18. National Farm To School Network | Miguel Villareal

Join us as Miguel Villarreal, Interim Co-Executive Director, National Farm To School Network & school food service veteran, shares how culinary education and community collaboration are transforming student health and school wellness. From growing farm-to-school programs to addressing food inequities, Miguel reveals how parents, educators, and food service workers can work together to create healthier futures for our students & healthier communities.

Miguel Villarreal LinkedIn

Chapters
00:00 The Importance of Culinary and Nutrition Education
02:02 Miguel's Journey in Nutrition and School Food Services
05:59 Community Engagement and Racial Equity in Food Systems
11:51 The Growth of Farm to School Programs
17:51 Implementing Farm to School Initiatives
24:02 Building Relationships with School Food Services
29:58 Sustainable Change in School Nutrition Programs
34:24 Building Systemic Change in School Nutrition
37:00 The Role of Central Kitchens in Food Distribution
40:14 Regional Sourcing and Local Farming Challenges
42:23 The Importance of Nutritionists in Schools
46:10 Culinary Education: A Key to Healthier Choices
49:35 Engaging Communities in Nutrition Education
53:39 The Power of Hands-On Learning in Schools

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Transcript

Miguel Villareal (00:00.246)
If you were to ask me, Miguel, what's the number one thing that you would advise a school district that once they started, you know, putting things in place and really changing the wellness environments in those communities, what's the number one thing that you'd make sure that that was being done at the same time? And that is culinary and nutrition education classes during the school day. There are communities that are doing that across the country, but they're far few in between. But every one of those

communities that have put it into place have definitely improved the culture of health and wellness in their community.

Jollie (00:40.846)
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50 meals are donated for every item sold to the nation's largest hunger relief network. So get to look good while feeling good. Now onto today's episode. Hey everyone, Jolly here with Interrupt Hunger's Movie Give Podcast. Thanks again for joining us today. We've got a great guest in Miguel Villarreal. He's interim co-director of the National Farm to School Network. Miguel, thanks a lot for joining us today. I've been looking forward to this.

Thank you, Bill. I'm glad to be here.

Why don't you just take us on a little journey? Why are you passionate about the farm movement?

Miguel Villareal (02:09.761)
Yeah, well, let me back up a little bit since we're both from, truly from Texas. You know, I grew up in South Texas and spent 30 years in the Dallas area after I graduated from college with a nutrition degree. Bill, nutrition and fitness and wellness has always been a part of my life, ever since I could remember. And I recall

You know, I earned a degree in food and nutrition because I really, wanted to in some way help society. I didn't know how. I didn't know how I was going to help teach others some of the things that you're talking about. When I was, you know, when I was 20, 21 years old, I didn't know what that career was going to be. But as it turned out, I was just led in the right path. And that right path happened to be working in school food services.

My very first job was with the Dallas Independent School District. Now, I didn't know at the age of 21 that as a food service director in a school district that you could make a huge difference in the types of foods that you were serving to children and the education that was provided and the community awareness and all that. Those lessons came little by little. I was there.

in, in Texas, working as a school food service director in Dallas and in Victoria and in Plano and learned a lot during the process about making sure that we're providing kids the healthiest foods and so forth. But, but it was a difficult challenge. It was a difficult challenge because at the time, this is back in the early thousands, maybe late, there was not a whole lot of interest in the

learning about the food that we were serving and why we were serving them and so forth. So I ended up moving out to California in early 2000. And, and for me, I had an epiphany at that time because as hard as we tried to change the system in Texas, I just thought that California was way ahead of the curve and was doing all these things that I had thought about implementing in terms of healthier foods. mean, just, it's just a

Speaker 2 (04:34.688)
a standard, healthy foods in schools, education around those foods, the community awareness and so forth, and foods from local farms. But I learned that that wasn't the case when I moved out here and got a job in school food services. In fact, the community that I worked in, a small community surrounded by over 60 local farms and none of that food was being served in the schools. And for me, that was the first insight that there's, we have a problem.

And so how do I, how do I solve this problem? Cause first of all, don't know, I don't know why this problem even exists. So learning why that problem existed was where I began my journey. You and I've had a few discussions and some of the things that we've talked about is engaging the community and making sure that everybody is aware of these changes that we're making and why we're making these changes in our schools. But even in a community like

like I lived in out here in California. It took a lot of effort and a lot of energy, but eventually we did get the community on board. We started bringing in foods from our local farms. We provided education for our students and of course involved our community at large, including our school community and our extended community as well. So I have...

I've been fortunate in that I've been able to work and live and play in the area that I love the most. So it hasn't seen like work at all, honestly. It's an honor to be able to serve in this capacity and to help others. And today, working with the National Farm to School Network, it's something that I'm able to do in this capacity because it's helping communities from around the country. represent all.

50 states, the U.S. territories and District of Columbia. We've got partners and members throughout the country that are working on these initiatives. And as I was saying to you earlier, we definitely have come a long way from when ICE first started back in the early 80s and to where we are today. And one of the things that I like to say, Bill, is that I'm living in my future. And what do I mean by that?

Speaker 2 (06:56.92)
Some of these things that we're talking about, we were discussing these things 20, 30 years ago in terms of getting communities together, having podcasts, talking about these issues that are so important. And it was just a pipe dream, if you will, back then, because there was only a handful of people talking about this. But today we do have the entire, seemingly the entire country talking about it and people like yourselves doing something about it.

That's what's exciting for me is that we've come to this place where people are paying attention and now it's about action steps and the things that we're probably discuss in this podcast.

Yeah, that's exciting. I can't imagine how good that feels to see, to have a dream that you shared with a small handful of folks. And that's, you know, you're actually living it today. That's cool. It does feel like there's a huge shift in momentum. We're seeing more more places all over the country talk about, you know, school gardens and backyard gardens and getting off of artificial.

flavors and colors and ultra processed foods and just getting back to the things that, that heal us instead of making us sick. You mentioned when you moved to California, you saw that there was 60 local farms. said how many of these farms are we partnering with? And, and you were surprised that they said none. So what's the benefit? That might be a good place to start.

Thank you for asking the question because it's an important one. I've always said that we need to speak with a common language. And what is that common language that we speak? And at the time, I remember I didn't have a term for it. just, I used to say we were buying from local farms because it was the right thing to do. We were providing local organic foods grown.

Speaker 2 (08:59.116)
by our farmers because it was the right thing to do. And some people understood what that meant, the right thing to do. But over the years, what I've learned is this common language and the Nashville Farmers School Network has a way of bringing it all together as well. Bill, honestly, what we were doing, and I didn't at the time did not think of it in this way, in this manner at all, but we were addressing racial inequities that existed in the food system that were put in place.

intentionally or by many, by whether it be large food manufacturers or others looking at how does a company benefit from a school food service program versus really looking at it from the other side. that is, how do we make sure that every child in that school has access to the healthiest foods? Because these racial inequities

I call them racial inequities because it's, you've got, when you have a system where you've got students that qualify for free or reduced meals based on income, and then you have a whole nother set of families that don't qualify for free or reduced meals based on their income. But in this case, those families, and in our case in this area, those families represented about 30 % of our population.

That is that they live above the poverty level, but below the cost of living standards. So they didn't qualify for meals, for free meals. Yeah, to pay for the meals. Well, they didn't have income to pay for their meals. So they have that discretionary money. So you had all these different groups and it wasn't equitable across the field, if you will, for all students.

This common language is so, important early on that people understood. And when I started using terms like equity and racial equity, those are common terms that are used in education by educators. But what they weren't doing educators at the time were using it to refer to the food system. It's like, it just, I remember one educator saying to me, many for that matter, but saying to me, Miguel.

Speaker 2 (11:22.87)
No one's ever actually ever said that to us. You know, they've never made that connection in terms of inequities in the food system. You know, we're providing food. mean, there's a kid you're coming in, there's food that's being provided, but it was a type of food that was being provided. You know, the type, the highly processed foods versus the local foods. And so it was a matter of, again, that common language and common knowledge of these inequities.

You know, again, I had many educators say to me as well, when I say educators, whether it be administrators or teachers, saying we hadn't really given it much thought. You know, it wasn't something that they were thinking about on a daily basis. They knew food was provided and they knew that, you know, for the most part, the food was reasonable. It wasn't bad food. It's just, you know, what that food consisted of. High sugar.

lots of chemicals, maybe some antibiotics and hormones and things that dyes and other things of that nature that as a school food service director, my responsibility is to make sure that I'm providing the healthiest foods. So again, that common language is so, important. And the more that we got people to understand that, then Bill, what we noticed is that people were then repeating these same messages. So we had teachers repeating it, you had administrators, you had parents.

You had the community at large, you had many others repeating the same. And so when everybody gets on the same page, moving in the same direction, you know, that's when we're going to make some. for, for me, it's always been about the types of foods that we're providing those children. Cause food, all food is not food, food, know, we got, as you know, we talked about this. so making sure that, that not only are we addressing hunger, but that we're nourishing children in the best possible way.

So they can be their best physically, mentally, in the classroom and in their environment. You know, one of the things that I said after being in school food services for 30 something odd years and then total time was over 40 years. But after 30 years, it took that long for teachers in the classroom

Speaker 2 (13:50.446)
to say to us, we're definitely seeing the difference in our children, in their behavior, in their ability to be attentive in the classroom because of the foods that are being provided to children. They were seeing that direct correlation. And as I said, I was in the food and school food services over 30 years when I very first heard that.

And I say that over 30 years because it took a lot of time to change a system. Now, when I was in Texas, I tried to change it as much as I could. But when I came out to California, I really started making those changes in the schools. And it wasn't just about introducing healthier foods. It was also about eliminating the highly processed foods at the same time.

took both, and then of course the education and the school gardens that you're talking about and engaging the entire community by making sure that everybody understood, like I said, understood this common language and this common vision. Someone said to me, Bill, many years ago, I mean, I recall we were trying to push through an initiative where we were banning junk foods from coming into the community.

junk food trucks coming in during the school day. When I say junk food trucks, just full of highly processed foods, high sugar foods, parking alongside the schools, the middle schools and the high schools during lunch. And kids just lining up and buying this stuff left and right. And it took a long time to pass an ordinance. We finally did pass an ordinance, but it took about

a good two to three, maybe four years to get this moving. When I say moving, to get it enacted in our community. And I remember saying to somebody, man, I mean, I'm working really hard with a lot of individuals and we don't seem to be making much progress. And it's just because I just wanted the needle to move a little faster. And what they said to me, they said, you know, what you're doing is you're getting people for policy readiness.

Speaker 2 (16:11.586)
So when it does come to a vote in terms of an ordinance, which we eventually passed, the city and all the administrators and everybody else who was engaged were very aware as was the community. So sometimes you have to provide that education, that policy readiness, getting people aware of what you're doing and why you're doing it.

So when you do are ready to enact, whether it's an ordinance or a policy or something that you're trying to initiate in your community, people are ready to support you in those decisions. And so I learned a valuable lesson at that time is that getting people ready for policy is also part of the process.

Yeah, that makes sense. Not to put you on a spot, but are there any numbers you can throw out of schools that have a farm to school program versus those that don't?

Back about 20 years ago, there was only a handful of school districts that were buying locally grown foods, probably less than 100 schools that were engaged. Today, the census, USDA does a census on farm to school. I don't have the latest figures, but the figures that we've been using for a while is that that number now is close to 62,000 schools.

around the country that are engaged in farm to school, thousand schools. And I'll you another number. That's fantastic. Yeah. I'll give you another number that's, that's even bigger than that. And that is the, the, the amount of money being spent on locally grown foods. Again, back 20 years ago was maybe a few hundred thousand dollars total. Again, milk aside. Now that number with the last census, not the most recent census.

Speaker 2 (18:21.076)
is close to $2.5 billion. And I do know for a fact that that number has increased from $1.25 billion to close to $2 billion in schools purchasing local foods. that $1 billion of those dollars are represented in fruits and veggies.

That's amazing.

Yeah, so there's definitely been a huge movement in that direction and having more schools engaged in farm to school initiatives and so forth. So, and when we're talking about farm to school, you know, again, it could be your garden, it could be your local farm, it could be education around the foods that are being served and where the foods come from and so forth. So farm to school is pretty much all encompassing involving not only local farms, but also your gardens.

and the education around that food that's being served and why it's being served and who's growing your food.

That's incredible, 63,000. That's so reassuring to hear. I no idea it would be that high. that's, that's cool. So what about the, so let's shift gears onto like how to, how to bring a farm to school program to your community. Like, I guess one of the first questions most people might ask is, is how much is this going to cost?

Speaker 2 (19:45.59)
Yeah. I used to say to people, when they, cause that came up all the time. How much is it going to cost? We, and, and you got your CFO saying, we just, simply can't afford to do this. And my, my standard response is always the same. We can't afford not to do this because of the benefits that it has throughout the food system. So not only are you benefiting children in their health.

But you're also benefiting and improving when you're looking, when you're talking about farm to school, it's usually about local foods made from scratch. you're, you're spending time and energy on training staff. spent a lot of money on training, providing training resources for our staff in terms of different menus and recipes and so forth that we could provide. So we were improving their ability to

do their work as well, not only in terms of the foods we're providing, but also then also working on what else do they need? Once they're trained, we need to make sure they have the right, the sufficient facilities to be able to work in these environments. And we were improving their worth, if you will, in terms of the efforts that they put forth on behalf of students. mean, we have a...

Bill, I think something that's not really known, but the people that work in school food services are extremely proud of the work that they do. Extremely proud of the work that they do. They love the fact that they're nourishing kids every day, that they're keeping kids from going hungry. And the more that they can do that in a way that's even beneficial for those students, I I can tell you over the years, different districts where I worked in, I were the...

The employees would say to me, I'd come in as a new food service director and they'd say, you know, we're still serving, I'll just use the word pop tarts as an example, just a general brand, but a highly processed item that were, you know, they didn't like the fact that they were serving that to children. So again, they're extremely proud of the work that they do, which is why I loved working in this environment. And when you have people that love what they're doing and if you can help them improve.

Speaker 2 (22:08.504)
the work that they're doing and the impact that they're having on students. So you have that. And then you're also impacting the local economies because you're supporting the local farmers. Now, you you and I talked about this, but in some instances you have farms that are struggling and then in others you don't, you know, you have farms that are, they're doing fine. They're selling their foods to the, to restaurants and so forth. But if you, if you can help and we've helped the

many farmers that I've known a lot of food service programs that have helped farmers keep their farms because they provided, they grew crops that were brought into the schools. And in some instances, where I lived out here, these crops were organic. The majority of the, many of these farms out here are organically certified. so, I mean,

you're serving foods to children that are, you know, they don't have any pesticides, are grown in the best environments possible, the highest nutrient value for those children. And so people used to say to me, for example, when we brought in kale, said, Miguel, do your kids eat kale? I mean, and I say, no, they don't eat kale. mean, not, not initially they didn't eat kale, but what we did was we provided education and

culinary classes, if you will, that taught children about kale, how to prepare kale, how to understand what kale was. then when we engage students in that capacity in the classroom, that's when we had our students consuming kale in the cafeteria. And we've always had parents say to me, how how did you, how did you get my kids to eat tomatoes or kale or chard or whatever it was that we were doing? But we were providing that education.

which is an important piece of this work as well. Students understood what that was and how it could be prepared and then tasting it together as community and so forth. that's how we were successful in our efforts.

Speaker 1 (24:22.568)
Something you said, want to highlight real quick. You were talking about how passionate our food service workers are in our districts and how much pride they take on feeding folks. And so I think it is critically important that a parent or educator that really wants to get involved and improve the nutrition of their school meals. The worst thing in the world you could do is go in like ticked off and shame somebody else.

because that is just, there's zero empathy there for what they're dealing with. They're doing the best they can and many times with a very, very limited budget. But don't forget how much these folks love our kids and love doing what they're doing.

Bill, I used to say to parents all the time, said, look, I'm no different than an economically disadvantaged parent that's on food stamps. In terms of size, when I say I'm, the school food service department is no different. We have limited dollars. And, but just like I wouldn't go into an economically disadvantaged parent's home and begin to criticize as I opened up the, you know, the cupboards and looked at the foods that were available. I mean, just start criticizing, why in the world are you buying this? And why are you buying this? And why you buying that?

I'm not going to criticize that parent. The first thing I'm going to do is sit down with that parent and find out about why they're making the decisions that they're making. I mean, you and I already know this in many instances, parents are buying calories. They're doing the best they can with the limited funds that they have, just like school food service directors and school food service employees. You mentioned it a little while ago, they're doing the very best they can with their limited resources. So if you want to help.

Yeah, it is about finding out, going in there and learning and asking those leading questions about how we can best improve the program. And over the years, many of my food service employees were the ones that were giving me insight into ways of improving the program because they did.

Speaker 2 (26:32.748)
this day in and day out. I wasn't coming in trying to save the day. was coming in to help and bring together a program that's going to be beneficial for everybody. Beneficial for them, beneficial for the students, beneficial for the community at large. And as I said, that included our farmers or others that were engaged in this process. Then it was beneficial for everyone.

But yeah, that message right there is, I'm glad you brought it up. And a very important one that's sometimes overlooked because it's easy to criticize what's been happening versus asking leading questions about why it's happening and how can we, the person that's talking or trying to help out, how can we support you in improving these programs?

You know, one of the things that I think anyone who has gone out into a backyard and pulled a tomato or a carrot or any fresh produce off and eaten it right then and there, compared to something that you got at a grocery store that, you know, depend what season it is, that produce, I mean, numerous days since it was harvest.

the nutrition profile in that freshly harvested fruit or vegetable is like the difference is just like, mean, you really can't explain it. It's just.

No, mean, those of us that grow our own fruit understand that clearly. Tomatoes or cucumbers or whatever it is that you're growing understand how the flavors of those foods are just beyond what we would normally get at a grocery store. so, yeah, one of the things that we used to do that...

Speaker 2 (28:31.158)
And in fact, again, this is part of that education process. We would, we were bringing families out to farms. We were doing second harvesting, where, you we had so many farms out here. We learned that over the years is that a lot of that food, because they were, farmers were growing this food. of these foods didn't necessarily make it to market for whatever reason, didn't get picked from the fields. And so.

That second harvesting, we put a program together. We used to bring families out and do a second harvest, whether it was, as I said, whether it was lettuces or cucumbers or potatoes or whatever the case may be. Those foods are being gleaned at second harvest on a Monday, put on a truck on a Tuesday, next following day, because was in the evening when we were doing this work. And then on Wednesday.

They were served in the schools. So talk about highest nutrient level. And like you're talking about the best flavors in those foods, beneficial for our students. And of course it was, since it was second harvesting, we weren't necessarily paying for that food either because it was just, that food was going to be tilled in the soil to make more soil, which is also a good thing. But in this case, it was actually being used to feed our students.

So somebody listening to this, let's say they're motivated by what you've been sharing, and I'm sure a lot of them will. Let's talk about where to start. And I'll tell you what we're doing, me and another mom in the community, we're just at the very early stages of this. But I'll just throw out a couple of things that we're trying, and then I want to hear what you've got too, because that's why you're here. One of reasons why you're here, I'm learning it so we can.

implement this in Bernie too. So there's a few different communities. You know, you want to talk to your teachers and your child's principal. That's an easy place to start. The school board, that's a great place to start. The leadership in the nutrition department, we'll get to in just a minute, but there's a couple of committees. I, myself and my friend, we recently joined

Speaker 1 (30:56.418)
the school districts, there's a menu advisory committee, which we have to sign off on on each menu. And we haven't had a meeting yet. I mean, this literally just happened a couple of weeks ago. Just to dip your toes in the water and start learning, because there's just so much we don't know. I also found out that there's a district wellness committee. I don't remember the actual name of it. But then also,

Yeah.

Speaker 1 (31:24.374)
One of the benefits of living in a small town, we've been planning on reaching out to the school food services leadership. And my family was at lunch on Friday and my daughter pointed out, she's like, hey, that guy's shirt said nutrition on it. And so we hadn't sat down yet. So I ran out the door and I stopped them. like, hey, excuse, are y'all with the district nutritionists? And they were and it was great.

One of them was the district's executive chef and the other was the general manager for nutrition. And so I got their cards and we're going to find some time to sit down with them and just kind of introduce ourselves. And I mean, if it's just a couple of people, it's going to be really hard. But the thing I just mentioned to them, I'm like, if we find out what your needs are and where we can help, we get enough parents and enough teachers and enough of the community helping.

then it makes things so much easier. So where do you see?

Yeah, no, no, that's, you know, I think you laid it out to some degree and that is engaging everyone along the process. So, you you talked about the, the, the school nutrition leaders, of course, and then, and the administrators and the school board and the parents and, and so forth and getting everybody really seeing the same vision and knowing that it's going to be beneficial for them as well. Because it just elevates.

I told you earlier that the people that are working in school food services really are very proud of the work that they're doing and want to do, you know, want to be able to help nourish those children in the best possible way. But knowing that there's along the way, and this is where people like yourself and the community at large can help with those barriers that are in the way. And you start just addressing them one at a time or two at a time.

Speaker 2 (33:27.146)
addressing those barriers. And then also helping elevate their voice. It's something that I used to say that what was happening is that people by and large didn't know what they didn't know in terms of what was going on in the school food service program. So helping elevate their voice as well and making them a part of this system as well is a big help because eventually

That's how you make it sustainable, Bill. It has to be built into the system. You you said you're on the Student Wellness Policy Committee. Those are usually involved administrators and teachers and nurses and parents and so forth and school food service employees as well. But in order for it to be sustainable, it has to be built into the system. You know, we can help as outsiders. We can come in and help and support and lend to their

to those efforts, but eventually that school district has to have the people in place that will continue to keep this process going. as I said, it's become systemic because it's built into policy and people understand. And when I say built into policy, even one of the things that I, aha moments that I've had over the years, even with

job descriptions. You know, that language not only built into, not only written into a wellness policy, but also written into job descriptions. So now you've got your HR people in the district that understand the role of the people that are working in school food services, the people that are hired in those positions understand what their roles are as well. And using the same language that you're talking about, but

built into that job description, where it's like, these are my expectations. This is what this school board and the superintendent in this community are interested in and have put it in writing in my job description. And in some instances, and in many instances, I should say, it may change the worth of what those employees are getting paid. When I say the worth of the salaries, because now you're just like,

Speaker 2 (35:50.606)
You know, it's not just opening boxes. Now you've got to have some, you're going to have some training. You're to be providing some, some, you're going to be making school foods from, from scratch. You're going to be engaged in developing recipes and so on and so forth. So, you know, you want to pay people a fair wage for the work that they're doing because it's, it's, it's valuable work and you, the community has invested in those employees. So those will, you know, that might seem minute.

But it really does make a difference. Like I said, it's not only written into your laws policy, but it's written into the person's job description and what the expectations are.

trying to make it systemic, those are the kind of changes that you need. Yeah, I wouldn't have thought about that. That's interesting. Let's see here. So one of the questions I had, we talked a little bit about central kitchens. We're starting to hear more of those where there's one, like a nutrition hub where districts, there's a significant upfront cost, but they have more space to more efficiently cook fresh produce.

Yes. If you don't have, let's start with the district that doesn't have a central kitchen. Most of these, especially in the elementary school, these kitchens, they're smaller. Can, if you don't have a central kitchen, how easy is it to start sourcing more from a, from in a farm to school program?

Yeah. So distribution is always a number one concern is how are going to get that food into all those kitchens? once you figure out the distribution piece and you're able to deliver that food to these kitchens, and if you've got the right facilities and people are trained and so on and so forth, it's being done throughout the country. I mean, in different communities where the food is actually delivered to, as I said, to these different locations.

Speaker 2 (37:51.372)
So it can be done. It's just that you have to go through, you know, all the different components of it. You know, how are we going to get food from and how are we going to determine how much food is being delivered and so forth. Yes, a central facility is always beneficial or in some instances because you can bring it all into one location, clean it, store it, clean it and process it.

and then still get that food out to all the sites. But short of that, it's a matter of training and distribution to those individual sites.

Yeah, that makes sense. did read something last night. There was a new report I was reading through that mentioned this one particular central kitchen. It was a decent sized community. I think they had about 30,000 students in their district, but they said costs were reduced by 5%. And actually the number of meals that students bought actually went up by 4.5%. So, I mean, that would make sense if you have better quality food.

Like more people are gonna wanna eat it, so.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There's a, there's, mean, food service directors are there. They're great at their, at their jobs and know how to, you know, how, or they can save money, what they can do to prepare different foods and in different ways. you know, using more. I know one of the things that we did when I was a food service director, we introduced a lot of dishes made with legumes, beans to reduce the cost as we were trying to reduce some of the.

Speaker 2 (39:32.376)
costs in some other areas. just making, know, future directors make these decisions all the time in terms of, you know, they might serve a higher priced item on one day versus a lower cost item on another day. And it just averages out at the end of the week. So it's beneficial for them.

I've got one more question for you out of turn a little bit, you've lived, you know what it's like farming in South Texas and the San Antonio area. And then you've also know what it's like to farm and really one of the fertile crescents of the country in California.

Yeah.

not all climates are created equal, and it's gonna be a lot harder in South Texas to find someone. So can you just share some thoughts or tips on how to deal with some of those?

Yeah, yeah, for sure. So when you think, when we think about local, you know, there's, some instances, because of where we live, yeah, local literally meant that they, that farm was within 10 miles, sometimes within five miles out here in California. But if I'm in a different community, even out here in California, if I'm living in the Central Valley, those farms might be a greater distance away. So it might be.

Speaker 2 (40:56.194)
You know, those farms may be 50 to a hundred miles away. So then you're working with different distributors in terms of regionalizing those, those purchases. So where is that food being grown and is it regional? Does it come from, you know, whether it's central Texas or south Texas or north Texas. So it's more, it's more regionally located, but you're still making an effort to buy seasonal foods for.

students that are coming within a 200 to 250 mile radius. Or even the term local is also used pretty loosely in terms of a regional, in terms of even nearby states. So now you've got New Mexico and Arizona and Oklahoma, Louisiana, in terms of where is that food being grown and is it still from within a regional basis. So the closer you can get to your

community, obviously the better it's going to be for everyone, but we also have to recognize that that doesn't exist much. How do we support farms even if they're 200 miles away, but it is a regional farm that's growing food, that's supporting local communities as local as they could possibly be. Those decisions just have to be.

So I'm not.

be made. then there are, you mentioned food hubs. Food hubs is a great way to, that we're seeing more and more of those crop up around the country because it really bringing it into a central location and then distributing it back out to the schools or to the communities is beneficial.

Speaker 1 (42:42.764)
Yeah. So, kind of random, something else. I get into the weeds. My wife says I go from obsession to obsession to obsession. True. But I've really gotten to the weeds here since, since we started talking and try to do some things. So I was looking at in Japan, they're kind of heralded as, as having really the healthiest school meals in the entire world. And it is fascinating in America. We're, we're just over 40 % of Americans have have obesity.

another 30 something percent have overweight, but 40 % rates of obesity in America, right around 4 % in Japan. And so I was trying to figure out like, what is that different community, different emphasis on community versus individuals in America. But one of the things they're doing is there's actually law and I wasn't sure I believed this, so I had to look it up, but there is, there's actually law that a school that has 500 students or more,

has to have an on-site nutritionist. And then if it's smaller, they could share a nutritionist between other schools. just such a huge emphasis on nutrition for these kids. And you see the difference. mean, they're 10%, the rates of obesity that we have here in the United States.

Yeah.

Speaker 2 (43:59.15)
So it's just not having, so definitely as a nutritionist, that's an important role for sure. But it's what they're doing. It's what that nutritionist is doing. Similar to what you're talking about in the work that you're doing, Bill, in terms of bringing community together and bringing everybody on the same page and understanding so that nutritionist is helping their community advance wellness efforts and whether it be in the food, whether it's

be in education or whether it be in the physical side of it as well in terms of working with the different groups. But that role is so, so important. it's a role that honestly, by and large does not exist. You're absolutely right. In school food service, just in school districts in general, they do in the larger school districts where you have, you're able to bring in a dietician and that can play, that can have that role because of

You know, they can afford to hire somebody. Japan is an example of those districts that have made that commitment. This position is critical to the role that we play. And this person, that's their responsibilities are not only about working with the school food service department, but also working with the extended community within the extended and local community.

So your teachers, and parents, your administrators, your school board, and then your extended community. so again, all around making sure that those efforts, Bill, are not only being introduced in schools, but also in the homes, right? So people are making those decisions about the foods that they're buying at home as well. So schools alone aren't making kids obese.

It's society in general, know, the food, we see it everywhere. mean, where kids are consuming, where families are consuming their foods, the types of foods that they're consuming. So it is about changing everybody's.

Speaker 1 (46:10.158)
everybody. Yeah.

view of food and what food represents.

Do you have time for a couple more questions? Almost done. Sure. Yeah. Okay. one other point I was thinking about with the nutritionist dietitians in Japan. It wasn't just creating the meals, but they were spending a lot of time on culinary education and teaching the kids about nutrition and proteins and legumes and how you can reduce meat by using more legumes and beans and fiber and all that kind of stuff. So there's a lot of skills that could come out of that.

So Bill, on that note, I don't want you to lose track of that, because if you were to ask me, Miguel, what's the number one thing that you would advise a school district that once they started putting things in place and really changing the health, the wellness environments in those communities, what's the number one thing that you'd make sure that was being done at the same time?

And you test on it. And that is that culinary nutrition education classes during the school day. There are communities that are doing that across the country, but they're far few in between. But every one of those communities that have put it into place have definitely improved the culture of health and wellness in their community because they've engaged everybody along the process. Not only the students have learned about foods and how they're grown and

Speaker 2 (47:44.398)
And how to prepare, for example, a, uh, I'll just use, I just use a couple of examples, how to make a balsamic vinaigrette from scratch versus buying it in the store where it has a ton of additives. How to make hummus, for example, simply how to make hummus, how to make a healthier salad. mean, I like earlier, I talked about a kale salad or even legumes and how to consume those. But that education that around.

that culinary and nutrition education classes during the school day for students, it's beneficial for students. It's also beneficial. And this is an aha moment for me. It's, it's, was incredibly beneficial for the educators in the school system as well. Because what I didn't realize at the time was that we've had a whole generation that have, that have grown up without learning how to cook and how to prepare meals and so forth. So.

They were learning and during the process as well. And I had many educators when we were having these classes say to me, Miguel, to my point earlier, I had no idea that this is how hummus was made. I had no idea that it was so simple to make a balsamic vinaigrette from scratch or whatever it was that we were doing. And then of course, those kids are going home and also teaching their parents these same.

skills and knowledge and so forth. And so if I was to, I had a magic wand that I could wave. was the one thing that I would make sure that would happen was that we would provide nutrition and culinary classes during the school day for children as part of this learning process. And that's when you really start seeing the benefits.

Is there anything, any one thing that could shift the health of our country more than teaching kids about nutrition and how to cook? Yeah. There's not.

Speaker 2 (49:47.936)
And no, isn't. And hands-on culinary classes. mean, not just learning about it in the classroom, but simple hands-on. And I'm telling you, our classes were so simple. They were set up in such a way. We went into a classroom, we set up the labs. The students loved it. It was no more than an hour a day. But all the students were engaged in these classes, along with their teachers for that.

for that week, we took one classroom. It was just a simple setup, but the benefits far outweighed the efforts that we were putting into it. we started seeing, not only were students learning about these, but we saw, that's what I was telling you earlier, the kale story. we served kale in the cafeteria on the salad bar,

The kale would be consumed. It wouldn't be just there for looks or the spinach was consumed or whatever it was that they were. It had learned that week and we provided it on the salad bar. So consumption of these foods also increased dramatically. I remember my manager saying, oh my gosh, I'm having to buy so much more spinach or so much more kale or whatever it is that we were working on because these kids were already used to.

consuming it, they knew all about it and they had already tasted it. again, it's an investment that we need to make on behalf of our society that pays off huge dividends.

I just think the I think we really sell kids short that you know, like they're not gonna eat this they want this, you know chicken fingers or whatever over here like kids are bad They are so stinking curious and they want they they love Experiential learning the hands-on learning man If you if you do those two things teach them about it expose it to them show them how to do it man that just opens up

Speaker 1 (51:58.008)
whole new world for them that they're hungry to explore.

Exactly. Now, one of the things that I learned during that process, I knew that we could teach our elementary school kids, I knew we could get them engaged. For me, was like, yes, those kids are going to be excited about cooking and cutting and learning different skills and so on and so forth. But I wasn't so sure, and I learned this, I wasn't so sure about the middle school students, the boys, especially in terms of...

cooking and having to work with food and so forth. But I was surprised at how even the middle school students, how engaged they were and really wanting to explore new ways of preparing food and just interested, just interested in general. And I just, I don't know why that I thought that the middle school kids wouldn't be, as I said, as engaged. yeah, and high school kids definitely are.

Now I get

definitely high school kids are, but the middle school, that 11, 12, 13 year old, but they were just as interested as well.

Speaker 1 (53:10.35)
Oh, that's cool to hear. Wow. Well, this is probably a good place to stop. Miguel, this has been, man, I've learned so much from you and I love your passion. You've experienced so many different components and sides of food nutrition for kids and our local farmers and the community. it's just, you've really helped kind of shine, really shown a path forward of how

Somebody that hears this or is interested in just being a food advocate for our kids can.

Yeah, thank you.

So thank you so much. I'd love to be able to, I'll shoot you an email if you don't mind. Some school districts that are doing this really, really well, the Central Kitchen or Farm to School. Just if I can grab some resources I could share the show notes for just, it's so much easier to start if you have.

Yeah, so and so on that note one of the things that I want to say is that for people by and large for everyone I mean I've said if you eat food You should be in the know and and know what's going on in your community and one of the ways to keep up with what's going on around in your community and around Your state and around the nation is through the National Farm to School Network and it's it's

Speaker 2 (54:29.544)
simply farmtoschool.org. You can sign up as a member. doesn't cost anything to be a member. You get a weekly newsletter that we send out that keeps people engaged and involved and just connecting people to people, people to resources. And again, it gives us these voices that are so important. The more of us that are out here talking about this.

in our communities and the more people that are aware of this work, it's work becomes easier and easier to do because people want to be. I, it's, it's no different. I used to say, you know, that people, when they see the benefits of this, and that is we talked about it earlier, getting back to making sure that, you know, children are being fed, that people, that their children aren't going hungry, but you'd be surprised at the number of people that

that really want to be part of that team and want to help out. And the more that you are engaged, the more people that are become a part of your team and your team starts just growing, developing, and it's easier, you know, more hands makes it it easier.

Yeah, we're already seeing that here locally in Bernie, because I'm talking about this stuff to every, you know, we were out with some friends, a big group of friends Saturday night at a local place and we're talking about this and you just see like their eyes open wide and they're get the smile like, my gosh, this is the coolest thing. Yeah, it's easy to get excited about this kind of stuff.

Yeah, and they should be excited about it because it is about improving the health and wellness of that community. mean, putting our values and what we are trying to implement in our communities, putting them into action, whether that be through food or education, demonstrations of how this could be done.

Speaker 1 (56:35.424)
I love it. This has been wonderful. Wonderful. So besides farmtoschool.org, F-A-R-M-T-O-S-E-H.

Yeah, of farm to school. Yeah, to school. Yeah.

Got it. then so how else could folks follow you or contact you?

Yeah, so thank you for asking. So one of the things that people really want to keep up not only with, with Farm to School, but if they want to keep up with even some of the work that I'm doing as a co-executive director, I do, I do a lot of outreach through LinkedIn. So you can find me on LinkedIn, Miguel Villarreal at LinkedIn. You can Google Miguel Villarreal at Farm to School on LinkedIn and you'll find, find me, but you'll in connection to the work that we're doing that I'm

I'm specifically doing and some of the things that I mean, people that I'm engaging with around the country to continue to change and improve the culture of wellness. And one of the things that I've been doing in my role is reaching out to as many individuals, organizations, different partners, again, because together we're going to be able to, you know, make a difference and support each other along the way.

Speaker 2 (57:50.35)
knowing, like in your instance, Bill, I think you and I have had this conversation, as you start going through this process, what is it that's going to help you and your committee move this a little bit further along? You know, some things that you might learn from me or I might direct it to somebody else that has done this already that's going to give you just that much more of a head start so you can, you don't...

The one thing that we all want to do is continue to advance this work in a timely fashion. again, when we involve in our, as you're doing, when you involve the entire community, that's when the magic starts happening.

Yeah, learn from each other, share the load. you, Miguel, you're doing amazing stuff. It's obviously how much fun you're having. I do follow you on LinkedIn. I know you're racking up the miles because you're literally all over the country and you're on panel discussions and conferences with some really neat people that are doing just amazing things. So just thank you so much for joining us today. I've loved getting to know you and man, just thank you so much for your heart.

for helping others and just trying to make it easy for others too.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It is, you know, this work is driven by heart, correct? I mean, it's, it's the majority of why we all do what we do. We, we lead with our heart, but we make decisions as best as we can that's, are beneficial for, for everyone. Yeah. I'm, I'm, I'm fortunate that I'm still able to support and, you know, make a difference as much as I can by bringing together people that are just as passionate and, and motivated and

Speaker 2 (59:39.968)
and dedicated to this cause. Now we didn't get, we hear this term quite a bit as well as that we didn't get here overnight and we're not going to get out of it overnight. And it's so true to someone like myself that's been engaged in this for at least four decades. But what I will say is that there has been some significant changes, even with obesity rates at their highest, there has been so much attention to this work.

But so now it's about the things that we're talking about is truly educating people and children along the way and making sure that everybody understands why we're doing what we're doing. And as I said earlier, when we started the show is that we speak with a common language that we understand the work that we're doing and we as much as we can be as truthful about this work as possible. So people understand.

you know, what it is that we're trying to accomplish, that's beneficial to everyone.

love it, I love it. This has been a lot of fun. Thank you so much, Miguel. I can't tell you how much we appreciate you.

Thank you, Bill. then I might, you know, I was just in Texas recently, but I was in the Dallas area. So my parents still live in San Antonio. So the next time I'm in San Antonio, I'll definitely reach out because I know Bernie's just up the street and we'll plan something. We'll, I was just thinking about this the other day. I'd love to be a part, even if it's to sit on your, one of the committees, just to listen to what's being said.

Speaker 1 (01:01:21.614)
think we'll that happen. Yeah, well, thanks for the offer there. Yeah, I'll definitely take you up on that. We'll come up with something. That'll be fun. All right. Yeah. right. Thanks a lot, Miguel. Now we're going. Thank you. All right. Bye now.

Thank

Speaker 1 (01:01:40.686)
Thanks so much for listening. Please rate and review the podcast on the platform of your choice so we can reach more people and more people are recommended this podcast. And if you really liked it, the single best way you can help us grow is by telling your friends. Now for all the legal stuff. The views and opinion expressed in this program are those of the speakers and do not necessarily reflect the views or positions of any entities they represent. For my day job, I'm an employee of ABB and appear on this podcast on my own accord and not in the professional capacity as an ABB employee.

All viewpoints provided are my personal opinions and not intended to reflect those of my employer. If you have any questions or comments, please shoot me an email at jolly at interrupt hunger.org. Let's go spread some joy people.