MasterStroke with Monica Enand & Sejal Pietrzak

Exploring the Intersection of Innovation and Technology in Education with Dr. Monica Goldson

• Dr Monica Goldson - Guest co host Ned Renzi • Season 1 • Episode 24

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In this compelling episode, Monica Enand and guest co-host Ned Renzi delve into the dynamic intersection of educational leadership and technology with Dr. Monica Goldson, the retired CEO of Prince George's County Public Schools. Dr. Goldson's journey to becoming one of the pioneering leaders in one of the nation's largest and most diverse school districts offers invaluable insights into managing complex educational systems and driving innovation during challenging times.

Dr. Goldson's story is a testament to the power of dedication and adaptability. Starting as a mathematics teacher, she rose through various leadership roles, ultimately overseeing a $2.4 billion budget as CEO during the COVID-19 pandemic. Her current role at EdExec Leadership Group continues to influence educational leadership and development. This episode highlights the importance of visionary leadership in navigating crises and seizing opportunities for transformative change.

One of the critical aspects discussed is the complexity of managing a large school district with a diverse board of 14 members, half elected and half appointed. Dr. Goldson emphasizes the importance of having board members with specialized knowledge in areas such as business, construction, and finance to effectively manage substantial budgets. The episode also explores the difficulties superintendents face in aligning board members and making tough decisions, including knowing when it's time to step down.

The potential of artificial intelligence (AI) in education is another significant topic. Dr. Goldson explains how AI can enhance student learning and streamline teachers' workloads. AI assists students with tasks like outlining papers, getting immediate feedback, and understanding complex problems, fostering creative learning. For teachers, AI can significantly reduce burnout by automating routine tasks such as drafting parent communications, creating lesson plans, and checking for assessment bias. The rapid technological advancements in education, accelerated by the pandemic, are reshaping the educational landscape, making student-centered learning more accessible.

Equity and excellence in education are at the forefront of this discussion. Dr. Goldson shares strategies for ensuring equitable resource distribution across diverse school districts. The role of the U.S. Department of Education in local school districts is scrutinized, with a call for the Department to focus more on providing technical assistance rather than enforcing compliance tied to funding. Emerging educational technologies that support students outside school hours, especially those from economically disadvantaged backgrounds, are highlighted as crucial tools for bridging educational gaps. In our final segment, we explore the role of technology in creating a more equitable and effective educational system. Dr. Goldson highlights the importance of understanding community needs and leveraging technology to meet those needs.



Georgianna Moreland - Executive Producer | Managing Editor;
Matt Stoker - Editor


Dr. Monica Goldson:

I did look at education as a business. I led a $2.4 billion corporation Next to AI. This is the second most important conversation that's happening now between students, teachers, and welcome to our special guest host, ned Renzi.

Georgianna Moreland:

Conversations with founders, ceos and visionary leaders in technology and beyond.

Monica Enand:

Welcome to Masterstroke. We have a very exciting episode today and we I don't know if everyone can handle it, but we have not one, but two Monicas on the show today. Me, of course. It's going to be an amazing day. Yes, Me, of course, and Dr Monica Goldson. And I'm joined today again by my guest host, Ned Renzi. Thank you for being here, Ned.

Ned Renzi:

Thanks, Monica.

Monica Enand:

And I will let Ned introduce his colleague Dr Goldson.

Ned Renzi:

Yeah, so Dr Monica Goldson welcome. So Dr Goldson's the retired chief executive officer of Prince George's County Public Schools, which is one of the nation's largest immersed diverse school districts. Let me know if I get these stats right, but I think you served over 130,000 students across 200 schools and like 19,000 staff members, so quite a large organization. And today you're now the CEO of EdExec Leadership Group, which is a leadership and development executive coaching firm where you focus on helping educational leaders and organizations maximize their potential.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

Ned, you got it correct and the stats are accurate.

Ned Renzi:

I passed the test.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

All right, yes, from a former mathematician, you did it.

Ned Renzi:

Nice.

Monica Enand:

All right. Well, we're so glad you're here. Education is such an important topic for us to discuss, especially in this disruptive time that we're living in. But you spent 32 years in the Prince George's County public school system, and this is one of the top 20%. It's in the top 20% of the largest districts in the nation. Well, first of all, congratulations on your retirement. We look way too young to have the word retirement associated with you, and so I know you're doing some exciting things now. Thank you for that.

Monica Enand:

But what I really want to know is 32 years in the school district ending your career not ending, I guess, but culminating your career with a CEO, being the CEO of Prince George County. Tell us a little bit about that career journey, like how did you end up as the CEO?

Dr. Monica Goldson:

Yeah, actually it was not something I was seeking to do, as most things, it just happened. I have an amazing. I had an amazing career in the same school district I had the opportunity to grow up in, which is very rare, yeah, so I went to elementary, middle and high school in my same school district. Now, was that ever planned? No, I'm an only child. When I graduated from high school, I wanted to get as far away as possible, so I went to Florida A&M University and I went to major in actuary science, had no desire to go into education, even though I come from a long line of educators. What people know about actuaries is that you have to take 10 mathematics exams to be a certified actuary, and I figured, you know what? Maybe I'll just teach a mathematics class while I'm preparing for the first three actuary exams and then, by the time you get two or three under your belt, typically insurance companies will pay for you to come on and work for them and allow you to study during the workday and work at the same time. So that was really my plan. Yeah, clearly I was not in control of that plan. I went to my former high school principal, hired me to teach at another high school. He was at a different high school mathematics and after the first week of school I knew that I was destined to remain in education. Wow, so that's how I started.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

I worked my way up. I was a mathematics teacher, an instructional specialist, who helped middle and high school math teachers throughout the district. I became an assistant principal, a principal so a principal of two high schools opened a new one, had one that was overcrowded and the district built a new one, opened that one and then became a chief of operations, associate superintendent over high schools. And then one day the superintendent comes in in July and says hey, monica, I'm out and the board wants to see you. Well, first of all, when someone says that, that's normally not a good sign that the board wants to see you, and anyone who knows anything about education, you can pull up an article right now, today, about some board up to some shenanigans and. But there are some boards are doing amazing things, but there are some who are not.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

And I went down to the board office thinking, oh gosh, what is this? And they said, hey, look, we would love for you to be an interim CEO superintendent. And I did think about it. I went home to talk to my two children, and I did think about it. I went home to talk to my two children. I have two young men now. One was still in high school in Prince George's County and the other one was in college, and so serving in that role meant that his life could potentially change. A high school student whose mom is the superintendent is not always fun, but he encouraged me to go ahead and do it, and so I went back and said, yeah, I'll do it. And so I was interned for a year and then was got the permanent job and was superintendent for five years, of which, let me be clear, felt like dog years because it was also during the pandemic.

Monica Enand:

Oh my gosh.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

So exactly. But you know, I have a saying, and it's actually on a sign, someone gave it to me. It says never let a good crisis go to waste. That's exactly what I, along with the executive team, did. We were able to move the district in a different direction that I firmly believe we would never have been able to do had we not been in a pandemic.

Monica Enand:

Okay Well, we want to explore that more, for sure, but I have a couple of reactions to what you just said. First of all, I think actuaries are boring, and you are way not boring.

Monica Enand:

So there's no way you are destined to be an actuary. That sounds way too boring for you, exactly, but I thought I could do it. Oh, I'm sure you can. I'm sure you can. Yeah, it just never happened, right. Yeah, yeah, no doubt in your ability, I just yeah. When we started the show, georgiana Moreland and Sejal and I talked about like how we were going to name the show, and we named it it's called Master Stroke and Georgiana came up with that name and she said we Sejal said like what, what is Master Stroke? And she, georgiana, explained that like, there are these moments in life where you make a choice that you know obviously you would have ended up doing something amazing. You know, I'm convinced that there are these moments in time where you make decisions and those little decisions really lead to something.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

I think so too. You're right. Nothing just happens. You're right Hard work, perseverance. You know I will say I wasn't seeking the CEO position.

Monica Enand:

Yes, ok.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

So that's why I say it just happens. But you know, I think when you're shifting from one one position to the next, I think that's always when you're making a different move or stroke into a different direction. And, um, I can remember I was a high school principal. It just opened a school. I'd said to the superintendent, he came in, he would always come to visit and I would say, hey, please don't touch me for five years, let me get this place up and running. He said OK, and ran out and left out the door, you know like, went on and visit some classrooms or whatever.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

But something happened in the district. So I wrote a really quick one page white paper on why I thought the decision he made was not the best decision. And the next thing I knew he called and he said hey, would you love to have the associate superintendent job over high school? I was like, are you crazy? No, I was really just trying to let you know that I did not agree with what just happened and these are the reasons why. And he said well, actually that is why we would need you to lead, because we need to hear the voice from the field, someone who's not concerned, scared to say something to the leader who's trying to make the right decision, or at least the best decision for children, and I think that was what caused me to pivot from being in the schoolhouse to the executive roles that I continue to acquire right after that, dr Goldson, I think I may have mentioned in one of our conversations where we sit on the board.

Ned Renzi:

I'm the only non-public school teacher in my family. My dad was a high school principal. My brother is now a superintendent getting ready to retire. Monica and I have interviewed a lot of I'll say just captains of industry and people who have done things where they report to a board of directors that are sort of handpicked or they opt in through an investment or whatever. And something that always, like, either fascinated me or puzzled me about education is you take people as accomplished as yourself and you report to a board of directors who have no experience in your industry, no training, no idea how to educate kids, but they get put in this role where they're, they're your boss. They get on the board because they have a kid who has one special interest and they think the whole world revolves around that kid.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

You know around that one thing and they're and they're a dog with a bone and not letting it go.

Ned Renzi:

How did you adapt to and deal with a situation like that?

Dr. Monica Goldson:

First of all, ned, every superintendent around the country now wants to come and hug you because you're right, that is exactly what superintendents are experiencing. That is exactly what superintendents are experiencing and you know it's you go at first of all. You go into it believing that every board member wants the same thing you do, and that is to provide the best educational experience possible for children. What, unfortunately, you come to find out is that that's not always the case, and you know, over time, you get to a point where you realize that their personal agendas are now hampering your ability to lead and to move a district forward. And so, in my situation, I had a unique case where I have 14 board members.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

In my situation, I had a unique case where I have 14 board members. That's larger than LA Unified. That's the largest school district in the country. I have 14 school board members. Half were elected, half were appointed because the county executive, which is very similar to a mayor, wanted to try to do exactly what you said Bring on professionals who could serve as my thought partners. Hold me accountable, ask me questions, because I led a $2.4 billion budget. Billion.

Ned Renzi:

Wow.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

And so I needed a variety of members on that board who had expertise in lots of areas. Under my leadership, I was able to bring on a public-private partnership where we built a total of now 14 new school buildings. So that meant I really needed someone who had a business acumen, who understood construction and who had a true sense of financing. You're not always going to get that with elected officials. You're getting someone who says, hey, I just want to be a school board member, who might just want to be a school board member because they eventually want to be a county council member or delegate and they're using this as a stepping stone and an outlet to get there. And I think you will find across the country why there probably is a revolving door in public education right now for superintendents. It is difficult, I will say in my five-year tenure you do end up spending a lot of time talking to board members. I spent individual. I had to meet with people individually. Then I prepare for board meetings in advance. So of course I'm looking at agenda items, I'm calling before we get to the meeting Do you have any questions? So I'm not blindsided on what I think the potential vote may be. And then, when you get to a point where you realize that everyone is not rowing in the same direction, you then, as a leader, have to make a decision on whether it's time for you to depart or not.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

And when it came time for me I was ready for contract renewal I made a decision that not everyone on the board wanted to roll in the same direction. I wanted to go in and I was very honest with the public on why I was leaving and I made it clear that it was the board. But I did that not necessarily to upset them because, hey, I was leaving, it didn't matter to me. I did it with the hope that they would change their actions and it would wake up our community to pay attention to what was happening in public education. Do I think I accomplished that? Probably, maybe about 40% of the time it works 40%.

Ned Renzi:

If you gave me an over under on betting, I would have bet under 40%.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

This is the one thing I can tell you about really great leaders. You have to know when it is time for you to go. And. I think that is a very difficult decision for CEOs of companies, profit, nonprofit and leaders in K-12 public education. You just cannot get so self-absorbed to think that you are the end all to be all, that. There is someone who's going to come in who can do better and greater, and why wouldn't you want them to?

Monica Enand:

there is someone who's going to come in, who can do better and greater, and why wouldn't you want them to? Well, that takes a lot of maturity, ego maturity, I think. I mean you know, ned, and I have talked about ego all the time. Of course we all have egos, but I think what you're talking about is a really evolved sense of self and sense of like what your mission is and how, what your role in the mission is. So I really applaud you for saying that, because I think it's an incredibly hard thing. It's easy to say and think about and it sounds right, but when people actually do it, it's incredibly difficult for them to do.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

It is very difficult. I don't want anyone to think that you could just wake up one morning and be like, hey, I think it's time for me to go, that you could just wake up one morning and be like, hey, I think it's time for me to go. It took me a year for me to vocalize what it is I want that. Hey, it was time for me to pivot. So lots of times people are like, oh, you're retired. Oh, my God, you're too young to retire.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

Monica, you even said it and I consider it repurposed. Before I could even get out of the door, the governor from Maryland called and said hey, Monica, could you be on the State Board of Education in Maryland? And I said, hey, sure, it's a volunteer position. Little did I know. Now I am the vice president of that state board, and so and I get, and I have an opportunity now to coach other superintendents across the district along with their executive staff. I have the pleasure of sitting on other boards for corporations that are trying to make a difference in the lives of students. And so you make that tough decision, but it's a decision. I think that if you can arrive there and understand that, it's what's you're making the best decision for everyone, yourself and the organization that you lead, I think you'll find you'll come out even better on the other side.

Ned Renzi:

Yeah, dr Goldson, if it's OK, I'd like to maybe take the conversation a little different direction. And you know, sort of, for me, one of the things I've been passionate about as an investor is this intersection of education and technology, so sort of. I have an engineering background, but I come from this family of teachers and so you know, the hottest thing right now is obviously artificial intelligence and gen AI, right, and so you know, you know, when you sort of look at this, there are sort of two parts to it One, how do you think AI can help students learn more effectively? And two, how can AI be used to help teachers and schools be more effective?

Dr. Monica Goldson:

Yeah, I think. First, the very first thing is that we have to acknowledge that there are many students who are using AI right now period. So for those school districts who have turned it off, don't allow access, have put up a firewall. You're only hindering their ability to access it during the day Because more than likely, they're accessing it.

Ned Renzi:

They're doing it at home, right?

Dr. Monica Goldson:

Or if they have a cell phone, they're using it on their cell phone, using it on their cell phone. What I, in my conversations with students and then I'll talk about the advantages of students and teachers is I always say to them especially for leaders who represent diverse districts, such as the one I had is that when you cut it off, when you cut off a artificial intelligence, what you're now doing is setting those kids up to be behind their peers, and what you don't want to do is do that because of your fear of what AI could do. I had the opportunity to hear some students talk about AI and the benefits of what it is, what it does for them, and the very first thing that they all talked about was is that they use it. One to give them an outline for writing. They don't use it. Many of them talk hey, we don't use it to write our paper for us, and if our teachers knew our voice when we turned in our papers, they would know who was using AI completely and who was not. Many students talked about using it for feedback immediate feedback on their work, or if they got stuck in an area. Um, there are. Now.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

Ai has the ability to even assist in mathematics, so helping them to problem solve or to dissect a word problem when they're like look, the word problem is written, I don't even understand it. And some have used it as a tool to take the exact word problem, put it in a tool to say, can you just reword it so I can understand it, reword it in layman's terms, and then have been able to solve it, and it's allowed our students to have creative learning experiences. That I know as an educator, as a former teacher. We sometimes get so stuck in what we've always done. We don't come to the table meeting the needs of our students with the creativity level that we should. So that's just a few. For teachers it's even greater. So the tool first of all.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

We've been talking a lot about teacher burnout after coming back from the pandemic, and so if you want to start to address teacher burnout, then you've got to start to integrate AI into the teacher educator experience. You could start as simple as helping them to draft communications to parents. To draft communications to parents, making sure that it's in a tone and a language that parents can receive, helping to write creative lesson plans, and so you do, as an educator, have to put in the standards or objectives that you're trying to accomplish. You've got to put in some parameters. So AI prompting is really important. This is really just a tool that's kind of directing you, giving you some ideas. You're going to still tweak it, you're still going to take that. But just imagine, as an educator I used to spend every Sunday planning for the entire week. If I had AI at my hand, my ready set tool, it probably would not have taken me all of Sunday, probably would have taken me two hours versus eight. And so that's where you can look at the reduction in the burnout.

Ned Renzi:

It's a productivity enhancer.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

Oh gosh, major productivity enhancer. Recently I talked to a teacher who said she had used it. She creates her own classroom assessments, like most teachers do, but she decided to put her tool in an AI tool just to look at assessment bias, and she was surprised at the change in the assessment items that she needed to make based on the items that she created. And it was interesting for her because, while she was happy to share it, you know, she just thought back to how many assessment items and tools she provided that kind of were not that she did not have the opportunity to put in this tool that she administered to students and gave a final grade to. So that's just a few of the items. I think we're just on the beginning of all the things that AI can do, and so you could tell I'm a lover of everything AI, of all things AI.

Monica Enand:

Wow. I mean I think we're starting to definitely learn here. What has contributed to your success and I definitely think it's a growth mindset and ability to kind of deal with changes and new technologies and embrace them and figure out how to harness them for good and the best. I imagine that over those decades you've got to have seen a lot of change. Can you talk to us about what the biggest changes have been in the last three decades and kind of where you see education heading?

Dr. Monica Goldson:

Okay, I'm going to start with the biggest because there's so many. But I'm going to start with the biggest and it really is the integration of technology. And remember earlier I said had it not been for the pandemic, we would not have been able to move our district forward as fast as we did, and that the technology piece was really the tool that helped to move us. We had talked about becoming a one-to-one school district. Honestly, it would have taken us probably five to six years because we were going to do this whole kindergarten step process, walking through the soul, and then we just ripped the Band-Aid off and became a one-to-one school district. What does it mean one-to-one?

Monica Enand:

school district.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

So one-to-one means that every child has a technology device in their possession every day, issued by the school, issued by the school district. So that's over the last couple of decades. That's a major change in trajectory than what you've seen before. So technology integration is one the shift towards student-centered learning where the teacher is the facilitator and the student is more participatory, has more opportunity to express their thoughts, to explore, to move away from the lesson plan. So if just by chance you bring up a topic that wasn't on the lesson plan, the teacher feels comfortable say you know what, let's explore that topic. I know that wasn't in my lesson, but let's explore it and see where it takes us. So more of a student-centered approach. We definitely have moved to holistic education where we are very concerned about the mental health and awareness of our students and staff staff. Very much around equity and inclusion, and I know those are sometimes the buzzwords, but in education that's more around closing the achievement gap for subgroups that typically are marginalized based on, you know, probably their zip code or social economic background. And you know there was a lot of conversation around STEM and now there's more conversation around STEAM and that was just the addition of arts into science, technology, engineering and mathematics. And then lastly, which is a big piece of this, now moving from vocational education to what we call now career and technical education, and I love to always inform the community. It's not the same. It wasn't just a change in name, it really isn't a change in the way our students learn. You know, when you take your car to a car dealership to figure out what's going on, they don't get underneath, they don't roll and get underneath the hood, they actually connect it to a computer, teaching our students to use the tools that they have to still deliver in those fields that we typically would look at as vocational ed.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

In terms of the direction we're going, I think all of those items I've discussed are always in the forefront of superintendents' minds today, right now, as we're moving forward. But just like times change, so should education, and shame on us if it doesn't, and you know it's. It's unfortunate that sometimes I will do a site visit and I will go in a classroom and the chairs are still in a row. The teacher's desk is in the front. What I'm looking for is that teaching looks different. It's even better when the furniture looks different and their couches and tables and chairs and kids are in groups. But we have to change with the times and I think that is where we're headed in public education.

Ned Renzi:

A lot of our conversations kind of at this local level. I'm really curious, you know, like when I talk to my brother, my dad, so much is influenced, you know, for them far away in Washington, right, and the Department of Ed throws this money out, they have strings attached to it which local people may or may not agree with. You know, as I researched it, I didn't even know we didn't have a Department of Ed until the 70s with the Carter administration, and education was pretty fine without federal direction in education, right. I mean we were a leader in the world, right. So I'm just curious now, like at a high level, your view Department of Ed net positive, net negative. If you were ran the Department of Ed, what top two or three changes would you recommend?

Dr. Monica Goldson:

Yeah, so the US Department of Ed. You're right, it has been interesting over the past couple of decades what their role is and there have been times that, depending on administrations you're right, I'm not too far from Washington DC and so I have the privilege of hearing that news every day Whether it was no Child Left Behind, you name it there have been mandates that come down and then that drives what comes out of the Department of Education. If there's anything that I could change is that, while I understand that the Department of Ed is supposed to be bipartisan I understand that's what it's supposed to be but to be more of a department that serves as technical assistance to state and local education agencies. I know that when you look at it like let's go back to AI as a great example, they've issued guidance around AI. Hey, states and districts embrace it.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

You know these are the things that you could. It would be as a great benefit. It doesn't tell you you have to use it. It serves as a tool and is willing to come out to states and districts to talk about what they need to do to create policies around supporting. So if they really should focus on ways to make sure that they serve as that a resource and a guide. I think where it gets muddy is that you have a US Department of Ed and you do. You have these national politics and then, as your brother can canest to, he has his own local politics and the local politics will trump that federal one all day long.

Ned Renzi:

He's squeezed in that all the time. You nailed it.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

All day long. So if they can serve as that assistance in helping to navigate it, then makes that superintendent's role better instead of having to answer to your local and then still having to answer to your federal. You know, there are some states that will not accept the federal funding because they don't wanna adhere to the federal requirements. There are other states that have no choice because they need the federal funding to help to close their financial gap and I hate that. That is where we are as a country. So if I could change it, it would really be around focusing on being a support instead of the hand-me-down of you have to do and in order to do it. To do it is when you get the dollars.

Ned Renzi:

And if you don't do it you don't get it.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

If I could pin you down at the high level Department of Ed, net positive or net negative to these school districts around the country, I think it's a net positive Anytime you have someone else in the arena in public education who can provide support on any level, who can provide support on any level I gave one example on AI and they have helped in assistance around literacy Then it's always again a net positive.

Ned Renzi:

The Dr Gold said I know you're involved with a few startup companies, including the one where you and I got to work together on and meet. You know there's some new technologies in addition to AI, a lot of interesting startups. Are there any particular companies or technologies you're excited about?

Dr. Monica Goldson:

Yeah, I'm very excited about those companies that are able to use technology to support students not only during the school day but beyond the school day. So for the previous school district that I served, 68% of our students were on frame-reduced meals and so very much needed support in the evenings with tutoring. So I loved opportunities for students to have that support in the afternoon or evening to help them navigate the work that they needed to do on their own time. Because I come from a community where sometimes students would leave school, go to work and then come home and so that having those opportunities that are not necessarily in a confined time to get support it might be 11 pm when they need support and having the ability to do that.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

Looking at the elementary level, very intrigued by getting community members to help with the execution of learning for our youngest children, and so was intrigued by companies that did small things by getting community members to read to students virtually During the summer and during the school year we know the value of reading to early learners and for a community such as mine, where many of our students were EL students whose parents did not speak English, that was not their first language and we were trying to find a way to help our students. So looking for tools that allowed us to kind of close that gap, so very intrigued with looking at technology tools that kind of help to bridge the school home connection, what do you think the best strategies that are in place to ensure the equitable distribution of resources?

Monica Enand:

So technology, experienced teachers, extracurricular activities across the schools and we know there's very different experiences in economically diverse areas.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

First, you've got to do an assessment of where you are as a school district period, and that's what we did. We knew that, okay, we were heavy on computer labs and laptops at the high school level, not so much at the elementary and middle school level, and you truly have to know where you're trying to move your district. So the pandemic was a great example. It shifted everything to online experiences and I can remember going out with the county executive to plead to parents. I need we needed 90,000 devices.

Ned Renzi:

That's massive. That's like bigger than 90% of companies out there.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

Exactly Because we were going to do something different for K1 and 2. But we needed 90,000 devices. I was 15,000 devices short. I am in the community on the news pleading to parents please let children use your work device. I'm asking employers, please. We're short, 15,000.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

This is before we had any federal funding to support um the pandemic. And I realized then like something has to give. This is crazy. Like first of all we're we're fault, because we should have been prepared for this. We weren't um, and that was the beginning of it.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

Then the next issue was so what? You got an advice now they need internet, so they need wi so if you're talking about equitable distribution of resources, you also have to tackle some community infrastructure issues. So we then I was in constant communication with our county government around their communities where they don't even have wifi access. They're constantly dropping. So what are we going to do about that? I had to reach out to cable company to buy hotspots and then deliver those hotspots to those communities. So it then became a whole community experience. So that's why I say, to really look at what that equitable distribution is, you do need some key players at the table. It can't just be the school district alone.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

We had to have a parent community meeting in three different parts of our county to talk about hey, this isn't a problem in one part of the community, because that technology device is their lifeline. It allows their parents to pay bills, it allows their child to pay bills, it allows their child to get tutoring, it allows them to get one-on-one support. We even were able to contract with a company that did mental health supports through technology, through the computer device. So there were students who were getting one-on-one counseling at home through the device, whereas other communities were like, hey, can you just keep the device? Whereas I had other communities were like, hey, can you just keep the device at school, because when we get home we don't want them to have the device when they get home.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

And I literally had to inform our community.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

We're talking, we got two different communities we're dealing with here and so we're going to need your help, because now we're getting ready to go into the haves and have nots.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

So in those homes where they didn't want it, their kids had exposure to technology devices all the time without us even giving it to them. They already had computers, and so we really had to have a compromise on meeting other minds, and so we then started to limit the amount of times that pre-KK one and two spent on technology devices, but allow parents to make the choice at those levels of whether they wanted the device to come home every day or not period, because the parent might need to use the device themselves. You've got to understand your community, you've got to know where the gaps are and then you've got to come up with tools to help them to close that gap. If I had said we're only going to let kids use that device during the school day, I would have created a major problem for students who needed that support in the evening and parents who now are relying on the tools that we provided to kids to be their lifeline back to a school building.

Ned Renzi:

I know, when I work with CEOs, we have the saying that says, meet them where they are and it sounds like that's what you're doing for your community. And some people in the same community are just in different places and you kind of meet them where they are and just start from there and meet them where they are and just start from there.

Monica Enand:

Related to that topic, I noticed that this year school just started here and I noticed that this year one of the high schools has the kids magnetic. They have these magnetic holders that they put their phone, their watch if they have one. They put their AirPods or whatever in the magnetic lockers or magnetic holders in the morning and then they don't get it unlocked until the what are like? What do you think about that? You know?

Dr. Monica Goldson:

interesting.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

You bring it this next to AI. This is the second most. This is the second most important conversation that's happening now between students, teachers, parents and district leaders. And so and interesting just had this conversation yesterday as a state board member with some other state board members and it really does vary. I think you've got to know your community districts where the parents are like don't you dare tell me what to do with my, with the cell phone I purchased for my child. Then we have other communities where they're like, oh my gosh, I they need it, like please lock it up. Um, and I think me I try to bring to a multiple lens.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

I was a parent, I was a district parent, so I can get. I understand the parents wanting to have contact with their kid all day. You know, now in this day and time with school shootings, it causes parents to then want to still communicate with their kids. So it's a very difficult conversation to have with parents because if you watch the news, there were parents who were like I was talking to my child when it was happening. So they don't want to lose that lifeline For educators. They will tell you please take it, but they don't want to be the manager of the taking of it. It's an interesting conversation and so I say all that to say one you've got to know your community. I think this is the time to begin to have those conversations, to provide the research around the advantages of locking up the cell phone at the beginning of the school day and getting it at the end, having resources and strategies on how you're going to resolve the issue with the parent who wants to get to their child right then. And there's no problem in piloting. So there's nothing wrong with choosing one or two or three schools out of a district to pilot it first, to work out the kinks, to use them, their parents, their students, teachers and staff to be the ones who help to sell it to everyone else. Everything doesn't have to happen immediately, right now, but I do think we are on the beginning of school districts looking at limiting the amount of time students are on cell phones.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

Now let me just say this one more thing really quick. There was a time when I first started as a principal where we were allowing students to have their cell phone because they were using it in the classroom to look up a word like help them. Now, with so many districts, having technological devices in the classroom for students to use. You now can have that conversation around. You don't necessarily need the cell phone because there's an iPad or desktop or a laptop right there for them to quickly access. So I think you're going to find a conversation. It's going to vary by community. What we don't want, what we're hoping, is that our elected officials won't go into the legislature, coming up and decide to ban without having these kinds of conversations and ramming down the throats of our community members.

Ned Renzi:

We've covered quite a bit of ground on, you know, education, on philosophies, on technology, what's working, what's not. I love this quote from a sci-fi author who says the future's already here. It's just not evenly distributed and I feel like you're on the front end of a lot of these different waves. And so if you put your hat on and say, hey, it's 2034, 10 years from now, and the industry's evolved according to your vision or what you're seeing at the edge right now, what do you think K-12 education looks like 10 years from now?

Dr. Monica Goldson:

I think we won't be talking about AI. There'll be something else new and shiny. If you recall, we used to freak out over the calculator. Now no one freaks out about that anymore, so it's very similar. I think 10 years from now they'll be like AI. There'll be something else new and shiny.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

I think what you will find because we are in a major teacher shortage. So I think what you will find is that students might be learning from a teacher in a whole nother state and they might be in a diverse classroom with students from their state and another state, and a teacher might have 50 students and very similar to sometimes what a college classroom looks like. I think you may find that at the secondary level, I think you're going to find flexible scheduling for students. I think right now there are some places where they are really looking at students who start maybe at noon and go later in the day because they have family obligations that they have to support in the morning. You have some who and it's very typical for seniors, but at an earlier age than seniors where they can start during the day, do a half a day and maybe work.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

You're seeing an increase of students who are doing dual enrollment and are able to earn their high school diploma and their associate's degree at the same time. I think you're going to find a lot more of that, and what I'm hoping you will find is a different post-secondary experience than the traditional college university experience that many of our students are doing right now, that many of our students are doing right now. I'm hoping that by 2034, our universities will look different because, for sure, our K-12 is starting to move in that direction.

Ned Renzi:

Yeah, look, I hope you're right.

Ned Renzi:

If it's okay, I want to double click on one of the things you said at the beginning of your vision, and this is the idea of, you know, one teacher teaching more students Right.

Ned Renzi:

And so, if I look at other industries, if you're in the music business, you know 100 years ago you could only sing to people you know in your venue, right. And then you have radio music, albums, whatever to today, where you have Taylor Swift and it's driven by power laws, right. One person's making a billion dollars, and you can say that about LeBron James in basketball or like any of these other industries. And so, like, what I'm saying is like in these other industries, technology allows the top 1% to sort of broadcast to many, and my view is my experience with teachers too is there's a lot of good teachers, there's a handful of bad teachers, but there's also a handful of just truly great teachers, and right now, those truly great teachers only reach 20 to 30 kids at a time. And, like, how do you get those truly great ones, the 1% of the 1%, to reach a hundred million kids or a hundred thousand kids, or something like how? How does that happen?

Dr. Monica Goldson:

You know, first it starts with um highlighting that you have some amazing teachers right there in front of you and then being, just what you say creative about how to get them to serve the lesson to thousands. And when you said it I smiled because I thought back during the pandemic we weren't planning to purchase any technology for K1 and 2. But what we did have at our disposal was something this old thing called a television, and we had a public television station. And so we reached out to all of our principals to say do you have an amazing K-1 or 2 teacher? They sent us names. Our content specialist said oh my gosh, yes, I've been there. This person is amazing.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

We paid them extra to teach a lesson that was then televised on our public television station for K1 and 2 in four core content areas. We published a schedule and parents could cut on the TV and their kids would sit and do the lesson. We even had packets of materials that parents would run by the school one day a week to pick up. That would support the lessons that the teacher taught. That was through a public television station.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

The same thing can happen now. It could be instead of that public television station. It can be through a computer, a device, and so we just have to move away from the traditional mode. We just have to move away from the traditional mode, and you're right, getting the top tier and getting down to a community of folks who need it. And when you think about it for the pandemic, there were parents who were like, oh my gosh, this is the best thing out, and the lessons ran multiple times. I mean, we even did PE on TV for pre-KK in one and two. So it's possible, ned. We just have to get out of our way and sometimes getting out of our way means we also have to have conversations with our union leaders that there are a group of people educators who want to work beyond the traditional work hours and who want the extra pay to do it.

Ned Renzi:

Well, tell you what if you start that company, I will fund you.

Monica Enand:

Well, thank you, nick. Thank you, thank you. Well, if you start any company, I would be interested in funding you. But you know, as I listened to you and I was thinking about this episode being very different than most of the episodes, because we talked to mostly, like business leaders, tech companies, founders and I was thinking, oh, education, I wonder how this is going to apply. But I'm sitting here listening and I'm thinking your leadership approach and the kinds of ways that you have to lead large groups of people it's a lot of the same. It's a lot the same. It's a lot of. I hear you talk about listening to different stakeholders, creating empathy with your stakeholders for other stakeholders, making sure everybody understands each other. Like, do you? You know, we've frequently talked about kind of leadership frameworks or how leaders think about. Do you have any frameworks that you use or sort of principles that you use to help you in your leadership practice that you could share? Yeah, definitely.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

I very much am aligned with the servant leadership model. I did look at education as a business. I mean, like I said, I led a $2.4 billion corporation in my mind and I also made investments to support me as a leader. So I had an executive coach and I had a coach that was not in education, because I needed that coach to look at it from a different lens. You know it's what pushed me to be a better leader. Ned said at the beginning I had 19,000 employees If you count substitutes, 20,000 employees, and I was always trying to find ways that I could get to them and I always wanted to make sure that they felt like they could get to me.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

Harvard does some research around the messy middle. If you can't move the middle of your organization, you're never going to move that organization. And I really spent a lot of time focused on the messy middle, the top that we're going to meet every. We met every Tuesday, the core of the classroom. I spent time in the classroom, that's that's. That was the crux, the core of our work. We can't do anything if we're not supporting that core. And I think for any leader, for any company, when you know what that core is, then you're trying to figure out how everyone can support that core. That is very well said.

Ned Renzi:

I think I could talk for two days on this topic. I'm like to me, it's the future of the country. Right, and you know, sometimes I think we do a decent job preparing the next generation A lot of areas. I think we do a great disservice to the next generation in terms of just preparing them to be adults and contributors to society. I think if we have more people like Dr Goldson, we'd be much better off as a country for the future.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

I sure hope so. I'm trying to raise two to be better. That I'm raising to be better for the country, and I sure hope there's some'm trying to raise two to be better that I'm raising to be better for the country, and I sure hope there's some other folks who are trying to do the same you are a great inspiration to many.

Monica Enand:

So thank you so much for spreading your inspirational story larger, wider, hopefully reaching people that have not met you or don't get the joy of, like Ned, of being on a board with you or knowing you and your work. But I really appreciate you spending time with us today and I look forward to all the cool new things you do in this next chapter and I look forward to our continued partnership, wherever that may lead us.

Dr. Monica Goldson:

Thank you for the opportunity. I truly appreciate it.

Monica Enand:

And this has been another episode of Master Stroke. Thank you so much to Sejal and to Ned, and thank you, dr Monica Goldson, and I wanted to also thank our executive producer, georgiana Moreland thank you for listening today.

Georgianna Moreland:

We would love for you to follow and subscribe. Monica and Sejal would love to hear from you. You can text us directly from the link in the show notes of this episode. You can also find us on the LinkedIn page at Masterstroke Podcast with Monica Enid and Sejo Petrzak. Until next time.