What If Psychiatry Meant Medicine For The Soul Again | The Gaslit Truth Podcast with Dr. Teralyn Sell & Therapist Jenn Schmitz

Psychiatry shouldn’t make people doubt their own pain. We open with a hard truth—gaslighting is baked into too many mental health encounters—and then chart a different route with psychiatrist Dr. Hector, who practices “medicine for the soul.” He shares how the White Butterfly ethos grew from Greek mythology and how SPECT imaging can reveal recognizable trauma patterns without reducing people to a diagnosis list. You’ll hear about the “diamond” and “triangle” signatures in the brain, why chronic gaslighting and prolonged stress can hit just as hard as a single event, and how validation becomes a catalyst for change when science meets story.

From there, we get practical. Real collaboration means quick, focused huddles between psychiatrist, therapist, and medical providers so nothing blocks deeper work like EMDR. We talk about using targeted supports such as GABA and tyrosine to balance arousal and motivation, and how to avoid numbing the very emotions therapy needs to reach. Dr. Hector argues that connection is a clinical tool: changing your visual presence to build safety, sharing your humanity without dumping, and using humor to l

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💊 Ready to Deprescribe Your Psych Meds?

Psych meds have harmed us—and we’re not just survivors, we’re deeply educated in psychopharmacology, psychology, and nutrition. As hosts of The Gaslit Truth Podcast, we guide people safely off psychiatric medications with strategies grounded in science and brain health

🔥 You’ve been harmed. You’ve been dismissed. It’s time to take your brain back—with guidance from people who’ve been there and know their stuff.

Chapters

• 0:00 Calling Out Gaslighting In Psychiatry
• 0:21 Community Updates And Live 100th Show
• 1:18 Meet Dr. Hector: Doctor And Student
• 2:27 The White Butterfly: Treating The Soul
• 4:09 Reading Trauma In SPECT Brain Patterns
• 6:00 Redefining Trauma Beyond One Big Event
• 7:35 The Diagnosis Machine And Quick Fix Culture
• 9:11 Survival Wiring And Slowing The Brain
• 10:50 Personal History, Migration, And Mothers
• 14:07 Collaboration That Actually Helps Patients
• 16:16 Supplements, EMDR, And Removing Blocks
• 17:47 Humility, Appearance, And Building Trust
• 19:52 Training Outside Elite Systems
• 21:49 Creativity, Resilience, And Real Healing
• 23:52 Humor, Bonding, And Nervous Systems
• 25:45 Beyond Sitting In Pain: Moving Forward
• 28:02 Boundaries, Transparency, And Being Human
• 29:34 Telehealth, Safety, And Shared Space
• 31:40 Closing Reflections And Future Plans

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:01

Psychiatry has a gaslighting problem. People are told their pain is in their head and trauma survivors get dismissed or over medicated. But when we see the brain not as a diagnosis, but as a mirror to the soul, that's when healing finally begins. We are your whistleblowing shrinks, Dr. Terlin and Therapist Jet, and you have landed on the Geslet Truth Podcast. Before we crack this open, make sure you hit like, smash, subscribe. And if you're on YouTube, ring the bell so you don't miss a thing. And before we introduce our guest, Terry and I have to talk about something exciting that's coming up in December, on December 12th, we are going to be doing a live recording of our hundredth episode.

Speaker: 0:37

100.

Speaker 1: 0:38

100. We made it. We're going to have merch. So if you want to get some deep throating merch people, that home be there. I know people like it's so inappropriate. Don't you know shit about Watergate? Do you not know anything about Watergate? Come on. Let's just let's get it done. But we are recording our hundredth. We're going to be doing that live and local. So if you are interested, make sure that you follow everything we put out because we're going to be talking all about it.

Speaker: 1:04

That's right. Can't wait. 100. I cannot believe we made 100. But anyway, here we are. We did it. We did it.

Speaker 1: 1:09

We're getting better with every episode. So just so everyone knows, especially today with our guest today. No, I don't. All right, let's introduce our guest.

Speaker: 1:18

All right. Today's guest is a psychiatrist who wants people to know he doesn't live above the struggle. Dr. Hector has worked through his own trauma, burnout, and self-doubt. The same things he helps others heal. For years, he hid behind perfection because that's what the system rewards, but healing humbled him. Hector is both the doctor and the student of his work. He studies the brain because he's lived what happens when it's under pressure. And he's seen how compassion can rewire it. His mission now is to bring humanity back into mental health so we can stop seeing doctors as detached experts and start seeing them as fellow travelers on the same healing road. Welcome, Dr. Hector.

Speaker 2: 1:59

Thank you guys for having me. That was, I love that intro.

Speaker: 2:04

Well, that's good because you wrote it practically, but you should love your words there.

Speaker 1: 2:09

Yes. All right. So we we've got to ask you where to dive right into this, Dr. Hector. Tell us about your practice that you have now. And can you give us a little bit of information on that? Because I know this is a little bit newer of a space for you and where and and and how you got here and where you used to used to practice.

Speaker 2: 2:27

Nice. So so my new practice called the White Butterfly. And the name came from when I went to the Louvre probably already about five years ago or a little bit more. It was right before the pandemic. And I saw a statue of Cupid kissing a girl. Well, that girl is Psyche. She's also known as the White Butterfly. But the word psyche means soul. And then I dove more into it because I'm a big Greek mythology nerd. And that's where the word psychiatry comes from, which means the medical treatment of the soul. So I was like, whoa, well, that's amazing. That's gonna be the name of my practice. But the more I looked at how I practice and how I do psychiatry today, that's literally what I focus on. And without thinking about it, something that I've always been passionate about. Even since I was a fashion photographer, I would spend time getting to know the person that I was gonna photograph that day. I would spend a long time doing hair makeup, getting to know them, getting to see where they're coming from, you know, what were their struggles. And I mean, at that time I was a photographer, I was not practicing what I'm doing today. But looking back, I was like, crap, that's what I was doing. And kind of always trained to do that. But I love it. And that's what I'm doing today, trying to bring back the true essence of what psychiatry is. And it's treating the soul that has been hurt, um, has been hurt by people, has been hurt by culture, society, whatever it is, right? And and what I'm trying to do is bring the mental health care field and workers into that. That is the essence of what we do, what we're doing. And that's what I'm doing. And I used to work at Aming Clinics, if everyone knows Aming Clinics, very well known in a mental health care space for using spec scans. So spec scans gives us an in a little bit of information of what is the brain doing. And I focus a lot in the emotional brain, which is the limbic system, and maybe we'll talk into it, talk more about that in a little bit, but it's looking at specific patterns of trauma. And that was what I became more fascinated when it came to working with specs again. Is how is it that in a picture of uh you know neurological image, we can see trauma. And when I go into that with a patient, they they have a little bit of a freak out moment because it's like, how do you know that? I'm like, well, I'm looking at these patterns, these areas of the brain shouldn't light up. The way that they're lighting up, but more specifically, the pattern that it's creating. So uh it just took me even more and more into the soul and this person's soul that has been hurting for probably a long time. And it's really fascinating how we're able to do that with an image.

Speaker: 5:12

So you look at that image as if the the parts that lighting that are lit up are the soul pain, kind of, right? Like it, like you can see that that's what it is instead of looking at it from like a damage. Like, is that what I'm hearing you say? Like, so this is it's kind of like the soul crying, like this is where your soul is crying.

Speaker 2: 5:33

It is very obvious to see if.

Speaker: 5:35

Yes. What would somebody see in that? Like, what would be the obvious pieces of that? It I know it's hard to describe it because we don't have like an image in front of us, but if you could if you could try, that would be great.

Speaker 2: 5:46

Well, there's there's two patterns that I specialize in. And one of them is what we've always seen through, and I mean clean axe is very clear of it describing this pattern is a diamond pattern. And it looks like a diamond, the four areas that are lighting up, but it's actually three brain regions that light up in the shape of a diamond, and we see that and we automatically start investigating is there psychological or emotional trauma or abuse. So that's what that pattern symbolizes. And as a psychiatrist, when someone comes with to us and they're like, I have this symptom, this symptom, we get so focused in symptomatology and coming up, you know, spitting out at the end of the machine a DSM-5 diagnosis. And I've noticed that a lot of these patients, they had multiple diagnoses given. So then they come to you with even more confusion. Like, what is it that I am really struggling with? And I'm like, well, you have a trauma pattern that is telling me that you've experienced emotional abuse or or psychological abuse. But then there's another pattern in the back of the brain in the shape of a triangle, that now what lights up is the occipital lobe, which processes visual memories. So then that pattern is more something that I saw and that I witnessed. It could have been done to me or it could have been done to someone else, and I saw it, and it was traumatic enough to have this brain area just light up, which means overworked, right? This area is overworked and it's trying to always calm the person down or it's trying to suppress some kind of visual image. So that's the two patterns that I have fallen in love with. And I've had patients call me a a voodoo person, they've called me a mystic, a psychic, psychic. And I'm like, yeah, we hear the we hear that with the patterns. The EMDR lamb is voodoo. Exactly.

Speaker: 7:33

Yes.

Speaker 2: 7:36

You know, when they come to talk to us and explain to us what they've been suffering, I'm like, has anyone talked to you that you have this? And uh the immediate reaction is how do you know? I've never told anyone how did you know that this was there? Now, those are the population of people with trauma that actually know and identify the traumatic events. And there's a lot of other people that have blocked it. So then they their reaction is no. That's not me. I've never and then I have to go into the conversation of what is trauma? How does your nervous system record trauma? And one of the, you know, one of my biggest, you know, works is explaining and dissecting that what trauma is, because we only think of specific abuse as traumatic, and we miss the accumulated trauma, the psychological trauma, the gaslighting that occurs in some relationships, that we start normalizing this kind of trauma. So we see it as, no, I don't have a traumatic event. I've never had these things happen to me. And I'm like, well, let's dive a little deeper into your relationships.

Speaker: 8:44

I think also some people just don't realize that it's if they've lived in trauma pretty much the extent of their life, they don't know any different. So this is just normal life. I remember when I worked in the prison system, this was, I think, during practicum time. So this is still when I was a student trainee. I went into a group and the first question was, has anyone here experienced trauma? And like one person out of 15 raised their hands. And so then the clinician I was with was like going around, like, tell me about your childhood, tell me about your childhood. How did you get disciplined as a child or things like this? And one guy goes, Well no, when I was when I was bad, my dad would throw wrenches at my head.

Speaker 3: 9:25

Okay.

Speaker: 9:27

That seems normal. Like, right? Like, you know, so they just don't understand often what what they've been through is considered trauma and does impact your brain in that way. So sometimes I don't know it's always like they are blocking trauma. Sometimes I think they people don't realize that they've had traumatic experiences, especially when they're, you know, chronic and prolonged throughout their life, right? So they don't realize how that changes the brain.

Speaker 1: 9:53

Something that I think is really cool to piggy off what you're saying here, Terry, is what you do, Hector, or when you're just talking about these spec scans that are done and these it's imaging that is done. Okay. Like it's almost like this statement of if you don't test, you guess. Right. And so this is this to me is fascinating, almost like the idea of like, I don't know, tapping someone's spinal fluid to actually look at like how psychiatric drugs are influencing the body and whether or not there is a deficiency in something or not, right? Um, which as we know, there typically isn't. And these are the lies we've been told when it comes to like, you know, the serotonin theory and things like that. Okay. But you actually have some concrete evidence to see that there are areas of the brain that have that look different. They light up, they have been impacted, they have changed. And so much of our field, and I'm just chunking psychology, psychiatrist, I guess. No, it's all fucking. It's like just flip flip, you know, spin the wheel, see where it lands. It's like a rush Russian roulette of life. And there's 15 diagnoses on that wheel, and you're gonna come off with five of them from different providers, and there's no concrete evidence. There's no science behind it, even though people want to really believe that there is. Like, yes, I have bipolaride major depression, I have ADHD. I have, okay, well, show me all the science. Okay. So this is kind of really intriguing to me because there's something very concrete that we can see that's actually showing the areas of the brain that light up. Now, you also said something earlier about like survival. And I want to ask you about this. How are we wired to survive? Because that's that's a thing, right? Right.

Speaker 2: 12:11

And well, I think we get trained to survive since we were very little. And then going back a little bit into like, you know, how do we come up with a diagnosis? I think there's also a lot of pressure on clinicians that they have to diagnose with one visit. And is by the way, it's not always put by the way we were trained. Patients want that immediate response.

Speaker 3: 12:35

Well, so does it. Well, insurance does too.

Speaker 2: 12:38

Which we can spend, I think, a whole year series talking about how our healthcare system needs to be changed and rewired.

Speaker: 12:45

You can come back, we'll have that discussion later.

Speaker 2: 12:57

And I'm like, no, this organ is a lot more complex. And today we're seeing you, today we're we're analyzing your mental status, but tomorrow and in the next 30 minutes, something can completely change. So to say that I'm gonna go see a psychiatrist or psychologist, and in one visit, solve all the problems that I'm dealing with, that's just bogus, right? But that's the other pressure that we're giving clinicians, which is why then we have turned into this healthcare system that we spit out and we need to give a drug immediately because that's what is expected of us. It's the same pressure that any other, you know, person when I work in the in the fashion industry where they were pressured to come up with something immediately and be a genius immediately. And it's like, no, wait a minute. This is not that easy. So I think I think going back to a little bit what you're saying, Jen, was that you know, the system has also put clinicians in a spot uh being in corner of you need to come up with a solution right now and then. So what is the person gonna do in that moment also survive and like here's a pill, take this, right? When it's like, no, hold on, I'm on. This organ is a lot more complex, is changing constantly, it's adjusting constantly, and is always trying toward survival and mode. And that's why I'm saying, you know, when we are trained, right, our surroundings train us, our immediate situations train us, but it's all based on what has been our constant training throughout life to face these hard moments or stressful moments of making a decision right away. So I try to teach my patients all that. When you notice that you're in this corner of coming up with a solution or say something that is like right now, you need to use that second brain and take a few seconds to think about what to do. But if that system hasn't been trained appropriately, it's always gonna spit out the first thing that comes to mind. And it's usually not the smartest. So I think the same thing happens with all of us and individuals and our and our clients when they have been trained to survive no matter what is thrown at them. And let's face it, now more than ever, especially um we're talking in you know American, right? American culture has been pressured people little by little to spit out the most genius, the most amazing thing, the most amazing podcast that is going to whatever okay, hold on. Timeout, right? So it's almost like we are socially gaslighting each other to come up with the next amazing thing. And what we need to do is go back, look at what we know, reevaluate, and come up with something else. So that's the part of that. I'm trying to retrain my patience to let's get out of that immediate survival mode that you've been always trained to do. To let's take a few seconds, let's pause in our day, take a nap if you need to, because this is an exhausting process. Your brain will recollect and do it all by itself.

Speaker 1: 16:05

You did this, you did for you. You have a story behind this, don't you?

Speaker 3: 16:10

Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1: 16:11

Tell us I mean, I know you do because it's in the form you've called out, but you can't.

Speaker 2: 16:19

I used to be a teacher. So for me, it's like teach what I know.

Speaker: 16:23

Wait, you were a teacher and a fashion. What haven't you been? Yes. Like, seriously. Okay. Right? The pressure for perfection. Exactly.

Speaker 2: 16:34

I, you know, I'm I'm, you know, I'm a very good relationship with God, and I'm always like, God, take me to where I can help people with all the tools that you've given me and all the all the different environments that I've worked in. And I'm I'm a geek for learning and knowledge, which is probably why I went in that path. Well, in my mom's words, when I told her I was going to medical school, she goes, This is it, right? This is it. We're not changing another career.

Speaker 1: 16:58

Are you done?

Speaker 2: 17:00

I I blame my ADHD or my untreated ADHD.

Speaker 1: 17:03

That zoology degree isn't doing shit, Hector. Like, are you done? Really?

Speaker 2: 17:07

Like, you said that. Yes. But like, you know, when when I when I look at, you know, I'm Cuban. We came from Cuba when I was about nine years old. That was a traumatic experience for a night. Yes. We were talking about that the other day and with someone, and I was like, you know, I think I must have seen things that I shouldn't have seen. I don't remember them. Right? It was the transition of coming from Cuba to the US was different countries, and all of it was, you know, pro uh not programmed, but like organized by mafia in those countries. Was I leaving a regime that was like silencing all people and knowledge? Yeah. But the whole process was a traumatic event, right? It was a lot of stressors and a lot of things that a nine-year-old and my sister who was four at the time, a four-year-old shouldn't be exposed to. But because of the circumstances to survive, my parents took us through that. And that's another thing that I talk about with my patients. Listen, I think moms are not the evil person here. I think there's a big talk in social media and mental health that mom is the villain. No, Disney teaches us that, but no.

Speaker: 18:16

That's stepmoms, really. Stepmoms in Disney. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: 18:23

Yes. No, I think they tried to do what they could with what they had. I agree. It was different understanding, different knowledge. And the moms of today in 20 years are going to be, you know, pointed the finger at for whatever they're doing today. No, no, no. That that, in my opinion, needs to stop. I think moms have done and are doing still today the best that they could. Because being a mom is a not a curse, but a really difficult job.

Speaker 1: 18:50

Oh, yeah, no, it can be a curse, for sure.

Speaker 2: 18:52

Oh, I can curse.

Speaker 1: 18:53

You can say that. You can curse. A fucking hard job. Yes. Fucking terrible.

Speaker 2: 19:03

That's just a little parentheses have to say about that converter, that topic. Does it also being gaslit to be this perfect mom?

Speaker: 19:09

No, I think it's a great topic. I I think it's a great topic, especially in today's social media world with cutting out moms, you know, calling moms toxic, all this stuff. And make no mistake, there are some moms that are not great, right? There's a lot of that. But I agree with the, you know, generational pieces. Like we constantly are evaluating, you know, reduced harm. Like, so what would be worse staying in Cuba or having my kids go through this thing, right? So, and that's that's those are decisions. Those are hard, hard, hard decisions that either way, you know, the outcome is not going to be good. But what is the least harmful? Right. So that type of thing is a constant evaluation in mom world, right?

Speaker 2: 19:59

But I would say that during that transition, even though it was difficult for me, I have moments where she would like memories that I try not to tap into, but memories my mom says, look the other way, or look over there. I literally have those moments in my memory. So I'm sure there were things that she saw that I shouldn't have seen.

Speaker: 20:17

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 20:18

That maybe I did one of these because I was like, wait, what does she not want me to see? Right. Right. Like I those memories are very vivid in my mind, right? So going back to the things that I experienced, those were difficult times for a nine-year-old. But then in other times in my career, in my life, I also experienced difficult situations that I always saw my mom tap in and protect me by choosing which one is worse, right? Yep. The best that she could. So I'm a big fan of what I call alpha females. I've always been surrounded by alpha females. I think that has catapulted me to do all the things that I've been able to do because they've been cheering me on to like go and do it. Why not? We could do that. Right. Right. Right. So I try to do that today with my patients. Now I'm not an alpha female, but I try to teach them, hey, you can do this too. Is it going to be difficult? Of course it's going to be difficult. But we got to get you out of this trauma hole that we're in of just revisiting the the situation and not separating your psyche, your soul from that environment, from that, from that memory. So I try to copy that behavior. So what I'm doing today, the only thing I'm doing is all these things that I've learned throughout those different industries that I've worked in, is applying it in psychiatry. And the more I I talk about collaboration so much with my with my providers, other providers, and I'm like, why are we not doing this? Why are you surprised that you're getting a call from a psychiatrist that wants to talk to you about a mutual patient? Right. As a fashion photographer, we would have extensive meetings to plan a photo shoot. But this is a person, this is a human being. Why are we not meeting and collaborating like for real? Like for real collaborating. Yeah. That let's face it, we don't have to spend hours talking about the client. We can talk in 10, 15 minutes. That's going to be the amount of time that I block. Because I know you're busy too. But we can spend five or ten minutes in my day and discuss this client together. So what I'm going to try to do is let me get all these I don't know, tactics or processes that were happening in other industries and applying them in mental health because it needs it. Mental health has to change the way we're doing it. The other day I was talking to a therapist who's very well known in South Florida. At the time I didn't know who she was. I was just telling her all my views. And then someone was like, you told so-and-so all of that. And I yeah, if that's change everything you've learned. Or even on the side. You gotta be more creative because the generation today, and and I'm not just saying younger generation, I think any generation that you're in, but living in this time today is a very stressful, demanding time for everyone. So everything we've learned in school has to stay there. And we need to kind of open up our creativity and change the way we're doing mental health. It has to.

Speaker: 23:10

I agree 100%. And I want to circle back to the conversation about collaboration for just one second. Because I we're not psychiatrists, right? We are we are psychotherapists by trade. Do you know how many psychiatrists I have tried to collaborate with and they never respond? Or the the funniest one that I had recently was they refused a telephone call, but said that they would entertain, entertain.

Speaker 2: 23:39

Use the word entertaining.

Speaker: 23:41

Entertain an email. That's the word they said to the client. Entertain an email.

Speaker 1: 23:46

And that sounds like, well, that's our entertainment, you know? Yeah. That's that's yeah, that's that's the norm for us. It's very siloed, is the word we often use. Like all the professions are extremely siloed in that way.

Speaker: 23:57

We're supposed to collaborate, but I think it's just the collaborate, send them to psychiatry to get medication collaboration. That's it. That's not collaboration. It's not at all.

Speaker 2: 24:07

That's just here. Go buy a banana, the store.

Speaker: 24:11

I know they're good there. Right. Exactly. How would you envision collaboration really looking like in an ideal circumstance for a client that you have? Like what would ideally be a collaboration effort? I do them today.

Speaker 2: 24:27

I have quick 10, 15-minute Zoom calls with, and sometimes there's all of us on the same call. I'll have a neurologist, I'll have their primary care doctor, I'll have their endocrinologist if it's applicable, their therapist for sure. And we're on a on a call. If we look at things like and again, I look at the fashion industry because I lived in it so much, and they will spend countless hours preparing the collection. Countless hours in detail of coming up with should we put the buttons here or here?

Speaker: 25:01

Right.

Speaker 2: 25:03

This is a human being. Why are we not spending a few minutes in the day to let's work together, get the best minds that this person has working on them together? Come on. Like and when I wonder in our industry, I'm like, oh my God, why are we not doing all of that? And guess what? They're winning in their industry. That's true. That's true. And and then let's say for a moment that we're in this industry for the money. Clearly, we're doing that wrong to them.

Speaker: 25:32

We are, yes, for sure. I agree with that too.

Speaker 2: 25:34

Yep. Because people who spent mil uh thousands of dollars. Have you seen that little tiny purse that Louis Vuitton made?

Speaker: 25:40

Yes. I did see that the other day. Yes. How much is that thing? I don't even know.

Speaker 2: 25:45

And people are gonna, without thinking, go and buy it because the branding is perfect. Because how they chose all the details of that tiny purse or whatever the heck they're gonna make next, they spend so much time collaborating and they are making a thousand dollars. And patients, our patients, are going and running and buying it or adolescent, or I wish I had that. Why are we not copying that way of doing business or doing the industry or doing that job and doing and what we're doing, which is saving people's lives?

Speaker: 26:52

I don't know.

Speaker 2: 26:53

But you see, do you see the like?

Speaker: 26:57

No, because I just did a post on this on social media the other day.

Speaker 2: 27:00

If you know, and then they post random thing on social media. Yeah. I don't know. When people are like, I want to hear about this brain of mine and this organ, which is a lot more valuable than that $36,000 purse.

Speaker: 27:15

I do think that there is a segment of the population that is in that space finally. I think it's taken a long time to get there, having practiced myself for like 20 years, right? So it earlier on it there wasn't that amount of curiosity. I do credit social media for for that one thing for allowing people to be a little more curious and wanting more or something different from their mental health providers than than traditional. There still is obviously a larger group of people that want traditional. Like if A, then that means I'm B and I get C as the response for that. Like, you know, and I think that's that's the, you know, psychiatry is in peril with that. Like the idea that they can solve everything with one medication. You know, here's a pill for you. But that has also been the such the standard of care that that's what clients expect, right? Like the expectation is I'm gonna resolve or solve this issue that I have that is a deep-seated issue with a pill. And that, and when that doesn't work, then whose fault is it? It's the it's the psychiatrist's fault or the the therapist's fault who couldn't break through the barrier of your being over medicated, right? So, because when clients are medicated, it is very hard to get to the emotional pieces of their brain when the meds literally stop that from happening. Yeah. But, you know, I I think we we are such a quick fix society. We want the simple, fast approach to a problem that has existed for 20 years in your life, right? Or more, you know, or in some cases 50 years or whatever. But we want the the solution today and right now because I'm standing in front of you. And when you say, well, this is gonna take a long time to unwind, like, oh, I don't have a long time, or I don't have the motivation to do all those things, or maybe I don't want to, you know, maybe I I want to live in this oblivion state. But I agree with you 100% that we need to rebrand mental health care, essentially, and and look to other people and their work to do it. So I don't know.

Speaker 2: 29:29

And and you mentioned something, and maybe to finish on the topic of collaboration, like if I know that my therapist is gonna go and dive in into this EMDR session with someone, I gotta remove anything that's gonna block that person from happening.

Speaker 1: 29:44

Right, right.

Speaker 2: 29:44

And then I gotta look for options in case you get triggered or you get way too stimulated, but they're not gonna block your ability or your therapist's ability to go there with you. So that's where I'm like, okay, if you're gonna change anything and I've told that to a therapist, and they look at me like, Really? You want me to you want me to tell you that stuff? I'm like, yeah, I want to go where your plan is, where are you gonna go to next so I can prep him or him or her to go and do that with you? This is the collaboration part. We're gonna talk today. Because when I introduced myself and the first time we meet, I'm like, we're gonna talk today, but I need to continue talking to you as we're working on this patient together. And I use that analogy of the fashion industry. I'm like, they're preparing today, next year's season. Because then we're gonna see the the harvest that we're gonna pick up. So, yeah, of course I gotta talk to you. And and then you gotta be telling me what you're going so then I can assess. But the other thing that occurs is especially mental health, by working together, I've seen this so many times, the person gets better much faster. Because the problem that you therapists are dealing with in the moment, they're like, How am I gonna do this? For me, it's like, oh, that's so easy. Put him on a low-dose GABA. Great. Collaboration. And for me as a psychiatrist, where I'm gonna go to next with my patient, I need you to tell me that you're working towards their pornography addiction. Oh crap, you are? Okay, he's gonna start wanting dopamine very soon. So let me give him some tyrosine to increase that dopamine drive. That's gonna be so easy for you to go through that.

unknown: 31:13

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker: 31:16

Oh, pharma gabba is so wonderful. I can have bottles right here, we're just saying. Yes. So Gabby wants you more now. You didn't even talk about it. Yes. It well, and the idea that, you know, Jen and I knew what GABA and Tyrosine are and do, and you just supported all of that. For our listeners, those are supplements. They are not prescription medications. So not guys.

Speaker 1: 31:40

We're talking aminos here and Gary and I are. We've talked a little bit about these, but this is this is the non-traditional therapy shit we do. This is what we this is our norm. Like we threw the whole educational stuff out the door.

Speaker: 31:53

But man, just in in a quick world to be able to collaborate with uh a psychiatrist like you would have been amazing for so many of my clients. And I and I I'm postul I'm have a hypothesis here because you're a psychiatrist, it's probably easier for you to tell people let's collaborate. And they're like, Yeah, yeah, let's collaborate, versus a therapist going, I need to get this doctor and this doctor and this doctor and this doctor all in a Zoom call.

Speaker 1: 32:19

They're gonna be like, Yeah, yeah, I get turned down all.

Speaker 2: 32:22

You gotta, you gotta, you gotta leave your ego at the door. I'm not any better than the rest of the team that is working with the patient. If I do it by myself, I'm not gonna get anywhere.

Speaker 1: 32:35

You led right into the next question, Hector. I need to read something for everybody that you put in in a the form to us. You said, I want people to know that being a psychiatrist doesn't mean I live above the struggle. I've had to work through my own trauma and burnout, hiding behind the professionalism and the perfection that the system rewards. Okay. That's a very powerful line right there. Like when you check your ego at the door, you have the ability to humble yourself. And that is so effective, even personally for somebody, but for patient care.

Speaker 2: 33:12

I I had a COO at Amy Clinic, I I was just a really good friend of mine. When I told her that I changed my shirt depending on who I'm gonna see, and I legit have a little closet here with different shirts. And she was like, Wait, what? And like, yeah. Because I valued my connection with a person that is in front of me. I need them to feel safe with me. We're gonna talk about their deep-rooted wounds in her soul. She needs to feel safe and protected, and that I am not gonna go out there and spill the beans so she can spill the beans with me. Number one. So, do I need to change my appearance? Change my appearance? That's another thing I steal from the fashion industry, of course.

Speaker 1: 33:56

I did my bad idea. This was my master's thesis, and everybody. Was it really? Yeah, what was it? Oh my gosh. That's exactly what it was about. Was people's responses to based on like hair, makeup, clothing, and but there's a science behind that.

Speaker 2: 34:12

There is. So why am I not doing that? Of course I'm gonna do it. And as a fashion photographer, of course I'm gonna change. Because I had my muse that anywhere I put any kind of style I did for her, she would just change and give a different message in the photo. She's not even speaking. So of course I value appearance. And I'm sorry, you would be an ignorant to say that valuing appearance is not important. Oh, I agree. Of people in mental health that I'm supposed to look, you know, smart, intelligent. I'm not gonna change my appearance. No, you need to change your appearance because that person in front of you might or might not connect with you just by the way you look.

unknown: 34:46

Yep.

Speaker: 34:46

I agree. Conversely, hold on. Conversely, therapists get the ideas that you can look, this is gonna sound terrible, frumpy and not put together, and that's okay for all clients. And I'm like, that is not okay for all clients. Not at all. And it's funny that you say this because I have not I haven't changed in between sessions, but I have certainly looked at what I call my lineup for the day. Like, who do I have today? And then I'll dress accordingly. Like I'll be like, oh yeah, most of them are 22-year-old college students. They're not gonna care if I wear a football shirt, you know, or something a little more, you know, casual versus, you know, wearing the traditional therapy garb, right?

Speaker 2: 35:26

So we all judge the person the minute we see them. So of course the patient. And for me, what I care is I want connection. I want that connection to occur and the trust to occur and it has to happen quickly. So yeah, my appearance matters. So looking at how we're giving those kinds of messages, I think is is crucial. So yeah, I I value that tremendously.

Speaker: 35:51

When you first started in psychiatry, did you start in a I'm well, most of us do start in a very traditional setting with our education, of course. But did you start with a mindset that this is gonna be different than traditional, or did you work your way into that difference? I was Because not everybody starts with aim in clinics. Like not everybody goes, like that's a very different, yes, yes. Go ahead.

Speaker 2: 36:17

Well, I started there right after residency. And where I was gonna go for was, you know, we talked about how we are, you know, valued or put value in us depending on where we went and where we worked, right? Or better yet, where we trained, right? And I trained in a very small hospital in South Florida. They only do mainly, they only do psychiatry. Their psychiatry department is their moneymaker, is what gets in through the door. But because it was a new program and the program director was younger, I think he allowed me to do more of my own reigns and like doing and do my own thing. So I was never cornered to be a certain way or to act a certain way to get that instant reward, right? But when I look at some of my counterparts who studied at Yale, studied at Johns Hopkins, they did their that those were big names to go and graduate out of. They would see me as like, oh, you went to Larkin. That's like that little hospital in South Florida. I'm like, yeah, that's where I match. And I'm so glad God put me there because they allowed me to do whatever I want with these kinds of things that I'm telling you. Yeah. So I was never put, I was never told no, don't do that. It was more of like, try. Yeah. And I think in other bigger educational systems, they would totally do that whole like, no, we're gonna reward the grumpy looking, you know, resident. That that means they're more intelligent. That means they know the psychopharmacology. That means they're gonna succeed. And honestly, no, they don't. They don't connect with anyone. Yeah. They can't because they don't know how to be a chameleon. And in this industry, you have to be a little bit of a chameleon. Keep your knowledge and not by no means undermining knowledge and and graduating from a really good school. But that needs to just kind of be there. That needs to just be a little checkbox of like, okay, that's my base. I need to know that. But from there, from that little tiny hospital that I was chief two years in a row, because I think they went with all my crazy ideas. But I gather the truths. I gather all the all the residents, and and I was rewarded for being the ugly duckly. I was telling that to one of my friends the other day. I was like, we need to start focusing on that person that has been marginalized because they're the ones that are gonna change things. So from there, I was blessed to start working with Daniel Aidman for that place. I know it kind of was a big Yeah. But really, I can't like, you know, I cannot credit enough that program. And later, ironically, I was contacted by bigger programs in South Florida for me to go to their program. And I was like, no, I'm gonna stay here. They're allowing me to do all these things, and now I get to do it that I'm out and I'm practicing. But they were they were never telling me no. No. So I always looked for copy and paste of what my mom did to me. Oh, you want to do a fashion photograph? Okay, go. We got you. Oh, you want to get a master's in theology? Okay, hey, we'll got you.

Speaker: 39:35

Not without the eye roll, but we got you, sure.

Speaker 2: 39:38

That's what you said, medical school. This is it, right?

Speaker: 39:40

Yeah. Exactly.

Speaker 2: 39:43

I'm like, yeah, this is it.

Speaker: 39:44

This is it. Oh, those are famous last words, aren't they? They just really are. Yeah. Yes. That's an interesting.

Speaker 2: 39:53

The being creative. Yeah. Um, and our creativity issue of our magazine, that's what I talk about the most. Because people that have been marginalized have had to tap into their creativity to survive. But once they're out of that survival mode, what I try to do is pump in more of that creativity for them not to survive, and I don't want to sound cliche, but to thrive in the environment that they're in. No matter where I put them. I take them out of this environment, put them in this other one, and they'll succeed there too. So that's where we need to change the way we're doing mental health. I think we're so narrowed minded and focused on the pathology that we keep them there. And I think it's because we've been trained, us mental health co-workers, to keep the person there, maybe at a subconscious level. I don't know. This is a big uh question in my mind, has always been. You know, you know. And more of like, let me give you all the tools that I have even learned in my personal life. And that's where that the taking off the white coat thing happens. Where this is what I have learned. I have been successful in this area. Go and do it. Yeah. We're gonna take care of the insomnia, the depression symptoms, like what I call the drama, right? The theme that is right now that it doesn't let me move forward. We're gonna take care of that. But now I want you to move forward and grow and have resilience in no matter what place I life puts you. That's what I try to do. And in the big scheme, a scheming psychiatrist. Well, we what I'm trying to do. Yeah. And I tell that to my patients the minute I meet them, you know? I'm like, we're gonna take care of the drama. Don't worry about it. The aggression, the random irritability, we're gonna take care of that, right? But I want you to succeed in anywhere I put you, and that's called resilience.

Speaker: 41:45

I love resilience. And I also, you know, it makes me think about the creativity that you had as a fashion photographer, because that's really tapping into your creative brain, right? And I've also found in in my world that when I get overwhelmed or burnt out or whatever, then I'm like, I gotta tap into some creativity here somewhere, or I'm gonna be stuck in this side of the brain or this area of the brain that is just dragging me, you know, to the depths, right? So then I have to slowly tap into some creativity and things to get me out. And it to me, it makes sense that you went through such a traumatic thing in childhood, and then you ended up tapping into wildly creative things as almost a way out, right? Of that traumatic thing. So I think we underestimate creativity in healing, period, and creativity in humanity. And so I always think about like pleasure too, like pleasure, creativity, all those things are traded off for being stuck. And I think the messaging in mental health often is just similar to addiction. Once an addict, always an addict, you know. Once you have PTSD, there's no way out from here except managing your symptoms, right? Once you're depressed, you're always gonna be depressed. Once you've got this, it's all it's like a death sentence, right? And I think that is what needs to be. Like you're broken. Like you're broken and you're always gonna be broken, and all we can do is like put band-aids on your brokenness, and that's how you're gonna live your life. And that has nothing to do with resiliency, zero.

Speaker 2: 43:25

And I think when we do that, we just unplug the hope cable.

Speaker 3: 43:29

Yes, correct.

Speaker 2: 43:31

Like, yes, no hope for you. We are damaged. I used yesterday with one of my patients, we were talking about this, and I said, listen, this is a process. This is like cancer. Cancer can come and go. My dad finished his chemo, cancer's gone. Maybe it comes out later, but maybe not. So let's focus on the right now, on healing this drama that I call it. Right? All the problems, all the things that you're seeing as a problematic, but you're not broken. This was done to you. In this case, it was a trauma event. This was done to you, you didn't cause it on yourself. As much as the world and social media and other people is telling you that it did. No, it did not. It happened to you.

Speaker 3: 44:14

Yes.

Speaker 2: 44:14

Now we gotta get out of it. And we have the mental capacity, because we've been giving a beautiful organ that is creative. So we have to tuck into our creativity to get out of it. And that goes towards healing. That's why those are the main themes of our of our magazine. We have creativity, another one that's my favorite is humor. Humor is medicine, man. Like, why are you not laughing with your patients and cracking a joke? That's how sometimes we're all the time is what they're laughing. They're laughing appropriately to the joke, too.

Speaker 1: 44:46

If any of my clients are listening to this, they're like, oh, yep. Like two-thirds of the hour is me saying stupid shit and I'd laugh.

Speaker 2: 44:55

Yes. I mean look at the science of humor. When you laugh, cortisol goes down because oxytocin goes up. Yep. Our bond gets stronger. And what is that anyone has experienced trauma deal with is bonding. Because bonding, the idea of bonding with someone or trusting another person has been broken. Right.

unknown: 45:19

Yes.

Speaker 2: 45:20

So now we gotta rebuild that. Isn't that just common sense? In my mind, it's common sense.

Speaker 1: 45:24

Like can we teach our patients to laugh and enjoy the pleasure? That then send the signals through the brain to produce that uh it's all it's you know, it's science. It's real simple. It is it's obvious science too, right? Like it's very obvious.

Speaker: 45:41

It's very obvious, which is also it's funny to me because like on the Gaslet Truth Podcast, we've had people that will email us and be like, your laughter is inappropriate to these heavy topics. And I'm like, can you imagine just being low and dark and all the time? All the time.

Speaker 2: 46:01

That message gets absorbed by the audience.

Speaker: 46:04

Yes.

Speaker 2: 46:05

You know, I interviewed a DJ for our connection issue, and he was telling me how we use music to get people to go buy a drink. A certain time in the in the song will change it to attract more people towards the stage. That low. I remember back in the 90s. So if I want you to laugh and bring down your cortisol, yes, these are heavy topics. I'm not undermining the depth and the and but I cannot be giving that back to you.

Speaker 1: 46:34

No, not at all. We we can't. No, no. And people will mirror that, people absorb that, people take that. It's exactly again, it's like psychology 101. It's real simple. I'm glad you said that. We do, right? It's it's because it's there.

Speaker 2: 46:52

And I think for whatever reason, we have even gone away from what we were taught in 101.

Speaker 1: 47:01

Right. Some of this applies. It's totally applicable across the board. Like it really truly is.

Speaker: 47:07

Well, I think there's a there's a weird thing on social media right now that therapists all they do is sit in someone's pain with them all the time. And I'm like, of course, yes, we do, but there's way more to it than that than just sitting and validating someone's pain incessantly over and over, keeping them in that low state of being all the time, right? So there's so much more in a therapist's office space, whatever it is, that they can bring to the table to help actually reattach people to humanity and their own, their own version of humanity, which is a broad range of emotions, not just like the low-level emotional state that they have. I think we forget about all of that, that there are more emotions to experience, and there's a huge range of that. So emotions are not bad. No, none of them.

Speaker 2: 48:04

No, they all tell us that it's not a bad emotion. It's an emotion. Right. Yes.

Speaker 3: 48:09

Mm-hmm. Yes.

Speaker 2: 48:10

So it's this categorization of emotions or categorizations of traumas that it's like, no, why no? No, time out. I literally felt it in that moment. Now, what you do with that emotion is what matters because then you don't want to be hurting yourself or hurting other people with that emotion.

Speaker: 48:28

Right.

Speaker 2: 48:28

Right. But I think that is so missed in in mental health. And that's where why I said about I think there are some clinicians that stay and try to and and and I'm I'm I want to say in a subconscious level, keep the person there. But I'm always applauding those that are not like, okay, this is we're here. Now let's get let's get us out of here. But we have to reflect that too. Yes, 100%. We need to walk alongside with them, but get them out of that that situation. And that a lot of times means we have to reflect our own emotions, have them in check. And and yes, you also have days that we come in, they're like, I'm so exhausted, I'm so tired. Something happened in my life that I am drained, you know, and I have moved patients around like they can't see me like that because they will decompensate. I mean, just if I look like this, they're like, oh, there's something wrong right here. Right. Yeah. I need to, but I also can't fake it. So there's been moments where I'm like, you know what? Well then let's reschedule for maybe a little bit later in the day, because right now, right, I got this news and I need to I need to do my own mental health check.

Speaker 1: 49:35

Yes. Right. We can be transparent in that way with our patients. Like it's really, it's really fucking okay. Like we were taught that that's like there's this hard and fast line, but that hard and fast line accounts for nothing with subjective humanity at all. It's it's it makes no sense. Those are the parts of the indoctrination that we learned that actually are not making sense at all in practice for us. No, we we need to be able to do that. So to our patient, it's it's it's it's a it's a mutual relationship there. So I'm really glad that you said that. And I know we are as we wrap up, I think that that's something really important for people to remember, especially clinicians, like to learn.

Speaker: 50:11

Have a huge I you know, I wish I knew that. Eight years ago when my dad died, I I was in private practice and I knew he was dying, right? We knew it was happening, and I got the message in between clients. And stupid me, I checked my phone in between clients and it was a whole thing. Anyway, so what did I do? I freaking went and got the next client. Like shut myself down. I what I should have done is recognize that I needed some time, but I felt so pressured that they had been sitting in the lobby waiting for me, blah, blah, blah, all this stuff. But I these are still things that I learn daily, right? That it is okay for me to also be human and you know, be tired or be certain ways. And it's also okay for me to say no when I'm not in a space of actually being helpful, right? So yeah, that would be.

Speaker 2: 51:15

They do.

Speaker 1: 51:16

And they do always ever time. Yep, they do time.

Speaker 2: 51:20

Because they they know and you've always said to them, and and I always do the vision, like, you know, I am same as you, right? We're going with our own struggles. We're still working through them, but we're gonna do them together. Yes. That's the part of connection and community that needs to truly happen, is we need to bring down our guard and and let them see that we're the same, we're humans. And and I'm always preaching that to my patients. So when they see that my allergies and I'm crying, my allergies are horrible, they're like, Rodriguez, you still have your allergies? I'm like, Oh my gosh, yes, I do. Sorry, I'm not crying, you know? Um, and they get it, you know. But it's the the connection, and guess what? Those are the patients that are doing the best because they see that I brought down my card. They see that I'm giving them all that I that I have because I do treat my patients like my family. I don't care what is being taught, any medical student, any psychology student out there, that is not true. Do not do do not practice like that. Okay. One of the best like things that I've been told by another doctor, teacher of mine, and he was actually an OBGYN, said you gotta treat that person in front of you, like if that's your sister, your brother, because if you have that mindset, you're gonna do anything and flip over any rock to figure it out. To figure out the result. Yes. You you'll work just as hard as they will. They do. You gotta bring down, leave it you at the door. Like you gotta you gotta shake it off and and and be human and real with your patients. So then, and honestly, they get better faster. So even if I have a therapeutic tool, they get better faster at because those two nervous systems got connected and they're gonna trust each other. And my patient's gonna be a lot more compliant than yours because I did that. You need to do it too. That's all that's all I I say, you know? Do it too. What's the big deal? Let them know that that you're struggling for take a few minutes of your day and share them with them.

unknown: 53:17

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 53:18

Yeah, you're asking your patient to do it. You're asking your patient to be vulnerable as fuck. Right. You just take a hot second. Right. Like exactly. 101. It is again like I failed like 101. I had to take it twice, but I'm fine. I made it everybody. I I I have been practicing great. 15 years all good.

Speaker: 53:38

I and I also want to point out, because I I think that you made reference to your you do telehealth, right? Are you are you a telehealth pro are you a telehealth only provider? No? No, you do in person and telehealth.

Speaker 2: 53:50

I tell my patients whichever way you want to.

Speaker: 53:52

Oh, okay. So what I want to bring in about the telehealth conversation quickly is that when you as a clinician do all these things, like you can still establish that connection through telehealth. Like it's it's not that hard. And as a matter of fact, as a clinician, it's easier to change your shirt in between sessions if you're at home near your closet.

unknown: 54:15

Yes.

Speaker 2: 54:16

And one thing that I have noticed was when I do telehealth versus in person, the person walks into the door and they're already acting. Because they're in a different environment. That's right. I took them out of their cocoon, right? And and they want to feel safe in their cocoon. Sometimes it's good to do that. I have a patient that came from Panama to see me the other day. And I have my patients from Mexico that come to see me in person. Because they're like, no, I want to see you in person this time. I go, come for it. But the the telehealth thing, the magic that I think telehealth did, and I would credit COVID. And we hate COVID. I was changing it was a big traumatic event, but it did a lot of positive, I think, in the way that we practice today. And what I'm referring to is when we're in our own space, we're more likely to share. We're more likely to open up if I'm curled up in my bed and I'm just talking to someone on the phone. You know, in some parts, I'm like, that's not connection. But for someone who's really struggling and is in a really in that in that hole of hurting, they don't want to come out. Okay, well, we go to them. Well, this is a great way to go to them.

Speaker: 55:19

Yes. Well, I agree. And also teaching them how to be safe and comfortable in their surroundings because one hour with me serving them coffee and tea and you know making them all cozy and comfy isn't going to change when they go home and they don't feel that way. Right. And so being able to have all the strategies or figuring out what your strategies are in your own environment, I think is really important too. So yeah. And being able to have like your seven schnauzers next to you if you need to.

Speaker 2: 55:47

I bring them sometimes when for some reason one of them notices when I'm with someone new and she's crashing the door because she wants to come to the back. And I don't know what's happening with her brain. But I'm like, how do you know I say you?

Speaker: 56:00

That's funny. Well, I'll tell you, normally my dog Linus is in the back. You can see him in any of my social media videos too. But when I see clients, Linus is right behind me. And I will tell you that all my clients know Linus and they're like, hi Linus, even though I have earbuds in, they're talking to Linus. Linus cannot hear him.

Speaker 1: 56:20

My clients did the same thing with Humphrey. He's always in the back and they're hi Humphrey. I'm like, I can't hear you guys. Like you're in my ears, but they just have to talk.

Speaker 2: 56:28

But isn't it magical though, too, that we can also let them into our space a little bit.

Speaker: 56:33

Exactly. That is the point. That they think that they have some type of access into our home too. And they do, because this is my this is my house, right? So yeah. So I think there's a there's a lot of really good things about telehealth that have happened. And yeah, and I I really enjoyed this conversation.

Speaker 1: 56:51

So thank you for coming on the show, Dr. Hector. It's great to have you. I wish you were like right next to us so we could just come bust into your building and just say hi. That's really what I wish we could do.

Speaker 2: 57:02

That would be cool.

Speaker 1: 57:04

We run in me welcome. I'll be teaching your back yet.

Speaker: 57:07

Yeah, I stay on the Gulf side of Florida more than the Miami side. So that would be a little tough. But you know, alligator alley is a thing. So yeah, anyhow.

Speaker 1: 57:15

Well, if you guys have stayed this long, we are the Gas the Truth podcast. Thank you, Hector, again, for coming on the show. It's been fantastic. And for those of you that are listening, please make sure that you go ahead or subscribe to us on YouTube, give us all the stars, and we look forward to you coming on the show. You might have to come back, Hector. Yeah, let me know.

Speaker: 57:35

This is super fun. All right, awesome.

Speaker 1: 57:37

All right. Well, thanks, everybody.