Concrete Inspection: GPR, Ultrasound & AI Explained

In this episode of Concretely, Johannes Lohner speaks with Dr. Koichi Oba, CEO of Proceq, about modern concrete inspection and the future of non-destructive testing.

They discuss key technologies such as ground penetrating radar (GPR), ultrasonic testing, impact echo, and eddy current, and how these methods are combined to assess the condition of concrete structures. The conversation also covers AI-driven crack detection, automated reporting, cloud-based data platforms, and the integration of inspection data into BIM and digital workflows.

A major focus is on the growing challenge of aging infrastructure, the shortage of experienced inspectors, and how automation, robotics, and better data interpretation can improve efficiency at scale.

For more information visit: www.concrete-ly.com

Transcript

Introduction & guest Dr. Koichi Oba

SPEAKER_00 0:03

Willkommen by Concretely. I'm euer host Johannes Lona and ich unterhalte mich mit experten aus unterhalten unserer Bauwerke. Welcome back everyone. Today we do our first episode in English actually because we have a very special guest who feels more familiar in expressing the technical vocabulary in English. Today is about testing technology and the future. Our very special guest today is Dr. Kuichi Ober. He has a very impressive resume that speaks for itself. He's originally from Japan. Did his PhD at KTH in Sweden. He joined Hilti, a global company where he was uh product director for business unit chemicals. Afterwards, he joined Zika. He was there also head of roofing globally. He was GM also of Diflex, that is a company that Zika acquired. After 12 years at Zika, he joined Holzim. There he was global head of mineral materials for another couple of years. And now he is at Prosec, which is a company that does testing equipment where he is CEO. Prosec is part of Techdos group. They include also other companies, for instance, Screening Eagle, that focuses uh more on the software for the testing tools. Then Dream Lab, which is uh, I think in Singapore based, uh they focus also on research, data analytics and AI. He is an executive member of the Carbon Construction Tech Group, and he is also president of TechDos Japan, member of the board of the Swiss Japanese Chamber of Commerce, as he often had positions in Japan and came back to Europe uh and back to Japan as I understood. Um I think I couldn't make the introduction shorter, um, but it's very impressive. Welcome uh to concretely, Koichi. Thanks a lot for the perfect introduction. Welcome. Um before we start with the real questions, I I seldom meet people that worked at Hilti, Seeker, and Holzim. And I wanted to know from your experience do these companies differ a lot in in terms of how they value customer support, RD marketing people, or is it all the same basically?

SPEAKER_01 2:30

No, I think it's uh amazingly, you know, every company, even only in Switzerland, is quite different. Uh I mean Hilti is very much marketing-driven, process-oriented, excellent, uh, management-driven company. And uh uh Hilti is of course, you know, private. They uh purchased the share back. So I think since 1980s it's a private company. Sika is a public company, and uh Sika prefers uh lots of long-term employees bringing in the long-term experience and the engineering know-house.

SPEAKER_00 3:12

And you you know uh the former CEO of Sika and Holzim quite well. No, who's now on the board of yes, yes.

SPEAKER_01 3:20

I mean, he's probably one of the most successful CEO in Switzerland. I think he was awarded twice uh the CEO of the year. So uh I'm very fortunate to uh uh be working with him so closely. So uh I also learned a lot from his uh the way of managing the company.

unknown 3:40

Yeah.

Japan vs Europe – construction differences

SPEAKER_00 3:41

Jan Jenish, yeah. Um, I mean these companies are very huge now in the in the meantime, you know. But you say the culture is still what keeps them apart, basically. I wanted to ask this later, but you have a lot of experience between Japan and the Dach area, Germany, Switzerland, Austria. What would you say are the biggest differences and and the differences maybe the other side is lacking at the moment for good quality constructing and maintenance?

SPEAKER_01 4:09

I think uh from the engineering point of view, I mean uh Japan to start with, uh seismic country, so you have uh another number of uh rebars. So riba pitch is uh different than here. And uh of course, if you uh talk about the different construction from uh let's say uh 10 meters bridge pier to a normal uh concrete in the normal buildings, of course, the way of building concrete is different, and uh of course the compression strength is different. Uh but all in all, I guess we can say there are some standardized concrete technology of 30-35 megapascal concrete with a certain number of arribas, but then there are certain countries they need to hire the specification of concrete based on their severe environment from static to uh uh let's say corrosion environment and XYZ, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:12

But this is all set in the regulations, so the regulations differ, right?

SPEAKER_01 5:17

Which and also uh I guess uh probably you want to touch base about this carbon topic. You know, they are like Europe is very much driven on the the carbon initiatives, but uh if you go to some other countries, they of course use conventional uh limestone-based cement and uh the CO2 emission from the uh the cement production, of course, regulate it differently from one country to another, then it makes of course the difference in the concrete quality. And uh, of course, for us is again uh quite interesting and challenge uh to inspect or develop the inspection uh product and systems. Uh we covered a global standard. Yeah.

Innovation in a conservative industry

SPEAKER_00 6:09

It's interesting uh because you mentioned that Europe is pushing this carbon technologies to replace uh conventional reinforcement steel that it can corrode in concrete structures and also trying to or removing CO2 or cement from concrete? Um this is very hard to do in the construction industry, no, because the structures have to last for 80 hundred years and no engineer wants to have the risk on her or him to try new things that might fail. Um, so how does this work in such a conservative industry to innovate?

Role of associations & standards

SPEAKER_01 6:46

Well, um I would say two entities are responsible. First is of course the the supplier, uh material supplier, we are the equipment supplier. Uh we have to bring in the new technologies, which is probably not uh existing in the market yet. But this technology should bring the value into the market, which is often in terms of cost efficiency. So uh the contractor will save money by having the construction period by half, or they have efficient data analysis systems, X, Y, Z. And secondly, um, I think the group of suppliers which often create associations. So, association, I was also the president of the European Waterproofing Association, and uh the association consisting of different uh suppliers, but of their competitors, but association has to uh change the market by promoting the new innovation into the market. So uh that's how I see the challenge. You know, one is supplier and uh the other one is association, we have to change the market. Of course, the market is very much driven by those companies, inspectors, general contractor, as you say, doing the work for the last 100 years in a similar way, as long as they don't see any benefit of bringing in innovation. Right. So uh that's that's how I see uh that that's our responsibility as a supplier to bringing in the new innovation.

SPEAKER_00 8:38

Yeah. And that can only work if you can build trust, no? If you're a small company and you have no track record, and you say you have this uh wonder uh material that can solve all problems, uh it's hard uh to convince. Certainly, yeah. Certainly, that's uh not only about the technology itself. And I I really like your point about the associations, which I think it's it's crucial. And uh it's also a mindset we we want to promote with this podcast to work together that experts from different stakeholder groups can discuss and and then agree on how we can do uh efficient sustainable job in the in the future. Um, does a prospect try to support these associations in their work? How how can you help them innovate well?

Introduction to concrete inspection

SPEAKER_01 9:26

Well, um two things. One, uh many of our experts sit in the let's say this association or more like a standardization committee. So uh in such a way we bring in new uh new technology to the national standard, and in such a way uh we can bring in the new way of inspection and uh new way of uh data analytics, and that's one thing. The secondly, um unfortunately, I have never seen like an international association of non-destructive testing suppliers. Uh we don't have it, maybe we should have it. But uh, we are often asked by the National Non-Destructive Testing Association to uh support them a certification program, like an inspector certification program. There we have opportunity to bring in our new innovation so the inspector will be aware of what they can do better using different ways of uh inspection.

Schmidt hammer, GPR, ultrasound overview

SPEAKER_00 10:48

Okay, yeah, yeah. Good uh Kuichi. I think it's finally time uh to go into the topic of this uh um podcast. I think it was a good introduction also, uh, talking about innovation. Uh, and now we can um yeah uh continue on the example of testing equipments. So um yeah, maybe I do a quick introduction. Um you already mentioned the Eddy Current. Uh there are different tools available on the market that help engineers make more than a visual inspection of a structure, which is uh often necessary. Um one of them, for instance, uh what I think was uh the first one of the first uh tools that Prosek developed, the Schmidt hammer, which I also used uh on an old construction on a ceiling for the beams. Uh it's uh it's a rebound hammer, it's a hand tool that you press against the concrete strong enough, and then with a feather it rebounds and it can make an assessment of the strength uh through through the rebound uh of this concrete. It's very quick and easy to do on a concrete surface. So you have already a bit of a feeling of if this is a sound good concrete or or not. Another one that also Koichi mentioned is a GPR, ground penetrating rudder, which is also a nice tool I used a couple of times. Um most importantly, I think, is for detecting the rebar cover, um, which is of course uh very crucial for the durability and service life of concrete structures because the rebuk cover protects the reinforcement steel inside from corrosion. But it can also be used for other things because the GPR goes in deeper than the eddy current. Um yeah, so you can also say a bit about the concrete thickness. And if you really want to go deeper, I think then you can use uh ultrasonic tools. I think that also is offered by Prosec for tendance pipes as well, right? To see if there are shallow holes, sauce tension and cables. Um, then uh also very interesting, I think, to mention half-cell potential measurement. We did an own episode about this technology before with um Aldo Rancati from Technotest. Was this uh general overview? Uh a good one for for testing tools for concrete, the most important ones.

SPEAKER_01 13:12

Yeah, uh Johannes, thanks a lot. Um, yes, uh that covers all this uh the testing equipment we have and the systems uh uh for the concrete. We also have a product for metal and also the road uh marking, and uh, but that's uh not the topic for today, right?

SPEAKER_00 13:32

No, yeah. We focus on concrete concretely today. Um, yeah, sometimes it's not clear for me 100% when to use GPR and when ultrasonic and when eddy current. Do you wanna maybe elaborate on this for also the listeners?

When to use GPR, eddy current & ultrasound

SPEAKER_01 13:49

Yes. So uh um so our principle is uh protect the build world and uh protect the build world focusing on the concrete structure, of course. And uh we often explain uh our business like you go to a doctor, right? The doctor will look at your eye, look at your skin, then measure the pulse, listen to heart, and then you scan the CT scan or make a Rentan or maybe ultrasound and then diagnose your health condition. So uh we have our business concept very similar that way. So we want to uh diagnose, we want to provide a system and solutions uh for our client to uh diagnose the health condition of a concrete structure. So, first of all, uh visual inspection, and then secondly, you uh we also have uh now AI software to uh detect the concrete cracks, uh surface cracking, and then you uh impact and listen to the echo because impact echo, and then you can also uh detect some of the delamination, surface delamination or air voice, and then you come to the ultrasound, and ultrasound typically you detect those area which uh interface between the different materials. So typically, like an air voice in the concrete you can detect, and but that's all this in the spot wise. You cannot scan it, right? You you take the ultrasound and use spotwise, you have certain area of measurement area, and then you can inspect. Then comes the GPR, or maybe uh I should start with the AD current. An AD current you can actually scan, and then you can create uh let's say the image, right? And uh you can of course, as you say, the AD current, you can uh measure the thickness of the river or the the size of the ribar, you can measure the embedment depths quite uh precisely, but it doesn't go deeper. And then comes the GPR ground penetration radar, and the ground penetration radar can also uh detect the PVC pipes and different metals, uh of course, and then also you can scan it uh with our product using the cloud platform. You can actually scan forever in principle, right? And so uh you come to a certain uh area, let's say the bridge deck, and bridge deck will consist of air void inside, and uh post-tension cable inside, rebar inside, and you will come with a different apparatus to see the different uh defects in uh uh concrete uh slab deck. That's how how uh you combine the different uh solutions. So, this is something which is very unique. Uh, I'm quite uh amazed of this concept uh we have created because in each technology you have different competitors, and um we are the only one uh providing such a concept of different non-destructive method. And GPR, we have competitors, and eddy current, you have competitors, we have uh uh impact echo, we have different competitors, Schmidhammer, we have different competitors, but combination, we are the only one who can provide to uh uh diagnose the health condition of a concrete structure.

SPEAKER_00 18:01

Okay, and these tools, uh eddy current, uh ultrasonic and GPR, they come in different sizes. Are they all for GPR? I know they're handheld ones and roller ones, um, but but in the end, uh one person can use them to test, right?

SPEAKER_01 18:18

Yes, yes. Normally it's it's of course when uh GPR weight like uh 40 kilograms. Uh you need a two-person to carry. Uh but in principle you need only one person to do the job, yes.

SPEAKER_00 18:35

Okay. So and in your experience, uh, do engineers all have these equipments?

Post-tensioning & inspection challenges

SPEAKER_01 18:41

Well, they should, yeah. Uh, because the inspector should not uh uh I mean diagnose the concrete only limited by one technology. So uh we often come, for example, uh we are now bringing in this uh post- non-grouted post-tension cable uh inspection as uh our standard offering uh because uh around the world, uh you know, after World War II, uh many bridge decks are built very quickly, but with a limited uh access to the amount of cement after the World War II. So they use the post-tension cable to minimize the amount of cement to build the long span bridge deck, right? Now, after 80 years, many of those bridges have a problem because we realize that there are non-grouted area around the post-tension cable is causing the corrosion of the cable, and around the world we have seen uh a rupture of those cables and collapse of bridges. I think a couple of years ago we had a bridge collapse in Dresden. I think some years ago we had a bridge collapse in uh Genova, and uh actually every year such incident is happening. Luckily, most cases traffic is uh stopped to uh drive over such old bridges, but inspection uh market for this application is enormous. So, why I'm explaining it, in order to inspect such a failure, we normally go with a GPR first. Then let's say um 10 meter, 20 meter span, we scan with a GPR, and then we can estimate somehow where non-growed zone can uh be identified. Then we go spotwise with the ultrasound to uh really see uh the non-grouted area, and then you have to drill the hole, and then you come with a videoscope and see if there's any corrosion or not. If there's a corrosion, you have to uh inject those anti-corrosion agents, and then after you have to uh inject grouts. How that's how the refurbished such uh oil bridges. And uh for such a project, we offered a system again, right? Not only the GPR or ultrasound.

GPR data, hyperbola & augmented reality

SPEAKER_00 21:29

Just for perspective, uh, if we say we have a 15 meter long bridge uh with a girl, how how many hours would it take to inspect this with your tools?

SPEAKER_01 21:41

No, uh uh so uh uh first of all, uh uh thanks for asking. Um for the GPR we can quickly scan. Uh of course we need to uh set it up, but advantage of our system is is easy to read. Uh, many of those uh GPR. Uh equipment, you need to be able to read the hyperbolar signals and the traditional the hyperbolar curves, and that can be read by experts. In our system, we have created algorithm and created uh visualizing those hyperbolas into the autogain uh uh colored picture, and then we can also use the augmented reality uh real time. So uh in front of the concrete garder, you can see the augmented reality picture of what's inside the concrete in the real time in front of you. That's uh that that's something which is very unique. Uh we are the only one who can provide uh such a solution. And on top of that, uh another uniqueness is we have those all the data and managed on the cloud basis, so there's no CPU in the equipment, means uh inspector doesn't need to uh empty the memory every day. Okay, right. So data is successively going onto the cloud platform, and of course, if you sit in uh in Germany or somewhere and you want to test in the job site in Switzerland, you can actually see that the real time on your screen because it's everything on a cloud basis digitized, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:37

So this this data uh conversion and uh visualization that's quite helpful and I guess something that is improving a lot in the last years. Uh, how is it with reports and uh export of this data? You have a tool for that?

AI, automation & reporting efficiency

SPEAKER_01 23:52

So uh uh the data is again so uh uh managed everything on a cloud basis, so we have also the software, even we can store uh uh uh say um competitors, uh the data uh uh inspected by competitors equipment. So what what does it mean? So we have uh data from EddyCurrent, we have the data from other technologies, we can put all together on a cloud basis on the same platform, so we can uh actually overlay a work, and uh then of course at the end push the button and we can create a report. So that's sort of very much efficiency. You can imagine in former days, or actually even nowadays, the engineer has to uh work on let's say one method on one platform, often it's not digitized, maybe Excel sheet, another one, another Excel sheet, another one with another Excel sheet. You have to put all these together, copy and paste some photos, XYZ, and it takes lots of time, right? And uh now we are also bringing in some AI tool so we can actually um what one of uh quality assurance work uh inspector uh sometimes uh uh asks for is counting the number of rebars, right? And if you scan and if you have a hyperbola, and if you uh uh want to count the number of rebutts, it's quite time consuming. So we have now created the software from hyperbola to the alt gain to visualize in the rebars, but also you don't need to count the number of rebars, you push the button, and with the AI you can automatically uh count the number of rebels, you can manually correct if uh the AI didn't uh detect uh one or two, and then at the end push the button, comes to the automatic report. This is uh efficiency, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:11

Yeah, and and then you have this augmented reality where you can project this 3D image basically of how the rebars are built up onto the same concrete wall, right?

SPEAKER_01 26:21

And so uh easy to use. And actually, uh a month ago, um the uh I visited uh the general contractor in Japan who was using also our tool, and it was a funny comment because uh he said even our foreign worker uh you know coming from uh Southeast Asia, uh, this guy was uh scanning the concrete. Even after 10 minutes, uh 10 minutes of onboarding, so he was learning 10 minutes, he could already scan and benefit out of this uh the tool. So it's very easy to read, augmented reality, visualizing, no hyperbolic curves. Of course, we can show the hyperbolic curves if experts want to see that, but uh uh you know they're different dimensions of uh easy to use to the very expert-oriented uh data analytics.

SPEAKER_00 27:22

And I mean, most of your customers are engineering companies that do structural assessment, and they work on a project basis, but their customers often have uh big portfolios of these structures. Have you had in the past cases projects where you had to offer some kind of APIs um more automatic to these uh portfolio owners?

APIs, robotics & inspection workflows

SPEAKER_01 27:45

Yes, uh we are uh now uh very much focusing on uh uh solution where we can provide efficiency, and then of course it comes to like a robotics uh combination with uh 3D scanner cameras, and then we need to uh uh connect two different systems using API, and uh I think this needs and demand is uh increasing. And uh, we have some reference uh project we are working uh in Japan, also in the US and the UK, also here in Switzerland. Uh, you know the drone is also becoming very popular in the inspection, but also uh like a climbing robot, uh, you uh measure the the uh inspect the surface, concrete surface of uh uh let's say silo, concrete silos or concrete cooling tower, and the demands uh is enormous. And you can imagine with using the robot instead of uh putting the scaffolding, you save lots of money.

SPEAKER_00 28:56

Yeah, and in general, I mean it's a big topic, all this uh data combination uh also for AI agents, for instance, to have access to all these different data, and they don't need different software always. What is most more important is the APIs that can bring the data from one service to the others. Um what we haven't touched enough yet, I think, is a bit the accuracy. I mean, you said with the AD current you can better detect the rebar uh diameter. Or which is the best tool to use when you assume a lot of rebars and you want to see more than the first layer.

SPEAKER_01 29:32

I would say that's uh I would say the GPR, but of course the dilemma of GPR is uh you know uh compared to the eddy current. Uh so far, we will not be able to uh uh measure the size of the rebar. But using our technology, uh we will be able to see the second layer of ribar. That's a big topic in uh country like Japan. Uh if you want to uh strengthen the concrete and drill the hole over, let's say, 60 centimeter depth, and you will suddenly hit the second layer, right? And uh in the most of uh I would say I would say none of our competitors can see the second layer so clearly as ours.

SPEAKER_00 30:27

And and how does it work then that because you said first you use the GPR for assessing where the post-tension cables could be before using the uh ultrasonic? So but these are quite deep inside the concrete. So with a GPR you do see these bigger post-tension cables, then quite uh how well do you see that?

SPEAKER_01 30:49

Yeah, often you know uh post-tension cable is not perpendicular, right? Like uh uh vertical and horizontal. So if you see you know the signal uh shown uh like uh angled, and we of course suspect this is the post-tension cable, right? Yeah, and that's of course, no, uh you need to know you know a bit of like a concrete engineering. So, what's inside the concrete? You know, you you have to know, right? And uh yeah.

Accuracy & limits of inspection tools

SPEAKER_00 31:22

Uh engineering companies they have a lot of time constraints. Uh I we talked to one testing engineer uh in this podcast who he said I think he had 300 structures to inspect in one year, uh, besides other jobs he had had going on. So uh I I I can understand uh I mean they have to do before they go uh an assessment with on the information they have and and probably then check which are the critical ones uh and where where to use which tool, right? But uh or what would what is your take when when to use these tools?

SPEAKER_01 31:57

Well uh again, uh I mean concrete structure is probably easier than uh uh let's say the grounds. Grounds, you have a soil, uh, asphalt pavement, and sometimes concrete deck, and um then you have like a cables, pipes, and and plastic pipes and um and and metal pipes and different concrete. I think you only have uh cement and water and uh aggregates uh and rebars, and sometimes uh okay, in the buildings you have like a PVC pipes and copper pipes, uh, but not as much as like a ground, right? So uh what I want to say um if you have certain concrete element, let's say like a bridge girder or bridge pier, you can standardize the inspection method uh quite easier, and then you know, like an impact echo with the ultrasound with a GPL, and then you inspect uh one by one and in an efficient way, then you have to of course select those products which allow you to uh proceed uh your inspection procedure as efficient as possible. It often the bottleneck is of course the creation from the data collection to uh interpretation to the reporting, right? That's actually the uh bottleneck part.

SPEAKER_00 33:39

Okay.

Bottleneck: data, interpretation & reports

SPEAKER_01 33:39

Going to the site and do inspection, it's maybe you have to cut the traffic, XYZ, it can be complicated. There, you also need to find the product with efficiency, but the bottleneck is I see more for data collection, interpretation to the reporting. So, what I want to say is um around the world, especially in the developed countries, we have a huge problem of lack of inspectors. Because uh, first of all, those guys who started uh the career for 40, 50 years ago, uh post-World War II, and those are now going to the retirement. Uh and those are the guys who can really read uh hyperbolic curves, understand the concrete structure, you can estimate what's ongoing through the visual inspection. These guys are disappearing now.

SPEAKER_00 34:40

Yeah, and now young generation it's very crucial because these people they have inspected hundreds of hundreds of structures and they know which are the critical areas, right? They know exactly I mean they have to do a whole structural assessment, so movements and other things, uh green growth, I don't know. Uh so we we often think only about one thing, but uh and and they take a lot of risk as well on them. So also if you want to do a good structural assessment in today's constraints already, you have to already say what not to expect inspect so clearly well, because you know there's nothing and what to do well. If someone is new, uh they're overwhelmed, no, they don't have the time to do all this testing with uh with their constraints, and uh that that's gonna be a big problem, I see, also in the future. Sorry for the interruption.

SPEAKER_01 35:31

Certainly, no, no, certainly. Therefore, if you have uh 300 bridges to inspect per year, you need to make sure that uh this young generation don't have much know-how, can read and interpret uh the inspection data and then go to another one quickly, right? And you need to standardize those inspection procedures, but also the procedure of uh interpreting the result. And then you can really accelerate uh uh the level of efficiency, right? And that's uh our uh challenge, and also uh then we will uh uh introduce the AI functions software, and then we will introduce the robotics, and then of course our user will benefit out of those uh improved efficiency. That's uh that's how I see the challenge. You know, um in Japan uh officially uh register the bridge is uh 700 uh I think 720,000 bridges, and half of those 720,000 bridges, uh 360,000 will be 50 years old in 2030. And there's a regulation that those uh 50 years old bridges have to be inspected in every two years, and you can imagine an enormous amount of uh uh infrastructure has to be inspected.

SPEAKER_00 37:14

And I mean uh for often of the young people they don't it's not their favorite job because it you often have to inspect during traffic, it's loud, it's dusty, it's bad air. Yeah, inside the girders, also. Yeah, exactly. So yeah, I think without robotics and drones, it's just not manageable in 10 years. What do you think?

Shortage of inspectors & scaling challenge

Vehicle-based GPR & faster inspections

SPEAKER_01 37:35

Yeah, exactly. I think certainly we will have a problem without having this uh improved efficient uh the inspection method and solutions, and also interpretation of the result, right? Using AI and visualizing, and uh without that, we will have a huge problem of uh maintaining those infrastructures, right? Well, we have uh we have now launched two years ago uh a vehicle-mounted uh GPL radar, call it GM8000. Uh, you can put on the vehicle and you can drive. While you drive, you can scan and measure concrete deck, uh bridge deck, and also uh utilities mapping, and that's efficiency without cutting the stopping the traffic.

SPEAKER_00 38:25

What do you see if you imagine the inspection world in 10-15 years? Let's say we have not enough people to inspect all these old structures in the building in the construction boom in the 50s, 60s. Let's say let's hope many of them are still there and working perfectly. Uh, how do you imagine uh this inspection life technologies to look?

Future: BIM, point clouds & data platforms

SPEAKER_01 38:48

You know, the the the for the last four or five years, you know, software development, especially AI and robotics, improved a lot. But you can you cannot imagine like 20 years ago uh how which kind what kind of phone we are using nowadays. With the phone, you can measure the pulse, and we also created the crack detection software. You can actually uh take a photo, automatically identify the cracks, and push the button and create already the report on iPhone, right? And in 10 years, I can imagine this technology will be accelerated and escalated to combine with other digital solutions like a beam, point cloud, and then you can really connect the inspection into such a grid spacing, and then you can really connect or attack certain area, you can uh download some of those inspection data, or you can save it to certain area. If you have, you know, like if you go to the doctor and if you made an operation just you know about the eye, and you need to know exactly where you operate it, right? After two years to come and see. And that's the same for building, right? If you want to refurbish, you need to know what has been done for the last 10-20 years. And this digital record has to be saved on one platform and also combined with the other platform. That's how I see the future.

Closing

SPEAKER_00 40:38

Okay, fantastic. So, uh, way to go for BIM, let's call it digital shadows. Um, thank you very much. It was super interesting. I would like to uh continue longer, but uh we don't want to take too much of your time. Um yeah, it was uh interesting. I wish you good luck with these new improvements of these technologies, including AI and faster report generation, uh taking time of engineers and inspectors. And see you soon. Ciao. Bye bye bye. Bitte teile deine Meinung zu der Folge auf meiner Homepage unter www.concretee.com mit Binnestrich zwischen Concrete and Lee. Sehr gerne könnt ihr auch persönliche Erfahrungen oder Beschwerden lassen. Bitte like und teile den Podcast mit deinen Freunden und Kollegen, auch über Spotify oder Apple Music. Und ihr findet übrigens auch eine englische Übersetzung der Folge auf meiner Homepage. Bis bald.