International Students Collaboration with ICEF - challenging stereotypes, learning from other countries, affordability and changing study patterns

We're excited to share our latest Housed podcast episode in collaboration with Martijn van de Veen , Chief Business Development Officer at ICEF. This session is ahead of the The inaugural ICEF Monitor Global Summit in September which has a track dedicated to student accommodation.

Sarah Canning and Deenie Lee will be speaking at the event in September, looking at insights from our latest research Unlocking Global Perspectives of Student Accommodation. They will be joining a host of other experts in the sector who will be focusing on affordability, availability, accessibility, and accountability in international student accommodation.

Find out more about the event: https://www.icef.com/events/icef-accommodation/

Some of the topics covered in this podcast episode:
🔵 The importance of collaboration globally - looking into different markets
🔵 Challenging the typical ‘international student’ stereotype
🔵 Tackling supply and demand and therefore affordability.

Each week, Sarah Canning, Deenie Lee of The Property Marketing Strategists and Daniel Smith of Student Housing Consultancy will be delving into a wide variety of subjects and asking the questions that aren't often asked. This podcast is for anyone who works in Student Accommodation, BTR, Co-living, Operational Real Estate or Shared Living.

Disclaimer: The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are the personal views of the individual hosts.

Transcript

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SPEAKER_03 0:00

Hello and welcome to this special episode of House the Shared Living Podcast. Brought to you by me, Dan Smith from Student Housing Consultancy, Sarah Canning and Deanny Lee from the Property Marketing Strategist. Now this episode is a collaboration between House and ISEF. So our guest host for this week and bringing an extra level of professionalism, I'm sure, to the podcast will be Martheim and the Ven. For those of you that don't know ISEF, it's very much at the heart of international education, offering data insights, defence, and thought leadership for universities, education agents, student accommodation providers, and any other service providers into international education. And personally, when I think of ISEF, I think of Marthein, and we're very grateful for him to make time for us during his busy schedule as an international man of mystery flying around the world to the various ISEF events. So without further ado, let me hand over to Martine. And do please like, subscribe, and review the podcast if you enjoyed it. Thanks very much.

SPEAKER_00 1:01

Welcome everyone to this special episode of the ICEF Podcast in a unique collaboration with Houst, the Shared Living Podcast, together with Houst Podcast moderators Deanny Lee, Sarah Canning, and Daniel Smith. Next to being podcast moderators, Sarah and Deanny are co-founders of the Property Marketing Strategists, and Daniel is the managing director of Student Housing Consultancy. My name is Martijn van der Veen, and this special episode also serves as a bit of a warm-up for the ICEF Monitor Global Summit in London on September 23rd, where accommodation is one of the main themes with a track dedicated entirely to student housing topics, such as the crucial role of agents and educators in the accommodation booking process, tackling the AAA in student accommodation issues, affordability, availability, accountability, homestay as the safe space for students overseas, and the connection between accommodation and mental health, just to mention a few. The sessions will feature key speakers and thought leaders from the accommodation and international education sectors and various providers of accommodation and related services we'll be exhibiting at the summit. Like Vita Student, for example, sponsor of this special podcast episode. For more information about the event and options to join us there, please visit isev.com slash accommodation. So, Deanny, Sarah, and Daniel, I'm excited to be on this unique podcast collaboration. The first time we do this, especially with the three of you, as it reflects what's so important, I think, when you want to tackle an issue, and that is to bring different stakeholders together. And in this case, stakeholders in accommodation and stakeholders in international education, because Sarah, the way to properly look at international accommodation is to look at it from different perspectives, right? Rather than having these discussions in our very own echo chambers.

SPEAKER_02 2:49

Yeah, absolutely. I think that kind of is why we do a lot of the work that we do around insights and webinars and podcasts and is really to open up those conversations. I think we've managed to delve into some pretty meaty and tricky conversations that they've been really welcome. So I think people are really keen and really motivated to have these conversations and collaborate with people, but sometimes they just need to be poked a little bit and you know and motivated to actually bring these conversations and to the public. So we're really, really grateful that you've invited us to be on the podcast today, Artile, and like I said, hopefully we'll get some good feedback and sort of provoke some more conversation. Um and that's the only way that we can evolve and um you know create better products for students, better services, um, and learn from each other, really.

SPEAKER_00 3:44

Yeah, so true. Po can motivate the right stakeholders. I think you're very good at that. And obviously you're going for lots of publications and insights into what's happening here. But uh, let's poke a bit further into the theme of today's uh podcast collaboration. The title is The Complexities of International Student Accommodation. That already sounds challenging. We've talked about complexities already, and so let's take a look at what these complexities are. And if I may give a first go at it, I guess it really comes down to three main themes. First of all, the specific challenges, requirements, and needs of international students compared to domestic students. Secondly, the the imbalance, to say it mildly, uh, between supply and demand that exists across nearly all major study destinations, which also has an impact on the pricing, I imagine. And thirdly, the responsibility that education providers have to facilitate access to accommodation for the students that they enroll. Now, Daniel, that's that's a lot to cover in in 30, 40 minutes, but would you agree that these are roughly the main themes when you talk about complexities in international student accommodation?

SPEAKER_03 4:46

The word, and also we can't forget that every single market is at different stages of maturity. And so the supply-demand balance is um uh is is sometimes weighted very heavily in terms of supply and sometimes very heavily weighted in terms of demand. So we have to make sure that we are cutting through that, helping each country in particular and uh and each region to improve that supply-demand uh balance. Because if you do that, then firstly, investors can win. Also, most importantly, students can win. And I think in terms of making uh accommodation more suitable, more affordable, the more stock that we build in the right locations and at the right suitability, uh the cheaper it gets because the occupancy levels start to even out, and that supply-demand balance becomes ultimately much more sustainable.

SPEAKER_02 5:44

I think also just to add to the complexity, when we talk about international students, that's not one body of students. So quite often, you know, everybody in the industry talks about domestic students and international students. But those two groups are made up of many, many, many subsets of different types of students. So I think when we're doing that, we need to be careful not to generalize. Um it's easier to, obviously. Um, but you know, we know from our research that just saying international students like this and domestic students like that, that's you know, that's just that's um glossing over the real issues.

SPEAKER_00 6:19

That's a really important point that you're making there, because indeed, if we start with the let's see, the accommodation needs of international students versus domestic students. I mean, Sarah and Dean, you have recently published a full report titled Unlocking Global Perspectives on Student Accommodation, where you indeed dive deeper into what international students really want. And indeed, can we actually compare this cohorts to domestic students? In the end, we are dealing with individuals. But regardless, I would assume that there are some, let's say, common denominators uh that set international students apart compared to domestic students. If there were some of these, Deini, which ones would you highlight based on your research?

SPEAKER_01 6:58

Yeah, I mean, first I just want to reiterate what Sarah says, really, that actually I don't think there is one size fits all for any students, whether they're domestic or international. Different domestic students have different needs, international students have different needs. Um, and I think our research has obviously delved a bit deeper into kind of what those international student needs compared to the domestic. And overall, generally, those international domestics are looking for, on a broad spectrum, a very similar thing of good quality accommodation at an affordable price that meets their needs. But when you delve a bit deeper into that, is where you start to see those nuances of what different types of students need in those different cohorts. One of the that we we tackled lots of different subjects across our research from contract lengths to whether there should be an ensuite, um, what goes in the room, and what students are willing to pay for. So it was a broad spectrum of things that we discussed, and I kind of got a list of some of the key things that we brought out around kind of where different students, um, different nationalities differ in that. Um, overall, we found that 37% of students would prefer a 38 to 44-week contract length, and 30% of them actually would like a full length of contract for the entirety of their degree. So we're looking at a three-year contract type. The other big discovery, I guess, that we had was that 60% don't actually prioritize an ensuite, um, which in the UK specifically, very much international students is a deemed thing. International students want to have a studio, um, they want an ensuite, but actually, what we discovered is really no, for some it is important, but over 60% it's not the vital thing that they are looking for. Um, and on top of that, only 12% would choose to live alone. So, this idea of studio apartments is the only thing that international students want, is really debunked from our research, is actually it's probably the only thing that is available to them and is there. And the other the other thing that we discussed was around willingness to share a bedroom. So 32% of international students expressed that willingness to share a bedroom. Two in five Asian students are willing to share, which is double that of Europeans. So, again, we're getting a shift between those from Asia and those from Europe. Um, and when you delve further into that Asian cohort, 45% of those are Indian students that want to share a room. So again, you begin to build up this picture around what's your demographic, who is your demographic, what what are they looking for? And it's very different across the patch, really.

SPEAKER_03 9:39

I think some of that is the cultural norms as well, isn't it? In terms of um Indian students being particularly used to dorms in in India. Um I know that the PBSA and the co-living that that they have out there for the most part um are shared rooms. And and then take a look at America, for example, pre-COVID, that was very much you go to your dorm room, you get your your roommate, and and you're in pretty much a twin room. And I think there's that normality that you know that's a bit of a legacy, I suppose. COVID has um has sort of curtailed that in the States, and I know that they're focused much more on uh on suites and making sure that you aren't sharing too many amenities, et cetera. Um uh but but I do see that sharing rooms is a real focal point for international students in particular who are focused on affordability, and I think that's where there's a real opportunity on a global level to look at um admittedly, we know that Chinese students, for example, they typically like studios. They have done in the past in the UK, they are starting to in in Europe as well. We're starting to see more prevalence of studios there. Um, but how much can we bring about more affordable stock by changing the room mix, not doing the same old things? And I think that's what we really want to see. The the work that you did, um Sarah and Deany was really good at drawing attention to that, that it shouldn't just be build the same old things um and just focus on studios and on suites, because that's what makes the numbers work, that's what gets the investors involved. It's really starting to think how can we solve the affordability crisis and the supply crisis by building more beds and looking outside the box.

SPEAKER_00 11:26

And by better responding to the needs of the students, as laid out in uh Sarah and Dini's report. So, as that report gives us a better understanding of the specific needs of international students versus domestic ones, let's take a look at the the options that they have because let's be honest, it is wonderful to better understand what they want, but it starts with what they need, and that is, first of all, a place to stay. And affordability comes uh comes in here, uh Daniel. Is there really much choice? And when there is, how affordable is it? I guess we keep coming back to the same issues lack of availability and the student housing shortage, as far as I understand, is only getting bigger. Or do you see some light uh at the end of the availability uh tunnel, Daniel?

SPEAKER_03 12:06

Do you know what? I'm I'm at in the UK in particular. I am starting to see some green shoots of maturity, let's call them. Um and by that I mean it's going to be an interesting year for our applications. And um, you know, a lot of internationals are uh either deferring or looking at other locations, and they are concerned about the cost of living. Um and and so we're seeing that as uh that sort of manifesting itself in a drop in our applications. Nothing major to worry about, and I think some of it was pent-up demand from COVID, but as a result, there are some cities in the UK that previously have had um far too little supply that now look like they are reaching maturity, and and they are cities like Nottingham and Leeds, and maybe in a couple of years' time, the likes of Bristol, for example. And I can see there being um a real opportunity there for students to get the best value for money because everywhere there is a supply-demand imbalance in favor of a lack of supply, the prices, the rental prices have shot up. We've had 20% increases in the likes of Glasgow or Durham or York or Edinburgh, numerous other places as well over the last few years, like year-on-year increases of around 20%. And that's not sustainable because it's pricing out students from being able to afford going to university in a certain city. So the lower that the occupancy gets in those buildings, because the more supply and the bigger the pipeline gets and the more supply comes on board, uh the better it is for the students. The prices will drop, the occupancy will stabilize, and that university will then have a sustainable platform to really build on. And so for me, from a student point of view, I do feel like there are definitely pockets of maturity in the UK. Um, we're starting to see some in the likes of Barcelona as well, and uh and Madrid and a few other places in Spain, certain cities in France, certain cities in Germany, again, all showing certain signs of that. Some of that may be to do with um, you know, long-term trends in China in particular. I do feel like the PBSA sector from an international perspective was set up to cope with uh bookings from China and applications from China, but that's very much changing now with the increase in Indian students in particular. That is the burgeoning um uh uh nationality uh that is applying on a global level, not just to the UK or the US or Canada or English-speaking countries, but to European countries as well now. So I think there's a real opportunity there for students to get better value for money, universities to capitalize on affordable accommodation, um, and ultimately investors, developers, operators to make sure that they are building the right product at the right price.

SPEAKER_00 15:10

Do you know what? I love that mix of optimism with poetry, Dan. I didn't know you had it in you. Greeting for real maturity. Uh, Sarah, do you share that optimism?

SPEAKER_02 15:20

I think the sector has been so good, and I'm sure you see this across Europe, Altime, that it's been such a buoyant sector that developers, operators, investors have been able to charge almost what they want for student accommodation. And it's difficult to argue when occupancy has been so good. So, why would anyone change the product and why would anyone change anything about the proposition, the contract, for example, if the rooms have been fully built and the investors are getting their return? So it it will take that shift, and we have seen it done right in a couple of cities in in the UK. Um I think it's probably quite a slow moving shift um to make significant changes, but it but it has to, um, because the sector can't be sustainable, increasing rent year on year in double figures and in certain cities. And we in the UK we now have a new government um that seems to be very proactive about planning. So there's been a blockage um which has kind of suppressed supply, and yes, it'll still take at least three to five years for us to see you know to see that coming through, but all of a sudden there could be you could see this 10 cups of supply just being unleashed into various cities. And you know, we always say that it's such a shame that the tech moves so slowly in that case because actually there probably was a shortage of student accommodation three years ago when these planning applications were were put in put in place and they were made in good faith. But because everything's taken so long and planning hasn't materialized, there could just be this kind of yeah this you know sudden release of of dead numbers, and you know, student accommodation is so intrinsically linked completely with education. So within those you know, five years, something may have changed at a university or a particular course, and that supply may not be needed anymore. Um, so it's it's difficult working in a sector that has to be so agile. You know, at the end of the day, you know, Deanny and I marketeers, we're marketing to students, we're marketing to Gen Z and soon to be Gen Alpha, a real changing demographic that the sector that's kind of responsible for you know for education and accommodation actually moves quite slowly.

SPEAKER_03 17:49

Um, I I think we've got to be building three or four years in advance, and that is the real challenge that we have because so many cities will go through an entire cycle of maturity in three years. We've seen it in Liverpool, we've seen it in Newcastle, we're starting to see it potentially in Nottingham and Leeds, and in three years' time, for example, Bristol's the best example. Over the last couple of years, they have had to bust students in from Wales. They've had to house students in Wales and then bust them in to the campus, onto the campus. Uh, and that's obviously not sustainable. The university has made hay while the sun shines because they want to get as many students in as they possibly can. Well, what we're finding now is that so many developers are now building in Bristol that realistically, in two years, three years' time, that pipeline will be very mature. And, you know, there will be thousands of new beds that come online at around the same time. Now, the universities are also building their own stock too. So, what does that mean for you know ultimately the supply? It just grows and grows and grows and it is unregulated. Now, with you know, and that and that's even with the old planning regime. So, all of those new pipelines, all of that new pipeline, all of those buildings has come through a really archaic, challenging planning regime. So with the Labour government supposedly opening the floodgates to um uh to housing in particular, looking to build one and a half million houses over the course of this parliament over the next four or five years. Um, I do think that it will get easier to build. There will be some investors and developers that get caught out by that because they've underwritten occupancy at 97%, as most investors and developers do. And actually the best they can hit is 60%. And that cycle of maturity is really being born out in Coventry. Now, Coventry was the darling of the international student for quite some time. Coventry University did incredibly well, and then it just dropped off a cliff. And those numbers really tanked uh in terms of the international applications. And during that time, developers and investors had built thousands upon thousands of beds, about sort of 10 to 12,000 beds in Coventry. And most of those now are around 70% occupied. Stu Rents, Richard Ward at StuRents has said that the average occupancy is about 70% in Coventry. So again, brilliant for the student because you can find a really good PBSA bed with 24-hour security for about £100 and all your bills and utilities included, nice gym, nice social and living areas and study areas, all mod cons. And it's about £100 a week. And so I think that the more we can do that, the more affordable and uh and more accessible higher education becomes. Um, but there will be some investors and developers that do get caught out. But again, that's where that's where student housing consultancy comes in for my shameless plug.

SPEAKER_01 20:56

Yeah, I was just gonna add that I think at the moment we've got such a changing global landscape in so many different areas that without looking at those data and trends, you're never gonna build the right thing in the right place at the right time. You know, we've got um, you know, a cost of living crisis, we've got big changes in kind of in education. I mean, in the UK, particularly we have a funding crisis, which does mean that education has to be looked at um in how we fund that. And I think as the point that Dan and Sarah have already made, is that when we're building, it's two or three years before it's actually built. And actually, who you're building for is probably a very different student studying in a very different way with very different competing priorities on price. And I think that's the issue that we will keep wanting to research on because we want to get that information as much as we can in the hands of people because what went before isn't what's going to go on in the future. Um, how people were educated is not going to stay the same when we've got so many different ways to educate, so many different types of courses that we educate people on. You know, we've got a growing In the UK, a growing emphasis on apprenticeships, which is a totally different way to get a degree, but you still get a degree at the end of it. And at the moment, there's no accommodation options attached to that. So I think it's just really when you're when you're an investor in this sector, there's so many things you need to be looking at and juggling and considering because what you build needs to be sustainable, not just when it's built, but for 10, 20, 30, 40, 50 years after.

SPEAKER_00 22:28

So well, let's move then from an investor perspective to a student recruitment professional perspective. What can the student recruitment professionals who are listening to this podcast, whether agents or educators, do to improve their student chances on finding appropriate accommodation? And uh and the answer shouldn't be let's send them all to Coventry, I guess. But uh with that, I I mean what can they do to help their students find accommodation? Anything that's that's not a bridge, a camping site, or a two-hour commute from Wales, for example, uh Sarah.

SPEAKER_02 22:58

Well, I know that everybody tried to emphasize this to students, but timing is really, really key. So the the stat that Deanie quoted before about students not wanting to live alone, but we've got this myth that students, international students, want to live in studio flats. That's just because that's what's left at the end of the season when they generally join the search. Now, most PBSA operators, if not all of them, have got a no no-risk booking process. So if a student doesn't get their visa, they're not going to be forced to live in a city that they're not studying in, they would always be released from that contract. And if they could book earlier, and we'd love the education agents to be emphasising this, then it means that they would get the option the same, you know, as everybody else to book what they really, really wanted. And I think the problem with the fact that they book so late, and generally what's left at the end of the season is the studios is A, they're more expensive, so it's giving the impression that international students can afford to live in a studio. And you know, to your point, Martina, like not living two hours out and not living in the campsite, there's so little choice that yes, they are booking expensive studio flats because there is no other choice if they're booking in July or August. But if they could book earlier, if they could book in February or March even, then they could get a much more affordable room in a chair flat, and there would be no risk to their booking, you know, at all if they didn't get their exam results or they didn't get their visa. Um you know, and I wonder if this can come even earlier, you know, within you know, I'm sure that in all colleges and schools across the world, you know, they're being encouraged to study abroad. But how many conversations that are being had about accommodation and what's available and the cycle and what's in the you know, we know that students get really, really caught up, for example, with guarantors, and you know, they have to have either they have to have a UK-based guarantor or they have to use a guarantor agency, but they're also given a very, very short amount of time to confirm their booking and to get all their paperwork together and to get their deposit together. And quite often, if they miss that 14-day, for example, window, they'll lose that room because they haven't got their paperwork together. So, yeah, there's a lot involved, so it's all about education, I think, really.

SPEAKER_03 25:26

Yeah, one of the great things about ICEF in Amsterdam, the uh ICEF accommodation event in Amsterdam last year was uh quite how eye-opening I think it was for a lot of agents about how they can work with PBSA providers, letting agents, uh, HMOs, any kind of accommodation operator in either the UK or Europe. Because firstly, there's there's definitely revenue opportunities there, but most importantly, it just streamlines the process for the student. And I think it's one thing getting your application done, helping with visas, and uh agents are really good at that. It's another thing then helping them to live and integrate and become part of a community. So really ensuring that the student has the right place to live, that it's affordable, that it's close enough to the university within their price bracket, um, that it's the right kind of room. Because the last thing we want is people living tend to a room because they've gone to a university where they can't afford it. So, as Sarah said, we have no visa, no pay in the majority of PBSA properties. HMO is slightly different, your sort of houses of multiple occupancy, whereby it might be a six-bed house, for example. Um, they're a bit more stringent there, and that is the majority of our stock in the UK. And it's slightly sort of fragmented and not quite as well regulated as PBSA. So, you know, we would say that because we sort of come from PBSA, but I think we'd it'd be um remiss of us not to mention the HMO market. But there are sort of four ways to market for uh international students to book their accommodation. You know, you can go through your university, they have good links to either their own accommodation or private providers, and it can be funnelled through them. You can go direct, just search student accommodation Bristol or Coventry or whatever it might be. And most of the time that will end up uh with you going to either direct to an operator or to a marketplace. And these marketplaces, that it's now big business. And you know, by marketplaces, I'm talking about the likes of UHomes or Fun Living in China or UNIACO University Living or Amber or Casita in in, you know, and and there are there are numerous others to feel free, you know, multiple other marketplaces are available. Um, so so I think that is definitely an opportunity to really help students compare and you know, uh and book their accommodation. Then of course, you could book through your agent. And I think international agents do need to take a bit of a step up and start thinking, right, how can I make sure that we are booking students into the right accommodation, not just kind of lazily funneling them through the university, but how are we giving them the right accommodation options? Sometimes that's a partnership with a marketplace, sometimes it's um a direct relationship with a PBSA operator or whatever else it might be, but there's a definite opportunity here to close some gaps and close some loops. And uh I'd like to see more of that, more collaboration on an international basis between agents, universities, marketplaces, and uh the operators as well.

SPEAKER_01 28:35

I mean, change doesn't happen without collaboration, and I think that was what was so good about the ISF conference last year in Amsterdam is that it was the first time of bringing all those people together to talk about their needs and requirements and changes, and that's so important, and I think it's it's from all levels. It's kind of what do you need to build, what students have becoming, to actually how do we get them the information they need to know to make the right choices about what's the right accommodation for them. And if you don't have that collaboration, we're all working in silos, probably for different objectives and never achieving the right objective, which is getting the right students in the right places to be able to fulfil their studies in the right way.

SPEAKER_02 29:16

I was just going to say, Martin, importantly, you had students at the ISO conference in Amsterdam, um, which you know is so important and we rarely see it in conferences, but um it was really enlightening, and you know, we learned a lot from those students, as I'm sure the rest of the audience did as well.

SPEAKER_00 29:33

No, absolutely. Um, and the Amsterdam event is of course going to be repeated this year in uh in London. More about that in a second. And I like what you just said, Deanny, change doesn't happen without collaboration because one of the conclusions that we had in earlier uh events like the one in Amsterdam or webinars or other conversations, when we would address what was often the pink elephant in the room, that which is the responsibility that education providers have to ensure access to accommodation for the many international students that they enroll. I mean, these students are paying hefty tuition fees. The question was then how accountable or responsible are the education providers? And very often the conclusion was that really it's a it's a shared responsibility, which ties in with collaboration, right? It's a shared responsibility of the education providers, of the accommodation sector, of the uh local and national governments, especially when you look at the significant contribution that international students make to the local economy. It's a shared responsibility with the students and their families, it's the responsibility of the recruitment agents. It just shows how important it is that these stakeholders discuss the accommodation challenges uh together. It just starts with more awareness, more clarity about uh around what these issues really are, what causes them, followed by working together, um, as you mentioned, uh Dean E, working together to find the solutions to these issues. Is it is it building more properties? Maybe. Is it increasing campus living solutions, more repurposing of empty office and retail spaces? Is it encouraging uh empty nesters to uh to make rooms available to students? Is it more home stays, more shared spaces? Is it more government funding, new policies, etc.? And it's probably all of that. But as mentioned at the beginning, it starts with bringing the stakeholders together rather than each group of stakeholders coming up with their own solution. I guess Daniel, Sarah, Deanny, that this podcast collaboration is probably a little cog in this big and complex accommodation puzzle. By discussing the different complexities, we create more awareness and encourage ongoing conversations because that way we are not part of the problem, but we are part of the solution. All right, Daniel? Right.

SPEAKER_03 31:43

And I I think um everybody has their role to play. And you know, as independent consultants, we are in quite a fortunate position. But I do think that universities in the UK being so underfunded, it's really difficult. And and to be fair, across Europe as well. I I know it's um it's not easy out there being a higher education institution, but um there was something that was said on a panel back at uh ISF Amsterdam, which was um, you know, if you can't house them, don't accept them. And I do think that this this is where higher education institutions need to take a really serious look at their housing strategy because students are voting with their feet. If they do not have a quality living experience, then they will not go to that specific university or even that city. And that is playing out in all of the reports that I read in uh, you know, in all of the research. And I just think that that's where that coordination really needs to come in across private sector, higher education, student accommodation operators, investors, developers, local councils, planning authorities. I could go on and on. And a lot of what I'm doing at the moment is uh lobbying the new government, trying to find a way in to discuss a student housing strategy um across the UK, uh, because at the moment we don't have one at all. It's a free-for-all. Every local council is at different stages of maturity and uh the planning regime is archaic. So what we need to do is tie it all together, complete collaboration, and make sure that we are working for the benefit ultimately of the student at the end of the day. And if there is money to be made from an investment standpoint in PBSA or various other areas or public-private partnerships with universities, then great, but it has to be for the ultimate benefit of the student.

SPEAKER_01 33:39

I think I'd just want to add that the world is changing, it's changing fast, the sector isn't, and that could be seen as arrogance, it could be seen as lack of maturity. Um, I do hope that it's the latter, and that actually the sector is coming to a place of maturity to actually say, well, actually, we are here to service our customers. Um, this is what our customer needs, and that customer is changing at a speed that I don't think anyone is prepared for. Um, so I think again, I just you know, that's why we need to have these conversations, we need to have these open collaborations because what's coming down the line is not what we're building, it's not what we're offering, it's not how we're communicating to students about what their options are. And I think that is, you know, Dan said it. Hopefully we are getting to a point of maturity, and that comes with analysing all the information and trends and understanding we've got around us and adapting to that. And we need to be a bit more agile, we need to be a bit more adaptable, and hopefully that will come with maturity.

SPEAKER_00 34:50

That's a really very good point because obviously, if you want to grow as an education provider, as an accommodation provider, as a company in general, you always need to grow and evolve with the world around you. And of course, in the accommodation sector, that can be done through the help of professionals like uh the three of you. So thank you very much, uh Deanny, Sarah, and Daniel, for this uh wonderful collaboration on such a fascinating, fast-moving, and very important uh topic. Obviously, we will continue discussing accommodation issues in more depth at the ISAP Monet Global Summit September 23rd in London. And Deanny and Sarah, you will be there with us to present a session that has the same title as your report, Unlocking Global Perspectives of Student Accommodation, which will also feature three actual international students who will be sharing their accommodation stories, right?

SPEAKER_01 35:39

We are, and we're looking forward to it.

SPEAKER_00 35:40

Yeah, it'll be great to be there. Definitely a session that I'm also very much uh looking forward to. And Daniel, you won't be there, but I believe that is really for a very good reason.

SPEAKER_03 35:50

A reasonably good excuse in that um I'm getting married that that weekend. So uh yeah, unfortunately can't make it, but can certainly highly recommend it. Though the um ICF student accommodation event in Amsterdam was really well received and uh and and enlightening for us, not just I think for uh the people that that we were talking to on the panels.

SPEAKER_00 36:10

Excellent. Well, you know, your excuse, Daniel, definitely a very good reason. And for those of you not getting married on September 23rd, you can definitely join us uh at the summit in London. For tickets and information, please visit ice.com forward slash accommodation. Also, for those of you interested to dive deeper into accommodation topics, do subscribe to House, the Shared Living Podcast, which you will find in your favorite podcast player. Thanks again, Deanny, Sarah, and Daniel, for this podcast collaboration. Thank you very much to our episode sponsor, Vita Student, and thank you especially to our audience for spending some of your valuable time with us. We hope that you will join us in London at the ICEF Monitor Global Summit. See you there.

SPEAKER_03 36:49

Incidentally, Sarah, Deanny, and I, we were lucky enough to present at the ICEF Accommodation Event in Amsterdam. And that event is going to be held in London this year on September the 23rd. Now it's a really unique insight, not something that really comes from a real estate angle in particular, it comes from an international education angle. So really unique, very interesting, lots of education agents, marketplaces, accommodation providers, and open nights, home for students and Londonists were all there last year. Thanks so much to Mark Time for his time today. This has been a collaboration between House, the Shared Living Podcast and ICEF. If you do want any more information on the ICEF accommodation event in London on the twenty third of September, do reach out to MarkTime, or you can visit iCep.com forward slash accommodation. Thanks very much for listening.