34. Austin J Karr on Quitting Alcohol, Finding Happiness, and Unpacking the Industry’s REAL Agendas

In this raw and revealing conversation, Austin J Karr opens up about his journey to sobriety — and what he discovered along the way that changed everything. From navigating the personal highs and lows of quitting alcohol to uncovering the not-so-hidden agendas behind the alcohol industry, Austin shares the truths most people don’t talk about. This episode is about more than just getting sober — it’s about reclaiming happiness, challenging cultural conditioning, and asking the big question: who profits from our pain?

Whether you're sober-curious, questioning your relationship with alcohol, or just ready for a wake-up call, this one's for you.

What We Dive Into:
– Austin’s personal journey to sobriety and what finally made it stick
– The surprising truth about happiness in early recovery
– Why focusing on positivity can change everything
– The role of the alcohol industry in shaping public perception
– How marketing targets young people (and why it works)
– The rise of "mommy wine culture" and alcohol normalization
– What non-alcoholic drink brands are really doing behind the scenes
– The importance of policy, pricing, and advertising in alcohol consumption
– How Austin helps others build a life they don’t want to escape from

Resources Mentioned:

Austin's Instagram

Austin's TikTok

AustinJKarr.com

Paying the Tab - Book

Connect with AF Superpowers:

•  Website 
•  Instagram

Transcript

Jennifer (00:26)
so tell me your story and then what you're doing and then, you know, like I said, maybe we'll have to do a couple episodes on this industry thing because

Austin (00:34)
Yeah,

that would be really fun. Well, I'll tell you my story briefly because obviously like everybody's, it's a long drawn out story. but I got sober in 2015. I my last drink January of 2015. So just celebrated 10 years in January and it w it's been one of those interesting journeys through recovery. So I have the, my addiction started when I was in college. like

I like so many people, like you've got kind of two options, right? You've got like your early teens or you've got college. Like those are your options for really developing a good addiction. And then, or maybe a little, like some people come to it later, but mine was definitely in college. 19 years old, had my, what I think of as my first drink. I don't honestly know if I had anything before that. I don't remember very clearly. I did not have anything memorable before that, but first weekend in college and had just a great weekend. And I think that,

that moment in time, both, you know, developmentally for me, being away from home for kind of the first time, and finding this substance that turned off a lot of the worry and concerns that I had in my life just led to this perfect storm of continuing. And so when all my friends and I graduated from college and they all went on to have jobs and

families and everything else. I just kept drinking. I also got jobs and had a family and did all of those things, but this, everything was kind of like alcohol centric, right? There was just this somehow gravity to alcohol that was different than it was for other people. And I knew for a really long time that I would have to quit. I mean, I think I knew from the time I was 24 that I would have to quit and I didn't quit until I was 34. I spent this

decade of my life really kind of lost in addiction and confusion. And then in January of 2015, my family came to me and said, it's time to get sober. You need to do something different. We're worried about you. And I was worried about myself too. And so I agreed to do something different. I agreed to do a hundred days. I said I would get sober for a hundred days. And then I was going to decide what I was going to do after that. And I knew what the decision was going to be. I was going to start drinking again.

Like that was the plan. The plan was not to get sober. The plan was to do a hundred days. And then on day 101, my wife asked me what I was going to do. And I said, I think I'll do another hundred days. And I've just been kept doing my life. Got better. Not everything got better. I got fired from my job. My car broke down. Like in that a hundred days was not awesome. Life did not just like turn around magically. Everything's awesome. It definitely was a hard hundred days, but it got enough better that I could.

say, I think that this is the path I want to be on. But I never committed to being sober forever. I never thought that's what I wanted to do. And so I've just really worked the last 10 years on building this life that I love. And then a few years ago, my therapist asked me, we had just been going around this like success and striving and like, I felt like we were having the same conversation over and over and that's my fault, not hers. But we...

She asked me if I knew what happiness was. Do you even know what happiness is? And I was so taken aback by that conversation. That was several years ago. And I started this process of like, what is happiness? What does it mean to be happy? How can I cultivate it in my life? And I meandered around that for a while until honestly, 18 months ago, I was on another podcast and the host asked me, Austin, you're coming up on, you know, is it almost eight years sober? And he was like, are you happy?

I was like, I think I'm content, but I don't know that I know what happiness is. And that has been the last 18 months of my life, trying to really truly understand happiness and how we can help other people find it. And what I have started to believe as a coach in this space is that we need to cultivate happiness really early in our recovery. think often we kind of say,

Okay, well I'm going to get sober and then later I'll be, got to struggle right now. I got to suffer through right now. And what we need to do is really start paying attention to the good things that are happening. Those glimmer moments, those moments of joy, because that makes getting and staying sober so much easier. And so as a coach, that's what I focus on. I focus on sobriety and happiness and the way that those two things intermingle in a way that we can find recovery really quickly.

Jennifer (05:03)
Well, I've heard where if you look at the positives, it makes it much easier than, my gosh, I'm never gonna be to drink again, the negativity and all that.

Austin (05:13)
It is crazy to me how people kind of get stuck in that, like, this got to be hard. ha and you'll see, you hear this in recovery, right? People are like, I had to struggle or it's a struggle every day. Or I'm like, my, how do you live that way? How do you live in that struggle every day? My life is not easy. Like none of our lives are easy. They're hard in their own weird ways. Right. But I focus on the good. There's actually really interesting research about how our brains are.

pre-wired for negativity and we have to really work at looking for that positivity. But once we make that shift, once we really start to notice it, it is, we see it everywhere. It's every day around us and we can continue to cultivate that positive mindset.

Jennifer (05:54)
So is it pre-wired for negativity for like a survival thing? Okay.

Austin (05:58)
Yep.

Yeah. So our brains are really awesome at noticing trends, patterns, habits, things that are, concerns, worries, targets, right? So when we're out, when we came out of our caves, right. And the world was full of saber tooth tigers. It was pretty important that we'd be able to notice things going badly and that we remember that that's where the saber tooth tiger lives and we should stay away from that. And so our brains are just really good at that.

They're also the reason that our brains are wired for dopamine is that when we find the berries, when we find the good things, we remember where those are in our brains wire for those things as well. So we can use this information to help us better navigate our current life where we're not forging for berries or running from saber to tigers.

Jennifer (06:42)
I like it. So you got a quick following on TikTok, right? What else are you doing?

Austin (06:50)
I am on Instagram. I love Instagram. I'm not like I kind of post the same content both places. So TikTok, I started doing TikTok lives every day. And for a year, I did a TikTok live every weekday, sometimes multiple times a day for multiple hours. I'm I think 700 hours of TikTok lives. So I've spent a lot of time on TikTok. And that then went from

this community that we'd built on TikTok to transitioning into an online community where we have five support group meetings a week. I coach on two of those. have peers that run other parts of the meetings. have a hundred members in that group and it's just a really great online space focused on building this life that you want, the positive aspect of our lives and how we're going to build into this new life. Because I don't want people to be worried about not drinking. I want them to

build a new life for themselves. And so TikTok transitioned into that and then into coaching, building out, you know, my program, my initial program is called a hundred days of sobriety and it's a 13 week one-on-one coaching program.

Jennifer (07:57)
So did you do the 100 days because that's what you did? ⁓ Now, did you use a coach or anything when you

Austin (08:00)
It did.

I

did, I did an outpatient program because 10 years ago I didn't know of anything else. I knew of AA and rehab. That was it. That's all I knew about. And I called up a couple of rehab places and they were like, did you already go through detox? And I was like, yeah, detox at home would zero stars would not recommend. and they were like, well, maybe an outpatient program would be better for you at this point. And I was still working then. So it was perfect. I go in the evening. I could keep my job. Little did know I was getting fired in a matter of days.

But yeah, so I went, did outpatient program, which I loved. And I'm actually, I still have a group of friends that we get together every couple of months from that outpatient program that we've been friends for 10 years.

Jennifer (08:43)
That's awesome. So looking back, I'm just curious, because you quit drinking and then you get fired. Don't you think you'd probably handle it better if you were drinking, I should say?

Austin (08:56)
I think either way would have been, I was pretty tired of that job. It was an awesome job. I loved my job. I really did. I just, I think I was like actively drinking myself out of that job. And so I don't think it would have mattered. It was, it all turned out great. I do, mean, like I was able to be honest with them at when I got let go that things were not going well. And I think that

You they gave me the option as most big companies do, right? You can try and save this. You can try and pull it back from the brink, right? Or you can take your severance and walk now. I think if I was drinking, I would have tried to salvage it, which would have been impossible. Like it was over. and so I, I'm glad that I did things the way that I did, but, yeah, that, was less than ideal day.

Jennifer (09:45)
Gotcha. Yeah, you went through a lot there.

Austin (09:48)
Most people do, right? Addiction is a horrible thing. It's not like we're ending up here because, know, most of us don't end up here because things are going swimmingly.

Jennifer (09:58)
Yeah, you can see the light. So you got the 100 days one on one. What other programs do you have that you're doing?

Austin (10:05)
Yeah, I do. I do group coaching programs as well. Um, I do a program. I'm actually going to be running my second group of this called happy AF and it is a eight week group coaching program centered around building happiness, cultivating happiness in our lives, not chasing it, but really building it. And what was really interesting, the first, I ran that earlier this year, that eight week program in that program. Um,

One of the things that I loved about it was that it was a mix of people who were in recovery and had been, people who were new to recovery, and then people who were not in recovery. People who didn't consider themselves as problem drinkers or gray area drinkers or anything. They were just like exploring happiness for a variety of reasons. And it was really cool to have this mix of people in that group. And so we learned a lot from that first eight weeks and we're redoing that one again later this summer.

Jennifer (10:59)
nice. Yeah, that sounds awesome. I was going to ask you if people are just unhappy if they want to just join in and sounds like they can.

Austin (11:05)
Yeah, absolutely.

I actually, so my 100 days of sobriety coaching is obviously for people who are interested in changing their relationship with alcohol in some meaningful way. But I do also offer other programs for like either ongoing recovery or for happiness coaching generally. So

Jennifer (11:21)
I like that. And so Instagram is under your name. Is that where people find you on TikTok as well?

Austin (11:27)
All my user, all my accounts, Instagram, TikTok, Facebook, YouTube are all Austin J Karr

Jennifer (11:34)
Gotcha. And do you have a website? All right. Well, that's.

Austin (11:36)
I do AustinJKarr.com. That's easy.

I know it was really advantageous. There aren't a lot of Austin J Karrs running around. There is another one and he is a bodybuilder. So if you search for me and you come across a guy who is not wearing Hawaiian shirts, but looks like he's at the gym a lot, that's not me. Keep looking.

Jennifer (11:53)
Okay, so let's talk about the industry, something I'm really passionate about. So what's your thoughts or what's your angle or where you're going with that?

Austin (12:02)
My angle,

my angle is I think we're being sold a whole pack of lies purposefully by the industry, right?

Jennifer (12:09)
So what about the companies that have NA drinks and alcohol drinks?

Austin (12:14)
This is such a, this is a tough one for me. And I don't know about you. I do drink non-alcoholic drinks from time to time. I don't drink a lot of them because I don't find occasion very often, but cause there's just so many other things I can drink. But, I, this is tough because part of me is like, I know what they're doing, which is trying to protect market share by having, or I believe, I don't know.

I believe they're trying to protect market share in a changing environment by coming out with non-alcoholic options. But I also really like that they're coming out with non-alcoholic options. And I think that that's a tough place for some people, for me to be at least of like, I wish that, I wish it weren't necessary, but I do think that there's, I think we're going to continue to see, we're seeing kind of the extremes at both ends. I think we're seeing companies come out with more non-alcoholic options, but then we also see companies

You know, like Sunny D, the great drink from our childhood, Has an alcoholic option now.

Jennifer (13:10)
Yeah,

I saw Mountain Dew and I was like...

Austin (13:13)
And so we're seeing like from the center movement toward NA options and then movement toward more alcohol in other drinks. And I think that that to me speaks to what's happening in the industry. I think that they're really working on they really want us to drink more, but also they're protecting market share a little bit by coming up with some NA options.

Jennifer (13:33)
and going for the kids.

Austin (13:35)
Yeah, totally. mean, what? Sunny D. I mean, I loved Sunny D when I was a kid, but also we've never had it because it was too expensive.

Jennifer (13:44)
Yeah, but you just don't see adults drinking it.

Austin (13:47)
It was last time you saw a friend like go to their house like what do have to drink like Sunny D? I Think I'm late for something Not a judgment call ⁓

Jennifer (13:55)
Right.

No, yeah, that's what it is. Yeah. Do you have kids?

Austin (14:06)
I do. have two little girls. One of them born after I quit drinking and one of them born before. So both have experienced a little bit different things. How about you?

Jennifer (14:15)
I have a 17 year old. that's kind of like where, you know, it's starting, like I saw, think, oh, maybe a year or two ago, where all of a sudden it was cool to have Budweiser stuff and cool, cooler stuff. it's, and I'm like, and then it was like, yeah, they're definitely targeting the kids. And I mean, great for the, great for them in that really they've got these walking advertisers, you know, and it's just like, yeah, I'm just curious what you tell your daughters or.

Austin (14:40)
So. ⁓

My oldest is 13. And she is really, really well aware of like the work that I do. And we have a lot of conversations because she was around obviously when I got sober and through this whole process. And so we've had, she and I have had more in depth conversations about addiction and about what that looks like and, and concerns about,

drinking young or choices that you get to make and how addiction shows up differently in our lives, depending on, you know, stages and things like that. I think it's really important to have those conversations. My youngest is like not, she doesn't even know what alcohol is, which is so interesting. She has just zero awareness of it. I think it'll be interesting as my daughter gets older, right? Cause she's just starting to come into.

maybe some people in her class vaping, maybe becoming aware of people talking about alcohol, but not fully in that world yet. Whereas you're, it's not like you said at 17, it's very much present, I'm sure.

Jennifer (15:39)
Yeah, definitely. So does your daughter remember you drinking?

Austin (15:44)
She does. remembers. Now it's one of those like memories of funny thing, right? But she remembers the night that I went to the hospital. And so. She but she or she was like 2 1 1 half almost three. And so it was. Yeah, she definitely has like there's some. I think there's some. Trauma.

associated with that, that she's carrying around with her that probably she'll have to deal with at some point. But she is aware of it. And she doesn't, don't think necessarily remember like my drinking, but that is a pretty indelible memory.

Jennifer (16:24)
Interesting, gotcha. So if you don't mind me asking, if you detoxed at home, you must have been pretty heavy into the, cause most feel, well, and I'm just kind of throwing this out there. I don't think a lot of people are super physically addicted to alcohol.

Austin (16:40)
Yeah, it's less than 10 % of the population. So it's pretty rare. Most people don't experience severe withdrawal symptoms. But yeah, I've been working at it for a while. Here's the reality is the job that I got fired from, when I got that job, something changed in my brain.

Jennifer (16:56)
I'm

Austin (17:04)
And I decided to drink the way I wanted to. I don't know what it was about that time period, like just before and when I got that job, I was like, I'm just gonna drink like I want to. And drinking like I wanted to was all day, every day. So by the time I quit, was, yeah, I mean, I was having withdrawal symptoms within hours of not having a drink. So I would go to a work meeting, for example, and begin tremors and sweating within a couple hours. So, yeah.

Jennifer (17:27)
Yeah,

I feel.

Austin (17:31)
It's uncommon, right? so. And most people end up doing medical detox, which is in hindsight what I should have done.

Jennifer (17:39)
huh, yeah. At one point, did you realize that you were like, I'm done drinking, it's not like another hundred days. And what, do you know what that was?

Austin (17:49)
You know what's really weird is the day I got fired from my job, I think I knew I was done.

Jennifer (17:55)
okay.

Austin (17:56)
But I still continued like the first 25 days was really researching like how I was going to go back to moderation, like how it was going to moderate. Like I spent a ton of time researching moderation. Like I hadn't already tried it. But somehow I thought that I was going to figure it out. That day was like a deaf. I don't know that I realized at the time, but looking back at it was a definite like turning point in my life of this is something different now.

But I still didn't, so by the time I got to 100 days, I think even when saying I'll do another 100 days was just, I'm not willing to say I'm done forever. I don't know what tomorrow is gonna bring, but I'll do another 100 days. But yeah, definitely at some point along the way, it just became, I think of myself as a non-drinker.

I want to, can I go back to this industry question? Cause I think it's such an interesting conversation about what do you think, what do you think we're seeing right now in this, like, especially sales toward younger adults? Because the, the data says younger people are drinking less, but

It's also seems like kind of a mixed bag of the data. what's your kind of like stance on this, what the industry is currently up to?

Jennifer (19:11)
Well, that's a good question because I haven't really looked at the data. I've more just like read some books and you know, when you quit drinking, your eyes are just open to everything. I do think that alcohol is becoming the cigarettes of the I guess it would be 80s and 90s. But I think of that Joe Camel and I think of, gosh, I was just interviewing someone and they were talking about the pink drinks in the store.

And she pointed out to her grandkids like, see, they're trying to go after you. Right. And I mean, they have to keep people addicted or keep drinking to keep making the money. So I think they're going to keep trying and trying. Yeah. Sneakier and sneakier. And, um, the advertising is just, it's good. I mean, it is so good. Right. Those football, they're Superbowl commercials are just good. You know, I hate that, but.

Austin (20:02)
It's all the commercials are all the good things. It's all the good. It's all the fun times with friends and celebration and enjoyment.

Jennifer (20:10)
out,

everything's beautiful and everyone's going to love you and

Austin (20:15)
Nobody's sitting on their couch at midnight finishing a box of wine in a commercial, Like, themselves in the dark.

Jennifer (20:21)
That's what we're gonna do is we're gonna start doing those commercials. Because it's true, there's no morning after, you know?

Austin (20:29)
No, it's never the end of it, right? It's the fun. It's the thing that we all romanticize, I think, when we quit.

Jennifer (20:37)
Something that kills me and I don't know how it was in Denver, but during COVID all of a sudden it became a necessity and you could have it delivered to your door. That hasn't stopped.

Austin (20:49)
It hasn't here either.

Jennifer (20:51)
like.

Austin (20:53)
Yeah, we can get takeout still from our restaurant around the corner, right? You can just pop into the restaurant, get your margarita. They put a piece of tape over the top, right? Just totally different for. I know that's normal in some states, but not Colorado. but yeah, it was, it was the way that it changed, and delivery and those kinds of options. And then just the, like, the ability for people to incorporate alcohol into their lives throughout the entire day.

Like the normalization of what I don't love the term alcoholic. It's not a term that I have adopted, but like I drinking during the day at your kids soccer game. You used you would have been called an alcoholic and now it's just like being a mom or like drink, like because you're drinking wine out of a Stanley. It's OK. I just think that that is the normalization of all day drinking is so bizarre to me because that's not behavior that.

I thought was normalized before.

Jennifer (21:51)
Yeah, yeah, I agree with you. Do you think that was because of COVID or before? Okay.

Austin (21:57)
I think that a couple of things happened during COVID. I think we were starting to see the rise of mommy wine culture, especially, and then COVID hit and you had women, especially unique stressors, right? And this isolation, which just leads to problematic drinking. And I think that it just so happened that all of those things really combined at the same time. And I think the alcohol industry saw that as an opportunity.

because what we saw is especially women with young kids, alcohol consumption skyrocketing. And while it's come down a little bit, it is not returned to pre-pandemic levels. So we're seeing, especially women with kids under two with problematic drinking, that gray area drinking for sure. So I think that, I think it was a combination of all of that happening at the same time.

Jennifer (22:42)
So did you have delivery of alcohol in Denver during COVID and are they still doing that?

Austin (22:52)
Yeah, still see the car. There's a liquor store pretty close to us that their cars all fancy and branded and I see him around all the time in my neighborhood.

Jennifer (22:59)
Huh. So why do you think that still is?

Austin (23:02)
There were some law changes that happened in Colorado to allow for it to happen. I think that people got so used to it that they're like, this is great, right? Colorado had blue laws, the alcohol regulation laws. When I was drinking, you still couldn't buy liquor on Sundays. Liquor stores couldn't be open on Sundays, right?

And you can only buy three, two beer at the grocery store. Like there's these weird laws and almost all of them have been rescinded. What we've seen in Colorado is a march toward fewer and fewer regulations around alcohol distribution and consumption. And I think that that is the other thing that's happening in a lot of states is we're seeing the laws change, which is why when we talk about the industry, I think we need to talk and why cigarettes specifically tobacco products.

saw their day of reduction was policy changes, right? Changes in law, taxation changes, and education. Those are the three levers we can pull. And right now, what we're seeing is loosening regulations and some of the lowest tax rates that we've seen, effective tax rates on alcohol. So we're going the wrong direction if we want to improve this.

Jennifer (24:12)
Yeah. So how do you think we change that? Like get in front of our legislatures?

Austin (24:17)
Yeah, I think we need to start talking to legislation. I think what we're going to see, and this is a unique time right now, think we're seeing the alcohol industry saying, pointing a little bit to Gen Z and saying, see, this problem is solving itself.

and then we're also seeing the rise of what we're this neo prohibition movement within the alcohol, like them talking about reduction in alcohol consumption as prohibition. And so I think we're seeing their pushback right now. I think we need to get in front of our legislation. I think we need to have these conversations. I think as people in recovery coaches, we need to be advocating for changes in laws, distribution, where things are available.

Advertising especially right you were just talking about that. Are we we have limitations on cigarettes advertising? And there are some on alcohol don't get me wrong, but they're not strict enough And you know, we NASCAR can't be sponsored by Marlboro

Jennifer (25:16)
Yeah.

Austin (25:17)
Right? We changed those policies. Those are the kinds of things we, so like, why is there an official beer of the Denver Broncos?

Jennifer (25:25)
yeah, good point.

Austin (25:27)
So I think we can advocate for these changes on the local level as well as on the national level.

Jennifer (25:33)
Yeah, because I am interested. Like, I understand the laws were changed, like here in my town to allow for delivery of alcohol. I just want to ask, why didn't they go back? I mean.

Austin (25:42)
Right.

Be a great question for your local council people. Yeah. You know, be a good question to email and ask about. Because I think, you know, the more we can advocate, the more that we at least ask the question, you know, we'll learn something different, I think.

Jennifer (25:59)
I started reading this book. can't remember what it is, but they were talking about the price of alcohol. Like, you know, the cheaper it gets, the more people will drink it. Yes. No, and you've got the other spectrum where the people want the high end, you know, beverages, but I was, you know, and I can't remember what country it was in, but they were just talking about some of it's so cheap and it just explodes.

Austin (26:19)
There is a price at which consumption will decrease. are some people that are resilient against any price, right? But the majority of the population at some point, as alcohol becomes more expensive, will reduce their consumption.

Jennifer (26:33)
Where do you get your research? Like where do you find your information? Because you know a lot. It's so interesting.

Austin (26:39)
I spend a lot of time reading, which is one of my goals for the last few years has been to read more. I read a really interesting book called Paying the Tab.

Jennifer (26:48)
Okay,

that would be the one that I got, yeah.

Austin (26:50)
That

book is fantastic. I love that book. Phillips Cook's research is amazing in that, you he talks about consumption rates for the population. That's a great book. I read a lot of research papers because I want to understand what research is happening in the industry in recovery spaces, as well as kind of what's happening in alcohol. I listen to alcohol industry podcasts.

Jennifer (26:53)
Okay.

Austin (27:14)
I read alcohol industry news releases and publications because I want to understand what they're talking about and how they're talking to themselves because those trade publications are them talking to each other. They're not talking. It's internal conversation, internal but public versus the external conversation that they're having through advertising. We see the advertising but we can see what they're talking about.

so, you know, when they talk about neo prohibition that, know, what they're fear mongering that alcohol that this isn't, this isn't them saying alcohol is bad. It is them is them saying alcohol should be outlawed. that's what they're trying to tell the population is this isn't just a health kick. This is them trying to take away your liberty.

Jennifer (28:02)
Yeah, I gotcha.

Austin (28:04)
So, so anyway, I'm also reading I'm fascinated by prohibition generally. Yeah. So I'm reading, I can't remember the name of the other book I'm reading right now. It'll come to me and I'll blurt it out. But another book on prohibition, I think it's really interesting.

Jennifer (28:18)
would love to have you on again. then I'd to dive more into this book. I would love to be able to pick your break here and have you look if you're cool with that.

Austin (28:26)
I would love to. Awesome. Send me, let me know when you want me to come back. I'd happy to chat and we can dig a little bit more into some of the conversations we're seeing in the industry or even maybe specific policy changes we could advocate for.

Jennifer (28:38)
Yeah, no, that would be awesome.

Hey.

Austin (28:40)
That would be fantastic.

so much for having me on. was a real pleasure.

Jennifer (28:44)
Thank

you. I'm going to go check out your happiness.

Austin (28:47)
Fantastic. I'd be more than happy. I can send you. I have a 30 day happiness journal that I actually launched for the sober summit. I can send you a copy of it. Awesome. Fantastic. Thank you so much. I will you to talk to you soon.

Jennifer (28:55)
Yeah, that'd be awesome.

Have a great rest of your

Thanks, bye.