4 - Exhausted by Perfectionism | The Sleepy Sisters Podcast

Who has the energy to try to be perfect anymore? Do we still need to pretend we're striving for the best anyone has ever known? Let's discuss...

Sleepy Sisters podcast is hosted by Elizabeth Brink and Sarah Durham. This show is unedited and often unprepared for, so we hope you enjoy our resistance to perfection!

Find us online:
www.thrivingsistercoaching.com
www.kattywhompous.com

Sleepy Sisters podcast is hosted by Elizabeth Brink and Sarah Durham. This show is unedited and often unprepared for, so we hope you enjoy our resistance to perfection!
www.thrivingsistercoaching.com
www.kattywhompous.com

Transcript

Unknown: 0:03

Hello low. The Sleepy sisters are back. I really can't believe people are listening to this, but I downloads you all 50 Download sponsors that you. I mean, I might have been like eight of those but still. It's fine. Yeah, Elizabeth brink, Sarah Durham are sisters, and this is our podcast. We said we do not edit, and we rarely prepare for welcome. Okay, let's get into it so that it doesn't go too long. Sarah has a cold. So you might hear a little cough, she's going to try to keep it away. And we also have a brother who has offered to make the sound quality better on this thing, but we'll see if like, we can really get this thing going because that's more sibling involvement and, and also to like, I feel like the way we started this podcast and kind of like the topic we're gonna talk about today. I feel like this podcast is like kind of our act of resistance against like the curation of like our society. Yeah. And like, if we're gonna show up, we know our bandwidth cannot handle too much prep. That's like, trying to make it all smooth and post production. I'll try not to bring an annoying sound every week because with the noise Krakow last week, and now my voice and the call. And if I laugh too hard, I may start coughing so Oh, I gotta get that mute button. Ready? Yeah, get your finger on the mute button. I will. Okay, so we're gonna talk about perfectionism, which is so freaking exhausting. So it totally fits the theme of making a sleepy, but I am so glad that we're talking about this today, because I am hosting some friends tomorrow afternoon to talk about somatic healing. And I was being all cute and made it like it's gonna be a high tea. And then one of them asked me about like, well, what, what is high tea? I looked it up and do I need to wear a dress and I was like, Oh, no. My version of a high tea, sent another message and was like, it's like casual high tea, which doesn't exist. And now I'm like thinking about the menu. And I'm like, gonna go to the store later today. And I am so prone to want to entertain in these environments. Perfectly, like, oh, it's fall, I should get pumpkin stuff. Or I should bake a really pretty Bundt cake. And I'm like, time for that. I don't have time for that. It's exhausting thinking about it. And it's gonna be fine no matter what. But I had not been thinking about perfectionism when I was making the grocery list. So there's things on there like dill, and I'm like, I'm not getting Dell. Sorry, friends, you're not getting little sprigs of anything. Um, okay, so perfectionism, you have some thoughts about this. So take us there. So I think it kind of is always perfection. Perfectionism, the word has, I've never resonated with that. And I think, you know, when I was like, kind of thinking this through, I've been doing some work around this. Because, you know, typically, when I am in a situation where I'm having to take a risk, or reach out or do these different things, like what gets in the way, is this edge, that is often called perfectionism, except for the fact that like, that's never resonated with me. And so it's always kind of been, like, it's not it right? But then I'm still stuck. You know, Elizabeth, and I lost a brother, when we were really little. So like, I've never lived in a perfect world, but someone says, It's perfectionism, I think, no, I don't really ever think I'm trying to be perfect at anything. And but the the problem with it is that language is really important for me in order for me to be able to kind of make meaning of my world and try to figure out like, how to move past whatever that thing is. And so I've been thinking about it even more this last week, especially when we had like, siblings, like, Oh, they're so critical on the podcast and all that and like, I didn't really care and like, you know, there's different things that come up, where, you know, I will overthink those things. I may not necessarily care enough to actually change them. But it will like come up and it requires energy and all that stuff. So anyway, I was thinking about why perfectionism doesn't like really resonate with me and what I could do about that. I'm like, I need another ism. I need another word to describe what it is. And I looked at, I looked up the word perfect. So I was like, Maybe I have the word wrong. Right? Oh, interesting. So there are a few definitions. And one of them is like, to get as good as possible, right? You just like, just as good as you can get it. Another one says, like to, you know, do something without fault. And I'm like, those are very different things to me. As good as possible, or without fault. Yeah. Seems like two ends of the Yeah, okay. Yeah. So, so, anyway, um, so I'm going to kind of describe kind of like, what I picture symbolically, in my mind. And we don't have to come up with a new ism word today. But I felt like it was important because it got me to the place of where I could kind of unlock about moving forward in some of these things that come up. So when I think about perfectionism, I think, okay, so here's a circle, like, imagine a circle. And everything outside of that circle is perfectionism. I'm not going there. It's space prevented, right? So I'm inside the circle, and we'll all humans are inside that circle, right? And what I feel like, where I get stuck, is not in the reaching towards perfectionism. It's that very narrowed layer around the circle of like, what society says we should fit into. And the way our culture has moved is that it's kind of tricky, because it's not perfect. It's it, you know, our systems and our culture are like, oh, yeah, flaws are okay, you know, not doing things perfectly are okay. But when you really examine it, it's actually not attainable either. No, humans live in that very narrowed rim of what we call like, you know, I guess like, what are what we call people to kind of like, move towards right. Does that make sense? Wait, so we're having we're calling people toward the edge of the circle? Society systems? I mean, I don't think you and I are, I think you and I are trying to stay inside the circle. We're trying to be just our authentic selves, right? We're just trying to be Oh, imperfect is outside of the circle. It's unattainable. You can't get out. I'm not trying to go there. Right. Okay. But there's like a magnet. You know, what I'm picturing? I'm picturing at Six Flags, that ride where you get in it, and you're sitting up against a wall and it spins and like, pushes you against the wall? Yeah. And then you feel like vomiting. But you know, I mean, like, that's what I'm picturing. Like, the world kind of wants you to be as hard up against the edge of like, trying to reach outside of the circle into perfectionism as possible. Is that what you're saying? Yeah, and part of why it's so complicated is that, you know, we don't like, you know, the world has kind of moved away from like, keep everything a secret that's not, you know, that's not, you know, that may present in a certain way or whatever. It's like we have moved more towards like being able to be a little different and like to have flaws, but there's still very small lists of acceptable flaws. If you have too many, or if you do it too many days in a row, it becomes, you know, if you're too much of an outlier. So it's, but like, being in that kind of rim of the, you know, the outside of the circle or on the circle, but like the rim of the circle, right? Because the flaws or having like, you know, the illusion of like, you don't have to be perfect, right? We think it's attainable, and it's not, it's exhausting. We might have a bounce up in there, like, every 10 years, or a few months or whatever. But to kind of like, be in there. No one lives inside of there. But because it actually isn't perfect, and actually has some like little glimmers of humanity. I still find myself bumping up trying to get up to that. And it's freaking wiping me out. Because really what the bottom line is, is that what I've figured out, or what I've realized, is that, that the rim of that circle is just a full time job of curation. It's just a full time job of curating like whatever waters I'm swimming in at the time, or system on site at the time, or who am around it's like, what's their list of like acceptable Yeah, right. And it changes and would widen the road tight. That's not a good match. I don't spoons for that. And I also have had enough healing where I don't I rebel against that, right. And so there's all of this tension. I feel like on a regular basis of me trying to say more in the circle. Yeah, you're trying to, you know, it's still picturing that ride. And I'm like, Yeah, as it's like speeding up or slowing down. It's like, oh, maybe I could step more into the middle. We went, we went to Silver Dollar City, a month or so ago, which is in Missouri, which I live in Missouri. Newsflash, but anyway, there was this. It wasn't a ride, but it was like a, whatever. A thing there. Were you it was like a grandparents house or something and you went into it, it was an experience, I'll call it and you went into it. And somehow they had architected is that a word? Art, I don't care, made the room, in a way. But I wanted to use architects because it felt, I don't know if it because it was very structural, where it felt like the room, they had built it in a way that it was like on a slant. But also everything in the room was on a slant, including the art and there were mirrors on a slant. I can't explain it other than I walked in, and I immediately felt like I was gonna vomit. Because I'm old. And I live, I could not walk across the room to the exit. I was like, having the hardest time. It's hard to explain. But it really messed up like my equilibrium, trying to like see everything slanted and then trying to walk straight across this room to get out as fast. It's like good. And I the there was a wall and there were handles on the walls, because I guess lots of people have this kind of reaction. My kids thought it was hilarious. But so I walked through this room holding onto this wall feeling like I was being pulled to one side and was not going to be able to stand up, right. And we got to the other side of it. And it was a hallway to like the exit. And like physically in my body, it was the weirdest experience. I mean, I hated it. And the kids loved it. But it was one of those trippy experiences where like, my perception of the room affected how my body could even navigate the room. And it comes to mind because I'm thinking about how if we're if we're leaning out, and we're always like reaching toward this edge of this, you know, this, this growth edge of like perfection is just beyond the horizon, how that perception of what we're seeing. And what we're trying to reach for has this effect on literally how we can move in our lives, how we can move through our lives. And that if you've ever been in a funhouse like that, which was not fun, but if you've ever been in an experience like that, I think it's a good illustration for like how it feels to be in this world. Sometimes it just feels like I don't know, if I can make it from one side of the room to the other. If I have to do it this way, because it's all slanted in a way that doesn't work for me, or feels like it's going to take me 10 times more effort to get to that place. And to have to call it good to call it done. than it looks like it is for other people. I mean, Cory didn't have as hard a time going through that thing. He still was like, you know, off to but like, it just seemed to have a very significant impact on me. And I see that in real life. I see other people, you know, walking through the world, living their lives with different kinds of hardships, different kinds of privileges. And we all look like we're coping differently. And I think that like that call toward perfectionism is different depending on who you are and where you come from, and you know what was modeled for you. But it's no less disorienting to anyone. Like it's disorienting to everyone to feel like it's not good enough. Or maybe it could be better. All the time. Yeah, I think I just I Yeah, and I think I need a new word because I feel like perfectionism isn't it. It's this. It's this other, this other expectation. That is like, Okay, we've moved past the fact that like, anyone expects anyone to be perfect. In fact, if you present too perfect no one wants that either. People make up stuff like someone comes in to perfect they're like, oh, I have to like put a flaw. They're like, Oh my gosh, I'm such an airhead or I'm so this oops. If You look too good. Yeah. Cuz it's super weird if you can stay up against that wall up against the edge of that circle. So it's like, you know, and I think, honestly, the system has come alongside that as well, I think, you know, a lot of stuff supports this idea that, yeah, like, it's okay. Like, you know, we have a lot of language around. Sure you should take care of yourself. And sure everyone lets mental health awareness, you know, things that the system doesn't necessarily follow through with. But they know enough that the masses are like, we can't do perfect, we can't show up perfectly. So it's kind of this like, illusion of attainability, that feels still viscerally like perfection, it will still tank you it will still like, and yes, some people can get close to that. But I think any human, you don't live in that space. But I also think too, like. I think the hard part about it is that it looks like humanities in there. Because it's no less like, you have no, I don't really feel like you have a closer access to your whole full humanity there than you would outside in the space of perfection. Because even if you're really good at stuff, I need a lot of resources. I just think that like, it's still this, it depends on the waters you're in, like I've said, like, it depends, like that bar is still going to be changed and kind of moved and narrowed according to like, whatever, like, yeah, next Yeah. Like, oh, you in the 1% can be on this outer edge of this circle. And like, now you're gonna rank and file among yourselves, and we're gonna fail less. Right. And I think that like, you know, as far as for me, like, what gets in the way is the fact that this, this, this outer edge is largely mastered, and I guess mastered or like, people have more access to it according to like, how well they can curate themselves and their experience and what they're offering to the world. And that takes a lot of energy and time, that I personally don't have access to, and don't necessarily want access to I mean, you know, it's like, I have a specific, you know, neuro type that makes that more challenging. And also, I've had a lot of healing and trauma in my nervous system, to where like, I want more access to my authentic voice, I don't necessarily want to curate on your terms, Mr. or whoever. And yeah, because like, if you get in touch with your authentic voice, you often will start to abandon some of these things that keep you striving for perfection. And I think, too, you know, we have to name privilege, you know, that there's this huge privilege and being able to try to attain perfection in any one particular thing. In actually attaining, you know, highest accolades in any one particular thing often involves, you know, things other than elbow grease. And, and I think, we don't talk about that enough. And we focus so much on the individual and laud you know, them for, oh, they just are so good at this thing. And, and then we all just kind of sit and wonder, like, wow, they are so good at that one thing. I'm not good like that at any thing. I mean, I have so many clients who feel this kind of shame around hobbies. And I know I'd post about this sometimes online, but just this sense of like, I'm not doing anything at a proficient level, let alone at a perfection level. Right. But like, what it has done this, like, over curated life, where we're only seeing the people doing the things well, is that everybody else who wants to try something new, it has, it's almost like our ability to cope with the discomfort of being in the learning stages, especially the early learning stages of something new. It's unbearable, and it's you know, for some people, it's just intolerable. It's like I don't want to be learning I feel like this about a lot of things. I don't want to be learning how to crochet I want to be like really good at crochet and like making gifts for people that they cherish. Well, that's actually probably never going to happen for me. I mean, I don't know maybe in my old old age, I'll get there, but it's not going to happen for me with painting are some other things that I've like, dabbled in because I don't have any intentions of like, trying to aim for that kind of beyond proficiency to some kind of like novice or whatever. But I think it just like gets in the way of us being able to explore and experiment thing with things. And then our world and our life shrinks. Yes. Right. So then we're just like, Okay, well, I guess this is the only path is just to sit here and wish that I could be someone else. And, you know, when I hear people come in to the coaching space and say, like, I just want to be able to pick a thing and do a thing, I just want to be really good at something. But there are things they're really good at. But it's like, they got good at something. And now the, the marker has moved, now the goalposts has moved and it's not satisfying. It's like, well, I want to be able to be good at this other thing, because I see people doing this really well. I see people socializing or whatever, and having great parties or whatever, and I want to be able to do that really well. Like the target is just going to keep moving. Yeah, and I think also, too, exactly, I think, you know, what adds fuel to the fire on that is social media, because then you have people not only showing up, once they get to that like kind of like outcome, like ish, like, part of life when they've taken this, like, whatever they're doing, and kind of like, been become proficient or mastered it, and they're presenting it, or they're doing it in sound bites. So we don't really know what the full life looks like. Right? Right. So, you know, whereas, like, if you're walking alongside people in their lives, and you're seeing that you're around, right, you're around, like, where they're meeting their edges in some of these different places. And it definitely levels the playing field. And I know, like with the younger generations, like young adults, too, you know, I hear all the time just about how there's all these parts of like, kind of coming of age or, you know, dating or being, you know, growing friendships and like those early adult years, where it's, you know, people don't even know how to access some of these posts themselves, because they've curated so much of their lives already, like online, that they they haven't, they're not walking alongside people to like, really be honest about who they are, or, like, you know, their challenges and things like that. And so that makes it really hard to be vulnerable and to like, you know, date and to be in relationships with other friends, things like that. There's just this curation, this, like, you know, and listen, I listen, that I'm not talking about, you know, people shouldn't like do their best and like, if they want to really passion about something they want to like, present it, I just think that there's so much focus on you know, cutting out the parts that are unsavory, or really hard and challenging, that a lot of us are feeling really isolated and really, you know, tired and sleepy because literally, you know, we're trying to like, it's not attainable. And if it's not, but I also think so here's, here's one little anecdote that I do think can help. And I am saying this with like, full transparency. I've only been doing this for three days. Ready for it? And I didn't mean anecdote I met. What did I mean? antidote? Right? No, anecdote is right. No, it's not a story. It's a thing. It's like an an antidote. Oh, an antidote. Like, like, you're gonna like cure disease, right? Yeah. Yeah. antidote. Okay. Okay. All right, we're clear. So I've been doing this for three days. But it's this appreciation practice. It's gonna sound super cheesy. And it may be it is. But Cory and I have been doing this in the evening for the last three evenings where we have sat down and we have shared, we've taken turns sharing three things that we have appreciated about our day or three, like things during the day we felt thankful for. And then three things that we appreciate about the other person. And in doing this, it's really because we take turns and we each do three, it has provided this opportunity for us to actually connect with each other and have a sense of what's good in the world in this moment. This tiny little thing, sorry, trying to laugh at Sarah's like dying on camera, and she's me. Oh, that's it. Oh my gosh, y'all. I'm going to pause the recording for just a moment while she catches her breath. Hold on. Okay, so there was probably no time there from the pause. But Sarah is fine. But she started laughing at herself. And that made it worse. So anyway, this appreciation practice what I'm noticing in these three days, which is not insignificant for somebody who has a hard time forming new habits, I'm just gonna say is that I am fixated less on the negative stuff like, even throughout the day, like thinking about what am I going to tell him that I appreciated about my day today and yesterday, and today had been like, really busy days. And it just like has been more on my radar. Like, I do think there's something happening in my brain, by us just like having this intentional space, to just say, like, here's some good things that happened today. And so in the appreciation for each other piece, I gotta say, I really need this in my life. And I needed it like my whole life and having him pause for just a few minutes. And think of like three things he saw or witnessed or three things about me he was thinking about or noticed in that day like specifics, because you yesterday was like, naming three specific things because I like made a yummy dinner and, and then he was like, let me reframe this and talk about three things I appreciate about your character that, you know, maybe these things that you did today, point to but also like, let me talk about your character. And y'all I cried, hearing somebody just say like, I really appreciate this about who you are, and like really see you and be able to say that is powerful. And, you know, it was day three, and I had a hard time coming up with three things about him that I appreciated that day. That was just a long pause for number three, because we're not with each other all day long. But it was just really lovely to sit and pause and actually think about one another and about our lives. From a positive angle that didn't feel gaslighting, it just felt like, can we notice the other stuff too. And I'm very curious about if we can continue this practice for an extended period of time, I am curious about the effect it will have on both of us in relation to perfectionism. And how we perform and how we show up in the world. Because it's really hard to be focused on all that negative input that drives you toward doing something perfect and being really, quote, good. If you're starting to have your like eyes and ears out for the things that are already going well and and are already worth appreciating. And like each day, one of mine was like the trees changing. And then yesterday that I noticed the trees are all kind of like dead now. And I was like, I am so glad that I appreciated the trees the previous two days because I love the autumn change of colors in the trees, more than most things outside. And I just anyway, I do think that like, it's one part of like setting down the commitment to the grind. And I think this other piece of like, can we be more president with the counter world of things that are going on that are good, in a way that's like building us up and not just feeling you know, silly and petty, you know, we don't just want the opposite of the harsh competitive perfectionism we want like, but what's good here and one of the things Sorry, I'm talking for a long time. This is my last comment. One of the things that that I've learned in somatic experiencing is not just looking for, okay, what's the counter? Where's the good, but like, if things are really bad in your life, and you're having a really hard season or or stretch of yours maybe looking for what's less bad? Is there anything less awful, just noticing that there's a difference between some of these things helps your nervous system to shift in and out of the heavy, hard, bad stuff and the what maybe is a little bit less so and I think that helps us disrupt perfectionism. It's a it's a hypothesis I have so we'll see. We'll see how that plays out. I'm going to unmute I was like oh is there's going to be sound coming out of my mouth. I'm not sure. Yeah, I like that. And I like you know you and I always talk about just fine Adding a little bit more ease. I mean, I think when we're trying to go in a direction that we want more of or less of, I guess, depending on what it is, just like you said, just kind of titrating in or like a little bit more ease, kind of takes the focus off of the big thing that we think we're trying to attain. That was bandanas. Like I went off of camera. I think I can laugh now safely. As I feel like Elizabeth really wrap that up lovely. I think that's a great place to start. And I think I'm actually going to do that too. I'm going to try that. I do a lot of like, I do some gratitude stuff in my meditation. But it doesn't often it's me. It's a one man show. Yeah. Like, what am I grateful for? What am I grateful for about myself? But I think sometimes having like a partner or a friend or someone that you care about, like reflecting back or saying things to you, and it's, let's, let's be real, it feels good. And it's really it does. Oh, and you started this like a month or two ago, you started in our sibling? Yeah, thread. On Sundays. Sarah started sending out like, Okay, what's one thing you're grateful for? And what's one thing that's kicking your behind right now? And all five of us are showing up in that space and sharing those things? And I just think it's really helpful to be balancing out the heart, the striving, the whatever it is. Yeah, yeah. Okay. Okay. But I have to, I have to go back and I have to talk about that really quick, because I know you're gonna get off. Oh, I do. I had to go. So okay. Okay, so she's in here, she's telling this stuff, and she's looking at me, coughing, and I look like I'm going to die. I thought about it. I was like, what is happening? When I say that has never happened. I'm telling you that it's never happened. I have never had a coughing egg like that in my life. I was struggling. I didn't know if I was gonna pee my pants. I didn't know if I was gonna pass out on the floor. I was up was bananas. And of course we're, you know, doing this podcast. And she's like, I'm just like, picturing her. Like, if she passes out, or she falls out of it hits her head. What do I do? You know, it's really awful, is that I was thinking, Oh, this has been such a good episode. So far. I don't want to lose. Oh, that's okay, too. Hello. But Hello, the perfectionism versus humidity. It's like, you're looking like you're okay, hacking up a lung, maybe vomiting. I couldn't tell if the laughing was making it worse, because it was such a weird situation because I was struggling and it's muted. And she's over there. I'm trying to still talk. And I finally realized this might be unedited, but I can pause the recording for a minute if things go sell. So I'm glad that you all didn't sit here awkwardly with me for that whole stretch. Okay, thanks for hanging out. This was a great start to this conversation. And if anybody's out there listening, and you try this appreciation practice, or you have thoughts about perfectionism, like please feel feel free to reach out to text us because you probably know us personally. Or you can send us an email or something. We'd love to hear from any of our listeners. I did get a Marco Polo from one and it was really nice, is a good friend of mine. So all right. I hope you guys have a great rest of your day. Love you. Bye bye. Love you