you to their friends, they're gonna be honest with their friends and they're gonna tell them oh, I didn't have to pay for this, so you're gonna run up against that if we don't charge any money. And then, if we don't charge enough, people are gonna perceive you as well. Enough people are going to perceive you as well. Does she really know what she's doing if she's not charging enough?

Speaker 1:

And we think about the alternative. A lot of my clients, especially those that have faced the yips, their alternative is to find a clinical counselor in an office setting that they're going to submit to insurance. That is very easily going to charge $200 to $300 for a session. And so my advice to you guys is when you start to understand that we're elevating the profession as a whole. It's okay to charge for your value.

Speaker 1:

Now, if you're starting out, I'm not saying you have to charge $500 or $125 for a session, which I do. Half hour sessions, um, how can you provide that value? So, instead of charging two to $300 for a session, I can get a lot accomplished in 30 minutes. I can get that price point down without sacrificing a full hour of my time. Again, I'm working with 10 to 12 year olds is my sweet spot, um, so there's like a lot of nuggets in there for you guys of like I've had the imposter syndrome. I had no idea what to charge. But now, after creating this community, I think there's something really beautiful about being transparent and that's my. That was my whole goal of this podcast. Today is like I'm going to have clients that are going to listen to this and I just I want to be transparent around pricing and I think the more transparent we are, I think we have more confidence in what we're charging.

Speaker 2:

I think you're not only being transparent, but you're just being authentic and telling your story the way it is, which is great. It's it's what we all want to hear about. Yeah, yeah, sure, thank you.

Speaker 1:

Okay, I'm looking at the, the google doc. This is a little bit longer than I intended. Do you guys have any like closing questions? I feel like Jason's question is like we have like that would be a great one to end on. What do we think? Should we go for it? Jason said Jason Sw, jason Swick, thank you for this. I loved reflecting on this. I think this will change a lot of perspectives. Um, he said, here's a topic suggestion I think is relative for most, no matter their season of business.

Speaker 1:

Challenging imposter syndrome. Every time one levels up, there are feelings of do I have what it takes at this level? Then doubt starts to rear its ugly head. But speaking truth into the value one brings to the table is much needed and so, jason, thank you so much for asking this question.

Speaker 1:

I tell this story to everyone I can and it's a great one to end on, and it's the lifeguard analogy. A business mentor of mine that literally was standing on a beach, not when he said this, but during that event. He said if you're walking along a beach and somebody is crashing in the waves and they're drowning, you don't look around on the beach and say who am I to save them? I'm not a lifeguard you would get in and I think about all the athletes that I don't care about softball, I don't care about your sport, I care about you.

Speaker 1:

And every time imposter syndrome creeps in I know that I have saved lives. I've had athletes in tears, on calls where we've set the sport aside and we've had life-changing conversations and you know to me that's why I do what I do, and so anytime you get an imposter thought that creeps in like your people need you, your people need you you. Ah, supposed to be like a light ending, that felt kind of heavy, but thank you guys for being here. And um, do you guys have any closing thoughts or takeaways from today's conversation?

Speaker 4:

I just I think it's really easy to um think that other people that are further along in the business like don't have these struggles. It's the same thing that, like when you ask athletes and they're like I thought I was the only one, and so it's just refreshing to to hear even though I know some of these stories like to hear them again and be like, yeah, she's, she's been in it, which makes me trust you more with my vulnerabilities, my, my business, my learning and growing, because you have been in it and it's just. I just appreciate your, your transparency and authenticity, because we all have these struggles If we're working in this space, no matter how, how big or what impact you you have, or how many followers or teams or whatever.

Speaker 1:

So I just really appreciate that it's a good reminder. Yeah, and you don't have to have a lot of followers to make a lot of money. I just want to like debunk that myth too.

Speaker 3:

The other thing I wanted to add into in wrapping is just how important like a mentor and a buddy and a colleague and like a friend in this process really is like for us. And just you know, hearing Lucinda say like, oh you know, I wanted to be her friend, blah, blah, like, same like, and and whether that was, you know, because of the way ABU showed up in the Facebook group, is where I think I first like saw you serve others and or then on Instagram, like, just you know, as Christy said, like being yourself and authentic and and though it felt like at first for me, like before I reached out, like, oh you know, would someone's view me as a competitor? Like should I, can I, should I not ask these questions? Because I shouldn't be, they shouldn't, they're not going to want to share with me, they're not going to help me, because what if I took away and and that's the wrong mindset and it was, you know, certainly not what I have come up against every time I've like been brave enough to ask because it's I did a reel about this Like it's not a slice of pizza, like and it's not, it's not gone Right and it's shared and it's it's wealth and it's not scarcity, and so you know, I just have appreciated that so much of um.

Speaker 3:

You know your mentorship, but then also like meeting others and theirs and the way that we help one another and share across sports and across experiences, because there's so much value, whether that's your very first client or very first team or you've been doing this for years, and so, um, hearing these things again for many of them and some new, like I've just as listen to, said, like reaffirmed so many pieces. But you know the one thing that if hearing this is helpful to you, the person listening, as a med performance coach, like find more people to talk to, because every conversation will be just as rich find more people to talk to, because every conversation will be just as rich.

Speaker 1:

Amen. I was going to add um, we haven't talked about it recently, but the mastermind has three core values. It's literally collaboration over competition, impact over income and radical transparency. Like that is, that is what I craved, that I wasn't getting in other things. And like, selfishly, I've loved this because we're all mental performance coaches, and so it's like I've been, I've paid for insane masterminds where, like people are like pet photographers or like nutritionists and all these things, and like it's just a fresh breath air of like a rising tide lifts all boats and like I'm so thankful for you guys and some of you I just connected with today, so let's, let's do this. I'm so pumped, amazing. Okay, we're going to. It's the top of the hour, so we're going to post this on YouTube.

Speaker 1:

Um, I have a call to action for you guys. I would be a bad business coach and mental performance coach if I didn't teach you something else. Is that when you provide value, there's also something really important, that, if you see the value in this, my call to action for you is like reach out, dm me and I do this also for a living and I help other mental performance coaches do what I do and I've invested in masterminds and selfishly I wanted to create a mental performance coach mastermind and so, if you love this episode, I would love to hear your feedback. Um, we are opening spots. We are in our fourth cohort of the mastermind and so it's kind of invite only. We've kind of just done a group of coaches. We cap it very small and we have some spots opening.

Speaker 1:

So if this resonated with you at all, send me a DM, even if you're not interested in coaching right now. Like, whatever questions come up for you, we can do more of these episodes. I can point you to some resources. But yeah, I liked what Janet said of like it's important to invest back in your craft, whether that's learning more with Brian Kane or with a peer group or a paid mastermind, whatever that is. There's so much that we can do to elevate the space. That's a wrap. Thanks, guys.

Speaker 5:

Thank you so much.

Speaker 2:

That was awesome, thank you.

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