Butterfly Leadership: The Art of Inspirational Leadership

What if the missing piece in your leadership isn’t another system, but a spark? We dig into the second “wing” of butterfly leadership—how to inspire people from the inside so your team moves from motion to momentum and from pressure to passion. If you’ve ever said, “People aren’t consistent” or “It’s hard to find good help,” this conversation reframes the problem and gives you tools to build dedication that lasts.

We break down the real difference between motivation and inspiration. Motivation is external—deadlines, checklists, task lists—and it’s important. But without inspiration—the breath that awakens purpose already inside your people—pressure cracks instead of strengthens. You’ll learn how to speak to destiny more than duty, call out potential with specific, uplifting language, and explain not just what needs to happen but why it matters. We talk practical habits: learn names, make every interaction a highlight of someone’s week, celebrate progress as well as results, and invest in people by sharing opportunities and platforms.

We also tackle the balance leaders must keep: sit among your people without becoming over-familiar, model an aspirational life without drifting into excess, and lead beyond the pulpit by inspiring with your lips, your life, and your love. Charisma counts as connection, not performance—warmth, presence, and genuine care that draws commitment and fuels contribution. Finally, we share ways to stay inspired yourself: surround yourself with life-giving voices, remember past victories, and guard your language so it breathes hope.

If you’re ready to see people give their all, run through walls for the mission, and grow into the leaders God designed them to be, press play. Then subscribe, share this episode with a leader you value, and leave a review with one practice you’ll use to inspire this week.

Transcript

Welcome, Purpose, And Guest Intro

unknown 0:05

Welcome to the Fivefold Food Podcast, hosted by Dr. Robert F. Dial, where ministers receive the spiritual nourishment they need to succeed. The Word of God declares, and he gave some apostles and some prophets and some evangelists and some pastors and teachers for the perfecting of the faith. Prepared to receive revelation, wisdom, and insight. Empower your ministry for victory. Now, let's praise the Lord.

Like, Subscribe, And Free Resources

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 0:39

God bless each and every one of you. I'm your host, Dr. Robert F. Dow. Welcome to the Fivefold Food Podcast. I'm so delighted that you're here with us for another episode. Whether you're listening on iTunes or YouTube, whatever social media platform, we're glad that you're here. We ask that you please like and subscribe. Also, if you're able to check out the show notes where you'll find links and descriptions so that you can get a lot of free material and other material that we have designed specifically for the five-fold minister. Our goal is to help you eat well so that you can excel. Man should not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeded out of the mouth of God. Again, I'm so glad that you're here with us for another episode. And today I want to bring on a wonderful guest that I'm going to have with us today. I am joined by my good friend uh Pastor C. P. Cornelius from the great state of Florida, where he's been pastoring over 30 years at Peaceful Believers Church. He's no stranger to this podcast. And again, Pastor C, I'm excited to have you here again for another time of dialogue, a conversation. In other words, but we're just going to let others get in on what we've been doing maybe well over 25 years now. So has it been 25 years?

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 2:04

Yes, sir.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 2:05

About 25, 26 years, something we've been just discussing and having conversations, and I and they they've so impacted us that we want to let others get in on them as well. So how are we doing today, man of God?

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 2:18

Good, sir. How are you?

From Caterpillar To Butterfly Leadership

Winners Find A Way: Sports To Leadership

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 2:20

I know you just asked me, yeah, before we came up, you asked how I was doing at the time of this recording. Uh, you know, we were in our NBA season, so we don't know what year, what time frame you listened to it, but time this recording, we had this the tip off the start of our uh uh new year uh for our team. And I was telling Pastor C how that my team is showing that pedigree that championship pedigree, you know, those OKC Thunder that's showing that championship pedigree. And part of what that championship pedigree, Pastor C is is uh uh winners find a way, champions find a way to win, they find a way, you know. Losers find a way to lose a game. True. Talk about another one of my teams that know how to do that very well, you know. Over time, no matter what, they're gonna find a way to lose, you know. So uh, but champions find a way um to win, and I think that's relevant as we talk about five old food and ministers and leaders in our discussions. That I believe true leaders, they find a way uh uh to lead and to go to new levels in their leadership, and that's what we're endeavoring uh to do today. We want to continue and get right into today's podcast. Uh, on our last podcast together, we were dealing with uh a topic, Pastor C, that God had blessed you uh uh to birth, and it was talking about uh from caterpillar to butterfly, but you were talking about leadership wings, how to get your leadership wings, and that's what we're dealing with how ministers can get their wings so that they can move from a caterpillar, as you so eloquently described, Pastor C in your message that caterpillars they crawl, and God don't want leaders to crawl, He won't lead us that ball. If you're gonna be a minister, a leader that ball and not crawl, then what has to happen? You got to get your wings and you got to go through that transformation like the caterpillar and become a beautiful butterfly. And we said that that was so important because as fivefold uh ministers, pastors, uh or uh uh evangelists, whatever kind of fivefold minister you are, whether you're leading a church, your ministry, an auxiliary in your church, or you're leading under a leader. You don't even have to have a title to lead, but you you you are not the leader, but you are a leader. If you're going uh to have the impact and influence that you said, Pastor C, we said to reach your full manifestation, we got to fly, and we dealt with the W. W is that these leaders need wisdom. If you didn't get that podcast, be sure you go back, check us out on iTunes. You can find it on YouTube, you can find it on Spotify, any platform. Be sure that you go back and uh get that episode. But let's go deeper. So we want to get the next wing. What was the next what was the I that you shared?

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 5:16

What is the I that helps leaders, uh, Pastor C uh to get their leadership wings that inspires others that that leader that has those have that those wings that leadership wings mean not only do you walk in wisdom, like we talked about the last time, last podcast, but you have that eye, you inspire others.

Wing Two: Inspire Others

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 5:41

So if we're going to be leaders that that that uh fly, we have to inspire others. And I think when I begin to think about this, Pastor C, this this podcast we put together, I believe on the on a surface level, you know, we might have uh some um ministers, pastors, evangelists, uh prophets, those that lead their own ministry, those that lead in some capacity in the church, even those that might not be leaders, because this apply to we're talking specifically to fivefold, but any type of leader where you're leading on your job or anywhere in your home, these principles apply, but leadership in every dimension. Uh when we say that leaders inspire others, would you say is is that like a given? You know, why why would you say that we need to have this conversation? Isn't that don't people just naturally do you think they naturally do that? Especially if we're talking about preachers or whatever, kind of help us with the let's frame this. Why does this conversation matter? Why do you believe we need to have this conversation? Why do they need to stay tuned in and not shift to somewhere else? Because they're like, uh, that that don't because that don't sound very deep if we look it don't sound deep.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 6:58

See, like you said, it seemed like it's it's a given, but inspiration is is I would say it's the it's the wind beneath the wings of that uh of that butterfly level leader. I mean it it's it's that's how powerful, that's how important it is, and it's not a given. It's not it's not a given because a leader, a leader can have structure, they can have systems in place, they can even have strategies, but without inspiration, all they got then is motion, but not more. But you know, I got the motion there, but it's similar to what you were just talking about with your boys. U at one point when they was playing, they picked up the momentum. And what we're trying to do is get leaders to get the momentum, they don't, you know, and inspiration and inspiration is that momentum. That that that's that momentum, so you can have motion with that momentum. So when y'all was playing last night, your boys out there playing, you know, uh by the time they get this court and as you were saying earlier, they they opened the night, they had momentum. A couple of times more was on the other side, but all of a sudden they picked up that momentum. But all the time, they always had motion going, but not momentum. And I think inspiration moves you from motion to momentum.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 8:25

Man, I I I like that. Help ministers, we're picking up what you're putting down. You you you can have motion, you could be doing things in church pastors, doing things in your auxiliary leaders in your department, in your own ministry, with whether you got a team of two, team of three, and if you don't even have a team, then you hadn't even you you really crawling because you ain't got a team yet for your own ministry. If you're a team of one, that means you really need to fly. You really need this because you need to draw a team to you, and inspiration is a part of that. I like that that we could be doing things and moving, but without momentum or the win of inspiration, we don't get our desired results. We don't win. There you go.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 9:22

We don't that's good, that's good, don't that's good because we don't have the wind that comes for inspiration. That's good. Now, see what take place, down that every butterfly leader at that. If you're at that level, we carry the responsibility. That's what I say. The responsibility to breathe what inspiration does, it breathes life in something. We breathe life into it, so we carry that responsibility. You can't transform people through pressure, you can't do it through pressure, but only through inspiration, not through pressure. If you're trying to pressure them, but you can inspire them through inspiration, is how you end up transforming them.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 10:12

I love that. Uh uh uh we're hearing that we can't transform people, so now I believe this is the desire of every leader. They want to see the people of under their leadership transform to do the things that they need them to do. There you go.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 10:28

There you go.

Motion vs Momentum

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 10:29

They want them to be transformed, to be changed. You know, uh, Pastor C, we have many leaders that are frustrated that get frustrated. We hear this, we hear this type of language. It's hard to find good help. You can't depend on people. Uh, people don't show up, uh, people don't keep their word, people are not consistent, and so there's a level of frustration that leaders have, whether it's pastors, someone in an apartment within their church or their work. And so there's what they're what they'll be groaning is in other words, what I want them to see. I think the wisdom in what you're saying is this. I want to connect the dot, is that they're not seeing the transformation that they need, the people haven't they hadn't changed to being like inconsistent to consistent, showing up when they say they're gonna show up, being there all the time, uh calling in. And so what happened is they don't they don't have the transformation. That's what I want you to see. That you need your people to transformation or you need them to change, and what you just laid down, Pastor C, if we're going to see people to make those changes so that they can't carry out our vision, carry out what God has given us, carry out what you need them to do, then you can't do it through pressure, you can't pressure them to do it, you can't guilt them trip to do it. Yes, you can't fuss at them to do it, you can't just leave them alone and they're gonna do it. But what I hear and what we're saying in this discussion through inspiration, there you go, you can begin to set the foundation to get people to make the changes that you need so that you can lead them the way that they need to be led, but it comes through you being an inspiring leader that inspires people. So that's good, that's what I'm hearing now. That's so important. That's correct.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 12:23

Because I think what inspiration is is that it's that divine spot, it's that spark that that you bring that awakened purpose that's already there, it's already in others, so it's there. I I say it like this it's the gas for the car. They already have the car, but they don't have the fruit, and that's what inspiration is it's the fruit that you put in the car. You can have the car, but the car ain't moving, it's not going anywhere, but you add that gas to it, and that's what inspiration to me. That's what that inspiration is. So that's why it's important that you inspire people, that you put gas in there. But notice now you already got the car, it's something that's already there. I emphasize that because I think people miss that. When when you inspire somebody, which it is is something that's already there, and you you scratch a match to it, or you put a spot to it, it's already there though, it's there, at least already got it, but you just inspire them in it, and that's what inspiration, you know.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 13:30

It it comes from the term, I think it's a Latin word, means to breathe into, it means to breathe into, and it started from a you know, dealing with uh from a spiritual standpoint, and now we can use even the natural when talking about people being inspired, meaning that something was God breathed, God breathed, and then he inspired people. So inspiration means to breathe into, so it's it's stuff that's you're putting something on the inside, you're sparking that's which is in them, and you're you're you're you're uh you're you're putting in other words, it's deal with the inward, and so when you inspire people, you're breathing into them something inward to stir within them. And I and I I want to add to this, I think it's so important as as well because what happens is I was thinking about this. The the the the the the power why we need inspiration is because when people are inspired, when people are inspired, they'll they'll give their all. See, when you have an inspired people, then you're looking at a people who will give their all, and we'll see other leaders. We could go down the road, pastors, obviously leaders, praise and worship leader team leader, you have a team for your evangelists to outreach, whatever level on your job, and that's like man, this is what they're thinking. This is the fallacy. Leaders that think, man, if I had some people like yours, man, I could do some stuff. If I had, you know, because man, you got man, you got good people, you got you, you got good people, and if I had people like you, man, I could do it. Like, man, if I had a team like that, if I had a if I had a person like that, one side of the coin is true. If you had them, but the other side, the reason that you don't have them, because you're not like the leader that you're talking about.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 15:27

That's good, man.

You Can’t Transform Through Pressure

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 15:33

And when you see that fruit of the leader, you're saying, Man, if I had some people like that, but the reason he has people like that is because of the type of leader that they are. Hear this, not necessarily the type of preacher they are. Whoa, that's good, not necessarily how much revelation, how prophetic they are, how good they can sing, none of that. It may be because of the leader. That's why it's so important that ministers learn how to lead. Because you said it, you can have systems, you can have structures, but if you don't have inspiration, you you got all that movement, but no momentum. Because what happens is when you have an inspired people that's been breathed into, what they'll do, man, they'll they'll they'll give their all because they're inspired from the inside. Then not only will they give their all, we use this term, Pastor. See, when it comes to great leaders, you know, me and you, we love sports. We say, when you find a good leader, what people to do, not only do they give their all and they lay it out in the field, you say for that leader, they'll run through a wall. That's right, they'll run through a wall for that leader.

Speaker 3 16:46

That's what we say.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 16:48

They'll run through a wall, but man, I'll run through a wall for that man, like David. Man, I'll run and get you a cup of water, man. I run. Why would you do that? Why would a person have such a level of devotion for a person that they'll run through a wall that that that if if if if if a person calls and then says, Hey, I need you to be here for me, and you could be thousands of miles away, and people to spend money, get on the plane, do whatever they gotta do to do that. Why would a person do that? Because we say, Man, they brainwashed, man. No, what has happened, they've did they've poured something on the inside of them, and they've been inspired. So see, see, see, you can see the power of inspiration, it can work in the negative or positive. When people get inspired, when they get inspired from the inside, they'll give the all. And when I hear this is when they give the all, Pastor C, then you as a leader, you'll get the prop, you'll see the proper manifestations that you want.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 17:49

Yes, yes, yes.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 17:50

What do you mean? Meaning that when it comes to comes in terms of the auxiliary or the church that you're leading, you'll get the fruit, the manifestation, because you got a people that gave their all because you were an inspired leader. Hallelujah. Not only will they give their all because they'll run through a wall, now you begin to see the level of dedication for you as a leader. Now, now we know as believers, we want people first dedicated to God. But the principle of Joseph, we see Joseph was not always dedicated and committed to God, but he was connected with his leader. Yes, Joseph was always in Potiphar's house, whatever he was. And so, my point is now if you are an inspiring leader, maybe you'll begin to get see the manifestation of the dedication. Reason leaders, and your auxiliary and your pastor is frustrated with you as a leader, and you're frustrated with the people because you can't get anything done because you believe because we ain't got good people, people don't keep their word, you can't do this and that. But the reason could be, Pastor, that you're saying that you know you can't depend on people, our church, because you don't have a dedicated people because you haven't been an inspiring leader. Because when people are dedicated, they'll give that all they'll run through all the last thing I see in this. I you know, I like put together in threes that if you don't become this kind of leader that we're talking about in this podcast, if you don't pick up what's being put down and learn how to do this and catch catch this because some things are cult and some things are taught. Catch the spirit of being an inspiring leader. What happened is people's efforts will eventually stall when they're not motivated, when they're not, when they're when they're not inspired. In other words, it'll come to a standstill because it'll stall. Why? Because you were not inspiring as a hear this as a leader, not just inspiring as a preacher or a prophesier or a singer. You got to be inspiring as a leader, and there's a distinction, Pastor C. Well, I think what happens is why we need this because some leaders only have relegated their inspiration to the pulpit only in their sermons, that ain't your leadership. That's that's that's that ain't that that's a a part of it. You you're inspiring the pulpit. So, Pastor, you you're inspiring the pulpit, but besides that, you're not, and many of you, you're leaders in your of your auxiliaries or of your organizations or whatever, endeavor. If you don't have a primary pulpit, I wonder why you don't have the dedication, you don't have the manifestation. Why? Because you haven't been inspiring people. We're talking about not preaching inspiration, we're not talking about preaching with inspiration, we're talking about leading with inspiration so you can become a leader that got his wings.

Inspiration Creates Dedication And Results

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 21:04

What are you hearing in this, Pastor C that man? That's man, that's good. It's it's I think what that leader has to recognize that you have to see when you're inspiring, you're seeing beyond where a person, where a person is crawling at. Those wings is in there. When you're talking about within, you're calling those wings within that's within them. You're calling that. I know you're crawling, but what inspiration does it calls to those wings that's on the inside of them, and where they where they recognize what they're capable of becoming, they recognize their ability to awaken that that God had put in them. So all of a sudden now they're fulfilling that because you called it out of them, if all that makes sense to you. So that's what I hear. So it's more than just motivating them. I'm not just just here to motivate you, that's part of it, but but not, and I think oftentimes in preaching, we inspire with the preaching, but sometimes that's that's to motivate. But leading is the deeper, when I'm saying deeper, go a little further. I would say, when I'm leading you and I'm inspiring you, I'm not just trying to motivate you, but I'm trying to get you to become awakened to what's in you, what you what you got the capability of doing, calling those wings out so you can go forth and do it. And now, as you're doing it, what you said earlier, you're fulfilling the vision of the house. Me as your uh as the leader. Now I got a leader doing the things because that leader has their wings, because I seen those wings, I seen beyond them crawling. Now you now you can run that ushers, that usher auxiliary that you're over. You can run that better than that, because I see the wings in you, so I inspire that. I I wake that up in you because it's in you, I see it. So I I speak to that that's in you. Now you got wings, and so one of the one of the best organizations, uh auxiliaries in the church is that usher, because that leader has been inspired, not just motivated, but inspired.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 23:26

Yeah, that's what I'm hearing.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 23:27

What you say?

Inspire The Inside, Then Motivate Goals

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 23:28

Oh, yeah, I I I love it. I think that brings us to when we think about inspiration versus motivation. Inspiration, what you said, is breathed in. You said you kept mentioned from the inside the spark that's already there. So when I inspire people, it's what's within them. And I think what happens is what leaders mainly focus on, they don't they don't know it. Pastors, the praise leader, children's leader, the uh the leader of leaders within their church, whatever dimension that you're you're leading your church and your own organization, what they do, they are trying to motivate people because motivate deals with the outward motivation, if you would, is what we would call when you're helping people reach a tangible goal. Yes, they're trying to motivate them to fulfill their vision, motivate them to prepare uh for the outreach, for the conference, for the service, for the choir event, for whatever pastor said, whatever God has put on your heart, division. So you talk with your people, whoever your people are. If you ain't got a people, that means you've lacked the level of inspiration. And we'll get to that, Pastor C because you don't have no people. That's good, you're just a preacher. If you if you are taking if you are walking and leading and no one's following you, John Maxwell said, You're not a leader, you're just taking a walk. That's it. That's right. Somebody have to be following you, follow you. But what happens is we're motivating them to do the vision, to do the work, because motivation, you're gonna deal with something that's a specific goal, it's specific, measurable, attainable, realistic, and it has a timeline. So that you'll mo I want you to do this. So if I thought about it this way, if I'm motivating you, Pastor C, uh, to to work out, I'm motivating them say, man, you need to go to the gym, man, you know, three times a week. You know, go to the gym, go to the here, it's gonna, it's gonna help help you be healthier, it's gonna go there, and you need to be going three times. You can go in the morning, you get in the rhythm. I'm motivating you, you know, they got it early, they got a good price. You can take a friend for free, you know, you're gonna feel better. You know, I'm I'm motivating you, and I'm telling you how often, hey, motivating you to go back to school. Hey, go see the registrar, you're gonna get that degree. Man, you're gonna make more money, you're gonna get promotion. It ain't as hard. They got it online now. Your other people are doing it. That's motivating because what I'm doing, I'm telling you things, and I'm giving you outside things to get you to take movement to do it. But what the inspiration comes in, inspiration, see, it's almost like you know how the Bible says the that the word of God divides the son, the soul, and spirit motivation, the inspiration almost like that. So it's a fine line. What inspiration is now, if I'm dealing with the health and you going to work out rather than telling you all these things to do, what you do motivate, what you said, but it starts for inspiration. Man, I see in you, man, man, that there's a there's a workout warrior in you, and you don't even know it. There's a discipline, man. There's a level of discipline in you that you have past sea, because I seen you discipline in this area. I see discipline in you, because I see how you're dedicated, that same dedication. I want you to know that same dedication, you can do that same thing when it comes to your health. And I see I see a winner in you. I see a person hungry. When I see you at the games, I see the way you're with your grandkids, and I see the way you do things, you're always about moving up. There's something in you that's about elevating, there's something in you about going up. And I want you to know I see that same level of going up as you get back into school. Because inside of you, there's something inside of you that wants more, there's something inside of you that won't greater. And what I'm doing with my words, with my action, I'm starting inspiration, I'm stirring what's in you, I'm pouring something in you, I'm pouring a confidence in you, I'm pouring a strength in you, I'm pouring I'm spiking a spark in you. And when I spark it in you, now we can have those goals. So hear the difference. Now, if you're only trying to motivate people for your vision, for your dream, what you're doing, hey, y'all do this, y'all do this, y'all do this, y'all do this, this why we gotta do this, this why, and you done nothing to put nothing in them. Now, if you try to have motivation without inspiration, you won't get your desired manifestation, and you'll be a leader that has frustration. Let me rewind that and say that again. If you are a leader that is experiencing frustration with your congregation, with your people, with your team, with your auxiliary, well, whoever, your wife, your life, and you feel frustration because people don't have the transformation, you're not giving the manifestation. I'm telling you the reason is not because you're not giving them motivation, because you're saying they ain't motivated. No, the problem is it's not might not they might be motivated. The reason is first they hadn't been inspired. Because when you first give them inspiration and they wake up on the inside, remember when they get that inspiration and they wake up on the inside, and when they're inspired by the leader, here we go. They'll give their own for that leader, they'll run through a wall for that leader. Why I do it for you. Why? Because I've been inspired. What you what is it, boss? What you need, pastor, pastor, leader, prophetess, eventually. Just tell me, man, what you need. Why? Because you you've inspired me. You you put hope in me. You you you you waken something, a possibility in me. I'm inspired. We don't use this terminology, but I'm inspired. And so and so, see, I I want to I want to move this to, I believe now, this inspiration is so powerful. How do we what's some ways? How do we maybe inspire people? Maybe what does it look like? Maybe some tangible ways. Uh how does it look like? Because I think what we've missed it, that's why I said at the beginning, we missed it with inspiration. And this is the thing I want to say, and you might hit more part of the mistake. State we've limited to the pulpit, and the preacher thought because he was inspiring in the pulpit, he was inspiring his people. No, you you you preach inspiring sermons. You can't lead with a sermon.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 30:16

No, no, no.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 30:17

You you your prophecies are inspiring, prophet. Your songs, sumpstrous, are inspiring. I mean, teacher, your revelation, evangelist, the way it's it it it all that, but what happened? You can't lead with that only, and so how do we maybe inspire? What are you hearing all this see? Because this thing began to kill me when I thought about it.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 30:41

I think one way you inspire you you can inspire God is first of all, people people how to put it, people catch fire from someone already burning. So if if if if if if you're gonna inspire, you need to be inspired within yourself in order for you to inspire somebody else. See, because that once again, people can't find from folks already burning. So I think one way you help people to catch fire, also, I'm gonna say is to uh inspire them, is as a pastor, relieving from just preaching a sermon, like you say, and sharing the vision. But I said, I don't know, let's give it. But what I mean by that is you got to keep painting the picture, but the picture cannot be down just the what. This is what the vision is, but what you got to give the people is the why. Get the leaders the why that helped inspire them because they know the why. See, if all you're doing is just giving them the what, all that do sometimes is bring in that motivation you're talking about. But to inspire them, you tell them the why. Okay, what do you mean by that, Pelsi? So when I give you the why, this this is the vision. I paint the picture, this is why we're doing it, and now also I inspire you because I let you know what's in you is why I'm pushing you. Why? Because what I see in you, that's the why. Because what I why what I see in you fits my why. This is why we're doing this. What I see in you fit the why. So I'm inspiring you, I'm not just motivating you. Once again, I'm dealing with what I see on the inside of you, so you don't just know my what of the vision, you know the why of the vision, and that's why you're here, and that's why I'm speaking to you because what I see in you help fit my why. So I think that's so vital and important to me. Those are the things is ways that we can do it. You can call out the potential. I'm always looking at the potential in leaders. You know, you that's how I inspire them. I call out the potential that's there. You help people, you have you help the leader see as as the leader, the leader, help a leader see what's with what's with inside of them, what's on the inside of them. And when you do that, you get that how you can inspire them because you you see what's there, you see what's on the inside of them.

Speak To Potential And Purpose

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 33:26

Man, that's good. Let's unpack some of that, man. You you you you you hit some great points, Pastor C. Let's start with that last one when you said that what what inspiration is because I want leaders could really get this, because it it'll cause you to get the manifestation, the transfer, manifestation, the results in in you and what you're leading, home or anything, it's gonna cause you to get the level of dedication from the people that you need, and and it's and it's gonna it's gonna cause these things to happen. When we begin to speak, you said to people's potential, yes. So so let's break it down. So, as a leader, you got to get the skills and learn. That's why we have these podcasts and put yourself in environments so you get the skill to be able to call out and see and recognize people's potential. You got to begin to see what people are. You know, sometimes we look at those people and we almost put them down like you see a positive in everything, you always see the good in people. That's that's it. You you need more of that. Some of us was born with that as a gift, some less, but you gotta get it nevertheless. So mean some people just like some people are a natural givers, natural, what you would say, like take charge leaders, you know what I mean? Like take the bull by the horn. You know, sometimes you gotta take the bull by the horn, don't worry about what people say, don't worry about their faces, be able to make decisions and roll with it, right? Some people got that naturally, others they have to learn the skill, acquire the skill, make the personality adjustments to be effective. It's in every area. Some people are more gracious, Pastor C. The more mercy, the more forgiving, tenderhearted, and but but others are not, but that's not excuse. Then you got to learn how to soften up, how to be more gracious, and all that. Same thing with this. Some people can naturally see potential and see the best. He saw the best in me when others around. If you're not that kind of person and you're more prophetic sometimes in a negative way, where you see things from ground down, everybody else seeing fruit, everybody else seeing fruit. All you see is root. That heart ain't right, this ain't right, that ain't right, man. The fruit that I yeah, I aim I y'all looking from the ground up, man. I'm looking for the ground, uh, something about their motive. I'm not saying that you need to bury that gift, but what you got to do now, these things you should not have done, but now you got to learn how to do these things. You have to learn how to see potential in people. How get books, get around people. I have it as a gift. I didn't know it, see, but I have to own my gift. I have a gift to see. If a person was a tree, I see the whole house built. I just see I see I don't see tree, I see the whole house, I see the whole architectural structure. When I talk to somebody, they just begin to speak to me. I can see their potential, I can see purpose, I can see books, I can see this, I can see that. I can I see so much. I see, and I had to learn not to overwhelm the people and just be oh, good God in Zion. See, because that gift can work against you. I had to learn just because I saw the potential, don't mean they will ever live up to the potential. That's why I would be frustrated with a lot of time with people because it's like I saw all this in you, and if you move too fast, what you'll do, you you will you'll ordain leaves instead of fruit. Instead, I had to learn how just because I can see what the tree should look like, let me wait till they burst some fruit because I get frustrated and I'll move too soon. Like Jesus went to the fig tree, and it was the time for figs, but it had no fruit. Some people can have leaves but never get fruit, so that gift can work in the opposite way. But my point is, see, we gotta learn how to you gotta learn how to see people's potential to inspire. Why? Because man, what that does is when you you you see that in me. Oh my god, see now what happened. You you see that in me, then you see that, and then you said too, when you're leading, don't just give them the what of the vision, the why. The why here it is why it matters to me. What's in it for me? Why why this good? Why? Because you said you kept saying, because I see you in this, I see how you connect with this, so now they see how they're part of something bigger than them that's inspiring. Yes, I'm just not a figure. I in other words, you're showing them from the inside, you matter. We need you, you are relevant, and what that does, Pastor C, that inspires people because you're saying you see value in me, you you you you see portance, and it comes to this that you don't speak just to people's duty, you speak to their destiny.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 38:39

Yeah, oh, that's good. That's good.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 38:41

So you're always talking to them about leads about your duty. Need you to do this, did, did, did, this. I need you to do this, this, this, this. I need my my associate to do this, this, this. I need my secretary to do this, this, this. I need my team to do this, this, this. You'll outreach, you got your own outreach, and all the time you talk to your team. What you need to do, I need y'all to do that, that, that, that. I need y'all to do that, that. But do you ever speak to people's destiny?

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 39:06

God is good.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 39:07

Not in the pulpit, preacher, Pastor. One on one, do I talk to you and tell you, man, this is what I see in you. So this is what God showed me. That inspires a person, Pastor C.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 39:21

So, so down, what I'm hearing, when if I'm just focusing on their duties, what I'm trying to get them to do, what that does, that proof that that that provides uh a more of a drive. That provides a drive in them to do it. Because you focusing just on their duties, do this, do this, do this. That's that motivation you're talking about. But inspiration, what you do is because you inspire them from that entry on the inside there, internal, what they end up doing now, down, you're not just motivating them, or you're just not trying to get them to do a specific duty, but you now what you end up doing, you make you get them where they want to do something, they want to because they then inspiration because what's on the inside gives them a want to, and I think motivation just give them a specific thing to do, but inspiration gives them a want to because what you see in them, so now they got a want to, and I think motivation is a temporary thing, but inspiration is an enduring thing, yeah, because you're inspiring, yeah, yeah.

Duty vs Destiny Language

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 40:35

You hit it. Not want to versus have to, yeah, yeah. You said that earlier. That's the pressure, yes, that's it. Because your words, you're telling you, you you you're you're putting pressure on. Listen, we're not saying we don't do these things, but you can't put the cart before the horse, leaders before motivation needs to be inspiration. Inspiration is the foundation for successful motivation. You you're trying to build a house without a foundation. Whoa. Well, I looked at such and such leader, such and such leader, and I even heard this about Nick Saban. We see people motivated, so all you think they do is motivate. No, there's a foundation of inspiration. Now that motivate because that motivation is gonna put pressure. So if you don't have if you hadn't already built a solid foundation from inspiration, they'll crack under pressure. They can't because they they quit. I'm not enough, I'm I can't do good, I'm not good, I'm not worthy, I'm not they'll crush it's too much. I can't handle this, I gotta life. Y'all don't pay me enough. I'm they'll tap out because you would put too much pressure. And why did the leader put pressure? Because I need stuff done, and I need you to come up to the standard. I need everybody to come up and you and all that stuff you're saying, true, leader, but you missed the boat because you didn't have inspiration. Because why you didn't know, but now you're learning. Speak to the potential, not to have now. This is the part because you said that uh motivation is is is temporary. See, when you are inspired from the inside, now the the the greatest motivation when somebody's internally motivated. Now I don't need when when I when I have internal motivation, which is inspiration and not external motivation, you don't you don't have to give me no rules, you don't have to tell me I don't need a boss over me. I don't need nobody, I don't need nobody. Some folk need people. See, see some people need somebody to wake them up and tell them to get what they need done, or they won't do it. They need somebody to hold them accountable. So I'm trying to tell you, leader, you can't be average. Now, this is average, average people need that, they need accountability, they need somebody to watch over their shoulder to make sure you do your exercise, make sure you do your work. But when you are a leader, need nobody to tell me, do it myself, hold myself accountable because one of the greatest leadership that you need, if you're gonna be a great leader, you need self-leadership. Yes, hold yourself accountable. That's good, and so that's what that inspirational. So it is. I love that, Pastor. It's not to have to, but then you said you have them to see why why of the vision that inspires them because now they see how they fit within the vision. Then you started. I hope y'all get that, leader. So you got to know the why of the vision, not just vision of the task. I need you to make these social media posts, I need you to follow up on this. I need y'all to know the songs, I need you all to be on time, whatever it is, leader. But do you got to know the why? Then you got to know how they fit into it. So, leader, you got to know your people. Pastor C. You always say this when we're coming saying, You got to know the state of your flock as a pastor. Yes, that's right. You you got to know whatever leader as a husband, you got to know your people. Yes, you gotta know your wife, your husband, your wife, their personality. You gotta know how to deal with them. There you go, motivate them because what inspire one person might not inspire the other person. What motivate? So, you got to get that foundation of inspiration, and you tell them, and then you said, if you're gonna be a leader that's inspired, you got to be stirred up, and you said it comes from the inside. You know, I thought about that song, let praise arise from the inside, right? And so you got to be around inspiring people, yes, hearing conversations like this. So I hope this is here, and you you kind of begin to see. Hope that the ministers are seeing and leaders inspiration versus motivation. We need to give people motivation, but first it has to be built on a foundation of inspiration. Because this is what inspiration does. I see, it helps people know their value from the inside. It letting people know I care about you, I value you. This what is in you, and when a person feels that you see them, that's it. They've been seen. You see me, I'm her, you hear me, you see me, you value me. See, this is how I feel. You I have value, I'm just not a cog in the wheel. You you see my potential, so sometimes your potential has some, it's outside of their duties. It's it's that leader that cares, but because I like to frame it this way a couple things that we have to lead, we have to inspire not only with our lips. See, we inspire with our lips, but we got to inspire sometime with your life where your life becomes aspirational. That's right. People look at your life, and your life show them the potential what their life could be. That's what it's called being aspirational leader, where you live a life that people like, man. I wanna I wanna be like them, but man, I want to live like it. It caused them to come up because something about your life, that's what we learn, and it it got let's give some authenticity to help the ministers. Let's see, for those YouTube video, wherever this is what they were teaching in the late 80s and early 90s, but it got twisted and got thrown off now that we're reaping some of the fruit that the heart of it had the right goal when it was about being an aspirational leader, that leaders should live well, drive well, do well, you know, because what it does, it it gives the people a goal, and so that was there was some truth in that because people need to see see things to realize this is possible, it got thrown off because some lead leaders got uh greedy, uh they became arrogant, uh it became all about stuff and things and not serving. Come on, and that twisted it, but we still can't throw the baby away with the bath water. Because if you as a leader, if how you how you live matters, and it's all relevant. We learn from our apostle, our bishop, it's all relevant to where you are, uh the state of your flock, the people you pastor, the the place you are, where you live, but you need to have a life that still that gives people inspiration. If your shoes are run over and your clothes are run over, you're not an aspirational leader. Watch this, and you won't inspire people.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 48:01

That's correct.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 48:02

So you have to live a life that makes people in spite aspirational, but you don't want to get too far, see where you got to have uh the the Maybach, the the the airplane, and uh and all the private jet. I'm not saying you shouldn't have all that, but I say that's the balance. And I think some leaders, if we don't tell them that, they can miss it and not become aspirational how they live, how they conduct themselves, how they deal with themselves, because all that stuff that inspires people with your life and your your lips and your love. Yes, you inspire people with your love when you connect with them, when you when you let them know you care about them, you're there for them. This is out of duty. Now that becomes inspiration that that stirs something on the inside, like you you care about me, yeah, you really do, and so it ain't about my typing, yeah, it's about my singing, and I think those important things see that we see how uh to be that inspiration leader. What are you hearing in this? You know, we just dialogue and what are you hearing?

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 49:02

I I think one of the things you said that stood out is uh when I when I spoke to uh speaking to their potential, call out their potential, and you were saying, therefore, you need to know them. But what kept ringing in my ear was like I always say to you as well, is that you got to sit among them. You you won't know them until you sit among them.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 49:26

Break that down. Help help these pastors, auxiliary leaders, fivefold ministers, those that are leading whatever, you know. What do you mean by that?

Foundation Before Pressure: Avoid Cracks

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 49:35

One thing is your attitude cannot be that I'm above them because I am the leader of them, but instead, I want to sit among you where I can feel you, and so as I'm feeling you, I'm getting to know you now. I can easily inspire you because I see the potential, but you don't sit among me if you feel like you're above me, so I don't sit where you sit. I don't, I don't allow myself to feel what you feel because I'm better if that's your attitude because I am I am the leader, and you just a leader. It can't be that type of attitude. The attitude got to be hey, I'm not above you, I'm the leader, but I'm not above you. I can sit among you, and as I sit among you, what I'm doing, I'm learning you, and now I can inspire you, like I said, because I see the potential is there, I can see it. So now it got to be where you're spending time with the with with the people that you're leading.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 50:42

Man, that's such good wisdom for pastors, any leader. I want you to help us keep the balance in it, Pastor C, because there's always a tension in one side of the road.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 50:53

Yeah, you don't yeah, you want to make sure that we don't become familiar. So I was just telling a group of my leaders, is that I hang out with you because I don't want them to ever become so familiar with me that they lose respect for me, in a sense. So in hanging with you, I can let my hair down, and I'm not talking about anything sinful, it's just that there's a certain respect level that as the leader that all my other leaders see that they have for me. So, no, when I hang with you, it's not in, like I said, a sinful way. It's just that in hanging with you, if I can use this term very loosely, we're at the same level per se. So we can hang there together. Now, with the leaders, yes, when I'm saying sitting among them, I'm not above them. That's true, but what I am saying, there's a different level about it, only in lead on only an authority manner. Me and you at the same authority level, but I'm not with my leaders, so therefore, there's a difference in me hanging with them and sitting among them. Gotcha. Okay, that that's the difference that I'm saying. I hang with you, but I sit among them. Meaning, when they're going through something, I'm right there. I'm I'm sitting there, I'm getting to know them, and I think I know them better when they're going through a trial or a test. I'm getting to know them, so I don't hang with them, but I sit with them. So that that's the difference.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 52:38

I've never seen that way sitting versus hanging with them. I like that, right? But I I like to look at it this way too. But I was I was just recently having this conversation with someone, I know it's a balance, and and that's what it takes wisdom because we cannot give you a an equation because every situation is different, every people are different, and that's why you got to get back from the last podcast. My god, that's so touched me last our last discussion. See, you brought that unfolded that, but that importance of wisdom is the principal thing, meaning that the balance of when see, it's a balance you can get in the ditch if you are with your people too much or in the wrong way, the wrong settings, wrong atmosphere, wrong places, then they can become familiar with you or lose respect for you, right? And that's what, but it takes wisdom in that, and we have to just break that down later. But on the same, so you got to be have God give you wisdom of not being around them too much, wrong place at wrong time. But the other side of this, if you're too far removed from your people, yeah, then what a couple things happen. You don't get to know them, you kind of live in the bubble. You you you you're living in the bubble. It's like we talk about people in management, Pastor CEO, they're making decisions in these lofty places, and they're not down, they're not boots on the ground. They say they don't get it because see they lost they lost touch because they're too far away. Yes, that's why Jesus came down and wrapped himself in humanity. That's right, and he can be easily touched without infirmity. That's why he's a faithful high priest. That's right, you gotta be able to be able to be touchable, so you got to get that balance because you could be a uh because if you're too far removed from them, then you don't know them. And hear this now, your people suffer because now they don't know you. We're from the generation. See, this generation now is a little more transparent, but our forefathers and before them, the generation is we didn't know struggle that they had. All we knew is that all they showed us was their faith.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 54:58

That's correct.

Lead Beyond The Pulpit

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 54:58

All they showed, they never they never showed us or spoke to us and talked about the fears that they had, the failures that they had, the follies that they had. Uh uh, they they never talk about the scars, and so what happened is it's it can set you up when you have uh scars and struggles. You think there's something wrong with you. Why? Because the the our leaders they didn't deal with that, they didn't show that it was like that man don't cry type deal. Yeah, men don't hurt, so it was all about their faith, and now you're so far removed from your people, you hurt your people because now they don't see an authentic authentic leader, and they don't think they can. And I know I was telling uh our leaders this does a school of thought on that. You know, you become mystical when you far away from your people, yeah. Because if you drink Kool-Aid with the people, now you're common. But if you're mystical, they rush you away. But I think there's something about that too, that's that's that's deadly for you and for the people because you set up a false narrative with them. That's why Jesus said, Man, I'm asleep too, too, yeah. And so I think we have to follow Jesus' pattern. I think we have to have wisdom in that seed to to be able to balance to be amongst the people and and and and and balance that because that's how back to the point. That's how you're gonna be able to inspire them because you know what they're dealing with. That's the point, and now your life becomes inspirational. Why? Yeah, you go through that's it. Your life showed them because they saw you go through, you know how much respect they got for you now because the way they saw you deal with it, now they know better than a sermon, they can deal with it. Why? Because you let them into your world, yes, yeah, that's it.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 56:41

You just connected those dots, man.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 56:45

Yeah, so man, I I think about that now. See, what are some ways we get Red Land this plane? Some other ways that uh maybe how we can how how does this inspirational leadership look like? Maybe how it look and and regular thing, or maybe some other closing things we can give them a how to do it, or way it looked, uh, any kind of terminology you have in that, how it look, or maybe way that we can we can do it. And what I thought about is this I thought about it, hit me. You leaders need to be, you need to be that more charismatic, charismatic. I start thinking about the charismatic leader is an inspiring leader. When I was trying to think of some ways to help leaders become how did this look, what did it look like? Because listen, when a leader, when a you know, you know what they say about a charismatic leader, they have a they have a magnetism to them, they draw, yeah. It's something about you know it's it's it makes people want to be with them because people feel valued by them, they feel like they want to connect with them, and when what people when people find a leader that's charismatic, they're drawn to them, they connect with them, they commit to them, and they want to contribute to them. That's what a charismatic person does, and they they they drawn to them, so commit to why it's like because that that charismatic leader brings energy in the room, yes, that's good. They bring energy, they make people feel good, they they they how to relate with people. So, not every leader won't have the same level of charisma, but I believe every leader, if you're gonna be effective and inspiring, we need to learn lessons from charismatic leaders. I think about your governor from Florida, how when he ran for the presidency a few years ago, what is his name? He's been to get out now. What's his name? Uh uh, is it Santos? Whatever. I know you probably know, but whatever your your governor's name. I think about I can't think you know, we only stand think his name, but whatever your governor's name, they said part of the reason he didn't win it because the way he didn't have no charisma, he seemed like a robot. I know even better problem than him many years ago when Al Gore, real smart guy. I think they said Al kind of helped maybe did some stuff with the internet. Al Gore, real smart president, but he was like a robot, he he he was methodical, you know. You know, it didn't, and and that doesn't people don't relate to that sometimes. So I think as leaders, step and ministers, all personnel are different. We can't just build stuff off charisma because we said it ain't all about your gifting, that's right. But that charisma we can learn from charismatic people, we can peep some of that game and learn how to be more engaging. I learned Pastor C with leaders. What smile more man? Some of my my covenant brothers and stuff from from I've learned that man. Hey, how you doing, dog? Like man, I don't do that. I don't talk to me. It's like, but something about you don't have to say what they say, but it's something about making people. I learned from one leader is and I I give you this, and then they taught me that they they gave me peep this game that one thing you want to do as a leader. When people encounter you, you want you want you want your their encounter with you to be the highlight of their week. That's the mentality you ought to have with people. My your encounter with me will be the highlight of your week of your day because I want to make you feel so special, so seen, so heard, so valuable, so needed, so wanted, not fluffing you, not lying to you. That's that charismatic leader. That's why they draw you in. And when you then people connect with a charismatic leader, Basty, that's great.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 1:00:52

That's great.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 1:00:54

So I think that's one thing that may help the leaders that you need to study that out in terms of not being that, but I don't want to get out of bounds for that. That's why we have these conversations. What would you add to that? You know, in that, because I think that's a way we're really gonna help them develop and become more inspiring. You have to learn from people because they are inspirational. Sometimes men may have no structure, they may not have no system, they may even maybe hollow and shallow, but man, they know how to draw people, they know how to connect with people, they're not connect with people.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 1:01:26

That's correct. I think what one thing is inspiring, right?

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 1:01:29

When you connect, that's inspiring. So when you connect with a person, you inspire them. Now you can motivate them.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 1:01:36

I I that part about basically you you being the highlight of their week. I was just here recently from a leader that was spoken in to me that I started working on intentionally, um, because I I didn't I didn't value it. That is learning the people's name that come in your presence because it's something about people like hearing their name call. Because that means when they hear their name call, that you took the time to learn that it's important. So when you address someone, you address them by their name, you know. So they walk in the room. So now what you're doing, you're connecting with them.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 1:02:17

Ouch, ouch, you're on my toe, man. I gotta do better there. You heard me toe, you on my toe. See, I gotta do better.

Inspire With Lips, Life, And Love

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 1:02:23

Yeah, so now you're connecting with them, and because of that, it's easy for you to inspire them because they feel like you care, because you took you know my name. So when you come in the building, you call that person or inner there, you meet that person, see them, you call them by their name. So it's something I started, I started working on. And you say, Well, that's that, what else it look like down with Donit me uh saying I'm trying to be, you know, uh faky or whatever, that I'm always appreciating my leaders. I not not by just you know saying, oh, they know I appreciate them. I speak it. You know, as I'm there, are they doing a task? Are they finished up a task or whatever the situation might be? When they leave my presence, I'm I I on purpose, intentionally, I let them know how I feel and that I appreciate them. Hey, you know, uh brother Mike, I appreciate you doing that, but Frank man, I want to let you know I really appreciate you. Okay, so that's to me, that's what is the how that feels like inspiration because what what ended up taking place is I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm speaking to that inward man in them. I'm speaking to that, I'm speaking to it indirectly. I'm speaking to that. That when when I speak to them, I'm speaking to that within them, and that I appreciate that. I I appreciate you. So now when Pastor do speak as their leader, and I'm inspiring them, they can receive that because they recognize it's coming from somebody that appreciates me. Well, when you get speaking at motivation, you're more given directives. That's correct, that's right. But now it's a smile, I appreciate you. So now they see that as being more inspiring to them. Oh man, that's real good. See, and so that's what that looked when you ask me what it looks like. I think that's part of that, where like what you said, you're learning, you're reading, you hang around other people that's inspiring, and you pick up from that, like what we do, and now I use that, I'll pass that on in inspiring others. And I do think the charisma part you meant that you mentioned, I think that's important, man, because I think that goes back to your lifestyle and I and what you were saying earlier. You know, no, we're not saying you have to have the plans. It everything kind of got what basically I took what you were saying, how I said, everything just got out of balance, and we just got to bring it back in balance, where people, because people do look at the way you live. If you try and inspire me, and yet your lifestyle ain't fitting what you're saying, you ain't inspiring me. Uh uh, how you gonna inspire me? So somebody needs to inspire you, is what their attitude become because of your lifestyle, but yet you have to have a balance in it.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 1:05:21

Man, wonderful. See, I so concur with that. You got to celebrate people publicly, oh, and then correct them privately. Yes, and I like how you said that because now you got the foundation for motivation because you inspire them. I think too, uh, with it, that you you need to celebrate their progress and not just their results, you know, because I'm a I'm a results-oriented person, I'm a goal-oriented person, and I had to learn as a leader that it's not all it's it's about the goal, but it's about making sure people are whole. People are not whole and never reach the goal. So I had to make sure I put up the pen sometime and celebrate progress and not just the results, and you know, that point out what they're doing well and to create that culture of improvement. Then to uh then also I say this how you inspire and what it looked like is investing in other people's potential, it's investing in them, yeah, it's spending time with them, yeah. Sometimes it's sharing your platform with them, yeah. It's allowing them to be a part uh of that, and I think that's that in inspiring leader. And and I get back to if we don't have that inspiration, then you're not gonna you're not gonna fly, you're gonna crawl, you're not gonna get the manifestation, you're not gonna get the dedication, people are not gonna give their all, they're not gonna run through a wall because you want that inspired leader, and you helped us so much today, Pastor C as you said that letting them know how they fit in the vision. And I pray that you'll go back and hear uh this podcast and get it over and over because this is just a part of how we keep these leadership wings. Those that have been with us, if you want to get more ministry materials, ministry, you'll see a link there now that you can get our training materials on uh our teaching platform. Then also there's a link there. You can go back in the uh if those that are watching on a video, those that are not, you can look in the show notes. And those that are with us on video, if not, you can look in the show notes. You you scan that QR code that you see now, you can get the link uh to Pastor C's book on leadership, it'll help you in a powerful way develop. And then also, you see another link. You can go back if you're watching the video, just go back. You can get a link to a book that I wrote on leadership, and then finally, you you scan the QR code, you can subscribe to this podcast for those that are by audio or listen to the show notes. Pastor C, this has been a wonderful discussion. I'm inspired because because uh we inspire with our words, but not only with our words, but our life and our love. And I want you to know your your love has been, you know, the love you I've seen you share with others toward me, it's inspired me to be a better me. And because of that, you know, I reach across the aisle because the friend you were to me 20 some years ago, whenever I meet people, you never know how to shake out, but I I try to show myself friendly, to walk with people, you know, to be a friend, not just wanting a friend, you know, be what you saw model to you, you know. And so you can we we inspire people in many ways, and when we inspire people, not just with our lips, but our life and the love, then they'll run through wall for you. That's true, they'll give their all for you, they'll have a level of dedication. Why? Because you've inspired now, like how you said you connected with them when you connect with people, people will connect with you. That's good, they'll contribute to you and they'll follow you. Any final thoughts?

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 1:09:19

Uh, today one thing I want to leave on down quickly. Here is that we didn't quite touch on is how do we stay inspired? How do the leaders stay inspired to inspire others, you know, so that you could, you know, you yourself got to you know stay inspired as a leader, you know.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 1:09:41

For you, you know, one thing I'll just say you can share with us being around people like you, platforms like this.

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 1:09:48

Okay, good.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 1:09:49

This inspires me being in environments around inspirational uh people. What would you add to that?

Sit Among, Not Above, Your People

Dr. Clinton Cornelius 1:09:56

I think also revisiting some past victories you don't have that helped you also. I call it remembering when. If you can keep a remembering when I think that keeps you winning, if if you can remember when W H E N, it'll keep you W I N N I N G winning, and that and that will help keep you inspired if you can remember some things, and like what you said, definitely hang around others, hang around others also, and then if I'm gonna leave, if I was gonna leave a thought um to leaders about how to do this, you know. We we we everything we've been sharing, I think one of the things you got to do, you got to watch your language, and what I mean by that by watching your language, you need to you need to use words like uplifting, start making sure your language fits what's some saying things that is inspiring. It's what I mean by watch the language, how how how how you how you speak to those ones that you're trying to inspire. And one of the thoughts come to mind, like I say, you want to say stuff like uplifting, you know, you know, terms like that that will help them. So I do think we have to watch how we speak to people in regards to the difference between motivating them. I might be saying one term, but to inspire them, I'm using different types of terms. So learn that, you know, somewhere create a language, find out that language that you can use that that moves towards speaking it over them, and that's gonna help with inspiring them.

Dr. Robert F. Dowell 1:11:38

So I see something that can be taught and caught. So I I that could be caught, but I think with those things that you're doing, it can be taught. Well, wonderful. Well, what a wonderful discussion. We pray. I pray that your heart has been blessed as mine was from this podcast uh today. We're gonna continue our next time together and developing those leadership wings so that we can move from caterpillar leaders to butterfly leaders. This has been Dr. Robert F. Dow and my good friend Dr. C. P. Cornelius from the great state of Florida. We pray that you have eaten well now that you can excel as a fivefold leader. God bless you. We'll see you out next time. Be sure you check the show notes, be sure you subscribe so you can get all the podcasts. We look forward to seeing you in our next time together. God bless you.