Before You Cut Bangs
Hosted by Laura Quick and Claire Fierman, “Before You Cut Bangs” is full of hilarious conversations about real life, common and uncommon crises, and possible cosmetic errors that come along with it. Through storytelling and therapeutic wisdom, Claire and Laura share how to NOT fuck up your hair (and life) while walking through similar situations,
Produced by Will Lochamy
Before You Cut Bangs
2.5 Wait, they aren’t gonna change? Now what?
The hardest thing in life is to be in a relationship with people that we hoped would change and then we wake up one day and realize maybe they won’t… or can’t.
On this episode, we are diving into how to navigate those relationships and come to terms with the reality of what IS TRUE.
Welcome to, before you Cut Bangs. I'm Laura Quick and I'm Claire Fehrman. I am a professional storyteller and I'm currently working on my first book.
Speaker 2:I have worked in mental health for many years in lots of capacities and this is a really important time to tell you our big disclaimer this is not therapy. We are not your therapists or coaches or anything like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean you shouldn't really trust us very much at all, unless you want to and it turns out well, then you can trust us, that's great.
Speaker 2:All right, today, on, before you Cut Bangs, we are talking about what to do when they simply won't change, can't change Might not ever change Refuse.
Speaker 1:Yeah, could happen.
Speaker 3:You hear that They'll never change.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm, and sometimes they don't. The old Oprah or Maya, whoever it was. When they show you who they are, believe them.
Speaker 2:Believe them, and so we'll tell you what to do if they won't change.
Speaker 3:And I think they might. Anyway, we'll get to that Opening question here. What is something that you're convinced that people are just pretending to like? Like I went with very expensive wine Because I feel like and I've worked at a place back in the day that was a really nice place where you had to do like wine training and tastings and all those and I mean I was more convinced than ever, after learning about all the stuff and tasting it all, that the $30 bottle if it's the blend like you like tastes just like the $300 or $400 bottle.
Speaker 1:Honestly sometimes better yeah to me.
Speaker 3:Sometimes better and it's a status thing. But buying the very expensive bottle as a status thing, you don't actually enjoy it more than the 30 bottle I resonate with that.
Speaker 1:People that say that they like salads with no dressing fuck all the way off. You're lying kale. Kale is when you yeah, don't, I'm not doing that, I'm not pretending. Oh my god, no stop. Oh, also, people that pretend they don't like mayonnaise.
Speaker 2:That's a lot too, and then eat your mayonnaise of choice dukes.
Speaker 3:Okay, good, never hi, mayonnaise is like my favorite thing. I don't eat it. I thought it was. It was something when I made a change when I turned 30 and was like, oh, I need to lose some weight. You don't eat mayonnaise mayonnaise.
Speaker 1:Well, we'll have to do a whole Intervention episode on how that's delicious.
Speaker 3:And look, if I go to a restaurant and they bring me mayonnaise, I'm going to dip my fries in it.
Speaker 2:God, I love fries and mayonnaise, so it's not like I can never have mayonnaise.
Speaker 3:It's not like that. It's like if I make a sandwich, I used to lather it in mayonnaise. Now I just skip the mayonnaise. Oh, that's serious.
Speaker 2:We'll work on that. As far from my health and wellness mindset. Okay, I thought of a couple, and please let the record show that I love 99.9% of foods. But these people that have joined the tinned fish club, what does that mean? Like fish in a can, like sardines?
Speaker 1:Oh, I have tried that. It's not great.
Speaker 3:I love anchovies, so some people love them. It's a good snack. I like it, like on saltines, yeah, or just by themselves.
Speaker 2:Like hot sauce.
Speaker 3:On a cracker, maybe hot sauce.
Speaker 2:My brother did love them, but I don't know. I couldn't be passionate enough to join a club. Oh, you meant like the clubs too far.
Speaker 3:There's an actual club.
Speaker 2:The tinned. Well, forgive me if this isn't exactly but the tinned fish club. Tinned fish club, it's like a wine of the month, jelly of the month.
Speaker 3:Here's your rotten disgusting fish, and like sardines, I know they're good for you, so I will sometimes, but I have to put salt and hot sauce on them, which probably then kind of negates.
Speaker 2:See, y'all are all dousing it with mustard hot sauce. Just be like plug my nose and toss her back. I'm not in any club.
Speaker 3:Here's the thing. But I do love anchovies Like I love them, so I do like them.
Speaker 2:I'm not going to be in a club, though I also don't believe the cold plungers.
Speaker 3:Yeah, the benefits are real. But yeah, yeah, the benefits are real, but yeah, it's got to be miserable, yeah, or people that are like I just love running. I mean, I agree, I know people that claim to Listen.
Speaker 1:I'll run, but it is only because I believe it is the least. It's the thing I can do the best out of all the things that I really suck at.
Speaker 3:Yeah, there can be good benefits and it's convenient. You can just do it. You can leave your door and do it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, put on the shoes and let's go, so what are we going to do with these people? That won't change. Have them start running, probably.
Speaker 2:Immediately, you need to get on a running regimen. Okay, well, tell us what it looks like in relationship if there's a stuck person, or what it could look like.
Speaker 1:So I think I've been the stuck person. I've been the person that was kind of like living on repeat and like probably was pretty difficult to watch from an outside perspective. But I think I've also met a lot of people on my journey that just felt like they were stuck or they wouldn't change or they weren't interested in changing. I have a parent like that. I have several parents, all my parents actually. But I think I think you have two schools of thought here People don't change, won't change, can't change and people can change. I have to believe I'm in people can change camp because obviously I have had radical change in my life.
Speaker 1:But what does that even mean to change? Okay, I think what it meant for me was waking up enough to take a look good a look, a good long look in the mirror at who I was, how I was showing up and saying, wow, I don't really like what I see and I want to be different. I think that's changed, changes, the admission of something's not quite the way that I want it to be. I'd like it to be different and I think it'll be different. I want it to be different for myself, but I also believe the fruit of that would that it would be different for people to interact with me as well.
Speaker 2:What do you believe the fruit of that would? What does that mean to you? Like, if people change?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean okay, this sweater off, I hate you. What does that mean to you? Like if people change? Yeah, I mean okay. So for me personally, like I definitely went through a 10 year probably episode of like never really super content, right what year what?
Speaker 1:how old were you when that was happening? It's still, you're in it.
Speaker 2:40 just kidding. I'm so surprised you're one of the most content people I know.
Speaker 3:I love so many parts of my life were very content. I'm just very content with a very. I mean I said I was never unhappy, it was just like uh is there more?
Speaker 2:yeah, kind of yeah, yes, yeah, oh, that's a good one so, so, but here's the thing.
Speaker 3:I don't know why I changed, but I just became very content and very yeah, just pleased all the way around, and so, like it changed.
Speaker 1:Content and happy is that's people who are thankful are content and happy.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So did you figure out how to just be thankful for what you had?
Speaker 3:Maybe, so Maybe that was it.
Speaker 1:Because you're also a super grateful person.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I just I don't know really what, because it wasn't like a. Okay, I'm talking to someone, a doctor, that's telling me I need to make this change, so I need to figure out how to make it. It just, I just changed. I think it just kind of matured and grew up and whatever. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Have y'all by? I cannot believe I'm about to ask this question. Have either of y'all listened to Jewel on Joe Rogan that episode? I don't ever listen to Joe Rogan, so don't come at me, but do y'all. Okay, I haven't. Well, I'm going to give a quick summary and I encourage everyone to listen to this.
Speaker 2:So Jewel was born into a wild world in Alaska. Basically, she was suicidal by 15. And then she saw other people that were happy and she was like I want that. And she devoted her whole life to figuring out what that was. Um, by like 18, she was offered a million dollars to sign with somebody and she's like this doesn't feel right, I'm good, I'd rather live out of my car because I know that million dollars won't make me happy. And she waited another however many years.
Speaker 2:That first album Can't remember what it's called, but we all listened to it On repeat, On repeat, and she made $12 million a month that year. Anyways, her whole stance on this is if you see it, you can decide to do it. Like you just have to go. And I say go after it Like she didn't decide. Oh, I'm not going to kill myself anymore. But she looked around and was like I want what they have and she did it and I think that's a little bit of what we lack now and I've talked about on here before, but this like grittiness to us.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that was. I think that when I got around healthier people, that was the big revelation for me of like whoa I want what they have, I want what they have. I see them living a different life than me and they seem more content. They seem like they they have. There was not an unsettledness about them and there was always an unsettledness about myself that I was like I don't like that. But then, but it took me changing environments completely to even feel like I had permission to change.
Speaker 2:So y'all are talking about pretty self-aware change. But then there's this flip to that of you're in partnership and partnership and parents typically are like the hot topics in therapy of my mom shows up like this and it sucks.
Speaker 2:My dad shows up like this and it sucks, so I'm and I'm miserable and fuck them, or my husband, my wife, my girlfriend, my boyfriend, whoever. If they did these things, I would be happier, and I think that's a super important narrative and I think that was why you asked the question today, like before we started. Can people change what happens if they don't? This is the setup. So I hear all the time clinically, or even friends or whoever this person, if they didn't do these things, I would feel so much better. What do you think about that?
Speaker 1:I think that an unhealthy dynamic always makes you think that it's probably the other person and that if they would just do all these things and you would, you would feel better. But ultimately, like I don't know better, but ultimately like I don't know, I don't, I don't agree with that.
Speaker 3:I feel like making concessions right is a good thing for you and your partner to do to small extents, to like, yeah, hear them out and whatever. But, boy, if you are in a relationship where you're really wanting to change that other person, maybe not the relationship for you for sure.
Speaker 2:So and we'll do both sides, because I see both where it's like a person is being told they need to change to make the other person happy, which sucks. And then I've seen the other side of if they would just change and I used to be in that camp. I needed my mom to be all of these other things to make me happy, um, in our relationship, and that that didn't work out for us until I did the therapy work and she said that I was pleasant. But that was like proof in the pudding of like I went and did the therapy, it changed the dynamic and then we got along better. So that that's a tough one to swallow. So let's go with the dynamic of I need this person to change it's for me to be happy, or I'm waiting for this person to change to's for me to be happy, or I'm waiting for this person to change to be happy. So I, as they know, I'm on this like big yoga path right now okay, and we're all really excited, are you?
Speaker 1:I love it. I think it's awesome. I've loved watching you like be so happy pursuing it thank you.
Speaker 2:Um, so this has required a lot, like daily meditation, daily movement, like daily yoga every single morning, and it has revived a lot of what I think was like dormant in me. It has, like, awakened me, like what you said, like you just wake up and I'm looking at these things and I'm like, oh my gosh, I can do this and I can be better. And I'm married to someone that, like, is not going to get up and I'm looking at these things and I'm like, oh my gosh, I can do this and I can be better. And I'm married to someone that, like, is not gonna get up and do yoga.
Speaker 2:And it scared me at first and I was like, oh my god, like we're not on this yogic path together and he needs to see all of the light that I am seeing. And so every day I'm like, well, let me tell you about the goddess Lakshmi, and like, how cool the blood like just fucking constantly could not stop running my mouth. And he's like that is awesome anyways, like he, he's being like really sweet. And then it hit me first of all, bobby's never gonna join my little path, but in bigger things in life, when someone is growing and someone else is stagnant. They'll either watch you grow and join you or they won't. And can you live with it or not? And can I live with Bobby not doing yoga? 100% yes.
Speaker 1:Well, cause you. That's like a hole in a gap that you can fill with all your yogi friends that do love yoga and we'll talk to you about the goddess and the light and the whatever else you're seeing. Like I think I mean truly, I do think that that is a big misnomer is like you know that you're going to evolve. If you're you're not growing, you're dying, as they say as they say, whoever they are.
Speaker 1:But I mean, if you're growing and your partner, like everybody, grows at a different speed, though, right, so like. But what happens when it doesn't seem like they're growing at all?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so that's when I see a ton of blame. And what does research say? That blame is Shame, yes, and Insecurity, dis discharge of pain. When I blame you, I puke my pain on you so I have a moment of relief. So when I need you to change for me to be happy, I have undealt with pain that I'm putting on you as your responsibility.
Speaker 1:Biggest thing I see in couples Like a codependent, an unhealthy level of codependency of like I need you to be good so I can be good. Yeah, I need you to. You've got to do these, check these boxes for me so that I can be okay, and you're not doing that, and so therefore, this sucks and you won't change.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like I'm depressed, I have anxiety. But if you did X, y and Z, those things would be relieved. Or our marriage is so boring and lacking but, laura, if you did these things, our marriage wouldn't be boring and lacking anymore. So I need you to go do that, so I'm happier. Those are, um, we can go back to our red flags episode. That's a flag. That's not like an irreparable flag, but it is a flag of your partner has some shit they haven't dealt with and they're safe enough with you, which is the positive part to say. What they're really saying is I'm hurt, I'm hurt, help me, help me. But it's coming out as fuck, you Fuck, you, fuck. You Do these things so I feel better. And guess what, if you went and did all the things, they, they don't feel better. They would just move the goalpost because they're still unresolved.
Speaker 1:Ugh. Okay, so you're saying the person who's saying I need you to change to make me happy is actually the one that's most messed up.
Speaker 2:In this specific scenario. But let's say, like you're married to someone who's struggling with sex addiction, like, of course they need to go work. That go do their work. That's not a reflection of you in that moment. It's like, hey, I need you to go deal with this so we have a safe marriage, right? That is a moment when, like, they've got to go do stuff. What all you listeners have to differentiate with is if someone is telling me to change for their happiness and I'm not doing something that is directly putting like a life at stake or putting us in danger. That is not on me. Now. If they're like you yell at me every Tuesday, that has to stop. That's something for me to take a look at. Am I being clear enough about when it's yours, when it's theirs?
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think like cause that feels very partner oriented. And it's funny, cause I think that I've had some accidental marriages, if you will. And I had this friend that I shared with my sister and she called me and she's like, oh my gosh, so-and-so is getting married again, and this was like the fifth or sixth time she was going to be getting married Well beyond, beyond yours. Well, oh, so many more accidentals than I had. But and this is not I'm not at all and I understand how it happens.
Speaker 1:You know, typically you're looking for somebody to make you happy, right, but like I remember saying so what is she saying about this guy? And she said, well, this guy's going to make her happy. And I was like, y'all know how we feel about that and he's just this, he's just that, he's just this. And I'm like, but is she different? Has she changed? Because typically, if you've experienced your own transformation, you have a lot more grace when other people are trying to navigate theirs. And I think that is like a, from a partnership perspective, is the thing we forget, like maybe you forgot when you were in a hard season or you were navigating change, and so then you don't have as much grace for the other person.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think you nailed it with. That's the difference in blame versus like growth mindset and grace of fuck you for being this way, or hey, this is hard for me. What do you think about it?
Speaker 1:Like, like, hey, man, it feels like we're still hanging out in the same area that we've been in for like a year and a half. Like, are you open to taking a step with me? What would that look like?
Speaker 2:yes, okay, I feel like that was clear, wilbur clear yeah, crystal yeah, all right, let's talk about parents la.
Speaker 1:So this is the hardest for me because I have a mom who has not been present most of my life and then I have a dad who has been present. But also, I had this dream one time that like messed me up. I remember telling Claire about it, but I first called Shelly and I was like, oh my God, I just had this crazy dream. The dream was I had this house and I was letting my dad move into the house, but I had moved all of the furniture the like really nice fancy furniture and art and everything in the basement and I was like, hey, just don't mess with that, I'm going to come back. And then, when we can like move it or sell it or whatever, I come back a month later and he has sold everything. And he said but don't worry about it. And he gave me $300.
Speaker 1:This was probably hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of shit in the bottom of my pocket. And this is a dream. It's a dream, but in the dream this was this huge chasm, him saying no worries, here's $300. And I remember afterwards being so mad like this is the kind of shit I'm talking about, that he would think that that's inappropriate, like that's so inappropriate. And my best friend said isn't that kind of what you do all the time? You keep going to the ATM of your dad trying to pull out $1,000 and really only has $100 to offer you and I was like I've got to call you back bitch. But then I was like, yes, that is what I do all the time.
Speaker 3:Well, shelly's a poet and didn't know it. Yes, but it reminds me of the actual real life story with you and your dad, where he won the lottery and gave you like $10.
Speaker 1:$100. Whatever. Yeah, he was like here we're going to split this A half a millionaire. And he was like I'm sending you something real nice.
Speaker 3:And it was $100.
Speaker 1:Like directly oh, it's a direct but that was before this dream was before that actually happened, and I remember being like, yes, foreshadowing of what was to come. But I think, like when I look at my parents, I have one that was present but also disengaged, so that's my dad. And then I have my mom, who struggled with addiction and, you know, had a lot of really messed up stuff happen and the more I learned about both of them. There was a season of my life, probably my 20, where I was like they don't care about me, they won't support me, they suck and they won't change. They're always gonna be this way and this is just my reality and that was one way to look at it.
Speaker 1:I don't hate that way and you know what? It's a totally fine way and you can find a lot of peace there because you can just be like they're not going to change. This is it I think that I've probably shifted into, because I still think that I think there's a really slim chance I'm ever going to get a different relationship with either one of my parents. I mean, truly one of them is intolerably so and the other one is just like how much can you really handle?
Speaker 2:Okay so, but where I've landed with it is like, the more I know about their story, the more I'm like that tracks. So that metaphor of like keeping, like going to the ATM and not getting anything out of it, that's what we're set up to do with parents that don't have, uh, I guess, the groundedness, the security to say, hey, I hear you and you're right. Um, that's what we deal with If we have narcissistic parents. Um, typically narcissistic mothers are going to have some kind of like, uh, unspoken jealousy with you if you're her daughter. That happens a lot.
Speaker 2:Narcissistic fathers very charming, very attention seeking. I'm giving like the literal thumbnail version, but those are probably my more extreme cases of we're biologically set up to look to these people for security. It's how nature works. These people are going to love you and take care of you and then humans suck compared to, like a mother deer who's taking care of her child and so the animal kingdom really does this better in some cases, but then they also like eat their children sure of them, so teach their own teach, teach.
Speaker 2:But the more dramatic cases of this are if I have an alcoholic parent that's actively drinking, if I have a narcissistic parent, if I have an unmedicated bipolar parent like these. These are people that, like I would go with the 20 something laura of. Like they can't give me what I need, I'm gonna go find it elsewhere well and I'll say like that was my solution was to put up.
Speaker 1:I wouldn't have called them boundaries, because I had no idea what a boundary was in my 20s, but I just went kind of no contact for most of my 20s. And when I did allow them to come in, I was so disappointed To be like never invited to a holiday until 10 minutes before or like and I know there's probably a lot of people listening that that's your story Like you're, you might be like you're the last person on the list for your family and you don't find out and maybe like part of your family is super duper close and they're they could do things together. And then all of a sudden they're like oh damn, we forgot to call laura. Let's just tell her. We're down here at the pf changs, we've come to alabama if you want to join us, and I'm like I actually remember you going literally a actual thing.
Speaker 3:I feel like your family might be intimidated by you. I don't know your family, but like you're, you know you got will scared of you. That's what he's trying to say. Oh, you know, I'm not, you got stuff going on. You of you is what he's trying to say. Oh, you know, I'm not, you got stuff going on. You're doing stuff, you're successful. I don't know, maybe they're like Maybe they've heard the podcast.
Speaker 1:Yeah, probably Maybe they've heard the podcast. No PF Changs for her. But I will say this and I want to family as an example, because I do think it represents a lot of the world feels similar to how I feel, like on the out front, on the outside fringe, maybe you have a drug addict parent and and that's really hard maybe you have a parent that's not diagnosed but has some mental illness they're walking around with or borderline personality, whatever, it doesn't really matter. At the end of of the day, that's super lonely, it sucks so bad. And so I also just want to say I am grateful my mom gave birth to me. I wouldn't be here without her, being a brave 17 year old who decided to choose life when she had every reason not to. And the same thing, my dad worked two and three jobs when I was growing up to provide for us, and you know like it wasn't, like their life wasn't easy either.
Speaker 1:I'm at this place where I try and see like I'm not saying it's okay what they do, but I am saying I've got to a place, at 41, where I can give a lot of grace, and so I do talk a lot of shit about them. Maybe they just don't they. It might be a little like we don't get her, and I think that I think that's true. I think there's a lot of like. I always ask my sister like but have they read any books? And if the answer is no, then they have not changed. Nothing has changed, um, and that is my sentiment. However, now I say I know they haven't changed, I acknowledge they haven't changed and I am willing to still go into the lion's den. I think I could do it for two hours. I think I can make it through a dinner. I love.
Speaker 2:I have two things I love that. Um, you came to this middle road of I can tolerate two hours Cause you know I have a hard time with that harsh pendulum swing of like my mom made me mad, so I'm not seeing them for holidays or whatever it is that we have made popular on Instagram. Yes, like you've been through a lot with these people and you now have this understanding of of course, y'all know I love the of course, like of course, they had to do it this way.
Speaker 1:That's what great therapists do. They look at you and they go, of course. Of course that happened and nobody my parents haven't been through therapy y'all. I have the gift of like I've transformed my life. Yes, maybe because I partially looked in the mirror and was like whoa, don't really like this. I'm looking at myself and looking at these healthy people and realizing there's this big divide. So I made a change. They I don't know that they've had that luxury. I don't think they've been exposed to the same things I've been exposed to, and maybe they haven't had that awakening, maybe they never will.
Speaker 2:But they're all I got. I would really encourage you if your parent won't change in the sense of we do gentle parenting, but my parents don't like lighten up, you know. And what I mean by gentle parenting and they don't is you know? There's this whole thing, do y'all know? There's this thing where you shouldn't tell your kids you're proud of them. Yeah.
Speaker 1:I've seen that. I've seen the Instagram Hate. I posted it on Instagram. It's so bad, it's like all these things you can't do, like you can't do, like you can't say you're proud of them you need to be proud, like we're proud or something it's like.
Speaker 2:You have to be like specific, but also make it like neutral, because if you're proud, then you could also be inclined to be disappointed.
Speaker 1:Basically, it's a terrifying world we live in with all these weird, but this is this is real.
Speaker 2:Like people like, well, you know, we're gentle parenting and we don't say things like I'm proud and I have boomer parents and like y'all, they don't know, but I bet they're not like whooping your kids I mean, that did happen to us growing up. But like times have changed and so I would really encourage people to take a look at is health and safety really at stake here, or do I not just like this part of them and can I learn how to tolerate it?
Speaker 1:That's where you get to shift into flexibility and compassion. I think I actually have a couple friends who has a little girl, like she's very, very little, and there's one parent that just goes rogue like one grandparent. That's just like doing whatever the hell they want, and I think it's kind of she's definitely in the camp of. This is the way I am Get over it, like mom, the grandmother, and I'm always erring on the side of like, yeah, that sounds insane and that would be really heavy.
Speaker 1:Also, you've got to pick and choose your battle, because if everything is a battle with your boomer parent, you're just going to live in turmoil all the time. So like, yes, you're doing gentle parenting and if you're like most parents, that means 90% of the time it's happening the way you want it to happen and 10% is not going to change the trajectory of your child's life. Like if they say they're proud of them because 90% of the time they hear you doing it. However, gentle parents are supposed to do it, which, let me tell you, I am not the gentle parent to talk to and no one has ever come into my office and said that their deepest wound was that their parents told them that they were proud of them.
Speaker 2:No, pretty sure it's the opposite of that I do want to go back to. If you're in the situation with your partner where you're banking on them to change for your happiness, I would pop into therapy, to be honest, yeah.
Speaker 1:And oh, this is a good one. Damn, because Claire and I know so many people who are either talking to us about therapy or like they're curious, therapy. Curious. If you show up and you're talking about your spouse, your partner, your loved one, your girlfriend, your boyfriend, about them going to therapy, but you're not doing your own work, shut the literal hell up, stop Do not kind of mean today. I know we do or you do, I do everyone All right.
Speaker 1:I'm sorry if we sound mean. I'm just saying that if you have the capacity to think about what your spouse or partner needs and you think it's therapy, they should be in therapy. But you're not in therapy, go get in therapy, because the tools that you'll have to navigate that relationship in a different way because I think sometimes it's like, well, they just need to be in therapy. It's like are you in therapy, so making appointments? What you're saying.
Speaker 2:It is. This is kind of what I want to say, but when we talk about change, it's really uncomfortable and we'll start it with a really subtle piece of. I was not content, so I found a way to become content. So none of what we're talking about is one 80 change to me.
Speaker 2:This is how am I more pleasant, how do I show up in my morals and my values, how I want to be a wife, a mother those are my biggest roles a therapist, a friend. And what's stopping me from getting to those places? Okay, and then those are the conversations you can have with really safe partners of hey, this is where I'm stuck. What do you think about that? Like, have you ever asked your partner? I feel stuck. Would you agree, being brave enough to ask someone you love, what do you really think about some of my behaviors? And sitting with it, what do you think of my strengths? What do you think of my weaknesses? And just saying thank you to that?
Speaker 1:Oh, that's some that does take therapy. When Shane and I have a Sunday meeting and one of the things we ask is like what can I do better? Like is there anything I can do better this week? And sometimes Shane will just hit me with a real zinger and I'll hate it. And sometimes I hit him with a zinger and he probably hates it. But like, I do think that is like a level of honesty that if you can have it, if you can be brave enough to talk about where you're stuck, you might give your partner permission to talk about where they are and I will tell you if your partner's stuck and in a lot of pain and puking it up all over, you just keep doing your work Like if you're in a secure marriage and it's falling apart a little bit.
Speaker 2:Like you keep doing your work. Just like Bobby won't do yoga, like I keep doing it and he'll either join the path or he won't, you keep moving forward. Your partner gets to join you or they can't, that's it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I'll simplify this a little bit. But like my marriage the first marriage it just got to a point like we went to counseling and she was wanting me to change in a way that would have made me unhappy, and so just kind of came to that agreement of, like others, I can't do that, because then I would be unhappy and that, even though that those changes might make you happy, wouldn't make me happy. So let's just be co-parents, and that's how that happened.
Speaker 2:God, I love vulnerable will. That was so great, yeah, and I can.
Speaker 3:I wasn't going to have a cubicle job and that was that was one of them that feels like a pretty big non-negotiable for you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, okay, well, take out the part where I was mean, cause I. Okay. Well, take out the part where I was mean, because I feel like you said what I said, but better, I was just being funny. You're good, are you sure? I feel bad.
Speaker 3:He'll listen and take it out of me. All right, Claire's got two more things. I know, I'm just kidding, I could always come up with more, but Claire's got a list of five more things I mean every a news segment at the end, where it's just you sending me voice memos of things you wish.
Speaker 1:you would have said have y'all seen the Martha?
Speaker 3:Stewart, I've seen just the two of them.
Speaker 1:Wait, have y'all seen the Martha Stewart documentary? Okay, she is saying things men have been saying forever, but she's saying them so straight-faced. She was like, if your husband's cheating on you, divorce him immediately. And then the guy goes weren't you cheating on him? And she was like, yes, but that was different. I was like but she sends a voice memo in there and she's like these panties on the East side are dead and that makes me very unhappy and I was like yes, let's go, claire.
Speaker 1:Hey, thank you guys for listening. We love having you here. We're so happy to be back for season two. Please give us a review, share us with your friends and if you ever want to reach out and you have a topic you want us to cover or something that you're just wondering about, let us know.
Speaker 3:Before you Cut Things is hosted by Claire Fehrman and Laura Quick and produced by me, Will Ockamy.
