Ryan Marshall started as a graphic designer and is now an Experience Design Strategist at Bottle Rocket. Together we had a very candid conversation about career, work life balance, and how major life events can shape the way you "design" your own life.
You can find Ryan on LinkedIn here.
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Feel free to stalk the Experience Design on Instagram or check out xdpodcast.com for all show notes and a full transcript.
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As always thank you for listening, and if you enjoy what you're hearing, please share with your friends and co-workers :)
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If you are feeling EXTRA inspired, I would love for you to check out my Patreon page here: https://patreon.com/xdpodcast
#staycurious
Ryan Marshall started as a graphic designer and is now an Experience Design Strategist at Bottle Rocket. Together we had a very candid conversation about career, work life balance, and how major life events can shape the way you "design" your own life.
You can find Ryan on LinkedIn here.
-
Feel free to stalk the Experience Design on Instagram or check out xdpodcast.com for all show notes and a full transcript.
-
As always thank you for listening, and if you enjoy what you're hearing, please share with your friends and co-workers :)
-
If you are feeling EXTRA inspired, I would love for you to check out my Patreon page here: https://patreon.com/xdpodcast
#staycurious
Okay.
Speaker 2:[inaudible] friends. Welcome to the[inaudible] podcast, a show that explores how design shapes the way we experience brands, products, surfaces, and our everyday lives. As usual, I'm your host, Tony Doe said, joining me for the first time or have come back for more. I want to take a moment to thank you for tuning in and if you find value in this show, I would be honored if you took a moment to share this episode, hit that subscribe button wherever you're listening or left a review. It's always greatly appreciated. And with that, what do you say? We just jumped right into the interview,
Speaker 3:Ryan, before we dive into all the things, why don't you give us a little background about how you got to where you are and what you do now? Yeah, that is a good question. Um, sometimes I don't really understand why I am where I'm at. Um, and sometimes I'm asking myself why I'm in Texas, especially in the summer. Yes, exactly. Um, so about 15 years ago, I kind of started my career, um, in Portland. And, uh, my background is in graphic design and after about 10 years, I'm in Oregon and trying to get a career, somehow I made my way to Texas and got a job at an agency over here. And now I'm at bottle rocket. Right now I'm a on the kind of strategy side of XD and um, kind of started out in design but kind of slowly moved to strategy. So this brings up a good point. I mean, obviously the title of my podcast is the[inaudible] podcast and at bottle rocket, I'm an XD strategist. Yes. But like what is XD? And furthermore, if we back up, you said you started in graphic design yeah. And it slowly transitioned into probably Ui, Ux, I a information architecture. Yeah. All of these acronyms. Yeah. But what I'm interested in, what do you think is the difference between Ui, Ux, XD, and how did you evolve getting there? So I think, again, if you go back, uh, or for me, if I go back say 15 years, um, graphic design was kind of this thing that was appealing to me. Um, you know, 15 years ago we didn't have a I iPhones, the web was still pretty early in development of male. It's like the big thing. Yeah, exactly. MMM. Oh yeah. I think kind of art and graphic design was something that kind of piqued my interest. Um, you know, and, and art was always been with me since an early age. Um, I think as I was kind of approaching college, um, I kinda realized that graphic design seemed to have a more of a, uh, career kind of attached to it. Um, were not that there's anything against artists. I think I just kind of feared being like a starving artist or just, I didn't really know what that looked like, but graphic design was cool because it was, Ooh, I can use a computer and, you know, make some money, you know? And so that, that, that was kind of appealing to me. Um, you know, we really focused on like traditional, you know, Swiss design and, and graphic design. So I had, um, just a, a really good foundation, um, uh, in design and then we got to kind of mess around with the web like a little bit and websites that just like really piqued my interest. And back then too, they were like, flash was kind of becoming a big thing and it Kinda was a big thing. And not only was I interested in kind of I think web design and that kind of stuff. I was also interested in programming. Uh, we had like an html class and uh, we may have had like a flash class or something back then, but it wasn't a lot of, there was like one class or a couple of classes, but um, I kind of wanted like more of that. So I loved kind of designing and I love kind of building, so I kind of pushed myself. I'm kind of outside of school just to learn like Java script and get better with CSS and more of the front end on the web. But just kind of, I wanted to kind of keep going. I really liked the idea of designing and building my own stuff. I think that, um, kind of having an understanding of like the technical aspect of it really helped me design better because then I could design and say, okay, I know what you can and can't do. Um, and that Kinda just help inform my design. So I spent probably about 10 years, um, actually had a, a crazy job right out of school. Um, and it wasn't really Ux Ui focused, it was more graphic design and I was there a long time for about 10 years, which is kind of crazy. Wow. Yeah, it's Kinda nuts to think I worked somewhere for, for 10 years, but, but really like during the day I was doing kind of just graphic design stuff, but on, uh, you know, nights and weekends I was doing side web projects. So I kind of started my own little business and I would do kind of, you know, smaller websites, so design and build the front end of websites, you know, back then, I don't even know if there was like Ux was really a thing yet or an acronym or whatever, but um, but kind of doing UX and not knowing it and Ui. But um, I really started to get interested in native apps like when the iPhone came out in 2008 or whenever that was 2007. Um, but it was just so new and you know, I needed to kind of go somewhere that was doing things with native apps. Um, so at about that time, an agency here in Dallas reached out to me, um, and they were doing native app stuff and I got me really excited cause I was like, okay, this is where I get to go and uh, you know, learn this stuff. I was just really excited to get there and, and just absorb everything I could. And what was really cool, I was just going there, I started to learn more about UX and kind of learn more about strategy stuff and just learn more about, um, I think, um, working on projects and products for larger brands and, and just kind of learning a little bit more about the industry. So before I'd kind of done more smaller things just cause I had my own little side business I would never really working with like really large brands are and things like that. So uh, it was just really cool to kind of absorb all that information. And when you were there, was it UI? Um, no it was, it was Ux and Ui, so yeah. Yeah, it was more, um, I think the interesting thing about, um, being at that, that past agency compared to where I'm at now is kind of the makeup. Um, I think of their design department. They don't really have, they didn't have like an XD department. Uh, but they, I guess they kind of all, they considered it all just design. But we did many of the things that say a strategist would do here at bottle rocket. It just didn't really have that, that term or that title wasn't necessarily like associated with it. Booze all bucketed under UX designer. Yeah. Like Ux, Ui. Yeah. But not all of it. We had some strategy, but some of the things that, that you do here at bottle rocket under that strategy kind of role were things that say a designer like myself would also do those things. So just a little bit different. So when you came to bottle rocket, you saw the opportunity here obviously in applied, but it was for art director. Yeah. So I think that was the interesting thing. Um, uh, I kind of felt good about being at least a designer here, you know, initially or say art director. I mean, I think that title was a little bit new to me. Um, but, um, kind of knowing I wanted to move in the direction of strategy and kind of knew that was kind of where my heart was at and where my, I guess career was trending. And, you know, it made sense for me to be here. Um, and I knew that I could contribute on the design side, um, but also be around people that could kind of help foster some of those areas of Ux, you know, and um, and strategy and kind of just helped me grow like in that direction. So when we talk about Ui and Ux and design, visual aesthetics, um, meaning behind things, sometimes the thought is if it looks great, it works great, but that's not always the case. That is true. And I think, uh, going back a little bit to earlier in my career, I used to kind of think that was the case that if you had something that looked really sexy, I was like, well, that must mean it's successful or useful or whatever. But, um, you know, a lot of people look at my design, yeah. Work and they tell me, Oh, you're such a great designer. Like, why don't you care about design? Or why don't you want to keep continuing with more like visual design, you know? And, um, you know, again, I think XD experience design as strategists and stuff, you're still a designer. You're still designing that experience. Um, but you're really digging into the why. Um, you know, behind, uh, peoples are companies, businesses, um, and all of that stuff helps inform the design. So to me, I feel like, um, you know, as long as you're kind of understanding the business value and users and, uh, the goals of the user and, um, you know, you can make a really great product or app or a website or web app or whatever, it's going to be a, and it can kind of visually look terrible. You know, I think that's what's interesting about experiences. There are a experiences out there that kind of looked like crap, but everybody uses them, you know? And why? Like, why is that? It's because, you know, uh, you know, people are different and, uh, people use things that actually deliver value and the visuals of stuff or just kind of, I guess like icing on the cake a little bit. Um, but I've used lots of experience that I actually use get value out of, but kind of look terrible. So to you, what is, what is strategy about, well, we're going kind of back a little bit. So when I was at that other agency, you know, um, I started to learn a lot about how important it is to understand the business of clients that come through the door and how, um, you know, what we're really doing is, um, you know, understanding their business, understanding their, um, their goals, uh, understanding their users, trying to understand everything we can so that we can hopefully provide an experience that supports those goals or exceeds those goals or whatever it is. So many businesses that are indifferent, you know, stages and evolution of where they're at. And so as, as a strategist, you're really looking to identify all those things. Um, and then, you know, there's kind of an assumption that there's some kind of experience that's going to help with those things. And then you're really there just to either, you know, validate those assumptions or um, and really kind of just help direct that business and make sure that, um, the experience it's assumed or whatever is really bringing value. So what kind of things, um, you have to think about the influence, the brand experience that are outside of an APP. You know, you really need to think, uh, you know, just know their customer's journey, you know, at, at kind of the different touch points of their customer. Like where do they interact with the business, you know, what's kind of a starting point, what's an end point? So again, like an APP is like one, maybe one touchpoint, but there can be multiple touch points within that journey. There's an experience that I've been really thinking about a lot recently that I more and more getting obsessed with the idea that voice is going to be a large part of how we interact with brands and how we order things, how we consume things. So what are your thoughts on voice as far as interacting with brands and it's becoming one of those experience touchpoints? Yeah, that's an interesting thing. Um, so I think voice is very powerful. I think it also can be very annoying. Um, so I think that's kind of the problem right now is, um, it's nascent. Yeah. It's a, it's, I feel like if there is a specific thing and for how voice is integrated today, you almost have to know how the voice is going to react before you can successfully interact with it in a sense. Um, so I feel like it can be powerful, but right now I still think that it's, it's, it's interesting, but I still want to talk to a human being most of the time and not, yeah, not just a robot all the time, you know? So for me, I mean, it's cool that, you know, you're, you geek out about it and all that stuff and I semi geek out in and I think it's cool, but it's more of like surface level cool or just, yeah. Initial kind of like, Ooh, that's cool. But then when I look at practicality, you know, I think, and probably like never really interact with that thing or whatever. We talked about your journey getting here and you and I were hired around the same time and part of our initiation, they have the, the all hands basically meeting and we tell an interesting fact about ourselves. And Yours was about, you had a quadruple bypass. Yes. Is that quadruple, quadruple four, almost five. And you're like, if somewhere were to see you on the street, like you're fit, you look like a fit dude.
Speaker 2:Right? They see me on the street, they go, oh yeah. Okay. Of course. Quadruple bypass. But how has that shaped your experience?
Speaker 3:Well, I think so. It's kind of interesting. Uh, it's definitely, I never thought I would have a quadruple bypass in my mid thirties. Um, I don't think anybody really thinks that, especially like you said, if somebody was to look at me and they wouldn't think that I would ever have one of those are better capable of that. But sometimes I feel pretty fortunate. Um, just because, you know, I'm fortunate that I was able to find that I had an issue with my heart. Um, you know, before that, you know, I didn't have a heart attack or anything like that, but, um, but I guess after I kind of just, you know, figured it out, I was Kinda really thankful, you know, because doctors do heart surgery is like every day, like every hour and we kind of, there's like a solution to that problem. Like, you know, but I was sometimes I think about people that have like cancers or things like that, that aren't curable, you know, and, um, it's crazy. Like, yeah, I dunno, I just feel like fortunate all the time, you know, again, thankful. I mean, who knows, I probably have cancer at some point. Uh, you know, but, but I mean, but I mean like, I guess like there's, there's like a fix to that. So I think like, like figuring it out felt really good. Um, beyond that. Like I kind of already took care of myself. It was actually a hereditary thing. Um, I don't actually eat too terribly and I, I exercise, but even more so as of late, I've been exercising even more. I'm just trying to really be focused on goals. And things that I want to achieve in my life, which actually I've kind of always been that way. I've always been very much a goal setter. Um, and always been pushing. Boy's been trying to achieve stuff in my life. I guess one of my biggest fears, um, you know, I just, I never wanted to get old. They're grow old and look back and regret something. Like if there is something I really wanted to do, like I'm always trying to push to like do that thing. So it was kind of always liked that before. But I guess maybe it gave me extra motivation to kind of stay focused on some things. Um,
Speaker 2:one of the things that I talk about is that, you know, designers, we're not just like these people that get hired and we have this massive expertise and all this knowledge. I mean, some of us obviously do, but they're from learned experiences. Um, but I think we're all designers in the sense that we design our lives, we designed our family life or work life. Exactly. And I imagine that something that radical has shaped the way that you are designing your life every day. And how has that affected the way that you look at your work life, your family life, man? It's a balancing act. Um,
Speaker 3:so I think like you mentioned family, I've got a couple of kids too. And um, you know, and we're definitely in family mode, but I want achieve all these goals. So I'm basically just looking at my day constantly. I'm looking at how I utilize my time. Um, and I think around the New Year, uh, I made some New Year's resolutions, which, you know, some people think you're kind of lame because you make them and break them and stuff, but I guess I just really felt motivated to get focused and, um, I looked at certain areas of my life and wanted to prove, improve in and um, but I couldn't do that, you know, and, and leave my family, you know, in the background. So, you know, my family is important to me. So I had to figure out how to make a little bit of time, you know, each day for, um, these goals that I have and, and um, so I kind of broke it into kind of hour chunks and, um, and I just told myself, well, hey, if I can, if I can do one hour of this one thing for 365 days, you know, in a year I've got to be achieving that goal at some point. You know. So I think a lot of times we have these big goals and I think we feel like we need to make, you know, take big chunks out of the steps, you know, to get to those goals. But my, my whole, I feel like my mindset now is just, just baby steps, you know, consistent, slow baby steps. Cause I feel like if I just keep doing that, then eventually that goal or whatever it is I was trying to achieve, you know, I'll achieve it. So speaking of goals in sort of passions, what gets you out of bed in the morning? What do you, what do you have that's just like burning right now? Uh, one of my goals is every morning to get up and read a little bit of my Bible. So, um, uh, you're kind of a faithful guy. Um, and my faith is super important to me. Um, so I'm just trying to just to, you know, get a little, a little bit into my Bible each day and that's, that's kind of one goal. Um, you know, another goal for me is my exercise. I'm just trying to stay consistent, uh, with that, uh, the two other goals would be a more programming and also, uh, just reading, like reading more. But all those things are getting me out of bed every day and just my job. Like I love it here too. So, uh, you know, I've got so many things that are getting me out of bed every single day and I get up early so people may think I'm crazy, but I usually, I'm usually getting up at about 5:00 AM every day. Like, it's just, I dunno, I think that kind of goes back to my first job that I had out of school. You know, we were expected to be there at like 6:00 AM and so I got really accustomed to getting up around around 5:00 AM and then early bird gets the worm I guess. And so I kind of just stick to that and I, I get up early and that's Kinda how I am. I do, I do my thing. So it kind of perfectly leads into the question that I ask all of my guests, which is, what is the one thing that is nondigital that you own
Speaker 2:that means the most to you or has added the most value to your life and why?
Speaker 4:Uh,
Speaker 3:yeah, that would be my bible as well. So my faith is the most important thing in my life, in my life. You know, my relationship with God, a kind of direct my life. Um, I really care about people a lot. Um, maybe that's why I'm in Ux. I care about, you know, users and I want everybody to have the best experience ever. And, um, but I, I genuinely care about people, all people and so kind of my faith keeps me grounded and, and kind of helps me to love people, even the most obnoxious people and people that make me mad and everything else. It just kind of brings me back to, uh, always treating people really well. I think that's kind of another thing that I really strive for is treating everyone really well with a lot of respect. Um, that's just a big part of me. Like I, it's almost like I don't really care if, you know, what anyone's upset with me or, uh, treats me wrong, cuts me off. Uh, whatever. Like I always want to treat everyone with 100%, 100% respect. It's just like super important to me.
Speaker 2:It goes back to what we focused on so much as the empathy. And that for me was very eyeopening as how I live my life is being able to empathize with the user. It changed the way that I interact with people. Yeah. So I guess you're a designer and your biggest influence is the ultimate designer. Yeah. I like the way you put that. I do believe. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Uh, God is a designer. He has designed a all of us pretty intricately and uh, we're all unique and it's, it's pretty awesome.
Speaker 2:Well, thank you for being here and sharing with us your story and being candid and vulnerable and a cool dude. So let's do it again sometime. Thanks Tony. And with that, we will call it a week. I hope you enjoyed this episode and if you did, be sure to share it with your friends, family, or coworkers. As always, you can find the show notes and full transcript Ed XD, podcast.com or stockmen, Instagram ad XD podcast. I can't wait to have you back next week, but until then, friends stay curious. The XD podcast as part of XD media LLC and is produced and edited by me. Tonitto sad hosting and publication of the podcast is through Buzzsprout.
Speaker 1:Okay.