Mindset to Market: Holistic Business Tools for Solopreneurs with Deborah C. Smith

#122 - How to Pitch Yourself to Media and Master Visibility as a Solopreneur with Jenn DeBarge Goonan

• Deborah C. Smith

Share episode

Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.

0:00 | 51:59

If you've been showing up on social media, building your offers, and making sales,  but you've never once pitched yourself to a publication, podcast, or local news outlet → this episode is your wake-up call.

My guest is Jenn DeBarge Goonan, founder of JAG Communications and a PR and marketing strategist with over 20 years of experience. Jenn has launched and elevated dozens of brands and nonprofits — from introducing Lululemon to the U.S. market, to leading social justice campaigns for Ben & Jerry's, to driving strategy for the Robotics Education and Competition Foundation and the Bosch Community Fund.

In this conversation, Jenn breaks down exactly what it takes to get organized, get clear, and get seen, even if you'rve never pitched before. 

In this episode, we cover:

  • What big brands like Lululemon and Ben & Jerry's understand about visibility that solopreneurs are missing
  • Why visibility is no longer optional — no matter what kind of business you run
  • The "North Star Message Guide": Jenn's signature 1–2 page messaging framework that anchors everything from newsletters to media pitches
  • How to write a pitch that actually gets a response (hint: it's only 6 sentences)
  • The biggest mistakes people make when trying to get press coverage
  • Why local media and trade publications are often the most powerful (and overlooked) visibility opportunities
  • How storytelling — not selling — is what gets your pitch picked up
  • The mindset shifts you need to stop overthinking and start pitching

Connect with Jenn DeBarge Goonan:

Jenn is currently launching The Greatest Good — a platform spotlighting nonprofits, change-makers, and purpose-driven organizations with hyper-specific calls to action. If you know someone making an impact in the world who could use visibility and support, reach out to Jenn directly.

She is also accepting applications for her Message & Visibility Accelerator — a 30-day, one-on-one intensive where she builds your North Star Message Guide and a custom communications plan so you're ready to be seen. She takes only 2 clients per month.

Resources mentioned:


Mindset to Market is a Luminous Creative Production. If you'd like to learn more about our business coaching program and group coaching container, please visit us online at DeborahcSmith.com.

Email Marketing: Start FREE with KIT
Join the Creator Network on KIT and create life-long fans and customers!

All-In-One 30-Day Free Kajabi Trial


20% Off Sakara Plant-Based Meal Program
Use code DEBSAKARA at checkout for 20% OFF your first order with Sakara Life.

Disclaimer: This post contains affiliate links. If you make a purchase, I may receive a commission at no extra cost to you.

Mindset to Market is produced by Deborah C. Smith and designed to inspire and support big-hearted creatives in finding their own unique path, building a sustainable business, and creating financial, spiritual, mental wellness and abundance.

🎉 Work with Deborah Learn More
💕 Visit Deborah online at DeborahCSmith.com
💕 Follow on the 'Gram. @deborah_smith_coaching

All right, friends, today's episode is a good one. If you are all over social media, you're talking about your offers, you're connecting with people, you're starting to make sales, but you've never pitched yourself to a publication or local news outlet or even for a podcast like this one, then today's conversation is for you because my guest is an expert with over 20 years of experience in PR and marketing. Her name is Jen DeBarge Goonan. She's a friend and somebody who I have been fortunate to work with. Uh, she's the founder of JAG Communications, and she works with social impact brands, mission-driven leaders to help turn their work into very clear messaging, credible media visibility, and to form partnerships that really, truly accelerate their growth by helping 10, 20, 100x the visibility on their business. So in this conversation, uh, we get into all the different steps involved to get organized and clear about pitching yourself to media opportunities and placements, and Jen shares generously from her wealth of knowledge Uh, around this industry and, and exactly how even somebody who is new in business can get a heightened visibility on their business. But I wanna take a quick minute to highlight something new that Jen is doing, which we didn't talk about in the interview. So the interview is chock-full of supportive information for you. But also, you should know that next month Jen is launching something called The Greatest Good. This is a platform via Substack and social media that's gonna spotlight heartfelt, real stories of organizations, nonprofits, and change-makers that are making an impact in the world, and she is going to help connect those stories of why they're doing it to crystal clear ways that people can support them and get involved with these organizations. So rather than saying something like, "Come follow me on Instagram," or, "Follow my YouTube channel," this is gonna be more like, "Okay, I'm looking for 100 volunteers this September who can help me pick up trash and clean this local waterway." So really hyper-specific calls to actions that actually make a difference, and these are gonna be feel-good features designed to inform, inspire, and encourage action. And so Jen has given me permission to say that if you know of a special change-maker or a purpose-driven brand that could use visibility and could use support, um, reach out to Jen. She is inter- interviewing people now to get spots on this platform, and there's a form that you can fill out. I'm gonna link to it in my show notes. And then she'll be conducting interviews to make sure it's a good fit, and there's no cost to participate. So if you know somebody who is doing amazing things in the world and making an impact, Jen wants to talk to them. All right, friends, with that said, I hope you're ready to listen to my amazing interview with Jen DeBarge Goonan. She's amazing. She's an expert, and she's just so fun to connect with. And so I loved this conversation. I'm grateful to you, Jen, and enjoy. Hey there. Welcome to the Mindset to Market podcast, your go-to space for practical tools and solutions to the everyday challenges of being a creative and soulful entrepreneur living in a material world. I'm your host, Deborah Smith, a holistic business coach and marketing strategist with 17 years of experience. I help my clients bust through mindset blocks and learn daily marketing practices that balance personal wellness with financial growth and impact. I'm here to offer you support with creativity, mindset, practical how-tos, and getting into imperfect, messy action so you can experience daily breakthroughs as you grow. If you're a purpose-driven entrepreneur building an online business, you're in the right place. Let's dive in. Okay, everyone, welcome back to the show. I'm so excited. If you're listening for the first time, we've got a great- conversation for you today because my guest today is Jen Gounan. And Jen has launched and elevated dozens of brands and nonprofits, from introducing Lululemon to the United States market, to leading social justice campaigns and iconic product launches for Ben & Jerry's, and driving strategy for organizations and not-for-profits like the Robotics Education and Competition Foundation. She works with the Bosch Community Fund, and so many others. So she's had a multi-storied career in public relations, and she's worked with some really high-level brands. And so today Jen and I are gonna be digging into a conversation about visibility, about what it looks like to do publicity for yourself as a solopreneur, and we're gonna get into some of the juicy nuggets about why people wait so long to pitch themselves, and what it looks like to get ready to be seen. So Jen, I am so, so excited to have you as a guest on the Mindset to Market Podcast. Welcome. Thank you. I am thrilled to be here. So Jen, you've worked with massive brands like Lululemon and Ben & Jerry's, and so just to get us started, what do you think those companies, like big brands like that, understand about visibility that personal brands and solopreneurs are missing? Mm. Good question. I mean, they're, they have a very deep appreciation and value visibility. They know that that's the engine to connect to their current customers and future customers. It really is the soul of the company. You start building your personality, which is a brand, right? And you, you're starting to have a two-way conversation, and visibility, this engine allows you to have more conversations and to convey your messaging to more people. And ultimately, if you're not visible, and if you have a business, it's not optional, right? Because this is the whole part of why you're in business, whether a talent, product, or service, you wanna bring it out to the world. You spend hundreds of hours in thinking about it and fine-tuning it, and you have to let go of the chains and step into being ready. I love it. Yeah, I think that that's something that I have thought about quite a lot, is like kind of what does visibility mean for someone who could run a business just on referrals, right? Like- Mm-hmm ... you know, I mean, if you, depends on what sort of scale you're trying to operate at. But I think that in this day and age, visibility is no longer optional. Right. Yeah. Even for those of us that kind of wish it was optional. I know. I know. And let me tell you, you know, those first couple steps up Cringe Mountain, the Cringe Visibility Mountain, you're like, "Oh, this, it feels so weird. I don't wanna put myself out there." But, I, I mean, you've told me this, and you have been a great coach. You just gotta, you just gotta do it, and it does get easier, I promise you. And, uh, your, your feedback and recommendations have all been spot on. Yeah. Oh, thanks for saying that. So I'm curious how you got into this line of work. Like, do you wanna- Take me back to the beginning, where- I would ... where did this all begin for you? So, okay. The, the real story is, um, is that in high school and college I was a cheerleader. Oh. I'm a glass half full type of person. I have high energy. I root for the underdog. I believe in the talents and the special qualities in people. And I am the ultimate hype girl. And so when I went to college, I didn't wanna go into math because math wasn't my thing, so I went into communications. And I realized there's such like a parallel thread between being a cheerleader and being a, you know, being someone who's in marketing and PR because you're ultimately positioning them or the service or product to be in the best light possible, and then you're, you know, pulling the levers to get that messaging or product or benefits across. And so I guess I'm like a consummate cheerleader, that just hasn't gr- I guess grown up. I love that. So I think it, that kind of reminds me of like knowing your personal design and kind of where your, your- Mm-hmm ... strengths lie and if, if it's... I love that you said you're a half glass full person. You know I am, too. Mm-hmm. Like I just said that to one of my clients this morning. I said, "Please don't get upset, but I'm always going to be looking for the positive highlight." Mm-hmm. Like a yes is our- Always ... moment that we're in. But I think it's such an admirable quality because, and especially as you're a PR communications advocate or, or coach or the person helping you, is like you're really seeing solutions and seeing the bigger picture, and then making connections, right? Communications is all about making sure that the messaging is on point, making sure that everybody's on the same page. Mm-hmm. And you can really tell when a company or an organization does not have a communication strategist, and they're just all- Mm-hmm ... over the place, and they're making- Yeah ... m- making a mess as they go. And even like with solopreneurs, you can see it in the scattered messaging on the internet, the showing up looking this way over here on LinkedIn and looking another way over there, and not having brand clarity. Yeah. And so- And confusion, like confusion just, you know, turns people away. And because how our minds are, and our brains are wired especially, we want things instantly. We want it fast. Like, so if you're not clear and kind of bold and whatever your messaging is, it's people are like, "Next." It's you're just forgotten. Yeah. Yeah, I agree with you. I mean, at this day and age, I think social media has really reared its head as like the- standard top of funnel for selling something. So no matter- Yeah ... what kind of a brand you are, no matter what kind of a product you sell, you've got to have a presence in the online space. Mm-hmm. Um, but I'm curious, what do you think is the... I mean, you know, what is the difference between being visible on social media, like on your own handles on, say, Instagram or LinkedIn, versus building the kind of credibility that happens when you get published in somebody else's publication? So the number one thing between doing it on your own and having, like just being on this podcast, right? It, this is a perfect example of that it shows that there's a third party, you, that believes in your guest, which happens to be me, or someone else's down the line or tomorrow, has valuable information to share that's gonna help your audience, right? And quite honestly, this is a partnership. It might be temporary just for this next hour, but think of it yourself in... This is a small step. Getting on a podcast and having a conversation is an hour of your time, right? And it's a small step. And what, when you're on a podcast, you get to share it on, on your social channels, so that amplifies it. Yep. And it's a signal to other people that you have authority, and someone else sees that authority in you. Oh, that's such a good point. I, I remember when I first started pitching to talk on people's podcasts, I was like, "I have so much experience to share." Mm-hmm. Long before I started this podcast, and I was terrified. Yeah. I don't know. I guess it's just, okay, we have to talk about the fear that goes along with visibility. But for someone who's listening who hears the words or the letters PR- Yeah ... and they think it's out of reach- Right ... can we... How would you define PR in a way that makes it feel slightly more accessible? Yeah. And for those people, 'cause it is an acronym, PR stands for public relations, and really public relations is all about elevating and increasing the visibility for whatever that looks like. It's... And there's so many different levels, excuse me. I mean, it could be media. It could be podcasts. It could be just your local media. It could be newsletters. It could be in-person events. It really kinda takes a shape of whatever you feel more comfortable doing. It's just putting yourself out there and, and shining a light on your good work. Amazing. That's a really great way to frame it because it doesn't have to be... PR does not necessarily mean I've pitched to The New York Times. Mm-hmm. Right? That would be, like, you know, that's extreme. It doesn't necessarily mean trying to get on local television. Mm-hmm. It could mean you have a strategy where you wanna be on 10 podcasts every month- Mm-hmm ... because those people all have viable audiences that are gonna hear your message and hear about your book or about your business offer. Exactly. Yeah, think about it. So if you're a solo entrepreneur and you make jam, right? Going to your local farmers market on a Saturday morning, selling your jam, that's a PR moment. It's a moment where you get to have interaction with more people than you did if you didn't go there. Mm, I love that you used the farmers market. That's my number one go-to example for people who are like, "I don't wanna do, you know, the internet." I'm like, "Great, let's go to the farmers market and- Yeah ... tack a flyer on the poster on the, on the pole. Yeah. Let's stand out there and hand out samples." Like, we don't have to be... I mean, yes, we're all online now, and we wanna get comfortable with that, but really, it's about being seen. Mm-hmm. It's, that's it. Like, straightforward. That's that. So when we were getting ready for this interview, I was saying to you, a lot of my listeners are running businesses. They have gotten clear on how they wanna serve. They've gotten clear on who they serve and what they do. But the idea of putting together a media kit and/or pitching, you know, to, say, magazines or articles- Mm-hmm to newspapers or even to, to podcasts feels out of reach. Right. And when I talk to my clients about this, they will say some variation of the response- Mm-hmm ... "I'm not ready." Mm-hmm. Yeah. Why are we not ready? Why do we think we're not ready? Yeah. There's, there... It's a mindset, to be sh- I, I, I mean, full, full stop, it's a mindset, and it's the value you think that you're gonna bring. And if you don't think that you're gonna bring value, then you might be more shy and less proactive to, to be out there. And sometimes it is a messaging, right? Sometimes you're just like, "I don't... I'm this to this group of people, and I'm this to that." And what we've actually talked about so much, so much is that I create, and I've done this for k- dozens and dozens of brands, nonprofits, CEOs, and celebrities. I always do a one-to-two page, and I call it the North Star Message Guide. And it's like, who you are, what do you do, what's your purpose? Like, how c- would you explain yourself in 20 words or less? What value or problems you're gonna be solving for someone else. And I always put the spotlight on the problem-solving and how it's gonna be transformative to X person or X, you know, population or what have you. And once you start saying it over and over, and it evolves, this message guide is always... I call it a living document. But once you have the crux of who you are and what you serve, like the who, what, when, where, then you're more confident because you feel like you're more centered in your, the messaging and the ethos of your organization or your brand. Getting the message clear- Mm-hmm ... is how you get ready. Yeah. I mean, a lot of times because, it's funny 'cause, like, solopreneurs, you're wearing so many hats. I get it, you know. I'm a solo business owner m- myself. So you know, the days are not long enough. You need more hours in the day. But this guide, for huge corporations to one-person operations, it is your North Star, and I say that because it offers all the different talking points for your ecosystem. So if you wanna do a newsletter, you wanna make sure your key messages in, are in there. If you're on a podcast, you're like, "When all else fails, I need to communicate this about my bus- my business." And then you start feeling more relaxed because you feel more confident on what you bring and how you benefit a certain population of your audience or customers. So this sounds like how people have a brand guideline where you have, you know, your fonts, your colors, your blah, blah, blah. This is a messaging guideline that is- Mm-hmm ... covers kind of all the facets of you as a business owner, the product- Mm ... that you sell, the service that you offer, and ideal client- Mm problem solved, all of that. So it's basically a one- to two-page guide that is your messaging guideline. Yeah. You call it out the North Star. I love that so much. Yep, because it's... You'll use it over and over and over again. So if you're writing a note to a customer, right? When you're doing a newsletter next week, you'll go back and you'll say, "Okay, these are the three things I wanna convey in this. I might have extra news or announcement, or I'm gonna be at a community event." But you wanna weave in the same messages so that when your customers see you week after week or month after month, there's a personality vibe, there's a messaging vibe that it doesn't feel like you're talking about soup one day and then you're talking about jam the next, right? Yeah, mm-hmm. Yeah, I mean, it's so interesting because so many people that I've worked with do have a multifaceted sort of landscape of what they could do. Yeah. And there is a ever-present debate about niching down in the sort of nor- online business marketing. Mm-hmm. It's like, do you niche down, or do you not need to? And, and- Mm-hmm ... the answer is always it depends on what you sell. Exactly. Right? It depends on how the solution that you deliver is being delivered. Sometimes your marketing does not need to call out, you know, a specific lane, like eldest daughter who's got anxiety, right? It doesn't have to be- Mm-hmm ... that niche, the person that you serve. Right. It could be the pro- depending on the product that you have, right? Yep. So would you do a North Star guide type of a document with someone like a Ben & Jerry's? Yes, absolutely. For each of the flavors that we launch, yes. For, for doing a social justice campaign, yes, always. And, but there was always a guide for just Ben & Jerry's, the brand. Like, who are we? Who do we serve? What, why we are in business, what our values are, or they are. Um, but if they are launching a, a, a new flavor, there's all... Like, why are they doing that? Who are they partnering with? What's the, the flavor profile? What ingredients are being used? So like, again, that North Star is used for operations. It's used for marketing. It used for the ad person. It's used for- You know, whoever's speaking about this new product launch, to the partners, whatever. Okay, so this is so good. So, so basically any time there is a new product- Mm-hmm ... and this could be, for a solopreneur, this could be- Yes. Oh, yeah ... a new shape of the container in which you're gonna serve, right? It's not just... So we're talking about Ben & Jerry's pints of ice cream, which I love this, like, and, uh, first of all, I love Ben & Jerry's. Um, yum. Yeah. But also- Agree ... I think it's, uh, really interesting to think about a product, right, and talk about how you would build a messaging guideline for an actual pint of ice cream. Mm-hmm. And how it's no different than, let's say for my coaching package, well, I've got a group coaching program, but I also do this one-on-one thing, and I recently shaped a new offer based on people requesting it from me. Mm-hmm. You know, I was getting a request from, from clients, "Could you do this? Could we do this?" And I was like, "I mean, you're the third person who's mentioned that. You know what? Let me- Mm-hmm ... that's a need in the market. Let me go look at this." So, but I did not create an entire messaging guideline just for that offer, but I should. Yep. Uh, and it could be just, just something where it's, you use it all the time. You're like, "Okay, what, how I'm gonna convey this?" Or what have you. Yeah, it's really important. Another tip I would give is someone, if there's, if there's a solo entrepreneur out there or a small business owner that is just like, "I don't know where to start", start with your customers. Send them a note and saying, "I'm gathering feedback. What do you think about my product? What could be better?" Most businesses have your advocates, right? There's, like, your cheerleaders out there, and they can give you some messaging just based on because they love it so much, and it gives you kind of a little bit of separation, right? Because you're so close to it. And that could be weaved into not only the messaging, but also a testimonial. This is what our customers say about us. And that should be conveyed, too, because that's third party, and that's a signal that other people like your product or service. And trust you. Yeah. You know I love that so much. I'm always, always, always trying to guide my clients to immediately start having conversations with real human beings- Yes who will give them real, honest feedback on whether or not their idea is even viable. Right. You know, before going to market, go out and talk to some people and say, "Would you see this on the marketplace? And think of it as a solution to your problem." Right. If not, we've got to go back to the drawing board. Right. And then you, you save so much time and energy and money, right? What would you say for somebody who's like, "Okay, I wanna put together this North Star guide- Mm-hmm ... for my business." What is the very first step? Yeah. I would do any admin, any housekeeping. Like, if you're doing any kind of tinkering with the product or service, like if you are making, you know, baseball hats or that are customized, make sure you have this everything down, like, you have your operations, your manufacturer, like, everything kind of really dialed in so that when you are ready to go out to the world and showcase your wares, your product is the best quality it can be. So you always wanna put your best foot forward because then people are gonna start reacting. They may purchase it, right? 'Cause visibility will- Ignite revenue. It will people, or they're gonna go to your website, or they're gonna check you out on social media. You will get more attention, so you wanna make sure that the attention that you're getting is at the best quality of your product or service. That's such good advice. Yeah. So, and I always say don't rush it. Like, if you need another three months to have more conversations or get better materials or better quality zippers or whatever that looks like, right? Or if you're opening a yoga studio and it's, you know, you're in construction. You don't wanna communicate or share your new yoga studio if you're, like, 50% done and in construction. Right. There's no mats yet. No mats. Like, you know, just get... Like, think through the customer experience, and then here's another thing. Ask your spouse, ask your partner, ask your best friend, ask a cousin, like, "What do you think of this? Like, how would you explain my business to me? What do you see as a gap? What am I not communicating?" Because if someone who loves it, who loves you will say, "Oh, yeah, I think you're missing this," or, "I don't understand what you mean by that word. That doesn't make sense to me." So leverage your network to help make sure that you're, you're in the best standing. That is such good advice, too. Yeah, I literally was just talking about this with one of my clients this morning. I said, "Listen, before you do anything else, let's get real human eyeballs on this and see, like, are we speaking the same language as- Right ... the people who might actually become clients." Mm-hmm. It's so important. It's just, it's really kind of just... honestly, just kinda think through how other people will see th- your business through their eyes really, and kind of look at holistically. And if you need that extra week, day, three months, six months, like, take it, and then your systems will be in place, and everything will go way more smoothly. And ultimately, you wanna make money, right? Yeah. And you wanna give the best to whatever your customers are looking for. Okay, so taking time to create some type of overall brand messaging guide is kind of a foundational thing here. What about storytelling? I know I've heard you talk a lot about turning meaningful work into stories, and so what makes a story actually compelling enough for media or partnerships? Or what, what gets our stories to kind of pop up above, above the noise? Yeah. I think storytelling is so important and more important than ever because you can kinda throw stuff at ChatGPT that comes out vanilla. You know, if you just started a business or you've been in business for five years or one day or what have you, why did you get in business? What was your purpose? Did, did a milestone happen? Did an event in your life that changed the way you're thinking? People wanna know the journey, right? And it's okay if it's messy or for it zigzagged. I mean, that's, that's the human experience. And also too, what impact? Like, if your product is helping people walk straighter because they have a disability or a challenge or what have you, how are you positively impacting society and humanity? And tell that story. And then ask the people that are using your product that, like it can be about you and your journey, but also the people that your customers too are just as important. And if you get a note and says, "I love your product because it helped me do this, and I couldn't do this before," whatever that looks like, ask them if you can share that publicly, and that you don't have to... You could just give the first name and no last name or no picture. But then again, that is another authority third party signal that shows that your product is really great. And that's why you- if you go to a website and people are doing, "I got five stars," or people said about this or that about my brand, product or service, I look at it even beyond taking off my PR marketing hat. That's why if you go to Amazon, you see the reviews and it says, "Do not buy this. It's highly returned." Do you move on or do you buy it? Yeah. That's so, so important. You're right. So yeah, I mean, the end of the, at the end of the day, we're doing all of these visibility pieces inside of our business and trying to get seen because more eyeballs equals more dollar bills coming in, assuming you can have the capacity to serve, you know- Right more people or sell more of your product. Right. And building a solid foundation is always the first step. And then- Mm ... taking, taking time to really pull together some of those stories and, and organize kinda what, what are people saying about me? What is the reason I'm doing this? I love all of that. Mm-hmm. And that could be like if it's a local story, and I'll, I'll give you example. We'll talk about the jam, if you make jam. And if you like can jam for, um, people that are going through a difficult time, and you create like a community around making jam and canning it and bring it to people that, you know, kind of perks up their day, that could be a local, a local story too, right? A jam that up- uplifts X town, right? To new heights, you know. Or how community members got together and made jam to, you know, bring sunshine to people who need it. Yeah. And that's what people are craving. Like, the world we live in right now is heavy. There's a lot of news that is, you know, challenging to wake up to every day, and people are looking for something that feels good, it's positive, it showcases the best in humanity. And so if you have a story like that, then share it with the world. It doesn't have to be on your evening news. It could just be on your social media channels. Tell the story. Be a storyteller, and it doesn't have to be perfect. It doesn't have to have a perfect picture. It doesn't have... You know, don't spend money on a photographer. Use your iPhone. People are craving authenticity really. Okay, so I can see how to do that within my little curated bubbles on social media. Mm-hmm. I can see how that would be turned into a reel or a carousel or a LinkedIn post in a world that I have, you know, constructed with my own ideas and thoughts. But how do we take the leap off of social media and make a connection with, say, I don't know, a publication, like a magazine or a newspaper? Mm-hmm. I, I think a lot of people don't even try- Yeah ... because they feel like they're missing something. Nope. Like a pitch deck- Nope ... or a media, you know. Like, they need proof that they've already been seen, so to get seen or something. Right. Am I right about this, or am I wrong? No, I, I, I think that, honestly, I am ... I'm, I'm working with a reporter right now for an event that's happening in Indiana. My note to the reporter was six sentences. That's it. Um, so you just get right to the heart. You can say, "Hey, Debra, I have a st-," I'm making pretend that you're, like, the local media. "I have, um, this heartwarming story that I thought that maybe your readers would like, and it involves X, Y, and Z. Would you be interested in speaking with these people or me, and I can help you get images or what have you. I look forward to your thoughts." That's all it is. It's just, you're just kinda teasing them with a story, um, and you'd be surprised that they're, the, especially local media, are looking for feel-good stories. They're looking for stories. Local stories they want in their backyard, point blank. The local media doesn't usually write a story that's 30 miles away or 13 miles. It's usually kind of, like, in a five, depending on where you live. Kind of, like, in your own, um, town lines or if it's... And people get excited. Like, once they're in the news, they're like, "Wow, this is great," and it was, like, a really great experience. And then people start talking. There becomes a buzz, and you, you drive more traffic to your website or to your channels or to your newsletter, whatever that looks like. Yeah. We make it harder than it has to be. We do. Yeah. It's your mindset. Like, you have to believe that your story's worth anything. And you know what? What I say is, like, if you, if you got into business, then your story is worthy 'cause you spent so much heart and soul and time and hours and resources to get there. You just have to be brave enough to just take the first steps. I love that. So what are the biggest mistakes that you see people making when they're trying to get visibility or get press? Is there, are there common mistakes that are made? I would say being too long or winded. Like, you know, the media probably gets, depending on where they are, like, the Wall Street Journal probably gets a few hundred pitches a day. Your local media is probably a dozen. But I just keep it right to the point, right from the heart. Like this woman who has a sound bath, the way I look at it as like a publicist, if sh- if she does media attention and she gets five more people to her sound bath event, that those five people may have really needed in that time of their lives. They needed that reset. They needed that connection with themselves. They are going through a hard time. So you're almost doing a disservice of not publicizing, you know, your event or service. Yeah, I know. I talk about this a lot when it comes to actually social media. People are afraid to post, and I say, "Well, your client who needs you cannot find you if you're not visible." No. Yeah, it's not a option. Really, if you're in business, b- being invisible is not op- is not optional. It's not good for you. You s- you know, at the end of the day, you need to show your talents and, and, and your value, but also, too, life is expensive, right? And you need to find a way to generate income. So publicity on a larger scale also can really impact sales. Can we talk a little bit about that? I mean, we've already mentioned that obviously you're in business to make money, and I'm curious why it's different between just posting something on social media versus we saw something in the newspaper that really- It's that third-party credibility. If someone is talking about your business or about your product or service, and you... It's just like almost like influencer marketing, right? I've worked with dozens of different celebrities over the years, and that's why a lot of brands pay influencers. You know, it could be someone who has 2,000 followers or versus 2 million. It's all about where your audience is getting their information, and that's something you need to know as a business owner. Like, where are your audience? Like, who are your people, right? Who's gonna buy them? Where are they beyond... Like, how do they live? Maybe it is... Is it a farmers market? Maybe they don't like farmers market. Maybe they're s- they're sports oriented. So you have to understand a profile, and as you get a little bit more sophisticated in your business, it's really important to stay close to your customers. Don't keep them at arm's length. If people love your brand, they're gonna love you, and they, they'll be open to sharing feedback, and that helps guide your plans for, for the next quarter, the next month or whatever because that way you save time, and you wanna fuel your, your company as, as fast as you can, you know, along whatever feels comfortable. But you're doing a disservice if you're not asking the questions because ultimately your customers... You should view your customers as your community, right? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Like, clients that I've partnered with in the past, I still keep in touch with. I believe, you know, like, I'm always there for them if they have a question, and I'm rooting them on. So it's... And I think you're a good person to speak to this as well. Like, building a community, it does... It could be 10 people or 1,000 people or 10,000 people, but just keep fueling it. Foster it, you know, show the love. Yeah, I keep in touch with everyone I've ever worked with. Oh. I mean, I've, I can't think of anyone that I've had a bad experience where I was like, "Whoops, we're not talking anymore." Great. But no, I love to follow my, the work of my clients and see as they grow and develop the products, and it's just really exciting. Okay, so but let's say we have the North Star guide, and we're really clear about the message, we're clear about our offer, we're clear about all the stuff that would go in that sort of foundational guide. Mm-hmm. And maybe also feeling pretty confident, like, okay, I feel like I could handle the capacity of, of being seen on a, on like- Mm-hmm ... let's say the local news or something. Do I, do I need to hire someone like you to help me make it happen? Mm-hmm. Or could I just write up my own pitch and send it on in? Well, how would we actually do that? I know you do this professionally, so- Mm-hmm ... what would you say to somebody who's thinking, "I'm ready for this"? Yeah. I would say, uh, make sure your messaging is, your product and your service is up to par. It feels, you feel super comfortable with that. And then I would go ahead, pitch your product or service, or event, if you're having an event, or if you're doing a partnership with someone. Anything that's kinda special, anything that you can use as a case study, and it feels good, and it's community-related, just give 'em a heads-up. Like, and the thing is, is that if that editor doesn't get back to you or isn't interested because there's not a room in the next paper or what have you, don't let that deter you. I have heard, when I tell you, probably thousands of nos, right? Yeah. I've generated thousands of media placements for my clients over the years, thousands from every publication you can think of, and I have heard so many nos. The way I, way I'm wired, if someone says no to me, I'm like, "Okay, that's fine," but I'll find a different way. Maybe I look at myself, I'm like, "Well, maybe my messaging is not strong enough, or I just need to wait because it's not timely." I'll give you a for example. Mother's Day is coming up, right? Yes. And newspapers are looking for stories around Mother's Day, right? It could be gift giving, it could be services about making mothers feeling really special on their, on their honored day. So think about what possibly you could offer. They might be... You never know. The local media might be looking at highlighting a list of local businesses that are doing something special for Mother's Day, right? If you're a restaurant, maybe you're doing a special brunch. If you're a florist, maybe you're doing a special bouquet, right? It, it goes on and on and on. So but think of times around the year that would make sense for your business to do something special around a holiday or a milestone, what have you. There's a day for everything. So- Yeah ... now you're getting more people into your business, right? And you want people to talk about it. Give them a quality, great experience, and then your, your business will, will grow naturally because people will be excited about their experience and will tell others about it. Yes. Love it so much. So mindset is a big part of visibility. It is. I think- Yeah ... about this a lot. I, I think that mindset, I'm guessing that it's the key ingredient to unlocking all of this. So can you just talk about that? What, what mindset shifts do people need to make to confidently put themselves out there and just pitch their work without questioning it, and get to that place where a no just means there's a yes someplace else? Yep. Um, one is belief, right? And you don't need to have, um... I would rethink the mindset as like, "Oh, I need more experience. Oh, I n- I need another product. I need a bigger following. It... This needs to be perfect," right? If it's great, it doesn't have to be the best right now, right? If it's... And I, I say that because I know quality's im- important, but go ahead. If you have confidence in your talent, then you should have the confidence to convey that to others. So it's really just looking at yourself and saying- Right ... "I am worthy of being seen as the person who's done this thing." Yeah. And don't be afraid to ask for help, right? Ask a friend, "What do you think? Is this... Am I silly thinking this?" And maybe you just need to have a conversation. Sometimes the conversations in our heads just overpower everything. We overthink it. Hire a coach, talk to a friend, talk to someone that maybe has experience in this, whatever industry you're in. Because if you overprepare yourself, you're gonna hurt yourself from daily momentum. Yeah. So interesting. And so basically we're just kind of saying to ourselves, "We are worthy of landing a, a placement in whatever media outlet." Mm-hmm. Why not us? Why not me? Right. Why not my event and/or my service? And what would you say are the key most important features of the outreach? You said lead with heart. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Is there a hook that we need to have in there? Like in social media, it's all about the hook. Yes, of course. I would tell you a story. Like why? What's the purpose? Like why... If you say some event triggered this b- business versus, "Oh, here's... I made this pen. I think you should look at it." Like why did you create the pen? "I created this pen because my child had issues with mobility, and I created a pen that now he and other people with his challenges can now write clearly, and it builds confidence, and it helps him with school." Give more context around that, of the why and the purpose, than just being, I guess, robotic in a sense. Yeah. Just be like, add your flavor and personality and the reason why. We're really kind of showcases your value. And also, too, like this pen, like if it's now helped 100 people in Massachusetts write clear and build confidence in the classroom and get better grades, then it... now you say, "Oh my gosh, 100 students have used that," or, "This school district is now using this. Who would've thought that?" You know, just changing this simple widget that everyone uses but may- maybe has something special or a gripper or what have you. Like give that kind of context versus, "I make a pen." Yeah. And that kind of gives you also an indication of who you're reaching out to, doesn't it? Uh-huh. Because I've heard you talk a little bit about trade papers- Yes ... and sort of these more unassuming placements that can have huge distribution volume, right? So if you're in a certain trade, instead of necessarily thinking like, "I gotta pitch to the Boston Globe"- Mm-hmm you might think, "Let me find the trade paper for florists." Yes. And what are they... You know, what... Can I get listed in an, a magazine or a newspaper where only the people that I might be selling to anyways- Right ... you know, are being featured. Exactly. So that's flowers. I love flowers, so that's perfect. I know. So I would. I would Google it, go to ChatG- whatever it looks like, and find flora magazines or flower, flower news outlets. And start looking around. See what do they cover. Do, did they already cover your product or service already? All right. So I'm gonna, I'm gonna put in my calendar, in eight weeks I'm gonna go and talk to the reporter Jane Smith about my, my product. Because they don't typically do the same thing back to back. They give it some more space, so that's a tip for everyone out there. And they need to fill their websites, their papers, their magazines, their podcasts. So shoot your shot. Do it. And also, when you get in the... When you start practicing, you'll like, "Oh, maybe I should be saying this." You'll get feedback, right? And as you do it more, you get better, just like in everything else, right? So I just highly recommend just trying and taking the first steps. So if you're listening, anyone listening to this who's like, "I've been at this for a little while. I've, I've vetted and validated my offer. I'm making money. I'm helping clients get results. My product is selling. But I have not tried PR. I've not really pitched myself to media to get more volume of eyeballs on my work." Mm-hmm. What Jen is literally telling us is y- you're ready. You are ready. And also too, I'll g- take it one step further. If you have built this pen, right, then you have knowledge that other people may be, in different industries, we may take, right? You're like, "Oh, I didn't realize. I didn't think about that." Pitch yourself to thought leadership podcasts or product, um, podcasts. Pitch yourself as a expert, and then you can weave in your product or service too. So there's two paths here. As you get more comfortable on this visibility path, you'll understand there's more opportunities. And also, here's another tip. If there's people in your industry that are doing the same thing, like you fan girl of someone or someone who's like a mentor, and see what their path is, right? See where they've been featured because that gives you breadcrumbs, and it gives you a roadmap to follow. Yeah. That's such good advice. I love it. So- We gotta talk about your business. I'm excited for your business. Jen and I started working together last year a little bit, and she is in business supporting clients, supporting people who are in need of boutique agency support with their PR and marketing. So I would love to hear a little bit about how it's going, and also how people could find you, and the kind of offers that you're currently working on. Yes. So my company's name is called JAG Communications. So you can find me at jagcommunications.com. And my business is really focused on the intersection of business and social impact. So I love working with business owners, brands, thought leaders who are doing something great in their space. So if you're working to help alleviate kidney disease, or if you're focusing on women empowerment through economic development, whatever that looks like, I gravitate and help people who are doing something good for humanity, full stop. Mm-hmm. And that looks so many different ways. And there's three ways you can work with me. One is that I do full service, like retainers, and that includes everything. So from messaging, visibility, content creation, social media, thought leadership, public relations, media outreach, the whole spectrum. That's the full package. The second way is, second way is just an advisory. So it is a monthly retainer, but it's more, as it says, advisory. So it's a monthly call. It's almost like having me in your back pocket. So if you need me to review materials, if you're doing media outreach, you need a little bit of light support. If you're like, "Can you just look at this press release? Am I missing something?" That's a perfect opportunity. Mm-hmm. The third way, which I'm most excited about, is called the Message and Visibility Accelerator. So I'm gonna be taking two clients per month, and they get one-on-one customized attention to really get clear messaging. Understand it starts with a one-hour to two-hour call where they... You just do a brain dump of, like, all the challenges, who you are. And so I listen, I create a message guide for you, and then I also create a communications plan based, customized on your business and what you've done or not done in 30 days. And so after the 30 days, you are ready for the races to be seen. You have your North Star guide. You'll have your North Star guide. And you have a, a plan. A plan. So maybe it's media. Maybe it's just we're focused on your newsletter. Maybe it's in your ... Maybe it's just employee communications, like you just haven't done the strongest job, or your team is just so lean that you just need extra help on a certain part of your marketing ecosystem or communications. I have worn so many different hats and am comfortable in basically any kind of situation, so that is a really customized per client, and so I'm taking only two clients per month for that. So a solopreneur who is running a personal brand and maybe is working just as an individual and has client programs and/or one-on-one programs could work with you to develop this whole media kit. Exactly. Yep. That is- It's, it'll be specialized just on, on their brand, and it could be A 30-day plan, it could be a year plan. It's whatever they need to propel their business forward That sounds like a really incredible opportunity. Yeah. And it takes a week, 'cause people, you know, people kinda hem and haw. Like, I- we get it done in 30 days, and then they're, then they're off. And then if they do need help afterwards, we can talk about execution or what have you. But it really gives you a container, a package that there's... It's a no-excuse package. You'll have everything that you need to be successful or take your business to the next level. I love it, 'cause I think strategy in your messaging is really the most important thing right now, isn't it? Because AI really has just leveled the playing field. It's so apparent now more than ever. I think it's actually... Tell me what you think. I have been feeling like when I read an AI-written message, even, like, sometimes people use them as responses on, like, LinkedIn or in Threads- Yeah it l- loses, it diminishes trust for me. And the reason is because I know everyone doesn't have time to sit and write out every single word they thought. Mm-hmm. I love AI for an executive function tool to make- Totally ... light work of, like, some of this bigger data crunching and all that stuff, and I use it to develop, you know, documents and templates and, and SOPs. And I love it for all of that, but I don't love it for writing messaging. Mm-hmm. I actually think it gets it wrong because it's just copying. It's copying all the stuff that they're pulling from the internet. And I will say, and this could be another, like, podcast conversation, is that you wanna make sure your, make sure your website is AI-proof. So you make- What does that mean? That way it's... So your website is viewed by ChatGPT, Claude, Gemini as your home base. So if your messaging's all over the place, it's not good. So they pull information from your website, from PR, media attention, and partnerships, like where you're being seen e- anywhere else. And the more robust those are, the more they, it's more clear and that you'll be seen in these searches. There's, like, four billion searches happening every day, and if they're looking for a local business in this town, and if you're not, if your marketing ecosystem is not strong, you may get passed over. And that's, that's, that's, you don't wanna- And so you're saying your website needs to- Be written in such a way that it reflects just clarity of messaging- Clarity ... so that it can get s- seen in a search. Yep, exactly. Okay. Got it. And the, the mentality behind it, which I get and which I research, is that most people don't lie on their website, right? You know, so it, it's viewed as a trustworthy signal. But- Got it ... it, it's, that is just not enough. You need to be seen in different ways, so that's why visibility, you really wanna future-proof your business. And y- you know, so that's why I'm, I'm so passionate about this, because I've seen businesses and nonprofits get overlooked for grants because it's, their messaging and visibility was not where it should've been. That's so interesting because we talk about cohesive marketing all the time, and making sure that your brand is cohesive across, you know, social platforms and your website and documents that you're putting out. And I think about it in the linear fashion of, like, how people travel through a funnel. Right. And let's say they interact with you for the first time, seeing you on a LinkedIn post, and then they see you pop up a couple times. They are curious. They click on a link that takes them to a landing page of yours where you're offering something. Maybe it's a free thing or maybe it's just, you know, a link to your podcast or whatever. To me, I think about the messaging pathway- Mm-hmm ... and making sure that a customer's journey from cold traffic all the way to onboarding because they've fallen in love with your work and they wanna work with you, has to be cohesive and unified. Mm-hmm. But I have never before this conversation thought about AI bots searching for you- All the time and dismissing you because your overall ecosystem is not cohesive. Yeah. I'll give you a really expensive hard lesson that I learned from somebody. There's a nonprofit who missed a $50,000 grant late last year because she was, their team was lean and they were busy doing other projects, and their website and their social media just dipped for a few months because they were, you know, overseeing something else. They did not get a reoccurring $50,000 grant because, I don't think it, I don't know if this is specifically AI, but the brand was looking at them, and they noticed that their website was outdated and they weren't doing social media, and that was a signal that something was wrong, and maybe they're in trouble. And so they didn't get the grant. That had, that they had- Wow ... gotten it three years. Now, granted, they probably, maybe the brand should've called and said, "Hey, is everything okay?" But this is just how people move. The, it's people moving fast. People making- Yeah, we're moving so fast ... recommendations in five minutes or less, and then you get overseen, and this $50,000 to a nonprofit is devastating. A hard lesson to learn, and now they put their attention back into their communications. But I share this because I felt so terrible for this ex- executive director, and it's just a lesson to everyone out- listening that, you know, you just make sure that you, you know, I know there's a lot of priorities on your plate, but make sure your cadence of your communication is clear and updated. I would just recommend blocking off time. It's three hours every month or whatever that looks like. You put it in your calendar, you block it off, you don't do any meetings, you do not move anything for that, because then you can just focus and make sure that you're doing the right things. Okay. So solopreneurs out there listening to this, and maybe you're not a solopreneur, maybe you have a growing agency or a growing business that you've got, you know, employees, et cetera. But generally speaking, we wanna have clarity on that foundation, that North Star guide around your messaging so that you can easily respond to opportunities so that you're cohesive and clear across all your platforms, right, Jen? Mm-hmm. That's, like, the basic thing, like, having that North Star guide. And if you want help, Jen is opening opportunities. This is so exciting. Mm-hmm. I'm really excited about the Visibility and Messaging Accelerator. Jen, do you have any last thing that you would like to share with the listeners before we jump off? I would just say believe in yourself. You created this business for a reason. You have the talent, and I would share your talents with the world so that people can find your product and service so they can better their lives. And the first steps can feel a little uncomfortable, but I promise you, step by step, you'll become a pro. And visibility compounds, so remember that you've got this, and just believe in yourself and your capabilities. Yeah. It's so true. Such good advice. Thank you so much for coming on the show today and sharing so much of your long-earned wi- wisdom with us. Um, I have one final question for you. Yes. What is something that you're looking forward to? Well, I live in the Northeast. I live outside Boston, so I'm actually looking forward to, um, brighter days, warm days to be outside in nature. Yes. I'm with you on that one. Jen, thank you so much. I hope you have a great rest of your day today, and thanks for being with us. Thanks. And for all the listeners, I hope you guys take away some value from this conversation. I know that a lot of people out there don't feel ready to start doing things like, you know, pitching yourselves to media and thinking about the bigger picture of a lot of visibility on your business. But like we just heard, I think it's so important that you do spend time clarifying your message and preparing yourself for that level of visibility, because it's gonna help you make easier sales. So think about that, and as always, the line is open if you have questions or you wanna chat about this further. I'm gonna drop links to all of Jen's, her website, and her upcoming opportunities, and that Visibility Accelerator in the show notes. And so please check out her work and consider working with her if you're ready to be seen. And until we meet again next time, may you be vibrant.