EP. 19:📱 Devices, Kids & Sanity—Can We Have It All? 🤯

Ever feel like screens are taking over your kid’s brain? You're not alone. In this episode of webe Parents, Dr. Alona Pulde & Dr. Matthew Lederman dive deep into the messy, real-life struggle of device use—without the guilt trips. 🧠💡

🔥 Kids love their screens. Parents hate the battles.
💡 The secret? Collaboration over control.
😲 Even our kids school us on our own contradictions (yes, watching belly flops for 30 minutes is totally different from their ASMR videos... right? 😂).

The takeaway: Devices aren’t the enemy. It’s about balance—helping kids see their own needs while setting healthy, realistic boundaries.

💬 Drop a 🎧 if you’re tuning in & tell us: What’s your biggest device-time struggle at home?

To learn more about what Alona & Matt are up to check us out at webeparents.com, or follow us on our socials at Instagram, Facebook, TikTok, or YouTube. Be sure to subscribe to webe Pärents wherever you listen to your favorite podcasts.

Transcript

WBP 119 - Devices Letters
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[00:00:00] 

Alona Pulde: Hey there! We'd love for you to hit that subscribe button. By subscribing, you're helping us spread the word and connect with more amazing people like you. 

Host: Welcome to We Be Parents, where parent doctors Matthew Letterman and Alona Pulde explore current parenting topics. Welcome to We Be Parents, 

Alona Pulde: where we explore the joys and challenges of parenting, share heartfelt stories, and help families grow closer together.

Hi, I'm Dr. Alona Pulde. 

Matthew Lederman: And I'm Dr. Matthew Letterman. 

Alona Pulde: And we're excited to be with you today and dive right in. But before we do, don't forget to hit that subscribe button. When you subscribe, you'll always stay connected to the latest parenting tips and stories, and you'll help us grow this amazing community.

Matthew Lederman: So the, the topic is devices, and this is the followup where we go over headlines and heartlines and letters from our listeners. Last week, we talked about the, the tool and how to bring that home. And this is fun, I love talking with you about the different things that come up. 

Alona Pulde: And before we do, just to give our listeners a little bit of a summary of what we talked about last week was device use, what is too much, how do we approach using the device both for parents and for kids in a collaborative and meaningful way that really eliminates so much of the struggle that many parents, including us, have on a regular basis.

Matthew Lederman: And devices is a tough one. This is one that we regularly hear questions about. We have parents asking us, couples are fighting about what's the right amount. And the moral of the story is there's no such thing as the right amount or the perfect amount or the correct amount. It's about what meets needs for everybody [00:02:00] versus what doesn't and how can we collaborate?

So we're going to answer some questions in a little bit, but some of the headlines and heartlines, which is just hearing a little bit about. People's experiences. And one was interesting, which was from Jordan and. Her experience where she said that sometimes it feels like you guys don't get why I love my game so much So sometimes she says we do and then other times 

Alona Pulde: or Jordan being our daughter 

Matthew Lederman: Jordan beer Yes, that would be helpful to know so they you know And she'll say that you know just sees like I'm on my iPad and they think that the stuff that I watch It doesn't make sense or it's hurting my brain, but I really like it And I get to not only enjoy it, but I can connect with my friends about it.

So, she was expressing to us how she's not really seen and understood. You know, they watch this, there's this thing on, I still don't understand this, this day where they're watching people eating and it's making sounds. Oh, 

Alona Pulde: this new ASMR. 

Matthew Lederman: Yes, and I, and they love it. They find it relaxing. And I, it feels like my spine is itching, like, oh, I can't even watch it.

And, but at the same, but then Jordan. Got me on the cruise and I really wanted to watch this belly flop contest and I for 30 minutes I'm watching these guys on the on the boat dump in these huge guys and do the best belly flops and on Jordan came with Me and she goes dad. I don't understand why you like watching this She goes you make fun of my youtube videos and now I have to watch you watch a belly flop contest and I said, you know It's really good point.

What we find entertaining is everybody's Everybody's business, you know, is their business. Right. 

Alona Pulde: Everybody's different around 

Matthew Lederman: that, right? Exactly. And I, and I had a lot of care for Jordan when she said that. So, it doesn't so much matter if we can understand or, or relate to what they're enjoying, but the fact is they do.[00:04:00] 

And to connect to that the best we can, even if we wouldn't enjoy it ourselves in the same way. 

Alona Pulde: And I think that's an important point is yes, to connect with their experiences and to acknowledge and validate that there is a benefit that they're deriving from these devices, whether it's fun or play or simulation of life experiences that for right now they can't have, like traveling all over the world or creating fashions or, you know, some of the.

Like Minecraft or Roblox where they build these worlds that then they can play in and so can their friends. There's a new game now. I don't even know the name of it, but it's where kids are parents and they have their own children and their own lives. And so in that they're learning responsibility, I mean, our kids come, came back and said, wow, we didn't know kids were so much work.

So there's value that they're getting from these devices, not throwing the baby out with the bath water and validating that. Helps them feel heard at the same time. We as parents can still connect to our own concerns and share them with vulnerability in a way that's connecting and get the kids to. To learn more about that and to potentially connect, ideally, right?

They're connecting inter their own internal worries and their internal values become connected to concerns over overuse of devices. 

Matthew Lederman: Exactly. How can we get them to connect to that? Right. For example, there's a study showing that screen time and sleep finding that too much device usage can make it harder for kids to fall asleep.

So I know our kids hate it if they're stuck sleeping and in bed, but they're not able to actually fall asleep. They're just laying there [00:06:00] and to help them understand that what they're watching before they go to bed, how long before they go to bed, having device free time before bed. It helps them, and pointing that out, but not in a critical way, but in finding a collaborative way to still meet their needs if they're meeting with a device, but also to help them fall asleep with ease.

Alona Pulde: I love doing that collaboratively with the kids, where we're reading that stuff together, and they're not just hearing it from me, they're actually looking at these studies and these study results. And wrapping their own heads around it, that's how they connect internally to, that kind of awakens those concerns within them, separate from what I'm telling them.

Matthew Lederman: Yeah. They, they laugh at me though, cause I'll find these articles and I'll text it to them and the article will be about using your device less, but then I'm texting them on their device the article to read. So. 

Alona Pulde: Yes. You want me to do this on my device, Dad? 

Matthew Lederman: There's a lot of contradiction. 

Alona Pulde: Yeah. It 

Matthew Lederman: reminds me of the time when I was Trying to work on mindfulness and relaxation.

And I was reading this mindfulness relaxation book, but I put it, and it was all about trying to decrease my intensity. And I put it on two times speed, so I'm like intensely trying to relax here. So there's some contradiction in my life that I'm still working on. 

Alona Pulde: Yes. There was another one that we had, the parent struggle.

A dad from an online parenting group shared how his son spends hours watching YouTube videos. He says it helps him relax after school, but the dad was worried that his son's losing interest in other hobbies. Oh, and I absolutely hear that. It's a pain I share regularly when I see my kids on devices and I think of all of the other things that they could be doing that.

It could be fun for them. And I think that's the balance, [00:08:00] right? And we're all that ultimately it's, it's finding the balance of, because the device does serve a purpose and it can be relaxing and it can be stimulating and exciting and fun and. Educational even, and at the same time, how do you balance that virtual world from not losing an attachment and connection to the actual world?

Matthew Lederman: It's a balance, and that's where the collaboration not only makes it more effective, but makes it easier so that as a parent, you don't have to figure out all the answers. It's always surprising to me when you collaborate with your kids. And all of a sudden they come up with a solution that you're like, wow, that's a great idea.

I didn't even think about that. Then they get offended that I'm so surprised that they came up with a good idea. But I say, hey, just be happy that we're celebrating. It's really true though. They come up with these really cool strategies that meet all the needs. So you give them the needs. And help let them work to come up with a strategy to meet them versus you coming up with a strategy that works for them.


[00:09:01] [Commercial Break]
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[00:09:40] [End Commercial Break]
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Matthew Lederman: So here's a letter dear We be my parents or sorry my daughter and I argue almost every day about her phone I tell her it's bad for her health, but she just says I don't understand. How can I help help her see my perspective and with that one if your goal [00:10:00] is your need to be seen and your perspective to be understood and Validated it might not be The person to do that might not be your daughter at first.

If you want to be seen, understood for your frustration or your worry, that about health, maybe you get a friend or somebody else to do that at first. The goal when you're talking to your daughter is about connecting with her. And she's not going to care about your needs to be seen and understood and validated until she trusts that you see her and understand her and validate her.

So if you're not in a place to do that, or you're only doing that. as a means to get her to see and agree with you, you're not connecting at that point. So let's assume you got the empathy you needed and you're in a place where you want to connect with your daughter. Then you're coming with curiosity.

Hey, I wonder why my daughter wants to use her phone as much as she is. I wonder what my daughter thinks about health. I wonder, and you are curious and exploring that with her. And then later, after you have a really solid quality connection, you can ask her if she has space. to also see your concerns. But if she doesn't have space to see your concerns, even if you force her to listen, because you have the power as the parent, she's not really taking it in.

She's just Tuning it out and thinking about what she wants to think about until you're done. What are your thoughts? 

Alona Pulde: And we talk about that when you use that approach of, I'm going to tell them what to do. I'm going to use a more authoritarian or power over approach. It's not that it doesn't work per se.

You might achieve the result of getting them off the device. But we talked about when you put kids in those positions, they have two options. They're either going to submit or they're going to rebel. When they're younger, they will submit. Once they have enough independence, they will start [00:12:00] rebelling. And they, and what we teach them is instead of connecting internally to their own values, to their own reasons for why it's important to limit or to set boundaries around device use, then they are only listening to you as long as they have to.

And that's device, it's, you know, peer pressure and what they're doing with their friends, it's social media, it's junk food. I mean, it's across the border. If you are not teaching them how to make their own decisions, then they will more likely make bad ones when they're left to, you know, their own, their own choices.

Matthew Lederman: Yeah, all they'll think about is how do I not get in trouble? How do I get away from my parents who are getting in the way of me meeting my needs? Because that's what people are trying to do. They're trying to meet their needs. Whether you're an adult or a kid. So ideally, and often, you share the same values with your kids, even if you have different ways of trying to meet those needs.

Alona Pulde: Yes. And the more you try and squash it, the more you try and eliminate it, the more appealing it becomes. And so it, you raise the status of devices by just, by using a strategy of trying to take them away. It's like the forbidden fruit. You can't do that. Well, that's the only thing that I want to do now.

Matthew Lederman: Yeah, that's the goal is to get them to see the concerns that you have and the needs that aren't being met because they have a need for health as well, but they're not necessarily connected to it in the way you are. If you just get in the way, you're, IM, you're getting in the way or throwing a rule down, without that connection, you're not, you're not teaching them the needs that are important.

You're teaching them, Hey, my parents are getting in the way of [00:14:00] me. That's that, if anything, that's not meeting their needs for autonomy and choice and self-direction and care. 

Alona Pulde: And even when we talk to them, even in a collaborative approach around what not to do with a device. There's also the importance of sharing what they can do instead, connecting them to all the opportunities that are available to them in substitution of using the device, which is hanging out as a family, which is doing in person things with friends, which is engaging in hobbies and activities that they enjoy.

Really connecting a felt body experience to the intellectualization of don't do this. Yes. What do you do instead? 

Matthew Lederman: Yes, and instead of telling them don't do this, this is why we came up with that book. We have an e book called Jake and the Brain Beam Busters and it's all about helping them connect to the needs that are theirs that aren't being met.

Through the device, not that we're trying to get them off to the device, but get them to connect to their needs that they're being sort of attacked or, or these beams that come almost like, you know, from the Ghostbusters movie where the beams are coming out of their devices and, and holding and wrapping around their brain.

And it's preventing them from, you know, the, through the dings and the notifications and the streaks and the lights. Are keeping them attached in these beams, and then the kids don't have any control. So the kids then can see that, and they want to get rid of these beams. They don't, they want choice. They don't, they want independence.

They don't want to be controlled by their devices. And helping them understand that. And when you do that, all of a sudden, now you're on the same team instead of working against each other. 

Alona Pulde: Yes. And, and on that note, we got another letter from our listeners and the, the sum of it was that the whole family, parents and children, were on the devices way too much.

And the question was, how can we reset [00:16:00] and make screen time feel balanced? I think that's a great question. And we did talk about it. a bit on our episode on devices, but we can, in summary, one of the greatest things that can happen is a communication and conversation for families around concerns for device use.

What's everybody's kind, and this is not an attachment to what we do or don't do at the end of that connection, but really sharing vulnerably. What needs are met and are not met when using devices. Once kind of the whole family gets in on the same page around that, it's okay. What can we do as a family?

How do we negotiate moving forward and holding each other accountable for what? We think is the time we want to spend on devices and the time we really want to focus on other things. 

Matthew Lederman: And then you come up with a plan together. 

Alona Pulde: Yeah, and you talked a little bit about your tech plan. You want to give a, just a general summary.

of what that looks like. 

Matthew Lederman: Yes, so the Team Tech plan is starting with understanding your child and really finding out what do you love about using the device, how is it helping you, whether it's, and there's so many needs. There's the play, there's fun, there's skill and competence, doing things that you couldn't do in real life, creativity, exploration, connection with friends.

These are all really important needs that are met. And supported with the device. So helping them understand that you make that it makes sense. They love it so much. And you can see all the value it's providing without interrupting them, without judging them. And then afterwards, share your perspective.

Once they say, hey, you got me dead, I understand. I mean, you understand me. Then you [00:18:00] share your perspective and you talk about it. When you're on the tablet late at night, for example, it can make it harder for your brain to wind down and then you're trouble falling asleep and you're tired the next day.

Does that make sense too? So you're not only hearing them, but then you're sharing your perspective. You then brainstorm together what to do. What can we do to make sure you still have your phone with the device and still feel good the next day? Creating a plan together would be a step after that. Okay, let's write it Let's write down our agreements and what we're gonna do and then let's test it out and experiment and then the next day We're gonna come back or in that next weekend We're gonna come back and talk about it what worked well and what didn't and then you keep checking in and you and until you Refine it Until you find a plan that works for you and for them, but that's very important.

It's not about just what works for the parents. It's got to work for the kids too, and when the kids trust that you care about that, all of a sudden they can connect to the needs that you're worried about. 

Alona Pulde: Yes, and I think that really helps with two other letters that we got, one of them Was around kids hating it when the devices are taken away and the parent wanting to set limits but not wanting to be seen as the bad guy or Another parent wrote how their kids love screens and every time they they've been on to look that the parent says they've been on Too long the kids get upset.

So how do you explain the impact of devices in a way? They'll understand both of those Same thing, parents have an attachment to an outcome. I'm going to take the devices away. I'm going to explain to them what the impact is. And I think what's beautiful about the tech plan that you shared is it starts with validating and understanding the value that your kids are getting from these devices.

And we can relate to that, right? Because we to derive value from our devices. We use them regularly and [00:20:00] often we don't set the same limits on ourselves that we expect of our children. So starting with an understanding and a collaborative communication around what these devices are even offering and then getting to the concerns without an attachment to what the ultimate outcome will be.

And then as a family. Agreeing to what that looks like. 

Matthew Lederman: And when the desired outcome that you have as a parent doesn't come to fruition, check back in and, and not blame the child. Try to figure out where there was something that wasn't clear in the agreements or where we need to shift the agreements to make it more effective.

So for example, I used to say to Kylie, we're going to set the device time to use it for 30 minutes. And when that timer goes off, you're going to get off. I would say, do that and remember. And she has a hard time remembering. So if I was dependent upon her memory to set the alarm in the first place, and over and over again that wasn't happening, rather than get mad at her, say, What do we have to change?

And I talked to her about that. What do we have to change? Because I know it's hard to remember. I know you want to remember. And I know you want it. So I'm showing her good intention. I'm seeing her good intention. But asking her to come up with a plan that when she can't remember because For whatever reason, that's hard for her.

So how do we navigate that? Elena, what would you think about as far as creating new agreements? I mean, this happened with us recently where you said it was a little too complicated. I come, I came up with a plan and it wasn't working out and I sort of. This is one of the nice things about co parenting with a loan.

I could just tap, tap over to a loan and say, Hey, why don't you take a stab at this? And you came up and really simplified things and that really seemed to help. [00:22:00] 

Alona Pulde: Yeah. And, and, you know, for the first, so the agreement was basically it's 30 minutes and then the screen goes off. And then, you know, if you're done with.

You get 10 more minutes, five more, whatever that is. 

Matthew Lederman: Yeah, there was like, there was like three or four steps. 

Alona Pulde: Right. There were contingencies and Kylie is all about contingencies that affords her more time on these devices. So now she knows that 30 minutes and, and initially. It was hard for her to remember to set the alarm.

So, the agreement then became, okay, my job is going to be to remind you to set, to check in with you that the alarm is set, and then at 30 minutes it goes off. But after maybe doing that for a week or so, It became habitual for her, and now there are times where I'll even look over and think, did she remember?

And I'll ask, hey, Kylie, did you set the timer? Already on. I have 25 more minutes. Right? So she's aware and, and it's become part of her practice, but she's doing that. Willingly, not resentfully, and Yeah, and 

Matthew Lederman: that's the key, is that when we, I, I, I think this is also important, is that when I had the more complicated plan that had contingency A, B, C, through Z, I think, and it was something that Kylie came up with, too.

And part of it is honoring, if she wants to try that, that we go for it, and then when we can't do it, or she, then she sees that it's actually not working. And then she's more open to shift versus if I proactively say there's no way you're going to be able to navigate 26 contingencies and be successful.

And I said, no, we just have to limit this way. Without us trying, I don't build the goodwill and the trust for her to experience it and see that it doesn't work to then be willing to change it. 

Alona Pulde: Absolutely. I think it's really important to honor that. And I also think it's important. And I think. You guys [00:24:00] navigated that, in my opinion, quite in a, in a very connected way, is when the agreement fell through, now Kyla was already feeling bad about herself that she wasn't able to keep this agreement that she came up with.

So there's already self judgment and shame. And if you had come at her about her own failure to maintain the agreement. That only goes south. Instead it was, Hey, this isn't working. Let's go back to the drawing board and find something that could. 

Matthew Lederman: On all authenticity, I think the night that I'm thinking of I did come at her with criticism and then I repaired and recovered, but I did remember thinking like, we've worked so hard on these agreements and you said you would do it and you're not doing it.

And then she got angry. And I remember thinking, how dare you get angry? I'm like bending over backwards to do these agreements with you. And you're not, like, just have some accountability. And it was a very tender moment for me because later, she said to me, Dad, I actually felt really bad about myself. And I get angry, you know, because that helps me not feel bad about myself.

But I know that you're right. And then all of a sudden my inner critic's going like, Oh my God, you know, how, you should know better. How could you, you know, induce shame? But, you know, it's messy, but we got to this great connection. And it was really helpful for me to see that she wants to be successful.

There's, you know, parents think that when kids don't follow through with agreements, it's because they don't care. It's not. They're just balancing all these needs, coupled with balancing their capacity and skill. And it's really hard as a kid. But it's not that they don't care. It's not that they're not good kids.

It's that there's a lot of crap happening that they're trying to manage. And a lot of times, as a parent, I don't see it. And I think having the humility, and [00:26:00] later, you know, not only to repair, but to bring a loaner in. to help clean this up. It's really helpful to play off each other and play to each other's strengths.

Alona Pulde: Absolutely. Yes, I, I absolutely agree with that. And I think this is, that is even more relevant when the agreements are made under duress in the first place, which this one wasn't. But so often, you know, you engage your children in an agreement that they don't even want to really do. And so the ability for them to actually be accountable and to see it through is going to be that much less.

So the more we can collaborate upfront, the more likely that's going to be something that can come to fruition in a connected manner. And I think on that note, I want to share one of the things we got back was, uh, family's success story. And this family decided to sit down and create the family tech contract.

And together they agreed on limits, fun alternatives, and ways to check in about their plan. And they noted that now devices are less of a fight and more of a tool. And I love that. The notion of engaging in devices for a particular reason and particular purpose, but not being controlled or governed by the devices.

Matthew Lederman: I love it. Yeah. I love it. Well, I appreciate everybody writing in and, and sending us stuff and sharing vulnerably what, what works, what's not working for you. And it's just so fun to do this together and I appreciate it. And we'd love to hear more from people. Any questions, concerns, stories, successes. You know, misses, near misses, and just email us at parents at webetogether.

com. Again, we'd love to hear from you. And I think the, the, the final message I would leave with before we wrap is screens can bring joy and connection, but true balance [00:28:00] comes when we know when to step away and make space for life beyond the beams. And I love the beam. I like that quote because it talks about the beams that wrap around kids heads from the Brain Busters.

And it's so helpful. So thank you, Lona, for your time and support, especially with these tough moments every once in a while that I have. And I enjoyed doing this with you today. 

Alona Pulde: I always enjoy doing this with you. And to our listeners, if you enjoyed this episode, please leave us a review. Your feedback helps us reach more families and share the power of connection.

Your experiences and feedback are invaluable to us. 

Matthew Lederman: Please email us at parents at webetogether. com with your own cheers and tears, as well as any questions or stories you'd like to share. 

Alona Pulde: And we'd love for you to hit that subscribe button. Bye for now.