What Really Makes a Difference: Empowering health and vitality
Current science, ancient wisdom, and deliciously vulnerable and empowering conversations about what really makes a difference in our health and vitality.
What Really Makes a Difference: Empowering health and vitality
Becoming Ourselves and Deepening our Spiritual Connection with Michelle Norris
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Hello and welcome to the What Really Makes a Difference podcast. I'm your host, Dr. Becca Whittaker. I've been a doctor of natural health care for over 20 years and a professional speaker on health and vitality, but everything I thought I knew about health was tested when my own health hit a landslide and I became a very sick patient. I've learned that showing up for our own health and vitality is a step by step journey that we take for the rest of our lives. And this podcast is about sharing some of the things that really make a difference on that journey with you. So grab your explorer's hat while we get ready to check out today's topic. My incredible guest network and I will be sharing some practical tools, current science and ancient wisdom that we all need, no matter what stage we are at in our health and vitality. I've already got my hat on and my hand out, so let's dive in and we can all start walking each other home. I am so happy to be sharing a conversation with none other than Michelle Norris with you today. If you have been in the paleo world, or in the plant medicine world, you have likely come across things that she has facilitated into creation, or is actively promoting, whether you knew it or not. She is a co founder and a CEO of Paleo FX, which is the largest paleo event in the world. She's also a co author of Primal Uprising book and a co founder of the Primal Academy. All of those things have been created to help people optimize their health and she also focuses on expanding consciousness. And helping people reclaim their freedom. She calls herself a spiritual coach and healer, but you will learn her definition of that and your definition of that may be entirely different. We talk about connection. We talk about flow. We talk about trauma. We talk about beauty from the ashes. And it's a beautiful conversation. I can't think of a conversation that I would rather welcome the New Year in than with Michelle Norris. So without further ado, let's get started. Michelle, I am so grateful to be with you today. I have wished so many times that when we were talking, I could record it so that I could listen to it again or so that so and so or so and so could hear it. And I know my listeners may not know you yet, but I am grateful to introduce them to you. So I have the fantastic, beautiful, and wise Michelle Norris with me today. Hello. Thank you. Thank you so much for having me in that. Wonderful little intro. Well, she hasn't heard my actual intro yet, but I got accolades. So the reason I brought Michelle on is she has such a wonderful perspective. So she is a spiritual coach and healer. Um, But does it in a different way? I am in a profession in which I'm get to meet a lot of people who call themselves healers, and it seems like sometimes when we say spiritual coach and healer, it gets a little like, Ooh, like energetic in a way that's hard to relate to or hard to explain. Not that I'm saying it's not accurate or not doing anything. But hard to figure out how to use words, you know, to explain what people are doing. What I love about what you do is you can bring back the groundedness and the relatability and make it so that it's an obvious thing that we could need some coaching in our spiritual life. Can you explain to me and to the listeners what it is that you do? Well, I, the work that I do is really, um, supporting people, um, to empower themselves and find their own sovereignty. Um, Um, so yeah, the spiritual coach and healer can, you know, can either get really super woo or it can get really super religious and I'm neither. Um, I shouldn't say that I am woo, but I'm, however, I am. It's really more about really supporting people to go in and find their own relationship with self and God. what that means to them. And I don't dictate what that is. I don't, um, put my beliefs on anyone else. I, I, I'm like, I'm trying to be the light that brings them to their own light. Um, so, you know, a lot of, I was raised Christian, um, Baptist is what I started out in. And then I became a Catholic and kind of recovered from that and became non denominational Christian. And now I would say, I am, I'm not a Christian. I am a Christ follower. Which is a very big difference for me because I'm not about the religion, I'm about a relationship. Your, your relationship with yourself and with God is first and foremost before any relationship that you have with anyone else. And until you master self love, true self love, There is no love for anyone else. Um, we can say we love, you know, our children, our spouses, our, you know, family, our friends, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. We can go down that road, but until you truly, truly, truly love yourself completely and only look for what you need within yourself, then you can actually truly love others. Because, you know, Christ said the kingdom of God is within you, not outside of you. Not anywhere else. It's not located anywhere else. We have this concept, especially any of those that have been, um, you know, in the Christian religion in any form or facet, that, you know, there's a heaven and a hell, and I don't believe there's another place for heaven or hell. I believe that's all here. And it's whether or not you choose to bring heaven or you choose to bring hell here. And I am, you know, it's interesting cause Brittany, um, our daughter that passed away 14 and a half years ago, she and I had these conversations before she passed and she was a music and worship ministry major and had planned to be a missionary and was going to be a minister, all of that. And that was one of the things we talked about. It's really about bringing heaven here on earth. And, and choosing to do that versus hell, because, you know, in all of our pettiness as humans, and all of the things that we get caught up in, and our insecurities, and our worries, and our fears, and all of that stuff, we actually create hell here. That's what we're doing, and we see that. You know, globally right now, there's a lot of hell in the world, however, that's all shifting and changing as we all come into our self mastery of self love and understanding that our relationship with ourself is primary with God in order for us to actually bring heaven here and bring love to earth, which is what our task really truly is. I mean, we were told to love each other as God loves us, and if we fail to love ourselves that way If we can't find that love for ourself, and we're constantly in these programs that we have been programmed with through no fault of our own, no fault of our parents, grandparents, whatever, we've all been programmed into this idea of unworthiness, of being undeserving, of, you know, sin, all of these things that we are, you know, we are no longer, um, worthy of, whatever it is that we desire. And none of that is true. The it's really about us coming back full circle to our full self love, which is the way God loves us. And when we fully self, you know, love ourselves, we can love others unconditionally the way God loves us because there are no conditions to the love of God. There's zero. It's not, you're worthy, you're not, you're, you did this, you did that, you, whatever, you sinned, you, all of these things, those are all the programs that we've been given, you know, even in the Catholic Church, one of the things that you do when you go into Mass is, you physically say the words, I am not worthy to receive you. That's not true. That is, that is a man made thing. That is a man made concept that we've been programmed with. The thing is, is that we were born worthy and we were born deserving of God's love and we will always be deserving of God's love. It's when we actually recognize that, love ourselves the way God loves us, then we can love others that this way. And then you understand that all of that is nonsense. It's a program that's kept all of us in this state of, of control. Because if you believe that you are unworthy and unlovable and all of these things, then you're completely controllable and that's, that's not what God intended. I'm gonna pause you for a moment because you just did exactly what you do, which is part of what I love. Which is it, it takes me a couple years to unpack something. I go slow, I'm noticing all kinds of things, it takes lots of different mentors and teachers to bring awarenesses to me, and then I have a conversation with you, and you pretty much just tie in a bow what I've been learning for the last two years and say it in five minutes. Well, you know, we connect. It makes you a wonderful person to record with. Thank you. Well, we connect the dots backwards. We can't connect them forwards, we connect them back, and that's when we We recognize all of the little things, all of our life, because, you know, we've also been programmed to believe that life happens to us, not for us. I'm, I'm gonna pause you for just a moment. So let's unpack some of what you talked about, because I think it's worth a mention. First of all, I thought that I loved myself before I got sick, right? I, I definitely grew up in a, in a religion. Also, mine was Christian. Mine was the church of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints, which I know people in or out of it. This is not about a show about religion. Um, it's a show about choice. But for me, I thought that I loved myself because I was a child of God and because I was chosen to come to the earth at this time to make a difference by following ABCDEFG and doing it perfectly, right? And I feel like there was some truth in that and some error in that. Like I do believe I'm here at a time for a specific purpose, but I don't think that anybody else tells me what that is. It feels like a voice that has risen inside of me that I find as I go, as I follow my intuition or my magic or my connection with spirit, my impressions, whatever your language says. But what I discovered as I really sat in it is that I Indeed did not love myself. I loved the like warrior or person that I was supposed to be for God in this certain way I realized that I had been taught not to trust myself because one of the things that we say in that religion is That you that natural man is an enemy to God and always has been so it's like, okay What I naturally well, whatever that really means what I took it to mean is like, okay my natural impressions I will make mistakes I will be selfish, I will do all of those things, and I need instead to submit myself to God's will. And what I realized is that training was from little to teach me not to trust myself, to teach me to ask someone else that could tell me what behavior they wanted me to do that was in line with them. I mean, kind of diabolical when you think about it, whether it was intended to or not, whether the people teaching me intended it or not. When you talk about it being a program, I think we are We decide so much of what we believe so young we can take something that maybe even had good intentions and turn it to Be I can't trust myself. You know what I realized was I also had a problem with Loving others as God loves me because how God loves me was something I also needed to learn I had a mentor That was fantastic. His name was Ernest Morrow, and he's in Canada. As we talked, he had a moment one day where he said, Becca, I don't think you believe in God. I think you believe in Santa Claus. I was like, what? And he just started singing, slowly, the song. He sees you when you're sleeping. He knows when you're awake. He knows if you've been bad or good. So be good, for goodness sake. He just kept singing it, and I just It was like, creepy, that's so creepy. And that, and I realized at that point, I needed to lean in to who I really felt God was and to notice how God or spirit or source or whatever was actually indeed showing love to me. How I came to learning and feeling more of that is looking around at me in nature, like it, uh, things that were growing on time with no dictation from me. And that I am indeed a part of another thing that I mean, a part of the cycle that is showing up without having to pay for it, without even having to know what I'm doing, that my very life, that my very body is a gift, whether that body is in pain that day, whether my life is in chaos that day. Still, I am present. I am alive. I am breathing in and out. It is for free, it is a gift, and the more that I sit in that and then expand from there, the wonder of what is possible in this day as a gift is amazing. And that's a reality. I literally did not make this happen. My body is self healing and regulating. I have sunshine I enjoy, snow I enjoy. I didn't do any of that. That isn't an esoteric saying. That's like reality. So it turned into what can I look at in reality is happening. That is showing me that I am loved, that I am cared for, that I am seen, that I am being given gifts all day long. That really switched it from love that I needed to earn the love I already had. Because if I was loving people, as I thought God was loving me, I thought they had to earn my love. As well. I don't think I really understood that until I started to have children. My, uh, son, Hunter. Actually, pretend I didn't say his name. One of my children really struggles with anxiety. And, um, was starting to get into feeling like he had to prove himself to me. And I could feel that energy and it was sticky. And I remember walking out to my car and thinking, I wish I could help him understand. I just love him, period. I always will. There's nothing he has to do to earn from me. I love him. And I had this feeling flood over me that was my connection to source. And I heard the words, that's how I feel about you and even more. And I thought, Oh, that's the first I understood. This isn't something I need to earn. Have you seen many people feel like they have to earn it or it has to be just right and, and how do you help people unpack that? Well, wow, that is such a, oh, that's a loaded question because, you know, this is a long running program. I mean, it is a program that we have been intentionally programmed with for very, very long time. The thing is, no, you don't have to learn, you don't have to earn God's love. You don't have to earn anyone's love. that is in a place of self love and understanding that they are part of that God's love for you and for everyone, right? And so it's really going through where did that begin for that person. It's the process of finding the core issue, the core wound, the core, um, limiting belief that, that was decided upon. It was a decision made by the individual that I have to earn love. Um, so, this was, you know, this is through so many people, especially people I'm really close with, felt like there was, their performance was how they got love. How they performed, how they did things was how they received love from parents, from, you know, others, what have you, in partnership. That's not even made up. Like, you can look for evidence to support that, like, oh, I feel more love when I get good grades. That's when they talk to me. Right. Right. I think. That's natural. Right. And then there was even, there's even, you know, people that realize that, you know, every time that they were injured, they got love. So then they, they created injuries in their lives and sickness and all of these things over and over and over in order to receive love. The thing is, is that we've been programmed with this idea that we have a very wrathful God. That's not true. That is all a lie. We do not have a wrathful God. What we have is humans that create all this nonsense and this strife and pain and suffering and all of the things that we see in the world. We're the ones creating that. God allows it because we have free will. We are so free we can choose bondage, and we do. It's part of, it's interesting because the original Um, the original, uh, title of the book was, um, Escaping the Human Zoo, and it's you are the zookeeper and the zoo animal. You're the one that has entrapped yourself into this cell of believing you're unworthy, all of these things, and you have the keys to the cell door to get out. It's when, when you actually wake up to the. full self love, to the relationship with God, to knowing that you are worthy and that you are good and that you are, you are deserving of all of the benefits and the blessings of life because you just exist. That's it. You don't have to do anything else. That is the true grace of God, is that you have nothing else to do, nothing else to prove, no performance, no nothing. It's, we're here as aspects of God experiencing. ourselves. That's what we're here to do. And that's why we all, you know, chose to come to Earth School. We all chose to come and do this self mastery, this self love, all of the things. And it's like what I was saying earlier, is that we, we have been programmed with the belief that life happens to us, not for us. But the, the true reality is, every single thing that happens in your life, what you deem or title, Good, bad, negative, positive, evil, good, whatever you, light, dark, all of it, it all just is, it's not either of those things. It is what is your perspective on it, and what your perspective is, is what creates whether it's good or bad. So, I've said this a million times, and I'll say it a million times more. I would never in a million years ever choose for Brittany to pass away and die. Never. And I also cannot deny the beauty that's come from her ashes. The thing is, is that, yes, God allowed her to pass when she passed, because it was her time. She was done here, which is an actually awe inspiring thing that, you know, she was three days before her 23rd birthday when she passed. She got her work done here that fast, like, wow, that's mind boggling. And it was painful, and it was difficult, and it was hard, and it was challenging, and I, there were days I did not believe that I was going to be able to get out of bed, It was also the catalyst for Palo FX. It was a catalyst for so many beautiful things. And it's really, do you look for the beauty in the ashes? Or do you look, do you dig in the dirt and looking for dirt? Because if you dig in the dirt and look for dirt, you're going to find it. And if you dig in the ashes for beauty, you're going to find it. And that is really what my entire life has been about. I have had an extremely challenging, difficult, painful past and one of the things that I've been able to transcend in the last couple of years is I, um, I'm not sure how familiar you or your audience are with human design and in human design, I have a channel called the channel of struggle, which is a channel where I believe that I have to struggle to find my truth, to find the meaning and the purpose in life or otherwise it has no meaning and I finally have transcended that channel in my It's, it, the thing is, is that a lot of people would say, well, why were you given that? It's because it's something for me to, it's an opportunity. I always see challenges as opportunities now, not as bad things that are happening to me or what have you. They're all blessings. And the thing is, is that I realized that I can, I can find meaning and purpose and joy and everything in my life without going through the struggle. I can do it in joy and bliss and happiness and love. All of that, it's the choice. We all have a choice. You can choose to be happy right now, you can choose to find the blessings in your life, you can choose to be grateful right now, you can choose all of these things, or you can choose to stay in the dirt. You can choose to stay in the unhappiness, in the anxiety, in the fear, in the worry, in all of those things. Not sure what you think it's doing for you. Because at the end of the day, we're all vibration, energy, and frequency and what, you know, it's this as above, so below, as within, so without, you know, the thing is, is that perception is projection, whatever you see out in the world that you do not like, or it makes you unhappy, it's here, and as soon as you find it in here, and heal it, and come to terms with it, and accept it for what it is, and understand that it's happening for you, not to you, That is when you transcend, and that's what we're here to do. Okay, I'm gonna pause you for a moment, because I know you have a really powerful tool that I would love to have you share with the audience, but to touch on a few things you said, I, I feel like, so I, I have also a lot of complicated past, as most of our listeners do, um, you know, without comparisons to each other, I think there, There are always the things in our past that we can learn from, and I think if we don't learn one way, then sometimes those experiences get louder and circle back around and we try again, and if we miss it, it circles back around and it gets louder and louder until we cannot ignore it, or until it takes a great effort to ignore it, but I feel like I used to see a Pinterest quotes or inspirational quotes that's life doesn't happen to you. It happens for you. And I remember the first couple of times I, I saw that it felt like, right, okay, well, maybe if you're just an ever loving optimist, how is this thing for me? Cause this sucks or this happened and I didn't have choice in it and now it's screwing up my world or whatever. Wow. And all of those, that inner healing that has been happening. When I got called to this journey that I am on the massive health climb out find self love Connection with source. I have looked back at every one of those challenges and truthfully, there is such Beauty in every one of them, but when you learn how to go into them in a safe way, so When I hear someone say life happens for you, and they have that tenor in their voice of someone that has done the work going into those experiences with a different mindset, I think it's amazing. So I know in going into some of the experiences that have been hard that we may want to resist that they are for us. There's been a few things that have helped. Um, there's the exercise I'm going to ask you about. But also, I know the neuroplasticity having to do with plant medicines has been a huge help for some people, um, so I would invite you if you could talk us through that a little bit. But also, I think leaning in in a safe environment or with people who have also gone through things that aren't interested in helping you be stuck, but also aren't interested in glossing over them. Um, Is so valuable. I come from a background of, I didn't really know I was allowed to be sad or angry about experiences because I thought that meant I was ungrateful. And that was the last thing I wanted to be. And it truthfully was a difficult experience and a beautiful experience for me to learn how to go in to those experiences, not just to have them be running in my background and me trying to shut them down. But to go into what it really felt like for me to be a Becca in some of those experiences and truthfully feel the grief and feel the fear with. With the direction point of learning what it was, was that was really going on and what it indeed was for and how it helped shape my life. And if it's in a way that I still want to support or if it's in a way that I would like to change now that I see it better. I feel like going in, but going in in a safe way with the intention of learning and understanding to improve my life was a big. That was a big perspective changer because I was afraid I would get stuck in it if I ever looked at it and truthfully before I had the support around me, I probably would have been stuck in it, stuck in victim mentality and stuck in grief or fear. So what makes it an environment where you can go into some of those things that are difficult? And use them as catalysts for change or growth, instead of getting stuck. Well, uh, a supportive container, it's set in setting. You know, whether you choose to use plant medicine to support that process, or you just work with someone that's been trained the way that I've been trained, in order to be able to take you. into an experience in your past that you see as a negative experience so that you find the clarity. A lot of times we will talk about it being your teaching or your lessons. I have a tendency to like to go to use the word clarity because it's more empowering in my opinion because lessons or teachings implies there was something wrong and there was never anything wrong. The thing is, is that it's just, it was just your perspective about what happened in your life that made it right or wrong, you know? The thing is, is that we're constantly creating our life every single day. Every single minute of the day, you are creating your life, and you are making choices energetically, vibrationally, frequent, uh, in your frequency as to what you're calling into your life. And the thing is, is that we, once you get there, that's the most empowered place when you realize that everything that's happened in your life, you created every single bit of it. You're completely and totally responsible for all of it. Now you are not in control of anyone else. You are not in control of how somebody talks to you or any of those things. You are in control of your response. That's it. So you can either respond. So you because. Can I, wait, let me, let me. Oh, sure. Let me just finish this one little thing because. Sure, sure, sure. This is important. So you can control whether you respond or whether you react. And that is where you have influence with other people is based on whether you respond, which is very intentional, mindful, and comes from a place where you stay in the center and not go to one extreme or the other in chaos or in pain or what have you. Or, when you react, usually, this is knee jerk, it's usually angry, it comes out sideways, usually regrets are there, all of those things. It's whether you not, you choose these things and when you choose response, you influence the other person to change. Like Wayne Dyer always says, if you don't like the way something looks in the world, change your perspective and then it will change. I'm sorry, there, I just wanted to make, finish that part. Oh, that's beautiful. For those who might be feeling angry or frustrated in their guts or their throats or whatever, like, wait, this thing that happened to me. So you're saying I created that, you know, if I was walking on the street and someone mugged me or my stepfather was drunk and did this, how on earth did I create that? Can you walk through that process of how you learn? What, what was your part? What was going on for you? So your vibration and frequency is what attracts everything to you. What, what is likened to itself is attracted to itself, right? So the thing is, is that we, this is my belief and I don't put this belief on anyone, but I, this is how I will explain it. We come in here into this life, choosing our life ahead of time for all of the lessons that are important to our soul's evolution. So we have soul contracts that we come into. The thing is, is that I was four and a half years old. My vibration and frequency to get raped was not, I didn't have a vibration and frequency of that. That was a soul contract meant to evolve my soul, right? And so there's a lot of people that don't like the idea of, of the law of attraction and that that's what you're, what you are calling in. The thing is, is it's not always all about the law of attraction. It's about what soul contracts did you agree to before you came into this life? For you to experience things to create another evolution of your soul for you to, to, um, transcend the challenges of that situation. So the thing is, of course, I did not choose, or I did not call in the vibration or frequency of being raped at four and a half years old, right? That's a soul contract. And it's interesting because it's one that finally came full circle in the last few years. It's because I started doing the work to, for my spiritual awakening for me to start really truly understanding Why are all the things that are in my life? Why are they there? And I have this really beautiful process So I never repressed the rape. I never, um, You know, it was never like in my psyche and me not remember. I've remembered it. It's very vivid. I can remember it very specifically. Remember his face, all of the things. It's the little details of it whenever I was doing this work. And I was actually, um, in a watch human journey and which is San Pedro for a lot of people. It's cactus, it's mescaline, and it's very embodied. It is not a psychedelic, it is psychoactive. And it's, um. In that process of talking through my rape with the, my facilitator, we came to realize what my true clarity, what my true lesson, my learning was from that. situation so that I could actually transcend it and see that situation for the blessing that it truly was to me. Would I ever choose it consciously? No, no, never would choose that or whatever. But I, what I realized is all of the blessings that came from it, the, the forgiveness of self, because I held on to this belief that I had done something wrong. I was told, if you tell anyone, You're going to be in trouble. So I didn't tell anyone until, I mean, I think I told Keith, like we had been married for a number of years before I, I told, even told him, I never told anyone my entire life because I had always believed I was wrong and I did something wrong and I was bad. And this is the programming that comes from some of these things. And as I unravel that over, especially the last few years is recognizing what was there for me. What was the learning there for me? And it was my self worth, it was all tied in my self worth. And so, These are the things that, as we move through our life, when you go back and I can take you into either in a plant medicine space or just in, um, some of the, the work that I do and the things that I'm trained in, some of the modalities that I'm trained in, I can take you back into a situation to Bye. That you may have believed is a negative thing or a bad thing that happened to you. And we can take you from this bad thing happened to me that to this thing happened for me. And this is what the beauty came out of the ashes of that situation. And, you know, like I said, we can do it in different ways. We can either do it in plant medicine space or You know, without and that doesn't matter. It's really about you going into the experience and changing the narrative and the story that actually changes everything moving forward. Because we believe that time is linear. We believe this 3D time is this linear thing when in reality, time is always in the now. Always perpetually in the now. The now is the only thing that exists. You know, yesterday does not exist. Tomorrow does not exist. That's a concept in our minds of past and future. It's why people have depression. Depression is, you know, worry or concern over, or regret over the past, and anxiety is fear of the future. The thing is, neither one of those exists. It's present right now, and that's it. That's all that exists is the present. And so, your, the present moment is constantly running throughout all time, always. So your future self is already living your most amazing life. Your past self is still living where it is. It is, doesn't change until you go back and change it, and you get whatever clarity, lessons, learnings from that, so that you change all of that, and you change your future. That is the work that I do and the point of power is now now That's the only time it changes either way It is the only time you have power is right now in this moment is what are you choosing in this moment? Are you choosing to be in depression and worry over the past? Are you choosing to be in anxiety and fear over the future or are you choosing to be in the present moment now in? complete joy and happiness and gratitude for what is, because until you are, nothing in your life will change. So what I've learned is that that choice, like what am I choosing? So I used to say that a lot, right? I was like a mindset. What do you call it? Warrior for positivity, but I don't think it had the same resonance because I was afraid. Of the other side. I was afraid of the negativity. I was like, Oh, let's only live over in this sphere. Right? We choose our thoughts. I'm going to choose to be grateful instead of understanding that I'm in a toxic relationship and I actually really do need to find my own boundaries and my own self love so that I will stand forward in a different way to change this relationship. Like the route that I chose before was Let's just focus on the positive. Well, look at the man behind the curtain. And what I learned though, was when I started to lean into real choice, I learned there were programs running in me that were making it. So I found it intolerable to look for the man behind the curtain, right? Or so that I didn't know how to self love or I didn't do all the other things. And I feel like the work that we do spiritually. That helps us understand those situations or those scenarios or how we, you know, asking ourselves how we really think about God's love, asking ourselves how, if we think our child needs to prove their love to us, or if we think we need to prove ourselves to God, like those, that spiritual work, I think adds up to be able to give you more choice. So you can be conscious. Of what you want to hold in your reality, what you want to have a space for and create while at the same time being aware that you have choice for many different things. Can I circle back to something that you said a few minutes ago? You were talking about how you were staying in this place of positivity because you didn't want to go into the negativity or into the, um, all of that. That's a spiritual bypass, right? If I don't, if I don't say that it exists, it doesn't exist. And that is true on some levels. However, the thing is, is that are you doing it out of fear or are you doing that play going into that in a place of love and unconditional love for what it really truly is? The thing is, is that at the end of the day, every single disease and disorder in the body can body can be traced back to a trauma that was not fully felt, realized or acknowledged or expressed. Right? So we can trace back every single trauma or every single disease and disorder back to a trauma and a trauma isn't like, you know, this massive thing you can shockingly a trauma can be somebody just saying really negative words to you when you were five or six and you hold on to them. You create a decision, a limiting belief that carries you through the rest of your life. And then when you go back and you can change that belief, it changes everything in your whole life, right? The thing is, is that. If you are attempting to stay in a state of positivity because you do not want to feel the negative emotions, we were, we are in physical bodies for a reason, for us to feel, and we are the only mammal on the planet that can have a thought and change our entire chemical makeup like that, and so the whole thing is, is that it's We It's, uh, the process of becoming and being able to choose willingly and lovingly happiness in this moment comes from expressing and feeling all of the emotions that you have about a certain situation, not burying your head in the sand and spiritually bypassing the situation and saying, you know what, I'm only gonna, you know, I'm gonna be Pollyanna about this and I'm just gonna stay in this positive state. The thing is, there's a great place for being positive in negative situations, or what we consider negative situations. However, if you don't go in and feel the full emotion, then you are actually damaging yourself further. It's really understanding that you have the emotions for a reason. It's for you to express them. And the thing is, we've been trained that emotions are are inconvenient. They're inappropriate, they make people uncomfortable, that all of these things, and the real true reality is that you are a human in a physical body for the sake of having emotions, feeling them, and the full range of them. So, I went through the process of grieving when Brittany died. I, I mean, like, I got in it. I didn't, I mean, there was no ifs, ands, or buts about it. It was one of the most miserable things that I've ever experienced in my entire life, right? And the thing is, is that I could have curled up in a ball and said, nope, not gonna do this, and not gonna, all of these things, I could have gone either direction, gotten where I just didn't ever come out of it and didn't ever see the beauty in all of it. Or just cut all of it off and was like, you know, not, not, I'm not going to go there because if I go there, then I'm just going to be in this just horrible, you know, uncomfortable, really painful place. The thing is, is that we have these things that happen in our lives for a reason, for us to run the gamut of all of our emotions and for us to feel them all, express them all. And you know, we even, we have an innate system in our body for us to be able to release trauma. Every mammal has it. So you can see a cheetah being run down on a Savannah by, I mean, uh, a gazelle being run down by a cheetah on the Savannah. And as soon as that gazelle knows it's safe, and it's, you know, been narrowly missed. dying, what have you. Once that gazelle knows that it's safe, it's going to throw itself on the ground and shake to release all the trauma. So why we see our, our dogs, when you touch your dogs, you're giving them vibration and frequency and energy that overwhelms their system. That's why they shake. As soon as you let them go, they'll shake their whole body to release all of that energy because they know it's an innate system. So as humans, we have this system and We have programmed ourselves out of using that system. We even do it to children. So the first thing that we do when a child falls down and hurts themselves, we put our hands on them. They're crying. We tell them to stop crying. We tell them that they're going to be okay. And we don't allow them to go through the process. of releasing trauma. And that's what we do when we try to stay in that state of positivity. We are denying ourselves the ability to process the trauma and release and express it. And so, you know, there was, there was a time and there's, the thing is, is a, it's a useful tool for sometimes when you know you're going to go way down and you don't want to get there and you want to stay in a place of positivity. However, it's important to go in and feel all the feels. and release all the feels and release all the emotion and, and be done with it and get your clarity and move on. And that's the, that is the thing that we do not do as humans because we've been programmed not to. You know, one of my first experiences that was a really meaningful experience in this regard happened at, um, the first plant medicine journey that I did, which you and your, your then husband facilitated. Um, and it was a, Remarkable experience to be with Keith in that space, because I was releasing something. I was revisiting a memory that was very traumatic and very difficult, hard even not to cry when I think about this space, but I was releasing and it was just he and I, it was in the middle of the night. That's when I often release my trauma. And I started sobbing and I went to like just wipe my eyes and apologize and my nose was gonna run, you know, and that's embarrassing. I'm sitting in front of a man and he stopped me and he looked at me and he's like, if you want to wipe them off of your face, if it's itching or something you can, but don't you dare wipe your eyes so that I won't see them. These tears are sacred. You let these tears. Blow. And I was like, what about my spot? And he's like, you let your snot blow. And it was beautiful to be in front of someone who was a, not judging B, not using it as a tool for manipulation. There was no sexual net gotta go happening. Just looking at me this though. It was a beautiful thing to respect my grief. I learned right then. So now I really don't wipe my tears away ever and apologize if they're itching my face or something's inappropriate. I literally rub them in like they're sacred. You said something a bit ago about how we handle things differently when we handle them with self love. And for me, that has been the thing that has helped me go into these things that can be challenging or hard to remember and not get stuck. I think of them now as though. I am holding a child who I love that is grieving about something, and that I know I want her to move through that grief rather than have it be stuck in her body, and I will just love her. I do that to those parts of myself, like with love, how can I, like, I will allow this grief or I will allow this fear. I hold myself differently, like, there it is. That's right. That was hard. I mean, you're right. That was hard. Where is it in your body? Do we need to shake? Do we need to move? Do you need to journal? Do you need to scream or cry? I love you. I love you. And I think when we learn how to handle our own difficulty with loving ourself and allowing that, it makes us more able to handle that space with other people. I don't think that Keith would have been able to sit in front of me and not try to coach me, not try to teach me. Make it better, not try to wipe my eyes unless he had done his own work in sitting in his difficulty. And I think that's how it, that's how it works. When we begin to love ourselves. I thought, okay, if I don't have to earn being good for, if I don't have to earn love by being good and checking off box ABCD, then that probably means I'll turn into laziness or I'll just. Do all these terrible things like I'll leave my family and get an addiction and cheat on everybody It was what people I literally people thought I was going to do like if you're only focusing on love doesn't that? literally people spoke to me in the way that's like does that mean you're just gonna Do all the bad things you've ever thought of doing like what's ever gonna keep you in check if being worthy of God's love It's not a concern literal conversation from a loved one close to me and It's been interesting to me that I've been answering that question every day since what I do when I feel self love is the opposite of waste. It is the opposite of laziness. It's also the opposite of over productivity. What it is is being present, listening to what, where I feel I need to be right then, what I feel I need to be doing right then. And it pulls me in such interesting places or to interesting conversations and actually more productivity, but with less. backlash on my body because I'm not hustling. Well, less than a brown puts it like hustling less, less effort. I show up in flow is what happens and in love and the doors that open in that place are entirely different than the doors that open in the hustle. Oh yeah, for sure. We're, and we're moving out of that. That's, you know, the, the years of hustle and grind and you've got to do all of this effort. That's not really what we were ever intended to do. It was not. We were meant to be in a state of flow, which a state of flow is you being completely connected to your source, your God, your, your creator. You are completely directly connected, and then that way you are operating in a place of divine inspiration always. And that's where I refuse to do stuff. Now, unless I'm in that state of flow, unless I'm divinely inspired to take action, I refuse to do anything. And I don't, and there was a time where I would have beat myself up for that. That, oh no, you need to be doing this. We constantly are shaming and guilting ourselves that we should be doing this or we should be doing that. And that's, you know, we're shitting all over ourselves all the time and it's, and all that it does is create Uh, the opposite of self love, but you are completely in a state of self love, then you will only act when you are in a state of flow and in your direct connection to God. That's it. And I will not. I don't beat myself up for it anymore. If I am feeling tired and I'm not feeling inspired to do things or what have you, I do not get myself upset about it. I don't, don't beat myself up. I don't guilt myself. I don't shame myself. I don't tell myself, oh, you're, you're being lazy. I don't do any of that anymore because I'm like, no, I will only act when I'm in flow, when I am in, you know, A state of grace when I am in divine inspiration. That is it. I will not do it any other way because the other way is the old way and it's all the old paradigms that we're destroying right now to bring in what we're, who we're meant to be, which is children of God operate in self love and unconditional love for others. That's what we're moving into. That's bringing heaven to earth so that hell actually recedes and goes away. And we can do it. We could do it overnight. If every person made the choice to love themselves completely and love others the way God loves us and not see the, the nonsense, the programming, the lies. I mean, we, this planet is abundant, completely abundant. There is zero reason for a single person on this planet to be hungry, to be homeless, to be in any of the situations that we see that we do not like. There's zero reason for any of it. The thing is, is that all this, the lies about how scarcity exists on this planet is a complete lie. Because this planet was created to completely rejuvenate itself just like our bodies were. It's also why our bodies completely rejuvenate themselves. You know, I can't remember what the cycle is. It's not that long. All your cells completely rejuvenate. rejuvenate themselves and you can heal yourself from any single thing. Doesn't matter what the doctors tell you. Don't ever accept a diagnosis as the truth. accept God's diagnosis that you have the ability to be healed through your source, through God. You do. And it's, it's whether or not you believe it. It's why people who pray or who have a connection with God do better when they go in for surgeries and treatments and all of that stuff, because they go in knowing and having hope and faith and trust in God. Well, trusting in God is trusting in yourself, in your, in your human body, that God created your body. For it to completely heal itself, and that's all you've got to do is completely trust that nothing is impossible. It is fascinating to think of nothing being impossible. I used to use, though, like a podcast about crazy shit Becca used to do. It's about, it's a podcast about the hard stuff Becca threw around in her mind all the time. But. Uh, I would sort of belittle or be frustrated with myself, like I maybe wasn't faithful enough if my health stuff wasn't healing. And what I learned is a combination of what we've talked about, which is, A, I really do believe there are some things in my life that are there for me, either that I signed up before I came here, or that are a result of choices that I have made. Put me in a place where harder stuff is more likely to happen, but that things are here for me to learn and some of that for me was not healing right away. Some of it for me was having a time where that health problem or that mental problem put me down for a while and I could see what it created and then I could see a different way. I feel like there's so many different Reasons that could that these difficult things in our life can be there and in the same hand can be That we do create our reality and our resonance and that miracles truly Are happening all around us all the time. A miracle can be like just that shift in what a cell can do, in what a belief system can do, in what a friendship can do, can create amazing miracles all around. Um, we have only 5 or 10 minutes left, and I would love for you, if you could, to share the exercise that you shared with me the last time that we personally spoke. So it reminds me a little bit of Byron Katie's work where she has you ask the four questions. But I love that in this exercise, you go a little deeper to find those parts that need to be loved. And as I have used this exercise in my own life, I am stunned at the results. It is a powerful shifting force because it's a powerful force for us going inward and then coming forward. Back out. Yes. Updated information, I guess. So can you explain to me what you coach here? Yes. So really it's all based on the premise of perception is projection. So anytime that you are struggling with some situation, um, it doesn't matter if it's a person, place, thing, situation, whatever it is. Is the first thing, the first, um, step in the exercise is, um, uh, now I can do this exercise without writing it down. Sometimes if I know that there's going to be a real profound realization, I'll write it down. But otherwise I've gotten to the place where I don't have to write it down. But I encourage everyone to write it down at the beginning when you're first practicing this is that the first one is to write out the entire situation, what you're, what the issue is, what you're upset is, what you're. Either your anger, your fear, your worry, your, you know, sadness, whatever it is, write it all out. You kind of coached me in how to write it out. So the thing I was frustrated with was finances. Well, this we can use me as an example. So we had just a lot of things happen all at once where our normal stream of income dropped and then a bunch of really expensive things needed to be fixed and it's in the holidays and this and that and this and that and all of a sudden we are like way under where we're. way under receiving what we are needing to spend in order to even, like, just have the basic things continue to function in our home and with our cars and Right. All of that. So, you know, um, you, so you write that all out, whatever the issue is, and then you turn everything around. If it's a person, whatever it is, you, I'll bring it all back to you. So I'm gonna do it this way because it's a lot easier. So in the first one I say. Um, I am upset with my mother because my mother is, um, not speaking to me, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, whatever the situation is. Okay? So in the second step, you turn it all around to yourself. I am upset because I am not speaking and communicating with me. And then the third step is, is this true? And the answer is always yes, always. It can never be anything else. And so then in step four, you go into the situation and you ask the question of yourself, where is it that I'm like not communicating with myself? Where is it that I'm not speaking to myself? Where is it that I'm not listening to myself? All of these things. And then you go in and then in that fourth step, you ask yourself what you need in order to heal this. And that, and you give it as much time, energy, resources, attention, um, because you can. And so you do that in that moment and when you do, you can see where the resources and the ability to be able to see your way out of the situation is. The thing is, is that a lot of times we're constantly looking for something outside of ourselves to take care of it. That's when you get to that place of self love where you know that everything that you ever need is always within you. It's never outside of you because God is within you. And so if you have God within you, you have everything, right? You, there's nothing you need and it's great to have desires that are outside of you. And that's part of what we're here for, is to realize what are our desires and to create the situation for the desires to come in. It's, When we are looking for that outside of us to complete us or to validate us or to love us or to find our love, but your love is all within you because you have God within you already. So if you have God within you, you have everything that you ever need, right? You have every resource. You're talking about the creator of everything is resides in you. So how could you ever need anything outside of you? And that Is where you're completely free. You don't need anyone or anything to complete you, to give you anything, to validate you, to love you, to anything. You don't need any of that. Now there can be desire, it's as long as you understand it's all within you. So you're the one that provides everything for you. You're the one that provides all of what you need for you. Because you have God within you already, and God always provides, so if, you know, do you ever see, you know, animals worry, sit and worry that they're not going to eat? They're provided for. Plants, animals, whatever, is always provided for. So if they're provided for, why wouldn't you be? The thing is, is it's the worry and the stress and the looking for something outside of you for, for completion that causes so much pain and grief and turmoil. It's knowing you have everything you need. I can tell you I was in a situation not that long ago that I, I was not enough money to pay the bills. sitting in a place of not enough money to pay the bills. And I could have chosen to get worried about it and start thinking, okay, what do I need to do? What do I need to do? What do I need to do? And what I did is I turned inward and I said, I love myself completely. God loves me completely unconditionally. God always provides for me. Is there going to be a benefit to me worrying? Is there going to be a benefit to me stressing? Is there going to be a benefit to me doing the whole, I gotta do, I gotta do, I gotta do, or is it going to be more beneficial for me to go inward and be, and just be with God, and tell God, I trust you, I know that you always provide for me, I know that everything that I need is already within me, and the thing is, is that as soon as I did that, everything started flowing, and I had more than enough. And I didn't, the thing, I've gotten to a place where I just, it's not spiritual bypassing. I just don't allow the, the spiral down. I don't allow myself to go into the worry because it doesn't do anything to support me. I go into my gratitude and if you go into gratitude and go, I know that you always take care of me. I know that you always provide for me. I know that everything that I need is already within me. I know that all of these things and it's the knowing, it's the trust. It's the faith that is where you move yourself out of all of these situations, but it's also going back and taking complete responsibility that you're the one that brought them all in and it's always for your benefit. It's always for your highest and greatest good, even if it doesn't feel like that right now. I've been through one of the most challenging, painful experiences of my entire life twice. So lost my daughter 14 and a half years ago. And then last year, massive shift in just everything. My whole life was ripped out from underneath me. And the thing is, is that, you know, there were times where I allowed it to take me under, I allowed myself to go into the places that were really dark and painful. And to the point that, you know, last year between Christmas and New Year's, I almost took my life. And the thing is, is that there is this. Once I moved past that, everything else is, everything else is meaningless. It's like, once I realized that my life is meant to be here, I have purpose, I have a reason for being here, and everything I've gone through in the last couple of years was meant to be here. For my divine purpose here, what I'm meant to do, which is what I'm doing now with talking to you and doing the work that I do, it's taking people from a place of digging in the dirt to finding the beauty in their ashes. And I have found the beauty in all of those ashes, but I, it came from me taking complete responsibility that I'm the one that called in everything that happened last year. I didn't make the choices other people made. I didn't Do the things the other people did. I didn't say the things that other people said. I didn't, I wasn't responsible for any of that. All I was responsible for was my response or my reaction. And my response and my reaction is what ended up coming through. There were times I reacted and then there were times I responded. And then I just got to a place where I only respond now. Nothing faces me, nothing. I don't, I do not get upset about words that other people say because they're not about me anyway. So, whenever anyone is speaking to you about you, just know whatever they have to say is none of your business and imagine that all you are doing is holding up a mirror for that other person because all they're doing is speaking to themselves. So everything that was being said to me about me was not about me, had nothing to do with me. It only had to do with the other people saying it. And once I got to that place of complete self love and knowing that none of that had anything to do with me. The only thing that matters is what I say to me. Everybody else's opinion of me is none of my business. And I do not make it my business. And that is where you can be in a complete state of peace and happiness and get to choose it all the time for real, not trying to mask some pain or what have you that you've got, that you're holding back. Because I went through all of it, felt all of it, and came out the other side. And that's, you know, one of the reasons I have my program, Beauty in the Ashes, because it's really, truly finding this, all of this happened for me. Not to me and I'm not a victim to anyone. Thank you so much for sharing that. It means something entirely different To know I mean, I know where the place you're coming from But thank you so much for sharing that because these aren't just pretty words and from that point you can reverse engineer back And say, is that something my soul would have called in is to have this devastation if it meant I was faced with the choice of really learning and embodying reaction versus responding, really tuning into my own self love, really like the thing, the project, the trajectory that that can put you on now is different was a painful yes. Would you have chosen it consciously? Probably not. Is it here? Yes. I am glad that we're going to do with it. I'm glad that you just said that because probably about. Maybe 10 months ago, I would have done anything in the world to change every single bit of it. And now, I would not change a single thing. There's no way. Because I am who I am now because of all of that. And doing the work to move through all of that. I wouldn't be who I am now if I hadn't gone through all of that. So all of it was necessary. Was it painful as all get out? Yes. Was it one of the hardest things I've ever been through in my whole life? Yes. Because even when Brittany died, I never thought of taking my life. But in this, I did. Because it brought up every painful thing that had happened in my life for me to deal with finally. You know, there were a lot of things that I thought that I had dealt with, that I had actually reconciled, that I was at peace with. You know, I've had some abandonment stuff with my father, that all came up. It was, it was this, it was every possible insecurity and pain in my life all tied up into one big huge thing to deal with and, you know, I've been doing this work for over a decade now and I am, I am now who I am because of all of that and I wouldn't change a single bit of it. Not a single bit of it. Thank you for that reminder too, that we continue to progress. And also if we think we have it down and some new thing knocks us off, still there for, for us and being able to move forward and find the beauty in ashes. Thank you so much for sharing yourself. Thank you for sharing your wisdom, hard fought and true. Yes. Definitely. I love you too. I will post in the show notes how people can get ahold of you. Um, and I'll post in the show notes how people can get ahold of you. And I look forward to being able to coach and help many people more. Thank you. Thank you, Michelle. Thank you. Bye. That's such a good conversation. I think the theme of that conversation would be in becoming who I really am. All of this was necessary. Sometimes I think it takes a different perspective to show us what we've learned and to help us choose how to move forward. It can seem like when there's trauma or there's really difficult stuff in our past or in our present, there's just so much suffering. And then we have some of these experiences like plant medicine teachers with, Good facilitators like mentors, coaches, and they can help us reframe and see the value in what we have gone through. And then I think there's less suffering that's actually required to help us gain the wisdom as we move forward in our day. I'm also so grateful for the mirror exercise that she shared. We were actually talking a couple of months before we did this podcast. And she shared that exercise with me for some things in my personal life. And she really is right. I find when I am really angry or frustrated with someone and I'm pretty sure it's their problem that they're doing that's complicating my life. When I do this exercise and look into it, there is always some part of me that needs love from me to me. And I've had some fantastic experiences in my own spiritual life as I connect with those parts and learn to give myself the love that I'm craving from other people. Super valuable exercise that I hope you'll try at least a time or two. I also really liked what she said about moving out of a state of hustle and grind and how we are intended to be in a state of flow. But I love the discussion about where that flow comes from. In Michelle's opinion, it comes from a state of being connected to your source and honoring your divine inspiration for what you need to do when that comes as a result of being connected. To your source, I really used to think so much of productivity as just a push and a series of lists. And like, there's like a badge for how much you can do and how fast, even if you don't want to do it. What I'm finding is true in my life now is that the more often that I approach my day with a state of flow. Almost interested curiosity about what I'm going to do when I have some goals I want to achieve and I listen to the flow for when I do what I find fascinating things happen. I will end up talking to the right people at the right time. The work is more engaging, the work is more fun, and I don't end up feeling worse after work. I end up feeling fed when I go about it with a hustle and a grind, I end up feeling hungry. So I loved her thoughts on that. And one last thing to highlight from this conversation would be the difference she talks about between spiritually bypassing our difficulty with a sort of only good vibes allowed kind of thing, versus going into a place of love for what truly is. She says every disease or disorder can be tracked to a trauma that was not fully acknowledged or expressed and that we can access a place where we see it. Feel it, really acknowledge it and come to love the lessons in that experience. Just come to love ourselves through it with our eyes wide open. And we can release those belief systems that we made as survival strategies and love ourselves into a health or into a life that we love more. It encompasses and includes the past, not just trying to shove it down or turn into an unwitting servant to it. So if you would like more about Michelle, head over to theprimalalchemy. com. And if you liked what you heard, please leave a review. It really does help me get more information out there. If there's any other subjects you would love to hear some insights on, you're welcome to send them over to me. You can DM me on Instagram at DrBeccaWhittaker or email me at drbeccawhittaker at gmail. com. That's D R B E C C A. W H I T T A K E R at gmail. com. Thank you. See you next time