High Achiever Burnout: How to Protect Your Energy Without Guilt

What if staying busy is not just part of your schedule—but the way your nervous system feels safe?

In this episode, Jess and Claude sit down with licensed clinical social worker Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero to explore the connection between high achievement, people-pleasing, hypervigilance and burnout.

Karen explains why high achievers may feel anxious when they stop working, why setting a boundary can initially feel more uncomfortable than answering the late-night email, and how the pressure to constantly perform can begin much earlier than we realize.

Together, they discuss:

• How mental load and overwhelm can leave us feeling completely stuck
• Why Type A tendencies may be connected to people-pleasing
• The difference between true self-care and expensive “wellness”
• How after-hours emails can send mixed messages to employees
• Why managers should help teams prioritize—not simply add more work
• Grounding techniques for moments of anxiety or panic
• How breathing, movement, pets, music and supportive people can help us co-regulate
• Why burnout begins long before the moment we finally crash

Karen also shares simple ways to create “glimmers”—small moments of safety, connection and calm that help bring the nervous system back down.

Because protecting your energy is not laziness, and you do not have to earn rest by reaching your breaking point.

Connect with Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero:

Website: https://kdtesorierolcsw.net

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/kdtesorierolcsw/

TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@karen.a..dwyertes

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/share/14iE8QdmpUz/

If this conversation reminded you of someone who is always carrying too much, send them this episode—and keep supporting your Work Besties.

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Transcript

When Busy Becomes Regulation

Jess K 0:00

Work Besties Wellness Check-in. If your calendar cleared tomorrow, would you feel relieved or would you feel panicky? Because for some of us, busy isn't a schedule, it's regulation. And burnout doesn't start when you collapse. It starts when your nervous system decides rest is unsafe.

Claude F 0:18

Today we are talking about the version of high achieving that's actually hyper-vigilance. And how to set boundaries without guilt.

Jess K 0:26

Karen Dryard is here to help us trade away from that impactful areas and catch burnout early, like a work besties would.

Claude F 0:35

So, Mike Check, we are protecting our energy this month. Let's get into it. Hi, I'm Clone. And I'm Jess. We are corporate employees by day, entrepreneurs by night, and work besties for life.

Jess K 0:49

Join us as we explore how work besties lift each other up, laugh through the chaos, and thrive together in every industry. Work besties. Welcome, work besties. We're so excited to have you back to July, which is all focused on burnout and boundaries. Because burnout doesn't necessarily show up overnight, and most of us start to notice it first creep into our body.

Claude F 1:16

The work besties throw line this month is someone else often sees your burnout before you do, actually.

Jess K 1:24

Had that. We did, yes. We did several times. So, Karen, welcome to Work Besties Your Podcast. So, for

Mental Load And Early Burnout Signs

Jess K 1:30

people that are meeting you for the first time, what do you do?

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 1:34

My name is Karen Dwyer Tesserero, and I'm a licensed clinical social worker in New York City. Um, and I have a private practice and I work with people all the time on so many of the things you just touched on. The body sensations, regulation, burnout. It's it's all in my wheelhouse. So thank you so much for having me here today.

Jess K 1:54

When people do come to you, what is that first sign that convinces them they need to talk to you?

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 2:01

I deal a lot with women, and a lot of women experience what I call the mental load. They have so many different things going on, things going on at work, things going on at home, if they have children, if they have relationships, friendships, and they feel like they're being pulled in a thousand different directions, and then they get stuck, and then they don't know what to do. It's hard to make any movement. We're seeing this very often with people with ADHD as well, because I'm so overwhelmed by all the different things that they have to do that then they don't know what to do, and then they just doom scroll or they get lost in something and nothing gets done. They just sit and they're like, What do I have to do? And they can't put into the order the things that have to get done in order to take the next step.

Claude F 2:48

So I see a lot of it in my work. So, what are those steps that really you need to, you know, avoid those? Or actually, once you're in it, how to get away from it?

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 3:01

Well, the first thing is when you recognize that you're feeling that overwhelmed feeling, that burnt out feeling, I always ask people, where are you feeling that in your body? Tell me what that sensation is, where are you feeling it? And what's the feeling attached to it? So if somebody's saying, I feel really anxious, where do you feel that anxiety in your body and what does that sensation feel like? Then we'll dive deeper and I might ask them, does it have a shape? Does it have a color? Where does it live in you? And then what would help it feel better? And we start to move back and forth between what might make it feel better, what might make it move. Because when we get stuck and we're in that burnout phase, sometimes just taking that next step is the hardest thing. So, what would feel better in that anxiety to take that next step? And we really help break down is this work stuff, is this home stuff, is this relationship stuff? Where's the burnout coming from? So, Karen, is it patterns that you're finding?

Social Comparison And The “Should” Trap

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 3:56

For everybody, it's different. I think a lot of it has to do with, and this sounds horrible. I think it sounds horrible. I think a lot of it is people comparing themselves on social media to other people, and that also hurts people because they're looking at other moms, they're looking at other professionals. Well, they're doing that. Maybe I should be doing that, and that's the big thing. We carry these shoulds with us, these shoulds, and I tell my clients this all the time we got to stop shitting on ourselves because when we are constantly using the word should, what happens is we are putting expectations on ourselves. And when we don't meet those expectations, then we might feel depressed, then we might feel angry at ourselves, like we might feel frustrated. We really want to eliminate that should. That should, it doesn't help anybody. That should work. There are a couple of words that I personally have a grudge with. Should is one of them, and normal is another one. And no should be.

Jess K 4:59

I agree with you. The shoulds. Are you seeing when when that starts to happen that there's typical things outside of the gym scrolling? Do people become overly busy? Do there are other things that trigger that you they should stop and say, wait, what am I doing this for? Now we're getting even deeper

Type A Drive And People Pleasing

Jess K 5:16

into it.

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 5:16

Oftentimes what happens is, and I love the type A people, they are my favorite people. I work from a trauma lens. And something about those type A people, they really, I really look at them through that trauma lens. What what motivates you? Where's your motivation? And oftentimes it starts really, really young. It starts by actually trying to please either parents or teachers, actually. They want to get the good grade, they want to be the good student in school, and they carry that messaging with them through adulthood. So now they're in the workforce and they want to please their supervisor and they want to get that next promotion and they want to get that raise that comes with that added responsibility to the point that they're working themselves so hard. So one of the first things we do is what do we need to do to take a step back from that? And what would happen? What would your supervisor say if at 10 o'clock at night you didn't answer that email? What would happen? Where would the worlds fall apart in that moment? And what would that look like? Because one thing that people do when they're constantly going like this, they're abandoning their self-care. And there's only so long you could keep doing that before something is gonna happen, whether it's physical health-wise, mental health-wise, there's gonna be a breaking point. So we really want people to be practicing self-care.

Real Self-Care And Finding Glimmers

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 6:36

And I hear this a lot from people. I can't stop to do self-care. I can't afford to do self-care. Self-care does not have to be expensive, is people automatically think, I can't go away for a weekend, I can't go to a spa. I don't have money to do those things. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. We're not talking that. We're talking about meditating every day. We're talking about doing a body scan. We're talking about building a little herb garden on your windowsill and taking care and watching those plants grow, whether it's a basil plant, a rosemary plant, because that's feeding that nurturing and it's feeding us and it's feeding our families. It's a whole cycle there. Reading a book, people don't read anymore. They sit and doom scroll on their phone. Reading a hardcover book for fun, not work-related, that's self-care. Making a doctor's appointment is self-care. Like people don't realize what self-care is or how to.

Claude F 7:36

I don't meditate, but I take baths. Yeah.

Jess K 7:40

Well, I think what Karen says, whatever heck, yeah, I think there's all forms of self-care that you're bringing up that people still probably aren't doing routinely, but if they thought about it, they would enjoy doing because they do think one of two things. One, it's something like meditation or manifestation, which I love doing, and therefore you're like, ugh, I don't want to do it. Or super expensive, like going to a retreat or a spa when it could be something as simple as forest bathing, going out and walking among nature.

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 8:14

It could be reasonable for taking a bath.

Jess K 8:16

Yeah.

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 8:17

Nature could be Central Park. Like people think, oh, I live in the city. I can't afford, I can't afford a trip to go on on a nature hike or a woman's retreat. Just go outside your door. And when you're in Manhattan, if you look at the trees, they usually have those little um gates around the bottom so people just don't step on there. And they usually put, especially in the springtime, flowers in there. Just stand there and watch the flowers. Just look at the flowers. Deb Dana talks about this. She is a therapist who works with polyvagal theory and she has a book. And in her book, she talks about glimmers. And glimmers are those little moments of co-regulation, those little moments of safety. And if we could create those for ourselves, those little moments of connection, whether it's with a pet, whether it's with nature, all of that helps us feel good about ourselves. And what it does is it brings our central nervous system back down. It really resets us and takes that step away from the burnout and from all the stress.

After-Hours Boundaries Without Guilt

Jess K 9:19

So I wanted to ask a question. It's kind of going back a little, but type A personalities do enjoy working for other types of individuals who appreciate a type A personality. Based off of that, it sounds like we still need to create boundaries. From your perspective, what is the best way for somebody who is type A who seeks out a certain style of leadership to ensure that they're getting what they need, but they're also still balancing the boundaries?

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 9:48

First and foremost, and the type A's are not gonna like this. Put your phone away. Put your phone away. Don't answer email after a certain time in the day, whether it's six o'clock or nine o'clock at night. And I know I'm asking a lot for type A's because they're they will respond instantaneously to whatever the email is, whatever the text message is. It's okay to take a step back and say, you know what? I could wait till tomorrow morning for that. I can put the boundaries up. And I know that right now, this is my time for self-care. This is my time for connection with my friends and family. Whatever that is, set that limit for yourself. It is okay not to be on call 24-7. Unless you're an ER doc that is constantly on call or something like medical like that, it's not life or death. Like even if you work for an insurance company or something, it could wait till tomorrow. It's okay to let it wait for tomorrow. And people need to recognize that that it's okay. And oftentimes people with type A, they have this people-pleasing quality. So they want to be responsive, but that's where in part the burnout is coming from because they're not taking time to recharge their themselves.

Claude F 10:56

So, how do you go to that step? Because obviously you're going to have just not answering will bring you anxiety. So it's like, you know. Go to your math. You'll be taking a lot of math. It's like damn if you do, damn if you don't, right? You have anxiety because you answered your phone, but then you're going to have anxiety because you're not going to answer your phone.

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 11:22

So, how do you get away from learning how to sit with that uncomfortable feeling of not answering it? And then whether you're working with a therapist on that, you're doing mindfulness techniques around that.

Jess K 11:33

I just noticed a little breath there, like I did it for you because I could feel your tension.

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 11:42

I'm having anxiety about go run the bath now. That's part of it, is just sitting with that uncomfortable feeling and knowing I'm okay right now. That's the most important thing. I have three mantras that I work on. Like to get rid of the should and the normal, I have three mantras that I work from. My first mantra is never settle. Never settle for what doesn't feel good, never settle for the wrong situation. Just don't settle. My second one is I'm okay right now. And that comes in with learning all of these bodily sensation things that I'm talking about and learning how to check in with myself. And I do a body scan. And with the body scan, I start on my toes and I work my way up and I just check in with every part of my body while I concentrate on my breathing and I remind myself I'm okay right now. So if that email doesn't get responded to in the next five minutes, I'm still okay.

Claude F 12:39

And that one also type A people. So uh we have also people working for us, right? In our team. So that is also up to us to make sure that uh we don't give that unsafety to our team and saying, okay, if I'm okay to send emails, but making sure reiterating it to our team, you don't have to answer after working hours.

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 13:06

So many people don't do that. They say the words. You know who's famous for this? Teachers. Teachers, people think like teachers leave the school at three o'clock. No, those principles are going, especially in New York City. The principals are going all day, all night, and they're sending emails and texts all summer when the teachers are off. And then they'll make comments to the teachers like, Well, you know, I sent you an email last night and like you never responded. And some teachers are good at like, well, my teacher contract says I don't have to answer you off hours. But other teachers respond really quick. And so there are different professions where the message is we want you to have a work-life balance, but then why is the supervisors, the vice president, whoever it is, emailing and texting at 10 o'clock at night? More companies need to know how to help their staff regulate and how to set those boundaries. It's really important because honestly, people who are going to work themselves and have those high levels of anxiety, what we know about anxiety is coming from the amygdala part of our brain. And what it does is once we start to feel that stress and that anxiety, our brain, that primal part of our brain that's in the center of our brain, is like, wow, you're in a life-threatening situation right now because that email just came in. So your body is gonna start to release adrenaline, that your body is gonna start to release cortisol. And we know that those hormones, long term in your system, really affect your physical health. They cause belly fat, which leads to diabetes, which leads to acid reflux, leads to high blood pressure, which leads to heart attacks. So we know that the mind, the brain, and the body are all connected to each other. And working the way that our society tells us we have to work, it causes all these problems. And that's why we need to set boundaries around it, because it really does impact on every part of our lives.

Jess K 14:59

Karen, if you're you are a manager, or even if you have a manager who does state that, whether it's in their Slack team's message andor at the bottom of their email, is that enough though? Because sometimes in my mind you see it again and again and it becomes like they don't really mean it.

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 15:19

If they meant it, they wouldn't be emailing you after business hours.

Jess K 15:23

Right. That's that's where I'm coming from. Like I think if it's one off with a blue moon, fine. But if it's literally consistent.

Claude F 15:32

I don't know. I have some had in the past or whatever, people that has been emailing at night. If I answer, I'm like, what are you doing? This is not for you to answer tomorrow, or things like that.

Jess K 15:45

But it doesn't matter once you trigger it, you're setting the big deal for all of us. That's where I'm going. Like, I understand there's that that does hell from one perspective because the person sending it feels like, well, I'm not causing it, but they still kind of are. Yeah.

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 16:01

They're sending a mixed message. That's the problem there. They're sending the mixed message of, you know, I don't want you to respond to this, but here's the email. Well, then why are you sending it? You could always put it in your save back or box or your draft box and then send it during business hours. So when that manager different.

Jess K 16:18

So she's giving a look because we did have at one point in time a manager who did do that. So at seven o'clock, you got 50 messages in a row.

Claude F 16:29

And just getting up in the morning, I was we were getting anxiety. That would cause more anxiety.

Jess K 16:34

But yeah, but in the instance you're referring to, this individual or people who are writing to you are doing maybe one or two a night. They're not sending you 50 to a single order. So I think Karen's point of view to me makes more sense. And I I'm thinking about myself personally, to be honest, when I send them at night, I it's not like I'm sending 10 to people, I'm sending one. So I could wait until tomorrow to send it.

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 16:56

Do it not be on the clock. This virtual thing that we have with virtual workspaces and everything. People are working until 10, 11 o'clock at night. What does that do for our system? So we really need time to deregulate. We need time to get off of the screen so we could get a good night's sleep. This is all what we're talking about as far as self-care.

Claude F 17:16

Sometimes it's easy, easier done than say than done, right? Because, for example, if we have, I see for myself, meetings like from 9 to 6, and then starting my work at 6:30, because unfortunately they are deadline. I will have to work at night and I will have to send emails to my team, not expecting them to answer at all. But that is the only time I can catch up.

Meeting Overload And Smarter Delegation

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 17:44

Right. But then my question would be what's happening from nine to six that there are so many meetings that the other work isn't getting done. So let's switch to boundaries because I think that's another one that we should talk about. That's the boundary of like, oh sorry. Like that'll and if somebody is coming at you with all these different projects and all these different meetings, it's okay, no matter what field you're in, to go to your boss and be like, hey, I have five days, they're completely full of meetings, but yet I have this other three projects you want me to done. Help me prioritize what meetings can I skip so I could do those other things. That's what a manager is supposed to do is help you help you prioritize your work so you know what to do, when to do it, and how to get it done. If they're overloading you, it's okay to have that conversation too. Of like my job description does not fit into the hours allotted. Yeah.

Jess K 18:32

And then I think the other element too is the at least I can attest for myself. This is not, I'm not projecting any of this is me. Um, the delegation of work and ensuring you're adequately delegating. Because if you're type A, you're sometimes like, well, I just know if I do this is gonna get done better and quicker, and I won't have to go back and forth, but you just have to be okay with it.

Claude F 18:52

Yeah.

Jess K 18:52

So it's going back to that boundary setting and setting your team up for success too.

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 18:57

And and recognizing that if you have a team that you don't feel comfortable delegating to, that goes back to training. You know what I mean? Like, where do we have to look at that? Why can't I give them work that they should be able to do or are capable of doing, or where's that disconnect? Is it just a trust issue? Is it an anxiety issue of like I don't trust them for no other reason than I just really want to people please and get it right? Or is there something foundational in our training that we're missing? And we need to go back and revisit that and train our staff in order to be able to trust them to get the work done to delegate.

Jess K 19:34

So, one of the things that I would love to dive a little bit more into is you talked about some boundary settings. I feel like I I've heard you talk before, if you don't mind sharing some of the like micro resets or things that people can do when you're in the thick of overloaded work and really almost going to have kind of an anxiety attack. What are some things someone can do quickly to kind of reassess themselves?

Grounding Skills For Anxiety Spikes

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 20:00

So, one of the things when someone's about to have a panic attack, we want to bring you back to center. And what do I mean by that is to ground yourself. When I imagine a panic attack, it's almost like scrolling the drain. Oh, I have this thought or this feeling or this sensation. And sometimes we don't even know what the thought is. I just want to normalize that part of it. And then all of a sudden, our system is activated. I don't like to use the word triggered. I like the word activated because we know that this is our central nervous system becoming alive in our body, right? Our neurosception is what happens in our body that is scanning the environment for risk. So if that email pops in at 10 o'clock at night and you're starting to have a panic attack, like I said, that anxiety is taking over and all of those bad hormones are gonna start flowing. The first thing you could do in that moment is check in with your body. Where do I feel this right now? And then the second part, and this is from Peter Levine and Somatic Experiencing, where am I feeling that now? But what part of my body feels okay or neutral? And focus on that part of your body that feels okay or neutral. And this could be hard for some people. Some people might feel numbness, some people might say, I don't feel anything. But if you can't feel anything, feel the weight of your of your body in the chair and feel the chairs uh supporting you and offering stability to you, or feel the weight of your feet on the floor and just concentrate on that that feeling of your feet on the floor because being in touch with those bodily sensations are going to keep you in the here and now as long as you're deep breathing through it. Does that make sense?

Jess K 21:40

Totally. Yes.

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 21:41

Anxiety is a passing, fleeting, ebb and flow kind of emotion. And we don't want it to elevate to the point of a panic attack. So we really want to check in with ourselves. There's a lot of different activities out there as far as like square breathing, where you breathe into the count of four, hit the top, take another deep breath. Council four, hit the top and go all the way around like that and just concentrate on those deep breaths while you're doing this because we know that anxiety is starting. So many people utilize the ERs because of panic attacks, or they don't realize it's a panic attack. So we really want to help educate people like, how can I avoid it reaching that level? It's okay to feel a little anxiety, but I don't want my heart racing. I don't want a shortness of breath because that's all part of what happens with the panic attack. So doing these deep breathing exercises, checking in with our body, grounding ourselves to our environments by just looking around and naming in our heads everything we're seeing around us.

Claude F 22:42

That really helps ground us to the here and now. I think also it's important if you live with someone for them to know and help you how to, for example, they can mirror you can mirror breathing with them, right? And that is going to help if, for example, someone is has tendency to have panic attacks just to tell the partner or whoever lives, okay, if it happens, just help me and breathe with me, and that will help.

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 23:10

What you're describing is what we call co-regulation, and absolutely, and we co-regulate from the people that are around us. And it is a beautiful process when when you have somebody there that could do that for you. And honestly, it's great to do with a person, but it's also great to do with pets. Like pets really, that's why we have emotional support animals. People really do co-regulate with their animals, and the animals co-regulate with us. If you have a dog, like they know when you're having a bad time or they know when you're feeling anxious, and they'll respond because they're co-regulating with us. That's a great example of what co-regulation is. And touch, if it's an appropriate touch and it feels okay, sometimes having our partners touch us really does help with co-regulation. I did a polyvagal training and we were talking exactly about this. And I'll share this. One of my favorite things to have happen is to have my partner just come and put his head hands on my forehead. This helps drown me. It almost like, almost like him literally holding me down so that I stay in the here and now and I'll take a couple of deep breaths. And he lifts. He's like, This is the most ridiculous thing ever. I'm like, it helps me so much. It doesn't matter. It helps me. That's like the hands on the forehead, or even the butterfly tubs and bathing, or even just having your partner hold your hands. Also, weighted blankets are good for this. If you don't have a partner who's at home, a weighted blanket really helps with anxiety and really helps ground us. So there are so many different things that we could do. Music is a great way to get out of anxiety. Because keep in mind with anxiety, people could go into fight or flight, or they could go into freeze mode. If you're in freeze mode and you're in shutdown and you're sitting on your couch and you can't move because you're having that anxiety, I want you to move. So if you have to put on whatever music you like that gets you up and dancing or singing along, that is actually gonna help you get out of that anxiety and out of that panic attack. Music is a great regulator. I'm surprised.

Jess K 25:11

Yeah.

Prevention Mindset And Closing

Jess K 25:15

So thank you so much, Karen. This has been absolutely fantastic. You've given us the language and the way to talk to burnout and really understanding the high achiever element of it, because that's where we are getting a lot of questions from is the high achievers who sometimes feel like being busy is the sign of success. And you've kind of clearly succinctly stated that is not the case.

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 25:39

Yeah. It's more avoidant than anything.

Claude F 25:42

Yeah, correct. Exactly. And we have to remember that burnout is not just the moment we crash, it's whatever led to it. So it's important to do self-care when it happens, but especially as prevention.

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 25:59

Absolutely.

Claude F 26:00

Make it a part of your team.

Karen Dwyer-Tesoriero 26:02

We want to be practicing it all along. This way it feels part of our natural habits. You know, because what that um lends itself to are glimmers and looking forward to doing those things, whatever they are. I can't wait to get home today and read my book. Because that's gonna also make it okay to not check that email. If I'm reading that book and I'm so involved in it, I'm not gonna want to check the email. So that helps set up those boundaries too.

Claude F 26:25

When I had a good book, I was like, I can't wait to be in the subway to be able to read. So thank you for this, Karen.

Jess K 26:32

We so appreciate it. For the Work Bestie community, if you enjoyed this episode, please send it to your friends for a listen. Don't forget to like and subscribe and check out Karen's website. With that, everybody, keep thank you each other and thanks, Karen. Bye. Remember, whether you're swapping snacks in the break room, rescuing each other from endless meetings, or just sending that perfectly timed meme. Having a work bestie is like having your own personal hype squad.

Claude F 26:59

So keep lifting each other up, laughing through the chaos, and of course, thriving. Until next time, stay positive, stay productive, and don't forget to keep supporting each other. Work besties!