The Gaslit Truth

Are You Sad, Sick or Stuck? Crystle Lampitt, Psychotherapist Journey of Healing Trauma & Empowerment!

• Dr. Teralyn & Therapist Jenn • Season 2 • Episode 48

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What if understanding your struggles could unlock a world of empowerment and self-trust? Join us as we welcome Crystle Lampitt, a licensed psychotherapist and trauma specialist, who shares her incredible journey from Indonesia to Kansas and how her late ADHD diagnosis fueled her passion for mental health. Crystle's story is one of resilience and transformation, offering listeners a powerful narrative of overcoming adversity and finding purpose in helping others move from survival to thriving.

Throughout this episode, we explore the profound connection between somatic work and mental health. With insights from experts like Peter Levine and Bessel van der Kolk, we discuss the intricate dance between the mind and body, highlighting the importance of culturally competent care and personalized health approaches. Crystle shares her personal experiences with somatic work, navigating traditional medical treatments for autoimmune conditions, and the delicate balance of listening to one's body signals to foster a healthier relationship with oneself.

The conversation takes a deep dive into themes of reclaiming personal agency and understanding trauma's impact on personal and professional life. We discuss the transition from external validation to self-awareness, exploring how therapy can facilitate this shift. Embracing vulnerability and recognizing mental health challenges as signs of our humanity are key to personal growth and healing. Connect with Crystle Lampitt online to continue this journey of self-discovery and empowerment.

The Gaslit Truth Podcast will be live and in person at the Feed the Recovering Brain Conference in Dublin, Ohio

Join us with the top names in brain health, including Christina Veselak, Hyla Cass, and Julia Ross, author of The Mood Cure.

We’ll be bringing you interviews and behind-the-scenes content as we explore how nutrition transforms mental wellness.


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Dr. Teralyn:

Therapist Jenn:





Speaker 1:

Hey everyone, welcome back to another episode of the Gaslit Truth Podcast. Before we start, terri and I have something that we just need to share with the world because it's so very cool, and I have to give Terri credit for this, because she got me a little Christmas gift that came in the mail, sure did. And I fucking love it.

Speaker 2:

For those of you on YouTube, check out our chat. You can see it on Instagram. Personally victimized by my neurotransmitters on my shirt.

Speaker 1:

I mean you're talking to two brain health gurus, so this is fucking funny to us. You may not think it's funny.

Speaker 2:

My husband didn't get it. He's like I don't understand your shirt.

Speaker 1:

I know he's an idiot and you know, I did post this on instagram and I wore this christmas. This was my christmas shirt that I wore. I mean I wore a nice little jacket over it. But I mean and it's funny because only like three people out of like the 50 I saw on christmas say something to me and I'm like, okay, you guys don't have any unsense of humor like, I'll put on the tacky Christmas sweater because that's funnier.

Speaker 2:

Anyway, Jen and I are personally victimized by our neurotransmitters. We are victimized by our neurotransmitters.

Speaker 1:

If anybody is out there that understands this, thinks it's funny, is in that same space can you please drop us a DM? That would be great, because we'll give you a high five on that all day long. Thanks for the Christmas gift, terry. You're very welcome.

Speaker 2:

We'll give you a high five on that all day long. So thanks for the Christmas gift, Terry. You're very welcome.

Speaker 1:

Appreciate that All right. All right, so now we get to the fun stuff, right? So, everybody, here's the deal. Today You've got to stop self-sabotaging because you are gaslighting yourself. And here we are. We are your whistleblowing shrinks, dr Tara Lynn and therapist Jen, and we are the Gaslit Truth.

Speaker 2:

Podcast. All right, we're going to welcome our special guest to the show and I actually did all the technology correctly, so 2025 is looking pretty smart for me at this point.

Speaker 2:

You toggled accurately, I toggled into the thing and I talked at the same time. So if you want to see it, go to YouTube. Yeah, I'm getting good, I'm getting good, I'm getting good. How many degrees it took? She can toggle Too many. All right, we're going to welcome Crystal Lampet to the show.

Speaker 2:

Crystal is a licensed psychotherapist, speaker and trauma specialist. Her passion is helping others who feel stuck in survival mode to find a greater sense of alignment and self-trust. I like that. As a multiracial transplant with her own ADHD diagnosed late in life, she has a special interest in working with multi-ethnic identity adoptees. We're going to talk about this right now and not parent expected cases or biological discoveries. In her TEDx talk, crystal shares her own story of shifting from a state of burnout, chronic illness and self-abandonment to greater ease, alignment and empowerment. Crystal uses a somatic and relational approach in her private practice to help clients shift their stuck patterns. Through her speaking engagements, she hopes to educate others and encourage them to never give up, even when prospects seem bleak. And we're going to get to where you can find her later. So welcome to the show, crystal Lampet. We need to like one of those little things.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, we need the clap.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, all of the confetti, the whole nine yards.

Speaker 1:

I'm sure there are sound effects I actually can do within this. I just need to figure it out.

Speaker 2:

Okay, that's on that. That's for you. Your technology assignment for the year Got it.

Speaker 3:

I'll be able to listen to. Did you guys watch Friends ever? Oh yeah, of course I've got my little Friends. I'll be there for you, Mug, and I've listened to it without the laugh track, it's so weird.

Speaker 1:

Everything becomes awkward. There's a reason they do that. We probably should get on board with that.

Speaker 2:

We're laughing at our own jokes all the time.

Speaker 1:

We do. We're our biggest fans, that's fine.

Speaker 2:

That's a weird, that's a really. I feel like a squirrel now because I grew up on laugh tracks. Everything told you what to do, they all told you how to feel. On sitcoms and things like that. You should be sad, oh, you should be excited.

Speaker 3:

Ha, ha, ha, ha ha.

Speaker 2:

Like you're told how to feel when you heard something. That's kind of an interesting segue for today. Yeah, a little bit, a little bit. So thanks for bringing it up. So welcome to the show. Thanks for having me.

Speaker 3:

It's good to meet you guys.

Speaker 2:

Yes. So we would really like to start off with your story, because we're very interested in personal stories, because usually there's a thread that starts us somewhere and gets us to where we are. So we would love for our listeners to hear your story, because it's kind of interesting.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, yeah, I know I think it's like any, especially in the helping profession, right, it's like something got us all here and I definitely had. It wasn't a straight path. I would say this is my fourth full-time career and I'm not that old, I'm 36. So I just had to bounce around a lot and we'll see. Hopefully I'll stay with this one. But I grew up overseas. So I, you know, I, lived in Indonesia for most of my childhood. My mom is Indonesian and it was. It was a lot of chaos, moving around a lot, and you know, my dad's job kind of took us everywhere and I eventually landed in the middle of Kansas.

Speaker 2:

So we're all here. Like you're like Dorothy.

Speaker 1:

Of all the places right, you could land.

Speaker 3:

Go from like mountains and beaches to Kansas. It was pretty funny. I thought it would be like Hollywood, you know, because my only exposure to what the United States was like was actually the movie Clueless, which I still love to this day. Oh boy, I do not love Paul Rudd. He's from Kansas, he's from Shawnee, where I live, right now.

Speaker 1:

He's so dreamy. He's so dreamy. I just I do like him. Paul, get your ass on the show here.

Speaker 3:

No, I know he's wonderful. So I ended up here, had a lot, you know, and it was fine. I mean, all things considered, we had to evacuate Indonesia actually, so we came from a background of a lot of strife. There was just a lot of political unrest going on. I actually was at a missionary school at the time, so they were persecuting anyone who was non-Muslim.

Speaker 3:

So it was just chaotic and I think my nervous system really learned that this pace was normal, like to be going, going, going and working hard, and we lived around a lot of poverty. We were very lucky. We were actually considered I'll never forget this we were considered wealthy because we had a refrigerator and so, you know, the town that we lived in, the village that we lived in, some of our neighbors didn't even have electricity. I mean, this is decades ago, and so I think my system just kind of learned like this is, this is the pace. You got to work hard at life, and moving to the States was like you're going to have to work harder than everyone else because of your skin color and did you know that?

Speaker 2:

I mean, was that something that you came here knowing? Did somebody tell you that?

Speaker 3:

Or was that just common knowledge, or no one told me this, not directly, you know well, I can remember one bully who did, but I would say it was more internalized. You know, you do get a certain message. There's obviously racism, but then there's also skin color stratification, which I mean in Indonesia is huge. So I may consider it a darker skinned Indonesian and everything. There is light skin lightening products. Right.

Speaker 3:

Here you want to be tan, everyone wants to be tan and look like they just came back from vacation. And in Indonesia you want to be white. You don't want to look like a laborer in the rice fields, right, because that means you're a lower class. And so I mean it was like everywhere, it was kind of a lose-lose, right, like there I was not light enough, here I was like tan, but it also wasn't going to necessarily work for me, being brown skinned. And so I kind of internalized it and just decided decided unconsciously well, I'm just going to have to work my ass off, right, I'm just going to have to be good enough and I'm going to have to show them. And so I landed in, surprise, surprise, some careers that were maybe not the best for my mental health.

Speaker 3:

But one area where I could kind of find maybe a little more acceptance was actually modeling. So I worked as a model for several years and kind of led a double life for a while while I was going to college and I was just tall enough that I could work in Asia, and so I did that for a while and I'm back here to finish my studies and then eventually that led into television. So I worked at the local news station here for almost eight, nine years and ended up hosting morning show, doing a newscast, you know, doing like three people's jobs basically. So talk about burnout. It was really chaotic but it was for all intents and purposes like the success story, right Like when I think of the American dream and before moving here, when I saw what people had, I mean I remember one of the first things that I was so surprised by was just how manicured people's lawns are. And you know we're.

Speaker 2:

I'm in the suburbs.

Speaker 3:

So I was like, wow, like look at how green the grass is and medians, like roads were organized. And I remember just thinking like, wow, this is it. Like we've, we're, we're, we're here, we've made it, you know. Um, and so I always kind of had this sense of like well, I just I need to work harder to be able to earn staying here. Um, and I'm an American citizen. So again, it wasn't even like that, was no one told me these things, right, but somewhere, like you get these ideas, um, so I did work at the station for a really long time until about, let's see, my mid, late twenties.

Speaker 3:

I started to get all these sort of mysterious ailments and eventually got diagnosed with hypothyroidism and autoimmune diseases. So actually my hair started to fall out in these huge chunks. I had these bald spots. Meanwhile I'm hosting a morning show where I'm on air every day so they diagnosed me with alopecia areata and then after that, also Sjogren's syndrome and psoriasis. So I started to get these rashes and my salivary glands and my tear ducts don't always work properly, and so I'm just like what is going on? I'm in my twenties, you know. You think that's supposed to be this great time of life. You're certainly not aging Right and so, but that is, most people get diagnosed with autoimmune illnesses and I think a big factor was was the burnout.

Speaker 3:

And so I kind of just I did all the things went to the doctor, went to holistic practitioners, I did everything under the sun, Like I think if you would have told me like hey, crystal, jump backwards 10 times before bed and that's going to cure everything, I would have done it. You know, I was just like desperate for somebody, um and so kind of short story long. That's how I started to look into somatic work, working with the body, also mental health, because I realized a lot of what I was doing was coming from fear and desperation and there's a whole host of physiological responses that are occurring in your body when you're approaching your health through the lens of fear and desperation, right, and so that body connection was huge and, I'm happy to say, most of my physical symptoms anyway, anyway, are in remission. So it's been years to get here, but it's a lot, a lot better. I had to, just, you know, I just had to change everything about my life. No big deal, but yeah it's.

Speaker 2:

I was going to say, and I went back to school and got a master's degree and then subsequent licensing. And you know, when you talk about like some of the careers that I've had are just not good for my mental health, I'm like, yeah, this one, yeah, I mean that's true.

Speaker 3:

That's so funny right.

Speaker 2:

Funny, but not funny you know like it's funny but not funny. But yeah, so you need a shirt that says personally victimized you do.

Speaker 1:

I was going to say she needs the shirt.

Speaker 3:

Like.

Speaker 1:

I'm curious to know, can you share just a little bit when you say somatic work, where did that start for you?

Speaker 2:

What were you doing for yourself? First of all, I want to backtrack that. What is somatic work for?

Speaker 3:

our listeners who don't know what it is. Yes, yeah. So somatic work kind of became popularized through a type of trauma therapy called somatic experiencing. It was created by Peter Levine. He really started looking into this and creating it, formulating it, in the seventies, so it's been around for several decades now. Um, and he was he, he and also Bessel van der Coke who wrote the body keeps the score. They were just really huge in scientifically finding evidence for that mind body connection.

Speaker 3:

And so with somatic work, especially when it comes to treating trauma, we are working directly with the autonomic nervous system and really helping. In my case, right, I needed to learn how to track my body, how to track my nervous system. What happens when we've been living with chronic stress or we have a lot of unresolved trauma? It's like our brain is on high alert all the time. So when I was saying you know, growing up overseas, I think my, my brain just kind of thought these things were normal.

Speaker 3:

And so somatic work is really just working with the nerve system, helping your body to understand and and access more regulation, more of that parasympathetic rest and digest, while also completing any potential incomplete or unprocessed trauma, um, that might be showing up in repeated what we call uh, survival responses. So you know, if you have a chronic flight response or you have a chronic freeze response, you might be feeling really dissociated, really spacey or really angsty all the time. So it's a different way of it's a still mental health, right, but it's like mental health is really physical health and vice versa. Like they're not. They're not as separate as we like to make them sometimes.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, all the time, like I want to.

Speaker 3:

I want to say like all the time, like your head, is connected to your body all the time Brain is in your body right, like yeah, yeah, Well, so that was my essentially.

Speaker 3:

What got me here was, I think, first, when I think anyone gets a diagnosis right, the first thing you're going to do is like, okay, well, let me talk to my doctor about this diagnosis right? The first thing you're going to do is like, okay, well, let me talk to my doctor about this. And I, you know, I tried the medications that they want to put you on for, whether it's autoimmune or hypothyroidism, and had Synthroid, and I tried these different things and I was lucky that they didn't have any adverse effects, but they also weren't really helping, and so that was sort of my first stop right Is like, okay, well, and I love my primary care. So I was like I really trust her, I think she's going to lead me in the right direction, and I was also pretty young, so I was just like I don't know, let's try it.

Speaker 3:

Um, tried that and after, you know, maybe six months or a year or so, not seeing much improvement. And also I wasn't, to be honest, the most consistent about taking the medications. I was kind of like I don't really know if this is it, and I felt awful inside all the time, cause I was like why is my body betraying me? What am I doing wrong? So then I went down the rabbit hole of these really strict protocols, right, so I eliminated, like everything, um, I did the autoimmune protocol. I eliminated sugar, dairy, all grains which I'm indonesian, we eat rice like all day, every day, right, not okay also villainize rice over here.

Speaker 2:

I have to say like yeah, rice is a villain.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, we, we do, and which that that idea right Goes like biologically against your body as well. So I just want to throw that out there. Right, like your ass, you tried an intervention or asked to do an intervention or part of an intervention that went completely against your, your, your genetics and how you are biologically hardwired. So that's just a very that's a I don't know. I just want to throw that in there because that's a very interesting thought. Right, because a lot of people are seeking that do a lot of those really strict diet changes for and I'm not saying that's not helpful, right, for people that have thyroid issues or Hashimoto's or all these things. I'm not going to say that, but we just removed something that actually might be very imperative for your functioning biologically.

Speaker 3:

Totally Well, and this is the importance of culturally competent care right, yes, this is just a different layer to it.

Speaker 1:

It is it completely is right, like talk about multiracial transplant that sticks out when you said that in your bio and I'm thinking okay. So here's an intervention that goes completely against how she's genetically wired.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, but but you read all these testimonials so well for Texas. So, okay, you know, yep. So I tried all those things and, and you know I will say, everything helped in its own way, if nothing else, just to give me good information about what wasn't going to be the right step for me, right? So even trying medications and seeing that it didn't provide enough of a support for me was sort of like, ok, well, what's next then let's try this. And and I did work with a, an MD, sort of like an integr MD out in California, who you know then prescribed sort of like a supplement plan. You know, we talked about diet, we did all sorts of things, and it was nice to have a little bit more time speaking with an MD, because that is usually, you know, as you know, pretty short, maybe 10 minutes to talk to your doctor, and so I did feel there was a little bit more care and attention.

Speaker 3:

But again, I was still doing these extremely restrictive things for my body and on the one hand, it was good, my digestion was better, like, go figure, eat more vegetables, your stomach works better. Oh shit, right. So it was still helpful in some ways, but in other ways I was more stressed out than ever, because I was getting this into this orthorexia where I was terrified to eat anything and and then I wasn't as much, because then I wouldn't go to a restaurant because I'd be afraid about, well, what's in the food and they're not going to have what I need, which is, you know, more than gluten free I needed, like, grain free, sugar free, and so then it just had this really deleterious effect on my mental health where I started realizing like my world is getting smaller and smaller and like, yeah, I'm moving more and I'm eating healthier, but I'm terrified of everything and I'm stressed out about everything, and so it's like just cortisol and adrenaline pumping through my veins all the time. And finally, I think I realized something has to change here, because even though I'm doing these things that appear to be healthy, I feel worse than ever. I was still symptomatic, and then I had this layer of you know, depression and just misery on top of it, this layer of you know depression and just misery on top of it.

Speaker 3:

And so that's what eventually and you're I mean like I know you were kind of joking, but I mean I did go back to school and I put myself through more burnout. I was still in the morning show while I was in school. Yeah, I'm a hit while I was in school. I mean, it was a wild ride.

Speaker 1:

We all do this shit, by the way, just so you know. This is not new.

Speaker 2:

How do you think I knew that I'm sitting here just going? Yep.

Speaker 1:

Check, check, check, check, check. Yes.

Speaker 2:

It's the plight of the high achiever.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, it is.

Speaker 2:

Well, it's also the plight of the I'm not enough person, I'll never be enough, I'm not enough and um, and I think there's that drive for a lifetime to solve that right, like, if I just do this next big thing, then I will be enough, if I just help enough people, then I will be enough. You know, if I just do this, then I'll be enough. And I wanted to point something out, because you know you're talking about changing your diet and all these things that became super restrictive, which is something that I don't necessarily believe in, unless it has to be, unless you've got a disease state like celiac, then you're of. It wasn't just the restrictive nutritional stuff, it was the beliefs about it, right, um, we were talking about self-sabotaging, limiting beliefs.

Speaker 2:

I think this is where I want to put that together, because, um, I don't want people to be like, well, she tried all these nutritional things and they didn't help her, and I'm like, well, the stress came from the thoughts around it, like the fear and the limiting things, and that's the cortisol stress that you were talking about. And so, when Jen and I talk about the pillars of mental health eat, sleep, move, meditate the meditate part is the emotional pieces of all of this and what we say to ourself or don't say to ourself. That was the part that seemed to be maybe missing, you know, or amped up, right, like negatively amped up, despite doing all the other things. I'm air quoting right? Yeah, correctly.

Speaker 2:

That part was the missing piece piece or the piece that just kept getting amped and amped, and amped and amped, which is hard. You know, being restrictive is hard right. So how did you find resolution in that piece for yourself? Then, in the piece of self-sabotage, how did you find resolution, or haven't you?

Speaker 3:

Yeah, no, I'm still figuring it out Well.

Speaker 2:

I mean, I am, I'm you know, I'm freaking 55 years. No, I'm still figuring it out.

Speaker 3:

Well, I mean, I am, I'm you know, I'm fricking, 55 years old and I'm still figuring it out Totally and as far as good enough piece, that would maybe always be a work in progress. Yeah, you're absolutely right. It's that everything is a relationship. Everything is how am I relating to this protocol? And if you're doing it in a way that it feels good and it feels supportive and you're like, yeah, I'm going to cut out grains and I'm going to eat these vegetables and these other things that feel really good for me and this feels really nourishing to me and you're affirming to yourself and your body is showing you that this feels good and this feels safe, that's probably going to have, you're going to have a totally different outcome, right, but if you're doing it in the way that I was, which was fear and you know, perfectionism, because that's the other piece, right, another part of my strategy is perfectionism.

Speaker 3:

So I couldn't even have one grain of rice, you know, I mean it was so intense and in my case, I wasn't. I mean I was and I wasn't aware of my trauma history, like, obviously, now, talking about it, I'm like, oh, yeah, like the way you know the environments we were living in, and I have a whole host of childhood shit that I'm like, oh, but I wouldn't have until I got into this work, I just thought well, I'm functioning because that's how we see things, right? Well, that?

Speaker 1:

means you're fine, yeah, so.

Speaker 3:

I would kind of say like, well, I just, yeah, I went through hardship but I just I'm resilient and it's fine, everything's fine. So once I kind of became more aware of, oh, trauma has something to do with why I am the way that I am and why my nervous system operates in this way, then everything kind of made sense. It was like, oh, okay, so your perfectionism around the way that you're eating, uh, the extreme hyper vigilance around doing things just right, um and so somatic work and really my very first training was actually in NARM it's it stands for neuroaffective relational model and it was so mind blowing because it is both somatic. So, you know, bottom up includes the body in the conversation. It is both bottom up and top down, so there is also the cognitive piece to it. And, being someone who likes research and likes things to make sense, I like I needed some buy-in.

Speaker 3:

Still, you know, it was helpful to understand attachment dynamics, the impact on your physiology when you have a childhood, uh, that might've had some chaos or ups and downs, or neglect I think neglect is actually the sneakiest one that most of us are not aware of Um and so understanding that okay. So not only am I completely disconnected from my body. I don't understand what my needs are. I don't need. I didn't even know you were allowed to have needs. I remember in one of my very first I think it was in my internship I somebody had this list of human needs. It was a worksheet that you know you could give to clients I'm like an intern by this point and it was a list that you know you could give to clients, like I'm like an intern by this point, and it was a list of human needs and it was like basic things that you would expect, like air, food, water you know and I'm like oh yeah, awesome food, I'm great, um.

Speaker 3:

And then there were other things like connection support joy. I was like huh I, I was like those are neat.

Speaker 2:

Those are luxuries.

Speaker 1:

That's an add on a la carte. Yeah, that's concierge service right there. That's fancy shit.

Speaker 3:

And I just remember and it sounds so ridiculous now, but at the time. So one of the one of the big puzzle pieces for me was I was in a string of abusive relationships. So talk about connection and support. No, my system was on high alert because I didn't understand, I never knew what shape my partner would be in when he came home. So that was adding to the hypervigilance, right. So I had actual environmental reasons to be fearful. But then I also have this internal patterning where my system was like this is what is normal, this is what you're used to.

Speaker 3:

So, yeah, being in a toxic partnership, totally your needs met, that's fine, this is how it is for everybody, right? And I wouldn't have seen that as self-sabotage or low self-esteem. If you would have asked me, I would have said I have tons of confidence, I host a morning show every day and I introduced myself to 30 people a week that I was interviewing and talking on live TV. So I just never would have seen any of that as self-sabotage. Or really I call it self-protection, right? I mean self-sabotage that the body and the brain are not trying to hurt you. They're. They're really not as much as it can feel that way, especially when you have chronic illness, that your body's betraying you. It's your brain and your body doing their damnedest right. They're trying their hardest to keep you safe, to protect you, um, and to signal you, but you have to.

Speaker 3:

Ideally, I teach my clients to like. Have you heard the saying like a feather bricks, am I? Um? First listen, for when something is a feather, like a little feather tickle, and if you don't hear or or notice the symptom, when it's a light feather touch, it's going to hit you again as a brick. You're going to get a brick in the face, you're going to get a louder signal and then, if you don't listen to the brick, you're going to get a semi right and you're going to feel like you got hit by a truck.

Speaker 1:

See you. You are like the second guest in the last month.

Speaker 3:

I was just going to say. Susie said the same thing. We just had another person talk about how illness will knock three times.

Speaker 1:

But it's about listening is exactly what you're talking about and the idea that the body is going to continue to protect and try to protect you. But I think that that's something that we miss a lot are the subtle signals, and you know what? They aren't that fucking subtle, like when you're talking about what you went through when it comes to the autoimmune pieces, right, and your alopecia, and going through, like, if that's not the body's way of telling you, stop, figure right, figure it out.

Speaker 2:

Then I don't know what is right, like these are the the body is going to actually tell you. The problem was is that the alopecia was on the back of your head, in your blind spot, so you couldn't see it right. If you saw it, if it was here, then maybe earlier you would have caught something. Maybe you know, but it was in your blind spot.

Speaker 3:

It was, it was still enough. I think I was lucky, though, right, because it was still enough. It was like it hit me right in my vanity, right. It was like, oh, this will get her to pay attention, because I mean, it's all about appearance and then on TV, right being on air, and so I was lucky that it was back here so I could do um, I did, I did clip ins to cover it up, um, but it was just enough. It was still enough.

Speaker 2:

I think this would have been that would have been well, that would have freaked you out. That would have been your semi truck.

Speaker 3:

It was going to be a little bit nicer. Maybe this was right, um, but it did I mean it worked, right it got my attention and then I started realizing, like you know, I haven't been feeling good for a while. What's going on with my digestion? What's going on with my energy? What's going on? My skin started to get these rashes and outbreaks.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, you need to listen to the episode of dr ebony cornish which will, which will be the episode right before this one airs, so I think you're gonna like that one.

Speaker 1:

She's telling the guests to listen be the episode right before this one airs, so I think you're going to like that one. She's telling the guests to listen to the episode. I know like it was so good. It was all about autoimmune diseases.

Speaker 2:

But I wanted to bring up something because it was kind of sitting with me when you said I was basically outperforming yourself daily as a TV anchor and interviewing people and all these things, but at home you were underperforming interpersonally. And I look at that now because I used to do the same damn shit. I would outperform at work, but this is well before I was married. I would underperform interpersonally, choosing men that were terrible, like just absolutely shit show of humans, you know, and I believe now that that was an extension, if you want to look at it as a symptom of not being enough playing out in my interpersonal life, and I was trying to overcompensate for that by professionally doing more, being more, becoming more, doing the next big thing. So I feel like people operate in those constructs that are in the same affliction. We professionally outperform everyone Interpersonally is where the damage is or where the symptomology lays. And once we can consolidate those two things right, life becomes more, equal, more, I don't want to say balanced. I hate that word.

Speaker 2:

More aligned. Yeah, aligned, yeah, that's a good word, more aligned. You know, there was a concept that you had that just keeps coming up over and over, and I don't know if it's a new buzzword or what, but you mentioned this I don't know if it was in your bio or somewhere that I read about personal agency so profound. How does someone, in your opinion, or how did you, reclaim your agency? Because, again, all the things that you did were kind of outsourced by somebody else. They told you what to do, right, like, do this, do this restrictive diet? Do this thing, do that, do this, do this thing, do that, do this, do this? How does one reclaim their agency when they're in that state of desperation to, I guess, reclaim their own health? And we give it up to everybody else, like, give me the answers, everybody. And so I don't know if you can talk about that at all.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, Well and I think this is part of why I came into this field is, I think therapy was the one of the first spaces where I saw an EMDR therapist and she was somebody who started to ask me well, what do you think? You know, how does that feel for you? And so I actually see this as one of the signs of healing, if you will, or signs of recovery is moving from what I call other referencing to self referencing. And so, when we have learned for so long that what's going to keep me safe is making other people happy, you know, presenting a certain way, maybe, in my case, people pleasing perfectionism, these are going to be the things that keep me safe, because in some senses they do, especially if that's a childhood thing, or, you know, this is how you survived, your family of origin, or, or this is what the world taught you about who you are and where you belong, right as a, as a woman who is like non white or or half white, um, what did I learn about? How to survive and stay safe? And so agency's huge and therapy was huge for me to start asking myself those questions about you know, what do you need? And, like I said, like looking at a list of like here are some examples of needs that all humans have one that de-stigmatized it for me, because then I was like, oh, I'm allowed to have needs and I'm allowed to disagree with some of the fuckery that's going on in my life right now. Like I don't have to be in a relationship with someone who yells at me and calls me names and gets violent. Like I don't have to do that. Wait a minute, whoa, whoa, whoa, you know.

Speaker 3:

So it was kind of speaking of being gaslit right, like I had believed and I believe internalized messages that you get what you get and you're happy with it and this is how all relationships are. I really remember thinking like this is just, this is what was normal and truly I just didn't know. And so really starting to find these sources within friendships. You know I had a few friends who I think social support well, the research also shows this right, social support is one of the hugest protective against most mental health conditions or trauma and any of the things that, um, that we deal with as humans. And so I had, luckily, a few friends who had lives that I was like okay, they're functioning, they have healthy relationships. So I think, finding those people in your life. You are.

Speaker 2:

I think I think yeah, I throw that in there.

Speaker 3:

Then or at least they appear to be better than how I feel day to day. Right, there was a level of uh, when I first understood what secure attachment is, I was like, oh, that's a thing, you can feel safe in a relationship and vulnerable in relationship and you can speak openly about your insecurities and your fears, like I had a friend who talked to her partner about stuff she was going through and I was like what you tell your partner that like doesn't he, doesn't that turn him off? Isn't he going to abandon you now? No, he tells me. I was like what? I mean, it just was like it felt so mind blowing. And so when you start to find, however, you find that right, whether it's a friend or a distant relative or therapist. I mean, therapy is one of the first exposures to a safe, secure, hopefully relationship and it started to invite this sense of well, how does something feel in my body?

Speaker 3:

And, honestly, lots of BMDR, I mean. I did a lot of BMDR on my trauma. I did do some somatic experiencing and NARM was probably one of the pieces that blew it wide open for me. It was understanding attachment and understanding how badly we need connection for survival, but also how badly we need to be able to be our own person. You know, in that connection, disconnection dance that we're all doing as humans and without making anything bad or wrong, I think we get really stuck in these binaries right Of, like this is the one right way to do it. It's not, there's not one right way, but I do think you can start to find in your circle I mean, I even would use books, examples from books.

Speaker 3:

I remember reading about attachment, reading Gottman's work and understanding what secure attachment was Like. He would just tell stories of examples and I'd be like is that really possible? So I think, first, you kind of need a little bit of hope, though, right Like you need a little sense of the fact that maybe there is a different way. Um and so, however, you can get that ideally through relationship of some kind.

Speaker 1:

Um, you know you, you talk a lot about, um, narcissistic abuse. That's something that has popped in a few of the things that you post. You've got that on your website, too. For you, the intrigue that you have, does that come from a personal space, based off of things that you have been through in your life?

Speaker 3:

Yeah, totally. And narcissistic abuse is sneaky because from the outside no one else sees it. In fact, people who will say you know high conflict personalities or pathological personalities which, again, trauma. I work with NPD, I work with narcissism, I believe we all have narcissistic parts. I certainly do. You know. Like, whatever you want to call it, we all have narcissistic parts. I certainly do. You know.

Speaker 3:

Like, whatever you want to call it, it's all coming from like it makes sense If you, if you really look at it, it makes sense, no-transcript being okay with that type of relationship. That begs the question like, okay, what is happening in me? Um, and whenever you say pattern, right, so for me, in my case, it wasn't like I just had like one off, like one bad relationship. I had like in a row that I was like what in the actual fuck? Like how are all of these other people apparently right? I know, I know it's not all um rainbows and sunshine with what people on social right. I know, I know it's not all rainbows and sunshine with what people on social media, but I really people who seemingly had like at least safe relationships, and I just couldn't figure it out. Something is. And then of course, I did the shame spiral. Something is deeply wrong with me. And then I understood more about complex PTSD. I understood, oh, some of this is again the enactment of trauma Right.

Speaker 3:

Exactly, but sneaky, right, because it was more of a neglect situation where, while we had, we were always safe or we would be removed from dangerous situations. To get to safety, right Like I ended up living in seven different countries by the time I was 12 and had gone to like five different schools and you know we were always removed from unsafe situations. So when I thought back on my history I was like, but we were, but we were fine, right, but it's the, it was the emotional piece, right Like there was never a conversation about, like, how are you doing with all this? Like, yeah, how, how did that feel for you? Or what's going on.

Speaker 3:

So I did not have an organized self, I did not have a sense of self, I just kind of went with. And I think this is what we do growing up, because there's no other choice. You just you take what you get and you get what you get. Um, and until you kind of understand that and can really look at it without shame, without blame, without this sense of something is deeply wrong with me that I need to internalize, then you can actually start accepting and having, you know, forming that sense of self and really realizing. I mean, I got to the point where I was like you know what, if I really am broken and this is just what's meant for me is I'm going to be single and, um, I was like I'm actually fine with that.

Speaker 3:

I genuinely was like, unless I can truly connect with someone who treats me well, who is able to be vulnerable, who can be honest with themselves and it took a while for me to be really honest with myself right, Because there is something very vulnerable about being perceived and being vulnerable in relationship, and so it took so much untangling and so I had to deconstruct like everything I thought I knew and then finally it kind of became clear oh, this is not, this is not a character flaw, this isn't something's wrong with me and something's wrong with them, and they're all bad and I'm all good. It's just not that simple. It's all of our unhealed wounds are in relationship with all of our partners unhealed wounds or unhealed parts. So these parts are going to do this little dance as, I believe, an invitation to look at what still needs work. And luckily now it's just not as unsafe.

Speaker 2:

I have some questions here because I'm and you may not have the answers and I may be incorrect and you can tell me that, because, as you're sharing your story of being 12 and moving to all these countries when you're 12, I'm guessing it was because your parents wanted safety, physical safety, and so emotional safety wasn't part of the conversation, because physical safety is yeah, trumps everything, it trumps everything. Safety is yeah, trumps everything, it trumps everything. So in your parents' minds and raising they're like we are doing the best thing we can to keep our kids physically safe, you know, as we move along. So I'm thinking, if you would have stayed in the environment that you were in originally as a child, none of this emotional awakening would have ever happened. Originally, as a child, none of this emotional awakening would have ever happened. It was because you came to the United States that we start talking about.

Speaker 2:

I'm just going to, you know, historically, look at Maslow's hierarchy of human needs, right, like. So if you look at that, like the basic, basic, basic safety stuff is on the bottom. That's where your parents were operating from all the time, you know, all the time. And so now you're working up the self-actualization tower here and you're like oh, wow, like I can see that there's so much more to the lived human experience than just, excuse me, than just living in the bottom. You know safety and safety of person, right, and resources piece of things, right. So this, this is real, like the cultural melding of your history versus now American culture, looking at emotions, and you know the self-actualized person, right. So okay, cause I'm, I'm sitting over here going. Is that what this is Like? Is that what I'm hearing? Is that what I'm? You know? Yes, and okay, so that that makes sense to me. I didn't really have a question. I was just like am I getting through this correctly here?

Speaker 1:

Like she's totally being a therapist right now, like that was a total therapist moment, like I'm really just trying to understand. That's what you're doing. This is what you're doing and I just this is good.

Speaker 3:

Right, right, and it's a huge like. Isn't that also part of reconfiguring? You know your narrative and your understanding is like I can now have so much appreciation, but I needed to process all the other shit first. Right, like, I still needed to understand how this impacted me. Even with good intentions right, I always differentiate intent versus impact. Even with the best intentions, the impact can still be, and this is where understanding your brain is so helpful. The impact can still be. Yeah, but that was hard for me, even though, yeah, we got to this.

Speaker 2:

Yes, no, I really appreciate that, the intention versus the impact, because I do think that we're living in a culture today of just impact. My parents were wrong, they should never have done this, because the impact to me was this and I'm like but intention brings context as well. You can't heal and this goes for you, for me, for my parents, for your parents, whatever you can't heal trauma if you're still fighting in the war, right? So we literally have to pull ourselves out of the war in order to start even looking at the trauma, right? Um, that it happened to us in the war, that we didn't know we were fighting, right?

Speaker 1:

Right, yeah, we had no idea, you know, and I got to add, add something onto this. Um, crystal, you, you said something that I think is really, and I don't you're probably so. I think some of us are so used to saying this, not only like as therapists and working with individuals, like, especially I know this comes out really like naturally out of my mouth a lot and I have to put myself in check to go okay, wait, what does that actually mean? When I just said that, jen, because you just said something about how it makes sense, it makes sense now when I look back on what I've been through, that I am going through what I'm going through now. Talk about a completely trauma-informed approach to most things in life. It makes sense. You are in the position that you are in. We say this to our clients all the time too. When you look back what you just shared with us about your history right In the multiracial transplant and what that means for you, it makes sense that you would be in this position. You just said that and it triggered me to think about and I'm kind of going you said the brain and I'm kind of going to the central nervous system here. So when I'm thinking about where you grew up and what you were exposed to.

Speaker 1:

Our central nervous systems don't develop right fully until we're like in our early 20s, right. And so if the central nervous system's function right is to receive that sensory information right, process it send the signals out right to the body and collect information. Motor right like send signals to our muscles, our organs. Right, cognitive learning, memory this is all these things right Like send signals to our muscles, our organs. Right, cognitive learning memory this is all these things right.

Speaker 1:

Thinking about how stunted that was for you never being right and I'm using some absolute words here but probably never being in an optimal state where there wasn't something constantly that never lets you get to any parasympathetic places ever, right, it makes sense, totally, you know. And then you put yourself where you are now, and I asked you a question about narcissistic abuse, right, and we think about from just the functioning of a central nervous system, space and continuing those patterns on and the body giving us these signals, whether it's the alopecia, right, or the autoimmune issues, right, like, it gives us all these signals constantly. And now in hindsight you can go back because you've hit some of these self-actualization places right. Where purpose is there now? Internal sense of agency has been found at a level that wasn't there before. It's almost like does it make sense for you? Does it make sense now? Like it's such a, and if it does, then what a great place to be. Yeah, like, what a great place to just sit in when it's like fuck, this isn't my fault.

Speaker 3:

Oh, totally, that's huge right, yeah, like understanding the brain, understanding environmental failures, environmental stressors and really, when you look at it from a psychobiological perspective and an environmental right Biopsychosocial is what we say in my field and it does, and yay. And also, isn't it a congruent response to be on high alert when you're living in a situation that?

Speaker 1:

is as it should be, as it should be right, like this is. For you to to operate differently Doesn't quite make sense. You'd be kind of an anomaly within all of this to be able to completely you know, or you're just completely dissociated forever. I mean, I would question that too with people, right, you know, and not that we have to pathologize everything and at the same time, I think this makes sense to just given what you've all shared, right.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, not until now, you know, would it really be? And and that is, you know, getting to a place where you can understand first the external changes that might need to happen. And it wouldn't make sense for me to be able to do this work if I was still in those environments, if I was still in a relationship. But both and right. Often when we shift the internal relationship to the self, we can then start creating some external changes as well, and vice versa. But we need both and it has to feel at least a little bit safe to connect with the body and understand sensations and needs.

Speaker 3:

But you know, the more, the more I think there is an understanding of your body is trying to help you and it's not betraying you. It's not trying to anyway, Right, and a lot of these responses are so congruent that takes so much shame out of it and also, I think it reduces some of that fear and intensity and, honestly, my continued work is helping my system to learn that it is no longer in those situations. So I'm continuously doing my own somatic work, accessing more parasympathetic and I think there's always going to be some, you know, residual stuff from there, especially earlier in childhood, right With what we know about adverse childhood experiences. Um, but yeah, understanding, it's like oh, your, your brain's on your side, your body's trying to help you. Um, it's just a game changer makes such a huge difference in how we relate to ourselves here.

Speaker 2:

You had said in something no, it was in your TED Talk yeah, that your mental health symptoms, looking at them as a sign of our own humanity rather than a sign of pathology, and I loved that, because we pathology fails us, right, it's where we stop, okay, so I've got a diagnosis, I've got a label, I've got pathology period Done, done, you know. And so I'm like no, we have to look at this as this is part of our humanity, this is part of our lived experience, this is part of this is what our body is designed to do. Actually, you know, and the signaling and all the stuff that Jen was just talking about a few moments ago, this is what our body is built for. But for some reason, we get stuck in the pathology and that's just it.

Speaker 2:

I have, you know, ptsd or some mental health diagnosis and that is my life forever, instead of the agency that we're just talking about. Like, okay, so this happened to me, this is my impact, you know, of life, and now I have a responsibility to self to develop my own agency here and figure out what to do from here. So, anyway, I don't even know if that was your intention when you said that, or I think it was just written as part of a title or something or whatever. But what do you make of that now hearing it at the end of the show?

Speaker 3:

That feels good to hear. I actually forgot I said that.

Speaker 1:

It's very epic, so you might want to brand the shit out of that girl, I'm just saying a t-shirt let it somewhere.

Speaker 3:

I had, if I could, that that really does encapsulate. I think what I hope my message can be to people is that there is hope and that there's so much wisdom internally that has gotten covered up by life, by stressors, by what I call adaptive survival strategies. Right, a lot of this work is not so much about let's add and make you better, and add things to your life to make everything better, and you need to be a new and improved version of yourself. It's really what can we subtract? What obstacles, what strategies have gotten in the way of and are covering up this innate wisdom that you have? And so, when we do this work, we get to slowly peel back the layers and hopefully reconnect with that wisdom in the body. And I mean honestly, I wouldn't do this if I hadn't had my own personal experiences with it. So I to say, you know, I I really um, feel like living proof of that.

Speaker 2:

Love it. Well, I would like to thank you for being on the show. Um, yeah, this is our second show of the new year, so welcome to 2025. That's right, that's right. And if you have stuck around with us this far, please like, comment, share and subscribe, and send us your gaslit truth at the gaslit truth podcast. I can't even talk at the gaslit truth podcast at gmailcom.

Speaker 1:

That, that's fantastic. And where can people find you, crystal?

Speaker 3:

Yeah, feel free to check out my website clwellnesskccom. And then I'm also at Crystal Lampet on Instagram.

Speaker 2:

Awesome. It'll all be linked in the show notes. Thank you everyone for being here and thank you, Crystal. Thanks for having me.

People on this episode

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Dr. Teralyn

Co-host
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Jennifer Schmitz

Co-host
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Dr. Teralyn

Guest
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Jennifer Schmitz

Guest