THE MILK

Ep. 16 Hypnobirthing For A Calm, Confident Labor with Nicolle Kasch

• Tayla Burke

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Intimated by birth? Hypnobirthing flips fear into calm & confidence with simple mind & body shifts. This week I sit down with hypnobirthing coach and doula Nicolle Kasch (owner of Mind Body Baby OC) to turn a fear-heavy narrative into a grounded plan you can practice ahead of time. We get real about the mechanics of calmer labor: how oxytocin and endorphins help the uterus work, why adrenaline shows up at the wrong time, and what you can do to keep your nervous system in a state that lets birth unfold.

Nicolle breaks down hypnobirthing as intuitive preparation, something any birth plan can include (not just the unmedicated ones!). You’ll learn simple, effective techniques—slow belly breathing with long exhales, relaxing the jaw and hands to soften the pelvis, and using the gate control theory of pain with a comb or spiky ball. We map out the “labor cave” environment that boosts oxytocin: dim lighting, cozy textures, familiar scents, and fewer onlookers. We also tackle different hospital scenarios , why food and electrolytes matter for stamina, and how partners can support you from start to finish: owning the birth plan and communicating with staff to hands-on comfort moves like shoulder anchors, light touch massage, sacral counter pressure, hip squeezes, & more.

More Of What We Discuss:

• defining hypnobirthing as intuitive birth prep

• oxytocin, endorphins, adrenaline, and labor chemistry

• fear–tension–pain cycle and how to break it

• slow belly breathing with long exhales

• face, jaw, and hand relaxation to soften the pelvis

• gate control theory, combs, and spiky tools

• light touch massage, counterpressure, hip squeezes

• sensory anchors using scent, lighting, and texture

• partners as advocates, coaches, and calm keepers

• creating a private, dim, nurse-aligned birth space

• staying flexible when plans change


If you want less fear, more flow, and a birth rooted in trust, this conversation gives you the science, the mindset, and the moves. 

Find Nicolle: mindbodybabyoc.com and @mindbodybabyoc. 

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Welcome & Why Hypnobirthing

SPEAKER_01

Welcome to The Milk, the podcast that pours it all out. The messy, the magical, and the mildly unhinged moments of motherhood and womanhood. Real talk, honest stories, and reminders that none of us really know exactly what we're doing. And that's kind of the best part. I'm Tayla, your host and soon-to-be mom of three. So let's laugh, learn, and milk the season of life for all that it's worth.

Meet Nicole And Mind Body Baby

SPEAKER_02

Hi ladies, welcome back to another week of The Milk. I'm so excited for this episode. I feel like it's perfect timing for me. I just hit eight months a couple days ago, actually. And so I'm starting to think about my birth prep and my birth preference and how I can go into it with the clearest, most confident mind, and also get Scotty to support me along the way. So I thought, what better way than to talk about hypnobirthing and invite my previous hypnobirthing coach, Nicole Kosh, to join us today on the podcast. Here she is. And I think the main reason for having this conversation today is because, especially for first-time moms, I think there's so much fear that we almost like see in movies and on social media around birth. And for someone who's never gone through it before and you don't know what to expect, it's only natural to kind of be a little intimidated and overwhelmed by the process. So today, my goal is to have Nicole here to kind of talk through hypnobirthing for people who have heard of it before, maybe not, and just find techniques and tools that we can step into our birthday with confidence and ease and just minimizing fear around the whole experience because birth is such a beautiful thing. And yeah, I have never felt more powerful as like a woman than I did pushing my first daughter out of my body. And so, Nicole, welcome to the show.

SPEAKER_00

Thank you so much. I'm excited to be here and chat about something that I could talk about for hours. So we'll see.

SPEAKER_02

So as the founder of Mind Body Baby, you give not only in-person courses and classes, but also virtual. So for anyone listening who's interested in this conversation today and taking some classes, Nicole can serve you from literally any place in the US, which is awesome.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, and I have over COVID times, it was very helpful actually.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah. When did we we crossed paths 2022?

SPEAKER_00

I was gonna say, yeah, it was like kind of on the tail end of some of that. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

And we did we did our private virtual classes and we got to pick and choose, which is awesome too. Like you have your full coverage classes, and then also ones if you there's certain ones that stick out to you the most. So, do you want to discuss? I I have to have you share your birth experiences first because when I first met you and you told me about it, I'm like, how is this possible? Does this woman not feel pain and just like uh definitely not?

Nicole’s Two Birth Stories

SPEAKER_00

I'm the biggest baby. So um, when I was pregnant with my oldest son, I was pretty naive and like didn't know what to expect and was pretty scared of the experience. But we were giving birth at Kaiser, so um I decided to take like all those classes. But the prepared childbirth class that the hospitals offer is pretty lackluster, and if anything, it made me more afraid. So then scrambling at like 33, 34 weeks, I went to the bookstore and found the hypnobirthing book by Marie Mogan. And as soon as I opened it up, I was like, oh my gosh, this is this really speaks to me. Um, it talked about a lot of intuitive things that I already knew how to do, some breath work, some visualization, and just really, really positive um expectations. And so I read that cover to cover a few times. We hired a doula. Um, I had no, I didn't necessarily like want to give birth unmedicated. I was just kind of like, I feel pretty confident, I feel excited, I'm just gonna see how it goes. And it really like wasn't that painful. It was certainly a challenge and it wasn't necessarily easy, but I I can't say that I experienced such intense pain that I was like screaming for an epidural, like people usually say. Um, and if when I got to the hardest part, it was like time to push my baby out anyway. So it was like cool, and pushing was great. Pushing like didn't hurt at all to me for that one. Um, and so it was such a great experience that that was what kind of launched me into birth work. I started teaching hypnobirthing, um, then became a birth doula and you know, got into things. And then I had my second son at home um with a midwife, and that was like an even more transcendent experience. It was a much shorter labor, which was nice because you know, I wasn't as tired. Um, but still just like not very painful. Um, he did come out a little faster, so that was that part a little bit sharper. But overall, like it was just such a joyful experience. And afterwards, I was so high from the hormones that I joke with people that like I could do it every month, you know, if I wanted a million children, because it was just it was great. It was, yes, it was a challenge, but it was manageable, yeah. And like you were saying, like I just felt so powerful as a woman. Like I had never felt more like beautiful and powerful than in those moments and having accomplished those things.

What Hypnobirthing Really Is

SPEAKER_02

So yeah, I love that. Yeah, I always like say you feel like superhuman, yeah. It's like all of a sudden you like have this like realization of like, oh, our bodies were put on this planet for this specific act, yeah. And it was just so cool. So I always love sharing hypnobirthing and just like different techniques to really help empower you for your birthday.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, and I also really felt like what hypnobirthing gave me was a way to be very connected to my body, and so that's like one of the things I like about it is yes, I had these experiences, um, but I feel like it was the connection to my body that helped me navigate the process. So I like to say that that connection's important even when things don't go smoothly, because I always told my midwife too, like, I had such a good relationship with her, and if something was going wrong and she was like, we need to go to the hospital and get a C-section, I would have been like, Great, no problem. Because I was so like in touch with what was going on.

SPEAKER_02

Totally. It's like what I learned from it, my personal experience was like you working with your body even through the discomfort and through all of that rather than working against it. Right. And so I feel like that's really important. And we'll get into all of those scenarios where, you know, maybe if your birth preference doesn't go according to plan and how this can play a whole role. So to kick us off, how for someone who has never heard of or understood hypnobirthing, how would you describe it? And then how would you describe what you do as a coach?

The Fear–Tension–Pain Cycle

SPEAKER_00

So hypnobirthing's been around since the 80s, so it's been around for a really long time. And I will say that the word has become a little bit more mainstream and it it can mean a few different things I've found these days. Um, but I think at the center of it is hypnobirthing believes that we all have our bodies all have an instinct to give birth because we're mammals. And that means that it doesn't necessarily have to be an inherently difficult, painful process, that there are ways to get in touch with that intuition and kind of allow our bodies to do what it's designed to do, or at the very least, get in touch with that intuition to navigate what comes up. Um so yeah, it's kind of like a way to prepare for an intuitive birth. I really like that concept of like giving birth intuitively because it's not so much about getting medication or not getting medication, it's more about tapping into that intuition. Um, and so the the programs vary quite a bit depending on who you talk to. But the toolkit that I like to um say is is kind of consistent includes like five, I think it's five basic pillars. There's breath work, there's um mindset, like positive affirmations, um rapid relaxation techniques or like tools that you can use in between contractions that you train yourself and your body to be conditioned to, um, visualization, which can be really helpful both for relaxation, but also like goal setting, like, oh you know, don't forget that we're getting a baby at the end of this. Um, and then the hypnosis part, which is the part that people get a little funny about. But hypnosis is just a funny word for deep relaxation, and it's a state of mind that we get into every single day when we're going to sleep and waking up. And so it's a way to tap into your subconscious to release fears and also to have your body be super, super relaxed, which makes labor easier.

SPEAKER_02

I love that. So I want to dig a little deeper into that mental and physical support that hypnobirthing offers, not just moms, but their partners, and we'll get into that too. But one thing I thought was so fascinating was the role of fear in birth and the laboring experience and why it is so important to reduce that fear. Do you want to talk about kind of what fear does to the body when you go into the birth experience with it?

Breathing And Relaxation Basics

Environment, Anchors, And Oxytocin

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. So birth is really mostly a chemical process, a hormonal process, and there's some major players in there. So oxytocin is the hormone, it's the love hormone. So, you know, it's the hormone we feel when we're intimate with somebody or bonding with your baby. Um, but it's also the hormone that creates the uterine contractions that we need to get a baby out. Um, and then endorphins function like they kind of tag along to reduce pain and like kind of dull pain receptors during that process, so it's more comfortable and possible. Um, and then there's adrenaline. So adrenaline is kind of, I always talk about it like a birthday party. So oxytocin and endorphins come early to the party, or we want them to come early to the party, and we want them to stay the whole time, and we want as much of it as we can get, especially towards the end. Adrenaline, we don't like if it comes early to the party, but we need them to come close out the party because they're kind of like exciting. But physiologically, what's happening in the body is your nervous system has like two states. There's the um parasympathetic nervous system side that keeps us calm and relaxed, rest and digest, you know, that kind of stuff. Um, and that's where those hormones flow freely, and we need a lot of them. And then there's the sympathetic sphere of the nervous system, which is the fight, flight, freezer, fawn response, um, and that's preparing you for danger. Well, if you think about when we're giving birth in the caveman days, um, if you're a laboring person and you're being chased by a saber-toothed tiger that's gonna eat you, it is not safe to have a baby. Like not only will your baby be eaten, but you'll probably be eaten. Um, and so your nervous system does a really good job of protecting you. What it does is it redirects oxygenated blood away from the core, which is where, you know, it's needed for labor and pregnancy in general. And it goes to the extremities, your your hands, your feet, um, you know, your your lungs to some extent. And that's all to help you survive and run away. Well, in 2026, whatever year it is, um, we don't have saber-toothed tigers, but uh there's so many things that act as saber-toothed tigers that our subconscious mind can't differentiate. And so um, even just a lifetime of watching scary birth scenes in movies or hearing your mom's like really scary birth story of you, you know, that turns into a saber-toothed tiger. And so when it comes to labor, when you're starting to go into labor, the adrenaline kicks into gear and it pushes out the oxytocin and the endorphins because you can't have both at the same time. And so what we see is um there's this concept of the fear, tension, pain cycle. And so when fear enters the body, you know, tension is created, tense muscles, even in the pelvis and the abdomen, um, and that you know, prevents a baby from coming out and that uh creates pain. And the more pain we're in, the more freaked out we can be, depending on the situation. Um, and so that cycle can just repeat. So if we can stop that process ahead of time, if we can reduce the amount of fear that we have, if we can prevent fear, um, but not all of it, but like you know, the biggest ones, um, then oxytocin flows freely, endorphins flow freely, muscles are relaxed, babies can come out, babies are getting more oxygenated blood, so they're happier and healthier when they come out. So, yeah, releasing and reducing fear is is so so important.

SPEAKER_02

And I'm I wanna I wanna confirm this. I I don't know if this is a stupid question, but it correct me if I'm wrong, like fear causes your body to resist the process of birth, right? So, and that's what enhances pain. Yeah, right. So when we're like especially with contractions, it's like you're scared of them, so you want to like fight them and then it makes it more painful. Yep. But I if I recall what you taught me was that when you just like surrender and like it's like an like a flow of an ocean.

SPEAKER_00

When you flow with the contractions, it's so much more, I don't want to say comfortable, but like it's it's more comfortable, not necessarily becomes 100% comfortable, but yeah, there's it's um manageable. Yeah. One of the exercises I do um in my group classes is if you take your hand, you know, and you you touch your fingers to your thumb like this, just regularly, you know, your muscles are contracting, but it doesn't hurt. Now, if you do the same thing but you tense all the muscles in your hand and then bring it to your thumb, like it's doesn't hurt maybe, but it's way less comfortable and it's harder to do. It's not enjoyable. Yeah, it's like who wants to do yeah. So if you think about like your body and your muscles are working all the time, and most of the time that doesn't hurt, but when there's some kind of dysfunction, when there's something going on causing, you know, tension, um, it makes it less comfortable. So yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_02

Okay, so when someone is experiencing this pain and discomfort and is wanting to, you know, block out fear and resistance, what are some of those things? And I know for anyone who's watching or listening, we're gonna do a fun little like demo portion at the end where you can watch Nicole demo on me or just like talk through them on camera. Um, but for now, what are some of the techniques you teach moms during the active labor phase where maybe they're feeling discomfort and pain? Like, what are some of the things that they can do to reduce that and work with their body instead of against it?

SPEAKER_00

So I will say that preparation is the most important thing. It's very tricky to do no prep and then during labor, like do something that's gonna make a huge difference. However, I will say that there are a few things. Um, so breathing, like slow, calm, deep breathing is always really helpful. It soothes the nervous system. Um, so even if you're completely losing your mind, even just slowing down your breathing, deepening your breathing can help a lot. Is there a cadence? So it I've taught like specific techniques, um, but I try not to be too rigid about it, which I is probably kind of annoying to people. But I find that again, we're trying to tap into your own intuition. So the the thing that's important to remember is um again, that like deep belly breathing, um, and also making your exhales as long as possible. So, like a deep inhale and a really slow exhale, that's the opposite of the type of breathing we do when we're scared. Like rescue breathing um is mostly like shallow chest breathing. So if we kind of do the opposite, that usually helps. Some people like to count um if you do like an in-breath for four and an out breath for six or eight. And if the counting helps, great. Some people get caught up in the counting and I'm like, Yeah, for can it.

SPEAKER_02

Okay, no, that that's good to know.

SPEAKER_00

Um, and then the second one I would say is like muscle relax relaxation. So anything you can do, even just like something as simple as relaxing the face and the hands, even if you just do those two things, it will help to keep the rest of the body relaxed. It's actually really hard. You can like kind of try it, probably. It's hard to like clench your butt muscles if you're focused on relaxing your face and your hands, like it's really weird.

SPEAKER_02

Divert distraction almost a little bit too.

Food, Comfort, And Hospital Tips

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. And so, um, oh, that's actually another another one. But uh yeah, but there's a lot of connection with the face, the mouth, the jaw to the pelvis. So um jaw relaxation can be really helpful. So one like breathing thing I like to do, I don't know if it's gonna sound weird on the microphone, but is horse lips. So that can really help with relaxation. Um, and then yeah, just like keeping your hands really relaxed because a lot of times we're like death gripping. So um, yeah, and then um you had said diverting. So then there's also something called the gate control theory of pain. Um, and so maybe some of you guys have heard of like a labor comb to squeeze. Yes. Um, the reason that works is because of this gate control theory. So basically, if you provide a different sensation somewhere else in the body, it can lessen the intensity of a painful sensation that you're having. So, like kind of gripping a spiky ball or um like the stress balls, do those help too? Or just it has like a texture, like it should be like a little bit painful, spiky.

SPEAKER_02

Oh, yeah. No, I love that.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

So uh some pain feels good.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I don't know. My my 12-year-old, we 3D print a lot of stuff, and there's these like spiky tube things he prints that I'm like, oh, these would be so great for labor, and they like feel kind of good. Like, I don't know.

SPEAKER_02

It kind of reminds me of like when you have migraines, my mom would always pinch in between my fingers. Yeah, same.

SPEAKER_00

Um accupressure, there's a lot of really good acupressure points for labor too.

SPEAKER_02

Okay, great. That's one of them, actually. Yeah, interesting. Um, do we want to talk about something I just thought about? Um, like, do you recommend setting the tone and the mood of the room?

SPEAKER_01

Yes.

SPEAKER_02

Like, what do you recommend? Like, is it like a candle or smells or light? I don't know. I feel like that would be really helpful.

Advocating For Your Space And Team

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. So, like I said, there's a lot of different um like methods of hypnobirthing. I've kind of developed my own over the years. Um, and so for my empowered hypnobirthing course, um, I talk about this five-step process to getting into like a really deep state of relaxation for labor. And the first step, we gotta start like easiest to to more difficult or more complicated, I should say it's not difficult. Um, and the first step is the environment for sure. It is very, very hard to relax in a stressful environment, right? That's why people get like white coat syndromes. Like you walk into a doctor's office and it's bright lights and it's you know, clinical versus a spa, which if you think about when you walk into a day spa, what is it like? Dim lighting, aromatherapy, soft textures, um cool colors, like soft colors. So you really want to think about your labor space both at home and in the hospital, wherever your birth center, wherever you're giving birth, um, as like a uh you know, the most relaxing environment you can you can think of.

SPEAKER_02

Like a safe haven. Yeah. You'd think of that.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, like a little labor cave. Um oxytocin loves privacy and safety. Um Um, and she's real shy. So darkness tends to be really helpful. That's why a lot of women go into labor at night because um when it's dark, your melatonin levels are higher, and that helps with oxytocin production.

SPEAKER_02

I never knew that. Yeah. I always wondered like what it is at night. I just thought it was maybe the body is so relaxed because you're sleeping.

SPEAKER_00

So when you're going to sleep, you are in a state of hypnosis. And so you're not feeling anxious, you're not worried about things, um, your body is super relaxed, and yeah, and then the melatonin production helps, which people always ask me, like, oh, should I take melatonin? No, it's not the same. Your body has to make it in order for it to work. But um, yeah, so you know, thinking about like dim, soft lighting. So like flameless candles, um, twinkle lights, like little like Christmas lights are really great. Um, I had my my second baby was born in December, so I was like all about the Christmas lights everywhere, and there were so many twinkle lights, and it was fantastic. It made for a really great postpartum as well. Oh but um yeah, so um lighting and then we also talk about like environmental anchors. So um an anchor is basically an association, so the way you feel when you come in contact with something, so smells, scents are really a big one. Um so a lot of people will kind of use a specific scent, like an essential oil or something, lavender tends to be really popular. And when they are practicing their techniques or listening to an audio track, um they'll make maybe smell or diffuse that scent. And then when it comes to labor and they smell it, instantly it brings their body into more of a state of real life.

SPEAKER_02

So it's like association. Yep. Oh my gosh.

The Partner’s Playbook

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, okay, and you can do it with any scent, it doesn't have to be essential oils. I know some hospitals these days don't allow them. Um, although then I just joke like make your partner an essential oil and just like rub it on them before Yeah, and you just like be sniffing their neck while you're exactly and I mean ideally you're kind of near them like that anyway. So yeah, um, yeah, scents and then um put on your pillow if you bring a pillow. Oh, that's actually a really good idea. I never even thought of it.

SPEAKER_02

I only thought of that because I have this like lavender pillow spray to help me like calm and it's supposed to help me sleep at night. So maybe like spraying that on a couple weeks before birth and then bringing a pillow with that. Such a good idea.

SPEAKER_00

Because I do tell people to bring your own pillow.

SPEAKER_02

I love bringing my own um what's it called? Pregnancy pillow too, to the hospital. I love like cuddling with it when I'm like if I'm laboring overnight, oh for sure. Progressing beds are so uncomfortable. Yeah. And because you're like hooked up and everything, it's like you can't get comfortable.

SPEAKER_00

It's hard. And the pillows they have, that's why I always tell partners too. I'm like, one of your first jobs when you walk in is ask for as many pillows as you can possibly get your hands on because we need to be propping her up in all the ways. That's smart.

SPEAKER_02

So you don't even have to bring your pregnancy pillow, just utilize all of it.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, yeah. I mean, you certainly don't have to, but the I pack for a vacation, like a two-week vacation.

SPEAKER_02

I know, I know you don't need to, but it just makes me feel it makes me feel better every time. Like we were gossiped about among the nurses, like in a funny way of like they're literally moving in cases of well they they knew us for weeks before because I was I had multiple hospital stays with the first pregnancy. And so one of the nurses came in and was like, Hey, I heard everyone's talking about all your luggage. Like, do you need like a bell boy? I'm like, you know what? We're like, actually, yeah, that would be helpful if you have one, sure. I mean, hospitals suck.

SPEAKER_00

Why not bring stuff that makes you comfortable?

SPEAKER_02

Um, sorry, I'm taking us totally off topic, but back to okay, so like sense and everything. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

So I know you can't really eat, but like you can eat.

SPEAKER_02

Okay, so let's talk about that. Could you bring snacks that like make you like your your feel-good snacks, your comfort feels to help like ease anxiety and everything too? That'll help.

SPEAKER_00

I mean, if you think about like labor comfort, you want to attack all the senses, all the senses. So with um lighting and you know, we've got the visual um smelling and then taste, like bring some chocolate, bring your favorite like electrolyte drink or snacks. Um, I mean, you can eat. There's really no reason you can't eat unless you have like, I don't know, some kind of serious medical condition, or you know you're gonna have a C-section. That those are different. But if you're healthy and you're planning to have a vaginal birth, like you can eat.

SPEAKER_02

Okay, I'm gonna remember that this time around because I was so hungry when I was induced the first time because they don't let you eat. And I was like sneaking, like I remember sneaking like a little cracker being like, I'm so hungry, I'm going to pass out. I'm like, how am I supposed to have so much energy to push this baby out of me, but I'm not allowed to eat for pretty much 23 hours before?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, exactly. And it's like I can't go 24 hours without eating on a normal day. Oh no. Let alone a day that I have a huge muscle in my body working and contracting every couple of minutes. So it's crazy. And it's all due to fear of liability and outdated stuff. Totally. So yeah, please eat.

SPEAKER_02

Great. Um, anything else you recommend before we move on to the partners?

Demos: Breathing, Touch, Counterpressure

SPEAKER_00

Um, we're talking about like stuff you bring, you know, having like a cozy blanket, like textures, soft textures. That's why I like bringing your own pillow is nice. Um and then I also will say to the environment, like vibes. Like make sure that everybody in the space is aware of the vibe that you want. Like, make sure everyone's on board. So I know people like to bring their whole families to their labors, but think twice about it because you know, giving birth is very similar to having sex, having a bowel movement. Like these things require a sense of privacy.

SPEAKER_02

Very intimate.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. So if you wouldn't have sex or poop in front of somebody, you might want to think twice about inviting them to your labor. Um, and and having a conversation beforehand, like with your partner, with your if your sister's gonna come support you or whoever, like I, you know, tell them how you want the space to be and make sure that they know how to advocate for you for that and energy as well, like with the nurses.

SPEAKER_02

Um I feel like being vocal with your nurses at the beginning about that as well. Like, I remember my early, I think it was like my first or second nurse in the induction. She was so rude and snappy. And I was like telling Sorry, I'm like, this bitch has gotta go because I am not feeling it. This is my day. Good for you.

SPEAKER_00

Don't really you're the queen of the day.

SPEAKER_02

Thankfully, by the time I like gave birth, she had like just gone off the clock, but my water broke, like it it punctured and like leaked out, and it was on the ground. It was like slightly like bloody tinted. Yeah. And I called her, I'm like, hey, my water just broke. She's like no, it didn't. You peed yourself. And I'm like, and she like throws a towel on it and starts wiping it with her foot. I'm like, but look, it's like pinky, it looks like there's a little blood. She's like, it's pee. And I'm like, I know I didn't pee. I know what hole it came out of that was like I knew my body enough. Yes. And so she was gaslighting me and I looked at Scotty and I'm like, what? So then I went to the bathroom and I'm sorry, Caleb um is in here who he's like on the video team. And what I'm about to say, you can close your ears. Um but my my mucus plug came out. Oh yeah. And I was like, I knew it in your water. And then as I like entered out of the bathroom, all of a sudden the contraction started like ramping up. And so I came out, I was like, my mucus plug came out. I knew that was mine.

SPEAKER_00

And what's crazy is she could have just tested it.

SPEAKER_02

She didn't want, she knew for some reason. I was like, what? I know she's like, it's your first time. Like, you know nothing, you don't know anything about your body. And I'm like, okay, I totally get that. I'm not this all-knowing person, but intuitively, I was like, I know that wasn't it.

SPEAKER_00

It feels so different. Like if you and you hadn't had an epidermal at that point. No, like you could feel it, you feel the difference between standing your pants.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, I was standing up. It's funny. Uh, for some reason, Scotty was like filming me and he caught it on camera of like uh my water rupturing. Yeah. And literally, I think like 24 million people have did that.

SPEAKER_00

That's actually pretty cool though, because it's a funny message.

SPEAKER_02

And it was like just like the realness behind it. It was very hilarious. But anyways, my point in all that is like making sure like the support team around you is good vibes too. And if they're not, I think you're allowed to say something about that.

SPEAKER_00

Oh, you for sure can fire your nurses. Um, you can do it kind of sneakily, like usually I tell partners just to go out to talk to the charge nurse. And, you know, I also do say we shouldn't be having any kind of adversarial feeling towards hospital staff. You know, everyone's just trying to do their job. And I actually really feel for nurses because those poor souls are overworked and underpaid. But um, yeah, you can just go out to the charge nurse and say, hey, it's just it's really not a good fit. Is there anybody else that's on right now she can trade with? Um, we're doing hypnobirthing or we're trying to have an unmedicated birth or whatever the case may be. Like, is there anybody on right now that would maybe be a better fit? And the charge nurse will make it happen, and it's not like you have to say it to the nurse's face. No, that's a good point.

SPEAKER_02

And 99.9% of the nurses are angels. Absolute angels. Like it's one of those things that's like lives rent-free in my mind. Like, I know the nurses that were there for me. Those first, like my first birth, my second birth. I I remember their faces. I just like remember everything about them. Yeah. Because they become like, it feels like part of your family. Like, oh my gosh, you helped me through those times.

SPEAKER_00

It's an impactful moment of your life. One of my doula clients, um, they actually named their or they gave the nurses, what am I trying to say? Their baby's middle name was the nurse's name because the nurse like helped save their baby's life when the doctor like wasn't there yet.

SPEAKER_02

I'm not shocked. 100%.

SPEAKER_00

It's very impactful. And you're right, most of them are absolute angels.

Final Mindset And Resources

SPEAKER_02

Oh, amazing moments. And they care so much. Yeah. Like I remember my nurses from the beginning of when I was induced, they obviously weren't on the clock by the time I had my baby. And when we were in the postpartum uh wing, the nurses came in and were like, we had to come meet your baby. And I was like, You care about one of the the dozen you see a day for, you know, but they really do. Yeah. So take care of your nurses is another thing. Like the little goodies, and just it's yeah, they're they're your cheerleaders if your family's not there and along with your partner. Okay, so let's get into the partner's role. Okay. Now that we're talking about that. Um, I think a common misconception is that partners are essentially like useless or helpless during the laboring and birth process. But after taking your courses, I found out that was completely false. And Scotty had so many marching orders when going into the hospital. And I feel like yeah, he felt really confident and equipped in how to support me. And so I want to talk about that. Like, what does a prepared partner look and feel like going into labor? And then what are some of the techniques that you teach them in your classes?

SPEAKER_00

So, one thing I would say is for partners, don't let her be the one that does all the research and the classes. Like do classes with her, read the books. Um, I actually like to put partners in charge of the birth plan. Uh, I tell them that, you know, obviously they're talking together about what they want on it, but I want the partners to actually physically write it out so that they are really familiar with what the plan is so that they can advocate. Because that's one of their big jobs is to be like the protector of the space, you know, the energy police, um, the communicator. Because she's busy. She we can't bring her out of her of her zone. She needs to focus on what's happening in her body. Um, even with an epidural, like there's still a lot that she needs to be, you know, focusing on. Um, and so it's his job to communicate and communicate effectively. So um I would say that that's uh really important, like being involved in the the research, the education, um, attending, you know, prenatal appointments as much as possible. I know it's hard with work, but um that's always really helpful. Um and then yeah, I I like to give partners a lot to do. So, like I said, being the the protector of the space, it's also important for them to learn these tools to help her stay relaxed. So learning, I have the partners like do the um techniques right along with the moms so that they can kind of understand how it feels. I also joke too. I'm like, you're gonna be a new dad, you're fully stressed out, like you need these tools.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, like the breathing techniques the men can use too during the Yeah, like don't pass out to start breathing.

SPEAKER_00

Um, so yeah, like learning the breathing techniques so that he can kind of coach her during the moments where she's losing it. Because my God, when you're in labor, you don't remember how to breathe all the time. Like you need constant reminding and encouragement.

SPEAKER_02

That's the most important piece. I think like the woman's mind, like you you're on a different planet at some point, especially if you're I remember my contractions were so quick and long, and the anesthesiologist was in an emergency C section, so I had to go through that for over an hour. Oh my gosh. And Scotty was on his knees next to me, just reminding me of everything that we spoke about, the different breathing, the different like asking the pressure points that he could do on my back or the comb. And he was the one guiding me through the different options when I wouldn't remember them in the moment.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, exactly, because you're not gonna remember it. No, that's why I also encourage people to take a hypnobirthing class like earlier in the pregnancy. People tend to want to take it at the end so they can remember. I'm like, you ain't gonna remember. You need to do it for so long that it becomes something that's second nature and it's not something you have to remember. But for partners, they have to remember. Um, so so yeah, like learning all of the tools and the techniques. There's um scripts that I give partners so that they can kind of know what to say. I find that partners can be kind of intimidated, they don't want to get in the way, they don't want to say the wrong thing, they don't want to make her mad. So um, you know, just being really, really encouraging, being very, very positive is usually important. Um, and then yeah, there's a ton of like physical comfort measures that we go over, like the counter pressure stuff.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, let's show those in the demo in a little bit. Um there's also affirmations, right? You give affirmations to the woman and like the partner to help talk through it all.

SPEAKER_00

I actually um in I don't know how many years ago I started doing this, but I I started giving partners their own set of affirmations, and they also get their own like audio track and their own relaxation track because I feel like it's really important for partners to remain calm as well. Like they have to be her rock, so they can't be, you know, passing out or freaking out or being scared or being timid. Um, and I've I've been in the room where partners freak out because their their wife or girlfriend is like making noises they've never heard and they think she's in intense pain. And I'm like, bro, this is just me and the nurse are like, what's wrong with this guy? Like clearly never done this before because this is very normal, and she's doing great. Like she was fine, and she had to calm him down. Oh no. So I think it was after that that I was like, okay, yeah, boys, you're gonna, you're gonna have to get yourself in check here because yeah.

SPEAKER_02

No, that's a great point. That like even if they're a little frantic on the inside, having the tools to like be that rock, and like when the I feel like when the woman is looking at the man and like, oh, you're calm, you're relaxed, you're confident about this, and you're cheering me on, like, oh, we're good.

SPEAKER_00

Yep, yeah. And being educated about the process, I think helps them be calm too. Because men especially have not really thought about the process of childbirth outside of that looks gross and scary and dangerous, until it's time for them to have a baby with their partner. So them understanding what's normal and what's not it helps them to be calm because they're like, Oh yeah, I remember reading about that, and that's normal, or they know the right questions to ask to see like what's going on. Um, and so that really helps for sure.

SPEAKER_02

And this is also important when it comes to like your birth plan or preference not going according to plan. Yeah. Like if an emergency c-section, or just like you're not progressing, that it's forced to have a C-section, or maybe the nursing team is recommending different things to help progress your your dilation. Like, it's also for those moments, right? Hypnobirthing and like a male's part in all of that. It's really good for not just, I think actually more than like your birth plan will most likely never go according to plan. So I think these are tools for both you and your partner in those moments where you have to make these decisions that you never thought you'd be making.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

And like how to tackle those together and have your partner guide you.

SPEAKER_00

And I mean being calm in those moments is really important because you don't want to be making decisions out of fear. Um, you want to be able to make decisions that feel right and that you're not gonna regret later or things like that. And so when your mind is calm, it's able to think more logically and you have access to more of your brain when you're calm. So really it helps with that too.

SPEAKER_02

Also, for anyone listening, if I sound different, I sound so croaky. I feel okay. I was gonna say you seem fine. And so I sound a little like a frog, but I'm I think you sound great. Okay. Um, should we get into the demo portion? Sure, if you want to. Okay, great.

SPEAKER_00

So, first we'll go over some calm breathing, and then um we'll do some like light touch massage. So I'm actually gonna have you just go ahead and relax back.

SPEAKER_02

Show off my big belly.

SPEAKER_00

Um, and you can either place your hands on your belly or just loosely in your lap, whatever is more comfortable for you. And good, look at you, you're already closing your eyes. I can see your back right now. Okay, so what I want you to do is um think about breathing into your belly or into your hands, and you're gonna take a deep breath in through your nose. And then as you exhale, let the air out really slowly, either through your nose or relax now. One thing I keep breathing like that. One thing I teach partners, um, especially if she's sitting like on a birth wall, is you can do like a shoulder anchor with her breathing. So go ahead and breathe in, you're just gonna place your hands on her shoulders. And then as she breathes out, you just gently press down.

SPEAKER_02

So good. Should I have Scotty in here?

SPEAKER_00

I know. So it's just a good way to help you feel grounded, especially when you're like sitting on a ball or in the bed, and it just kind of presses you down and grounds your nervous system. Another place um that can be really nice is like the chest. Good.

SPEAKER_02

Wow. I have ghost bumps. That's better than any prenatal massage I've ever had.

SPEAKER_00

So then um another technique we teach partners is light touch massage. So um, you know, when we think about massage, usually it's like this kind of massage, right? But that can be really tiring for partners after like seven hours. Um, and also it can be really overstimulating for laboring moms. So instead with light touch, we just use like the back of the fingernail. Just lightly over the skin, and you know, you could either do it like this. Sometimes some people find that too ticklish, so you can also just do like um flat palms. Um people also kind of like the gentle squeezing, which can be nice, like that, um, especially like at the hips, like for counter pressure. Um, we can show that too. Um, also, did you like having your hair played with?

SPEAKER_02

Oh my gosh, okay, it's that comb thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh my gosh, you can get it off Amazon. What do they call that? I don't know, like scratcher thing.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. So um a lot of people like having like their hair played with or like even pulled a little bit. Um, but sometimes that can feel nice. So you also want to think about like where we're putting the light touch massage and then the pacing. So like this isn't gonna feel good for seven hours, right? Like it's too fast, it's on one spot. So you want to think about keeping the movement random, um, thinking about places where she doesn't normally get touch. So, like, you know, all these kind of intimate places that aren't like the major zones.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, like don't go for my nipples.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, we don't need to go to nipples, but we could do like side boob, under boob, side of the belly, inner thighs, you know, all those areas tend to be kind of nice. Um, and then also like hands. So um there's a ton of nerve endings in the hands, and we don't normally have anybody like touch and massage our hands, so it can feel really special and really nice, and also um prevents some of that, you know, like tension from building up in the hands, so that's always good. Um yeah, I'm trying to think of what else.

SPEAKER_02

So those are great. That like brought me back. I thought what about the head scratcher thing? Yeah, that was the best little thing that I brought. Yeah, I need to order another one. I don't know where mine went.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I know. One of my kids broke mine, but the that like goose pimply feeling that you get like that's endorphins. That's like where we're creating like your body's natural pain reliever. So amazing.

SPEAKER_02

Should we do the compression thing?

SPEAKER_00

So if you want to just like lean over the chair and show the camera your butt. Sorry guys. So um, sacral counter pressure can usually feel really good, so even just constant pressure on her sacrum like this is good, and then the hip squeeze, it's kind of hard. I always feel like I have to show people in person the hip squeeze, but basically, you find the top of her hips and then you put the bottom of your palms in like the juicy part of her butt with your fingers touching her hips, and then turn your fingers inwards towards each other and squeeze the bones together. And what it does is it kind of opens the pelvic outlet to relieve some of the pressure as baby's head is moving down. Your baby's probably already kind of low.

SPEAKER_02

She's so low. We were at the doctor yesterday, she's like, we can't even see your face because it's in your like pelvic bone already.

SPEAKER_00

Like, all right. Um, I also like to get in here with my hands along the sacroiliac joints because everything is opening as the baby's coming down, the back of their heads pressing on the sacrum. So this usually feels really good during labor too. Anything with the hips, lots of like deep tissue massage. So it's like light tissue or light touch everywhere else down here. We want pressure, and don't be afraid to touch her. She'll tell you when she doesn't like it.

SPEAKER_03

Yes.

SPEAKER_00

Um, but if she doesn't say anything, that means it's good to do.

unknown

I love that.

SPEAKER_02

Well, I remember like before I got my epidural and I was like thrown over the top of the hospital bed, like almost throwing up because I was in so much pain and I was just in this different state. And Scotty was trying to touch me, like, don't touch me.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

I'm about to throw up and the little touches, like you think you're gonna want it sometimes. Yeah, and it's like you want something else, but then like the deep pressure down here was so nice. Yeah, so it's nice to like have the variety.

SPEAKER_00

Yep, just keep trying stuff. I I don't want partners to ever feel like intimidated or scared that they're gonna do something wrong. Like, you can't, she'll tell you exactly what she thinks, but doing nothing is worse, like just keep trying stuff until she tells you to stop.

SPEAKER_02

I love that. Yeah, well, thank you for the demos. Of course. Sorry, I had my butt in the camera for you guys to see. But those those back the pressure points are just my favorite. I remember just like leaning over the hospital bed when I was feeling better, but still a little uncomfortable, and oh, that relief that it gave me. Yeah. It was 10 out of 10. Yeah. Okay, let's get back to chatting. Okay, so I hope you guys loved that demo. Um, if you're listening, feel free to watch it back on YouTube. We'll also post these clips on social for you to look at. Um, don't try to watch these if you're driving. Um always like have to say that as a disclaimer. I'm like, I do not want to be responsible for someone's car accident. Um, but to kind of close us out, I think this episode's been so informative, but I want to ask one more question of what is one thing that you want moms to remember and understand before heading into their birthday?

SPEAKER_00

That they likely have a well of strength and power available to them that they aren't aware of, maybe, or maybe they are, but that that's always accessible and the way they use that doesn't have to necessarily be overt, like you know, we think of strength and power as like loud and big, but it can also be in the quiet way somebody advocates for what they want or you know, speaks up for themselves, even gently or quietly. Um, and it can also be like telling a nurse to F off, but that that's that's within every woman, and I believe that wholeheartedly. I I think that we just have been told to suppress it.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah. No, that is such a good answer. It's better than anything I would have come up with. Um but it's it's true, like it just reminded me, it like brought me back to my birth experiences where I have uncovered different strengths and things about myself that I never knew existed through those challenging and just larger than life moments. And it is such a cool experience to be like, oh my gosh, like I'm way cooler than I thought I was. Exactly. Yeah, no, I love that. Well, thank you so much for your time and your knowledge. I hope everyone just gains so much information and confidence for anyone who might be taking on birth. Maybe it's your first, maybe it's your second, or maybe it could be your third, like me. I feel I feel ready to give birth. I wish I was about to give burger like like I still got it come any sooner. Yeah, I got I still got some time to go. Um, so where can people find you? And then if people are interested in like booking with you, what's the best way to get in contact with you and learn more about your classes and all that?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, so um my website is mindbodybabyoc.com and then I'm on Instagram at mindbodybabyoc. Um email is probably the best way, but I'm also pretty responsive on socials like with messaging. So yeah, and I have um I have a studio in Mission Viejo in Orange County that we have lots of classes and support groups um in person, but I also offer a ton of different stuff virtually as well.

Closing & Where To Find Nicole

SPEAKER_02

Amazing. And as always, you can find all of her information in the show notes. So easy access to get a hold of Nicole. Thank you all for joining me on another episode of The Milk. We'll see you next time.

Head Shot

Tayla Burke

Host