webe Parents
Welcome to "webe Parents" with Dr. Alona Pulde and Dr. Matthew Lederman! We're parents first, doctors second, and life coaches third, blending nutrition, lifestyle, and connection medicine with nonviolent communication to help families thrive. In each episode, we'll share our "Cheers & Tears," dive into our "Topic & Tool," go from "No Skills to Pro Skills," "Bring It Home," and wrap up with "One Last Thing." Join us as we share stories, skills, and tips to help bring your family closer together using our professional expertise.
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Dr. Matthew Lederman & Dr. Alona Pulde
webe Parents
EP. 40: How our Presence Shapes Connection-Letters from our listeners
Challenging highlights you'll want to hear:
In this episode of webe Parents, Matt and Alona dive into the uncomfortable truth: most of us walk around performing connection instead of living it. đ We force smiles, suppress our real feelings, and accidentally teach our kidsâand partnersâto do the same.
Theyâll unpack why authentic presence matters more than âgetting it rightâ and how chasing joy from the outside inleaves us disconnected from ourselves and those we love. đ
đ„ Hear about the viral moment when a parentâs tears on the first day of preschool overshadowed their childâs joyâand why missing those moments creates long-term disconnection.
đ„ Explore the danger of masking emotions with fake smiles, especially with kids who see right through us.
đ„ Learn why setting boundaries from a closed heart can backfire, and how embracing your messy, real self builds trust over time (even if it feels risky).
Have a Kinectin Account? Explore these Nudges to see how they apply to your own life â in a way only Amari can.
What is Amari?
webe Parents has partnered with Kinectin to bring you Amari, your personal AI coach. Now you can interact with the ideas from our podcasts, articles, and parenting tipsâand Amari will help you apply them directly to your personal life.
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Producer:Welcome to We Be Parents, where parent doctors Matthew Letterman and Alona Polday explore current parenting topics, share stories, and help bring families closer together.
Alona Pulde:Welcome back to We Be Parents. Last week... We explored a subtle but powerful shift, how the way we show up energetically can change not just how we feel, but how the world feels to us.
Matthew Lederman:Today, we're going to bring it home, though. We're going to really help people understand through some letters from our listeners and some headlines what it's like to practice and the ups and the downs and how to navigate them. You know, I think it's so... Interesting to me to really understand that your nervous system has the power to generate love, that we can shift our physiological states if we want to. When we get up in the morning, we are not these managers of our circumstances, but we can actually show up and shift how we show up, which affects not only the people around us, but it affects how we feel minute to minute. It's very powerful to really connect to that.
Alona Pulde:Very. You know, we talk about it on an intellectual level, the bi-directional messaging that comes from the body to the brain, the brain to the body. And, you know, you can feel happy thoughts and smile or you can smile and cultivate that sense of joy. And I love the The practice, as you practice and connect to, ooh, that really resonates, not just on an intellectual level, but in a felt sense.
Matthew Lederman:And it's so much more important, the felt sense. Yes. I'm all about intellect growing up. The only things that were valued were intellect and grades. And what do you think about that? And even if someone asks you how you feel, you actually tell them what you think. It's rarely do you share how you're feeling. But the felt sense is where that aliveness lives, right? And there's not only aliveness, there's wisdom in that felt experience. So, you know, when you let it shine, people feel it. And it's like a game changer. Yeah. And at the same time, I've been there, and I'm imagining there's people listening that are like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I know feelings are good, feelings are good, but they sort of blow it off a little bit. And my invitation is, is to really deepen into that felt experiential world. Because a lot of people think they're going to feel happiness when they get to some finish line. And no matter how much money you make, no matter what promotions you get, that is not where you create the joy that we're talking about.
Alona Pulde:Yeah, I think even if you can't get to the felt space yet, there's... This lives even in our intellect, how we think about our situations, how we think about our circumstances, and then how we think to show up. in that environment. And then slowly we start valuing the felt sense and then maybe connecting to that and seeing how differently that embeds.
Matthew Lederman:Yeah. I mean, when our spirits lead us instead of our thoughts, when our internal hearts and energy lead us instead of external, I like what you said last week. Do you want to share about the Yeah. I
Alona Pulde:think we often chase connection from the outside in. We were hoping to get seen by others, but really the most powerful shift that we can do for ourselves is to see ourselves. And when we do, when we fully see ourselves and show up, there's a natural shining that happens in that.
Matthew Lederman:Exactly. I love it.
Alona Pulde:But I think a lot of times we don't value that. One, because it's a standalone. So what if I see myself? We're programmed to seek external validation. We're programmed to strive for more, to strive for better, to get praise. All of that coming from the outside in. And we're not really taught to show up as ourselves to... live in our integrity and in the values that we hold dear.
Matthew Lederman:Yeah, exactly. And we can do a quick recap. Last week, we talked about this reverse fame circuit to feel the warmth in our body, let it generate the smile and the love and offer that as a gift, not a test to other people. And they respond to you You know, like I was experiencing on the mountain. I talked about that last week. They respond to you in a way that I imagine when you're famous, people come up to you and are like, oh, you know, they're smiling and you're really being seen. And you can show up in a way that creates that sense of connection and love and being seen by people without being famous.
Alona Pulde:Yeah. I love that. And the reminder for me also is the mirror neurons that happen. I often think of the movie Inside Out, which I thought was a brilliant movie in reminding us of the different parts that live within us. But we all have a joy. We all have a sadness. We all have an anger. We all have a fear. We all have a disgust. And they all live together. And the If anger has been the resonant voice and that's how we choose to show up, sometimes we need that help. Your joy allows my joy to get connected to that, allows my joy to come back alive and back online. And so you choosing that path really invites and gives permission to others to do the same. And it just is a reciprocal thing. that just is a gift that keeps giving.
Matthew Lederman:Yeah, and when we lead with gardenists, we get that gardenist back.
Alona Pulde:Yes.
Matthew Lederman:You know, whatever we put out there, we tend to get back.
Alona Pulde:When we turn fear online, you know, that's the visual image that I get. You know, when I'm running on my fear, I'm inviting your fear to come back online.
Matthew Lederman:Yeah. And we want our kids to talk to us, but when they talk to us and we're not present, it feels so deflating that they stop talking to us. So I gave the example last week about the watermelon and Jordan sharing her watermelon. And I could have easily been busy and be like, oh yeah, that's great, Jordan. I'm glad your watermelon was good. Versus really be with her. She was celebrating and feeling joy around that and taking a minute to really just be
Alona Pulde:with her. Oh, I like that. That's rich, actually, because what you just connected to and what I'm going to name is that your mirror neurons will only fire if you're present to allow that to happen. So her celebration, if you're present to that, your mirror neurons have an opportunity to rise and to meet that. But if you're distracted in the past or in the future or completely somewhere else, there's no opportunity for that mirroring to happen.
Matthew Lederman:Yes, yes. And then we start... having blocks of our life energy would then create these coping mechanisms. So I'm sure, you know, lots of people, including myself, have been with, you know, as kids trying to share something, could have been with a parent or a teacher, and you didn't get the sense that they really heard you, saw you, and received you. So you start to tone yourself down and not share as a way to avoid that pain. So If the parents want that connection, you have to show up in a way that creates an environment where they feel safe and excited to share. And if you've created that wound, which we all do to some extent, we do the best we can as parents, you can heal that by naming it and practicing it and rebuilding that trust.
Alona Pulde:Yeah, I love that. I love that. So should we dive into some of the stories we wanted to share?
Matthew Lederman:Go ahead.
Alona Pulde:All right. Parents actually from Las Vegas shared a heartfelt moment on TikTok that went viral. They dropped off their three-year-old son for his first day of preschool. Both parents found themselves overwhelmed with emotion. The mom captured the moment in a video showcasing the genuine tears and feelings that many parents experience during these milestones. And the boy, on the other hand, had a wonderful day and was eager to return to school, highlighting the contrast between the parents and the children. That's a moment of watermelon growth. you know, that was missed because here's this child so excited to come back to school and we're caught up in our own story and our own emotion, not present to the moment, not present to their experience, not even able. And in that presence, not even able or in that lack of presence, not even able to hold both.
Matthew Lederman:Right. And that makes it very difficult to, for the child to show up fully if the parent gets hijacked by their own experience. Now, that happens, but what we can do is we can name it. We can even say, hey, I see how excited you are and I'm getting caught up with something in me. Can we come back and I can celebrate with you fully because I need to tend to this for a minute or two. That honesty also preserves authenticity while also holding space for their needs. And then you can come back and do it later.
Alona Pulde:Yes, that's the both and. And or, you know, and as you graduate and in the black belt scenario is, I see how excited you are and how happy you are, and I'm going to miss you. And those are my tears. Yeah. The both and. So that... There's opportunity for, there's space for both of those truisms.
Matthew Lederman:And if you don't name the both and, and you either focus on yourself, that's going to be disconnecting. But if you try to force your sadness down and pretend that you're celebrating them, it's still not going to feel right. That happens a lot with empathy, where people are angry. but they're using empathic words and the other person doesn't soften because their body knows that what that person's saying and what they're feeling are incongruent.
Alona Pulde:Yes. It's not authentic and it's felt.
Matthew Lederman:So what matters is what's felt, not the words coming out of your mouth. That's a core principle of nonviolent communication consciousness. It has nothing to do with the words. It's about the energy behind the words. So another story is this from a few years ago where a mother and a child with severe autism shared her experiences of masking her true feelings with a fake smile. And she used that to navigate social expectations and judgments. And she described the emotional toll of constantly appearing composed while dealing with challenging situations, emphasizing the need for authenticity and the courage to express genuine emotions. And we've talked about that where... And it actually is quite off-putting when someone has this permagrin and smile, but we know that they can't be... And in fact, they'll be smiling as they're talking about trauma or sadness or they're upset or they're anger, and it's just a smile all the time. And there's a disconnection there. It's a little bit... Well, it's incongruent, right?
Alona Pulde:Oh, yeah. And you feel that. You... It's almost, you know, you described it in the last episode when you're taking a picture and you smile and you're not really feeling that joy. And we talk about it, you don't see it in their eyes. And so it's a permagrin, but there's sadness or flatness in their eyes. And so that inauthenticity, that That lack of congruence creates a tension that you're not sure what to do with. And we talked about that in the last episode too. Presence doesn't mean... Yes, it's beautiful when... We can connect to joy, but not every moment we can cultivate that joy. You know, some moments are sad and some moments stimulate anger. And so being authentic is allowing for all of those and being present is allowing for all of those. But in that vulnerable presence, there's a magic that happens too. And I talked about it in the last episode previously. But I'll just summarize it here is that I use music often to, I don't even connect to that, but like to express my own emotions when they're hard for me to express. But you guys know that now. And when you're hearing a song that says, oh, Alana's feeling sad, there's this beautiful empathic presence that I get from music. from you, from Jordan, from Kylie, allowing me to be seen because that's the whole point. We want to be seen. We also want to learn how to cultivate joy because that's something that is foreign and we don't do enough of. But there's also that desire to be seen in our authenticity, which ironically is, I think, what allows us down the line to cultivate the joy because it provides that safety to do so.
Matthew Lederman:Right. And an important caveat is we want to be seen with our full authentic selves. We want to be seen with our full aliveness and have that be received.
Unknown:Mm-hmm.
Matthew Lederman:Because a lot of people to belong will make themselves small or shrink or hide part of themselves. And even if you're seen, but you're not authentic, you don't feel fully alive. It doesn't meet the need.
Alona Pulde:Right. You strive harder to be seen for who you're not.
Matthew Lederman:Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And it doesn't work. It's interesting with the smile and the picture, you said that for me... I can't hide how I'm feeling. You said that people always know how I'm feeling. And I noticed that if I try to smile in pictures, it'll look fake unless I'm really connecting to my body about what I'm happy about. So it's interesting that, I wonder if that's a common thing for people or, you know, are models just always feeling joy or what do you think?
Alona Pulde:Well, I think, you know, Professional actors learn to either connect to that emotion. A lot of method actors do that, right? They connect to whatever the emotion is, whether it's an unpleasant or pleasant one, and really dive into that space so that they can personify it.
Matthew Lederman:Yes. Well, the good news is if anybody sees me, you'll know exactly how I'm feeling.
Alona Pulde:Yes, yes, you, yes.
Matthew Lederman:This episode of We Be Parents is brought to you by We Be Calm. The ChildCalmer designed by doctors and loved by parents.
Alona Pulde:Struggling with bedtime routines or managing your child's anxiety? WeBeCalm transforms deep breathing into a fun and engaging activity, helping kids find their inner calm. Perfect for bedtime stressful moments or any time your child needs a little extra help to stay calm. Visit WeBeCalm.com to learn more and bring tranquility to your family. We be calm because we be in this together.
Matthew Lederman:All right, so let's jump into letters from our listeners.
Alona Pulde:Yeah.
Matthew Lederman:Want to do the first one?
Alona Pulde:Sure. So we got a letter that started with, I really resonated with the idea of smiling from warmth, not performance. But when I tried it with my 11-year-old after school, they just rolled their eyes. It felt like rejection. Am I doing something wrong? Oh, yes. Yes. We hit upon that.
Matthew Lederman:You say, yes, they're doing something wrong?
Alona Pulde:No, yes, that's a pain point. That's an absolute pain point. I hear you and I feel you. And we talked about that last time because I think that's the hardest part for parents is not only to be present to what you're experiencing, but to be differentiated enough To stand in that presence regardless of the feedback that you're getting from your external environment, a.k.a. your children. And it's hard. It's so, so hard. I notice that sometimes. I have those episodes where I'll share something that I'm really excited about with the girls or an experience that we're going to have. And all I hear back from them is why that won't work, you know, completely deflating my balloon. And I noticed the shift from this joy that I just experienced to anger and resentment. And, you know, so it is hard and it's a beautiful practice to be able to stay present to our experience and regardless of... of how other people react to that.
Matthew Lederman:You have to summon Ted Lasso.
Alona Pulde:Yes, Ted Lasso, our new favorite show. But yes, he is a great model of just being himself, regardless of the circumstances, regardless of what he gets back. He is stable and solid and lovable in that state.
Matthew Lederman:Yeah. And to be able to show up, it's a skill that you practice, to be able to show up and not expect anything back.
Alona Pulde:Yes.
Matthew Lederman:And that you're sharing and that you can meet all of your needs, even if that person doesn't contribute to your needs in that moment. So you practice that, and sometimes you want something back. But if you need something back, your offering is really a demand. It's the ability to put something out there and, you know, and... You don't have to be okay with it. You don't have to be okay with them not giving you something back that you were hoping for. But you can empathize with them and yourself. And that, to me, that's where the nonviolent communication comes in is, oh, I know they care about me. Something must be going on for them that's preventing them from giving me what I just asked for.
Alona Pulde:Yes, and I'm also wondering, you know, we talk about bringing it home, and one of the things about bringing it home is really explaining, inviting, and practicing it. When this is a new behavior that you're adopting, and you have not sat with your family, it's foreign to them, there's a lack of trust sometimes. And so it's kind of like, hmm. What's going on here? Or what's behind that? What's coming at me? Versus, oh, this is my mom or my dad practicing and cultivating joy.
Matthew Lederman:Yeah. When we change our relational energy, other nervous systems need time to build trust with that.
Alona Pulde:Mm-hmm. So part of the eye rolling could be, I don't understand it. I'm uncomfortable with it. I'm interpreting it as something completely different than what it is. And so even in those moments, and I found that that has worked actually really well with the girls, is if I stop and rather than react to their response, I take a beat and and decide how I want to show up and show up with curiosity, not with judgment, and just say, hey, you know, I'm wondering what came up with that eye rolling.
Matthew Lederman:Yeah, it's a really, it's really good practice because if you could show up with curiosity, you are in that nonviolent communication consciousness, an NBC consciousness. The curiosity to say, well, if, you know, and this happens when you and I get in an argument and I'll say, okay, You know, you'll ask the question, you know, where's my phone? And I'll say, the phone's on the table. And you'll be like hurt and annoyed. You say, why are you yelling at me? And I'm just asking you for my phone. And I'll think to myself, I could initially get defensive and say, I wasn't yelling at you. I was yelling to you where your phone was. Then we start arguing about whether I was yelling at you or not. Versus curiosity would be, well, I know I wasn't yelling at her, or at least that wasn't what I was trying to communicate. So I'm curious, how did she hear me? And then she says, I said, oh, so did you hear me yelling at you? Like I was, you thought I was, you then had a thought that I was frustrated or irritated or impatient. And you say, yes. And I'll say, oh, well, I can see why you feel hurt and sad when you ask for your phone and you, and you think that you're getting back irritation, right? So now my curiosity allowed me to empathize with you and not take on water. And I can say, of course she got sad and hurt if she thought I was communicating irritation. Even though I wasn't trying to communicate irritation, I get it. That allows you, to me, that's the beauty of nonviolent communication.
Alona Pulde:So if you've been listening to us for a while, you know we get a lot of questions about what to do in tricky parenting or relationship moments.
Matthew Lederman:Yeah, and if I'm being real, I'm asking Alona those same questions all the time. I get into those same tricky moments as everybody else does. And as much as we wish we could be there for each other in those exact moments, we just can't always be.
Alona Pulde:Yeah, that's why we partnered with the amazing team at Connectin to create something we truly believe in, an AI coach called Amari. And we didn't just lend our names, we helped build it and train it and brought in everything we've learned about emotional healing, connection and communication.
Matthew Lederman:Yeah, we spent years training and learning and we've created Amari who is so calm and grounded, listens deeply and responds with warmth, clarity and compassion. There's no judgment, no reactivity. In fact, we tasked our children with trying to get Amari reactive and they still haven't succeeded. It's just steady support when you need it most.
Alona Pulde:We use it ourselves all the time, especially when we feel stuck or overwhelmed. And Amari's really helped us pause, reflect, given us insight that helps us come back to each other.
Matthew Lederman:We designed Amari to help you strengthen the relationships that matter most, starting with the one you have with yourself.
Alona Pulde:And we are so excited that you can try it now at WeBeParents.com and click on WeBeConnecting with a K to sign up. And when you have your Amari moment, please let us know as we'd love to hear about it.
Matthew Lederman:So another letter here is, I've been trying to bring more presence to our family moments, but my partner seems irritated by it. Like I'm being too much or over earnest. What do I do when I'm trying to change the field, but I feel alone in it? Well, I get it. There's no such thing as too much. When somebody says you're too much, They imply that they know exactly the right amount and that they're the judge of that. And that's just, that's not true. There's no such thing as a right amount of anything. And if you're being honest and wanting to connect in a way that isn't resonating for them, then translate what they're saying to be like, that's about them. There's something in them that's not resonating with how I'm communicating or how I'm showing up. And it doesn't mean that how I'm showing up or communicating is wrong. And then I'm going to be curious. I wonder what it is. What thoughts, what stories are forming in their head in response to my communication?
Alona Pulde:I also think that many of us are conditioned in a right-wrong mentality. And we know the right... way to show up the right uh level of emotion to express vulnerability is wrong you shouldn't be this vulnerable or you shouldn't express emotions so freely you should be more guarded more reserved more composed um more stable whatever that means then If you start showing up differently, start showing up with more vulnerability, it's threatening. Because if all of a sudden the way you're showing up is right, that says the way I'm showing up is wrong, versus, oh, you can show up differently and I like it, I don't like it, it's resonating, it's not resonating. But there's no space to do that when we're in that right-wrong mentality. And then separate from that is that I think vulnerability... Because it's not a practice that we do regularly. It feels threatening to a lot of people.
Matthew Lederman:Yeah. I think the nervous system, anytime there's a change, even though it might be a change to increase connection, they're going to say, something's off here. And is this dangerous? Is this emotionally dangerous? So that's where it's helpful to actually name your shift. And I'm trying to practice being in my body more. I'm trying to practice connecting to joy more. I'm trying to practice being Sharing more authentically. And if at any point this feels uncomfortable, you're not clear what I'm doing or not trusting what I'm doing, just let me know so I can do it differently. That builds trust by letting them know. It also gives them an invitation to bring up their discomfort if it comes out at any point. Because you don't want to just focus on what you want to do differently. You want to focus on the connection between you and the other person, which means it also matters how they're receiving what you're doing differently.
Alona Pulde:I think it also disarms them because a lot of the times when we're being nice, you know, kill them with kindness. We want something back. And so it's, hmm, all of a sudden this person's being really nice and vulnerable. What is lurking behind that door number two here?
Matthew Lederman:Right. Either something bad happened they're going to tell me later or... They want something, but there's an ulterior motive.
Alona Pulde:Yes. Versus, no, this is just kind of how they want to be separate, that differentiation. And that you don't have to go there if you're not ready to go there. That's a lot of times partners or parents and children are enmeshed. We... kind of live attached to one another versus separately. There's me, there's you, no, there's us. So is us feeling okay? Are we feeling vulnerable? Are we, you know, but that isn't the state. It's there's you and how you're feeling and there's me and how I'm feeling. And if I feel pressured to do what you're doing, yeah, that's going to be off-putting and it's going to be disconnecting. And I'm not going to welcome Right. So I love that. So this is another example of really bringing it home by starting with explaining what you're doing and and inviting a space, even if people don't want to jump on board the train, inviting a space for you to be experiencing that.
Matthew Lederman:I like it. I like it. Let's do you want to do one more letter and then we can jump into the. The game, tension trade-offs.
Alona Pulde:Ooh, okay. Okay, we got this letter. This episode made me realize how often I've smiled while feeling resentment. How I've offered connection as currency, not as a gift. How can I repair that? I love, I love... Naming the opportunity to repair, that's already beginning the process, is trusting that you can do it differently. And just because this is how it's been done doesn't lock you in to this fixed family dynamic. And I think it's important to honor that so many of us are living in survival mode. I catch myself in that so often. And in survival mode, I'm guarded. I'm scanning for danger. I have a small, constricted, fear-based scarcity mentality. And so there is that trade-off. To be connected, to be joyful, I need something back. Versus this is how I can show up just because this is how I choose to show up because it makes me feel more alive, because it makes me feel better in my own body.
Matthew Lederman:Yeah, and I think it's important that trust builds not from these big gestures, but from this consistent congruence and this open communication about, hey, this is what's going on inside of me. If I'm not sure what to do, I always go vulnerable. I always think that that's the beginning of connection. If you're not sure where to go, share what's going on inside of you, even if that's confusion around where to go next.
Alona Pulde:You don't feel like smiling. Don't smile. Yeah. That's what's authentic. That's what's real. That's you owning your present moment.
Matthew Lederman:Exactly. And it's so important because if you've been smiling all the time and you stop, your partner is going to say, what's going on here? And at the same time, if you keep smiling when you're feeling different things... Your partner is going to be saying, what's going on here?
Alona Pulde:Or you build a resentment that then makes connection currency over something that's desired.
Matthew Lederman:Right. And if you're on the other end of it, to know that this person is not consistently smiling because they have nothing better to do. It's coming often from a wounded place. And they were more accepted when they smiled or that's what was allowed. Or if they didn't smile, the parents got all into their business or whatever. So to create an environment where it feels safer for them not to smile, you can really contribute to your partner by helping them create a space of safety if they're open to sort of just gently, not that you know it's right to not smile when they're not happy, but more just to say, hey, do we want to start stepping into authenticity? Would it be helpful to you if I did X, Y, or Z to create a safer container For you to show up just a little bit more authentically. And what could that look like for you?
Alona Pulde:Yeah. I think the invitation is to practice cultivation of joy as part of that sense of feeling more alive in joy. But really, it's about being seen. Being seen in the full capacity of where you are in the moment. Exactly. So remembering that.
Matthew Lederman:I love it.
Alona Pulde:All right. So what's this game we're playing?
Matthew Lederman:So this game, we're going to try it out. It's, I don't know if it's really a game or more of like, you know, questions, but basically I'm going to give you a dilemma and I'm going to give you two choices and ask you some, some questions about it. Okay.
Alona Pulde:Oh boy. Oh boy. I'm on the spot. Okay. You're on the spot.
Matthew Lederman:Okay. So your child is yelling
Alona Pulde:and
Matthew Lederman:you're already on edge. Do you set the boundary calmly, but firmly, even if your tone is flat and your heart is closed? Or do you wait until you can access warmth, even if that means not setting a limit in the moment? So let's answer that one first.
Alona Pulde:Oof, I have to pick one of those?
Matthew Lederman:Yeah.
Alona Pulde:Ah! I don't like any of those. I would probably set a boundary calmly but firmly, but my town would be flat and my heart would be closed.
Matthew Lederman:Yeah. And that's something that we all have these bad experiences choices to make. And it's like, what do we, what do we do? But if you had to pick one and then, you know, right now you're grounded and you could say, okay, well, here's what I would do differently.
Alona Pulde:Yes.
Matthew Lederman:So I'll give you a chance to answer that. If now that I forced you to pick one, it's
Alona Pulde:all right. I would, I would want to be able to express where I'm at and to, to ask for some grace and, You know, even if that means not setting the limit in the moment. Yeah. It probably depends on how unresourced I am, too.
Matthew Lederman:Right. That affects us, for sure. I'm already on edge, so. You're already on edge. You're under-resourced. What part of you is more scared, the part that hates disconnection or the part that fears chaos?
Alona Pulde:Oh, I hate disconnection.
Matthew Lederman:Yeah,
Alona Pulde:really. That was an easy one.
Matthew Lederman:All right. And what does your child learn from your timing about safety, authority, and availability? What does your child learn from your timing? Because I think that's the challenge. We're like, we got to do this right now, or we got to respond right now. And I know that was one of my big ones. And you actually like to wait and say, okay, I'm going to let that... I'm not ready to answer that question yet.
Alona Pulde:Yeah. And often I can do that. But when I'm already on edge, when I've had enough, and it's funny because the girls... very much know that. They're like, oh, we know you've had enough because then the boundary comes harsh. And the message is very clear. I have had enough. This is over. This is my way now. But I think that's what they... You know, they learn, like, if that happens regularly, there's an inconsistency, a lack of trust around how your parent is going to respond. And then there's that authoritarian power over dynamic that slowly builds over time.
Matthew Lederman:Yeah. And
Alona Pulde:I think in a... Power over dynamic, it works very, very well as long as your children submit. But when they start rebelling, that's when that whole thing comes to a head, which is why the teenage years are so challenging for so many people.
Matthew Lederman:Yeah, yeah, makes sense. So can you name a moment this week where doing it right overrode doing it real? So right versus real? That happened for you this week?
Alona Pulde:Oh, yes. So, yes, because it was a pain point. I got triggered so much that I couldn't show up the way that I hoped that I would. And it was the girls had a disagreement. I don't want to get into the disagreement, but it was a pretty big one. And I felt... sadness for both of them, but above that was the sadness and their disconnection and, you know, getting kind of sucked into, oh my God, they're never going to talk to one another again. They hate each other. And can't they just see their sisters? Sisters have to ride above everything else, you know? Um, and so I think it was doing it real, um, But it definitely wasn't doing it right. You know, I mean, I had to really bite my tongue. And I think the lack of congruence there was very visible, even though my words were calm and my words aimed at connection. The energy behind that was so urgent, an urgent need for repair. We need to figure out how to fix this quickly. Yeah. And I think that has cost.
Matthew Lederman:Yeah. And now, I mean, some of these disconnections are pretty big. We had to do a whole ride to school just to hear each other's feelings and needs. And then you had to do a redo on the way home. We couldn't even fit it into one ride to school. So sometimes it just, and their bodies, their nervous system needed time. The night before and then that morning and then by the next afternoon, it was ready to shift. So sometimes it's a lot of people think you can get all needs handled and connection completed in one conversation. And often it's multiple.
Alona Pulde:Yes. Let's do another one.
Matthew Lederman:You pick one for me.
Alona Pulde:Okay. Okay. So your partner is missing the moment. Do you... Swallow your disappointment to keep peace in front of the kids or name it, even though it might rupture the moment for everyone. So your partner isn't present to a moment.
Matthew Lederman:I would probably, if I was resourced, I would swallow it to keep the peace. And if I was under resourced, I probably name it and blow up the whole thing.
Alona Pulde:Ooh, that's, well, yes, I definitely under-resourced. I resonate with that. But I think if you're resourced, you don't swallow it. You show up. I'm saying if I had to pick between these two. Oh, got it.
Matthew Lederman:Yeah. If I'm resourced and didn't have to pick between these two, this is like a would you rather. So it's not, you know, neither is great. But if I'm resourced, then I'm actually going to name it with connection.
Alona Pulde:Yes. I'm realizing I don't do well with DRA. I always look
Matthew Lederman:for that. You don't like DRA. What's option C? Yeah. And the kids always have like, would you want to eat a spider or a scorpion?
Alona Pulde:Neither.
Matthew Lederman:You got to pick one.
Alona Pulde:Okay. What story does your body tell you about being too much or too little or not being heard or seen? That
Matthew Lederman:is one. I have these parts that I call the garter and the neater. And the neater is like, wants to be received with warmth and love and care. And the garter is the one that says, hey, Let's tone it down. Make yourself a little smaller. Why don't you want a little bit less so that you don't get disappointed? So that's how I have these two parts that are. And actually, the other day, I was standing and picking up the kids from a theater class. And there was this group of women talking. And my instinct went, you know, because there's a little bit of social anxiety, I would call it, where I'm like, oh. They're not going to necessarily want to talk to me or whatever the reason was. And my initial instinct was to go sit on a chair and get on my phone and actually literally get smaller. But instead, what I did was I said, oh, look, there's the garter showing up to try and protect me from not, like if I did speak up, I wouldn't have been received or they wouldn't have responded, let's say. So the garter was trying to protect against that. So I definitely am seeing that dynamic now. And at this time, I actually didn't get on my phone and I stood there and I said, okay, well, let me see if I can connect to a smile. But I think it was one of those creepy smiles that was like, like I was forcing it because I was still a little nervous or whatever. So, hey, I'm baby steps here.
Alona Pulde:Yes.
Matthew Lederman:But I at least stood there. I didn't get small. I stood there with my creepy smile and was all good.
Alona Pulde:Oh, that's funny. And if you were to rupture the moment for everyone else, what does that teach your kids about rupture, repair? If I
Matthew Lederman:was going to rupture the world, what does that teach the kids?
Alona Pulde:Yeah, if you rupture the moment, if you show up.
Matthew Lederman:Oh, it definitely teaches them how to disconnect. They can do that well on their own, though, so they don't need my help.
Alona Pulde:And repress and suppress, I think, their authenticity. Show up in artificial harmony because there's such a big cost.
Matthew Lederman:Yes, that's a good one.
Alona Pulde:To show up authentically.
Matthew Lederman:Exactly. Ditto.
Alona Pulde:But I think, and this goes back to the first letter from the listener, I think this is where the value of knowing that there's that opportunity for repair. Now, that's something that I did not connect to when the girls were fighting was there will be room for repair. There will be room for, I didn't trust that in that moment. And probably because I was under-resourced and because it just seemed so big to me. Yeah. So.
Matthew Lederman:It's sort of like when we talk about this with families when we're doing, And to remind them when there's a big fight, I pause it and I'll step back and I'll say, hey, you know, we have a lot of trust. We worked together for quite some time. And every time there's been a disconnection, by the end of the connected conversation, you both are seeing each other's beautiful needs that were behind the pain that you were feeling. So can we just step back and remember that and trust that we're going to get there again, even if it feels right now really big? And I think that those exercises sort of stepping out are really helpful. And then you build that trust that, hey, we'll get there. But it's hard when you're in the heat of the moment to say, hey, they've disconnected many a times and every single time they've repaired and reconnected. But for some reason in the heat of the moment, we forget that.
Alona Pulde:Yes, yes. Yeah, so that's a good one to remember. Repair is a good one to remember.
Producer:Just one last thing.
Alona Pulde:You don't have to have a perfect smile. You don't have to pretend to be someone you're not. There's room for you. There's room for your authenticity. There's space to choose yourself. How you want to show up and to lean into that. You don't have to be perfect.
Matthew Lederman:I love that. There is space for your full self to be seen and held.
Alona Pulde:Even if you're the one seeing and holding it. Yeah. Which is really the ultimate lesson.
Matthew Lederman:Very sweet. Wonderful. Well, we'd love to hear from people. We really appreciate you listening. Please reach out to us at parents at WeBeTogether.com. And then, of course, we really appreciate if you would subscribe and rate and review the podcast. It helps us spread the word and get out there. And we really appreciate everybody's support.
Alona Pulde:Yes, and please send us your letters, send us your questions, send us your comments. Thank you very much for listening.
Matthew Lederman:Thank you for writing.