bob-sabin_1_03-16-2026_100339 0:18

Welcome to Tracking the Cats. I'm Bob Saban, my co-host Steve White, is having some technical issues this week. He'll be back with us next time, but I've got a good show here for you today. The show is brought to you as always by Stan Insurance. They cover. All your insurance needs throughout the Southeast. As a matter of fact, they have offices in Silva, Waynesville, Clyde and Highlands, but you could be calling'em from Florida and they'll take care of you commercially home, auto, whatever your insurance needs are. Stanbury Insurance, our sponsor today, we've got a very cool guest for the first time. We don't have any other people with the background that this coach has. That's as interesting. But we've got softball coach Jim Cliff. He's been with us for 14 seasons now, and has coached at all different levels in softball. And has really brought these ladies on the last couple of seasons. 2006 was a pretty good year for softball and this year starting out to look even better. Coach, welcome to tracking the Cats where we talk about all things cat mount. And today it's softball.

squadcaster-200e_1_03-16-2026_100338 1:33

Thanks for having me. I'm looking forward to next half hour or so.

bob-sabin_1_03-16-2026_100339 1:37

Great. I had a little bit of weather up there o overnight in ee It is Monday, the 16th of March and storm came through. We got a good week last week. You had three out of your four games that you won and you're off to one of the best seasons ever. Can you tell us a little bit about how things are looking with the ladies this year?

squadcaster-200e_1_03-16-2026_100338 1:59

They're, clicking on all cylinders. Actually they're clicking on most of the cylinders. That's what's exciting about it, is I keep telling'em, we still haven't hit our ceiling at all. And, you don't know what that is. But one of the things I think this program struggled with is having all three phases of the game working at the same time. And right now that's what we have going. And so I think it's all come together. Been working towards this, not, it's not just this season, it worked out. We've been trying to put these pieces together since COVID, we had a really great year the year after COVID, and it was, with all the restrictions and such, and. We ran into a few years of struggling in the pitching area with some different odd things happening, all coming together. And so we've been digging ourselves outta the pitching hole and, it looks like that's happening. And with that, that's really what this game comes down to. You. If you score a whole bunch of runs all the time, that's great, but if the other, you let the other team score more, gonna win very many games. So I think we're coming together. On pitching defense and the offense right now is clicking big time and I think we're seeing the results of that.

bob-sabin_1_03-16-2026_100339 2:59

So over 14 years here in Colory you have seen ups and downs. What's it been like over the, that period of time and what kind of challenges have you guys faced? You talked a little bit about COVID, but there were years before that too, that we've had some pretty good seasons. But tell us a little bit about the, those 14 years.

squadcaster-200e_1_03-16-2026_100338 3:20

Obviously I came in actually as the assistant coach in 2009 for the fall of 2009. And there, so there had only been a few years prior to that, that the program had been in existence. And so 2006 the team won the conference and their inaugural year, which was a record kind of thing. And so set a bar that made it difficult to reach. Obviously when you win a championship first year a lot of expectations, i'm not sure whether economy things what have you. It became the, that coach left after that first year. I think there's been budget issues. There's been this, there's been that what, whatever, what, whatever the reasons or excuses you wanna look at how, whichever you wanna look at. I think it's just been a matter of trying to attract really solid players. We've always attracted really good character here. That's what we go for, right? I've always said I'm not, I'm in this business to have fun too, and I like to be around good people and we try to that's who we try to recruit. We start character first. And so we've had some up and ups and downs. People don't think about the Southern Conference. I guess you think of Southern, Southern Conference from the bigger sport level and how we're doing within the conference at any one year based on football or what have you. People don't really realize that, especially in these last couple years, that the Southern Conference from a softball standpoint has been highly competitive. And even on a, looking at a national level, especially from a mid-major point of view. And I think last year was the first Amer we went into conference, with a winning record last year. And so did I believe, five other teams ahead of us too. And it's, we had a, Mercer had an incredibly good year and they, they were fifth seat in the tournament, ended up winning the tournament and going and playing in the championship game at regionals against Florida before they finally were were knocked outta regional. So they, the Southern Conference is a very competitive conference and. We, last year was a, an improvement overall that from the year before. And we were still super disappointed because we expected much higher, but we didn't expect, it was like five teams took big steps as well. And so you're, sometimes there's windows. We feel last year we were still being led by sophomores and and this year we've got those as juniors and we have a couple seniors that have really stepped into it as well. That are are really leading the team. So we feel like we're being led by some upperclassmen instead of being led by underclassmen. And there's nothing wrong with underclassmen, but there, this is not an easy level no matter which sport you're talking about. Division one level. There's, there comes experience comes a lot of wisdom and figuring it out kind of thing. And we feel like we've we're finding that, that nice place that soft spot for this team to that sweet spot, not soft spot, but sweet spot for this

bob-sabin_1_03-16-2026_100339 6:01

Yeah.

squadcaster-200e_1_03-16-2026_100338 6:01

Where we've got a lot of the tools and like I mentioned earlier, the phases of the game covered. And now we've got the mentality and the leadership.

bob-sabin_1_03-16-2026_100339 6:09

Yeah, when you look at the stat sheet, which I was doing over the weekend and you look at whether it's hitting Maya McPherson, and then you've got pitching is strong. And Fielding is strong as well. 1.0 pa past most of your players. Tell us a little bit about that balance because as you mentioned, you can hit, but if you don't have everything else to back it up, it's not gonna be as good.

squadcaster-200e_1_03-16-2026_100338 6:33

And I think we're really lucky. We have a full coaching staff. We still don't have as many as they've just changed a rule. We're, pretty much anybody within the athletic department can come out and coach on a team. You can add'em on there and coach on a team. So you've got people that have operations people and player development people. Those are positions we don't have. And now they can go out and coach on the field. And so sometimes we go out there and there's been a number of years where it's just being my associate head coach, Madison Armstrong. And it's just been the two of us going against. And when we, we're gonna be playing Clemson coming up here, we played them in their inaugural game at home and and and beat them. And they, we had three coaches that day and we were looking over there and it felt like half the dugout was with with staff looking at that across the way. And that's pretty normal for us. And so having four coaches has lightened the load and allows us to cover more things. And we've always felt like we've done a really great job, but. There's always something that has to say. There's one no way in the world that two people can cover any, everything, especially when, even if you're losing, you're sleeping five hours a day at the most during the season. So we're, we feel like we're getting a lot more all the way around. And so you look at the, the balance on, you start looking at the girls and seeing what they're doing and they're getting a lot more feedback. We've taken a step up have a new camera system that allows us to, to augment our training. And a new scouting system. There was for years, everybody had more on us. Then we had film on us. And are things that you think are niceties. And maybe 10, 15 years ago they were, if you had it, it was a luxury you had and nobody else had. And now if you don't have those kind of things you're way behind the power curve. And we didn't realize how valuable that was until this year. And we're, now that we have it and what we're able to do and how much better we. Be able to prepare the players and I give it to the players. They're going out there and doing it. I don't know, I guess they would have to say, I'm not sure how you'd measure how much the stuff that we have now from a technology standpoint and which has adjusted our approach to practices and games and everything, how much that's helping them perform. But I know it's not hurting.

bob-sabin_1_03-16-2026_100339 8:38

And speaking of that money is always important not just for the scholarships, but for how you fund everything from travel through technology. And just last week it was announced the Betty Peel Endowment, which is I hope, going to be a a major help for you guys. Tell us a little bit about that and what are your goals for coming up with, any funds that are accumulated through that.

squadcaster-200e_1_03-16-2026_100338 9:02

I'm not sure exactly how that's gonna work now. We're still in that stage, obviously with with Kyle Pifer, our athletic director and all the staff on how we're going to go with that. But we, I, it's, I think that's one of the things. And not to get too controversial here, this is a. A cultural thing for us, not here at Western as much as it is just an overall cultural thing. And you'll notice even at the bigger levels, there's gonna be a discrepancy on the support for women's athletics. It's just everybody wants to, if they're gonna throw some money, they wanna throw some money at a male sport that's just cultural. I don't know about tradition, but it's cultural. And this is probably the biggest. Step towards that. So I'm, what I'm hoping is that shows it's, it, it leads the way, whether it ends up endowing scholarships. Right now the Southern Conference we did opt in and which gives us we, we no longer go by scholarship limits. We go by roster limits. The Southern Conference said, yeah, we, they wanted us opt in. So everybody's opted in, but they've decided to stay with scholarship. Limits just for our conference. So I have to imagine times change down the road that will happen within our conference. That, that keeps us very competitive with the other softball schools in our conference. Sticking with old NCAA scholarship limits of 12 is what softball was. But if you look at it, if they take the limits away and we go to roster limits. Obviously it, it basically cuts us in half of what we have now. So having an endowment, if that's where the Betty's endowment goes then towards scholarships and that can really be help down the line on, on, on staying up on that. But, gonna put us at 25 Fools, but if it can keep us up there competitive with everybody else in the conference, which is what you're looking for right now. If it goes towards an equipment thing we're now fundraising all of the technology we have. It is web-based subscriptions to go. So it, even with the hardware it has, it, it's usually several thousand dollars a year, maybe as much, four or$5,000 a year for the subscription. And so we're probably looking at running a couple camps just to cover subscriptions. So anything that we can get. From a or if the endowment goes towards more equipment, that kind of thing, be able to spend it. Lemme put it that way. We, there's not gonna be a problem with, Hey we spend it all up and we have this money left over. I can guarantee you.

bob-sabin_1_03-16-2026_100339 11:26

Yeah. I'm sure that. And what about facilities needs? How are you guys doing with that?

squadcaster-200e_1_03-16-2026_100338 11:31

It the one of the things I've always,

bob-sabin_1_03-16-2026_100339 11:33

i.

squadcaster-200e_1_03-16-2026_100338 11:33

proud of. And I look at it as our number one recruiting tool if I can get, and coach Hunter, who was a kind of a legendary basketball coach here was the coach when I first got here. And he said, man, if you can get'em on campus, you got'em. And I didn't know exactly what that meant, but anybody that's been on this campus in general, it knows how beautiful it is. And it's just gotten better since back then. When I first got here in 2009, they were still building, some of the dorms and they had just opened up the the. dining hall. And so where the fountain is right now is a big pile of red mud. They like, apparently the year before I got here, they had closed the road that went through it. Since then, we've added buildings obviously the ACA science building the new health building. Just. A half mile off campus and it's it's growing and it's just absolutely beautiful. And our, they built our softball complex, you could look at it and say gosh, it'd be nice to have this thing or that thing. But you look at it, and I always say it, the bones are awesome. So as far as you come up here and bring a a student athlete up here, a pros, prospective student athlete, and it's just they look at how beautiful it is and it's, so it's a beautiful place, it's starting to show somewhere. And so there's some things that need to be refreshed and maybe some things that need to be upgraded. And so we'll be working towards some of those things. Added obviously a six camera system that is really amazing. Matter of fact, what I've been really proud of is that part of the kind of a side thing to this camera system is that they offer replay. And so we went from no replay and they just passed a rule within the conference that we could use it as an option. And now we've used it every game. And we don't have to

bob-sabin_1_03-16-2026_100339 13:09

Okay.

squadcaster-200e_1_03-16-2026_100338 13:09

ESPN coverage. And, we share that with baseball. If we have a weekend series and they do, we'll get it on Saturday for our two games, they'll get it on Friday and Sunday. You can't have replay, day one and not day two. So you either have it or you don't. And we've already had it. I think the only game we didn't have it was we had a kind of a popup switch the opener with a and t. We were supposed to play down at them. And because of the weather down there which sounds odd, you would think we had the bad weather. We were, we had perfect weather, perfect field conditions that was beautiful. They still had ice on their field and so they came up, up here and we weren't prepared to. Flip the switch on the replay, but after that we've had replay in every game and it has been fantastic. It just sit takes you up to that next the next level and the quality of the games and I think umpires appreciate it. You'd think an umpire does not appreciate having being second guest on their calls, but they appreciate it. Yeah, it may be more than anything else is when you have replay and a coach can only come out and appeal two plays and then it's over. So he is not, they're not having somebody come out and argue with him every other pitch. The umpires seemed to appreciate it as well. So we're getting a lot more of those kind of things. Just a few years ago we installed new backstop padding. Our goal is to. Outfield fences padded as well. And we're just moving in those directions. So it's almost every year we're adding something, whether it's a little something or a pretty substantial something. And and if you haven't been here for a while and you go out there, you it'll you, whether you've really realized that we have new backstop pad, you look and say something looks fresh, something's popping out here. And especially if you watch our ESPN broadcast, the thing that you see most is from the. fill view to the looking over the pitcher shoulder, looking at the batter, and there's that backstop padding, and you think little things like that don't matter. And they really do. And that's pres that's presenting our university. People think only softball, but it's the face of any of our sports that go on television represent our university. And so we're really proud of what we're doing right now. And we still have a long way to go.

bob-sabin_1_03-16-2026_100339 15:06

Yeah. And what you said about get'em on campus holds true across the board, whether it's basketball, football baseball, track and field. The being able to, I'm constantly surprised at the talent that we have given the limitations financial limitations that everybody talks about with Western. And, we can cry all we want to, but there's, by the way, there's a, something coming along that hopefully will help all sports as well. There's a new group of folks who are trying to do some other things outside and we may be able to announce that in a few weeks. But in the meantime, let's get back to the ladies. Talk specifically about your talent. You've got a very young team. I think I counted 10 freshmen on the team out of 25 people. Tell me a little bit about who are your outstanding leaders with the team, both in pitching and hitting this year?

squadcaster-200e_1_03-16-2026_100338 16:00

Yeah, I'd almost tell you the the other balance after those freshmen. I think that is one of the things that is, maybe a key. I talk about, part of that recruiting thing I think is we have a we have some players that maybe on other teams would be jumping on the portal. If you look at their talent and their production and there's several of them Maya McPherson is right there at the top. If this week, if not the top number two, whatever with batting average, she's hitting I don't know, like a 4 63. I don't know why she's not hitting sort 4 64, we'll take 4 63.

bob-sabin_1_03-16-2026_100339 16:28

4, 6 3. You're right.

squadcaster-200e_1_03-16-2026_100338 16:30

and why did, why is she staying here? Why are the, why are these players where everybody else is hopping on portals? And and I think they came here because they wanted this experience. They're that group of people that aren't, aren't looking for that temporary, throw me, let me see the money kind of thing. And I, then I get it. Everybody's got, I guess everybody's got their price. I don't know. But there. This is where they are flourishing, athletically, academically and socially. We're getting some really good people and that, that kind of, those kind of core values are kind of things that they're looking for are all the sudden some are also really good qualities of good people that end up becoming good leaders. And so we have some really great leaders. We have our three captains Tate Tuman, who is homegrown here. And matter of fact, she'll say she, where she said, yeah, I'm headed home and I'm going, where you mean to your apartment or to your folks? Because they're not equal distance. And but she's as a senior Tate Tuman Taylor Waitley our senior catcher and Becca Ick is one of our sophomores incredible leaders, but is followed up by, lily Bell and Sidney Dirks and Maya McPherson, who happened to be leading on the field as well. But when we have it's getting, it's one of those things you want a player led. Team, that's the most powerful leadership you can have because if it's always coaches, then it's external motivation and it's coming from them. And so we'll have, get done with a game whether it went the way we wanted to or or not, whether there was issues that we have to talk about. Certainly the coaches might bring up a few things, but many times I'm getting ready to go, okay, got, let's talk. And it's not one person popping up and then everybody stays silent. It's a, it's an exchange back and forth being led by those people. I just. Just mentioned. I think the leadership is super strong. It has to be with the number of freshmen we have, and obviously we have some sophomores but we have some sophomores waiting in the wings as well with the leadership or starting center field or Courtney Marks a great leader. She stepped up and asked to present in the fall about doing an exercise that she had done before in core values. We talked over. Threw it her way. She did a fantastic job. That's amazing for underclassmen to stand up in front of her teammates. Every time you stand up in front of the teammates, whether you're a coach or a player, is a chance for ridicule and disapproval. And so she walked up there and just owned it and it was obviously well received the way with the way she brought it forth with confidence and, we just have a lot of players. I think that's one of the things that. Certainly waiting in the wings for, with what we have lined up in the next recruiting classes, but also what we have on the team. I don't think when we graduate these seniors that are our captains that we're gonna have a leadership void. And I think that is something different. We've had some really great leaders on this team, but having a consistent. And it's almost becomes, part of the culture is having consistent leadership and we're very excited about the future from that perspective. Right now we're win the game that you're playing, but when you look at the the future it, it remains bright. Yes.

bob-sabin_1_03-16-2026_100339 19:29

Talk a little bit about your pitching staff,'cause you're having a good year there as well. At least starting out.

squadcaster-200e_1_03-16-2026_100338 19:34

Yeah, I would say, we've got a senior there with Riley Pennington, and she's doing a really great job. She comes in, in, in many support roles. We're probably not as robust there as I would feel comfortable. And no coach is ever comfortable all the time, you gotta stay uncomfortable, so we're really being led. By two sophomores. So in that case you'd look and say we probably are a little bit younger on that, but they're both the, they're both just doing a great job. I think we're pretty much led by Amanda Fulton, but and you look at her, she has a seven three record. We've her into the every fire we can find. But if you want to. Call being seven and oh, which AG Batson is as a number two, I, it's hard to say, it's, you can't, which one's your number one, right? They both are throwing very well. They're very different pitchers. And I think, there are two examples if you look at their numbers. Last year Amanda started off really well and, as the year went on we, that's where we, that's where we struggled. That's what slowed us down, was pitching, started off really well last year and then and was not strong. It was a lot to ask of a to carry the team on her shoulders. And she did. She did a solid job all the way through, but really you could see her getting tired. I think she did a great job of saying, okay, that's what it looks like. Most of the freshmen that have played travel ball, she played really high level travel ball. She played on the same team as Lily Bell did. They all come in going, yeah, I played travel ball every weekend. We played five plus games. It's, I know what it's like, I can handle it. And then they get here and they don't understand when you live and breathe softball, and then the rest of the time you're doing your your academics and it's every day. And if you're not doing softball, you're still hitting the weight room. And it's a grind. And I think she realized what it took. And she came back after the summer just. Just an amazing, somebody that figured it out. And I'm really excited to see how things go the rest of the year for her and this team. But I'm really excited to see what happens for the rest of her career. She's just a really levelheaded player. If you see her strike somebody out and point at the catcher, that's a big display of emotion for her,

bob-sabin_1_03-16-2026_100339 21:35

that's correct.

squadcaster-200e_1_03-16-2026_100338 21:36

the same thing. Now she, that's when you'll never know what she's thinking. She's that she's got that game face on all the time. And she has grown so much from her freshman year and she's, I think both of them. have become very consistent, which was, usually what happens with a freshman at any position is the consistency issue. When they're playing their best and gosh, they're amazing. They're playing like the senior, and then the next game or next play, not so much. And I think that's what we're getting out of our sophomores on up, is the consistency. And that's really the, I think the main thing happening for Amanda and AG Baton.

bob-sabin_1_03-16-2026_100339 22:09

That's great. We've got a big week coming up. You got Clemson tomorrow. Hopefully if the weather allows it, they will actually be on campus a nationally ranked team. It's a rematch from last year. And then you start the conference season this weekend, so big week. And then moving on to conference play for most of the rest of the season. How does, how do we match up, do you think? Within the conference?

squadcaster-200e_1_03-16-2026_100338 22:35

I think we're, I think we're gonna match up really well. Right now we're one of the top hitting teams defensively. We're up in the top third. I think we're better than what our numbers are showing right now. We have a freshman at, or two freshmen that are working at, shortstop and if we could go and take their numbers, eliminate the first half of the first half of the season, and look at their numbers, they're, everything is much higher. And I think that's that's getting better. So I think we're gonna get better defensively. So we're up there in the top third of that. We are in the top half pitching. Are if you take a look at everybody's top three numbers of pictures, we're probably right there in the number one or two. We're right there. But you, I always say you've gotta, you still gotta go through UNCG. You still have to go through Chattanooga. I don't care what they're doing. They're, they have a customer really been the big program. Sanford has always been a strong program. You look at their record, they have a losing record. Go check who they've been playing.

bob-sabin_1_03-16-2026_100339 23:29

Correct.

squadcaster-200e_1_03-16-2026_100338 23:30

I just completely ignore their record. I can tell you when you get into a conference, they have the ability to walk through the conference. And then Wofford right now is probably showing a. Best of anybody, and I'm, I sure haven't figured out what they've, what they did last year and talking to their coach, they were shaking their head about their offense and they had really great pitching and now that it their pitching is still solid, but it's flipped now they're leading the conference and hitting. So that, that's something you've got ETSU has struggled the last few years, and now they're in preseason one of the top teams. It what's happening is we, everybody's hitting pretty well. But those teams that I've talked about have some a good, at least one frontline pitcher that can get it done, I think, leading the conference, a pitcher leading the conference right now, u from U-U-N-C-G is a transfer transferred in. And so you don't know what's gonna happen from year to year, but I think we're gonna be right there in the mix, so I I'm not gonna make any bold predictions. This is a crazy game. But the way we approach it, we don't have to play a whole season. We just have to play one game at a time. And that mentality, that one pitch, one game at a time thing is. it's huge. It's a simple cliche kind of thing to say, but it is very hard to actually do. And so I think we're gonna be I feel we're I'll make this bold statement. We're gonna be right there when it, when we get going. But it's gonna be a battle every game. I don't know what it is. You can play a really tough schedule and I think we, I don't know. I think, I don't know if we played the toughest preseason schedule in the conference. Like I said, you look at somebody like Sanford. But I feel like we played a super solid schedule so you can look at some really good solid wins that we've had against some really solid solid teams. And and I think we're gonna be there at the end of it, just me doing the, using the measuring sticks. I'm I have at this point, the season with no conference games played but conference for some reason is a different animal. And so we'll see how it goes.

bob-sabin_1_03-16-2026_100339 25:23

You took the words outta my mouth when you said you've got some impressive wins so far looking at schedule, so that's great. I really appreciate you being here today. It's been a great conversation. Wish you the best luck with the rest of the season. And that's gonna about wrap it up for tracking the cats today. Brought to you as always by Stanbury Insurance Offices in Silva, Waynesville, Highlands, and Clyde. And we will see y'all again in two weeks. Thanks for being here, coach.

squadcaster-200e_1_03-16-2026_100338 25:51

Thank you for having me. Go Katz.