Origin's
The stories of our lives often define us. Listen to these interviews and learn how and why people navigate their lives.
Origin's
Rabbi Menachem Caytak: A Beacon of Light in Times of Darkness
Have you ever wondered about the journey to becoming a Rabbi? Rabbi Menachem Caytak recounts his riveting journey from his roots in Ottawa to his spiritual endeavors in Chicago, Manchester, and Israel, and how the teachings of the late Lubavitcher rabbi, Menachem Mendel Schneerson, left a lasting imprint on his path. A unique roller coaster of personal growth and spiritual awakening - a story not to be missed.
The episode doesn't stop there. Rabbi Caytak and his wife Chana take us along on their mission to strengthen the Jewish community in Michigan. Through their relentless dedication and hard work, hundreds of households found a space to celebrate their shared heritage. Together, they navigated the challenges of living an Orthodox life in a secular community and discovered ways to connect with Jewish families in the area. The conversation also digs into the significance of Jewish holidays and traditions, and Rabbi Caytak's perspective on adapting Judaism to appeal to modern audiences.
Lastly, we address the dark cloud of antisemitism. Listen as Rabbi Caytak transforms this concerning issue into an opportunity to spread the message of Judaism. We also explore the intriguing concept of combatting evil in a spiritual sense, the importance of faith, and the power of free will. Tune in for an enlightening conversation that will warm your heart and broaden your understanding of spirituality, community, and the human experience.
So my guest today is Rabbi Nachim Keitech, who is my Rabbi. He is my friend, and I'm really excited to have you here today. It's not every day that you get to meet somebody, well, first of all, who I honor and respect so much but, at the same time, who has such a unique job. Right, like, how many people choose to be a clergy? Not a lot, and it's a really interesting thing, and so I was wondering, first of all, if you could tell us first of all, where were you born, what's your back story, and then we'll get into how did you end up choosing this as your career?
Speaker 2:Thanks, brian. Thanks, it's a real honor to be here and you know it's amazing to sit with a friend and you know I always enjoy our conversation. So the story is like this that I was born in Ottawa, canada, so I grew up there. My parents originally weren't raised religious. My father is a child of Holocaust survivors and my mother, her father, so my grandfather. On my mother's side, he was a soldier, an American soldier under General Patton, who liberated Holocaust concentration camps, and you know so we had I had that both, you know, conflicting, not conflicting different grandparents on both sides and my both my parents.
Speaker 2:When they were in their later teens they decided to become religious and my father was in medical school at the time and he was searching for more meaning and purpose and he felt that the life that he was living and he was living a pretty traditional Jewish life but he felt that he was missing something and he connected with the Chabad movement, which is a Jewish, you know, spiritual and Jewish movement which focuses on connection to God and love of the fellow Jew, and he fell in love with that and he really embraced that type of lifestyle and he became religious and so did my mother and they met and they married and they moved to Ottawa and my father was, and still is, a doctor, so he originally started off as a general practice and now he's in ER. So I grew up in Ottawa. I have 11 siblings, so it's 12, including me, and it was. It's quite a. It was quite a childhood.
Speaker 1:I would imagine there was a lot going on with 12 children. We could probably write a book about it, so and did your other siblings also choose to become rabbis or become part of you know this life.
Speaker 2:So all my siblings are part of the community, part of, like the Chabad, the religious community. They live all over the world and, you know, everyone is amazing in what they do, but not every single one is, you know, in the clergy field. I have a brother that's a younger brother, that's in the clergy field. I have a brother-in-law. My brother is a canter. I have another brother that's a canter, actually a Moscow, and I have a sister which she runs a synagogue in Sao Paulo, Brazil, together with her husband, my brother-in-law. But the rest of us, the rest of my siblings, are in business and have, you know, different professions which you know they're highly skilled at, which is amazing to see.
Speaker 1:That's phenomenal. So when, how old were you when you decided or when you had thoughts about becoming a rabbi?
Speaker 2:So it was when I was a teenager a young teenager I left school, the way it works in the, you know, the more religious system. So, being in Ottawa, there was a Jewish day school which, of course, I attended until eighth grade, but after eighth grade there wasn't any further education, so there was no option in Ottawa to continue my religious education. So from the age of 14, I moved to Chicago. So I moved to the big city, to a boarding school which is very customary in the Chabad community, in the more religious community, to you know, to go to such schools. And I was in this high school for three years and it was there that I was really exposed, so to speak, to you know, different people and rabbis in the community that led such amazing lives that I was like, wow, I want to be someday like this, like these people. Like you know, it's a life that the whole day you're not thinking about yourself, you're thinking about other people, you're not thinking about what you need, you're thinking about what other people need.
Speaker 2:And there was one rabbi who actually, coincidentally, I'm actually named after, so he wasn't alive physically when I was alive. I never had the opportunity to meet him. I was born in 96. He passed in 94. So I missed him by two years. We share the same name. I'm named after him and his name was the Lubavitcher rabbi.
Speaker 2:I have said rabbi Menachem Mendel Schneerson, of blessed memory, and in my early teens and throughout my teenage years and going on in my 20s, I really, really developed a passion for his teachings and for his philosophy and he had a tremendous, tremendous love of people and he was all about reaching out to others. He was all about not judging people about who they are, what they look like, understanding that every single human being has a soul and that soul is a piece of God and that soul is a piece of you, because you also have that soul and that's who you are and if you love yourself, you love your other, you love your fellow human being and it's all about reaching out and helping and connecting. And the rabbi's teachings really inspired me to do what I'm doing today and inspires me every day on a good day.
Speaker 1:On a good day. Yeah, everyone does have those bad days from time to time. So you were 14, you moved away from home, you studied for three years at the school and then you went to where to get your rabbinical training, because, at that, point you're only 17 or 18 years old.
Speaker 2:Right, 17 or 18. So Chicago finishes and you got to pack up your bags and move again and this is part of, so to speak, like the system, the Chabad educational system, and so I chose to learn in Manchester in England, which had a really amazing program for like this was like the equivalent this was the equivalent of undergraduate of you know, to start my rabbinical degree. So I learned in Manchester for a year and I transferred after that to Israel actually. So I studied in Israel for two years after that. So, which was Manchester was an amazing experience. You know, to get to, you know, be in that culture there and the teachers that they had there was incredible. And then in Israel was something very, very special, even though I regret one thing.
Speaker 2:I regret I went to Israel. I learned actually in an Israeli Shiva, an Israeli school. It was like a rabbinical college, but I went with a group of American students. So I never fully integrated into the Israeli culture. I never fully, fully, fully learned how to speak fluent, fluent Hebrew. You know, I noticed I could converse in Hebrew, but the problem is, I think, in English. So there's always a pause between. You know, when someone speaks to me, I have to think before I respond. So it's a regret that I have to, just that I live with.
Speaker 1:I understand. Well, you know you were 17. Yeah, and so you didn't go to a formal college? Then did you?
Speaker 2:No. So this was, this was. No, I didn't go to a formal college, but this was the equivalent of a college, you know. So there was classes focused all about rabbinical learning and you know people have a common misconception that, you know, judaism is just the Torah, the five books of Moses, the Bible, and that's not at all which we were focusing on. Just to throw it a number, there's over a hundred thousand books on Judaism and what we focused on for most of the day was the Talmud, which is Jewish law you know tort law, you know criminal law and the Jewish philosophy and tremendous Jewish wisdom. So most of the day we were immersed in these concepts, which is extremely, extremely intellectually stimulating and challenging. And you know that was the makeup of becoming a rabbi, which took, you know, five to five, you know almost six years.
Speaker 1:Got it, got it. So, within the college system, are you able to pick? Like you know, somebody picks their major, as an example. It's still a college degree, but it's focused in a certain direction. Are you able to find, choose a certain direction within the rabbinical college, or was it just? Here's everything?
Speaker 2:So I actually, I basically just generalized in my rabbinical degree. But after you finish your rabbinical degree which I finished, you know. So I started it in Israel and then in, first, you know, in Manchester, then continuing Israel, and I finished it in New York. But I did it with the high court of Israel. You know, they, they, they, I would get tested, we'd get tested. It was a group, it was like a division in New York, but we were part of the general college in Israel. We were tested by the rabbis there and that's how I have my degree from.
Speaker 2:But there was that's like the general degree you could then specialize in in so many different fields, and I did not continue that. I, you know, I got my radical degree and then I became, you know, a rabbi in Troy. But some of my friends continued for another couple of years to specialize in a specific field. You know whether it may be, you know, tort law, which is a very big thing, or whether it may be in in wedding and divorce, or conversion, or you know, or you know kosher food or so on and so forth. There's all these different things which you could specialize in, but I'm I'm just a simple just a simple rabbi.
Speaker 1:Right, there's. There's no such thing as a simple rabbi. But okay, got it. So that's very interesting. I didn't know there was all of that availability to you. And so you finish your degree and who throws a dart on the map and says, okay, you're going to try Michigan.
Speaker 2:I finished the degree and I was 22 at the time, and in the more khabad and the khabad community, which is again, as I mentioned before, religious, just for the sake of putting it into a category, it's a more religious community, which I'll later speak that khabad doesn't believe in labels, but just for the sake of clarity, it's a more religious community. So I'm living in Crown Heights at the time, in Brooklyn, new York City, and from the age of 22, the custom is to start dating. And this is a fascinating thing in the khabad community and the entire religious community as a whole, the Jewish religious community, that until we're ready to date for marriage, we don't date. So there's no such thing as coed classes, there's complete separation between female and male and ideas focus on your studies and marriage and dating is holy. It's a union between a man and a woman. It's all about family life, which is holy and pure. And until you're ready to get married, we don't date. So the way that. So I'm 22, I finished my degree and traditionally this is the time to get married. So the way that marriage works. So what do you mean? How are you supposed to find a girl?
Speaker 2:So the way it works is, as it says on Fiddler on the Roof, and I'll explain how it works is matchmaker, matchmaker, make me a match. So it's you basically have either it's more informal or sometimes more formal. You have a family friend that says, hey, I know a girl, that's great, can I set you guys up on a date? And it's basically a matchmaker function is like a dating app, but just it's in a person. There's also such a thing as dating apps, but matchmaker is a lot more intimate because they know who you are, they know the other person and you set two people up on a date. The entire function of a matchmaker is to set a prospective bride, a prospective groom, on a date. That's it. So you date if you like the girl, if the girl likes you, if you guys get along, you marry. You could date for as long as you want, you could date for as short as you want. It's up to you guys. The matchmaker brings you guys, makes the date, but after that you're on your own.
Speaker 1:And how many matches did you have before you met your wife?
Speaker 2:So I was very lucky. A lot of my friends right now I'm 27. A lot of my friends right now are still not married. They probably dated 30 girls and a lot of my wife's friends are still not married. It's hard. You got to find someone that you're really compatible with and you really get along with. I was fortunate that it was the first girl that I dated.
Speaker 1:And she is a lovely human being.
Speaker 2:So yeah, she definitely is. She definitely is. And before you marry, as I mentioned before, marriage is pure. Family life is holy. So before you marry, there's no intimate touch. There's no touch.
Speaker 2:When you're dating someone, you want to know if you like the person, if you get along with the person, if you find this person a pleasant human being, if this person has good morals, good character, if this person will be a good partner, a good either father or mother. That's a purpose of dating and of course, there has to be the emotional attachment to love. But that's through getting to know the person in a setting without touch. Once there's touch, your image is clouded. You don't know what you like about the person. So therefore, in the more religious custom, until you marry, there's no touch. So we dated and we got to know each other and we connected and I flew here. She was living in Michigan at the time I'm saying she's from Michigan, from West Bloomfield, and then she came to New York and we found that we really got along. We found there's a lot of compatibility, we found there's a lot of connection and then we decided let's buy a ring and let's get engaged.
Speaker 1:Mosul's oven. Mosul's oven.
Speaker 2:And then we married. So I actually got married here in Michigan, so her parents, he's from here and that was my first taste of Michigan.
Speaker 1:And now you have four children, right? Four children, four children, wow, and how many do you want?
Speaker 2:to have. I'm counting, so let me tell you something Children is the blessing. See, you want to have a, it's also a lot of mouths to feed on a rabbi's salary.
Speaker 2:So we're not. We don't go to Disneyland, we don't go to Disney World. We're not flying to Europe on vacation. Our priority is our family and it's the biggest blessing in the world to be able to have an offspring, to be able to raise the next generation and, god willing, raise them upright, raise them with the values that me and my wife share, to try to impart them in the values and, god willing, they'll be even better than us, that they'll be good, upright citizens and continue to make an impact in this world. That's the greatest blessing that we can have our children. And with blessings you want to have as many blessings as you can.
Speaker 1:So we're at four.
Speaker 2:But if God gives us more, we'll take more.
Speaker 1:And counting, I get it, I get it. Okay, so you've become a rabbi, you're 24. I'm 22.
Speaker 2:22.
Speaker 1:You get married and then you're here in Michigan and somebody says Troy, michigan, that's going to be your spot. And you begin and remember you started just knocking on doors and saying, hi, are you Jewish? You know, you probably had a list, because we're all on some list somewhere, and you started introducing yourself. And it's been how long since you began that, from the first door knock till today is how long.
Speaker 2:So let me just back up. So it wasn't that no one suggested Troy. We were looking for a place we wanted. My wife and I shared this goal, this value of moving to a place and helping others, you know, living a life of service, living, as we mentioned before, living a life of community, and we wanted to move to an area that didn't have a strong Jewish community and strengthen it. So we were looking all over the world, literally all over the world, and nothing was, you know, nothing. As I'll mention a Hebrew word, nothing was like a shidah, nothing was a good match. You know, it was this problem, that problem, and we were just getting. You know, we were looking for almost a year.
Speaker 2:We were living in Crown Heights after we got married and I continued to my studies there for a year in an institute of higher education to continue to learn more. And finally we said, you know, we're looking all over the place, let's look a little closer to Hannah's home. And we said let's look at Michigan. And we started looking at Michigan and we said, hey, you know, there's this whole area east of Woodward. You know the whole, there's a whole area of Troy, rochester Hills, rochester and more East and Cone County. That's. There's, according to data, which is which the Federation published, there's thousands, there's like 2000 Jewish families in this area and there's really not not a lot going on. So we said this, this, this has to be, this has to be the place. So we moved there and, yes, we didn't know anybody, not one.
Speaker 2:Back, my father-in-law, rabbi Shemtov, runs the Friendship Circle, which is an amazing organization in West Bloomfield. They help children and adults with special needs. So he said he knows so many people and he's been to so many different Simcha's Jewish celebrations and, unfortunately, shiva's Jewish mourning, and he's never been to one in Troy. So he said there's no Jews in Troy. But we saw this data from the published by the Jewish Federation just in 2018. And we said we want to give it a shot. We didn't know anybody and we started knocking on Jewish sounding last names. We bought lists from these data companies of some Jewish, possible Jewish households and one of the first people which we found. So we started even before we moved here, just as a test run was in April of 2019. And just as a test run, we were trying to see if we found any Jews and one of the first people that we bumped into was your wife and your daughter.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I was at work, I think, so you met them. Yeah, I love that. I love that I got to be part of your origin story, essentially, and now you have how many families or participants? You have a center, essentially a congregation now. You have been attending, you've been by the bedside of people who are sick. You've been around people who are in need. You are providing classes for children. You're providing camp. You are providing classes for adults to further their studies. You've created a gathering place and a place where Jews can come together and celebrate holidays. I mean, that's a short summary of just some of the stuff you've done and that you started in 2022, no, no.
Speaker 2:So it was the summer. It was right before Russia's shot off 2019. So, we're doing like four years now.
Speaker 1:Four years and a year and a half of that was a year that was COVID, so you really couldn't do much there. And where are you at now? Numbers-wise, like how many people could you say are part of our community now?
Speaker 2:So we're in touch with 800 Jewish households.
Speaker 1:That's pretty amazing.
Speaker 2:So some of them are not yet fully engaged. They're engaged to some level. Either they may take matzah on before Passover or they come to the big Kahnuk event. But hundreds are engaged on a more personal level, either through taking the classes, either through attending the bigger holiday events, either through sending their children to our programs or their teens, or we have a program for college students. So, yeah, so we're only starting, but thank God we've managed to create a place where Jews are able to come and celebrate their Jewish heritage in an engaging way.
Speaker 2:In a way, jews here are not so traditional and we wanna provide Judaism in the most accessible and meaningful way possible. So Judaism is not purchasing a ticket to synagogue and having to sit through a service which is five hours long. That's not Judaism. Judaism provides meaning, it provides purpose, it provides a why. What am I doing here in this world? How can I overcome the challenges which I'm facing today? How can I lead the best life possible? Judaism teaches us all these answers and it's all about just unlocking the box and making this accessible to people. That's what we're all about. And also providing that community. So many people feel isolated, so many people feel alone. Providing that community where people can come and really get to know each other and connect on a personal basis.
Speaker 1:That's phenomenal, and what I love is your enthusiasm, besides the fact that you're smart as a way up. I mean you really, really you know, whenever you and I sit down and talk, your knowledge of what you've studied and how you can convey very you know sort of ancient teachings and important teachings through stories and through experience is. It's one of my favorite things about spending time with you, really, and I love that and I just love that, and so I think other people are also drawn to your enthusiasm as well as your intellect and your warmth and your kindness, and I just love all of that about what you bring to the community and the table. So when you were young, though, you had this image of what it would be like to be a rabbi, and now you're living it Was it? You know, when you lift up the curtain, are there any areas where you're like I wasn't expecting that?
Speaker 2:So I'll tell you, when you're young, you have this image of you know of what it means to be a rabbi, and you have this image that you know you work hard and you find you reach it and you're good. You know you reach the height and you're and you are in success mode and you're good for life. You're just riding high, you conquer the mountain, you're on top of the mountain, you're good to go, and when you're in the job, there's never success. You know. Of course there's opportunities. Of course there's. I'll take that. I'm not saying there's never success.
Speaker 2:There's amazing moments and it's amazing to grow with the community and connect with the community and see this amazing community continue to grow. But there's never job done. There's always more to do and there's always a tremendous more to do. And the more you do, you know, the more programs you have going and the more people you connect with, the more needs to be done. You know, the more the community needs to continue to get together and continue to grow.
Speaker 2:So we're only in the beginning, we're only scratching the surface. You know people here, you know you have a center. You know there's 800 families you're connected with. You know you could just sit back and relax. It's the opposite, you know. The workload only continues to grow, which is amazing, which is something that I love, you know, which is why I wake up in the morning, because I love connecting with people and I love, you know, engaging with people in a Jewish way. But we're only growing. We're only in the beginning and you know God willing. You know God should grant us the success to continue to be able to flourish. You know, and you know God willing, grow our team and grow our center and grow the community in ways that you know we never even dreamed of, even, you know, four years in.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think it's again. I love your enthusiasm and it's phenomenal, and I have similarly for myself, because, as a yoga studio owner, you know you go from 10 classes a week to 20 classes a week and you think, okay, 20 classes were good. You know, everything's stable, everything's good. And then things change. Oh well, now we need 30 classes a week. Well, now we need 40 classes a week because we got more people. Oh, we got more people, we got more problems.
Speaker 1:And now it's, you know, it goes from everything from the toilet overflowing and needing more toilet paper to creating programming and satisfying customers and giving them something special, but always, you know, sort of pushing the ball forward a little bit so that you always have something new to teach and new to create and more people, more problems, but yet more opportunities to serve. And there's, I'm with you in the sense that you know, I've dedicated my life to service as well, obviously in a very different arena, yet at the same time, at the same time, you know, I spent an hour and a half with somebody yesterday who had an abusive childhood and needed to talk it out, and I was the shoulder to cry on with whatever my life experience had to offer to give of wisdom, maybe not from a, you know, degreeed position, but from a human position, and I love that about my job and I love that about being of service to others. It's, you know, when I get up in the morning and I'm like I don't wanna work out this morning, I don't wanna do my yoga practice, I don't wanna do it, and I'm like, well, but Brian, you have to do this for the sake of others, get up and you go. And it's a beautiful life, it's an absolutely beautiful life, Exhausting at times.
Speaker 2:I think, brian, that's why we you know, I think that's why I find so much of a similarity when we get together and we talk, because we are in the same field. You know, it's about improving people's lives and engage in helping people, and it's amazing to see your dedication and inspires me, you know, to continue to do what I'm doing, so it's yeah, just different vehicle, different vehicle. Different name.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, different name. I was talking to an Indian gentleman one time and I said I don't understand why there are so many Indian gods and goddesses. It doesn't like isn't there one God? How do I understand it? And he explained it to me like this. He said you know, if you are an individual who happens to connect to the female qualities of God, then there's a female God. If you connect to the male qualities, there's a male God. Ultimately, it helps one connect to their higher power, based upon something that's already residing within.
Speaker 1:And so if it's yoga, if it's Judaism, if it's this or if it's that, then it's a good idea to connect to the female God. And so if it allows people to elevate themselves, to connect deeper, to become better human beings, to become kinder to each other, to have deeper, better relationships, I'm all for it, whatever it is. And the fact you know I'm born Jewish, my DNA test says 97% Eastern European Jewish, not Eastern European, eastern European Jewish, and I get that and I love that, I embrace it fully, and I find you know what I do as a yoga teacher and as a student of yoga to be also quite satisfying. It gives me other answers and it's funny because when we talk and I talk about some ancient Tibetan Buddhist yoga, blah, blah, blah thing, you're like, oh yeah, well, in Judaism we have this and they're the same. They basically it's the same message, it's just a different delivery. And I really enjoy those conversations when we're like, yeah, we're talking about the same thing. Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1:At the same time, in regard to you know, living an Orthodox life in a fairly secular community, I mean you're really kind of isolated. There's not a lot of, there aren't a lot of Jewish people here, there's certainly almost no Orthodox community here, the Chabad community here in the Troy, rochester area. And how do you find that? Is it hard for you? Because there really isn't a whole community gathering together. It's you and your wife and your children almost.
Speaker 2:And a few people that come to visit you know.
Speaker 2:No, it's not hard at all. It's like, you know people ask me you know how to? You know how it must be such a challenge. You know to live. You know by yourself, you know what do you do for. You know for prayer and you know customarily as religious, do you know? You go three times to pray, and three times a day to pray, and in Shabbat there's a much longer prayer and you go with the whole family and so on. So it's not hard at all, you know it's, it's.
Speaker 2:I absolutely love what, what we're doing, and this is the greatest way that we could express our Judaism in service of others. I want to tell you, you know, a quick story which really, which really resonates with me and really brings out this point, is we just had the holiday of Sukkot, right? So Sukkot, it's a Jewish holiday, and the custom is to to wave a palm branch together with a myrtle and a willow and a citrus. So four species that each represented a different type of person and we're bringing them together, representing that we're all one, that despite the differences, we're all coming together in unity and oneness. So the citrus in the Jewish community is, is, is, you know it's, it's customary to spend a lot on it. You want to get the most beautiful one. It's yellow, it's from Israel, it's, you know, the Celestum from Italy. You know you want to get the most beautiful, perfect one, perfect color, perfect shape, no blemish. Everything's exact on this citrus. You know, people literally spend, without exaggeration, hundreds of dollars on to getting the most beautiful one.
Speaker 2:The Rebbe, which is my teacher, so he churned the table, the table tables, of what a perfect citrus should be, what a perfect etchroke should be on its head. He said people think that a purple, a perfect etchroke citrus, is yellow. I say that a perfect citrus is brown. Why? How does a citrus churn brown If enough people hold it. The warmth of a person's hand literally discolors this citrus. So if you take your beautiful Lula Venetra that you bought and you bring it to other people and you give the opportunity for them to do this mitzvah, to do this Goudi, this Jewish commandment, and enough people shake it, your citrus will churn brown.
Speaker 2:And this is the whole idea of Judaism not to keep it for yourself. Bring it out to other people. Don't keep a perfect one for yourself. Rather, take the one that you have and bring it out to other people and help other people also engage with this beautiful message and beautiful mitzvah. That is a beautiful etchroke and that's the etchroke that I strive to have every Sukkot. That the end of Sukkot. I want mine to be literally brown enough. People shook it. So the same thing with my Jewish observance is that I'm not in it for myself, I'm not in it to feel good to be able to go to synagogue and to be able to have a kosher store down the block and bagels and this and that. No, I'm here for the community and the greatest way that I could express my Judaism and my family's Judaism is to live here in Troy and it's definitely not a Jewish area and spend Shabbat together with the community and spend Shabbat together with the local Jews and celebrate through that.
Speaker 2:So it's not a challenge at all.
Speaker 1:That's a great story and it's so true. It's so true. It's like, well, what's the best yoga mat? The one you're gonna use, yeah, the one you'll use a lot. Exactly Different story, but similar. Anyway, I love that and I love the Rebbe stories. So many times I'll have a question for you or you'll come to me with something, and that's where we always end up is a message given by a great sage and then how that applies to today. And it's interesting too how our tradition, which is thousands of years old, is still alive today and relevant in this day and age. It's kind of a rare thing to really make it work. I think that people in general you hear about churches and synagogues where attendance is down and people are kind of moving away from very traditional ways of thinking, because the churches and synagogues haven't really adapted to what is more modern thinking and how to appeal to a group of more modern people and still have the same message but deliver it in a way that people more enjoy it, and I think that you're doing that, I mean.
Speaker 2:It's not just me. They say Chabad is God's greatest PR team. I'm saying the message. It's something which I find so much and by no means take any credit. It's the messages which, again back to the rabbi which he literally lived with and spread and I know I'm just an emissary, a messenger, spreading these messages which are already out there is that Judaism contains so much, there's so much wisdom and there's so much meaning for a practical, every day, not so religious Jew. The problem is that it's locked up, it's not accessible, and what we're trying to do is make that accessible. Make that accessible through the events, through the learning opportunities, through the children, through the teens, through the college students, everything which we're doing. We're trying to bring Judaism's message to the world and it's such a beautiful message, it's an everlasting message, and the problem is again that people just don't know it, and that's what we're aiming to do.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and you do it really really well as a matter of fact. I mean, I'm always so impressed and do you deal with much antisemitism in this area? Have you run into it much, or has it been just people or just people? And everyone seems pretty friendly.
Speaker 2:I'll tell you in general, people are people. Everyone's friendly. It's a. You look at, you see on the news this incident, that incident and you think the whole world's crashing down, but you see the everyday humanity and love of people. The world is a really good place. People here are amazing people. I can't say that I don't bump into it and I'm a very proud Jew and I'm a very I appear like a Jew. There's nothing that I could do to hide that. So I do bump into it occasionally. But listen, america is an incredible country. I'm incredibly blessed to be able to live here. It's the most amazing country to be able to practice religion and freedom. It's such a blessing I'm able to walk down the street with my KIPA and be allowed to do it and be encouraged to do it. So there's so many blessings. So an occasional this and occasional that I don't let it bother me, but 99% of the time there's no problems then it's the most amazing community that we live in. So I'm extremely grateful.
Speaker 1:That's phenomenal. What are your hopes for the future? What's your? Do you have a? Do you sit there and go? All right, I've got a one year, three year, five year plan, or is it more? Let's just continue to do what we're doing and people will come build it and they will come kind of an idea Like where's your, how does that work for you?
Speaker 2:So we, we, you know we're our organization's based on a lot of idealism and you know a tremendous amount of passion and so on. You know, my wife and I, and you know we've created small team to continue to grow, but at the same time we do have a business plan and we do have a budget and we do have a plan for growth. So the next plan is continue to expand. We have certain steps that we want to do to continue to expand our youth, to engage with the extremely young children, you know, the infants, to expand the teen programming. But in general, for the next, the next big stage which we want is to either purchase a preexisting building or purchase a plot to build upon.
Speaker 2:And it's not just a synagogue, it's a Jewish center, it's a place where Jews, you know it's not just to pray, because you know some people prayer really doesn't speak to and they're not interested in belonging, so to speak, to a synagogue. It's not their thing. But this is a center where the goal is to have something for every Jew and we want to engage not just half or not just a large amount. We want to engage every Jew that lives on this side of town. If they don't want to participate. That's fine, you know, that's fine. But we want to give them the opportunity to know what's going on and we want to reach out and engage with the people which are just not aware or just you know. They've moved here, they're not connected with the Jewish community, and we want to provide those opportunities to them and, god willing, we'll, you know, only continue to grow and continue to flourish.
Speaker 1:And what's nice also about the way you present it is you're not asking somebody to be who they're not. You're not saying, oh well, you know you're doing Judaism wrong and if you just do it our way you'll be better. You know, I've never, ever heard that, felt that, even thought you implied that ever. It's always been hey, we're doing these cool things, you're Jewish, we're Jewish, you know, you want to come along for the ride and it's. I mean, I've yet to hear anybody say, oh yeah, you know, I kind of felt pushed into something. Never, ever.
Speaker 1:It's always been an invite, which is a very sweet sort of approach. I mean, you know, I'm never going to, you're never going to see Jews knocking on doors saying, hey, you should be Jewish and I'm glad you don't do that as a matter of fact. But it's very sweet the way you approach it and I'm really really grateful for that. And your wife takes a fairly big role in things too. I mean, granted, you've got four children and I'm certain you probably have some help at home, but she's still as active and still very. You know, it's not just you, the rabbi, right?
Speaker 2:Right, she takes more than half. You know, we would not be functional at all without her. So she definitely makes I joke. I'm the shlepper, you know. I just do what I'm being told to. You know, being told to, but she's the one. She's definitely the brains behind everything and she's definitely a tremendous reason why we're able to do what we're able to do. You know, and this is like just another way of the difference, and you know, I'm not sure how many people you know are aware so much of like the difference between a rabbi there's usually just a rabbi of a synagogue and you know, there's the rabbi's wife who kind of does her own thing, but she's not involved. This is not like that at all. She is front, left and center of what we do and she is a huge reason why we're able to continue to grow. And you know, the community at large, I believe, is extremely grateful.
Speaker 1:It's an amazing work that she does. Yeah, it really is. It's a real team effort and you know, a lot of times you know, in sort of the secular community it's, you know, it's. It looks like the man is doing the work and the woman's at home raising the kids. Judy, isn't, really, isn't like that.
Speaker 1:I remember hearing it explained to me once by a Lubavitcher rabbi that the most sacred, important job is the raising of our children. And if it is the rabbi's job to sort of, you know, be the captain of the ship for the spiritual growth of the family, then it's the wife's job for much more of the practical every day and in his mind anyway. And what more important job is there? Right, it's not subservient, it's not less than it's not somehow pushed to the side. It's like that's the most, that's the most important job, plus what she contributes to the community and the Chabad Center and and everything else. It's, it's. It's really amazing to see. And so you know, from the outside, looking in, it's one thing, but from the inside, looking out, it's a, it's a very different story, right.
Speaker 2:Right, definitely, I mean our. Our priority is definitely, definitely, our family. You know, the the most important thing that we have and the biggest blessing that we have is not our cars and it's not our home, is not, it's not anything, it's. It's it's our children, it's the fact that we are blessed with, you know, for beautiful children, and definitely Hannah is and more to come.
Speaker 2:And, god willing, yeah, it's, it's definitely our priority and you know, their education and their upbringing is definitely front, left and center of everything which were, which were passionate about and everything which we're trying to do. You know, and Hannah is, is, is is crucial to that. The Hannah in my case, but really the Jewish woman is, is crucial to that, to that effort. Of course it's a partnered role and of course both parents have to be involved. But between me and you, you know we're both fathers here. You know, when we try disciplining or we try, you know you know our children maybe not react as much, react as well, but when it, when it's the mom, there's a much better reception and there's a much better connection and you know it's a motherly thing. There's nothing like there's nothing like a good mother and Hannah definitely plays that part.
Speaker 1:There's. There's also a lot going on in the world right now, specifically in Israel. I don't want to get into a conversation about who's to blame, who's at fault and things like that, but you know, I don't know when people will watch this, if they watch this six months from now or a year from now. Israel was recently under attack by Hamas from the Gaza Strip and nobody you know who knows where this is going to go or how bad it's going to be. But what can? What can?
Speaker 1:I'm not even going to say just Jews, but what can people do in America to Be supportive in some way to? I mean, I'm sitting here thinking I need to go there, I need to do something. I'm not saying I need to go pick up a gun, but what if I could work at an orphanage for a while and help children? What if I could hand out water? What if I could help in reconstructing somebody's home and be a slipper? I feel like I should be doing something and sitting here, you know, in the bubble of Rochester Hills, you know where the talk of the town is, the next Christmas parade so far removed, you know. And what can we do? What can anyone do here?
Speaker 2:If someone's able to help in a physical sense, you know, that's, that's, you know, definitely a blessing. We had an event, you know, which you were part of. We had a soldier that was, you know, is on his way to Israel to fight. You know, in that physical sense it's, it's, there's nothing more holy than to use your body to, to, to, to, to, to, to save Jewish lives which this, which this person has done. But for the rest of us, that that that are living in in America, and for many of us, you know, including myself, it's not so practical to go there. I definitely, you know, perhaps could get on a plane, but I have a community here. You know, I have responsibilities here and you know, brian, you as well. I'm saying you're impacting people here. You know, perhaps it wouldn't be so right to leave, you know, your post, but there is, there is, there is things which we can do, and this is this.
Speaker 2:This is turns to Jewish belief, that we believe that everything that happens in the world and this is an extremely tough belief, especially now it comes from God, physical and spiritual. So, when we want to, we want to impact the outcome of something. Sometimes we can't do something in a physical sense sometimes, but we could do it in a spiritual sense. So there's tremendous, tremendous evil in this world. We've saw barbarism which we didn't believe could exist after the Holocaust. You know, we saw and say not going to get into details. You know now the numbers 1300 innocent kids, mothers, fathers, gun down, burn the live in their homes. Most terrible, terrible, terrible atrocity, terrible, terrible things done to them. What can we do? This is going back to the Rebbe, to Lubavitch.
Speaker 2:Rebbe is how do we fight evil? How do we fight darkness? By adding light. You don't fight darkness with clashing with another, bringing another piece of darkness. You fight. You fight darkness with lighting up the dark room, with adding more light. So what can we do is in our own world now, in our own community, in our own bubble, add more light. And for the Jewish people you know that means doing more Mitzvot, going a little bit beyond their comfort zone, putting on the fill in, lighting the Shabbat candles, giving more charity, being nicer, being more involved in the community, connecting with people that need help, and this is just in general for everybody. Spread more light, be nicer, give more charity, get more involved in organizations that need help, are able to help people Through us spreading more light. That is the greatest way that we could combat this terrible darkness. So you're right, we're not helping in a physical sense, but we're definitely, definitely helping in a spiritual sense, and that's our part in contributing to winning over this tremendous, tremendous evil which exists today.
Speaker 1:So when we say this comes from God, I mean there's a lot to unpack, I mean that's a conversation that could take hours and hours and hours. Because we think, if we have this image of God as benevolent and kind, why would there be this creation of such evil and such horror? If we think of God as vengeful and angry or something, then we think to ourselves well, what did I do to create this? You know what did I do? It's, there's a lot there. Is there a message that can be given about that? Because how do you have faith in God when you see such horrible things? Like it has to shake us to some degree and make us question at the same time what do you do with that? Like, what's the this is?
Speaker 2:and I know this is a hard question because I think people of all faiths at some point go well, this isn't what God's supposed to do, right, it's a very hard question and for me and for you it's very personal, because these are our brothers and sisters, these are people that we would begun the life to. I've lived in Israel for two years. This wasn't against, you know. This wasn't a political thing. This was purely evil that tried to kill as many Jews as possible. So it's like waking up in a nightmare. You know the past couple of days. You know you wake up in a days. You know, could this really be happening? You know, I thought such evil didn't exist in our teenage. This is the 21st century, hello.
Speaker 1:That's right.
Speaker 2:But at the same time, we believe in God. But we also know that God gave free will to men and this is an extremely difficult thing to reconcile. But God gave the choice to men to make decisions that could go against what should be done. So the fact that these barbarians, these monsters, committed such a massacre was them. They made that decision. They made that decision to commit such evil and, god willing, they'll pay the price for making that decision.
Speaker 2:But when it comes to us responding, we can make the proper decision. We can make the proper decision, and it's so easy now to fall into depression and to fall into just panic. Jews all around the world, especially since it's just spreading all around the world this tremendous hate. We can make a decision either to panic and to live in sorrow and fear, but we can make another decision and the decision is to live a more uplifted way, to live through spreading more light, through combating this darkness, through doing more good actions and deeds, and we understand that there's a God in the world and that God hears our light, and this is the best way to spread this evil. So I don't believe I gave you a full answer and there's really. This is not something that could be spoken about really unpacked on one leg, but it's much more comforting to believe that there is a God when there's such pain than to believe there is a God.
Speaker 1:You said something really very, very poignant in that God gave us a choice and in such, you can choose to create peace or you can choose to create war. And just because God didn't necessarily create this situation God created human beings to manage their own situations and that choice was ours and there's human kinds. And that actually resonates more with me, I think, because if we think God's micromanaging our lives, well I don't know, I don't really know how much attention that should be given. But if it's, god got the ball rolling and is managing things in a way to say, all right, well, choose here and then live with those consequences, well, that makes a little more, for whatever reason. In my head, that makes more sense Right.
Speaker 2:And this is a question which has really been Jewish sages and perhaps every philosopher has grappling throughout the ages. How do you reconcile this? Sometimes there's things that man doesn't do. You have a young baby, gets sick. Why does a baby deserve this? If you go to the hospital or the pediatrics, you see, why do they deserve such pain? Sometimes we don't have answers.
Speaker 2:And it says in the Bible. It says when Aaron's children were, they passed away in the Tabernacle. Two of his sons died through attempting to do a service that wasn't accepted by God. It says Aaron was silent. He didn't have answers. He did not have answers. He was silent. He didn't say ah, I got it, you know, I got God. Thank you for you know, thank you for this, I get it. He was silent, but at the same time, he continued going on. He didn't let the pain and the tremendous, tremendous loss and tragedy that he experienced on a personal level to take away from his, from his faith. In fact, he held on to his faith stronger, and even though he didn't understand, he continued to do what he was doing, and even on a greater scale.
Speaker 2:So we don't understand what's going on, but we know what we could do, and that's, you know, our faith. Hold on to our faith, hold on to prayer and spread, spread more light.
Speaker 1:Now, a lot of times in the moment it seems so overwhelming painful. We don't know why. We don't understand, but over time we typically do. I mean, all of us can look back in our lives and look back at a time and go that was really hard, but look what I learned from it, look where I am now because of it. And but in the in that moment, we never understood it at all. It was only through time and perspective. So, god willing, we'll all have time and perspective to look at this and say, all right, well, what were the mistakes and what can we do better and how to live better. You know, wow, well, I really I love that we spent this time together. I know you have to leave very soon, so how do people reach you? How do people find you on social media and outlets? What's the name of your synagogue? What do you want to call it? Center, your center?
Speaker 2:So it's. It's the Chabadjua center of Troy. We're right now located in downtown Auburn Hills by Auburn and Squirrel, but God willing, you know, we'll continue to grow. You could go to our website, which is JewishTroycom, or Facebook page is Facebookcom, forward slash, jewishtroy, and you can reach out through email, which is rabbi R-A-B-B-I at JewishTroycom. Love to chat, love to connect and every relationship that I have is such a blessing. You know I only gain connecting with other Jews and connecting with other people. It's the biggest, it's the biggest blessing. It's the biggest blessing you know I personally enjoy, you know, the most about being a rabbi is learning from other people's experiences and I gain so much from hearing what other people have to say in their perspective. You know it enriches my life in such an incredible way.
Speaker 1:I know I can see it in your face, I can hear it in your voice and I see it when you connect with people, and I love that about you. So thank you so much for doing this and I look forward to spending time and seeing you soon. Thanks, ryan.
Speaker 2:Thanks.
Speaker 1:Bye.