S3 Ep5. Joy as a Way of Life: Janet Harvey’s Journey from Wall Street to Regenerative Humanity

In this rich and soulful conversation, Janet Harvey shares how being an alchemical visionary shapes the way she invites people and organizations to transform from the inside out. She describes alchemy as a natural process of turning what is into what is possible, drawing on examples from nature, cooking and soil, and explains how this lens led her to name and build her company, Invite Change, over the past 30 years. 

Janet reflects on her corporate journey at Charles Schwab & Company, where she led a massive transformation that successfully moved thousands of people into new roles and locations while retaining 96 percent of the workforce. That experience inspired her to become an entrepreneur and a leader’s leader, working with executives on six continents to widen their lens, listen deeply and access the wisdom that already lives inside their organizations. 

She also shares how she unexpectedly became a coach’s coach, ultimately taking over and rebuilding a coach training school, expanding it into a global center for rigorous coach development and advanced education through Invite Change.​

Throughout the episode, Janet illuminates the profound ripple effect of well trained coaching, introducing her ripple effect formula: "every one hour with a well trained coach can positively impact 1,600 people in 30 days.: She describes coaching as a process of restoring access to a person’s essence, inner authority and personal sovereignty, and she contrasts coaching with therapy, mentoring, consulting and training so listeners can understand when each modality serves best. 

She speaks candidly about trauma, grief and healing, including losing her mother and fiancé on consecutive days and how honoring trauma’s own clock allows people to move through loss rather than around it.​

The conversation also explores intuition and the body’s wisdom. Janet explains how she begins each day with movement, Asian Pilates, strength work and quiet reflection to stay resourced and fully available to others. She describes intuition as into me see, a form of intimacy rooted in noticing energetic and emotional shifts, mirror neurons and subtle changes in the relational field. 

By practicing stillness and patience, she allows clients’ next insights to emerge rather than pushing her own agenda, modeling coaching as deep witnessing rather than problem solving.​

Throughout the episode, Janet returns again and again to joy. She finds joy in everyday moments, from hummingbirds at her window to pulling weeds and watching her beloved Seattle Seahawks play and she reminds listeners that every interaction is an opportunity to be a cathedral builder in someone else’s life. 

She closes with a heartfelt affirmation that every person matters, that we are all more than our hardest moments and that our shared journey toward a regenerative, more compassionate world is possible and already underway.

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Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (00:01.452)

Welcome to another edition of ABWilson’s Heart of the Matter, a podcast that uses overwhelmingly positive questions to learn about our guests, where every episode uncovers extraordinary stories of triumph, growth, and empowerment. Hi, I’m Aderonke Bademosi Wilson, and my guest on today’s show is Janet Harvey. Janet is an alchemical visionary, leader’s leader, coach’s coach. Janet, welcome to the show.

Janet M. Harvey (00:35.862)

Thank you so very much. I’m delighted to be here and to be your guest.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (00:41.720)

So Janet, okay, I’m obviously going to ask you to start with your very first descriptor, an alchemical visionary. What is that? Please tell me.

Janet M. Harvey (00:54.230)

I knew from a very young child, in fact, my parents would tell you I was verbal at six months. My first memories are at about one and a half. And I’m one of those people that has a great relationship with change and always have. And it took me a long time to have humility and compassion for people who don’t. So many people I meet say that would be in their top three, “Don’t make me change.”

And it’s really what led to naming the company that I’ve now led for 30 years, called Invite Change. The alchemical process, whether you’re thinking about it in the stories of alchemy turning lead into gold, or you’re thinking about it as a chemist who understands when you’re cooking, the interaction between sugar and salt and meats and vegetables, that is an alchemical process, just like nurturing the soil is an alchemical process to grow food. It is inherent in mother nature.​

And what I began to see as a pattern in my life is that I was always seeing beyond what was right now. I could see right now, I’m very effective at being able to read the full spectrum of what’s going on, but I can also see the ripple effects that are happening. And so it’s given me a great deal of hope for the future. While things are dissolving right now in some very horrific ways all over the planet, right, America, where I come from, is just one flash in the pan of many places that are deteriorating when we think about it in the last hundred years of tradition.

And yet the seeds are here. When I think about all the interactions I have with Gen Z and Alpha and the adamance they have about purpose and being values aligned and taking care of one another and the sense of responsibility to the collective. In my work, that’s the shift from an “I” orientation to a “we” orientation. And ultimately, if we’re to get back to something regenerative, which is all of us, including the planet and all the relations on it, that’s what it takes. We have to find a rebalancing, if you will, and understand our responsibility to attend to the wellness of the planet and all of our societies. Yeah, so that’s what it means.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (03:38.850)

Thank you. I have never heard that term before and I think it will stay with me because as you’ve described, I can start seeing it, right? I can start seeing the chemical reaction in things. So thank you for sharing that. What is a leader’s leader?

Janet M. Harvey (03:53.771)

Yeah.

Janet M. Harvey (03:59.648)

Much of my work, even inside of corporate, so I spent 14 years at Charles Schwab & Company and it was a brilliant time. I loved every second of it. And the moment when I realized it was time to be an entrepreneur, it was mutual between us. Like, I’d done everything I came there to do. And to this day, I have people who will say to me, “How did you learn how to do that?” Like, hang on, I’ll tell you. It was a very long time ago.

But they were such a progressive company and I, as an alchemical person, loved it. They always gave me the things to do that nobody else wanted because it was too risky or too big or too scary, whatever. And so I had a fabulous experience. And when I left, I was trying to replicate a project I had done changing 6,000 people’s lives across the United States in our branch offices.

And it was outrageously successful, under budget, under time. We had an 85 percent retention goal, and we kept 96 percent of the workforce, even though 40 percent of them left their hometowns and went to stand up call centers, which was brand new in the financial services industry at the time. And I just woke up one morning and I said, “I’ve got to go see if I can repeat history. I want to go to other companies and see what I can do.” All change happens at leadership level.

Until the leader is able interiorly to get comfortable releasing their identity based on their history and can be here and forward, change doesn’t happen. You can have transformation project after transformation project and it’s not going to work. So having been in the trenches, you know, inside of an organization doing a massive transformation, we were moving from a customer service company to a sales company and doing financial planning.

It was a big lift. If you look at the commercials today, the seed of the commercials today for Charles Schwab & Company was that project I did back in 1991. So I work with leaders on all six continents, large and small companies, profit, not for profit, a little bit of government work. And I am there to help them make that mindset shift and begin to widen the camera lens they have in their organization and to appreciate that their very best consultants and coaches are already there if they’ll simply learn to listen.​

And listen to learn, not listen to confirm their own assumptions, but to really understand what actually is the dynamic day to day, moment to moment inside their organization that their customers are experiencing. Because it’s at those points of contact that the wisdom of innovation lives. So that’s leader’s leader.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (06:52.856)

Being a coach’s coach.

Janet M. Harvey (06:54.613)

I am. This will sound crazy, but when I left Schwab, I said I will never own a training company. It is so pedantic. It’s so step by step by step. And I’m like, I love the concept in the abstract, it’s really good, and I love translating it into something practical. Well, that was a lot more about consulting and coaching.

Well, you know, life does its thing. In my last year at Schwab, I spent some time in London opening up the office there. That was a ball, before the EU existed. Talk about crazy circumstances for business. And when I got back, that was when I did the big project and then I decided to leave, and I was done with San Francisco. I’d lived there for 20 and a half years and I wanted a change of scenery.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (07:34.574)

So.

Janet M. Harvey (07:48.406)

So my accountant says, “Move someplace where they don’t have personal income tax, please.” I’m like, “OK.” So I moved to Florida. I bought a condo on the ninth floor of a high rise on the beach in Fort Lauderdale. I don’t really like it very much. I was 15 minutes from the airport. That was useful because I was on airplanes from Sunday night or Monday morning until Friday night.

I had gone on a vision quest as part of my spiritual practice. And while we were just coming back from four days of fasting and silence, we’re all sitting around drinking some miso soup. And somebody from San Francisco was on the trip with me and tells a story about something we called Supper Club. My good friends and I, I had many, five couples, and it was impossible to see enough of them.

So I said, can we do something like every six weeks where we get together? But here’s the catch. I want you to bring a date for me because I was the only single one. Well, the very first Supper Club, all the guys decided that was just a very bad idea. So one of them was on this trip and starts to tell this story. They had made up this whole long list of things. I only had three requirements. Couldn’t be a couch potato, so that’s for life.

Comfortable holding hands or kissing in public and meeting me either intellectually or spiritually. So he was laughing about one of the ones he put on the list, which was something about taking a shower every day. Rather silly. But this couple from Washington, DC raises their hand and says, “I have the guy for you. He’s just moved to Miami. We’ll introduce you.” He’s my husband now.

And he was living in Miami. He had just moved from Washington, DC. And so we met on a blind date and discovered we had all these people we knew in our various communities in common. And he was originally from the Northwest. So he came to my door one night with puppy dog eyes telling me he was leaving to go back to Washington. And I said, “Well, let’s keep having fun for as long as you’re here,” which was shocking to him.

Janet M. Harvey (10:05.413)

And I came out for New Year’s and met his mom, and three weeks later she had a massive stroke. So he moved a little earlier than he was planning. I came to help him with that. She died at home and the rest is history. Like our lives were just clearly meant to be like this. And 26 years later, yeah, that’s my husband Russell.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (10:29.022)

Great story. Great story.

Janet M. Harvey (10:31.552)

Now back to your question. So what do I do? I take a year off. I go on sabbatical for a year. He takes me all over Washington state and a little bit of British Columbia. And I finally looked at him and I said, “It’s really important to me that I get back to doing something. And I’ve decided what I really want to do is coach.” So I launched Invite Change. And I get involved with the International Coaching Federation in Washington. And I meet the

Person who founded a company here that was a training company, Fran Fisher, and she invites me onto faculty. This is 2003. And I said, “OK, I’m going to teach but I don’t want anything to do with the rest of it. I’m never going to own a training company.” She gets breast cancer, sells the company to a gentleman who said he knew something about leader development, who absolutely knew nothing about leader development. And in the summer of 2006,

He fires all the staff, turns out the lights, and throws everything literally in the dumpster. And we had 100 students going through classes. And when I got the news, I was in London visiting my husband’s son. And so we fly back home. And the team comes to me and they say, “You’ve got a financial mind. Can you manage the buyout?” I said, “Yes, but I want nothing else to do with it.”

You know where this story is going now, right? So it turns out that I end up owning the company along with six colleagues until we had the financial crisis. And then they all said, “We’d like to teach, but not run this company.” And all of my advisors said, “You should just sell it. You should just close the company and be done with this.” But my inner guidance said, there’s a legacy here to steward.

The field is growing and needs good quality, rigorous development for coaches. And so I doubled down and I bought all of them out at the end of 2009 and relaunched the training school and brought all of my other coaching and team leader and teamwork into the training company. And that’s who we are today. So I never looked back. I actually adore developing coaches.

Janet M. Harvey (12:47.273)

And also provide lots of advanced development and mentor coaching and coaching supervision. And, you know, I spent six years on the global board for the ICF at a really formative time, and then another seven on the Foundation board, and more recently, a couple of years on the Thought Leadership Institute. So I believe in the discipline of professional coaching and well trained coaches make a huge ripple effect in a positive way in the world. Every one hour that someone, that a human, spends with a well trained coach will affect 1,600 people in 30 days.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (13:21.647)

Hold on, hold on, hold on, repeat that. Please, please say that again.

Janet M. Harvey (13:22.773)

This is the ripple effect formula. Every one hour that a well trained coach spends with another human being will impact 1,600 people in 30 days.

It’s a pretty simple formula, but it’s the ripple effect of relationships. Everybody has five people that are close to them. As they change their behavior, the people around them will notice and they will adapt as well. They have another five to ten people that are outside of those immediate five. You start to take that 14 times 14 and you apply that by four weeks and you get to 1,600. So my point here is that

We’re in the business of restoring people’s access to the essence of who they are, restoring a sense of inner authority that they have the power of choice about how they relate to their lives, what I call personal sovereignty. It can also happen in a professional context. And ultimately, we’re about, from my authentic self, I can find my wholeness again. It never goes anywhere. We just get a whole bunch of stories we layer on and forget.

And so it is a remembering process and a releasing of a lot of the personality that we developed to stay safe that we don’t need as we grow into the fullness of who we are. So generative wholeness is the body of work that we bring forward from Invite Change.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (14:58.850)

Janet, how can people find you? If somebody wants to become a coach or be coached, how can they find you?

Janet M. Harvey (15:08.277)

Well, super easy to email me anytime or call, which you can find the phone number on the website. It’s Janet.Harvey, H A R V E Y, at invitechange.com. And it’s Janet Harvey on LinkedIn. There’s a fabulous YouTube channel for Invite Change. They can learn a lot about coaches and coaching and coaching education.

The website is invitechange.com.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (15:39.606)

OK, I’ll put it in the notes on the website so people can find you. Janet, thank you so much for sharing. Please tell us three interesting things about yourself that our listeners may not know and your friends will be surprised to learn.

Janet M. Harvey (15:54.773)

Hmm.

Janet M. Harvey (16:02.389)

Goodness. Well, some of my friends know this, but not all of them. When Russell and I got married, we got married in the acre and a half next to our property, which we then ultimately ended up buying. And it has 30 old Douglas firs on it. It’s just a magical meadow. And we did lots of spiritual things, lots of singing and bringing in the spirits. And then

The minister was asking my husband, “Well, where’s Janet?” And a very, very dear friend of ours, and Henry just passed, was a Washington State Patrol motorcycle cop. I came in sitting side saddle on a Harley. So you can feel the alchemical, can’t you? Just a lot of seriousness and

Be in the earth and be centered and grounded in your heart and then the reality of the material world. I am all about joy. That’s one of my top values along with vitality and generosity. And maybe to a fault sometimes, but I’d much rather have it be that way. Our mission statement as a company is about be authentic and generative, choose to live values aligned, and cause reciprocal prosperity.

And we live that every single day. I have a lot of people who say to me, “Yeah, believe it or not, I really am 66.” I love my work. I don’t have a job. I have this opportunity to make a huge positive impact in people’s lives. And I was recently at an event that’s been running for 24 years called Thinkers 50. It’s all management gurus,

A little bit of an academic event, but people that you would, if you were looking at a New York Times bestseller list on business books, all of them would be there. And I’ve never been to the event, but they were talking about regeneration and I’m writing a book about regeneration right now. And so I wanted to go and learn and meet some people and see what was up. And I met one of the networking, at the end of the day, and this woman walks up to me, gorgeous,

Janet M. Harvey (18:28.989)

Dressed to the nines, gorgeous, just radiating beauty off of her. And she clasps my hands and looks me in the eye and says, “You have no idea how you have transformed my life.” And I’m like trying to stay connected here, but also figure out what her name is on her badge. And I turned like this to introduce her to my colleague Sylvia that was standing next to me. And then the instant that I turned back, she was gone. She was gone, and I never saw her again.

And I’ve got to tell you, this happens to me on a pretty regular basis. So I guess the moral to the story is always remember every place you show up, be yourself, because everyone else is taken, Dr. Seuss. Thank you very much. And you never know how you’ve touched someone. I think we humans forget that we are cathedral builders. Every touch, every moment, the barista at Starbucks, the

The gentleman who picks up your trash, the woman who works on your car, the person who goes door to door to sign you up for some service. Don’t ignore them. Don’t ignore them. Every one of us matters. It’s one of my core principles. Every person matters. And I think when we get back to remembering that,

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (19:42.318)

Mmm.

Janet M. Harvey (19:57.438)

And not take it for granted, we’re going to have a much happier society. And I think the next couple of generations are going in that direction. So it’s my faith. It’s my faith in what’s coming. And while it’s going to be challenging to navigate the surrender of a lot of things we’ve gotten too comfortable with, and it’s been exploitive, we have it in us to become regenerative. And I have deep faith in that.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (20:23.246)

Wonderful. Thank you. Thank you.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (20:31.554)

Can you tell us about a recent accomplishment or success that you’re particularly proud of?

Janet M. Harvey (20:40.319)

Well, top of mind, I just came back from working with a wonderful project with a company headquartered in Japan who has a subsidiary here in the United States. And a visionary head of strategy there came to see me at the end of ’23 and said, “I’d like to do this project. It’s really risky. But I want to see if we can build a bridge between Japan and the US,

Because when the expats come over, they don’t seem to get onboarded well and our local staff don’t seem to know how to interact with our expat staff. And it’s impacting our ability to run a profitable business here. We’ve got to get the barriers out of the way.” So he called it DEI leadership and it was very values aligned to the three corporate values. And he wanted to do

A leadership development program with eight of the top leaders, four expats, four local. They had to work in pairs and then produce an initiative that would cut across the globe. So all of the subsidiaries and headquarters would be impacted by the projects that they would select, develop, and implement, and they’re in implementation now. This led then to the team that is the

Close to 40 percent of their profits. And they got an opportunity because of our success in ’24 to do team coaching with me. And I just finished their session on Friday, actually. I fortunately got home before the snowstorm. What I witnessed in the room from July to January were six people who could barely tolerate being in the room with each other.

Highly technical, very strong, very effective individually, but had no idea how to be a team. And watching them work their way through a brand new decision making framework, applying it to four big, huge power initiatives that they’re working on, and laughing at the same time they were able to be penetrating with their questions. And the SVP over that group, I’m just watching him in the back of the room gobsmacked.

Janet M. Harvey (23:02.421)

He did not want to do this project at all. And my sponsor said, “Trust me, it’s going to work.” And it did. It was really good. So that’s kind of the work context one. In October, I was invited to come to Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, which was super exciting. I had not been there before. Eleven years ago, I had been in Dubai, the very first time that the region held a conference about professional coaching.

They had me do a two and a half hour keynote. Oh my God, who does that? And I was to introduce the ICF core competencies. Great. It was fun. I got a standing ovation at the end of two and a half hours, which was really cool. So I get invited to come for a conference being held for the first time in Riyadh. Two hundred fifty people in the room, men and women together. That’s an achievement all in itself.

I was the opening keynote for the second day talking about presence as a leadership act. And I had this most extraordinary experience. About ten minutes into my talk, I could feel like the room was breathing with me. You know that when something is so palpable and so present, you know that you’re merged into a field that we’re all creating together. It didn’t matter

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (24:19.266)

Hmm.

Janet M. Harvey (24:31.185)

What words were coming out of my mouth. We were in the collective experience of learning together and honoring the humanity of each other. It was so special, just so special. And I had other opportunities to be a panelist over the two and a half days and met many, many wonderful people that I had only known virtually.

And now I got to see them in the flesh. Several graduates, several clients, a couple of customers. It was just one of those total “fills my cup” events and will for a while yet for sure. Thank you.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (25:09.900)

Congratulations. Congratulations on both successes. And thank you so much for sharing them. Janet, please tell us about a time when you made a difference in another’s life. What were the circumstances? Paint a picture for me.

Janet M. Harvey (25:32.304)

Honestly, I feel like I do that every day. And I’m thinking about, I was at Charles Schwab & Company when the crash happened, the financial crisis of ’87, and it was bad. It was really bad. There were people that lost everything. Homes, money. Some people committed suicide. There were people who had heart attacks, who had strokes.

And I was part of the team that was helping to sort out debt that people had that we needed to collect on. It was a tough tension, just a really tough tension. And I’m thinking about a husband and wife in their seventies, and he’d had a stroke and I was in the hospital with them. This was not a task I really wanted to do.

But I was also at that point our chief surveillance officer. So it rested with me to sit down with them and help them to understand what had happened. Because the truth is they really didn’t know. And the market had moved so fast and they ended up being very exposed. And here’s this wife and she is probably going to lose her husband. He does recover, but not completely. And

She’s now thrust with this responsibility that she’s never had. She’s never managed any of the financial matters for them.

I just looked at them both and said, “This is, for now, one of the hardest things you’ve ever navigated for sure. And you can’t undo it. It simply is. But you have your lives. You have your lives ahead of you. Every choice, one step at a time, we will work with you. Don’t let this take you down.

Janet M. Harvey (27:33.981)

Remember that human spirit is always more than the moments that have passed. It is also all the moments to come if you choose it.” And she cried for a while and I just sat with her and I held her hands, and on the other side she took out a Kleenex, she blew her nose, she wiped her eyes and she looked at me and she said, “OK, what’s my first step?”

Janet M. Harvey (28:01.108)

Makes me cry. I really believe it. I believe we can face anything. And I, you know, I don’t say that from a Pollyanna place. In my own life journey, I have had my moments when I was flat broke and living out of the back of my car. Five part time jobs, just trying to get through college and find my way in the world. We all have those stories. We have sandpaper moments.

They make us who we are. And when we remember that our journey is a shared journey with the rest of the humans and nobody’s an accident that comes across our path that we get to interact with, that activates our compassion and empathy. We could use a bit more of that right now, don’t you think?

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (28:49.684)

Absolutely.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (28:56.194)

Thank you. Thank you for sharing that story.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (29:04.014)

Yeah. And it’s got to be difficult, right, at 70 to basically start over again, especially as I assume you thought you had everything lined up to be at this stage in your life and then things outside of your control happen to you. How do you guide somebody through that? How do you support them?

Janet M. Harvey (29:21.757)

Exactly.

Janet M. Harvey (29:34.355)

You know, there’s a couple of things that are really important. And it is about distinguishing coaching from the other modalities, right? There’s a long spectrum of human development. And you could think about, in the center is where I would hold coaching, because it’s a peer to peer, adult to adult relationship, not a power differential. And if we go this way, this is the clinical work, social services, psychotherapy, onto psychiatry,

Where there is a responsibility by the practitioner for diagnosis, intervention, and evaluation. If we go to this side, we’re going from coaching to mentor to trainer to consultant. Again, you begin to have a superior subordinate because of something technical or some wisdom or experience that they have. So coaching is not the answer for everything.

When people have gone through trauma, it’s important to not coach until someone is able to accept that they have an inner authority that they can choose from. Trauma wipes that out. Our neurobiology protects us on purpose, right? It’s its role and it’s the oldest part of the brainstem, something called the reticular activating system. And it’s what causes reactivity.

You know, I did a podcast a few years back on judgment because I find that we hold judgment as something that we should get rid of. “Be nonjudgmental” and “suspend judgment” is a very common request that people will make. And yet human beings use judgment to discern what is and isn’t safe, what is and isn’t enlivening, what is and isn’t comfortable.

It’s like breathing. You can’t get rid of judgment. There’s a difference between judgment and judgmental. When we act out of our belief that we are better than someone else, that’s not discernment. That’s ego protecting itself. So when we can get still enough to realize that that thing that’s happened outside of us that’s created a traumatic event in our life will pass.

Janet M. Harvey (32:01.011)

And we need to take time to heal. We need to take time to sit and be witnessed, to be with someone who is unconditional with us, to allow this to help us to realize we’re more than the moment of that trauma. And for some people, that’s a couple of weeks. For other people, that’s a couple of years, maybe longer. It never goes away. The loss is horrific. And we will always

Have it with us. It shapes us. It influences us. But there is a moment when we can put the trauma in perspective. My mother died of cancer on January 20th, and my fiancé at the time died of a heart attack the next day, January 21st. So I know what deep loss is all about. And I realized that it took me a good eight months before I could

Anticipate when the wave of grief would come. Because before that, it was completely unpredictable. The wave of grief would just come and it would often be at the most inconvenient moments. I thought I was ready to go back to work after three weeks. And I went to go have lunch with my boss. And I just burst into tears when she asked me how I was. I was like, clearly not ready to come back to work. And I ended up taking six months to recover.

And it was long walks in nature. It was time sitting in stillness. It was journaling. It was bodywork. It was letting the grief move through me. I’m sharing this to say that trauma has its own clock. And when we fight against it, thinking we have to be strong and stand up, we actually prolong it. This is why

Going to see a therapist, going to group support, leaning on friends, learning how to receive from other people is so very important. To not be in a hurry to all of a sudden feel like, you know, I can pull up my bootstraps and grit my way through it. You’ll just pay for it later. And you’re going to pay for it in your body because your body can’t handle that level of adrenaline and always being in our sympathetic system.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (34:22.914)

Thank you. I firmly believe that dealing with grief, ideally, you have to deal with it at the time, right? Whatever it looks like, whatever form it takes, because if you don’t deal with it now, you can deal with it later. And I always think it’s harder later because you’re not quite sure what’s happening. At least at the time, shortly after something traumatic has happened,

You know this is probably a result of that. And you may not be able to tap into that knowing as well as you could at a later date. And so thank you for that. I do believe that. And congratulations on taking the time off that you needed, right? Taking the time that you needed to heal and

Janet M. Harvey (34:53.620)

Exactly.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (35:21.248)

And reposition your life. I think that’s the only way I can think of it.

Janet M. Harvey (35:25.052)

Yeah, I felt like I lost my mooring. I was standing on a dock and there was no ship to get on. Then Wayne and I were going to be married and we had decided to elope and airplane tickets were bought. Tours were booked. We were going to Nepal to go up Everest. And so I went. You know, the insurance had paid for his ticket and my friends thought I was nuts.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (35:29.614)

Hmm.

Janet M. Harvey (35:55.029)

“You’re going away for five and a half weeks by yourself. Are you sure?” But it was exactly what I needed. I needed to be in me. And the poor Sherpas, because some nights I would just sob sitting out on the land. Right. But they were wonderful. They really were. They were very wonderful. And I remember on the Annapurna trek, there was an 82 year old man, an attorney from Los Angeles, and his son had come with him, but he’d injured his knee. So

He’s on this trek with his 82 year old dad. The Sherpas drew a picture of me. I’d found a stick and I gave Albert one end of the stick and I had the other end of the stick behind my back and I was helping him get up the harder hills and they drew a picture of us. It is so cool. I have it in my journal and I look at it on a pretty regular basis. You know, it’s just that.

That’s what I mean. You never know who’s going to come across your path and inspire you. He did that day. And it was such a joy. I had my vitality, and I could feed into him in that way. And then it helped me remember.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (36:56.078)

Mm-hmm.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (37:06.806)

Mmm. Mmm.

Janet, what were the key strengths and qualities you relied on to make a difference for the couple in the hospital room?

Janet M. Harvey (37:23.316)

Definitely joy. It’s like the air I breathe. I think that having a birthmark on my face has been a journey that’s taught me about unconditional self love. I didn’t always have it. But I wasn’t going to let the world tell me that I needed to be different,

In other words, to be like them. I was always going to stand out and it makes some people uncomfortable, but most people who know me say, “I don’t even see it anymore.” Yes. So it’s the ability to radiate that unconditional self love. And I think the third thing is that I have yes to life. Bring it on.

Good, bad, and the ugly. It’s OK. Bring it on. All of it. I want to have the full experience. It takes a lot for a human to get born. And the soul that comes with it has a purpose. And that’s my daily mantra. You know, to the goddess, “May my soul manifest everything it came here for through me. Help me to see, help me to listen,

Quiet into my faith and listen to my soul’s calling and consciously choose my answer.”

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (38:53.794)

Thank you. Can you recall a situation where you overcame a challenge that led to personal growth? What did you learn from that experience?

Janet M. Harvey (39:03.636)

How much time do we have? Oh my gosh.

Janet M. Harvey (39:16.852)

Seriously, I mean, I could give you many. I think it’s one of the gifts of being human. Sandpaper moments are what we learn from. I’m thinking about one really early. Before I went to work for Schwab, I was still in college. And one of my part time jobs was with a company that was selling

Clothing. The designer was designing for women in the rodeo. So shirts, skirts, pants kind of stuff, belt buckles, hats. And I was the operations manager where everything was being sewn. So in the factory. So it’s in the south side of San Francisco, and most of them did not speak English,

And were busy on the sewing machines. And I had taken a one week vacation. And when I got back, I’m looking at the books and something’s not right. It just wasn’t right. And so I called our finance company. There’s a process called factoring where you sell your receipts of sales and they give you money in advance of the product being shipped,

Cash flow strategy. And I said, “I think you need to look at what you got sent over the time I was away and tell me if it matches what you got from the production manager as what they actually sewed.”

Janet M. Harvey (41:07.486)

Her partner was embezzling.

Janet M. Harvey (41:12.936)

They called me back. I mean, it didn’t take them more than 15 minutes. They called me back and they said, “Give your notice. You need to get out of there.”

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (41:19.222)

Mmm.

Janet M. Harvey (41:21.340)

I really couldn’t afford to lose the job. And I really liked the designer. I felt terrible for her. I couldn’t believe this guy had done this. It was like, you’ve got to be kidding. And I’m 20. I’m 20 years old going, “Is this really how the world works? This is ridiculous.” But you know what? It is sometimes how the world works. And I’m

It was an extraordinary lesson to learn about eyes wide open, tell the truth, be honest, have integrity, have respect for self and other. And this person had gotten themselves involved in drugs and the two of them were not doing well together. And this was the consequence for them. I was just a, I was a bystander who was a little too smart for her own good.

That’s gotten me in trouble more than once. Like I said, I don’t know how much time we have. I don’t think I have as many of those experiences now. I would say somewhere by my mid forties, I was in pretty good shape. Still had traumatic events happen, but not ones that were of my own doing, because I slowed down enough to pay attention to my choices.

When I had met Russell, I was, as I said, I left on Sunday night or Monday morning and came back on Friday night and I was not well. And I didn’t know it because I’d never been to a doctor and I was blessed with excellent health until I didn’t. And it turns out that I pretty much blew out my adrenals. I went to see, I didn’t have a doctor. I didn’t even know how to think about getting a doctor. That was the

For me, that was traumatic. What do you ask? How do you know if they are any good? Like I had no context for it at all. And we happened to be here on Whidbey and I was feeling horrible. I had terrible cramps. And either it was coming out this way or that way, and I wasn’t keeping food in. So I went in to see the naturopath and he does a whole bunch of stuff. And he looks at me and he says, “You’re pretty sick.

Janet M. Harvey (43:46.812)

Your body’s pretty toxic right now.” And I said, “So what does that mean?” He goes, “Well, first of all, the only thing you can eat for the next 30 days is green.

Janet M. Harvey (43:59.925)

Water, no sugar.” I didn’t have a lot of it anyway, but no alcohol, no caffeine. Right? I could do decaffeinated tea and spinach, lettuce greens. He said, “Stay away from broccoli. That’s a little too intense. Do your best to not do anything acidic. Thirty days.” Talk about boring. Oh my God.

However, it only took about two weeks for me to be able to keep everything in my body. And then another six months slowly adding regular food back in. For a very long time, I couldn’t eat potatoes. Even if I just stole a French fry off of Russell’s plate, I would get massive cramps in my stomach. This is long before people were talking about things like irritable bowel syndrome. I wasn’t being diagnosed. And of course,

The one doctor, the regular doctor that I went to go see after he ran tests, he said, “There’s nothing wrong with you. We’d like to put you on Valium.” And I said, “Let me get this right. You have no idea what’s wrong with me and you want to mask all my symptoms by drugging me?” And I said, “You’re fired.” And I stuck with the naturopath and actually have been with him for the entire time I’ve lived up here in Washington.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (45:16.140)

Mm.

Janet M. Harvey (45:24.168)

You know, we could keep going. I’ve had emotional things. I’ve had physical things. I’ve had business things like I just described. I just figure they’re all teachers.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (45:36.686)

Yes, indeed. Janet, thank you.

Janet M. Harvey (45:41.267)

Mm-hmm.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (45:43.372)

You are listening to ABWilson’s Heart of the Matter podcast.

Welcome back to ABWilson’s Heart of the Matter. My guest today is Janet Harvey. So Janet, we’ve talked about your career as an entrepreneur. We’ve talked about your career previously with a financial services organization. And we’ve also talked about how you support leaders and how you support coaches.

What self care practices or strategies help you to sustain your energy and motivation while navigating your journey?

Janet M. Harvey (46:33.414)

So the one that I start my day with is physical. And one could say that’s because when I was a kid, I was an athlete, that that’s why I do it. I don’t think that’s the truth. In high school and undergrad, I had been told that thoughts create emotions, create movement in the body. And

What I have come to realize is that’s backwards. Actually, our bodies have such extraordinary information. And I’ve noticed in my coaching practice now, almost 30 years of doing this, that my body, if I’ll stay still enough, my body will intuit where the customer is going long before it ever gets to my rational thought in my brain.

And if I really let myself breathe into the relationship field that we’re creating together, me and the clients, just like you and I are doing here on this podcast, my heart opens. And now not only do I have my sensory system, but my emotional system is available. And then the quality of my question to invite someone to go inside themselves is exponentially better.

I’m not trying to manage, interpret or translate from my brain, which is going to have all of my biases and ego invested in it. I am instead 100 percent available for the other person to be with them on their behalf. And I’m allowing myself to experience them fully, like standing on the beach at the edge of the ocean and letting a wave wash over. That is the work of coaching

When it’s done really artfully. And we are in full witness and experience of the client. And the question that arises from that experience on behalf of the client to examine for themselves, from where within them does the experience they’re having of their own lives arise.

Janet M. Harvey (48:46.696)

What choice did they make? What belief was moving that choice? What value got honored or dishonored? What aspect of their identity is ready for another generation to evolve forward?

Janet M. Harvey (49:02.172)

I don’t even remember what question you asked me anymore.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (49:04.083)

Hahaha!

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (49:08.718)

Well, I asked about self care practices, but I do want to come back. I want to come back to that. So I’m going to let you finish that thought. But I also want to ask you about intuition because you mentioned intuition. I want to come back to that. So please finish your thoughts on self care.

Janet M. Harvey (49:11.742)

Yeah, thank you.

Janet M. Harvey (49:20.244)

Hmm.

Janet M. Harvey (49:24.276)

So body. My point is the body carries most of the wisdom and so my first practice in the morning, I do Asian Pilates and then I do sit ups and push ups and then I do some lightweight training in my upper body. So it’s about 40 minutes.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (49:44.876)

You do Asian Pilates? Tell me about that. What’s the difference?

Janet M. Harvey (49:47.410)

Mm-hmm.

Janet M. Harvey (49:51.249)

I would say that it is a combination of isometric exercise along with Tai Chi movement. So a lot of core and straight spine and then creating fluidity. So you’re moving your arms, you’re moving your hips, you’ll move your leg and your arms, right? So your trunk stays fluid. And that’s really the reason I do that piece is to stay mobile. Mobility is how we age gracefully and with vitality. And then I do the weightlifting because Lord knows, ladies, the first thing to go is here. That’s my first thing. And then I usually spend 15 minutes quietly. Sometimes that’s deep meditation. Sometimes it’s just sitting with my journal and

My intentions for the year. And oftentimes that’s the moment, as I said, my pathway practice is to quiet into my faith, listen to my soul’s calling deeply and consciously choose my answer. So that’s a practice every day when I come out the other side. And then I have a cup of coffee and I work my way through the news. And then I start with something that I absolutely love doing.

Sometimes that might be writing. Sometimes that might be making a connection. Sometimes it’s being a guest on a podcast. We’re approaching 7 AM here in the US. So you and I have been playing in the dark here this morning.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (51:36.174)

And I appreciate you being available this early in the day, so thank you. So two things, I want to touch on intuition. You mentioned that, and if you stay still enough, you can intuit your customer. How do you do that? How do you find stillness and listen to your intuition?

Janet M. Harvey (51:42.184)

Yeah.

Janet M. Harvey (52:07.472)

One of the things that I’m known for is my insistence that students speak in ordinary language, not in jargon.

And I believe that if we look at the word intimacy and you break it down, it means “into me see.”

What is intuition? It’s intimacy. It is the practice of recognizing that we’re having a mirror neuron experience. So that’s the scientific side of it. How do I know I’m having that experience? Most people would report things like goosebumps on their skin. Some will say they get a little dizzy, a little lightheaded.

Sometimes people will all of a sudden have a spontaneous exhale or inhale. Others will say they get a visual image, like their mind’s eye all of a sudden explodes with a sunrise or a mountain or an animal or colors flashing by. These are all the body’s responses that something has just shifted. Can I notice

From one moment to the next moment. And then can I experience the quality of the previous moment and the now moment? So it’s the noticing that something has shifted and then being available to check the sensory experience and providing the insight of that quality. When we’re training coaches, part of what they learn to do is to notice how a client arrives.

Janet M. Harvey (54:00.871)

Are they distracted? Are they laughing? Are they shut down? Are they angry? Right? I mean, you can hear it in the tone and intensity and pace and word choice. All of these are sensory and then emotional. So intuition is simply allowing ourselves to experience and paying attention, noticing when something has changed

From one state to another state. And waiting is the other aspect. One might maybe call it patience. My nemesis, my entire life, learning to be patient. It’s no wonder I’m a coach, because I must be patient in order for this to be work that truly is on behalf of someone else and not my own agenda. So in the stillness can be the breath.

Sometimes it’s soften the eyes, don’t look at the client. Sometimes it’s pushing your chair back, just allowing the space to grow a little bit with the client. Most of my work today is in Zoom or some online platform, although I do some work in person as well.

Janet M. Harvey (55:23.774)

I almost never have to ask a question because the space that gets created invites the client to say the next thing that matters to them.

Janet M. Harvey (55:36.435)

The intuition notices each shift as it happens. I’ve watched clients who start laughing. When you give them the silence, they shift into a deep silence of their own. And as I keep breathing into that silence, I can feel the grief or the sadness or the disappointment. And they shift again when they look back up at me, and I’ll say, “And what journey did you just go on?”

The intuition is picking up the energetic shifts and the emotional shifts, and it gets used to invite the client to do their own noticing. We are that reflective mirror until they can do it on their own. I think it’s one of the most underused skills as humans, the art of noticing without having to interpret it, simply to experience it.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (56:24.290)

Mm-hmm.

Janet M. Harvey (56:33.936)

And it’s a practice, right? This is my 15 minutes of quiet, sometimes meditation. What am I doing? I’m noticing. How am I arriving into my life today?

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (56:49.688)

Janet, thank you. Thank you for sharing that. The other question that I want to go to, and it’s something that you said earlier during our conversation, you’re writing a book. Tell me about your book, please.

Janet M. Harvey (57:04.084)

You.

Janet M. Harvey (57:08.052)

So this is my third adventure in writing a book. And I’m co writing this one with my colleague from Italy, Silvia Tassarotti. And the title of the book is “Regenerative People:

Janet M. Harvey (57:24.956)

Leaders, Organizations, and Communities.” And the gap that we saw about a year ago was that a lot of what was happening in the circles that are talking about regeneration were focused on verticals. We hear a lot about regenerative agriculture, which is really where the movement began as kind of the next thing after sustainability. But now we hear about regenerative economics, regenerative investing, regenerative business models.

And

As coaches, we both recognize that that kind of societal shift, which will be quite dramatic, frankly, we’re still very “I” oriented. We’re still very young, particularly in the West, maybe not so much if you’re a student of Buddhism or Taoism. However, it’s still an “I” and a “we,” right? It’s in service to the collective in the Eastern tradition.

Regenerative is all of us. It’s remembering that we are part of this planet, that every choice we make has a ripple effect out into the world. Make them wisely. Indigenous peoples knew this forever. Seventh generation thinking. And we’ve strayed far, far from it. We lack the patience and the thoughtfulness to be still enough to say to ourselves, “This choice,

What are the intended consequences? What might be the unintended consequences? Who’s not in the room as we make this decision that we could imagine what the impact might be and give it due consideration?” To get there is going to be quite a dramatic mindset shift. Belief systems are going to get challenged. People are going to have sandpaper moments as they navigate. So the book is really talking about, what is regeneration at the

Janet M. Harvey (59:23.142)

Individual level, and then at the leadership level, and then at the organizational level, and then at the community level. And what will it ask of each of us as we do our individual journey, and then attempt to lead others through that journey? So we have chronicled the why, we have articulated ten characteristics of being a regenerative human. And then the rest of the book will have

Stories of some of the pioneers who are doing this work now, how they’ve been learning, where they’ve skinned their knees and gotten back up to try it again. All the chapters will have some reflection questions, and we’re also creating a companion workbook and an online course. And it’s the first of three books.

So it’s really the next probably five to seven years of my work on the written side.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:00:23.912)

And when will the book be available?

Janet M. Harvey (01:00:27.880)

Well, we finished the first draft of the manuscript this week, as a matter of fact, and we have interviews to continue to conduct in order to bring the stories into the manuscript. We, fingers crossed, we’re aiming for Labor Day here in the US, which would be September 1st, or I guess officially the 7th, but yeah. OK, so here, if you want to participate along the way,

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:00:45.954)

Congratulations. I’m looking forward to seeing it, to reading it.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:00:56.718)

Mm-hmm.

Janet M. Harvey (01:00:57.276)

We have a landing page you can go to. It’s go.invitechange.com/regen, R E G E N. And when you go there, you can take a quick five question survey, which we’re hoping to get a thousand people to do before the end of the year. Really simple, won’t take you long, a couple of minutes maybe. And then you’ll be able to download the table of contents and the first two chapters in their current form. So version one of the first two chapters. And then you can join

The online community and we’ll be sharing more content and interviews and stories. And it’s a place to be in dialogue with the other people that are in that community. Ad free, we’re not trying to sell you anything here. Someday we hope you’ll want to buy a book. However, this is really meant to get the conversation moving and

To start having people initiate the process, the change process, to think as a regenerative human.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:02:03.534)

Thank you. Thank you. And I’ll absolutely be sure to add the information to the podcast page so that people can find it and help you achieve your 1,000 survey respondents.

Janet M. Harvey (01:02:05.267)

Thank you.

Janet M. Harvey (01:02:18.643)

Excellent. When we hit one, we’ll go for two. We just launched that in November. So I think we’re at about 110 at the moment.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:02:22.900)

OK.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:02:33.792)

OK, all right.

Janet, how might sharing your experiences of success and growth create a positive ripple effect in your family, community, the world?

Janet M. Harvey (01:02:52.371)

You know, the ripple effect is up to each person who’s on the receiving end. I can’t answer the how. What I can answer is the what. That what I choose as my mindset, thoughts, beliefs, routines, preferences, choices to be more spontaneous, to allow myself to be with the moment as it shows up,

That is what starts the process. And if I’ve given of myself unconditionally, I know that that will touch others.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:03:48.302)

Thank you. What exciting opportunities do you see on the horizon? How do these opportunities align with your passions and aspirations?

Janet M. Harvey (01:03:59.538)

Well, I think we’ve been talking about it all morning. You know, the things that I’m working on now are about extending our reach. Technology is accelerating the way people get access to learning and the way they get access to each other. And I think all of us who are in the learning, growth, and change business

Have an opportunity to shape in a way we didn’t before. Before everybody had everything that’s ever been done by humanity in the palm of their hand. And they’re rapidly learning that if you ask a better question, you have more open up to you.

Then what do you do with it? Because technology will move faster than the human brain is meant to process. And I think that this is presenting a bit of a dilemma right now. “What do you mean I can’t control it?” Well, you can’t. So give it up, because that’s not how this is going to work. You can be in relationship with technology. You can be in relationship with what it processes on your behalf. You still have the power of choice.

You’re not a victim to it. And these are the things that we’re going to need to grapple with. What’s the right amount of regulation? How do we ensure that undeveloped brains don’t get brainwashed? Those issues are real. And it takes all of us to pay attention to that and not see technology as the demon, because it isn’t. It actually might help save the human race. We’ll see. That’s up to us.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:05:52.024)

That’s an interesting concept, that technology could potentially save the human race.

Janet M. Harvey (01:06:02.098)

Because it can think about everything we’ve ever thought faster than we can.

And it gives us the freedom to choose, to be alert, to notice, to be conscious in our choices, to give consideration to other that we say we don’t have time for because we’re so dang busy.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:06:31.534)

Do you think technology can potentially predict

Human behavior, therefore human outcome?

Janet M. Harvey (01:06:42.611)

I think technology can present scenarios of human behavior. It’s not the behavior. It’s its own ability to infer from everything that’s ever happened. It knows all history and it can say, “Given that history, this is one scenario. Here’s another scenario.” I don’t know how much time you’ve spent playing with any of the generative AI tools, but you get your first right answer and it’s like, “Number two is stupid.

Pull that out. Here, answer this question instead.” And it rewrites the three that you kept because it realizes, “I made a connection that doesn’t make sense. OK, here.” And it learns. Right? I’ve been working on ours for two years now. I mean, it’s uncanny how it sounds like me. And my point is, I’m still responsible for the other side of it. So I don’t think it replaces humans.

But it gives us an edge up because it can go through all that we know of human history. And it’s feeding itself in current time. And then it makes inferences and builds scenarios. Whether we follow them or not, that’s still up to us. So I think it’s a partnership that we build, not an independence.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:08:00.814)

Hmm.

Janet M. Harvey (01:08:13.649)

And the freedom it’s going to give humans to come back home to heart, that heartens me.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:08:21.756)

Mmm.

Janet M. Harvey (01:08:24.967)

Being a human has no destination and it demands a conscious, intentional, deliberate wholeheartedness to thrive individually and as a community. And we have been so overloaded in our quest for money and wealth and material things that we have benched the incredible magnificence of joy and love.

This may bring us back into balance, I can hope.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:09:00.844)

You mentioned joy. What brings you joy?

Janet M. Harvey (01:09:03.769)

Everything. Everything. Really. Watching my Seattle Seahawks beat the Los Angeles Rams last night was really fun. And it’s joyous to me to watch the joy in all of those young men’s bodies and faces and laughter and hugs and, you know, it doesn’t matter. It’s up to me to feel the joy. It’s in everything.

Watching the hummingbirds on the feeder outside my window. Yeah, everything. Even pulling weeds. Everybody’s like, really? I’m like, “Think of the beauty that’s left after I finish pulling weeds in the garden. It’s wonderful. I got my hands in the dirt. It’s joyous.”

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:09:55.564)

We’ve almost come to the end of our conversation. And I’d like to know, what book recommendation do you have? It can be a book that you’ve read recently or something that has stayed with you over the years.

Janet M. Harvey (01:10:22.899)

I’m choosing three. Which one? One of the really impactful books when I was having a tough time figuring out why people thought I was scary and intimidating, because that was not my heart, but it was how people were experiencing me, is a book by the Arbinger Institute called

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:10:29.511)

You can show them all.

Janet M. Harvey (01:10:52.815)

“Leadership and Self Deception.”

It’s brilliant. It’s told as a parable. And there’s one similar to it, a little shorter. Dr. Stephen Karpman developed something called the Drama Triangle. And a colleague of mine who’s passed, right, his soul, David Emerald, wrote a book called “The Power of TED.” And TED is in capital letters, T E D,

And it stands for the empowerment dynamic. He had the great privilege to spend a bunch of time with Dr. Karpman and he built the antidote. So how do I move out of victim? How do I move out of persecutor? And how do I move out of rescuer? And they are coach and champion and

I can’t believe I’m just going to space on the third C. It’ll come back to me. Anyway, very, very easy to read, also written as a parable. These are both books that I use in personal and professional coaching relationships.

And the other one is written by a gentleman from Stanford who has taught creativity forever and it’s called “The Highest Goal.”

Janet M. Harvey (01:12:26.907)

This is a wonderful book for those who are seeking the next evolution they want to make in their lives and remembering that that’s up to them. You’ve got to find your why and your what before you step into the hows. Goal setting without connection to what’s at the seat of your own soul doesn’t work. That’s another good one too, by the way, “Seat of the Soul.”

I could take my camera and show you that the walls of my office are filled with bookcases.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:13:07.992)

Thank you for your book recommendations. Janet, is there anything else? Do you have any final thoughts?

Janet M. Harvey (01:13:10.163)

Sure.

Janet M. Harvey (01:13:14.387)

Oh, I should have given you my latest book, which is “From Tension to Transformation: A Leader’s Guide to Generative Change.”

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:13:17.607)

Please say it again.

OK.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:13:32.248)

Do you have other books that you’ve written?

Janet M. Harvey (01:13:34.035)

The one before that is called “Invite Change: Lessons from 2020, The Year of No Return.”

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:13:54.382)

Thank you. I’ll add them to the list. Do you have any final thoughts?

Janet M. Harvey (01:13:56.883)

Great.

Janet M. Harvey (01:14:00.628)

Only how much I appreciate and have gratitude for your curiosity. As I said to you at the beginning before I’d even experienced it, it’s important to remember the quality of the interviewer makes a big difference in the depth and breadth of sharing that can occur in this kind of format. So well done, my friend. Thank you.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:14:25.208)

Thank you. Thank you for your time. Thank you for saying yes. And thank you for sharing so generously. And I just want to go over some of the appreciation nuggets that I’m taking away from our conversation. And

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:14:51.534)

Some of the things that stuck with me during our conversation.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:15:00.160)

You said this thought, and I just captured just a small portion of it. You said, “Cause reciprocal prosperity.” And I thought, wow, I like that.

Janet M. Harvey (01:15:13.555)

You.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:15:17.078)

Remember to show up as yourself every time. Every person matters.

We all have sandpaper moments that make us who we are.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:15:37.866)

And trauma has its own clock.

Aderonke Bademosi Wilson (01:15:43.756)

Janet, thank you very much for your time today. I appreciate you joining me on ABWilson’s Heart of the Matter, a podcast dedicated to asking overwhelmingly positive questions as we uncover incredible stories and wisdom of people you may know. Janet Harvey, thank you so much.

Janet M. Harvey (01:16:06.771)

Pleasure. Thank you