Speaker 1: 0:30

and I'm a mortgage lender there.

Speaker 2: 0:32

Very cool. Now take me back. What drew you to the world of home loans? Just give me a quick overview of your journey, from the start.

Speaker 1: 0:41

My journey started a very long time ago, and that's because my mom has been in the mortgage business since the early 2000s and so I grew up speaking mortgage at the dinner table, and she tried to get me in the business many times, including in high school, where I did some part-time work doing database work. For her, it wasn't the right time then, and it continued to not be the right time for me.

Speaker 1: 1:04

You know, it's really hard to envision yourself doing what your parents do for a long time, and so I went my own way after college, but still in real estate, and real estate became a constant theme in my life, starting out with the federal government through their commercial real estate, and then in commercial agriculture, and then eventually, during COVID times, it became the perfect storm of super low rates, lots of business in mortgage lending, terrible business in commercial agriculture and in commercial office, and all at the same time giving advice to friends and family about how to do house hacking, which I had started out my journey doing and not getting paid for it. And so it was all coming together, pointing me that this was something I should definitely be trying out. And now my mom gets to say I told you so you probably should have started 10 years earlier.

Speaker 1: 2:00

And, yeah, she absolutely loves that. And I think back on it now and I do not know if it would have been better for me to start 10 years earlier, and that's because starting in this business with only six months left of 2% rates taught me how to build my business better, because it was harder to build the business.

Speaker 2: 2:22

I love that. Yeah, that's great. You hold both a BBA and an MBA with a real estate focus, as you mentioned. How has your academic background helped you serve clients differently?

Speaker 1: 2:35

I have a completely different focus than most mortgage lenders. It's because I approach the business as a financial advisor. I spend a lot of my time, when I'm not doing mortgage, looking up obscure tax laws and nerding out about the tax code and all the changes that are upcoming. I speak with CPAs and financial advisors every single day so that I am on the cutting edge of what they're talking to their clients about, so that I can integrate it into what I do. So, in short, I'm a financial advisor that just sells mortgages.

Speaker 2: 3:07

Okay, yeah, I'm sure that's what sets you apart from other mortgage loan officers as well, so that's really amazing. From capital project management to financial coaching, your career is rich in nuance. What parts of that experience do clients benefit from most?

Speaker 1: 3:24

Definitely the process orientation. Much of my early career was in developing templated processes both for the federal government and for real estate investment trusts, on how we could do things more efficiently, but while also delivering excellent service, and so that's what I deliver. In the mortgage space, I deliver highly customized approaches to individuals, but with rigid processes that make sure that everybody gets excellent service.

Speaker 2: 3:49

Yeah, I love that. Processes that make sure that everybody gets excellent service yeah, I love that. I love that you kind of marry the two things that a lot of people don't. You have the rigid process that is needed, but you also have this personalized kind of more not fluid, but a little bit more fluid because it's personal to each client.

Speaker 1: 4:07

And it absolutely needs to be. No, two people should get the exact same mortgage.

Speaker 2: 4:11

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 4:12

Even though a lot of mortgage terms and conditions are standard across the entire industry, there is enough to be done around the edges to customize it for everybody.

Speaker 2: 4:21

Yeah, absolutely. What sets the Pat Holland team at Embrace apart from other mortgage groups in the DMV area?

Speaker 1: 4:29

It's got to be the length of experience and everybody on our team delivers excellent service. That's a given, but it's the depth of experience. Nearly 5,000 families serve so far on that team and that encompasses all kinds of markets and all kinds of loans. Whether it's people who are veterans served our country. Those loans are often looked down upon in the industry. So we're advocates for veterans. We are advocates for people with non-traditional income. That could be some people who write off all their income, which we see a lot, especially in the DC, maryland, virginia area. A lot of contracting companies that will write off everything show zero on the bottom line. It can be challenging to get a mortgage for those people. So we have solutions for them and we really pride ourselves on delivering that custom solution and not turning anybody away because it looks hard on the surface.

Speaker 2: 5:24

Yeah, I definitely. I appreciate that. I'm sure so many people appreciate that, because, I mean, I have family members that have had a difficult time, you know, getting alone because of things like that. So thank you on behalf of everyone. I know, but it's always great to kind of tap into niche, like areas where people just aren't. They're just turning them away for you know for lack of a better term kind of laziness or there is a lot of laziness in our industry. Okay.

Speaker 1: 5:56

It's not just on the lending side. On the real estate side you'll find that some people gravitate either towards the buyer side or the listing side because they don't like to deal with certain kinds of people. So on the buying side, some realtors don't like indecisive people.

Speaker 2: 6:12

Okay, yeah.

Speaker 1: 6:13

Choosing the right home can be difficult, Finding the right staircase. Some people really focus in on that the right neighborhood. But it's always those little things that give us even more joy in our job, finding those quirks, especially in our clients.

Speaker 2: 6:26

Yeah, you guys embrace those quirks.

Speaker 1: 6:29

We do.

Speaker 2: 6:29

Yep, you're known for taking an inquisitive, passionate approach. What does that actually look like in client conversation?

Speaker 1: 6:39

What it looks like is. We start by figuring out your why, and it's similar to why anybody gets into their business, but focusing there first ensures that when I deliver on the financial side, which is the easy part, numbers are very easy to work with. It's the people side that can be difficult. So making sure that we're delivering the right house at the right price point is what it all comes back to, and so the personal approach really encompasses the why of why your family is moving, what it means to them to be in that new location, what it feels like, and if we can deliver that feeling, that's where our success lies.

Speaker 2: 7:18

Okay, yeah, how do you ensure that a client's long-term financial health is factored into every mortgage recommendation that you make?

Speaker 1: 7:27

Yeah, so your finances today may be excellent, but we need to look into what will happen in a couple of years Absolutely, and so while it is not required to get a mortgage and, in fact, I'm not allowed to use any information about future family changes or job changes to make our decisions it does need to be part of how we structure a mortgage.

Speaker 1: 7:50

I'll give you an example. A couple of weeks ago, I helped a family who plans to retire all members of the family within the next couple of years. The news is all talking right now about how refinancing is just around the corner. We've been saying that for years, though, and so, for a family that may not be able to qualify for a refinance in a few years, the structure of the loan needs to be different. We need to go for everything we can today to get them a lower rate instead of a plan that might have them planning on refinancing in a few years. What it looked like for this family was both a temporary interest rate buy down and a permanent interest rate buy down and a permanent interest rate buy down, and so for that family, we've delivered the ending rate on their mortgage, still below where market is today, and giving them a ramp up period now into that new home.

Speaker 2: 8:39

Oh, wow. Yeah, that's great. That makes sense. Yeah, you mentioned your mom was also part of your team, which I think is so cool. How has that family connection shaped the way that you show up in your work?

Speaker 1: 8:54

It's given me a really unique perspective, because I came into the business working both with our branch manager and with my mom and seeing two very different styles of how to deliver excellent service on both sides, and I think what I have gravitated to is somewhere right in the middle of both of their styles and creating my own unique way to deliver that same service. But every single day I'm picking up tips and tricks from both of them. I can call them any day and get advice from somebody who's been in the industry for so long and has seen all of the market shifts that we're seeing now two or three times over.

Speaker 2: 9:32

Yeah, I love that you have these like built-in mentors and that you're still open to always learning as well. I think some people who are so successful like yourself almost put up a wall to like learning more, to tapping into their mentors, but I really love that you still are open to learning, growing and talking to your mom a little bit about things.

Speaker 1: 9:54

I do. I end up talking with her almost every day because of the business.

Speaker 2: 9:59

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 9:59

And so sometimes the rest of my family feels left out because I've already covered everything that we could possibly talk about with her on those calls.

Speaker 2: 10:08

Are you the favorite child?

Speaker 1: 10:10

I won't confirm that, but you said something else about always learning, and that's definitely one of my core values. I'm not a huge music person. In the car, whenever I'm driving somewhere, it's podcasting, and so it's always about networking, about business growth or economics, and so I'm just naturally curious, and if there's a topic I don't know more about now, it's conversations with Gemini or ChatGPT, to make sure that I truly understand what I'm talking about.

Speaker 2: 10:41

Yeah, gemini and ChatGPT are such underrated tools for that there's a lot of controversy and things like that, but they're very underrated tools for learning and for staying on the cutting edge of things. So that's really cool and, as a musician, sometimes I'll take podcasts over music as well, so don't tell anyone, I said that. As someone raised in Fairfax and now living in Reston, how has your deep local knowledge impacted how you serve Northern Virginia buyers?

Speaker 1: 11:12

I think it's given me perspective on how the market has changed over time growing up here, and that will come in when people are talking about expected price appreciation. It comes in when they're talking about changes in zoning laws. As somebody who lived through a school zoning change when I was going into sixth grade, the current changes that are being proposed in Fairfax County really resonate with me and I'm able to talk to people about what changed in my neighborhood, which went from going to Chantilly High School to Fairfax and what happened to the friend groups that I had at the time, because going from fifth to sixth grade in a lot of schools that's very close to or going into, and so I'm able to personalize the things that I'm talking to my clients about because I've lived through many of them in this area.

Speaker 2: 12:02

Yeah, and that builds that trust factor too, so that's awesome. What's something you wish more first-time homebuyers understood about the lending process, especially in the DC, maryland, virginia market?

Speaker 1: 12:16

It needs to start significantly further in advance of when you want to buy than you think. Most people think it needs to start after you've started looking on Zillow and you're like, oh, my lease is coming up in the next three months. Maybe I should figure it out now. That's actually even on the early side of when many people do it. About half my clients come to me and say I want to move within the next 60 days. When many people do it, about half my clients come to me and say I want to move within the next 60 days.

Speaker 1: 12:41

While it can be done, the process is going to feel rushed because it is being rushed. I prefer if we're starting at least a year in advance of when you want to move. What that gives us time to do is make real plans and take action on them to make the journey better. That could be anything from building credit to showing more income on tax returns and many more things to get the person to where their loan will definitely be approved, as opposed to now. We're scrambling. We're already under contract on a house and we have to figure out how to fix something that would have been a really easy solution a year in advance.

Speaker 2: 13:15

Yeah, were you a procrastinator as a kid.

Speaker 1: 13:18

Only on school projects? Okay, yeah, I was just curious, because it sounds like you Were you a procrastinator as a kid, only on school projects.

Speaker 2: 13:20

Okay, yeah, I was just curious, because it sounds like you're definitely not a procrastinator here and I'm always one for kind of playing like the long, slow, steady game to approaching these things, rather than like oh no, I have 60 days. So I was just curious.

Speaker 1: 13:35

But yeah, definitely, definitely in school, but with things that I'm passionate about. But, yeah, definitely definitely in school, but with things that I'm passionate about, definitely not. Yeah, I get that and I can tell that most people are not passionate about the mortgage lending process.

Speaker 2: 13:46

Yeah, that's why they leave it to them.

Speaker 1: 13:48

And that's why you leave it to the end. Right, it makes sense. But you're doing yourself a disservice if you leave it to the end.

Speaker 2: 13:53

Absolutely. That's great advice In terms of like your culture and team dynamics. What's the internal culture like on your team in Edbrace and how does that impact the client experience?

Speaker 1: 14:06

Everybody on the team is just trying to deliver excellent customer service and you can tell that especially when we get a client who's going through something difficult whether it's work or not finding the right house every single interaction they're having with somebody on my team is reinforcing that we're there to help them, and sometimes that's helping them find a new job, which we did recently for a client or helping find them people to help them move for free, if they're you know.

Speaker 1: 14:35

especially if a disadvantaged family needs financial support to get to that next home, we can only do so much within the lending process to access more cash for them. Sometimes it's reaching out to the rest of our network to make sure that they're well taken care of oh I love that you guys do that.

Speaker 2: 14:51

It's kind of that pay it forward mentality.

Speaker 1: 14:56

Absolutely. It always is in the benefit of everybody to pay it forward.

Speaker 2: 14:59

Exactly what's something your team celebrates or does behind the scenes that makes a big difference in how you operate, I guess, aside from paying it forward.

Speaker 1: 15:08

Yeah. So we're obviously very numbers focused in mortgage lending. So whenever we're having our best month ever, even if it's just by $1 more, that gets celebrated. Oh yay, having our best month ever, even if it's just by $1 more, that gets celebrated. We are always celebrating teammates that go above and beyond on customer service, so five-star reviews are always celebrated, as they should be.

Speaker 2: 15:28

I'd love a good five-star review. All right, the fun part, personality and like tapping into your passions. I saw that you're kind of known for your love of cooking. What's one dish you make that always wins people over?

Speaker 1: 15:43

It is spicy miso braised short ribs. It's done with two handfuls of Thai chilies, which is always a gamble Sometimes they're hot, sometimes they're not and it really comes from my passion for blending cuisines. It's done in French-style cuisine, so sort of like a beef bourguignon, but with all Asian ingredients.

Speaker 2: 16:05

And it's one of my favorite things to make Amazing Do you ever cook for your team?

Speaker 1: 16:10

I have cooked a few times for company potlucks, and the one that is a real hit, that takes almost no time at all, is a smoked cream cheese dip. You buy a block of cream cheese, put whatever season you like on it I like either everything, bagel or like za'atar and you put it on the smoker at a low temperature for an hour and that's it.

Speaker 2: 16:31

Oh my gosh, you just gave a free crowd pleaser like recipe to everyone watching.

Speaker 1: 16:38

So that one came from Pinterest originally, so I cannot, oh my gosh, you should just claim it.

Speaker 2: 16:42

It's fine. You're also involved with HART. Why is animal rescue important to you and how do you support that mission? Today I saw on your website you have a picture, I think, with an elephant or something right, yeah.

Speaker 1: 16:55

So the elephant one was a sanctuary in Thailand we visited where they rescue elephants from hard labor camps or places that make them give rides to humans all day. Oh my gosh. On the heart side that one's an animal rescue for dogs and cats in Northern Virginia. They have local organizations for heart in most cities. So whatever city you're listening to this in, definitely check them out. Both of our pets right now were rescued from heart and a portion of all of my commissions go back to heart and it's because I believe in animal rescue and no homeless animals. But it really goes back to they don't have a choice why they were abandoned and if we can do a little bit to help them, we should.

Speaker 2: 17:42

Oh, thank you on behalf of me and my rescue little cat, willow. That's awesome. This is kind of one of the last ones. If you could combine your passion for food and real estate into one dream project, what would that look like?

Speaker 1: 17:58

There's already plans for this, Really so. International property is big on my to-do list as well, and so dream is to have it might not be in Italy, but an Italian villa type place with a garden, open air cooking space and like rescue animals all over the place.

Speaker 2: 18:18

That's so amazing, and you already have plans in place.

Speaker 1: 18:20

We will be visiting Italy later this year. We're going to do, you know, a little bit more scouting We've been before but the plan is to have a couple of international properties where we can put down roots as well.

Speaker 2: 18:31

That's amazing. Well, congrats on kind of getting started with that and I hope you have a wonderful trip. But that sounds incredible. Is there anything I didn't touch on that you'd like to share with us today?

Speaker 1: 18:45

I think that people need to speak with somebody in the real estate industry, even if you are consuming tons of real estate news. The reason is real estate is hyperlocal.

Speaker 2: 18:57

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 18:57

And it does work on vibes, not just on the hard numbers. So when we're looking at data that's pushed out even by very reputable sources we'll take Wall Street Journal, for example those are usually national numbers, and even when they write stories about a specific person in a town where they had a hard time buying a home, the numbers aren't everything. And you do need to speak with a local realtor, a local lender, to figure out what's different from those numbers, especially for somebody in your particular situation.

Speaker 2: 19:32

Okay, yeah, that makes a lot of sense and thank you for sharing that, because I feel like a lot of people do want to kind of handle everything on their own and, you know, look online and come to their own conclusions. But I am of the same belief as you. I think it's always better to kind of consult a professional and really get their like kind of inside, take on things, because they're the ones that this is their bread and butter. So, totally agree. Amazing that this is their bread and butter. So, yeah, amazing. Thank you, joe, so much for coming in and making the time to talk to us about Embrace Home Loans and your journey. This has been such a fascinating conversation and I know our audience is gonna love that recipe tip but also everything else we talked about. So thank you.