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The Business Lounge Podcast with Kim & Chris
Welcome to The Business Lounge Podcast! Each week we'll share proven marketing strategies to help you build an audience of buyers, create impactful content, and grow a profitable business without compromising on your values with your host, Kimberly Ann Jimenez!
Kim is an Online Marketing Strategist, Educator, Founder and Thought Leader in the online marketing industry.
Having worked with 33K+ small business owners & entrepreneurs across an array of industries over the past decade, Kimberly and her business partner Chris Michael Harris are obsessed with helping you level up your marketing game, and grow your bottom line.
They co-lead their flagship program, The Business Lounge, which teaches business owners & entrepreneurs like you how to navigate the confusing & often overwhelming world of online marketing and build an unapologetically profitable business on your own terms (and without compromising your faith, your family or your freedom).
Join us at thebusinesslounge.co
The Business Lounge Podcast with Kim & Chris
The Marketing Game has Changed...FOREVER
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The online business game has completely changed—and in this episode, we're breaking down what’s really working right now! If you’re ready to simplify, pivot, and actually thrive in this new era of business, this episode is your blueprint. Let’s go!
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Welcome to the Business Lounge Podcast
KimWhat's up, Amelia? It's Kim and Chris and you're listening to the Business Lounge Podcast.
ChrisIn each episode, we'll break down all the latest in online marketing, give you all the deets on what's working now to turn your content into customers, boost your leads and sales and scale your business fast.
KimAll without compromising on what you care about most faith, family and freedom. And listen, it's all real, raw and unfiltered. So let's start the show. What's up guys? Welcome back to the show. I'm here with Chris, who is my amazing co-host.
KimHi and I'm super pumped. I mean, we are bringing a whole new season to the Business Knowledge Podcast and it's going to be fun're going to talk. Listen, we've been talking to you guys for a while. We get a lot of feedback from y'all via text message, via chat, etc. Um, and I asked you guys last year if you would like it if I brought on a new segment, kind of like a new direction to the show, where we talk about what's working right now to grow an online business, how all these crazy economic trends, political trends, cultural shifts are impacting the online space, and you said a resounding absolutely yes. I even asked if you would like me to do it with Chris and everyone was like please have Chris on which was awesome, thank you.
KimSo we're excited we're launching this show now on YouTube as well.
Chriswell, we've been doing the podcast since yeah like 2017, I think subscribe to the new podcast channel please do we need all the subscribers um which? Was kind of a which was kind of like a bummer, because we were just we were just going to upload it to kim's we were, and then like consolidate the power, you know, and like it was, like we. We work with, uh, a strategist and he was like no, you need to start new channels for all these things.
KimAnd I was like.
ChrisNo, oh man, it's like you climb Everest. You know, I know, and you're like I almost had 100,000 subscribers on Kim's channel and then it's like no, back to base camp.
KimBack to base camp.
ChrisSweet sweet.
KimIt's like great, no, but we're excited. Um, I think that's part of what's working right now. Chris, if, if we're talking about trends and things that are shifting, video has always been something we've encouraged our clients to do forever and ever, and we've been doing coaching for 10 plus years, if you guys have been following along, but for those of you who are new, video has always been our thing. We've done video for a really long time and we wanted to just capitalize on this new trend. I feel like everyone is really crushing right now with video and especially video podcasts. I think they're absolutely the future. I've been saying in some of our newsletters that we've sent out if you're not part of the email list, there's going to be a link below the description. You're not going to want to miss it. They're really good. But essentially, I've been telling you guys, if you're subscribed to the newsletter, that, dude, the election was won through podcast it was like that's a big deal and because we talk youtube uh, about youtube, because we talk so much about content creation.
KimThere are are some serious shifts. I follow political campaigns really closely. People are like, oh gosh, bless your heart. But listen, they're the highest funded marketing campaigns in the world.
ChrisWe'd be foolish not to.
KimAbsolutely. So I'm always looking and paying attention to like, okay, what is this campaign doing right? What is that campaign doing right? And there's so much that I feel like we can learn from online businesses. And so, like, I'm going to treat you guys like adults. I don't want to hear in the comments oh, you're talking about politics. Well, listen, it's 2025. So, like, this is the conversation and we're going to talk about it, we're not going to be like a lot of people in the online space it's true.
ChrisWho?
Kimare just like can't sing anything.
ChrisThey wouldn't even say the word politics, the p word, get out of here the p word, p word.
KimI don't know if that actually happened, by the way I just made that up, but it's but.
ChrisBut if you know the energy in the online space, that's the energy you know, it's probably real so we're gonna be real.
KimI, I don't have time, you don't have time, to kind of like beat around the bush and sort of wink at it. I'm like no, I'm, I'm just going to tell you like it is.
ChrisIt's too. There was a notable person that was basically kind of dismissing the importance of following politics as it relates to growing your business like it was some kind of distraction.
KimFor sure.
ChrisBut if you lived the last four years, you know that politics had a pretty significant impact on your life and on your business. And I think also too it did impact a cultural shift. And I think also too it did impact a cultural shift.
KimA hundred percent.
ChrisI think it's foolish to deny that, and so you know. Sure you can put your head in the sand, and I do think there's a degree of overconsumption, I do think there's a degree of getting a little bit obsessive with it. But to not at least be educated about what's happening or aware, I think you quickly fall out of touch. Yep, I don't think. And especially in a marketing capacity, you need to be able to speak to where people are at all the time.
ChrisAnd so I think, if you disengage from that to such a degree and keep your distance from that to the point that you have no idea what's going on, even the industry leaders have fallen out of touch, and I think they may not admit that because they probably don't even realize.
KimThat's the problem with falling out of touch you don't realize it until you're like wait what happened yeah, and Chris, we've been having these conversations behind the scenes with our community for four years and they've all been like, oh my, because we have an internal, we had an internal podcast yeah we just transitioned it to being like let's just release it to everybody.
Chrisyeah, why are we Exclusive too?
Kimyeah, Well like we were getting all these people who are like, hey, this podcast
Why We're Going Public and Partnering
Kimwas so mind-blowing and so real. I feel like if you guys post it publicly, it would benefit so many people. Because we went there Plus they're like I'm trying to actually share it with my friends and I can't because it's behind a paywall.
ChrisYeah.
KimSo we're like, you know what it's so true.
ChrisLet's just be who we are behind the scenes. We got a fancy new sign. We got a studio and a new behind door number one. Shout out to lc sign. Shout out to yeah, lc tony, tony yeah, no, it was awesome we mounted it on this black.
KimUh, if you're listening, you're not gonna what the heck we're talking about. He said we. He means he we.
ChrisIt was a we effort here but so this piece of uh, it's just um plywood, yeah, and then we painted it black and then mounted it to. It turned out really cool, but it might be flickering. We got to work on the camera.
KimSorry if it's like a little flickery.
ChrisNow you're gonna notice. Sorry I shouldn't have told you. Stop noticing, um, but yeah, so we, we just you know, the brand overhaul I'm pointing to my hat if you're listening, not watching yeah, like, we just really felt like it was time to, as kim says, that we're gonna talk about throughout this episode. Probably many of you may be. We hear often, like you guys are hidden gems, and I'm just repeating what people say.
ChrisI'm not saying that that's true or not true, but we spent a lot of time building the business side of things the last eight to 10 years, like let's make money. You guys know, kim, what we're all about. Right, we're about profitability over popularity and not just being popular on the internet, and that involves making money. And so it has come to a point, though, where it's like we've really done that well and it's time we start building the brand, and so we figured out a way to kind of like make them all play together, obviously with me being involved. We're gonna talk about that. Why the heck am I here all the time now, like, why is Chris all of?
Kima sudden going to be a part of this? No, no, yeah, I think a lot of people have questions and listen. You know if you're new and you don't care about the behind the scenes.
ChrisYeah, just zoom through. Timestamp it.
KimWe have timestamps Like please just go through the trends and the things that are new that are happening, but this is for, like our existing folks, people who are changed in our company. We need to do a whole episode about that. But essentially, chris was running solo for many years, I was running solo for many years as well, and we always collaborated on the background, always.
ChrisWe were basically partners. You know what I mean. That's the part people didn't see. It's like we were always like unofficial partners regardless.
KimSo you, since the start of the Business Lounge, which was our membership. Now it's called TBL Academy and we have our whole entire brand is called the business lounge.
ChrisYeah, it just became a company.
KimBut in the early days of like baby TBL, Chris was always doing coaching calls with me because they were very overwhelming.
ChrisI don't think I've ever missed one. Literally Even when I was traveling I did a remote with Kim A hundred percent, so it's kind of like I've always been there, so you've been there for like hundreds of coaching calls yeah, just not publicly all the time.
KimAnd then in your membership. I've been a part of that and when you had the book club and we started sharing a lot of our clients, a lot of the people who were in the TBL membership were also in Chris's book club.
ChrisAnd then you were doing coaching and we're like what are we doing just separate? Yeah, we're going to have a whole episode about couplepreneurship and how to work with your spouse, or even if you're an entrepreneur and your spouse is not, how to support the other person, and obviously that's not our capacity. But we have a lot of clients that we engage with where the partner's not an entrepreneur.
ChrisAnd so there's some things that we've picked up along the way, like how to support that person through going through that, Like it's. You know, it's a lot, it's a lot. So, yeah, we'll probably talk about that too. There's so many topics we can cover. That's the I think that's the exciting part about making this public facing now.
KimFor sure, and so, essentially, long story short, we really felt like God was leading us to partner and that my brother came in and so he was running his own company as well. So we've basically partnered and, um, chris and I, we're now the business lounge together. So we had a lot of people we're like are you kim and co? Are you kim and chris?
Chrisyeah, what is happening here, confusing to everybody, I was like no, including us.
KimSometimes we're just we're the business lounge together. Chris has his own website, I have my own website he has his own, I have my own channel, and then we're collaborating here.
ChrisYeah, so if you know, like John and Lisa Bevere, or you know, chip and Joanna Gaines, like, think, both their personal brands, but they all serve the greater good of the business that they support, right? So, like Magnolia or Messenger International, like so that's kind of the dynamic that we're borrowing from them. Shout out to their mentorship in that regard of like cool, how do these two play together but serve the same thing? And that's what we're doing.
KimMentorship from afar.
ChrisMentorship from afar, all right. Hopefully not from afar always. That'd be cool to know them.
KimYeah, that's true. That's true. All right, so end of our banter. Are you getting ready to talk about all the shifts? Yes, all.
ChrisYes, all right, so we've got a whole list. Guys, we actually covered this. I'm curious to see, because this was a few months ago now I pulled this from. We hosted a workshop inside of TBL Academy, which is our self-study program, shameless plug and so we're going to go over some of these not all of these, this was like a two-hour thing, so we're going to go over some of these.
KimThe online space. Everything has changed, everything has changed and if you're still operating with a 2019 mentality, you're going to get left behind. It's just not going to work. So we're seeing right now, 50%, I would say, of our clients are having probably record months right now, like they're, they're making more than they did pre pandemic. And then we have another 50% of clients who we've been telling for the past few years you need to pivot, you need to pivot, you need to pivot. Now they're really feeling the pain of not staying ahead of the game of these trends, and so we want, as a cautionary tale, to like be like hey, let's talk about all the things, let's be transparent about what's actually happening in the online space, let's have the conversation that no one's willing to have.
ChrisYeah.
KimAnd talk about all the shifts, but also talk about the opportunity, because I don't know about you, chris, but I'm more excited about online business than I have been in a very long time.
ChrisI think that goes without saying.
KimI think we've been.
ChrisAnd a lot of it has to do with what we call the old way versus the new way.
KimExactly.
ChrisAlignment, the old way of running a business like this, of marketing a business like this. It was so tedious, it was so arduous, it was so dynamic. There's so many moving parts and pieces. You couldn't tell people you sold something too fast because they're like, ew, gross. And it's like, well, we used to have to tell people all the time. Would you walk into a Walmart and be offended that they tried to sell you something? And you'd be like, no, of course, like you're there with that intention, right, and yet, for whatever stupid reason, when you get online, it's like how dare he sell something? And I don't understand why. That was the coming from the offline space, because my first business was offline, just a traditional moving and installation business. Like if you're not selling, you're dead, you know. But man, you get into the online space and it gets, so it got was so weird. It was like you went to somebody's personal brand website. You didn't know what the heck they did there was nothing to buy nothing to buy.
ChrisThere was no shop page you had to like start here.
KimAnd it was like a resource list a resource list and then Y'all remember the start here, pages.
ChrisMaybe six years later you get introduced that they actually sell something Right and it's $12. And then you, three years later, introduced to another thing, you buy that's $99. And it's like man, you're going to monetize these people after a decade. So for me, again coming into this world, I'm like this is crazy, like this isn't business. What is this? So, for me, I prefer this. It's straightforward, it's cut and dry, it's do you have what I'm looking for? I want to grow my business. Hence I find somebody to help me grow my business. What do you have to offer? Boom, clean, dunzo, transactional. Now that doesn't mean that
Major Shifts in the Online Business Space
Chrisyou can't also provide value. You can also have be an attractive character to your specific ideal client avatar, like all those things exist. But man, everything behind walls and everything was so secretive and tongue-in-cheek, I don't know.
KimIt was just weird there was just a lot of complicated things too, like you have to set funnels and automations and autoresponders and five trillion drips of campaigns and um we did all this email at this time and then you, you split test.
ChrisThat.
KimIt's like, oh my gosh in fairness, though, we've made millions of dollars yes, with the old way. With the old way, it was just hard, the old way still pseudo works, so we're going to talk about adapting it. Um, but you cannot stay stuck in the old way or like your business is not going to do anything. Even yesterday, sorry, what were you going to say?
ChrisWe've been saying you can't sell a 2019 offer. No, it's true, they're dead. Like you got to move on, you got to adapt. I was telling one of our clients yesterday I was like you have to divorce the old way. Like you are still like clinging to parts of it and so much of it has adapted. Now, like kim said, there are ways that it were. We are hybrid, hybridizing. I made that word out.
KimThat's not really, I mean, if you had already figured. I made that word up um, but yeah, but yeah, I think like yesterday in coaching, literally yesterday, um, I had a client who was like oh my gosh, kim, you have been telling us this for the longest time me and chris, she dropped a podcast from Amy Porterfield and Jenna Kutcher.
KimThey were talking about how organic traffic is dead and how they're pivoting and shifting their whole businesses, and it's the same thing we were talking about in the Sam Card Mastermind back in February. So we went to top 40 online sellers.
ChrisYeah, we got a plaque. Oh yeah, we did. Where are my thumb there? We go boom right there. Yeah, that's for processing yeah multiple seven figures.
KimI know that feels like a humble brag, but a little bit of a humble brag it's the truth, um, so anyway, what was really eye-opening for me was how so many people in that space had built huge audiences right, and I think they were still I think, in many ways are still running in the same exact way they always have. You know, they're still basically operating with like a not even a 2019 mentality, almost like a 2015 mentality. Yeah, it's true um and so, like new seasons, y'all require new skills you have to upskill can you talk about, though, why some of that happened?
Chrisyes, let's do that. That it did, because it's for sure there's reasons for there are reasons for it.
KimSo the first one we've been talking about these three major um shifts in the market, but I think the first one is Amazon culture.
ChrisYeah.
KimSo pre pandemic.
ChrisAmazon brain is what I call it.
KimExactly we were. We were still like the the general public had not yet fully adopted online commerce.
ChrisNo, like we have.
KimYeah, I feel like the online space is always like 10, 15 years ahead, sometimes at the market pre pandemic. Yeah, but then the pandemic hit and everyone was closed and amazon you know, was making money hand over fist. A lot of the behaviors that we saw in the pandemic of like ordering everything online. I mean we saw people who never bought regular things from amazon in our family start ordering beds and mattresses and like their toothbrush and toilet paper and we're like what?
ChrisFor real, for real. That's not exaggerate, that's not hyperbole, that's for real.
KimAnd that those behaviors really like they how do I say this? Like, let me say that again, these behaviors stuck around after the pandemic.
ChrisYeah.
KimAnd a lot of what we see in the online space with like multiple funnels and having to warm people up and build a lot of relationship. That happened because we were trying to actually correct essentially the disconnect between the physical commerce space and the online commerce space. People still had a lot of skepticism around giving their credit card to a random website and getting scammed and you know having a business, kind of like take your money and disappear, because those things happened with online businesses.
KimLet's not act like we're you know like online in general, right right and so now people are like I want what you offer and I want it now. I don't want to wait to find out what you sell in your seven day email sequence. I don't want to go through a huge launch and maybe six months from now when you open the cart buy. I want to buy today. Yeah.
ChrisAnd some of that is just a natural progression of a market, so obviously Amazon brain was a big part of it. People got accustomed to spending money on the internet but it was only an acceleration, and there wasn't the fear.
ChrisYeah, so it accelerated and it normalized, being like, oh yeah, sure, now, honestly, we do things and I don't think we think about how weird it is. Yeah, so for us, many of us in our generation, like uber is hitchhiking with a smartphone, let's call it what it is. You know, airbnb is literally squatting, but you're just paying the person to squat in a bedroom. You, you know what I mean. Like it's weird. And so a lot of these catalyzed and normalized the marketplace and we can benefit from that because people are less unwilling to spend money on the internet. But then the second part of it and there's more. But the second part of it is the natural progression of a marketplace. So the reason now is they've been through the webinars, they've gone through the sales emails, they've applied, they know you're pitching something at the end, so it just feels inauthentic. Yeah, when you're like, oh, but wait till the end there's a surprise, a bonus.
Chrisyou know, like they know it's coming, and that doesn't mean it's not effective as a mechanism, but it means that they're less willing to exhaust calories, because they've heard it a billion trillion times, and so getting out ahead of it and having layers of specificity is really important, because people need to know what you do and who you do it for, and if they don't know those two things, within like I'm talking seconds, they're gone.
ChrisThey're going to find somebody else that actually is communicating that well, and so we're seeing stupid things work, like putting a vsl on youtube or running ads directly to something that usually we would have been like. Now, now, six months of warming you up on our email list, you know like those are things that would have been required before, and now it's like dude, I know I don't have the, I don't have the appetite for it. Just tell me what you do and who you do it for. I just want to know, like, what's the format? How much is it? So the hard part about that? It's easier, right? It's easier to get to your audience.
KimThe hard part is that it's easier. No, no, no.
ChrisThe easy part is that. The easier part is that you can go direct. The harder part is now the benefit of having the old way
Amazon Culture and Trust Barometer
Chrisand extrapolating this out and having the two-hour webinar and the seven days of emails is you could slowly kind of work through your sales process your messaging your different buyer types, all the things that we preach and teach, right, you know.
ChrisBuilding in scarcity, uh, or working with the deadline. So if just going evergreen alone, you're removing the deadline potentially unless you create a deadline or create scarcity, and so now you have to truncate those mechanisms into like small window yeah, of opportunity.
KimYou have to know what your message is. You have to be clear about it.
ChrisYou have to communicate it fast yeah, and so a lot of people think we're just like hey, just go direct and sell on the internet and they think there's no strategy involved and a thousand percent. I don't want to say it's harder. It's easier tech wise, but it can be somewhat harder if you don't know what you're doing. To communicate the message you need to communicate in the smaller timeframe that you have to do, it's only harder if you don't have the tools and you don't have the framework. So that's basically it.
KimIf you're just trying to wing it. It's harder.
ChrisYeah.
KimBut here's what I really really like, chris, and I think you mentioned something that was really important. Kind of going back a little bit, you mentioned that you know we do weird things on the internet.
ChrisYeah.
KimOr we just do weird things as a society right, we're weird, we're just weird.
ChrisHumans are weird.
KimBut I remember five years ago getting someone to give us their credit card and put it on our website was a scary thing for them.
ChrisYeah, super.
KimAnd that's part of why we love SamCart, are you saving this?
ChrisYeah, right.
KimIt's a secure checkout. We had to let them know we don't save any data on our website.
ChrisIt's stored securely through Stripe, even for email opt-ins. You had to put that Remember. We will never share your yeah.
KimNow, literally, our clients are like you. Have my card on file.
ChrisI don't want to, but thousands, thousands of dollars. We're not talking like renew me for 15 bucks.
KimThey don't want to have to put their credit card details. They're just like it's saved, you know. So, that's just one way in which we're seeing behavior shift and really this isn't something that we're saying, oh my gosh, like this is the new way. It's like, no, we're looking at behavioral patterns in the market. The market was not ready five years ago to say, charge my card, like if you charge a card without someone's explicit consent, there would be a chargeback and there would be problems.
KimNow it's like people are used to doing that, and so that's, I think, one of the biggest shifts that a lot of online businesses have not caught up to yet. They're still working in the old way. I think the second one is really interesting too, and this is all about trust y'all. So Edelman barometer came out two years ago, almost three years ago, 2022. It's like a trust barometer, and they do.
ChrisHow do they measure stuff like that? Polls yeah, they just ask questions. It has to be just polling.
KimSo Gallup poll actually Edelman was this year, gallup poll was in 2022. Edelman's 2025 trust barometer is showing that trust is eroding. Is showing that trust is eroding Like we've had issues with trust, especially with how the pandemic was mishandled and all the conspiracies that became true.
ChrisCareful, we're releasing this on YouTube.
KimRight and how. People don't trust institutions, they don't trust big government, they don't trust big tech. They don't trust big corporations, big ag, you know, know pharma all of these institutions that people used to trust. Now they're asking big questions out, and so in a lot of ways, I feel like that has catapulted and created opportunity for the online space, in that there is a bigger appetite for content consumption from independent totally sources right citizen journalism Citizen journalism, like you're seeing the Independent podcasts.
KimExactly. You're seeing the explosion of podcasts, the explosion of newsletters and independent publications like Substack just erupting All of a sudden. Newsletters are a thing again in the online space.
ChrisYeah, it's crazy.
KimWe're like what so consumption? The appetite for content has never been higher. The problem is that we're in a really weird socioeconomic cultural moment, and I feel like online business hasn't caught up completely to that yet, and so they're still creating content like it's 2019 with, like the PC, ultra polished.
ChrisYeah.
KimLook at my life. It's perfect aesthetic beautiful right here's my lunch and then, um, it's overly produced yeah you know we have like yeah, 12 angles yeah in like 2019, let's say 2018, where it's like oh, you have to spend two hundred thousand dollars to have your course yeah overly produced by a company and they're it's gotta look super incredible like the production bar was really high yeah, you had to hire scorsese to put your your course out and now it's like guys here's me on my iphone.
KimPeople want exactly they want raw and real and that's what they connect to, because mainstream media has been lying to us for so many years and all these you know talking heads and pundits just the lies are so ridiculous that people are like I just want to talk to a small business, I want to talk to a creator, like they're my friend.
ChrisI don't know if you guys are aware of this, but we're big. Well, I'm Kim via osmosis, big comic book, movie, TV show fans.
KimYeah, kim, via osmosis, she's married to me she has no choice. I love them, though they're awesome. She does. Don't let her fool you, I'm not a hyper nerd, but I really enjoy them.
ChrisSo I was a massive fan of I'm less now because it is kind of dark but the Daredevil TV series and what's crazy is so if you don't know the history behind it. The show launched on Netflix. It had three seasons. It was really really like had like a cult following. It got canceled and then there was like a huge petition, like millions of signatures. The actors even got involved with sharing the link to the changeorg. Seriously, it was a whole thing. Somebody like created a URL, save daredevil anyways. So they got it saved. Disney got, you know, procured the rights to it and made another season. They just came out. I think it's great, like I personally like it. But the crazy thing about it is and I'm bringing it home here kim was looking at me like land the plane no I'm not land the plane, I'm not, so I feel the look.
ChrisOkay, I won't look at you, I go down rabbit holes and she's like Chris, land it, land, land, land. That's what she's going to do.
KimStart like this Just hand gesture when I need to shut up when you guys see me doing this. Yeah, that's what she means.
ChrisChris stop. But what's crazy is that people are complaining because it feels overly produced and it's too cgi and they like the old gritty feel of the original daredevil. And we went back and watched some of the episodes, guys, they didn't even use like camera stabilizers, like literally the camera's like shaky on shots that are not supposed, like not like a jason bourne thing, where it's like intentionally shaky, it's like no, it's just low budget, it's very authentic, it feels real and so the more that ai becomes a thing in the world which is going to be the case, it's going to feel buttoned up and pretty and perfect and unfortunately, people are going to start to identify that as not real real and if you think I'm lying history repeats itself or if you think I'm exaggerating, look what happened.
ChrisPeople started figuring out that there was like robo calls or they were actually talking to chatting with a. They would be representative. Representative. You know, like a bot. You know that we push back on things that aren't real. It's just history, it's it's proving that over and over again. And so when ai starts pretending to be real and you start seeing pictures that are fake like I was listening to him and I've been listening to these awesome youtube videos from, like Billy Graham or Napoleon Hill and then the other day I'm listening to a Napoleon Hill.
ChrisNapoleon Hill, I'm doing air quotes and literally he's like in the days of blogging and social media. I'm like what?
Kimthis is not real, this is AI. And then we did a little bit of research and we were like I actually ran it by Grok. I was like, like Grok, I have a feeling this is AI. Can you like scrape it and let me know.
ChrisYeah.
KimAnd I was like yeah, absolutely, it is AI.
ChrisIt's AI. Here's why it's tapped this way, I'm like what. Yeah. So I listened to this whole thing and I was so connected to the message or Billy Graham, but people were calling him like a false teacher in the comments about Billy Graham. What? Yeah, because it said something that wasn't necessarily scripturally accurate, biblically accurate.
KimSo we have a problem.
ChrisAnd so people in the comments were calling out Billy Graham, and it wasn't even Billy Graham, it was just something that was a creation of AI, and so we've yet to see a lot of that.
KimYeah, that's going to push more, but wait until people are getting framed for crimes.
Christo see a lot of that, yeah, but wait until people are getting framed for crimes or there's I mean for real, for real, like it could get nasty with ai, like we haven't seen the nefarious use case yet I mean, we have a black hat small scale yeah, but like you know, hacking accounts, like it's going to happen, uh, and we have to figure that out as a society how we're going to counter that.
ChrisBut the point is bringing landing the plane. The point is, is that as we start associating not just the distrust in mainstream, buttoned up, overly produced now ai included in that camp the more people are going to be like I like this because it feels real. I like this because it feels cozy we're talking about cozy content um, I like this because it feels human and I think we're going to start choosing human because it's relatable, has a soul.
KimYeah, a lot of stuff doesn't feel like it has a soul yeah, and I think that that absolutely moves us into third shift, which is very obvious. It's ai right, yeah, um, I feel like the last two years have been crazy and really it didn't really start, I think, impacting as much online businesses, uh, up until probably like six months ago maybe longer.
KimYeah, I would say the fall of 2024, fall 24, that's when everyone was like, oh my gosh, and it was weird because we thought, oh, it's the election and it was. A big part of that was the election, it was both but another part of it that I don't think anyone is really talking about that much. Until recently, as, like dude, the value proposition has changed. It's not information anymore.
KimYou know if you are selling courses, you have to pivot. You have to change your business model to include something else that is more value, because people can, just they just don't want to go through. You know 50 videos in your course and members area. They want answers now not more information, and so we've been saying this answer is not information for like two years, but now it's actually like hitting critical mass. We were talking about it in the context of content. Now it's like oh, it's also your offers.
KimYou know you can't just stay stuck in the old way, and so that's really what we've been working on is helping our clients transition their business, pivot their business we've pivoted our own business massively. The lord, because that is where I feel like spiritual discernment really comes into play. Yeah, not that I'm trying to say, oh, look at us, we're so awesome. No, y'all like we can be idiots just like everyone else.
ChrisAnd the holy we wouldn't have done it in our own strength, for sure we couldn't have. We wouldn't have seen this.
KimNo, it was spirit led the holy spirit just kept nudging us and leading us, like, hey, I remember clearly 2022, you have to start a coaching program. And I remember I had no idea who was going to help us do that, because I've never done that and you've been telling us we have to do this.
KimPeople are ready for the next thing and I don't know what that needs to look like, but we have to figure it out. And so we went out, hired Jennifer Allwood who's incredible, one of my business coaches and mentors and she showed us how to do it and we crushed, but it was hard and it was scary, and I think that's can you speak to that.
KimLike can you speak to the fear sometimes that people uh experience when they're having to change things, when so many things are changing at once, cause we're seeing that with our clients and it's challenging, it's a lot.
ChrisYeah, it's a lot. Um, I mean, obviously the biggest piece of advice that I think him mentioned is you got to stay prayed up. Um, stayed up and prayed up, because if not, man, you're gonna look back. I mean, at best you're gonna be second in the race at best, and there's
AI Impact and Value Proposition Changes
Chrisa lot of ways. And again, you know, this is not us, this is not us driving in our own strength.
ChrisHere we were ahead in many ways, saying things years ago that, honestly, at the time, were very much rejected by by even our clients, that now we're like, oh my gosh, you're right and it's like well, you like well, we're just messengers, we're just communicating things that we're downloading, that we're receiving, and so I think that's the number one part is, you gotta stay connected to source. We're entering into an era where it's now more important than ever, because we guys, within a very short period of time, are not gonna be the most intelligent beings on this planet any planet, I mean.
ChrisI think we're there, and we're probably there Right. And so the value, not only is the value proposition shifted, but you have to tap into a different state of being, you have to be a spirit being, you have to utilize your spiritual gifts. You know for, for, basically, since the industrial revolution, if we're being candid intelligence, the seek, the seeking of being candid intelligence, the seeking of and the acquisition of intelligence or furthering intelligence, was our entire paradigm, it was our entire focus.
ChrisIt's where we Developing the intellect, developing the intellect, and I'm not saying that we're going to go back to, you know, being hillbillies and not knowing anything Like that's not what I'm saying but we stopped flexing the spirit muscle. We stopped. And I remember hearing from people you know it's good to be cultured in here from people from other places in the world, but like there's people in, like Nigeria, for example, that they declare things I mean the way they pray is very different than the way we pray in this country and they speak with authority. I mean they like and they actually see miracles. Like one of them said I don't remember who, I don't remember where I saw it. You see a lot of content on the internet.
ChrisBut he said people in America say that why don't we see miracles like we used to see in the Bible in today's era? And he's like it has nothing to do with God not showing up. It has everything to do with you not praying that way for those things to happen. God doesn't show up because you desire it. God shows up because you showed up first and you were declaring and praying and believing and then God showed up. And so I think we have to shift that because, at the end of the day, what is going to make us more valuable than anything else is having that spiritual discernment. That is our ultimate cheat code as beings. That's how God intended for us to be, and so we're trying to compete with chat TBT.
ChrisIt was funny because I used to joke and tell our clients I listened to books at 2.5 X on audible because my brain just moves really fast. Kim has to tell me all the time like stop. She told me today after a session. She's like stop going so fast. Like I would hate to be your brain, it's so fast.
KimAnd then would hate to be your brain. It's so fast and this is having it like that, though not like that.
Christhat's how I received it. I'm going so, oh my gosh, like how do you even keep up with that? I'm exhausted for you, and that's just always been my brain. I'm a d, d, d, d, d, d, uh, and then some more d and so for me, that's just how my brain operates. And so I joked and said I don't know if you watch the office, but the episode where Dwight is trying to compete with the website and he's like trying to make more sales on the website, that was like me with ChatGBT, trying to read books fast enough, and it's like it's impossible. You're not going to win that race, but you have spiritual giftings. Maybe they've been unearthed Like you don't even know they exist or what they are, and people are going to create that connection with you and it's going to give you certainty in a time of uncertainty.
KimI think that's huge. Yeah, I think that's already happening too, when Chris and I were talking last week and we were like what is the next evolution for human beings? And I absolutely agree it's a return. It's absolutely a return. It's not an evolution per se Restoration.
KimIt's a redemption of who we were actually meant to be. Yeah, I feel like we're seeing that even in the online space the last couple years. Like so many people are talking about their faith. You know that you would never we were some one of those be like. I don't think people would have ever guessed that I you know I'm a pastor's kid or that I was christian, um, and I think we all kind of felt the calling of like what have you been doing?
KimLike why are you leaving Jesus at the door? And I have a whole episode on that.
ChrisYeah, people comment on it all the time.
KimIt's crazy how all of us, at the same time, are getting the same message. And it's not like we're going to church together. You know like we don't know half these people.
ChrisWe're not sharing notes from Bible study.
KimExactly so that's really really powerful.
ChrisYeah, we've also been saying too the counter to AI is HR, human relationship and, I think, leaning into your people and what they want. So, for example, the client you were referring to earlier, it was like but what do your people want? Yep.
KimWhat are they asking for? What do?
Christhey actually want. So not only do we get the confirmation about coaching uh, group coaching and one-on-one coaching through being that being spirit led, right, but guys like, even if it wasn't that people were begging us, can I work with you? Guys one-on-one like, oh my gosh, can we do like we would do something where it was like one-on-one touch to us, not just membership stuff, and or like coaching calls, right, we would do code, we would do monthly coaching calls and they would go four hours and nobody would leave.
ChrisYeah, like, literally the drop-off was zero and we're not that interesting so it's like no, there's something here to this they're ready for for the next yeah, they're craving it and so we, so so the signs were there, uh, and sometimes we do a really bad job and and, uh, there's a, there's a principle around this. It's a paradox, but basically is like there's like a blindness that comes to you being in your situation and and not being outside of and looking in on your situation, and so maybe the power of you know, masterminding and coaches cause they help you overcome that paradox. Sometimes you know we do that, right, we see something in somebody else's business. Why are they doing that? It's like, dude, you're missing like 48 things that are so obvious to everybody else. But you right, and it says nothing about you. By the way, there's not an, you're not um deficit. You don't have a deficit in some way. It's an actual paradox.
ChrisIt happens to all of us, including us as coaches like we're, like, we're doing that and it's like, yeah, because you're blind to it, yeah, so some of it is just leaning in and being mindful of that and talking to your people, and always start with your person. Who's your ICA? What are they asking for? There's always a new opportunity, guys. Always, always, always and forever. There's always a new opportunity. There's always a new blue ocean. There's always something with AI. People are going to be underserved in a different way. And so what does that look like? And it's not saying the answer for you or everybody is oh well, kim and Chris are coaching. He's saying go be a coach, that's what we're saying no, please don't do that.
ChrisIt's not a it's. It's not a matter of copying the playbook. It's a matter of leaning into your people, because they'll help you dictate that, in conjunction with a healthy spiritual life, in, so that you have double confirmation.
KimExactly, I love that. That's awesome. All right, so should we close it here and start part two?
Chrisand get into specifics. No, you want to keep going, let's keep going. We're 40 minutes in, are, or do you want?
Kimto keep going, let's keep going. We're 40 minutes in, are you sure?
ChrisNo, we're not. We're actually not. We're not 40 minutes in. I think I started recording like 20 minutes before we actually did, so we got more time If it's up to this one, we'd be here for three hours. We'd be here for hours and hours and hours.
KimWell, I, want to test. This is the appetite for a long form.
ChrisDo you want us to do one hour long episode 30?
Kimminutes three hours.
ChrisWe're here for all of it, so let us know because I'm there why don't I do some quick rapid fire with you then about stuff that we talked about?
Kimlike he doesn't want to end the episode. Do you see him like? We'll see?
Christell us in the comments be like no shut up at 30 minutes, I have stuff to do, or hey you? Guys can talk and I'll stay, so let us know in the comments we can always break it down into part two if we need to break it down all right cool so we talked about relationship building um strategic alliances and finding and sticking with your tribe yeah, I think one thing too is like you cannot play scared in this season no if you're playing scared, you have to get your mind right.
KimYou have to get your mind right and I get it y'all. Especially as a woman, I think a lot of change and chaos doesn't sit well with us generally because biologically we're wired for protection and safety. Um, and chaos is really a man's game in a lot of ways. Like you guys are wired biologically to like be the warrior hunter, you know, fight the fight and chaos almost as exciting in a lot of ways because it's a new challenge, something that you're seeking after, whereas even if you're like me and you're, you have we all have masculine and feminine traits, right.
KimBut like, even if you're a woman like me and you have like that fire, that hunger, like I tend to gravitate towards more of like the bro circles, because I just I'm aggressive and ambitious somehow I wasn't like that before, I just just developed into that. But even if you're like me, it's still scary to see all the things that you used to rely on and do not work as well. And I'm talking practical things like launches are pretty much dead right now.
ChrisWe're going to talk about that, right. Sorry, Jeff.
KimThings like no, jeff is adapting.
ChrisNo, he is adapting. He's awesome. Follow Jeff if you want to know how launches are adapting Jeff Walker, by the way.
KimHe's awesome. And then we see things like email is totally different now. There's a lot of things that have shifted there.
ChrisYeah, that's true.
KimSocial. There's just all kinds of new paradigms in terms of algorithms and how platforms are kind of copying each other. And then I also think that the traditional funnel is not working anymore and that's hard. I think there's a lot of fear, but y'all, here's the thing. I get it and I want to empathize if you're in that place where nothing's working Like we have clients who are like their business just stopped. Like their lead gen just stopped their clients, you know, stopped buying like this All of a sudden out of the blue.
KimLiterally overnight, and it's challenging to watch them go through that, because we have been through that in our business and it's really hard yeah but you have to believe and you have to continue to level up your mindset and know that there's a new opportunity in every season.
Kimif you don't do that,
Spiritual Discernment in Business
Kimthe mind game is the thing that ultimately is going to determine whether you win or lose. You will get stuck in perpetual overthinking, overanalyzing or getting down on yourself. If you get stuck there, there's no coming out of it. Like you have to pull yourself out of it or at some point it's a point of no return, and we have seen businesses close left and right.
ChrisUnfortunately.
KimBecause of what I'm just talking about. It's a mindset thing first, and if you don't put yourself in a place where you're surrounding yourself with tribe and you know collaborations and alliances with other people and you're not in a space, that is actually positive, and directionally successful. There is going to be a lot of things that you're going to, you know, really, get to a point where you're just self-doubt, lots of fear lots of confusion.
KimIt's too stressful. So courage is everything. Get your mind right, get yourself around people who will support you. Listen to shows like this one, encouraging, uplifting. Hey, here's a positive, here's the opportunity.
ChrisYeah, and real, and real, and real. For sure, don't fall, because I feel like the online space has been uplifting and encouraging for a long time. But then I think a lot of them got hoodwinked because they were ignoring some of the real.
KimYeah, I agree.
ChrisAnd I think it's a matter of being. I always say this when I tell our clients something scary that could be received as scary, I always say this is not to scare you, it's to empower you A hundred percent. And so if we're telling you something, it's not us being pessimistic, negative, it's like what Tony Robbins says. He's like like if there's weeds, don't pretend like there's not weeds exactly.
KimYou know what I mean.
ChrisSo we know there's weeds in the world there's weeds, we know there's weeds going on right now in this economy that's okay it's, and we know there's an elephant in the room that's replacing people in jobs by the minute, like so let's not pretend like that's not happening let's talk about it and put our head in the sand and be like everything's fine and daisies, like that's not a strategy, guys, it's not a strategy.
ChrisSo we move forward, and we move forward empowered, but with an equipped knowledge, right? So kim says it best and I want to repeat I actually highlighted here because she was speaking to it but discipline your disappointments I. I don't think that's my original actually it might not be her original, but she says it a lot, so I'm going to give her tony robbins quote okay, well, t TM Tony Robbins but, also assist to Kim.
KimAssist to.
ChrisKim. Assist to Kim.
KimOkay.
ChrisWe'll buy the trademark from you.
KimLet me ask Rock, who said this first.
ChrisDiscipline your disappointments, guys. You cannot. We had a client. It sounded like Bill Cosby, from Bill Cosby himself. I know that's like a name you can't say anymore, but if you've ever watched bill cosby himself, he, he said you cannot. Oh no, that was any murphy. Anyways, regardless, discipline your disappointments. So we just went on a whole thing. Yeah, that was totally random. Um, so, discipline your disappointments. Uh, we just had a client I'm getting back on track here and one of the things I told her I borrowed this from ryan levec, since we're borrowing statements from people now um, but I told her I said the name of the game is to stay in the game until you figure out how to win the game and shout out ryan levec, because he said that. And I feel like in a season where there's a massive shift, which is what we're seeing uh, we had a client that was ready to throw in the towel and just she was like wanting out of her contract and it was like no, no, no, no, no, like you're gonna honor your contract first of all. Second of all, let's figure out how to help you win. And we just got a really, really positive report. It took her like a month or two. She's been battling her butt off. We have been too. Everybody has been.
ChrisBut you've got to discipline those disappointments. You cannot let yourself spiral and you cannot be like I'll just go get job. How long do you think it's going to be before they replace you? If you're not able to sell it because of AI in your market, what are the odds you're going to get a job in that exact same market doing the exact same thing, where they're not going to replace you with AI if that was your concern, right, they're going to get replaced faster because you can't adapt that job to what you need it to be, to actually work.
ChrisYou can't. What if I do it this way? Instead, he's like no, we've replaced you, like that's real, that's happened, at least in your business. You can adapt and be AI enabled, or you can say I'm going to give you prompts about how you can use AI to do the thing that I used to teach you to do. So it's about that adaptation. But if you don't discipline your disappointments, you will spiral, you will wallow. Everybody is going through this, whether it's AI or whether it's whatever the economy. Everybody's going through it. So you have to discipline those disappointments.
KimYep I love. So I asked Grog and it said the original one is Jim Rohn and he says leaders must learn to discipline their disappointments. It's not what happens to us, it is what we choose to do about what happens that makes the difference.
ChrisLove it.
KimAnd it's so freaking good. I love he also and this is this is also kind of leads us to the next thing. You know, whenever there's changes, we resist change, and so we get from our clients like, oh, but it's so much work, or like, oh, my gosh, I have to learn this whole new thing. It's like no, you don't. First of all, it's getting easier and much simpler to run an online business, true, but sometimes getting yourself out there putting content out, consistently, learning how to actually sell with your content, build desire with your content, it is a skill up, right, you're skilling up, and sometimes I still get pushback from some of our clients on that and I'm like listen, okay, so I don't. So I don't know. Grog is a little confused. I don't know who originally said this, but I remember listening and I think maybe even Jennifer Allwood reiterated this. She said listen, in business you get to pick your suck, and I love that perspective, right?
KimSo, someone I don't know who said it, but this kind of relates to it. Right, they said like there's two kinds of pain. There is the pain of discipline and then there's the pain of regret. I think that's a tony robbins it might be but I love that paradigm all quotes.
ChrisYou either attribute it to tony robbins, but probably jay shetty posted about it too at some point oh my god shout out jay shetty for all of the most historic quotes of all time. Et tu Brute, by Jay Shetty.
KimSo one of the things that I always tell our clients like listen, you can choose to be upset about this new way of doing things. You can choose to be like oh, I have to learn how to build desire in my content. I can't just post, you know, frivolous things like an influencer on instagram and people are going to hire me yeah, or oh, my gosh or you can be why do we ever think that would work?
ChrisI?
Kimknow or you could be upset when flowers join my quenching program or you can be upset when your leads suddenly die all of a sudden and there's no one buying and you have a hard time paying your bills. Like. That sucks much more. Yeah, Like so pick your suck Like what sucks more Right, and I think in a lot of ways we have a hard time doing trade-offs in online business.
ChrisYes.
KimIt's like it has to be one way or the other. It's like, guys, let's adapt and evolve.
ChrisIt doesn't mean it'm going to be real right now, I'm just going to be real raw. But some of y'all some of them parents out there that these people had were softy, mcsoft pants, because I can tell you one thing my parents and I know Kim's parents obviously did not set us up to think that life was going to be easy.
KimLike what? Why did you say obviously Because I have Latino parents.
ChrisOh yeah, easy, like what? Why did you say? Obviously because I have latino parents. Oh yeah, that's not. That's not the latino culture. If you know anything about latino culture, it's life. So my dad used to say life is hard, and then you die like, no, you didn't, yes, he did no, he did because I would be like it's hard or whatever.
ChrisI'd make some beta boy comment. You know, little little six-year-old chris was like that is hard and he's like, well, life is suck, and then you die. Or life is hard and then you die, life is hard, life is hard and then you die, not until you die, and then your dad should have been a motivational speaker.
KimOh 100. No, he would have been a bestseller no, but these people need this message.
Chrisyou know, like it's true, life is hard, man, it's not I. I think too, and obviously and for the Christians in the room, you know this right Like life actually gets harder when you declare yeah, get ready for it, not only when you declare yourself for the kingdom. But then, when you declare yourself a kingdom builder, oof, Because like we work with courageous Christians, we're not out here. For like the Salvation Sunday folks, they're like I got my salvation to show up on Sunday.
KimWait, wait, wait, wait. This did you just. I have never heard you say this.
ChrisI make it up, you 100%, just made it up the salvation Sunday, the power of winging it.
KimI love this.
ChrisThe salvation Sunday people Uh-huh. So salvation Sunday people again. I'm not hating if that's your thing, but like they get to the point, grow in their spiritual life.
KimThat's enough for them.
ChrisThey're cool with that. They're fine. They show up on Sunday. They go through the motions, they eat at the same place. At the end they make their lunch reservations. This is what they do. They read their Bible. They do their devotional every day. They read the verse of the day. That's what they do. That's awesome. I'm happy for them. I'm glad that they found Jesus.
KimI am, but that's not who we work with. We work with courageous christians that not just declare themselves for the kingdom, they declare themselves as kingdom builders, and they're the difference we're all here with, like the sword of the spirit. Oh yeah, no, kim's reading.
ChrisYou know the book, kim's reading right now it's called girls with swords like this is my wife I'm ready for the battle sometimes she prays now and it's like I think she's mad at me, like it's full Latin energy. I get in the spirit. She's like and I'm declaring, and I'm like whose black folk church did you attend this week? Like all that energy, like for real for real.
KimHe just doesn't know. He doesn't know, no, so I still pray like a white dude.
ChrisI, so I still pray like a white dude. I got to step it up. I do. I'm like Father. Please help me today in all of my pursuits. Please make me prosperous and give me peace. Why are you making me laugh so much today? And it's like it's just like it's going in on it, you know. So I got to evolve beyond my whiteness in that regard, because I really keep it very Caucasian in.
KimOh, what's the girl from the Terminator? I forget her name. Oh, Sarah Connor. Sarah Connor is my spirit. A hundred percent.
ChrisIf Sarah Connor is not on her wallpaper on her phone right now, I'd be shocked. I just gave you a quote from Sarah Connor the other day. She's like. I want it. Send it to me.
KimTrue, you did she did.
ChrisIt's just happened. This is real life.
KimThis is life married to a Puerto, not a new yorkan a real putter, thank you, thank you, no, but for real y'all. I feel like this is the time that we're living in. This is not a time like we are at war. You guys and people get scared when I say that, but it's the freaking truth yeah, we might not have the war in the traditional sense, like maybe our grandparents where they were, you know, scared of like nuclear bombs and nuclear bombs and you know that kind of thing.
KimYeah, but we're in an information war, we're in a spiritual war we're in an economic war there's so many things you said, you said info there's so many things that are happening right now that we have to be aware of, and I don't want people to think like, oh, you know, if you're not a christian, you're not welcomed here. Chris said, you know, we work with courageous christians, we work with people from all walks of life, like we have clients who are atheists or clients that don't believe like us at all.
ChrisThat's true, they're going to learn, for right now, we're going to learn them.
KimWe don't think right, we don't feel like God is calling us to be Christian coaches for. Christians Right, Um, but we are, we're we're bold about our faith. We talk about our faith a lot and I think it just naturally attracts people who are like us.
ChrisYeah, it's funny because we've actually had a lot of people that don't share that and we've had some really amazing conversations with them about it. But what I mean by that is you're out there, you're kingdom building and you tend to attract a lot of kingdom builders when you do that. And you know that it's true. Like you are, you just said like I'm, I'm an enemy of you and I'm like I am declaring myself against, literally the prince of this world. What do you think is going to happen?
KimYou put a target on it, so you better stop slipping.
ChrisYou better stop living in compromise, like gotta right, like you gotta be out there. Because I'm telling you, I thought life when I became a christian at 25 I'm like, hey, it's gonna be great, you know, joel osteen. And then it was like, hey, that wasn't my experience at all. Like I'm like I need that prosperity gospel back, joel osteen, because that was not what I expected oh my gosh, chris, chris, no, I actually like. Joel, you're hilarious, thank you.
KimNow I lost my train of thought.
ChrisThat's what I tend to do. I was going to add to something you were saying Welcome to my brain.
KimIt was so good, oh man, I forgot.
ChrisSalvation Sundays.
KimSalvation Sundays Salvation.
ChrisSundays.
KimBut getting back on track with the list.
ChrisWe have a list.
KimYeah, thank god we have a list. Thank god we have a list there's. We talked about courage. We talked about how that's so important. You can't, you can't play scared. You got to go all out, and I feel like this is a season to try new things and be a risk taker, like you have to in a in a shifting economy, when things are pivoting, when things are changing, you just gotta try stuff and not be afraid of failure.
ChrisOkay, if it doesn't work great.
KimYou start something else, like it's not a big deal. I feel
Simplified Business Models and Content Strategy
Kimlike a lot of us want to have all the fricking little pieces before we're ready to take the first step, and that's not you will guys the name of the game is speed is speed. We told our clients listen. The theme for this year is fast the future is and the reason that we're simplifying everything is because we're trying to go faster yes we can't go fast if it's overly complicated yeah, it's got to be lean and mean, and so that means that, like you got to take the first step before you know all the pieces, before you know how you're going to make it work.
KimI'll give you an example. We launched our coaching group last year yeah 2024 yeah, last year yeah and group had no coaching Right. We had one-on-one coaching for a while and had no idea what we were going to teach, how it was going to be formatted.
ChrisNo idea.
KimHow the structure was going to work, but we didn't care. I was like listen, we're going to learn from their behavior and we're going to try some things right yeah like we broke them out into pods and they hated being in pods.
ChrisOh my gosh, it was so awkward.
KimIt was so awkward one session and then we didn't do it anymore, right but slowly, over time, we understood what they needed, what they wanted, and they started getting results that we had no idea were even possible in a group setting. That, like, changed our whole paradigm and we're like okay, we're going all in on group this year. So it's one of those things where, like, you just have to do it and experiment as you go, instead of thinking that you're going to get this magic formula and that everything is going to come into place and you're going to know exactly what you're going to teach, exactly how you're going to pivot, exactly what the offer is going to look like exactly what the price is no.
Kimyou have to test the market and let the market tell you hey, we want it this way, we want it that way. Simple.
ChrisI want it. Next, shorten your planning time. All right, so the future's fast. Kim mentioned that. I want to pull this note up because shorten your planning time, guys, one of the biggest differences that we've made in this season. You talk about the future being fast, simplify, simplify, simplify. I. And you talk about the future being fast, simplify, simplify, simplify. I'm reading a book right now called Blitz Scale. It was written by Reid Hoffman, was one of the co-founders of LinkedIn, big in the tech space, whatever, but he says get a foundation, make sure your foundation is established and run fast. So one of the ways that we've done that, and we highly recommend, is to do what we call quarterly rocks. Shout out to one of my personal friends and mentors you know Wickman on that one, because we operate in quarters now. Also, brian P Moran not there's two Brian Moran's one, sam cart, one author, so I call him Brian P Moran, but wrote a. What is it? 12 week year and he talks about planning in quarters. Highly, highly, highly, highly recommend game changer for us.
KimI love that. Listen, my practical brain is having a hard time. These are all theoretical. Can we jump to the practical ones?
ChrisYeah, the bottom of the list.
KimYeah, okay, I like this Down here yeah.
ChrisDown there Right.
KimPerfect.
ChrisSo here's, a couple of things, y'all go up a little bit.
KimOkay, so simplified business models that go deep, not wide, okay, so less offers. Sometimes I think and this is we fall into that trap. We have too many offers and it's too hard, for, like people do not have the appetite right now to figure out what you do.
ChrisThey're not going to do it If they have to accept.
KimYou know they have to like have any calorie. Like what exertion calorie?
Chrisexertion.
KimWhat am I trying to say?
ChrisHelp me out here we like consuming calories, not exhausting calories.
KimIf they have to exhaust calories. I trying to say help me out, we like consuming calories, not exhausting calories. If they have to exhaust calories, trying to figure out what you do, they're out. So instead having fewer offers that are way more targeted to the market, meaning they're exactly what people want, and you need to do research and actually test those yeah that is going to be so much easier. We've simplified our business model significantly technology has given us shallow brains this is proven scientifically.
ChrisThere's a book about you can read it called the shallows yeah um, and we have pancake brains now. We actually have less attention span than a goldfish by four seconds, so you don't have time for them to learn about your 72 offers. Yeah, like if you're doing the spray and pray method of just launch a bunch of stuff and then hope You're just on a roll with these zingers.
KimYou're doing the spray and pray.
ChrisSpray and pray method. It's when you just launch a bunch of stuff and hope that somebody buys something. It's not going to work.
KimIt's not.
ChrisIt's true. There's too many people selling something. People are not going to exhaust the calories to learn what you have and what you sell. They don't care you about it yeah.
KimThe beauty of that, though, is that there's people selling newsletters making literally seven figures a month writing emails, guys writing emails right, just emails. Simple business model. Hey, youtube channel that promotes their free newsletter and the free newsletter promotes their paid newsletter. Simple same thing with like low ticket subscriptions or communities simple business model. You don't know ultra complicated with a billion upsells.
ChrisWe have a lot of people that feel pigeon-held by that. Yeah, that's true, but I'm not passionate about just that thing, and it's like okay, but just make money with that thing.
KimDo you want to?
Chrishave a lot of hobbies or do you want to make money, and I'm sorry but again are things you're going to do as hobbies and you can find a way to do them as hobbies, and there's things that you can find market penetration and make money and you can always expand your brand if you're known for something. Guys always say this amazon sold just books to start. Now amazon sells everything under the sun and then some things you don't even know that they sell.
ChrisThey sell it 100 and so you can continue to you. Once you go deep in one area, you can then start to expand, and that's just a general principle, not not even a seasoned principle.
KimYeah, another thing I think that's really important this year y'all is like you really want to make sure that you're creating content that builds desire for your offers, and we've been saying this at Nauseam, so I'm going to be very short here but, we just literally put out a new mini class on my YouTube channel. We'll link it here if you want to go check out how we're doing this. But your content can no longer be random.
KimYou can't just post, you know, your content pillars and then have a couple things that you do every day like stories and show up every day on stories. It's like no, no, no.
ChrisThe document, your life strategy, oh gosh?
Kimno, you need to create desire for what you sell, and you do that by bringing people into the behind the scenes.
ChrisI feel like the vlog is kind of dead right, the vlog style stuff, unless you're like, really noteworthy.
KimI think if you're a content creator and you're just showing people cozy content, yeah, yeah, yeah, like you said, that trend is huge of like just watch silently as I document my life mary's nest, just cooking in mary's kitchen, her hill country kitchen right, very simple
Kimyeah um, there's still something to be said about that, but most people that we talk to they're not content creators they're service providers they're coaches, they're consultants, they have a business yeah and so it's like dude. Yes, there's something to be said about showing people how you interact with clients. That kind of documentation is great, yeah, but not like oh, hello, good morning I have a hundred and breakfast.
KimI have 150 followers off, 150 followers on instagram and you're documenting dropping your kids off at kindergarten but it has nothing to do with what you do and that's fine occasionally, but when that's 90 of what you post, yeah, I'm like come on I have a friend who, literally, that is all that she does, um, and I'm like, oh my gosh, how is this making money?
Chrisit's not I know. I know because we talk about it.
KimIt's not, and so the the time for that. Like I think people had that appetite in like 2018 and we were all taking like pictures of ourselves, like we were models on instagram and it's like that's not it anymore. So we have to move beyond and that's kind of like the influencer, the influencer era a little bit yeah, and we're not there.
ChrisThe influencers are really that. That era is really fading out did you see? Kim has been way ahead on that one did you see dave ramsey's talk on that?
KimOn Sean Cannell's?
ChrisYeah, because you shared it with me. Yeah.
KimBut did you watch it?
ChrisNot the whole thing, just the clip that you sent me.
KimDude, I'm thrilled that Dave Ramsey is talking about how the age of the influencer is dead.
ChrisHe goes hard in the paint. He's wrong about Bitcoin, but he's right about this.
KimBut do you know how many people came at me in 2021?
Chriswhen I started talking about that.
KimPeople were mad, big mad that I said that, but it's true, they were mad. I'm sorry, it's true and now we're seeing that all over, not just online, but you were seeing that in the markets, like in the financial sector, where people are basically saying like, hey, we're going back to a return of proof of work, meaning we're going to invest in businesses who actually generate a profit, not the speculation stuff that we do with like oh, could they reach unicorn status because we got a random valuation yeah, even in the online space you see a guy like alex hormosi who has emerged as kind of like the thought leader in a lot of ways, and it's it's about money it's all about money.
ChrisIt's about money and the previous ones, if you remember back five, six, seven, eight years, it was about just keep. It was about just keep putting out content, just keep putting out content. You know, go sell stuff at a garage sale until you can make enough money with your brand to get brand deals or whatever Like keep building your audience. It's going to take years and years, and years. And then you have a guy like Hermosi to be like no, I pretty much just put on ads. In one month I was going to go broke and instead I made millions of dollars. And this is how you do it.
KimA hundred percent.
ChrisAnd so I think that's healthy. That's a healthy correction in my opinion, because I think we were too cutesy in online business and this feels more transactional in a lot of ways. I know it feels like a gross statement to say that it's true. Look, when the economy is not good, you don't have time to be playing around with stuff like that. I don't care what your lunch looks like, I need to pay for mine today. Exactly you know what I'm saying? A hundred percent. You know what?
ChrisI'm saying Like I don't give a crap what you ate. I got to put food on mine, unless you're a dietician. People grow an online business. Well, I don't care that you had spaghetti and meatballs this morning as your leftovers from last night at olive garden show me the strategy yes, show me the money, show me the money show me.
KimBut seriously, here's the other thing chris launches are dead in the water you said that I know, but I'm gonna say that again, okay I'm gonna say that again listen jeff can be a big man. It's not. You keep saying Jeff, oh, my gosh. At first I thought you were talking about another.
ChrisJeff, no, Jeff Walker Walker.
KimTexas. Anyway, guys, launches still are working. If you have an actual component to it, that is done with you.
ChrisOkay.
KimNow done with you. Okay, now, here's the thing we're. Up until last year, I was still seeing a lot of our clients win with launches that were longer, meaning like five to. We have one client who does like three weeks of live events, Um, and that was still working. But now this year we're seeing that slow down significantly, where I'm to the point, Chris, where I'm just like I don't want to launch ever because I just.
KimI'm not a launch person've never been a launch person there's many people who built their whole business model of launch. I'm very much like an evergreen person, like I love, mrr, and having continuous cash flow um like this life that I'm gonna launch twice a year.
KimIn other words, a real business, thank you so this is this is for real, because I heard someone I think it was jack from oh my gosh, what's this funnel timer that we use? Hurry timer no, no, no, no. The other one, the real one deadline deadline funnels, deadline funnels. Yeah, so the founder jack. He said that launches are a sales mechanism they are not your whole business, and I'm like preach bro preach it's so true.
KimUh, we've never taught that launches are the thing like, in fact we have a client right now that we're trying to move her away from launches, because if your whole business is launching and then disappearing, it's like that's a lifestyle, that's not a real business. And sure, you can make a lot of money in the old way, but the new world isn't going to wait for you to launch six months from now.
ChrisEven some of the leaders in that space we won't name names but even some of the leaders in the launch space, we've personally heard them in person, not like from afar, like actually in the same room say like I don't know why we did that.
KimLike actually in the same room, say like I don't know why we did that, like I don't know why we weren't selling all the time Right, and it's like yeah, we, we, we, we thought that we agree, we, we, we agree. So one of the things that I think is exciting, though, when launches aren't working as well as they used to, though, is that you can actually turn your launch essentially into an evergreen content funnel. And you should have been doing that all along, it's like Nike, to an evergreen content funnel.
ChrisAnd you should have been doing that all along. It's like Nike They'll release the shoes and then they continue to sell the shoes that sold out, because hello.
KimThey did a good, awesome, big event that got everyone excited and they didn't pull the shoe. They kept the shoe on the shelf.
ChrisI understand the scarcity aspect of it. Limited, limited availability.
KimIt worked for the market. It worked for a season.
ChrisBut when you've got people who can go to ChatGPT or can literally get online and get blasted with 15 other offers, they're not going to wait six months for your epic launch.
KimAlso, people are getting served what they want now via ads. We haven't even talked about that in the news feed, and so people don't want to wait, they
Launches Are Dead: New Business Models
Kimwant what they want. They want it.
Chrisnow is on a fact they'll wait six months to go to the tony robbins date with destiny, because it's freaking tony robbins right, um. But they're gonna do other things in the meantime, and even tony's doing his online now, not in person, and it might be for that reason, so they can do it more often or evergreen, I don't know. I don't know what the plan is, because they just announced they're not doing that anymore, which is an interesting shift, that we'll talk about another date yeah, so we're landing the plane now right with like one or two more yes, at the most okay, we talked about specificity with your offers.
ChrisThat's good. If you have courses you're going to do, done with you as much as you can. We talk about launches, also with courses.
KimIf your course isn't selling, consider that transition and here's the thing high ticket is still selling, low ticket is still selling what's getting destroyed?
Kimis the middle and so it's modeling what's happening in our economy. That's why we have talked and been so vocal about the fact that economies matter, politics matter. We have to talk about it. It impacts small businesses, as we see right, and so when you have, um, the middle class shrinking, that's exactly what's going to happen. It's going to model that in the online space. That's why you're seeing a lot of people like Amy Porterfield, for example, reframing her podcast to actually work with people who are more advanced. She's going for that higher ticket, and if you're going low ticket, you got to go low, low ticket right.
KimYou're serving a consumer market and so, in a lot of ways, I think that the middle people are the people who are really suffering right now, because their their sales just died yeah, you gotta go, and they were supporting a lot of people.
ChrisYeah, totally agree. Um the other another thing, I think we've kind of touched on this, but I think this is really important to restate if we haven't. Um, that people are overwhelmed with information now more than ever. Oh gosh, it's so true, like sure you can go to ChatGPT and it'll give you an entire business plan. One, are you going to hold yourself accountable to do it? Two, are you going to be able to curate it until you know what the opportunity is that you should pursue right now, given all the context and layers of who you are and what you've done, can guarantee you that it's not dynamic enough to help you with that? But three, your person is probably significantly overwhelmed because now it's not just one fire hose, it's like 3,000 fire hoses of information. So Kim said answers over information 1,000%. But know that you can be the counter and be the final answer or the help. It's also why they're looking for specificity. I don't need more information, just tell me what to do. And a lot of that overwhelmed with information aspect is why that's becoming the case. So done with you is part of why people want that. I don't care, I'll pay whatever. I just want help getting it done. Go with people that are all in. You've got to be all in. Kim said go all out, be all in Whatever terminology you want to utilize but you got to be all in and find people that are all in.
ChrisWe talk about PWMs players with money. You want to make sure you're focusing on people that actually have money to spend and make sure you're meeting them with an offer that makes sense for you. I don't have a problem with a low ticket subscription, but you better have a lot of people. If you're going to sell $7 low ticket subscription, like you better have a lot of people, and so it's always good to have people PWMs that are willing to pay you. And what would you render that service for? If you do have a business, that's a service providing business that you can offer something higher ticket. It's a lot easier than selling 1,000 people at $7, right?
Kim100%. And I think just a final one would probably be guys, you have to reposition your offers for consumption and I feel like a lot of us are still kind of thinking in very narrow ways of like it's got to fit into the course, you know, bucket, or it's got to fit into the subscription bucket perfectly. We're seeing hybrid crush right now, where people are taking their courses and turning them into. There's a coaching element to it or there's a done with you element.
KimThere's ways in which you can reposition your offer where it doesn't have to fit perfectly into like it's either you know I do it for them or they take my self study course. It's like no, no, no, like there's in-betweens. So, finding those and being really smart about how do you plug into the need that the market has right now with an established offer that maybe you tweak, maybe you, you know, share it in a different way, switch the format around. There's so many ways in which people can actually pivot and position their offers to crush in this new economy.
ChrisNew economy. Awesome guys. All right, this was all we had for you today. All we had, all we had. Sorry, this was all we had for you today. All we had, all we had. Sorry, this is all we brought today. Um, yeah, do you want to close this out? Sure I don't
Final Thoughts and Closing
Chrisknow what to say go host.
KimNo, but thank you so much for being here with us. You guys, don't forget to subscribe for more episodes there's going to be share with a friend and share with a friend extra videos for you to watch. Next, I'm here on the screen and we will see you in the next one, un beso bye for now.
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