House of JerMar

From Burn Your Shit to Big Deck Energy: Tarot Lori's Journey to Spiritual Entrepreneurship

• Jeanne Collins • Season 2 • Episode 66

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Discover how a deck of 78 cards holds the key to deeper self-awareness with this week's guest, Tarot Lori Dyan. She says the cards are not about fortune-telling; they are a mirror reflecting your inner wisdom back to you.

Returning to the House of JerMar podcast, Lori brings her signature blend of grounded wisdom and playful insight as she unpacks the true power of tarot. "I always say a tarot reading, at least with me, is a conversation with your soul," she explains. "I'm the interpreter, but you can have this conversation yourself." This refreshing perspective strips away the mystical intimidation that often surrounds tarot practice.

Lori's journey from communications director to full-time tarot reader wasn't immediate – it evolved over 35 years, beginning with lessons from a witch named Erica in Calgary, Alberta. The transformation accelerated after 50, when Lori finally decided to "plant her freak flag and let it fly." This courage led to a two-book deal with HarperCollins, with her latest release, "Big Deck Energy," demystifying tarot for modern readers.

Beyond dispelling myths about "scary" cards like Death and the Devil (which actually represent transformation and limiting beliefs), Lori dives deep into tarot ethics. She explains why questions should focus inward rather than prying into others' energies, and why everyone has the intuitive ability to interpret cards for themselves. Her practice has expanded beyond individual readings to corporate events, women's retreats, and even strategic planning sessions with businesses.

The episode culminates with Lori pulling the Star card for listeners – revealing it as one of the luckiest in the deck while offering profound wisdom about destiny, free will, and walking your own path. As she reminds us, "The magic is in you" – tarot simply helps us access what we already know deep within.

Ready to start your own conversation with your soul? Grab Lori's book Big Deck Energy, follow her on Instagram @TarotLori, or simply pull a card and see what messages find you when you need them most.

More about Lori Dyan:

Lori Dyan is a 2X HarperCollins bestselling author, tarot expert, and ritual guide with 35+ years of experience inspiring audiences worldwide. Known for her signature blend of humor and insight, Lori has been featured in Vogue and at luxury events from Beverly Hills to Bali.

Whether she’s captivating leaders at Google and Chanel or leading transformational retreats at Canyon Ranch, Lori creates unforgettable experiences that help guests release what no longer serves them—and step boldly into what’s next.

Her bestselling debut, Burn Your Sh*t, cracked open the power of ritual. Her latest bestseller, Big Deck Energy, launched into the self-help top 10 alongside Mel Robbins and Glennon Doyle, bringing tarot into the mainstream.

Mentored by a crystal-ball-gazing witch and deeply connected to her Indigenous lineage, Lori’s work weaves ancient wisdom with modern clarity to create uniquely empowering experiences.

www.tarotlori.com

House of JerMar: houseofjermar.com

Empowerment Fundamentals Course: https://members.houseofjermar.com/empowerment-course

Instagram: instagram.com/houseofjermar/
YouTube Channel: youtube.com/@Houseofjermar
Read Jeanne's Book: Two Feet In: Lessons From an All-In Life
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Speaker 1:

I always say a tarot reading, at least with me. I call it a conversation with your soul, you know, and I'm the interpreter, but you can have this conversation yourself with your own deck or just with the book. A lot of people just flip through the book and what do I need to know today? Doink and they choose a page and there's the reading. So you don't even really need the cards. But it's why, you know, these messages are so specifically random and randomly specific and that's why I say a card of the day. I'm thinking it means something very specific to me. You see me do it and you're like oh my god, this message is just for me, this is crazy. And then, three months from now, someone somehow gets that Instagram post coming up in their feed and sees it three months later and they're like, wow, this is exactly what I need to hear.

Speaker 2:

That's why I'm very I never say the date in the card of the day because it finds you when you need it. Welcome to the House of Germar podcast, where wellness starts within. The House of Germar is a lifestyle brand, empowering women to live all in through interior design and personal wellness. We are a destination for women ready to reimagine what is possible in their homes and lives and then create it. We are honored to have you join us on our mission to empower 1 million women to live all in.

Speaker 2:

I am your host, jean Collins, and I invite you to become inspired by this week's guest. And I invite you to become inspired by this week's guest. Welcome everybody. I'm your host, jean Collins, and today we have one of my favorite guests who's returning to the show Tarot Lori. I am so excited to have you back on the show. And, guys, we are going to talk all things tarot rituals, retreats, numerology. There's so much. She written her second book. For those of you who can see, here we go Big Deck Energy. So, terrell Lori, thank you for coming on the show. I'm so excited to have you.

Speaker 1:

Jean, I'm so happy to be back. I love just hanging out with you. Your energy is delicious.

Speaker 2:

And so is yours. I feel like a little kid this morning. I was like, yay, it's Terrell Lori Day. I just like you know you're all things woo, but you're so cool, you're so grounded. I have so much respect for you as a female entrepreneur and so I just love spending time with you and I follow you on Instagram and I do your rituals and I do your full moon rituals. We'll get into all that and your book. For those of you who have not seen Laurie's original podcast episode where we talk about her first book Burn your Shit. You didn't start out as Tarot Lori, so tell everybody how did you get into tarot cards and having this be your career and your mission and your purpose and everything that you are?

Speaker 1:

Right, no problem. I think it's really interesting because I've always been fascinated by the metaphysical and you know UFOs and witchcraft and psychics and mediums and all of that stuff. Growing up in the late 80s there was no real internet that you could be Googling anything about. There was no Google, and so everyone in Calgary, alberta, where I grew up up in Canada, saw this psychic named Erica who was a witch like a legit witch, saw this psychic named Erica who was a witch like a legit witch and she had the crystal ball and the red velvet wallpaper and 15 brooms and tea leaves, all the things. And I just loved her. And I remember the first time I saw her and she pulled out this big deck of old tarot cards and I was immediately like, what are those? Tell me everything. Oh, my God, I'm obsessed. And so I just started reading cards and she ended up mentoring me. I wrote about her in a paper that I wrote in university women's studies class about the history of witchcraft and she was one of my interview participants and so I got to really know her and she became my mentor. And then I mean the deck that I use is my original deck. I've had it for 35 years now and every reading I've ever done is in this deck, starting from day one with Erica practicing, and it's just something I could never put down.

Speaker 1:

I have a communications degree. I was working. I was a director of communications for a major telecom company. I did a lot of like stuff but I did not. I was not great at it. I would take my clients for readings when we had lunch and that's sort of what kept me in the game that you know, on that level. And then I, years ago, decided to just go all in. At that point I was doing more, you know, freelance copywriting and I had kids at that point, so I wasn't in the high, high level, but still in communications, and I finally just decided to plant my freak flag and let it fly and I am a tarot reader and that's when things really took off.

Speaker 2:

It was pretty cool, it is so cool and your story you talk about in your book, in both of your books. So when did you decide you wanted to become an author?

Speaker 1:

Well, again, because I write for a living and I'm confident in myself as a writer, the book thing was very serendipitous, very guided in a way that I don't realize until I look back on it, because I, you know, I had this little Zoom recorded very, very low tech how to do tarot workshop that I had created, and I wanted to have some sort of PDF document to go along with it. So I just started writing out my interpretation of the cards, which, do you know, your interpretation with your cards evolves as you do. You get this dialogue developing with your deck over time, and so my interpretations in many ways can be quite different or go more in depth or kind of in a different direction than the Tarot 101, as I refer to it. So I started putting this document together and then I started thinking, well, I'm going to put a story to each card, to sort of show that card in action, to sort of show how it can apply in everyday life. And then it expanded and expanded and I had all these friends who were doing self-publishing and I was thinking, well, I mean, I write for a living, like, why don't I try self-publish?

Speaker 1:

Maybe I could get you know a little indie publisher to print this for me and I don't have to pay too much. And I started thinking, well, what if I? What if they paid me? Like, what if I could make a couple of bucks on this? That'd be kind of cool. And then I started thinking, well, what about, like, if I had an agent who then shopped it around to publishers for, like, a publishing deal? And then I started thinking, why not like a big five publisher, like, why not me? You know? And that's sort of how manifesting works is you have these goals, you take steps towards it and then just see how things turn out.

Speaker 1:

And it turned out that I had a meeting with my agent, with HarperCollins, and they said, you know, tarot's kind of been done to death, but we really like this ritual. You do this burn your shit full moon fire ritual you do on Instagram live every month. Could you write a book about rituals? And my agent, being amazing, said, said, yeah, she'll write your book about rituals, but you also have to print the tarot book. So that's how I got a two book deal. The ritual book came out first. That came out last year. The tarot book just came out a couple of months ago and I actually had to rewrite about two thirds of it because it needed to match the tone and because you know it had been years since I'd originally written it. It needed to be zhuzhed up a bit, but that's how I became an author and deliver it.

Speaker 2:

You know you got to meet people halfway right, you got to meet the universe halfway. And you in your stories in your book you really talk about like how you had to really step into you being this person, you being Tarot Lori, tarot cards and being an author and being a speaker and doing retreats, like you had to really step in and get outside your comfort zone in order to become who we all see now. How scary was stepping into that new, unknown universe where, also at the time, when you step into something like that, like you didn't know, oh, I'm going to be doing retreats at Canyon Ranch and I'm going to be traveling around the country you don't know.

Speaker 2:

So how scary was that to step into that whole new you.

Speaker 1:

Well, it's funny because what really initiated a real spark? Or people are talking, liz Gilbert, and they'd be talking about things in a beautiful way that is unique to them. But I would be thinking to myself, well, that's the high priestess, well that's the tower, well, that's the wheel of fortune. And I got really annoyed thinking nobody realizes that these 78 cars has all of these lessons within them, at least the way that it's developed with me over time. So that got me sort of the gumption, you know, the chutzpah, to get out there and say like I want I have something to say about this. You know, and I think it's something that comes with turning 50, because everything happened really started to take off when I turned 50.

Speaker 1:

I'm 55 now, where you know you turn 40 and you start not caring as much what people think, and then by the time you turn 50, it's like I'm not even going to ask to see if you care, like I really don't care what y'all think, you know. And so that was a real turning point for me to be able to just say I'm just going to do me, I'm just going to do this stuff. I have something to say. I know how profound and powerful these tools are, whether it's rituals or tarot cards. They're not magic but they can be very magical and I want it in the hands of as many people as possible. So I'm really lucky that my career is my calling, like it really is my mission.

Speaker 1:

I'm sweaty just talking about it. I get my daughter calls it the tarot sweats when I get like in the zone talking about it. But yeah, it's very much my mission to tell as many people. People will ask me. But you're sort of sharing all your secrets in the tarot book, like you're giving it all away. Why would people even want a reading? But you know you get a reading with me. It's going to be unlike any reading you've ever had with anyone before, same with any other tarot reader. Like I'm confident enough in myself to not feel like I have to hide. You know what I know about it. I just want everyone and let it meet you where you're at and do what it can for you.

Speaker 2:

I just want everyone and let it meet you where you're at and do what it can for you. Yes, well, and you do a great job of explaining in this book in particular and you explain this when you talk online too it's like take what resonates and get rid of the rest, because your message to someone one day with one card, it might hit me very differently than it's going to hit you. Or you might pull a card today and pull that same card a month from now and your message you might say the same thing with the same really funny story about the card and what it means, but it might hit me differently a month from now.

Speaker 2:

So the beautiful thing about tarot and tarot readings is that it's an evolution as people are growing and evolving and it's not like a one and done thing, like yeah, okay, you're a Leo, all right, great, yeah, I'm a Leo, yeah, that's not changing. But tarot is evolving based on what's going on.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I always say a tarot reading, at least with me. I call it a conversation with your soul, you know, and I'm the interpreter, but you can have this conversation yourself with your own deck or just with the book. A lot of people just flip through the book and what do I need to know today? Doink and they choose a page and there's the reading. So you don't even really need the cards. But it's why, you know, these messages are so specifically random and randomly specific and that's why I say a card of the day. I'm thinking it means something very specific to me. You see me do it and you're like, oh my God, this message is just for me. This is crazy. And then, three months from now, someone somehow gets that Instagram post coming up in their feed and sees it three months later and they're like, wow, this is exactly what I need to hear. That's why I'm very. I never say the date in the card of the day. Yes, because it finds you when you need it.

Speaker 2:

You do which is true, and sometimes I see your stuff and I follow. You know you're one of my like starred people, so I see your content, but sometimes, you know, I'm not always on Instagram and so sometimes it'll be a couple days later and I'll go and I'll look and I'll be like, oh well, that was a couple days ago, but that's hitting today, like that's hitting, yeah, wild, it's so wild. Okay, so, before we get into the book of which I have so many questions and everybody, I read this entire book, every word of the entire book, more than once and I learned so much, and so I can't wait to dig into the book. But before we do, I am just personally curious what is the most interesting thing you have learned about yourself in this journey?

Speaker 1:

I learned that I know more than I thought I did. You know, when I had to put it down on paper, and when I had to, because the original draft was, you know 80% what the cards meant, the interpretation, and then I had a little bit about the history, a little bit about how to do a spread, how to ask a question. You know, I didn't have anything about the ethics of tarot at that point. And when I had to write this book and they said, no, that needs to be flipped Like, 20% is the interpretations, but the rest has to be all this other stuff, and I thought, oh God, how am I going to?

Speaker 2:

I don't know that.

Speaker 1:

And then when I started actually writing, I was like, oh, I actually know a lot about this and I did. Do you know research on the history? To really I had. Do you know research on the history to? Really I had to you know, verify sources and stuff. With HarperCollins they don't mess around like you need to. You can't say something happened without citing some sources, of course. And that was really really cool to just realize the depth and breadth of not even what I know about tarot, but just the confidence that I have in my ability to connect with these cards and the confidence in the cards to tell me what I need to know when I ask it.

Speaker 2:

Yes, Do you think of the cards like almost like little people, because they all have a story and they all have a personality and a character. So do they almost become like characters in a movie to you? Oh jeez, did you watch Schitt's Creek? You know what? I did watch some of it. I didn't watch all of it, but I watched part of it.

Speaker 1:

Yes, so Catherine O'Hara in Schitt's Creek. Her name's Moira Rose. She has this relationship with all her wigs, where they all have a name.

Speaker 1:

Amanda and Stephanie don't like each other. That is what I'm like with my cards. I say it all the time. I am Moira Rose of tarot, like it's so funny, because I'll be like, oh, they do not like these cards, or oh, we're getting trolled. Or I'll always say, oh, it's like tarot saying this. Sometimes it's the card, but it's more often just like as an entity, the deck. I always say in a reading, even a one card reading has a personality or a tone or a vibe, and sometimes it's really ethereal and metaphors and sometimes it's really bossy or prescriptive, sometimes it's consoling and sometimes it's like babe, did we stutter? Like get your shit together. You know like it's. There's always like a vibe. So in that way, 100% there's a personality to these cards. Yes, for sure. Yes.

Speaker 2:

It feels like it as you're reading the book. And when I had you on the show before and you were talking about this book, I was like, oh yay, I'm so excited for a book that's going to tell me all about the individual cards. And you told me, well, it's actually flipped. And I was like how much is she really going to say Like, isn't it all just?

Speaker 2:

about what each card means. But it turns out, as I was reading it, it was so insightful and I think I mean I learned so much and we'll get into my questions in a second. I learned so much but I found it so insightful to understand where these cards came from. Because then when I pull a card, now my understanding of that card and you always talk about like, look at the card first before you run to the book, and look at the card and see what the story is trying to tell you, because it's different for everybody.

Speaker 2:

Like your personal interpretation of the card and you always used to say that you say it on Instagram too and I always kind of was like I don't even understand this. Like what are these circles with these star things going through it and everything kind of looks grim on a lot of the cards going through it and everything kind of looks grim on a lot of the cards. Yes, but it was really helpful to understand the story of the card before I got to the card. So anyone who's watching or listening to this, you really need to read the book. It will make the cards themselves have so much more meaning to you if you read the book.

Speaker 1:

Oh, I love that, thank you. Yes, all right, so there are 78 cards?

Speaker 2:

First fact I didn't know. I had no idea there were 78 cards. I actually had no idea that there were major and minor. What do you call them? Arcana, arcana, arcana.

Speaker 1:

That's how you pronounce it. It comes from, I think it's the Latin word arcane, like secrets or unknown things.

Speaker 2:

Okay, Can you explain the difference? Do people have no idea Like I started having no idea what the difference is between major and minor arcana.

Speaker 1:

Yeah for sure. And also the difference between, I think, oracle cards versus tarot cards, because oracle cards can be 78 or 12 or 102. It's up to the creator, and they usually have a message written right on the card and it's a lovely prompt or a meditation point and that's great. And then tarot is more of a system and within this system it's not considered a tarot deck if it doesn't meet certain criteria in terms of 78 cards, a major arcana and a minor arcana. The major arcana is the cards that have the word at the bottom, like the sun, the devil, death, judgment, the world there, and they tend to be big, really like life journey cards, major messages, in theory okay, whereas the minor arcana is split into four suits, like a regular deck of cards, but instead of hearts you have cups, instead of spades you have swords, and so you have these four suits and they start at ace and they go up and they have a king and a queen and a page which is kind of like a jack, and then they have an extra guy, a knight, or actually the knight is like a jack. Anyway, you don't need to know that, but each of these suits wands, cups, swords, coins has a different sort of vibe to it. One tends to be more about money, one more about emotions, one more about, you know, new beginnings or careers, and they tend to be more in theory about, like, the day-to-day of life.

Speaker 1:

Now, this is where I diverge off of the sort of tarot 101 of it all. I think there are a few major arcana cards that are total snooze. They can be about fun things, but they're not telling me much. And there are a lot, a lot, a lot of minor arcana cards that are massively profound and impactful messages and often, especially for me, with the coin cards, the pentacles, the money cards, it has nothing to do with money.

Speaker 1:

I always say this could be about wealth, health, career, love, home, family, many. You know one or many areas of life and I give you this. You know, when we have a reading of any kind, it's like together we draw a map and I'm helping you read it and then what you do with it, as we said earlier, is up to you. I can't give you a prophecy saying, oh, this card means you're going to be an ophthalmologist, you know it's more okay. This card says you got to get your head out of your butt because you're focusing on the wrong things, or you know messages that you're meant to then take away and apply to your life, and so for me, whether it's major or minor arcana, they can be massive messages or little kind of like nothing burgers. Either way.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, so give me an example of a major, minor, arcana card that could have a lot of meaning?

Speaker 1:

Oh for sure, the Ace of Swords for me is the most powerful card of the entire deck, and it is a call to arms.

Speaker 1:

The cards will usually say you know, here's a lesson, here's something to look at. And for me the Ace of Swords is saying like girl, we're done screwing around, here's what you're going to do. And it is a call to arms telling you it is time to step into your power. It is time for you to claim your space, use your voice, be the author of your next chapter, not a passive reader. Be the protagonist of your story, not someone else's sidekick. Be out there, unapologetically, authentically yourself, knowing it's enough, because you're enough as you are in this moment, not needing anyone's permission. Like it's this big.

Speaker 1:

Like you know, I go on about that card for a bit. That's not really a Tarot 101 interpretation, the Venn diagram they're touching, you know, but it's not, it's for sure, not a circle with the Tarot 101. And then something like the Emperor is a major Arcana card and for me he just represents a building. He's like where you work, it's an institution, an organization. It's more of a qualifier or gives you a context clue rather than a big major message. So if I pull the emperor, I'm for sure pulling another card to give. Okay, what about it? You know, let's get a message around this emperor energy, because it doesn't say enough on its own.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, Are there cards that you don't see very often, so when they come up you're like whoa, whoa.

Speaker 1:

I wouldn't say that I don't see very often. It's really interesting. For instance, when I do a reading, a full reading for someone, if they have in this deck of 78 cards there are only four aces. So if you get four aces in your reading, to me that's auspicious. And I'll say to people like, ooh, this is juicy. Or if the spread, the pattern I lay the cards out in, is a circle, it's like a clock and we look at the cards in pairs across from one another. So 12 o'clock with six, one o'clock with seven, two o'clock with eight, and if I have two aces across from one another I'll be like, oh, interesting, you know, like it's just from a tarot reader perspective, like the combinations I think are more interesting than one particular card showing up, and that's what I think is so valuable about actually having a tarot card reading, by the way, everybody.

Speaker 2:

It's not just about one, it's about the story that you're creating with the clock. I tried to explain it to someone the other day and it's the story, because tarot cards are about a story, but it's a story about it. It's not just you picking up one card and being like, oh, this, this is what you should focus on. It's really about the story that a whole reading can give to you at like we started with any point in time and where you are in your life, like if you did a reading for me, you know, this week, it would be different than the reading that you did for me a year ago. It would not be the same.

Speaker 1:

Well, although to now.

Speaker 1:

interesting point, though, is if someone hasn't taken, because there's always homework in a reading with me there's always some takeaway homework and if someone has just, you know, ignored the homework for whatever reason and not done any of the work, they may see repeating cards. My best friend of like 30 years, who was my first well, 30 plus years, because she was my first tarot client, you know, in terms of like, who I would practice with for years would get the same cards, just kind of like you know, oh, I know that. And to the point that she started thinking she was a tarot reader and I was like, okay, take it down a notch, because you're talking too much, let me say this stuff. And then when she started making major shifts in her life, she started getting completely different cards. She's like I've never seen this card. What is this card? It was super cool.

Speaker 2:

That is very cool, I have to say. When I was reading through your book and looking at all the different cards, I was like I've never seen that card before. Now I don't hold them that often, but you know I've done readings with you and other people and I was like I've never seen that card before. I've never heard that card before, and so it was very interesting to read about some of the different cards that were out there, and I was like, oh, wow, that's never come my way. Okay, interesting yeah.

Speaker 1:

Depends on the message, and sometimes you don't necessarily need that message because it just isn't really applying. But if there's a card that offers homework with it and you keep getting it, then I'd be like girl, how's that homework going? Or does it maybe need to be applied to another area of your life instead of the one that you've been focusing on? That kind of thing, yes, all right.

Speaker 2:

So can we talk about the two cards that people I am sure have questions about the devil and death? Sure, you talk about that. Those are not necessarily negative cards, and can you explain why?

Speaker 1:

about the intention. You know, if I take a hammer, I can use it to hang a beautiful picture, or I can bash in someone's windshield, you know, and it's the same with the cards. So you'll see, especially in popular media, the devil, the tower, the death card, and everyone's like say goodbye to the dog. Yeah, you know, and it's just so silly. The death card is one of my favorite cards. I love it.

Speaker 1:

I always say it's a top three card for me to get because it's transformational change. You know it looks all scary and gross and that's because that is reflecting our relationship with change. So if you resist it, even though the end result is great, it can still suck the process because you're being dragged, kicking and screaming, you know, versus if you welcome change, oh God, yes, I'm ready, let's do it, I'm ready for this. It can be amazing, start to finish. So there's, you know, the death card. Everyone sees the skeleton on the horse and then he's got the big scythe and everything. But in the distance there's always a little sun peeking over the horizon and that's the little like hey, here's, something better is coming. So that's the death card reframed, reframed. And I always tell people you can Google it, it's never physical death, like, no animals, no plants, no people. It has never been about physical death.

Speaker 1:

The devil often is reflecting addiction and greed and jealousy and lust and you know seven deadly sins, like you know, these two people chained together and then this big scary devil behind them together and then this big scary devil behind them.

Speaker 1:

For me it's actually goes upstream from that and it's the kind of negative self-talk, limiting beliefs, that kind of stuff, that devil squawking in your ear. You're never going to get this. You know you don't deserve it and I give people homework with that card to address that devil, to bring it to the light and see it and get rid of it. Because if you don't, then it can then be expressed through things like addiction, you know. So it gets pretty deep. I have a lot of people who are like you sound like my therapist, like I see a cognitive behavioral therapist who told me to do the same thing. I'm like that's why my readings are kind of different. You know, right, it's the power, yeah, but the devil is never biblical or satanic or anything like that. He's the gremlin on the shoulder telling you you're a piece of garbage and you need to like just flick him off, get rid of him Right?

Speaker 2:

Yes, Well, and you also talk in your book about and I've heard you say this before as well, but you talk quite a bit about it in the book about the right and wrong questions to ask at a tarot card reading, whether you're the one reading the cards or someone is reading them for you. So can you talk about right and wrong questions to ask?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, because there isn't a card that you know is a definitive yes, definitive no. Or you know next Tuesday, or oh, you'll meet him at the Starbucks. You know it's not like that, that's silly. So you want the question to be open-ended, not a yes, no question. So instead of will I get the job, you would say what do I need to know about that opportunity? Or instead of saying, is Fred the one, you'd say what do I need to know about me and Fred?

Speaker 1:

You know, and it often tells you what you need to know to be able well, it can give you guidance about a situation or a person or an opportunity, but it can also often tell you the work you need to do yourself to be able to make the most of whatever's before you. And when it comes to other people, I don't, and that goes into the chapter Don't Be a Dick.

Speaker 1:

The Ethics of Tarot is you don't ask about other people's intentions or try and dip into their energy. That's like that's no good, that's not cool.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, it's not the purpose.

Speaker 1:

So if you again it's not. What does Fred think about me? Is Fred going to leave his wife? Is Fred Fred? Fred? No, no, this isn't Fred's reading, this is your reading.

Speaker 2:

So what do I?

Speaker 1:

need to know about dealing with Fred. Yes, it's all bringing it back inward to you, yeah and because that's the ultimate goal of a reading, hopefully is to give you agency to help empower you to make the best decisions for yourself moving forward. You don't want to abdicate responsibility of your life to some rando with cards, right?

Speaker 2:

No, no, you don't. You don't and that's one of the beauties You're not a psychic. You're not about telling people, like you said, you're going to go meet so-and-so on this day or you're going to die at 55 or anything like that. It's not, it's not about that. It's actually, I find it much more personal and personal growth and so, honestly, much more powerful, because so many people say, you know, psychics are crazy because so-and-so tells you you're going to get cancer and die at 50. And you want to be like, yeah, ok, no, but with tarot card reading. It's not about that, and so it's so much more about reflecting inward for you and you're just saying what you see. So I would think you get a little bit less of the. You have no idea what you're talking about, lady. You're crazy, or maybe I'm wrong. Do you still get that? Do you still get like you're woo? You're crazy, you're a witch, you don't know anything?

Speaker 1:

I mean, I think that people who think that I don't let that into my orbit, so I don't hear about that because I'm not attracting that kind of energy of those kinds of people. I do go to a ton of events, especially with the dudes, where they're sitting there arms crossed like okay, which tell me what's up, let's see what you got, and I love it. I just like okay, babe, let's do it.

Speaker 2:

And by the end.

Speaker 1:

I have to say, like, get out of my chair, I have other people waiting.

Speaker 2:

Your time is up, you can book a session Because they just want to can I ask another one?

Speaker 1:

Can I ask another one? So you know I'm happy to read skeptics. You have to at least, though, be a little bit open to it, and I think anyone sitting in the chair is at least a little open to it. And I think my approach I call it woo-woo without the cuckoo it puts people at ease, and the way I read the cards and the stories I tell and I like to keep it light and have humor, but it's also gets very deep and personal, and it can call you on your stuff, you know, yeah, but it's never saying like this sucks, see you later. It's more like, ok, you're in it now. Here's what you need to know to help you navigate through Right.

Speaker 2:

Right, and when you do readings because I've done them with you before, it's like you give that you'll say one card and be like OK, that's what this says. No-transcript.

Speaker 1:

What's your strategy there? It depends on how many people. If it's a more intimate gathering, then they can ask a few questions. I pull a few cards for each question, but it's never usually more than three cards for a question. I usually I don't know why, but it's either one or three cards, never two, never five or four Like it's usually one or three, and one card can give you plenty. If there's a lineup, which there usually is, because I'll get some people side-eyeing me walking around, but as soon as I get one brave butt in the seat, then off to the races and there's a lineup and because then everyone tells everyone else too, and they're like oh it

Speaker 1:

wasn't scary. Oh, you're not crying, oh, I'll give it a shot. And in those instances it's usually just one card, and I just stare at them awkwardly while I shuffle the deck, get their mojo in there and then I go okay, fan them out before them, ask what do I need to know right now? And pull any card, let me see it first. And sometimes I I'll say, okay, I need another card for clarity and I know if I'm already pulling another card, okay, give me one more, because it's usually one or three. Yes, yes, you know, it can be one minute or a few minutes for events.

Speaker 2:

Well, it's interesting that you say the one or three, because in the interior design world, like, everything is always in threes, like you never have, just like. Like, if you're doing a grouping of something, it's never just like two candles, it's three candles, it's never four.

Speaker 1:

It's never two. That's good to know.

Speaker 2:

It's either one, three or five, depending on what it is, but five is like five, is it? So most things happen in the design world around three in threes Interesting oh.

Speaker 1:

I love that yeah.

Speaker 2:

I don't know what that is or why that is or what that means, but always in the design world it's always in threes. Like if I'm setting a table and I'm putting candles on the table, I will put threes in threes. I'll put two groups of threes or I'll put one. I'll never put two and two.

Speaker 1:

Oh my God, I'm going in my living room right after this and I'm going to sort myself out. I'm faking already. Oh no, that's not looking good.

Speaker 2:

I digress, that's a total side subject, but I totally digress on that one. Let's talk about the deck, because you have rituals around the deck and can you talk about what those are and what those maybe mean, like in terms of like the shuffling and who touches and cutting and spreading out, and there's like you have your own rituals around that.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, it sounds dirty when you're like who's touching, there's cutting, yeah. So with this deck I mean before any reading, whether it's one card or whether I've had someone just pull one card or done a full reading Whenever I start a reading I always start by knocking on the deck and it's usually three times, like I'm just thinking, yeah, I just automatically do three and that just is like an energetic palate cleanser. It's just sort of knocks out the energy of the last reading. And then I stare at the person and I shuffle the deck and I'm not thinking anything. I'm just sort of locked in on them and they can be looking at me or anywhere else, because it can be very intense. So I tell people you don't have to look at me, you can look wherever you want. I'm locked in. It's not a staring contest. For the reading.

Speaker 1:

I don't do reversals, which is where the cards are sometimes upside down. That's mainly because the witch who taught me said it's an energy thing, kind of like how some people keep their money. Well, you'd know, with like the feng shui of it right, like it just keeps the energy flowing cleanly, with the cards being one way. So I always just do it that way and then I keep my cards in this little box that I've had for like 25 years now. I mean, it's falling apart.

Speaker 1:

I actually have to do some TLC on it. Before that it was wrapped in a scarf. Before that it was in the box. It came in for, like you know, the first 10 years and in terms of cleansing it, I tell people you can put it on a windowsill under a full moon. If you want, you can put crystals on or around it. I don't do any of it. Sometimes I remember You're like the down and dirty reader.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, but usually, you know, they keep it on an altar, but for me this little box that I store it in is the altar.

Speaker 2:

And when you travel, I'm sure you do not check that ever. I'm sure it goes on with you.

Speaker 1:

It's one time I did and I was like sick about it. The entire trip I thought I swear to God if someone goes in and steals my bag or something, yeah, and then after that I thought it's just not worth the stress. I'll just keep this thing on my person at all times when I travel, for sure.

Speaker 2:

And have you ever gone through the? You know, through the TSA, whatever they call?

Speaker 1:

it up in Canada and had them been like what is that big box in your bag and hold it out A few times I've had people like it goes through the little scanner thing and you can see my bag, it gets out and then it goes back in and then it's there for a second, and then it goes down the other, the, and then it goes down the other, the little side thing where they're like whose bag is this and I'm like ugh, and a few times people have said what is this?

Speaker 1:

And then I explained tarot cards and the first time it happened and I thought, oh God, I'm going to get like deported or put in a cell or something. And by the end of it the lady was like taking my business card because she wanted to get a reading.

Speaker 2:

I was going to say yes, you recorded recently in the airport and you said like the security people were staring at you, like you were a little like unnerved by them.

Speaker 1:

But that was because I had a camera propped up on a little tripod like on a shelf thing and I was doing a card of the day tarot reading, so that's why they were probably looking so like what in the hell is this lady doing?

Speaker 2:

It looked like I'd set up shop, got it All right. Can you explain? One other question related to the cards, and then I'm moving on. You say to cut the deck with your non-dominant hand. Why is that?

Speaker 1:

Again, that was a thing taught to me by Erica the witch and it was because when you use your non-dominant hand, it's kind of like a shortcut to your intuition and so, and if people get confused because I it always puts people they're just like oh what? Because I'll say like, okay, are you right or left-handed?

Speaker 1:

and they're like, uh, sort of like it's like I didn't know there would be questions not that complicated and you know, if they, if they cut it with their oh no, that was the wrong hand I'll'll say don't worry about it, it's not a big deal, but it's just again. It's a ritual, but it's nothing. That is a hard and fast rule where if you forget to cut the deck or you cut it with the dominant hand, it's going to mess up your reading on to other things.

Speaker 2:

I do have a question about intuition, because you talk about this in the book, that sort of a stance that everyone has a degree of intuition to be able to read cards for themselves. Can you talk a little bit about that?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, for sure.

Speaker 1:

I think that intuition is something we all have and it's just the volume might be turned up a little louder for some versus others, for whatever reason.

Speaker 1:

And it's about understanding that these cards again, there's nothing magical, they're just pieces of paper with pictures on them and each one tells a story and then when you put them together, they tell the story of you. And if a card speaks to you in a certain way, makes you feel a certain way and you have a certain like almost emotional reaction to it, or a reaction or oh, this means that for me, and you pay attention to that and note that down so that you remember it next time, and the more you start to like recognize these things and listen to them but, most importantly, trust them, that's when tarot really gets cool, that's when it really sort of starts to sing. You know, these cards can be a prompt for your intuition because it just if you pull a card in the morning and look at it and just sort of take its message into your day and then reflect at the end of the day, you'll start to see how that message kind of showed up in your day.

Speaker 1:

You know, and it can also be a creative prompt I do with Jen Pasteloff. She does these writing workshops online and every so often I'll drop into the Zoom and pull a card for people and just show it to them and then that's a writing prompt. So it can be a creative exercise and they know nothing about the card and what it means. That's cool. Yeah, it's pretty cool the different uses for it. Yes.

Speaker 2:

Including intuition. Including intuition, but did you find, while you were evolving as a chair reader, was there like an event or something that happened that you're like, oh my goodness, I think I really am intuitive, I think I really have a gift, or was it just it grew over time?

Speaker 1:

no-transcript. So yeah, it was gradual for me Okay.

Speaker 2:

I like that.

Speaker 1:

I'm a late bloomer.

Speaker 2:

Yeah Well, I'm 55 too. We're all late bloomers. We're figuring it out later in life. Yes, okay, I like that. I'm a late bloomer. Yeah Well, I'm 55 too. We're all late bloomers.

Speaker 2:

We're figuring it out later in life. Yes, yes, all right. So I would love to switch gears and talk about, kind of, what else is on your bucket list, what is on the future that you, things that you want to do, experiences you want to have, how you want to grow your business, what's kind of out there, because the more we put it out into the universe, the more it will start to come.

Speaker 1:

Yes, that is absolutely correct. What I am focusing on, my intention now is to increase my platform, increase my presence, get these tools in the hands of as many people as possible, because I know how effective they can be, whether it's tarot or rituals or crystals or whatever and I do. I lead retreat weekends at Canyon Ranch Spa in the States in California, and I love that, and I was in Bali and participated in a retreat and I'm looking at going to Europe next summer to do a couple of retreats. I led a retreat, a women's retreat, here where I live, and I was originally thinking like if I could get 40 women for this one day retreat, that'd be pretty cool. We ended up selling out the venue at 75, 80 women, wow, and it was an amazing day, I'm sure, of in-person ritual events getting on a stage, speaking to people, doing tarot for people on the spot, like just introducing this to people in a new way. I'm super passionate about it. It really lights me up.

Speaker 1:

So, in addition to readings, obviously and I went to Google headquarters, you know, and they had this big event for their sales force like 400 people from around the world, their entire sales force and I was brought in to give readings and it wasn't just like entertainment, it was. We are really focused. The theme of this week that we're doing is lighting up everyone's inner, you know, purpose and potential and letting them become their own manifestors, and like they were talking that kind of talk and we want you to support them in that and it was so cool, like it, you know doing it in different ways. I work with a few business owners who bring me in to do not just work with them one-on-one but also, you know, let's talk about the corporation. Let's pull a card for Q1, q2, q3, q4 and see what shows up.

Speaker 1:

So cool yeah. So just expanding in that way and also so like validating too.

Speaker 2:

You're like okay, wait, google cared. Google cared about what you are passionate about and the value that you can deliver with tarot cards. That's amazing. Google was stoked.

Speaker 1:

That's so cool, but it was mostly to just house videos that I was putting on my website. And then, when I was at this Google event because they own YouTube, all of these YouTube top execs I was pulling cards for and they were saying, well, how's your YouTube? What are you doing on YouTube? Do you do this? And I was like don't look at my YouTube, guys, just stop. It's embarrassing. There's nothing on there. There's a card of the day I tried it for, like in 2018 or something, oh my goodness. And they were saying, like you are missing out on a huge opportunity, stop it.

Speaker 2:

Huge.

Speaker 1:

And so I'm dedicated to doing not just card of the day, I do a card of the month for each astrology sign. Oh, cool One thing I started doing that's really cool since we last spoke and I've only done it twice, so it's still new but I pull a card for myself every week. I don't post about it, but I do. I do take note of how that card's message shows up in my week personally, and then at the end of the week I do a little video about the story of like okay, the card was this and here's how it showed up. And that's actually been kind of popular, I would think that's very popular.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and it's pretty cool. Yes, because I was going to ask you if the card, when you pull the card of the day, do you feel like that message is specifically for you or does it feel like it's for a?

Speaker 1:

broader audience. It often feels like it's for me, more often than not, to the point where I think why am I even posting this? This isn't going to apply to anybody.

Speaker 2:

It's obviously my message, yeah, but yet it does. It applies to so many people. I know it's wild.

Speaker 1:

So Bali, are you going to go back to Bali? But I think there are just so many other places to explore. Yes, you know, and one thing I noticed, because I had prepared all of these little you know postcards, sort of expanded business cards and things that I was going to take to retreat centers and the yoga barn and all these places to promote myself to come back to lead retreats and stuff and as soon as I got off the plane I was like oh no, absolutely not. The Balinese do not need me coming in telling them how to do rituals like time to burn our shit guys, absolutely not.

Speaker 1:

They've got it down.

Speaker 2:

Absolutely not.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, that is not for me to do. It felt very like cultural appropriation, but kind of in a in a flipped kind of way, now taking a bunch of babes and going to the south of France or to Italy or to Greece and using a beautiful location to do a weekend or a week of immersive like rituals and tarot and you know, stepping into the best version of yourself, healing old wounds. We're manifesting, we're releasing, we're doing it all that I'm into.

Speaker 2:

I am so into that too, so I follow you. I will be 100% on board, because I think that's just really cool. And one of the other cool things that you talk about when you do these retreats and these events are the women and I don't want to just exclude men, but let's just say women, the powerful women that you are attracting into your life. Is that just like pinch me?

Speaker 1:

amazing. I'm obsessed with women. I love women, to be able to work with them and to be able to learn from them and just see the power that happens when we gather together. It is a very specific thing to women, it's the coven of it all, it is, and so to be able to lead and also be a participant in those kinds of gatherings has been. It's unbelievable. I have so many you know friends or like groups of friends, where we have these conjuring sessions Every week. I have multiple I call them conjuring sessions on the Zoom, where we just talk about like accountability and what we're working on, and it's not about like, how are the kids? It's like, okay, how's that core wound going?

Speaker 2:

Like what happened since last time.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, there's no small talk. You know like I'm done with small talk. I don't have it in me.

Speaker 2:

Oh, I'm so with you. You get to a certain age and a certain personal development that you're like I can't waste the energy on that, it's just not going to do anything for me.

Speaker 1:

Not benefiting anybody.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, no, thank you, no, thank you. You are so beautiful. Okay, before we go, one question and then if you would be willing to pull a card for the audience.

Speaker 1:

I would love I was going to say it better be. Can I pull a card Of?

Speaker 2:

course, yeah, of course no. But my other, my question, before you pull a card, is is there anything that I didn't ask you, that you want to make sure you get out to the audience and you want to communicate, did I miss anything?

Speaker 1:

I don't think so. You're a fantastic interviewer. I mean just really pushing the idea that the magic is in you, in everyone listening. You know it's wonderful to have a tarot reading with me or another. You know it's wonderful to have a tarot reading with me or another, you know tarot reader, to get a psychic reading, astrology reading, whatever floats your boat. But you can also buy my book and just pick a page, or you can get your own deck and just go for it yourself. You know it's nothing. You don't need to permission, you don't need to think, oh, I haven't been doing it for decades like she has. That doesn't matter. I just I'm slow and steady, like that's me. I'm the, I'm the tortoise, not the hare when it comes to this stuff.

Speaker 2:

So just, these tools are there, so take advantage of them, which is a really powerful message, because I have seen you on other shows and listen to you and sometimes the host will be like, oh yeah, I pulled cards before and I kind of just felt like who am I to pull cards? Like I don't feel like I'm intuitive and who am I to do this? I don't have any background in this, who am I? But I really found that your book and I was really happy to know like I had the right kind of cards too. I was pretty proud of myself that the cards I bought on Amazon were like the right cards, because I was like, wait, I might not. Even I was like, wait, I might not. Even I was like I might not even have the standard cards. I know so little about what I'm doing that I might not even have the standard cards, but I did at least have the standard cards and your book makes it really inviting to just like embrace the journey and just do it and I kind of have fun with it. I don't do it every day, but I do it a lot and I just find it's really fun. So I thank you for that, because you took some of the stigma away from the cards for me personally.

Speaker 2:

But that doesn't mean I won't like not still have readings, because I still will Like wow, your readings are so powerful.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and it's, and it's whatever you need when you need it. You know, sometimes you want a full enchilada and sometimes you need just a little little taste.

Speaker 2:

Yes, exactly, and sometimes when I pull a card I don't really like it. I'm like, well, why don't I like it? Like, what about that nudge? What about that nudge is making it? So I'm not so happy about that card. And that, I think, is a lot of times where the power in the message is it's like I didn't like it. But that doesn't mean you get to put it back and be like I want another one.

Speaker 1:

I mean you can, but probably that card's message is pushing you to do something that's going to make you uncomfortable.

Speaker 2:

Correct, exactly, and so learning to just sit with that and not have it be like it's not going to tell me every day that wealth is right around the corner. Right, and that's okay. That's okay, that's life. So, before we go, because I've taken up so much of your time, if you wouldn't mind reading a card for the audience so they can get a little bit of your flavor. That would be fantastic, yeah, okay.

Speaker 1:

So I'm going to knock, so you'll hear me knock. And now I'm doing the awkward shuffle and stare Not awkward shuffle, but I call it the awkward stare because I'm just like Snoopy on the doghouse staring at you, okay. So I'm just going to ask does Jeannie need to know right now? Ooh, you got a juicy one. So you have the star, and the star is, for me, one of the luckiest cards in the deck. For me.

Speaker 1:

I have four luck cards wheel of fortune, the world, the star, the sun. And it's never just handing over all the luck, it's offering you a lesson to help. Good and the bad and the ugly are all part of your path and certain people, opportunities, experiences showing up for a reason and a season, you know people coming into your lives to be the teacher, the student, the guide, the mirror, an opportunity showing up, whether it's 20 minutes or 20 years, there's a reason for that. That's your destiny. And then what you choose to do with it, because you have free will, is often up to you. So you can dance with it, ignore it, kick its ass, let it kick your ass, learn from it. But the star is saying don't get too caught up in trying to figure out, like what's the meaning, what's the message, what's the purpose of the? Instead, grab that lucky stardust, shove it in your pocket, hit the road and go do your thing, and then there's usually perspective down the road where you look back and say all right, I get it. Okay, that actually makes sense.

Speaker 1:

And we always want to know in advance rather than retrospect and that's not how it works.

Speaker 1:

Now for you, Jean, I'm going to go a little deeper. I don't always, but I want to for you, and this one there's deeper interpretations in the book too is to just remember that we are born alone and we die alone, and from the moment we're born to the moment we pass, it's like our souls join hands with other souls, whether it's parents, partners, teachers, lovers, and we often walk side by side, hand in hand, from start to finish. Every so often there's twists and turns, oopsie, daisies. You figure it out in the end. Sometimes you know you part and then you find each other further along the path, but more often than not it's like you know what our work here is done. I'll catch you on the flip side, Not if you go in different directions. What the star is reminding you is that the path you are on is a singular path. We are all on an individual path. You can't be pulling someone along their path or yanking them onto your path, even when it's obvious you know better, because it screws with their karma.

Speaker 1:

You know, I'm learning this still the hard way with my kids, like even when it comes from a protective or loving place. It can prolong or enlarge the lessons that other people need to learn when you try to carry the burdens that are not yours to bear. So all we can do is have a handout to say, hey, I'm here if you want to walk alongside me on our respective paths and hold hands but I can't pull you along your path, I'm not yanking you onto my path and I will not wait.

Speaker 2:

I love that. And do you see how understanding? Yes, right, yes, it's really powerful we can't be living everyone's lives for them.

Speaker 1:

Yes, and knowing the role of destiny and free will. Understanding all of that is what helps you access the luck that's available with this star. It's almost like it unlocks the luck that is so good, makes sense.

Speaker 2:

I'm going to go back and create a little snippet of this for myself so I can listen to it again and again. It totally makes sense. It's so powerful. I absolutely love it. And someone said to me recently, like looking at a relationship as what's your soul contract and just looking at it a little bit differently. So it's interesting that you brought that up, because that's right along a similar line there. Everybody you have to go buy her books. They are just, they will make you laugh, they will educate you, they will expand your knowledge and they are so fun. So thank you for taking the time to be on the show. I wish you all the best with the rest of summer and as we move into the fall. I can't wait to see your retreats and europe next year. Oh, my goodness, count me in. I am so there.

Speaker 1:

So fun, right? Thank you, this was a pleasure. It was so great.

Speaker 2:

Thank you. Have a beautiful rest of your day. Thank you for joining us for another episode of the House of Jermar podcast where wellness starts within. We appreciate you being a part of our community and hope you felt inspired and motivated by our guest. If you enjoyed this episode, please write us a review and share it with friends. Building our reach on YouTube and Apple Podcasts will help us get closer to our mission to empower 1 million women to live all in. You can also follow us on Instagram at House of Jermar and sign up to be a part of our monthly inspiration newsletter through our website, houseofjermarcom. If you or someone you know would be a good guest on the show, please reach out to us at podcast at houseofgermarcom. This has been a House of Germar production with your host, jean Collins. Thank you for joining our house.