Insights from the Couch - Mental Health at Midlife

Ep.29: The Catalyst: How to Spark True Transformation

• Colette Fehr, Laura Bowman • Season 3 • Episode 29

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Welcome to season three of Insights From The Couch! We are kicking off 2025 with an inspiring discussion about creating real, meaningful change as we step into the New Year. Should you set resolutions or focus on intentions? Is there a "right" way to build habits? In this episode, we unpack the science of habit formation, the power of identity-based goals, and what it means to take radical responsibility for your life. You'll hear practical advice, motivational stories, and strategies to keep you inspired long after January ends.

Join us as we explore how tiny, incremental changes can lead to monumental shifts in your life and why embracing both discipline and self-compassion is key to achieving your goals. Whether you're looking to tackle fitness, finances, or personal growth, this episode will leave you ready to take action—one small step at a time.

 

Episode Highlights:

[0:03] - Introducing season three and the concept of meaningful New Year’s change.
 [2:34] - Exploring SMART goals vs. wildly improbable goals and why you need both vision and incremental action.
 [6:24] - The science of habit formation: Atomic Habits, tiny habits, and why small changes matter.
 [10:53] - Radical responsibility: owning your life and choices, and why this is the foundation for change.
 [16:17] - Reading “The Risks of Autonomy” and reflecting on its powerful message of personal accountability.
 [23:11] - Personal stories of significant life changes, from quitting smoking to overcoming financial struggles.
 [36:22] - The importance of discipline and consistency in creating lasting habits.
 [43:19] - Starting small: how a 2-minute habit can transform your life.
 [52:40] - Doubling down on your strengths and why change isn’t just about fixing weaknesses.

 

Resources:

For more on this topic visit our website insightsfromthecouch.org If you have questions please email us at info@insightsfromthecouch.org we would love to hear from you!

If today's discussion resonated with you or sparked curiosity, please rate, follow, and share "Insights from the Couch" with others. Your support helps us reach more people and continue providing valuable insights. Here’s to finding our purposes and living a life full of meaning and joy. Stay tuned for more!

Colette Fehr:

Happy New Year everyone, and welcome back to season three of insights from the couch. I'm Colette fair here with my co host Laura Bowman. Both of us are licensed therapists, bringing you the conversations we have in person to the podcast, and today, we've got an action packed episode with lots of good nuggets of wisdom on creating change for the new year. Should you make resolutions? Everybody wonders, should you make intentions? How do you create truly meaningful change? We're going to talk about the science of habits, identity based change, taking radical responsibility for your life, what kinds of change work and don't work so that it's not February 1 and you're saying, what happened to those resolutions? So we have a lot of information for you today. Let's get started. I'm so excited to talk about this today. I really am, first of all, I'm contemplating making my own changes for the new year. And it's such a big topic, what's a healthy way to make change the new year, if any? Should you make resolutions? Should you make intentions? Should you build habits? Should you have goals? Should you do nothing?

Laura Bowman:

Yeah. Should you give up skydiving?

Colette Fehr:

Yes, easy, right?

Laura Bowman:

Yeah. Like, nothing, no. But I love change. I love I mean, I was always that kid, like in the new school year with like, new notebooks, like that feeling of like, I'm gonna get it right this time.

Colette Fehr:

Yes, yeah, yes. And that's what I actually like about the new year, is that it gives you a fresh start.

Laura Bowman:

Yeah,

Colette Fehr:

you know, at least the feeling of a fresh start. But we know most people have given up their changes, their resolutions, if you will, by the middle of January, if not the beginning of February. And one of the biggest mistakes people make is trying to bite off more than you can chew, do too much at once. So today, we really want to dive into really making good change what works, what doesn't work, and how you can whatever you're grappling with out there that you want to change. It really is about living the life you want to live.

Laura Bowman:

Yeah, yeah. And I just gave a whole speech about change at Toastmasters in early December. So just really thinking on this.

Colette Fehr:

So sure, some nuggets, yeah,

Laura Bowman:

like, some of the things I realize are so paradoxical, like, like, the idea you we hear about, like, SMART goals, like everything should be, you know, measurable, specific, measurable, measurable, attainable, realistic and time bound, right? And that that's kind of boring, like that, that that really the wig, the whole idea of, like, a wildly improbable goal, which is, like has energy and you're really turned on by a goal, is something that really can pull you forward, but that you need both, right? You need the big vision and the incremental behaviors behind it. But people either trend one way or another, where it's so like boring and dull, and they're not really excited by it, or it's so wildly improbable that they never get started. And like how you need both somehow,

Colette Fehr:

yeah. And I like, you know, I think you've read it too, right? Atomic habits, James Lear,

Laura Bowman:

yeah.

Colette Fehr:

And then I also read the BJ Fogg book, tiny habits. I think it was called, I didn't like that one as much, but actually, a friend of mine, we were just talking about this, and she had just read the book and said the one thing that stood out to her was that they BJ, Fogg talks about waking up, and the first thing you do as you put your feet on the ground is saying, Today is going to be a great day. And I read that book maybe four years ago, three years ago, something like that, time is a very muddled proposition at this point, but I do that, and I kind of made that a little habit. And it sounds small and it is, but it's really got a profound effect, because you're setting an intention at the beginning of your day that it's going to be good. You're channeling your energy. I think of it like a gratitude, right? You're helping your brain remember that this is what it's going to be. And I think what I love about atomic habits that I thought was more successful than the other book, The storytelling, but also just the way he really makes it so simple that we have, there's, there's a science to have it formation, and you can have goals which are about your results, or, I think he calls them outcomes, right? And then you can, yeah, outcome driven things like, I want to Number of pounds, I want to get a new job. I want to, you know, lose at. whatever, be in better shape. I want to get a relationship this year. But that really and then you can have identity based goals, where it's like, this is the person I want to be. And I think we should talk about that a little more, yes. And then also you can have process driven goals. Because really, the whole thesis of the book is that however you go about it, it's small, incremental changes consistently, that change the direction of your life. And I'll never forget, he uses the analogy, think of an airplane. You know, I'm not very good with these physics kind of things. But even that was such a powerful metaphor for me that if a pilot changed, they were flying from New York to LA and they changed the direction of the plane by one degree or something, you'd end up in a completely different in the middle of the ocean. So if we can find ways to break down, change and not say, Okay, it's January, and I've got to become a different person, get another job, lose 20 pounds, work out every day, right? But it's Who do I want to be? And then what tiny, tiny, tiny, tiny, little habits can I make? Can I form and focus on the processes that support you.

Laura Bowman:

Yeah, I got the same out of that book, like the processes and the systems and how some of the most powerful imagery that I got out of that book was when he's talking about ice melting and that the temperature has to decrease, you know one degree at a time, and you don't see these changes. These are imperceptible. This is you putting in the reps, like doing the workouts, or making the green drinks, or going not doing alcohol, or whatever the little imperceptible behaviors are. And the temperature comes down, until all of a sudden the ice melts. And he has the same imagery with the bamboo. Yeah, I was just gonna say the bamboo is growing for years underground building infrastructure, until one day it like shoots into the air, right?

Colette Fehr:

And you don't see anything that's happening. And I yeah, I think this is a part where people can get really stuck. I think we can all get stuck. I think he calls it like the Valley of disappointment. There the valley of despair.

Laura Bowman:

Yeah, yeah, yeah, waiting for your change to like, show you some sort of reward,

Colette Fehr:

but it's a delayed right process, right? It's a delayed process. And I think that's the part people don't see. You know, I've recently made a lot of changes to my life, what I'm doing professionally, what I'm dreaming as possible to do professionally, this being part of it. And it started, it looks to people like, oh my gosh, you're doing all this stuff overnight. But I started laying a foundation for these things, you know, like going on TV, podcasting, doing public speaking, a long time ago, when no one saw anything happening, and even I, at times, questioned, is this going anywhere?

Laura Bowman:

Yes, and that you have to be okay with a season, maybe a couple seasons of that type of and putting in the reps I'm seeing where this is going. I'm not sure where it's going. I'm staying curious, I'm staying open, I'm staying committed

Colette Fehr:

and flexible enough to alter the smaller, little goals. So let's talk about that along the way. Let's talk about the identity piece. Because I think for our listeners, whatever it is you decide to do with the fresh start this year, and if you decide to do nothing, that's okay too. I mean, I do think this becomes yet another social pressure and like, fuck that, right? If this is a year where you just want to breathe and live, that's a great goal, yeah, more joy, just more presence, more Yeah, time, right? But every time we have the end of a season, the end of a year, I even think a lot about it in September, back to those new notebooks for the school year. That's such a habit in my body of like Fall is a fresh start, just an opportunity to think more about life is short, and how do I want to live it? Do I want to wake up every day and get out of bed and feel excited to be alive? That's what I want. And so when I think about what I want to change and and right now, I am thinking about that a lot, even as I have a lot on my plate, I think about okay, when I envision myself taking responsibility for my own life, knowing I'm the only person who is going to take care of me, ultimately, right? I'm going to live the life I create. How do I see myself? And then, okay, what do I need to do? What do. Read, do I need to shift the course of the airplane almost imperceptibly? That helps me get from here to there?

Laura Bowman:

Can we just stop for a minute? Because I love so much what you just said, you know, I just told you before we started. I love the posts you have about that your life really began to change when you realize that no one was coming to save you. Yes, that it was gonna Yeah, oh, it was gonna be you that changed your life, and you were responsible for you. And, you know, having seen a lot of people, and being this person myself at times, and having the belief that something outside of me was gonna fix things for me, that's a change unto itself. If that's the one thing you tackle this year that you realize, like your life is your responsibility, that's its own, its own thing.

Colette Fehr:

It's a huge thing. And I didn't always see it that way. I mean, sadly, there were times that I had romantic fantasies that I bought into that I believe, like the fairy tale of as as awful as it sounds, I would never have said it this way. Yeah, yeah. You know, like, like, Oh, someone's gonna ride up on a white horse and kiss me while I'm in a coma and bring me back to life. But I think initially, after my divorce, I sort of thought that like, Oh, I'll be in a better relationship, and everything will work out. And that was really abdicating all of my responsibility and not only that, but my power, yep, yep. So it is a huge shift, and it is critically important, but let's talk a little bit about what that looks like, because we see this in therapy, right? And I see it as when you're not taking responsibility for your life, it's a mindset where you're steeped in resentment, victimology, victimology, resentment, jealousy about other people, right? Oh, it's not fair. They have this and this, and they didn't work that hard. You know, I work so hard,

Laura Bowman:

screwed in this scenario. It wasn't right. Yeah, yeah. And, you know what I just want to say, like, if you're in that place, that's information, it's just, and I think you have to grieve, and you have to, like, listen to your own resentments, but God, don't, don't stay there. Like, that's not a place to stay, it's a place to visit, hopefully, to pass through. And it's like, if you can pass through, it, things can get better.

Colette Fehr:

Yeah, this is not to say that if something awful has happened, that you don't have a right to feel angry, hurt, disappointed, rage at the universe. I mean, these feelings are normal, but there's a difference between a victim mindset and getting stuck in resentment, and I don't think resentment is really ever a healthy place to me, to me, resentment means that there's something, some place you're letting go of your power because it's sort of a hybrid of like anger and hurt and injustice and again, doesn't mean you don't have a right to be angry, or that a wrong has not been perpetrated, but you're choosing to stew in your own disempowered juices instead of say, Okay, this fucked up thing happened, it's not okay. That person wronged me, or that person like hurt me. Now, what am I gonna do about it? How am I gonna take back my power, rebuild my life? Focus on me, because whatever anyone else out there is doing has absolutely, really, at the end of the day, no bearing on your happiness.

Laura Bowman:

Yeah, yeah. As soon as you can I completely agree with everything you just said, and that is the quickest you can get to the question of, What are my choices? What are the choices I have? Now, you know, even though this fucked up thing happened or this wasn't fair, of this is not supposed to be my life. What choices do I have now? And the people who can get past that place are focused on what their choices are,

Colette Fehr:

yes, and what do I want to do? And again, it doesn't mean something awful hasn't happened that doesn't take time to work through I'm not minimizing that, nor am I saying I've never been stuck in these places myself. Oh, I have, yeah, I think we all have, but I've learned from them. And now, when something happens to me where I feel wronged by someone, or hurt or disappointed, I still feel the feelings, but I really don't shift into the like, Oh, you did this to me. I stay in the like, okay, so what does this mean for me? What boundaries do I need to set? What role did I play and what went wrong, if any. How can I learn from it? How can I grow? You know, what does this tell me about who I want in my life, what kind of relationships I want? It's just a. Different shift. So what we're saying here is all change starts with owning responsibility for your life. Yeah, yeah, start here. Have you ever read that poem? I think I read it to you years ago. It's not even a poem. It's like an ode to responsibility.

Laura Bowman:

No, I'm curious now

Colette Fehr:

that I found. Oh, my God. If I can find it, I'm gonna read it. I think I have it okay. I found it in a drawer at when I worked in residential treatment, you know, years ago for aspire, and it was so powerful. Let me just see if I have it really fast.

Laura Bowman:

I think we all need to hear that

Colette Fehr:

it's so it's almost shocking how, like hard core it goes. But it's here it is. I have saved almost nothing, and I this. I mean, I must have gotten this 20 years ago, okay, it's called the risk of autonomy.

Laura Bowman:

Oh, I have this sheet. I got this sheet years ago, I think from somebody, maybe, yeah, probably, maybe that's where I got it. Let's give Sally credit, yeah, okay.

Colette Fehr:

Should I read it?

Laura Bowman:

Please? It's so powerful.

Colette Fehr:

Okay, the risks of autonomy. Who's responsible for you, accepting responsibility gives with giving up the hope that someone else will care for you and protect you. We are largely alone in this world, and always have been. There is no other road to take in life but to accept responsibility. If you do not accept responsibility for your life, for every bit of your life you place yourself in jeopardy. You've been you for a long time now, and you've had the ability to say no and to act on your beliefs. As soon as you were aware something was wrong, you had some responsibility for changing it. Other people do not have an accurate view of your inner world, your plans or potential others can never really act for you, but only for what they think you need. In other words, for them, when you accept responsibility, you are saying, This is my risk. I am in jeopardy, and I will assume it. To accept responsibility means that you're going to do what has to be done, or you're not going to do what has to be done, and that whatever happens, good or bad, it's to your credit or to your fault. Okay, here's the mantra part, you are responsible for what you say. You are responsible for what you are. You are responsible for what you feel. You are responsible for what you do. You are not responsible for making anyone else happy. You are not responsible for becoming what someone else wants you to be. You are not responsible for distorting the truth to keep from hurting another person's feelings. Amen. You are responsible when someone breaks a secret you told them because you were a poor judge of character. Ouch. You are responsible when people use what you say to hurt you, because you should be able to tell when a person does not wish you well, and you are responsible for defending yourself. You are responsible for the ties other people have with you, because it takes two to tango. You are responsible for everything in your life that wouldn't be there unless you did something. If you don't like your lifestyle, you are responsible if you don't like your job, you are responsible if you don't like your home, you are responsible if you don't like your husband or wife, you are responsible. If you don't like you You are responsible if you don't like the way you are treated, you are responsible. You are responsible for everything in your life, all the successes and failures, accept your success with modesty and gratitude that your plans have worked out. Accept your failures as realities from which you must learn without taking responsibility for your life, you will never be happy, because no one can fix your life but you. And this is by Dr David viscot from a book called risking.

Laura Bowman:

Yeah, I've tried to get that book, I haven't been able to find it. Oh, I think it's out of print, but oh my god, I feel like I feel very shook by that,

Colette Fehr:

me too,

Laura Bowman:

but I think I'm so glad we're talking about this while we're talking about change, because this is the this is the nascent place of change, yeah. Why people get stuck?

Colette Fehr:

Yeah, oh, yeah. You have to be willing to say whatever is happening in my life, I am responsible, and if I want to change it, starts with me and ends with me.

Laura Bowman:

Yeah, and I've had phases, god of it. I've had to go around a circle, and like so many iterations of trying to get other people to do things, you know, so that I would feel better. Or when are you going to fix this so I can relax? I. Had to go around that May till a few times before I finally gotten here.

Colette Fehr:

Oh, me too. And for years, even in my current marriage, I did this, and now I don't do it anymore, but I used to, oh, if I do it this way, then you'll get it and you'll change. Oh, if I say it that that way. Oh, maybe if I do this, but surely I can explain, and I used to like tap dance around, in part because that was the role I played as a child. You know, feeling empowered and adultified in ways to manage, to try to manage adults during my parents divorce. I think that's where I learned that behavior, not that it worked, but it was some way to try to exert control over what I felt powerless about in my environment. But we grow up and we're still doing these things become habits of behavior, and that is right up there with taking responsibility is letting go of the responsibility of managing other people are who they are. Yeah, let them do what they're gonna do, and then you have choices to make based on what they do.

Laura Bowman:

And this right here is like so often why women come to therapy, right? They're so frustrated by my partner behaviors that won't change my children, yeah, things that just feel so unyielding, and they want, yeah, they want control, and it's, it's accepting and allowing. And you see people banging their head against this wall for years, okay, well, I'm glad we, we started with responsibility,

Colette Fehr:

me too, and I have little goosebumps, and I have had that thing for 20 years. I've read it a million times. Yeah, it never fails to produce a charge in my body, yeah, like, a feeling of, wow. And even now, as I read it again, and there's been so much growth on taking responsibility and letting go of what isn't mine, there's still a lot more work to do, and it's an important thing to remind ourselves of, what stay in your lane, drive your car in your lane. Yes, everybody else it might be, you know, like I 95 in Miami, out there, but you do you,

Laura Bowman:

and allow their people to do them. Yes, this is like the Mel Robbins, let them theory, right? Yeah. Have you seen that?

Colette Fehr:

I I've, yes, I've, it's not, yeah, oh yeah, I've seen it. Her new book. I'm not, like a huge fan, so

Laura Bowman:

I'm not either, but I think it's that idea of let people do what they're going to do. Behavior is a language, and then it's up to you to respond. You know how you're gonna live your life. I love behavior as a language. Behavior is a language. It communicates, doesn't it? Right? Because words are meaningless if they're not accompanied by consistent, congruent behavior, yeah. Okay, so let's shift into like nuts and like other strategies for change. What has been like an area in your life where you're the proudest of changes you've made, where you made the best change.

Colette Fehr:

I feel like I've made so many changes I have, and I'm constantly making changes. I feel like I reinvent myself over and over, and this is sort of the way I live my life. I really like change, but I would say just to out myself a little, or at the risk of outing myself a little, one of the biggest and hardest of my life has been quitting smoking.

Laura Bowman:

Yeah,

Colette Fehr:

I mean, I was like a crack addict with cigarettes, and I started smoking at a very young age, very young, like 12 years old. We could buy cigarettes in the vending machine at the train station. You know, I grew up in a suburb of New York, so we took the train all the time, back and forth to different towns where my friends lived. I was always at the train station, and I was always smoking cigarettes at the train station. And all my friends did it too, but most of them didn't get hooked on it to the degree I did. You know how you can have a genetic predisposition for certain addictions, cigarettes? It's like my greatest true love. Yeah, I've heard other people say that same thing, Oh, my God. And it really was more of a behavioral addiction. I never had any nicotine withdrawal, and I know that's not the case for everyone, but there was something about a moment where I get to just think and process and like, smoke my sick, yeah, yeah, that I couldn't ever imagine my life without. And I tried everything. Eventually I it was giving me some health consequences, like I still don't really know exactly what, but once I discovered that I really had to. Make a decision to get that out of my life. And at that point, I'd been smoking on and off since I was 12 years old, and I didn't quit.

Laura Bowman:

When you finally quit,

Colette Fehr:

40,

Laura Bowman:

really?

Colette Fehr:

Yeah,

Laura Bowman:

God, well, you made it look easy, because when you quit, I felt like you just made a decision. But was it like fear and pain that kind of like, yeah, and this is that choice well, wow, yeah, wow, yeah.

Colette Fehr:

and this is one of the things about making change, So the motivation was fear, wanting to be in good is that you do have to have some motivation. And my motivation was, you know, I didn't. I quit when I graduated from college. I didn't ever see myself being like an adult smoker. I thought it wasn't part of my identity that I wanted to be a smoker. Like, if I saw an adult smoking, I was like, ew. But then I smoked. So when I do it, yes, it made no sense, but I did quit after college, and then I didn't smoke for years, until after I had Charlotte, my first daughter, then it became just the like, Oh, I'm just gonna have a cigarette, like, the few times I get out of the house with like, a glass of wine. Because, you know, your whole life changes when you become a mom, it became a mini rebellion. But because I have so many neural pathways for that, eventually I started smoking more and more, and then when I got divorced, that's when I got back into it. So I had about eight or nine years of like, chain smoking, health, and I realized I had a rationalizing story of, like, Okay, well, I'm gonna quit before I get lung cancer before I do damage. Like, I'm just Young and I'm smoking because I'm going through a crisis, right? As soon as my crisis ends, well, I mean, is the crisis going to last my whole life? Like, all of a sudden I'm 40 years old, I'm not young, right? I mean, I'm I'm a smoking adult. I had to confront the fact that the identity I rejected was who I was and that that's not what I wanted.

Laura Bowman:

Yeah, I love that. Oh, yeah. I mean, I think pain is one of these things that really brings you to your knees. I think that's the thing above everything that will help you change the quickest You can want to something, but fear, consequence and pain are bar none.

Colette Fehr:

Okay, so this is why so often, and I get why people are frustrated, but it's really true. I believe what you're saying. I agree with what you're saying 1,000% when people come to couples therapy, something I'll often hear is now I'm about to walk out the door like I'm done. I basically told him I want a divorce, and it's more often the wife saying this, and a heterosexual couple, and now he's ready to come to therapy and make change, and he's doing all these things like, what the fuck it's too little too late. Why didn't you do this eight years ago, when I tried to come to you with my legitimate complaints, and you didn't do shit. And it's because, unfortunately, sometimes people cannot get their head out of their ass until they suffer. They taste loss, they feel afraid

Laura Bowman:

100%

Colette Fehr:

and I guess the cautionary tale on this is if you have a partner, whether you're a man or a woman who's saying, Hey, I'm not happy, or I feel lonely, or we need to do something. Listen, listen, before the pain comes. Because sometimes people don't pay attention until it's too late.

Laura Bowman:

I would argue most people don't pay attention until it's too late. I think, I mean, it's in all, a lot of meaningful change for me has come from pain. Watching my dad die at 61 and the health choices that he made, and the confronting reality of the genetics in my family, I think, has pushed me to be much more conscious of my health than I otherwise would have been,

Colette Fehr:

because you really changed the way you exercise, the way you eat. Can you talk about that a little?

Laura Bowman:

Yeah, I mean, I mean, my dad was, we just have a pattern in our family of, like, emotional eating. They're just, they're big drinkers, they're big eaters. They're just like, my dad's whole family was like the like Mad Men from the 1950s cigarettes and like, martinis. And, you know, my dad was a an eater. He was a closet smoker. He was a closet drinker, which is so weird, because he would go out and he would have a martini and a non alcoholic beer and look like the most moderate person. But when he would go home to his house, it was a whole other story. And he like binge ate. He was he soothed himself with food. And unfortunately, I am my father's daughter. I am my father's daughter. In so many ways. And I, I'm not a drinker or a smoker, but I am, like, I'm prone to emotional eating, and I'm, I'm just watched him kill himself, essentially, till he got, he got large B cell lymphoma, which killed him in like, 21 days. And my grandfather before him died. It's like, I think, 67 from lymphoma. So, like, this is, you know, like you have to look at your genetics and who you favor and take a hard look at, like, Where am I headed if I don't change these generational patterns? So, you know, I became a runner. I became, and that was an incredible like awakening for me to my own power and my own choices. And I loved becoming a runner, but it was initially motivated out of God, I got to take care of myself, or this is where I'm headed, and I'm still confronting that, you know, on like eating whole foods. I know we probably are all on that. You know that trajectory of like, some days you do better with that than others, but I know that I have to take my health seriously, yeah, and other pain points. I mean, things with money. I had a family where people rescued other people with I was rescued constantly with money. I had a client say to me, say to me, I don't know anybody anything. He said, I have paid my college. Nobody's ever bought me a car. Nobody's ever taken care of me a day in my life. And he's like, I own my life. That's what he was communicating to me. And I'm sitting there thinking, oh, so I've had the opposite experience, and it fostered the belief that, like the help was always coming from outside.

Colette Fehr:

Oh, my God. Oh my god, yes, yes, yes. That is another huge change that you and I have both made. I was rescued with money my whole life, too. I really did think it grew on trees and that somehow it would always be there. I was never preoccupied with it. I just assumed, because it was always going to be there, right? It would just materialize when I need it. And I've never cared about money or things very much. But I didn't even realize how distorted my beliefs were, and it was a messy path. I mean, when I went to graduate school to become a therapist, my father was willing to pay for graduate school, and I was trying to make this change, and I was like, No, I'm going to do it myself, and I'm going to take student loans out, like everybody else. But I didn't know what. I didn't know my my financial and fiscal behaviors and understanding were so immature that I got myself screwed into like, $100,000 of student loans, and I just it was a mess, and I paid them off, but it was a nightmare. Yeah, and, you know, I was trying to take responsibility and get out of all of that, but it was a really bumpy road, and at many times, going back to victimology, I was like, I should have let my dad pay the hell who wouldn't pass like, why did this happen to me? Well, it happened to me because I didn't know what I was doing, right? I didn't educate myself adequately on the loans. It's easy to blame them on other people. I mean, it's not a really great industry, but I think that if you're going to make changes in your identity and how you do things, changes that are lasting, it is important to note that there's going to be a lot of messing up, a lot of messiness and painful growth along the way. These changes don't come easily.

Laura Bowman:

Yeah, yeah. And I think it's like you had to get into that big bind, because I was, like, working next to you, and you were getting out of it. And I think it's like you're born in those moments. You know, your identity is born in solving some of these problems. Like, that's why I always say, like, kind of bless the mess. If you're in a pain point right now where you're like, I don't know how this ends, you know, this is where you are being. This is your crucible, where you are becoming who you're meant to become. Next Yeah, I know you wouldn't choose it, but it, it is, forges the next level, it forges,

Colette Fehr:

yeah, because you saw you're right, you were there beside me. There was a period of maybe two years. I didn't buy anything, I didn't go anywhere. I spent 1000s of dollars a month on my student loans. I made the choice to show out of it, right? I had the temptation of, like, maybe it'll just go away. Maybe some presidents will, like, eradicate it, or whatever. And then I thought, You know what? I gotta just, I gotta take responsibility and just do it. And I listen. I'm not saying everybody's in a position to do it. I'm not trying to say everyone is has the same variables that I did. Right? But what I am trying to say is that it did not come without suffering, and it did not come without discipline. And I do think this is something increasingly society doesn't like to talk about, but is also very important, whatever changes you're going to make, there is a degree discipline is actually healthy. It's the way we parent ourselves. It doesn't have to come with a rod and corporal punishment, right? Figuratively speaking, emotionally, we don't have to beat ourselves up. We can be encouraging self compassionate and self loving, but we do have to hold ourselves accountable and build a muscle for discipline.

Laura Bowman:

I completely agree. You know, becoming a consistent human is what becoming an adult is, yes, and I, I love, I love that stuff now it's, it's kind of where I find the most pride when I was looking back on the years. You know, sometimes you think I'm going to make a change and it's going to happen really quickly. But like you said, it's like, one degree at a time, and I feel like I have layers of sediment now where it's like, Okay, I did that for a year, yeah, and now I'm doing this for a year. Like, I mean, I, I was so happy to see, like, my streak, my like, I'm, you know, I do weight lifting. I've done it like 202 20 classes now I go

Colette Fehr:

amazing. Laura,

Laura Bowman:

yeah, and I'm getting stronger, and I know this year I can get a layer stronger. I can take it to the next level from here. And I feel like that's the way my life has gone, in general, with my business, with where I push myself, it's like I go here, and then I go a level up, but this is just, you're just taking the next step of consistency and discipline. Yep, exactly. It's not sexy,

Colette Fehr:

no. And that is actually my thing right now, for this year, I have so much going on professionally, I don't feel like I need any more goals there. I really want to get back in shape. It's interesting for me. I'm someone who has popped in and out of being in good shape, and I can, you know how they say there's no true science to how many days it takes to set a habit. It's just never quite becomes like a permanent habit for me. And I mean, I've gone a decade where I didn't miss more than a workout a week, where I was exercising every day and feeling good about it always brings a ton of dopamine, which is the reward loop of habits, right? That something feels good, it makes you want to do it more. Somehow, it never quite takes off for me with exercise, there's still that, like, teenage part in me that wants to, like, lay around, eat junk food and binge watch TV and read books like that is, like, my default, a very strong part in identity. Yeah, that like, if that part gets the chance to do that, that thing will come back where I just and I'm not a lazy person at all. It's not that. It's just like, I guess the way I learned to self soothe at a young age that still feels the strongest. So getting up and getting right into my workout clothes, because early morning is really just the only way I can consistently work out, yeah, you know, I want to get back into that. So as we segue a little into like, let's give some of the bullet points about making these small changes. That is the one degree toward the life you want to live, whatever that may be, you know, I can use as an example for me. I'm trying to, I was going to do 10 minutes a day, you know. But even that, I feel like and set a certain time a day, even that is probably too big. And this is where I think a lot of people go wrong, because they don't have the patience to say, if I slice it really thin, right? Then it feels like it's not good enough,

Laura Bowman:

it's not big enough, it's not gonna help,

Colette Fehr:

yeah, but the way to do it, and I've done this before, and it worked. I did this during COVID. I lost now I'm on zepbound diet shots, as you know, and I'm losing weight slowly. But back during COVID, i and it's not as easy, even on the damn shots, like I'm not this person who's disappearing in three months like other people, like, I'm still hungry. It's fucking crazy, but it's definitely helping. But during COVID, I lost like 2530 pounds on my own, yeah, and I built a regular habit of working out. And I started really, really small. So I think where I need to go is I've got to get myself in the clothes. I've got to get I'm in the habit right now of laying in bed. I wake up early, but I lay in bed and I play eight. Eight New York Times word puzzles. A lot of people do that. Yeah, and I love it. It's like, my favorite little time of the day. So I've either got to, like, add this new I want to get in the clothes and I just want to get on my stupid fucking peloton that is sitting there like an obnoxious piece of furniture in my living room unused.

Laura Bowman:

Well, that's a big BJ Fogg strategy, right? That you take an existing habit and you link a new one to it, yeah?

Colette Fehr:

And James clear says that too, right? Yeah. BJ Fogg talks about, every time he peed he did two set of two push ups, yeah, that's, yeah, I get that. So I'm trying to figure out, you know how I can just get myself into the clothes and get on the peloton? Truly, if I were willing to spend a month where I just got dressed and got on and walked for two minutes,

Laura Bowman:

you would do it. You would start.

Colette Fehr:

Yeah, that's probably what I need to do. Because, guess what, in six months, I'll be back to running two or three miles. Instead, what I did is I signed up for a 5k which I can't run, and I, like, bought all those weight things at your place, which I'll go once, and I'll be, like, in the hospital. It's too big. It's too big. You got to start right there, right work your way up. And the steps are, I was just looking at this. There has to be a cue, right? A craving, a response and a reward. This is how you build habits, and a habit is essentially just something that's automated. Your brain no longer has to divert mental energy and resources to making it happen. You just do it right? I wake up and I grab my little Spelling Bee, and I'm ecstatic when I see the little letters. And can I figure it out without the hints? I want to be that ecstatic about getting on my peloton.

Laura Bowman:

Yeah, and it may take months, but this is, you know, I've talked about Elizabeth Benton before on this. But if anybody's like curious, I love her principles. She has this whole thing on consistency. She has the principles of consistency. So if you're curious, look up Elizabeth Benton, which one of her principles of consistency is, because I struggled with this. Yeah. Is that where you start is not where you stay? And this is exactly what you're talking about. Yeah, is that you start by just putting your workout outfit on and like, standing on the treadmill, but you know, two months later you're going to be walking two miles or running a mile or whatever,

Colette Fehr:

right? Because the point is that actually some days you might get on because my hardest part is getting in the clothes. Yeah, it's like, cold. I mean, Florida cold, you know, not, not 89 degrees. And I'm like, Oh, I'd rather be under my duvet cover doing my little word puzzles. But once I'm in the close many days, I'm gonna get on the treadmill, and maybe I will feel like doing it, but then there are those days that I'm not going to feel like doing it. And this is the point of having it small, is that if it's super small, and I know I only have to get on and walk for two minutes, right? And then I'm done, then on those days, I've still met my goal.

Laura Bowman:

I love that. Yeah, so that's where you're starting. That's your big that's your beginning of building the bamboo infrastructure.

Colette Fehr:

Yes. And Laura, as I say this, there is the part of me I can feel her chomping at the bit right now, going shut the up. Colette, that is the dumbest thing ever. That's not good enough. It's not satisfying. You're gonna put all this energy and you're only gonna do two minutes like you gotta go, go, go. You're losing muscle tone. You don't have time for this to take months, right?

Laura Bowman:

I can feel that part, but that actually, that part will slow you down. And believe system that slows us down. And this is never good enough, right? It's never big enough change, impactful enough change.

Colette Fehr:

And this is where self compassion comes in, where I can talk to that part and say, I hear you that you're worried that I'm not going to make these changes, that I'm not going to get back in shape, that I'm going to lose all my muscle tone, because these diet shots make you lose muscle even more. And we know at this stage of life, muscle and everything. I mean, I was never that muscular. I am like, the most delicious jelly donut right now. Like, it is really bad. Yeah, so, but that part's just worried that if it doesn't push me to say, Okay, tomorrow before work, I'm gonna get on the treadmill and I'm gonna run for 45 minutes, 40 minutes. 40 minutes, yeah, yeah, like that will feel like a workout. But you know what? Then I won't do it again, because I won't be able to walk for four days, right?

Laura Bowman:

Right? So where you start is not where you stay, right? And trust the process on change, right? And making a. Small change. So the idea of a cue is what is going to be the impetus for the thing, like, pair it with something else, right? Make it more attractive to do it. Like coffee is like, for me, my cue, like, I can get out of bed for coffee, and if I'm out of bed, I'm likely to do some sort of physical movement.

Colette Fehr:

Okay, you know, another friend of mine was just saying the same thing about the QB and coffee. Maybe I should try that. Yeah, I probably, if I had to quit coffee, I think some of my behaviors would slip. Well, I'm definitely not quitting coffee, but I was thinking maybe even so the cue, I thought about doing my one little Wordle, but then what if I did because the idea of making it attractive, you know, a lot of people will talk about with habits watch your favorite TV show on the treadmill or the bike, yeah. So you're pairing an activity you love with an activity that's less desirable. You know, I can't really run doing my word puzzles. But what if, as I first got on, what if I did my little spelling bee? Yeah, as I was warming up,

Laura Bowman:

I love that. I would pair it. I would pair that whole

Colette Fehr:

I'm gonna try that. I'm gonna try that. And then the other thing that I think I'm just using this as a metaphor, but is making it easy. So what worked for me during COVID was that I got my workout clothes out. They were right there. I didn't have to do that extra step right? I sit and I put them right by the bed, like, there they are.

Laura Bowman:

Yeah, no, that's a great idea. Those are, those are perfect for that habit. Uh, one of the things that I know that I'm ready to do, and I just sort of confronted this recently, is that there's been a few areas of my life that I really want to take to the next level. And I was like, I think I need help. Like, I think I need to, like, hire somebody for what, like, I think I want a business coach. Like, I think I need that like, and I, you know, I have this, I'm very independent, or I'm, I'm a, I'm somebody who I think is pretty hard to help. I do a lot of, like, internal processing, yeah, you know that about me? And so I don't, I'm always kind of keeping my own, I don't know my own thoughts in and and they're all inside. And I think I need to externalize some of these things, because the consciousness that creates problems is not the consciousness that's going to solve a problem. So I'm like, I think I want help here. I've also thought about like, there's this money group, like investing group for women, and I'm like, I think I might want to get involved in so I think I need help. I think I need the inspiration of other people to push me forward, because my mind doesn't know the next step there, right?

Colette Fehr:

Okay, so that's another good investment group. I want to do that too. I know, right? I need to be educated. Yes, I need it more. There's just I need help in certain areas. And I think we all need help in certain areas. I agree. I think I need help in some of the areas, you need help too. I think what's hard though sometimes, is finding the right person, finding the right fit, yeah, but that's okay. It's not an overnight thing, you know. But I love that, right? Like, if you're stuck, get help. Get help, right with whatever it is,

Laura Bowman:

yeah, you know, quitting drinking. Like, sometimes people need people need help. There. There There are some things you can keep your own counsel around, and you can create momentum on your own. And in that case, it's like, maybe you don't broadcast your intentions. Like those people that are like, I'm gonna get in such like, color shape, like, this is the year, right? It's like, Shut up, you know, just keep it to yourself for a while, right?

Colette Fehr:

Yeah, I never keep anything to myself, as you know, but I agree, stop.

Laura Bowman:

Don't broadcast it, because when you broadcast it, sometimes it takes all the energy out of it. When you have, like, a little personal goal, sometimes it's like you're working, you're gardening at night. It's kind of like exciting. It's on the day. I love you.

Colette Fehr:

I hear you. I think I'm a little bit opposite on this one, and maybe it speaks to our extroversion, introversion, internal versus external processing. For me, yes, I run the risk of, like, I say a goal, and then people are like, she didn't do it. At this point in my life, I don't give a fuck. At least I'm somebody who's stepping up to the plate and taking chances, and so if, like, the world sees that I didn't make a goal happen, like, so be it. So be it. Everybody else can stay home and suck their thumb while I'm not taking risks so I don't feel embarrassed. But what it does for me when I tell people is it makes it more real. I mean, I'm No, love it. I love it. That doesn't that doesn't hold me just saying I'm not. back anymore. I think it used to at some point, look, oh, if I say I want to have a TV show, then if I don't get a TV show, then everyone's gonna see that. Who cares? Great. At least I went for it, right? I don't know what's gonna happen, but to me, when I say I want to have a TV show. I want to be a therapist on TV when I put that out into the world, and I don't want it for fame, I want it for the joy of it like it's something that excites me, it's a new challenge. It's something that makes me want to jump up out of bed and wake up every day. That's why I want it. I want to feel alive. And so the more I say it, and the more I tell people to me, the more energy it gets, the more real it feels, the more my intentions of like this is what I'm doing, and it's happening feel real.

Laura Bowman:

I mean, I totally get that. And then the other perspective, just for me, is that I feel like I need to create self trust around behaviors. So if I want to do something that is new to me or it's not in line with my default mechanisms, and I know that I, you know, my system is always pulling me off the road, I want to prove to myself with behavior, yeah, quietly, that I've got what it takes to do the thing, yeah, where I'm saying it into the world, but that makes sense too, yeah, that makes sense too. But at the same time, I think there are areas where you have to like, be like, I'm raising my hand. I'm doing help. I need help. I need somebody to like. I need somebody else's thoughts or some accountability around something, process with somebody and get into action? Yes, yeah. So you just have to know what those things are. For you. Another thing that us talking, I know we're like, running long here, is that you always, we're always thinking about that, you know, the negative way we think is that we always have to remediate our weaknesses, right? Like, just even you with, like, the getting in shape, like, it's something that's hard for you, but it's like, you want to, you want to deal with it. I think change should be about remediating some weaknesses, but like, double downing on your strengths. I think that's like, I mean, your example of that, like, with the speaking stuff and the acting stuff and the television stuff that's you going, I know what I'm good at, and I'm like, putting, I'm sliding my money towards black, right? Yeah, yeah. And and that, I think most of our energy should go to things that we're exceptional at, and some of our energy should go towards remediating the things

Colette Fehr:

I agree I am not trying to become like a fitness guru, yeah, right, right, yeah. I just want, really, my motivation is to just feel and be healthy. You know? I want to be healthy. I want to take care of myself, because I care about myself, but that is not my thing. It's never gonna be my thing. So for me, it's more a matter of, you know, as I'm thinking about the changes I've scanned back. And this can be helpful for people too, to times in my life where my fitness routine was serving me, not what other people think it should be. I'm not gonna spend hours in the gym, and I don't want to. I'm not interested in that, and and all the power to you, if you are, it's just not for me. But times when my routine worked well was when I woke up, I swallowed the frog. I did about a 20 minute workout. I ran out of trouble. I do really like to run. I'm not willing to go outside in the dark by myself for a host of reasons, but that was when I really enjoyed working out. It I felt great. You know, I love the endorphins it gives you. So something like that's probably the big trajectory for me, is I want to get in like you and I have talked about a couple of weight workouts a week, yeah, which I didn't used to do. And then I want to wake up most mornings and do a short burst of cardio, whether it's walking fast jogging. You know that that's it. That's like the that's the final road Yeah, so, but I agree, your strengths are your strengths for a reason. They're gonna bring you the most joy.

Laura Bowman:

If you're gonna pull you forward the quickest, like you're you're never gonna be like whatever. I mean, I'm terrible at, like, math. I'm never gonna be an abstract mathematician, and spending any time there is pretty much a waste of my energy. So it's like, figure out the things that you as your special sauce, and put energy towards that this year. So if you looking at the things you want to change, and they're all things that are not areas of strength for you, pick at least one area where you're doubling down on your essential stuff, right?

Colette Fehr:

And just 1% what have you shifted? Just 1% Yeah. You know what? If you just read a book about something you're interested in, what rate like start really small. So for these goals we're talking about, pair it up with some kind of cue that's going to lead to a new behavior. Make it attractive. Make it easy. You need some kind of reward built in. You know, maybe the queue is coffee, but maybe after the workout, it's another coffee, or it's a go, a pastry, or whatever. The hell who cares? Just something that feels like a reward. And then I think one final thing you and I talk about all the time, but it's so important for this, when we're making identity based changes and creating change about living the life you want to live. Visualize. Visualization is a proven tool. It works. You know that book The Secret a million years ago, whether you think that's a bunch of bullshit or the most profound book you ever read, the if there's anything to it, it's that what your mind focuses on, what you see for yourself, it fills your heart, it expands in your body, and you will naturally start to take action according to what you're envisioning. So think about if I were so excited to get out of bed every day in six months, what would be happening in my life that would make that come true?

Laura Bowman:

Yeah, that's an excellent question, right? Yeah, by my life, what would be happening? Yes, and then,

Colette Fehr:

and then backtrack from there, take some teeniest nugget, yeah, yeah, and you'll get there.

Laura Bowman:

So goals are big and small. They're public and private, their strengths and weaknesses, yeah, like they're, you know, there's paradox, there's nuance to how you do change. But I think we hit it today, and you got at the heart of it, it's you taking radical responsibility for your life, for your one precious life,

Colette Fehr:

exactly. Mary Oliver, what will you do with your one wild and precious life? Exactly? All right. Well, on that note, let's wrap up. Thank you all for listening, and if you liked what you heard today on insights from the couch, and we hope you did. Please share with your friends, and don't forget to write us a five star review. Those reviews help us spread the word to other women out there like you. We're so grateful to you all and excited to be back for season three. Lots more good episodes to come every Wednesday, take care, guys, bye. You.