#15 Secrets to Conquering Self-Doubt and Productivity with Gary Miles

In this episode, Sylvia interviews Gary Miles, former lawyer now turned success coach, where he shares how to unravel that knot of self-doubt that tightens every time we try to put ourselves out there. With the precision of a seasoned litigator, Gary dissects the dreaded 'marketing mindset block' and offers strategies to transform it into an empowering tool for personal branding. His insights stem from a rich career, and he generously shares personal anecdotes and practical guidance on how to market oneself authentically. Shifting gears to productivity, we dissect the day-to-day battles against the clock that every professional grapples with. We probe into the paradox of 'busyness' and how disciplined planning, strategic breaks, and a redefined perspective on time can lead to a more productive and fulfilling work life.  Gary shares so much wisdom in this episode and you won’t want to miss it!

Episode Highlights:
Overcoming Self-Doubt and Imposter Syndrome
Success Coach and Accountability Plan
Embracing Challenges for Personal Growth
Self-Imposed Stress
Balancing Career Boundaries for Success

Links mentioned:
The Free Lawyer Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-free-lawyer/id1614507857
You may order your copy of Breaking Free here: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CPKSQ59R
LinkedIn:  https://www.linkedin.com/in/gary-miles-freedom/
Gary’s website: www.garymiles.net
Get your free Marketing Planning Workbook: https://sgandassociates.ca/marketing-planning-workbookforpodcast/

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Transcript

00:00 - Gary Miles (Guest)
Don't think about what if, what if I get up there and stumble? What if I get up there and say it too much? Just prepare and stay in the present. Stay in the moment. Don't let our mind drift to what if, what if this happens, what could go wrong, cause all those things just create stress and fear. For us, it's just being the present. We're all good at what we do, whatever it is. We're skilled, we're talented, we're experienced. Get into the process, get into action and don't let the mind go to what the outcome is. 

00:32 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Hello everyone and welcome back to episode 15 of the Serve First, Sell Later Marketing Podcast, and in this episode I'm honored to have a special guest, Gary Miles, who has been practicing law for more than four decades, primarily in litigation and more recently, in family law. He was the managing partner of Hughesman Jones and Miles in Maryland for over three decades and is not of counsel to the firm. He has been a trial lawyer, managing partner, author, leader and entrepreneur. He loves helping folks solve their problems and he's passionate about showing people how to free themselves from the prisms that entrap them. He has seen the pressures in the legal profession and he is dedicated to helping his clients achieve fulfillment in their practice. He provides practical tools to help his clients overcome obstacles, freeing them to enjoy the success and freedom they crave. 

01:31
Gary has a popular, highly rated podcast called the Free Lawyer and he's also the author of the book Breaking Free. Welcome, Gary, so excited to have you here today. I know when we first connected, one of the things that impressed me most about your background was the work that you do as an attorney and the work that you do as a success coach for lawyers. I'd love to hear a little bit more about that and how you got started. 

02:01 - Gary Miles (Guest)
Yeah, I spent 45 years practicing law. I did mostly litigation and, as you may know, it's a very stressful area and I spent most of my time in conflict and an adversarial relationship with someone else. The other lawyer and I had opposite perspectives and goals and after 45 years I guess I got tired of arguing with lawyers and I realized how stressful the profession is and I realized I wanted to transform myself instead of someone who's in conflict with lawyers but someone who's in support with them, because in my 45 years of running my own business, my practice, I learned a whole lot, mostly from things I did wrong, and I learned from them how to do them better, and I want to help and support as many busy professionals as I can to find as much not only success but joy and freedom in what they do. 

02:57 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Yeah, I love that. Joy and freedom is so important, especially for legal and financial professionals that are. They're in pretty stressful positions. There's a lot of difficult work that they do, and so that is definitely a needed way of life, for sure. So what are the things that I see? A lot in the profession is what I call a marketing mindset block, and that's a real fear around promoting themselves, being active on social media, marketing themselves, and I wanted to unpack that a little bit because I'm sure you see that as well in the work that you do as a success coach. What are your thoughts on the marketing mindset block that professionals face when they need to get out there and start promoting themselves, because without marketing, it's incredibly difficult to grow a practice? 

03:46 - Gary Miles (Guest)
You know it's funny. I coach people on that, but I suffer from it myself. When I released my book in December, writing just the about the book and about the author section in the back was a huge emotional challenge for me, because I know what I'm good at and so forth. But it was very hard for me to put it on paper and I think a lot of us struggle. 

04:11
We know we're talented and there are some folks who don't mind saying I'm really good, but for most of us we shy away from that, we don't wanna seem too braggy, and I think for me my coach helped me with that because he helped me see no, that's what you are. It's okay to say that, it's okay to be you'd, still be humble, but still be truthful about who you are and what you do and what sets you apart from other people. And I think in whatever professional field someone is in, whether it's finance or law, we all have a unique brand, something about us. It's different than other people, and I think it's good to identify what that is and to make it visible, because if we don't create our own public identity, someone else will create it for us. 

04:57 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Yes, absolutely so. Do you find that in that? I guess that fear of marketing oneself, that maybe limiting beliefs could be a factor that comes to play with that, would you say? 

05:12 - Gary Miles (Guest)
Limiting beliefs and self-doubt, which may be related to each other. For some reason, it seems like the more talented a person is, the more they struggle with self-doubt. It probably has something to do with perfectionism, but I know for me. I was in my fifties. I owned and managed my law firm. I was a very successful trial lawyer with a great track record, and I felt like it was all make-believe, like is that really me? Like I kind of looked at myself and said is that real? And we tend to really question ourselves whether we are as good as other people see us. 

05:50
And it takes some work to work through that and I work with my clients on that to help them really say I hope them look at the facts instead of their feelings. You know what are the facts of who you are and what you've done and what you've accomplished, and what do other people say about you and is that right? And what do you say about yourself? And is there truth in that or is that just a story? And sometimes the reason we hold ourselves back from identifying what is good about us is our own fear, fear of being authentic, fear of being seen. If I don't take that chance to write a book, have a podcast, market myself to this group, speak in front of this group, then I can't fail. So I'll tell myself oh, I'm not that good to be the speaker at this conference, you know, because part of it, I think, sometimes is a fear. So I think limiting beliefs, imposter syndrome or self-doubt and fear are things that really factor into it. 

06:50 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Absolutely so. If you were working with a client and they had this fear, how would you go about dismantling it? Or how would you tackle the thought process around? You know, I need to get on that stage and speak, or I've got to promote my book, and so all that perfectionism and posture syndrome pops up. What advice would you give to someone if you had to define it in a couple of steps? So what are some of the first couple of things you would do to help someone and I know that this is kind of like it's not a one-time thing, it takes time but what would be the, I guess, the action steps you would provide? 

07:27 - Gary Miles (Guest)
Well, first is to be mindful, or self-aware, of what we're thinking about, because sometimes someone has a block against marketing themselves, but they don't think about it. They don't know why you may suggest to a client to do something. They're going to say, no, I don't do that, but they haven't thought through why. So the first step is figure out what's going on and what message are you telling yourself and why are you telling yourself that? Then the next step is does that help you? Does that thought that you're telling yourself serve you? Does that help you to be more successful? Does it help you to be happier? No, of course not. Of course, it hurts me to hold me back. Well, why don't we try a different thought? So for me, like as an example with my podcast, when my coach said you have so much experience and knowledge, you'll start a podcast, and the first thing I said was I'm 66 years old. 66 year olds don't do a podcast, they're too old. He said no, you don't understand. You have 45 years of experience as a lawyer. Someone who's 30 has five years of experience as a lawyer. What's more valuable? So a lot of them comes to reframing those negative thoughts into something that is better and choosing a thought that serves us, that helps us, instead of holding us back. 

08:44
And then the final thing is just to look at the facts of who we are and what we've done. What do other people say about us and why do they say them? Those people aren't there to toot our own horn. They're there because they believe in us, whether it's our friends, our coworkers, our partners, our coaches support us because they see in us what we're capable of. And I know I found that's what I saw with my coach. He saw I had a vision for what I was capable of that I did not have for myself, and that's what I have for my clients. I have a vision of their success and who they are and what they can be. That is true, but they haven't seen it yet in themselves. 

09:21 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Right, yeah, I love that. I mean, that's just an action plan in a box that you've just given to our listeners. So you take that action plan and then you've got to start implementing that each and every day. So are there any tips that you would share with anyone that how could they go about and start implementing that? Because I know one of the things when we work with our clients is we like to get them to write it down. So that was a step one. What is it that's coming up for you and what's holding you back? But anything else that you see as a really great way I mean accountability, I would think is the work that you do as a success coach. That's a wonderful way for your clients to stay accountable to what you're coaching them on. 

10:05 - Gary Miles (Guest)
So the one thing is, if you have to give a talk in front of a thousand people and scare you to death, start with something smaller. Find a group you could talk to Maybe you're in a law club or some sort of professional club See, hey, can I give a presentation to people who are your friends? And then realize, oh, that wasn't so hard. So start with a smaller step. On that way, you know, if you don't like doing a LinkedIn live, do a recorded video for a minute. Oh, that's pretty easy. And so take smaller steps along the journey of what your goal is. And then the second thing is just to prepare, get into action. And the third thing is to not think into the future. 

10:46
Don't think about what if? What if I get up there and stumble? What if I get up there and say too much? Just prepare and stay in the present. Stay in the moment. Let our mind drift to what if? What if this happens, what could go wrong, because all those things just create stress and fear. For us, it's just being the present. We're all good at what we do, whatever it is. We're skilled, we're talented, we're experienced. Get into the process, get into action and don't let the mind go to what the outcome is. 

11:17 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Yes, yeah, and I like your idea of just getting out there and doing it. If you never do it, then it becomes increasingly difficult to take that step. But if you're taking one step each day and practicing that, it just becomes like a muscle that you're working and you continue to make it stronger and stronger. 

11:34 - Gary Miles (Guest)
One of the things I think a lot of people struggle with is they like to be comfortable and they don't like to get outside their comfort zone. I'm really good at what I'm comfortable with. I've done it a thousand times. I know how to do it. I know how to do it well, it's easy. But it actually gets kind of boring after a while to do the same thing over and over again and do it well, and we're afraid to try something new, something new and different. After practicing law for 40 years, it was new for me to start actually building a coaching service. 

12:02 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
It was new for me to have a podcast. 

12:04 - Gary Miles (Guest)
But once you do it it's like that was fun and I feel good about myself that I tried something new. I took the advice I needed and I did it. So we get such a feeling of accomplishment when we take on a new challenge and we are afraid, we're afraid of failing, we're afraid of people laughing at us or judging us. But when we do it and succeed, we feel so good and we grow. 

12:29 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Absolutely so. When you work with your clients, what are some of the biggest challenges or obstacles you see that they face in running their practices? 

12:40 - Gary Miles (Guest)
Well, we talked about some of them so far. Perfectionism and self-doubt are the two biggest, and they actually can be connected. So when I strive to be perfect, it's usually I'm doubting that what I did was good enough. It's often a quality work so far, but we want to be A plus, so we think it's not good enough because we're doubting ourselves and we're perfectionists. Then we start doubting ourselves more. Why haven't I finished that yet? Why did it take me so long? So I think that's a really, really big one. And productivity is another Easy. Professionals have so much to do and so little time, and I know for me there were so many days I'd go into work and I feel like I was there, I worked hard and I got nothing done, and I felt further behind when I came home and then I beat myself up like what did I do all day? How did that happen? So I work a lot with my clients on steps to be more productive and it really, really, really helps them. 

13:39 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
If you're ready to take your practice to the next level, then you'll want to get a hold of our free comprehensive marketing planning workbook, designed specifically for professionals just like you. With this step by step guide, you'll unlock the secrets to attracting your ideal clients, generating more leads and mapping out your entire year of marketing with ease. Don't miss out. Simply go to SGIndissociatesca forward slash marketing hyphen planning hyphen workbook for podcast Link is also in the show notes. Check it out. Yeah, so what are those steps? What would you recommend to anyone? I mean, there's so many busy professionals legal and financial listening to this episode. What type of advice would you give them when thinking about productivity, but in a way that doesn't feel like I don't think I can do that, like that just sounds like way too much work. 

14:38 - Gary Miles (Guest)
All the things I'm going to say are really easy to do. Yeah, they might be a change of a bad habit, but they aren't hard to do. The first is to change our mindset about time. I mean, how often do you hear someone say, both at work and in personal, I don't have the time. I wish I had more time, I would, but I don't have time. We look at time as something we don't have. And if we just change our mindset to I have 24 hours today, how do I want to use it? What I want to use it for, and use it purposefully for whatever we want to use it for. 

15:11
The second is a lot of busy people. If you ask them, what did you do? To say I have no idea, I don't know where the day went, I don't know why I didn't get more done. Well, that's, let's figure that out. So I actually have them get keep it on their computer or, even more convenient, it's just a pad of paper and from the minute you walk in, you keep track of everything you've done. So I'll go talk to Sylvia for 15 minutes on the phone. Eight o'clock, eight, 15, eight, 16, what am I going to do next? And you actually track what you do so you realize. Well, maybe I got more done than I thought or maybe I wasted time scrolling social media or spent too long talking to a client. I could have done that shorter. You actually become aware of what you're doing. 

15:52
And the other thing and I was very subject to this was I'd be working on a motion have to prepare, and you'd call me on the phone. Well, I won't use you because you're very annoying. I saw a lawyer would call me on the phone who was very, very difficult, and I'd interrupt what I was doing to take that difficult call. That would throw me off my game. And then I get back. Where was I? What was I doing? What was my mindset? What were was I in this thought process? So instead I have people playing their day before they go into work. 

16:21
What you're intending to do, we don't always happen. We get new matters. Different things happen. But when you work on something, you work on it from a set amount of time nine to 10, without interruptions. You don't reply to emails. You don't take calls. People call you. You don't answer phone. That's okay the little message. You call them back. 

16:40
But we work for an uninterrupted span of time on one thing and one thing only. Multitasking is the biggest waste of time and we're so busy we tend to do that and I'm working on something, and then my assistant comes in and we're up to talk to her. Then the junior attorney comes in I'd love to talk to him, and we get all these interruptions. And we do that when my door is closed. When my door is closed unless it's a fire or an absolute emergency, don't interrupt me. And we work for an hour with the door closed so we poke our head out. 

17:08
Do you need me for anything? Go and return some calls, Go and return some emails. Return all our calls, return all of our emails, check in with people that might answer to you, and then close our door and work for an hour in the next project that we have and schedule time for breaks in the day. The busy professional always puts himself or herself last. If you think of a professional athlete, if you think of a marathon runner, they don't run a marathon seven days a week to get ready to run the marathon on Sunday. They rest before, show that they're refreshed and full of energy, but we burn our minds out sometimes because we don't give it a rest during the day, Self-aware of our time, work on one thing at a time, without interruptions, and block all of our emails and calls together. 20 emails came in while you're working on that. Take a break, return all 20 emails, but don't interrupt what you're doing 20 times to answer those. 

18:01 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Right, yeah, Every time we change tasks, the productivity just drops significantly. So it's like stay on the one task for a certain amount of time and then shift to something else, because the brain just can't handle this. You know, oh, let me just shoot an email and then let me just finish this document, and so like spend the time to finish one thing and then move on to the next. So I know that's super important is to be able to do that. Any apps that you would recommend? I know one of the things that we like to use. I mean, it's a simple app Pomodoro, I think it's which is like a timer, so if you're working on something, you turn on that timer for 20 minutes or 25 minutes, and then you stop, you take a break and you go on Any kind of productivity apps. 

18:44 - Gary Miles (Guest)
I don't use an app, but I do believe in Pomodoro and I think that's what I tell people to do to plan. It may be a different length of time for different things, but make that your sole focus for that period of time. And sometimes we want to work on something till it's finished, and so what some lawyers run into is it's going to take me four hours to do that, and I don't have four hours in my day, and so it never gets done. Where they come in on a Sunday to instead work for an hour Monday and Tuesday and Wednesday and then take a break. 

19:17 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Yes, yep, that makes total sense. So you've written a book called Breaking Free Congratulations, that's quite an accomplishment. 

19:27 - Gary Miles (Guest)
Thank you. That was my own story about having to do that. That was out of my comfort zone, but having done it once, now it's like I wouldn't say it's a piece of cake, but I know how to do it. I'd be happy and looking forward to writing my second one. 

19:42 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
It's fantastic. So what's the book about? 

19:45 - Gary Miles (Guest)
So in the book I talk about the 12 prisons of our mind, some of the things we've talked about limiting belief, fear, perfectionism, comparison, comparing ourselves to others, expectations and in each chapter I outline what the mindset prison looks like, what it is, how it affects us, what gifts we get when we are controlled by it, and I give tools for each of them. Like we've talked about for productivity. I can set number of tools for them to manage that mindset prison, and then I have 12 keys to unlock those prisons. There are things like gratitude and acceptance and mindfulness and being present using a mentor, things of that nature that when we live in those, we're no longer imprisoned by those mindset issues. 12 prisons of the mind and 12 keys to unlock them and, unlike most books, the chapters don't really build on themselves. Each one of them is somewhat independent. 

20:50 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
I love that. Well, first off, where can everyone find the book? If they wanted to purchase it? It's on. 

20:57 - Gary Miles (Guest)
Amazon. Amazon Breaking free a guide to personal and professional freedom as a lawyer. 

21:03 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Okay, great, and we can add that to the show notes as well. We'll definitely add a link for that. So, when you think about the book and the process of writing, was there anything that stood out for you as a wow factor? Was you start writing the book? It's like, wow, I never really thought of it that way. Or wow, that wasn't what I was expecting was going to come out of that. Was there anything like that that kind of surprised you when writing? 

21:27 - Gary Miles (Guest)
the book. Do you know about the substance of the book or the process of writing it? 

21:32 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
I would say the substance of the book. 

21:34 - Gary Miles (Guest)
The wow for me was how much of our own stress is self-imposed, because a lot of it is half how we respond to those circumstances in our life that are difficult for us, that we have no power over. We all have those people in our life who are challenging, who are difficult for us. We all have circumstances in the economy, in our family, in our office that are challenging, that we have no power over, and yet we so often focus on them and create our own stress and it doesn't serve us. Doesn't mean that that person is difficult to work with. If you think about how much a needle is going to hurt before you get it, it's going to hurt more. It's sort of that kind of thing. 

22:23 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Yes. So that's interesting, the stress factor that we impose on ourselves that really we can't control, and so it's about how to release that and not focus on that. So I think, even just looking at some of those different factors that you indicated in terms of perfectionism and imposter syndrome, quite honestly I think that that's something that most of us experience and I think, in what I've seen in the work that I do, you can diminish it if you are aware of that feeling first and then addressing that, and I think it gets better, but I'm not sure it totally disappears. 

23:04 - Gary Miles (Guest)
What's your take on that? It's a daily process. We have good days and we have bad days. I like the phrase halt. If we're hungry, angry, lonely or tired, things aren't going to go well. So if we're ever feeling angry, then we need to fix that If we're feeling tired or disconnected. So I always look out for those factors in my life because when those happen, that's when stuff shouldn't bother me, but I let it bother me. 

23:33 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
I love that Holt. Did you say HALT? 

23:38 - Gary Miles (Guest)
HALT. Are you hungry, angry, lonely or tired? 

23:43 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Got it, got it. So I guess the next question that I'd love to get your perspective on is so many professionals run very busy practices and so it's so hard to balance everything work and family and there's always the question is there really a life work balance? How would you answer that question and what are your thoughts on some of the best strategies to deal with that? 

24:11 - Gary Miles (Guest)
I guess the first thing is each person should figure out what their values are in their professional values. What is it you're looking for? How much money do you need to make? How many hours are you willing to work? How much time do you want to spend with your family? How much independence, autonomy do you need at work? 

24:30
I think a part of the problem is people haven't really figured out what their values are. If I want to make, if I don't need to make a lot of money, but my family's really important to me, maybe I should work in a different place that isn't so financially remunerative but allows me greater freedom and independence. Or maybe I should start my own firm or practice. So I think that's the first thing is to figure out what it is we're really looking for. Because what often happens when people start their careers, they will obviously pick the highest paying, most prestigious job. That's usually their first choice, but maybe that's not the right fit for them, maybe that's not where they really want to be. 

25:09
And then the rest is being present when we're at work. Be truly present, use those productivity steps we talked about before, but when you come home, shut work down. If you need to work at home, set an hour aside, go into your work space at home, work from seven to eight, but then shut it down. Don't let that bleed into when you're at the soccer game with your kids. And some of it comes to setting boundaries, saying to the boss look, texting me at 10 o'clock on a Saturday night is not something that works for me. We have to come up with a different way of doing that. 

25:45 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Absolutely so. When you're looking at someone who's maybe just starting out starting their new practice, what advice would you give to them? And then, what advice would you give to that very seasoned professional who has kind of reached that stressed out or burned out factor? 

26:04 - Gary Miles (Guest)
I think for the new professional, it comes back to what I said before. What is it you want to do? What is it that you find fulfilling? You know my experience in life, like I'm really enjoying coaching and writing my blogs and doing my podcasts. I love it. It's fun, it takes time, but I love it. What is it that you would find fulfilling? What is it that would really bring you joy in the field of law, because there are a lot of different things we can do? What area of practice, what kind of firm, what kind of business? So that's the first thing. What is it you would really like? 

26:37
Because we don't law school or our professional education, usually with the thought of being of service. I want to help my community, I want to help my clients. We usually don't go in thinking I want to make a certain amount of money and so figure out what brings you joy and then chase that, because our life can be whatever we choose it to be. We're never stuck. The freedom to make it what we want it to be. 

27:01
And for the more seasoned professional, if they're burned out, let's talk about why are you burned out? Is it too many hours? Is it the people you work with? Is it the kind of work you do? And same question what is it you would like to do, Like five years from now? Who would you like to be and what would you like to be doing? And a lot of people live an unexamined life. They don't ever think about that question. They just go to work and don't think about what will bring me joy, what would I like my professional life to look like? And have to answer that question first before we figure out how to get there and then we come up with an action plan, how to achieve that. 

27:45 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
I guess a question I would have for you is how many seasoned professionals ask themselves what brings me joy? I guess that that's a question that probably stops them in their tracks when you ask that. 

27:57 - Gary Miles (Guest)
Too few, too few. But if you're unhappy, let's figure out why it is you're unhappy. It could be a variety of different reasons and we're only speaking hypothetical, so I don't know for a particular person what it is. And maybe they can't stand the people they work with. Well, maybe the only solution is you need to work in a different place. Maybe it's they don't like the kind of work they're doing. A lot of times we look for fulfillment in our work, but we end up doing work which isn't very fulfilling. Well, would you find fulfilling? So I think that is the problem. Too many people have never thought of that. And they're 40 years old, been practicing 15 years and they're miserable. But worse, they don't know why they're miserable. 

28:41 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Yep, I love that. I know that some of the work that we do with legal professionals those particularly in family law will decide that they want to move from family law to maybe something like family mediation or divorce mediation, where litigation is out of the picture. And so they come to us and they say I'm ready to make that transition and I need to market myself. So I like the suggestion that you made, like maybe you need to switch. Where you are right now, maybe it's a different service offering. But looking at that and saying what brings me joy and I'm sure that when you ask that question, it must be an eye-opener for your clients and it must also just allow them to see what's possible- and that's why what you do is so valuable, because and that's a great analogy I practice family law for 15 years and I'm a certified mediator. 

29:35 - Gary Miles (Guest)
I've done that too, and the practice of family law can be very rewarding sometimes, but sometimes a client is very difficult, but more often than not the other lawyer or the other party is very difficult, and it's very frustrating to see another lawyer churning the file and making fights about things, because most lawyers who are good see themselves as problem solvers. We want to help our client solve their problems and sometimes it doesn't happen because of the other party or the lawyer. But in mediation it's the most fulfilling thing in the world to get two parties who can't talk to each other, who can't come to an agreement, to sit at a table and you help fashion, help them come up with a solution that they both are agreeable to, and so I could see why a lot of your clients would make that choice, and then you can help them market themselves in that arena and build that business. 

30:29 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Absolutely. 

30:31
There's a big demand for that because I'm seeing a lot of professionals in that arena that want to make that shift for the reasons that you've identified as mediation being a more thoughtful, a more less it's less stressful, it's less stressful but also there's less confrontation, and I think that's what brings the attention to the mediation space, and one of our missions at SG Associates is to help mediators and those in the dispute resolution field to spread the word and make people aware, because the awareness levels are still quite low, and that's where marketing comes in to really help people understand there are different options out there. So, yeah, super, super important for sure. 

31:15 - Gary Miles (Guest)
And if someone is practicing that area, mediation is such an important service. When the clients, when they ask me about it and they're thinking about mediation, I say please do it. If you two can talk to each other and if you can treat each other fairly and be open, it's the best, because if you two can arrive at a solution with a trained, experienced mediator, you will be so much happier, you'll save so much stress, you'll save so much money and you'll have a solution that the two of you chose was best for you and your family. 

31:49 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Absolutely absolutely Any parting thoughts. 

31:53 - Gary Miles (Guest)
Gary, I guess the final thoughts of it's okay. I'd like to share three of the most important tools that I believe in. The first is gratitude. When we focus on what we're grateful, all of us have stress and all of us are blessed in many, many ways. So when I have my clients do for a month, 30 days, when they wake up in the morning, write down three things they're grateful for and the kicker is they cannot repeat anything. So if you write down I have a wonderful wife that works for Monday, but when Tuesday comes you can't write her down like every day for the same thing. And after 20 days you've written down 60 things you're grateful for, and that's pretty impressive. But now you have to go about looking for something to be grateful for. You have to look for something in today that I could write down tomorrow that I'm grateful for. And when we search for gratitude in our life, our whole outlook changes. 

32:51
The second is acceptance. So often we resist those things we don't like the person we work with, who's difficult, the client, who's demanding. It gets in our head and we just keep thinking, oh, that person is so difficult. Just accept the fact that person's difficult. That's who they are If we don't want to represent them, we don't represent them. But if we're representing, just know when they call they're going to yell and they're going to be upset and that's okay. But acceptance is really the answer to a lot of our problems. And the third is to be mindful, to stay in the present, not let our mind go to the future, because the future is just full of worry and stress and anxiety. Never worry about the outcomes, just be present in the moment and do our work. So those would be my three most important tips. 

33:37 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
I love that. So it was gratitude, acceptance and mindfulness. 

33:42 - Gary Miles (Guest)
Yes. 

33:43 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Yeah, that's a great way to close off this episode, gary, thank you so very much. Where can our listeners find more of your brilliance? Well, thank you very much. 

33:56 - Gary Miles (Guest)
I'm very active on LinkedIn under my name, Gary Miles. My website is garymilesnet and there's a link to my book there, a page about the book, that if you want to check out the book you can. All my blogs are there and all my podcast episodes as well. 

34:14 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Awesome. 

34:16 - Gary Miles (Guest)
And well podcast is called the Free Lawyer. It's on all the platforms and release a solo episode on Monday and a guest episode on Thursdays. 

34:26 - Sylvia Garibaldi (Host)
Fabulous. Thank you for imparting such wisdom. I know that our listeners are going to get so many valuable and inspirational points from this episode, so thank you once again. 

34:39 - Gary Miles (Guest)
Thank you, I appreciate it. I appreciate who you are and what you all do to help and serve your clients.