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Ep. 52: Chased by Love, Cornered by Truth: Are You Brave Enough to Hear Your Child’s “Gift”? 🎁🔥

• Matt Lederman & Alona Pulde • Season 1 • Episode 52

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You’ll hear Matt & Alona flip the script on “feedback” — turning unmet needs into a loving gift that deepens trust instead of detonating connection. They walk through real moments at home, show you how to receive a “gift” with genuine excitement (yes, even when it stings), and model the exact words to repair without defensiveness. You’ll also hear Alona’s raw confession about a parenting moment that cut against her core values — and how her daughter’s “I have a gift” became the bridge back to closeness.

Challenging highlights you’ll want to hear:

  • “The Gift” mindset: share unmet needs without blame so the other person actually feels invited to love you better — and you stay out of the shame/defense spiral. 
  • Why apologies often backfire (too early = about you), and the step-by-step repair that lands: receive, reflect feelings/needs, express regret, then share your intentions last. 
  • Gamifying receptivity so kids feel safe giving feedback (hello, $10 rule or special privileges) — because silence ≠ happiness. 

Moments that will challenge you (and are worth leaning into):

  1. Alona’s “I let her out of the car” story — a 5-second decision that violated her deepest value of “I will not abandon you,” and the brave repair that followed. 😳❤️‍🩹 
  2. Translating attacks into needs: hearing “You’re always late” as a plea for reliability, predictability, and mattering — then responding without excuses. 🧭 
  3. Teaching teens to bring you the hard stuff: if you’re not getting “gifts,” they’re probably suppressing — and distance grows in that silence. 🧠➡️💬 

Have a Kinectin Account? Explore these Nudges to see how they apply to your own life — in a way only Amari can.

Nudge: “When my kid challenges me or uses a harsh tone, I react with defensiveness or control. I want to try ‘The Gift’ instead. Help me translate what I’m hearing into their feelings/needs and coach me to respond with empathy before I explain myself.”

What is Amari? webe Parents has partnered with Kinectin to bring you Amari, your personal AI coach. Now you can interact with the ideas from our podcasts, articles, and parenting tips — and Amari will help you apply them directly to your pesonal Life. Don't have a Kinectin Account? Create one here
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To learn more about what Alona & Matt are up to check us out at webeparents.com, or follow us on our socials at Instagram, Facebook, TikTok, or YouTube. Be sure to subscribe to webe Pärents wherever you listen to your favorite podcasts.

Alona:

Hey there! We'd love for you to hit that subscribe button. By subscribing, you're helping us spread the word and connect with more amazing people like you.

Producer:

Welcome to We Be Parents, where parent doctors Matthew Letterman and Alona Poulday explore current parenting topics, share stories, and help bring families closer together.

Alona:

Welcome to We Be Parents, where we help families grow closer across generations, whether you're raising young kids, navigating the partnership with your spouse, or trying to reconnect with your own parents. This space is for you. Hi, everyone. I'm Dr. Alona Polday.

Matt:

And hi, I'm Dr. Matthew Letterman.

Alona:

And what are we talking about today, Matt?

Matt:

We are talking about the gift.

Alona:

The gift. I'm really trying to avoid that. So let's talk about how you're doing.

Matt:

Today's episode, you don't want to talk about the gift.

Alona:

Oh boy.

Matt:

It was a tough gift.

Alona:

Yes, it was a tough gift. So what is the gift?

Matt:

Well, we'll focus on how I'm doing first.

Alona:

Let's focus on how you're doing.

Matt:

I'm doing well. A little bit tired. Last night Jordan said to me, Dad, it's probably not a good idea that you stay up late and work at night. And I said, I think that's true. And then he stayed up and worked. And then I stayed up late and worked then. So she's gonna give me uh she's gonna yell at me tonight. She'll give you a gift. She might give me a gift. No, but but the gift, the gift is cool. But before we do that, how are you doing?

Alona:

I am actually doing uh fairly well. I am uh already embarrassed for myself and the story that I'm about to tell, but uh building resilience here.

Matt:

I think if we're not feeling embarrassed, we're not being vulnerable enough, is what uh last year I went off about the customer service.

Alona:

Yes.

Matt:

Very embarrassing.

Alona:

Oh yeah. This one's right there next to you.

Matt:

So the gift is all about making your unmet needs feel like a gift when they're expressed to another person. Right now, if somebody does something that we don't like, we used to communicate. Most people are used to communicating what when their needs aren't met by what the other person did is wrong, by what's wrong with the other person, by and labeling them as something such as inconsiderate or disrespectful or disobedient or non-compliant, whatever the label of the day is.

Alona:

Right.

Matt:

So of course, hearing feedback doesn't feel good because you're about to be labeled and people are gonna see anything but your good intentions. On the flip side, in nonviolent communication, Marsha Rosemer used to say, How can sharing your unmet needs not be a gift to the other person? He said, You should share your unmet needs as if it's like Santa Claus coming to give you a gift. And you say, Ho, ho, ho, guess what? I have needs that weren't met. And it sounds a little funny, right? But when your needs are about you, not what the other person did that's wrong, and you're basically saying, These are my needs, and I would love people to help contribute to meeting my needs more effectively in the future. But it's not about what the other person did that's wrong. So a lot of times because we're in that old mindset of judge them to the other person, we think our needs are gonna be heavy, weighty, and land as criticism. But if we can shift our mindset, that's the first step before we can even shift other people's mindsets. But don't think of it as what the other person did was wrong. Think about these unmet needs and the other person's doing the best they can. And now you're gonna give them an opportunity to help even more.

Alona:

I think it's really powerful. It it sounds like it's an opportunity to disconnect, but it's really truly creates a deeper connection between two people when you are able to give and receive a gift. And, you know, a lot of the times we face situations where we are criticized or we feel criticized or judged or blamed or shamed or whatever that is. And rather than approach it with authenticity and vulnerability and connection, we create disconnection by turning away from the person, allowing our hurt to create that space, you know, because we're not showing, we're not coming to, for lack of a better word, confront the other person on how what they on the impact of what they shared. Yeah. And so instead we kind of bury it. But you never really bury anything. You know, even if you show up later with artificial harmony, oh boy, did that get embedded somewhere. And usually it comes out when there's a tiff or a disagreement or, you know, all that baggage starts rising and shooting out because Pandora's box can only remain closed for so long. You can only stuff, stuff, stuff, stuff for a certain amount of time.

Matt:

And I don't even think it's like you said, I don't think it's stuffed. You know, actually, was it yesterday? Yesterday when I was trying to tell you something and you were so overloaded with all the stuff with the kids' homework and everything. And I came to tell you something, and you were like, Come on, let me let's go. And I got offended that you were rushing me and I took offense and I felt hurt because it didn't meet my needs for sort of care and respect, let's say. And I you came as I was walking back downstairs, you said, Ah, you know, I'm just having a really hard or something like that. And I just kept walking past you. Like I I nodded, I think, and I walked down, but I was feeling hurt and upset. And I got down to the step of the basement, and I said, I'm now holding on to hurt, which feels really heavy and uncomfortable in my body. There's a disconnection between us. And I at the moment didn't feel compassion for you. But I knew that I was feeling so I was doing it for me. I was like, hey, this is heavy in my body. I'm actually taking on weight. This is not helping me. This is actually hurting me, regardless of how it impacts you. So I went back upstairs and I said, Matt, all you gotta do is guess how she was, give her a little bit of empathy and see what happens. And I said, Oh, Alona, are you feeling overloaded and just needing a little more ease and support right now? And you looked at me and you were like, Oh, yes. It's it's uh, I just can't, I mean, there's just so much. I don't even know how I'm fitting it in right now. And I'm you know, sorry I came at you hot, you know, or whatever it was. And I felt so at that point I felt compassion for you and all of that heaviness left my body. So even if you think you're just putting a lid on it, you're putting a lid on something that's boiling underneath.

Alona:

Oh, absolutely. And it that's what I'm saying. It never you never actually put the lid on it, you just temporarily file it away, right? You know, and if it didn't come out then, then the next time, let's say I got hot, all of a sudden it's not just that time that you're coming back at me with, you're coming back with all of that stuff that you filed away under Alona Gets Hot, you know? And and all of that comes back up. And so something that might seem like a small argument suddenly explodes into this big thing because of all the things that we don't feel comfortable addressing. And I think the gift is a beautiful tool to really allow addressing issues in the moment, even if it's not in the exact moment, you know, close in in proximity to the actual event, so that you're not holding on to that.

Matt:

Yes. And that's the key is this is not about being nice to the other person or doing it for the other person, although the gift is to some extent how you receive the gift. But what what just giving you a little of empathy was helping my body, regardless of whether it helped you. So if you're not, if you don't have the energy or the goodwill to do it for the other person, do it for yourself.

Alona:

And that was a beautiful thing that you gave me empathy, but the gift is really about hey, if I share with you, yeah, I have a gift, but I just but that's saying what we'll learn about the the specifics about the gift.

Matt:

I don't think you had capacity in that moment to hear a gift. Gift of a gift. Oh no. So I think part of the gift isn't right is saying, hey, I have a gift. Are you ready? So maybe we get in what the gift is.

Alona:

Yes.

Matt:

So the gift is is is basically saying, I have some unmet needs, and I would like to tell you about it so that you can be aware of my needs, and maybe you can help meet my needs more effectively in the future.

Alona:

And can I say that, add to that? It it really is about sharing the impact of somebody's behavior or words on you that led to unmet needs. Hey, you know, uh, can I share a gift with you when this happened? This is how I felt.

Matt:

Right. And sharing your needs, sharing your unmet needs, you know, is some for some people they'll be confused. Like, why is that? How is that a gift? You're telling something. In fact, our girls will ask us that, we'll say, Dad, why do you like gifts? Your kids, you know, are telling you something that you did that they didn't like. And it's funny, they use that language. They don't say, you know, you're doing something that you did wrong, Dad. Right. So even then they sort of trained to say it that way, but they're it's unusual. Right. And I said there's two things. I said, one is that it means that this relationship really matters to you. So it matters enough that you're coming to me and letting me know. And then two is teaching me how to love you in a way that works even better for you. I want to love you. I love you so much. Now you're telling me how to love you even better. I think that that if you think about it, that builds so much trust that there's at any point when they say I have a gift, it sets the table that they're about to to tell you something because they love you and because the relationship matters so much.

Alona:

Yes. And to receive it as a gift also because there is an ideal way that I want to show up in this world. And I fall short of that more than I would like, you know, but the gift helps me get closer to that ideal because it gives me an opportunity to reflect on a behavior that I exhibited that negatively impacted somebody else. Exactly. And what opportunity did I have to share even my displeasure in a way that landed better for them. Right. So it's not about stifling yourself either. It's about how do you share how you're feeling while still holding the impact that it can have on another person with care.

Matt:

Right. And that's the key, is that you're doing both. Yes. A lot of times when we tell someone we don't like, we're basically telling them how we think we're telling them how bad they are, and we're hoping they repent and that we can forgive them.

Alona:

Yes.

Matt:

That's the antithesis of a gift.

Alona:

Right. It's almost like forgiveness is an easy out, you know. Oh, I forgive you, or will you forgive me? What does that even mean? You know, that I I'm not gonna change, but in this moment, we'll just forget almost about what I did. That's how a lot of things are. Sometimes that's what it sounds like.

Matt:

That's the extent, and that's why I notice when people s hold on to anger, when our kids will stay angry, it's as if if they think that all they're gonna get is a sorry, it's not enough. Yes. It's not they don't it doesn't capture the pain that they've experienced well enough. So they want to hold out so that you really feel it. Oh, yes, and that you get that gives them the empathy that they need, and that gives them a chance of really mattering, that that this really matters, and that gives them the chance a little bit of predictability that maybe it won't happen again if they if this really is a big deal to you. So so that holding out, you can let them know. In fact, the gift you're about to talk about.

Alona:

Yes, it is I'm feeling it deep inside still.

Matt:

Yeah, well, and that's you probably need a little empathy too. You need a little empathy. So the rest of my life for that one. But uh, but what I said to Kylie is I said, Kylie, we can continue not, you know, not speaking to somebody. And I think the reason the need you're trying to meet is because you want that pain that you're experiencing to really matter and you want it to be held. But if somebody says sorry, it feels like it goes by too quickly. So, what if mom is able to hold that pain with you for longer than just saying sorry? Would that feel good? And she said yes. And then she came down and gave you the gift.

Alona:

So if you've been listening to us for a while, you know we get a lot of questions about what to do in tricky parenting or relationship moments.

Matt:

Yeah, and if if I'm being real, I'm asking Alona those same questions all the time. I get into those same tricky moments as everybody else does. And as much as we wish we could be there for each other in those exact moments, we just can't always be.

Alona:

Yeah, that's why we partnered with the amazing team at Connectin' to create something we truly believe in. An AI coach called Amari. And we didn't just lend our names, we helped build it and train it and brought in everything we've learned about emotional healing, connection, and communication.

Matt:

Yeah, we've spent years training and learning, and we've created Amari who is so calm and grounded, listens deeply and responds with warmth, clarity, and compassion. There's no judgment, no reactivity. In fact, we tasked our children with trying to get Amari reactive, and they still haven't succeeded. It's just steady support when you need it most.

Alona:

We use it ourselves all the time, especially when we feel stuck or overwhelmed. And Amari's really helped us pause, reflect, given us insight that helps us come back to each other.

Matt:

Yeah, we designed Amari to help you strengthen the relationships that matter most, starting with the one you have with yourself.

Alona:

And we are so excited that you can try it now at weebarents.com and click on we be connecting with a K to sign up. And when you have your Amari moment, please let us know as we'd love to hear about it.

Matt:

So before we do the gift, should we talk about the steps of the gift? Or do you want to go into the gift and then do the steps?

Alona:

Yeah, maybe we go into it and then stairs. Here we go. Okay, this is a doozy for me. Oh, I'm like feeling flushed.

Matt:

All right, and your holiday, you know, we should name that too, though, that maybe there's a part of you that's nervous to share that on a podcast, a parenting podcast, because there's this, you know, almost this idea of competence is means you don't ever make mistakes versus competence to me is when you make mistakes, you become aware of them and you repair them and you change and try and do better.

Alona:

You know, it's funny. It's like I don't, I, I don't expect the listeners to think that I do everything perfectly and I definitely fall short. Speaking of yourself, I I said I, I, I you too, but I, but but the uh I think this one just because it rocked my own integrity, and that is gonna sit with me for a very long time. You know, that it's not other people's judgment of me, but my own judgment of myself. Like I fell so short of my own integrity um and the way that I want to show up in the world. But uh, so Kylie and I were dry, so we had just moved and we're getting everything situated. And last minute she remembered that she needed something from the store. And so I'm heading out with her and Jordan, and she is in a mood. And I should have known right then and there to disengage and take, you know, take a beat, like take that pause, but I did not. I stepped in it with her and we just started bickering and going at it, and it escalated and escalated and escalated, and we're driving. And you know, we haven't we hadn't gotten that far from the house yet, but it she turns to me and she's like, Let me out of the car. And I said, You want out of the car? Fine. And I pulled off the side of the road and I said, Get out. And she got out. And I started driving ahead, and I'm like, you know, at the maybe like a centimeter or two, I the car moved, and I'm like, oh my God, what did I do? I just dropped my daughter off in the middle of the road. She's like, Yes, she's two blocks from home, but we just moved. This is a new environment. Is she gonna find her way? And I can't believe I dropped her off with all these cars here. Somebody's gonna pick her up. And so I'm trying to turn around, but traffic is blocked and right in front of us. I'm like, oh my God, oh my god. And so I turned around and then uh I picked her. I I turned the car around. I'm standing in front of her. I'm like, Kylie, get in the car. And she didn't want to get in the car. And you know, cars are coming behind us. I'm like, somebody's gonna hit us from behind. You better get in the car. So she gets in the car reluctantly, closes the door, and will not look at me. And I get it, you know, I don't want to look at myself. I can't believe I did that. And so I it was quiet for a beat, and then I I immediately shared my regret. Not an I'm sorry, but I cannot believe I did that. And I so regret, you know, showing up that way. And even if I'm that mad at you, there are so many other strategies never want to do that one again. You know, but she was so hurt and I imagine, like so scared and hurt and shocked, I think. And so I got the silent treatment, and basically, I think the only thing she said to me was she turned to me and said, I'm never speaking to you ever again. And I was like, Okay. And so we get home and there's a silent treatment, and I don't know, it was dinner, and after dinner, I'm sure I know that she talked to you in between, but after dinner, she need she started doing homework. And so all of a sudden she's asking me questions about her homework, and then she looks at me and totally stone, you know, stonefaced. She's like, I'm not supposed to be talking to you, and turns away. And then I I think you guys talked for a little bit, and she came back, and she was teary, and she said, I have a gift for you, and then she shared with me how she felt, you know, through that experience. And it that one happened to be easy because I was there with her, but I was one really grateful for her authenticity, two, really grateful to have the space to hear her and be in that pain with her, you know, and it was hard because I stimulated that pain. You know, and even though she was not an innocent bystander in the actual conflict, that did not justify for me the strategy that I chose. So it I'm not like and and I'm making that point because I don't want parents to think, well, you know, they can get away with any behavior and and the impact that they leave on me doesn't matter. It does, it absolutely does. But also the choices that we make in response and how we we do respond matters too. And so in that moment when she was sharing that with me, it was it really was a gift to be able to acknowledge the impact that that had on her. And uh when I did that and I shared with her how I could imagine how scared she was and how shocked and and hurt, um, she I she softened and started crying um and gave me a really big hug. And so I know that she felt that deep in her core too. Yeah.

Matt:

How are you doing before we jut dive into that? I think it's good to check your system. How are you feeling now? Like after sharing that story, what's coming up for you?

Alona:

Yeah, I mean, now we're making jokes about it, you know, but like I I I'm grateful for the gift. And it's for me that will always be a pain point, you know, that because I really fell short, I like I said, of my own integrity and care for my daughter and integrity in how I want to show up as a mom. And it was so far from that uh for me.

Matt:

Like that consistency, that reliability, no matter how bad things get, you show up in a certain minimum.

Alona:

Yeah, and I'm here, like I'm physically here. Like for me, it was I've I physically you know left you on your own.

Matt:

Right. Um and no matter what happens, you want to always physically be there.

Alona:

Yeah.

Matt:

That's like a core value of yours.

Alona:

Yeah, and I can walk away and you know, cool off, but I'm still there. And this one felt more like an abandoning. And I don't ever want her to feel like I'm abandoning her.

Matt:

So it really wasn't integrity with your core values. Like there's a lot of leeway, but this went beyond that.

Alona:

For me, yeah.

Matt:

Yeah.

Alona:

Yeah. And it's funny because, you know, in retrospect, the girls are like, you know, that was like five seconds. I'm like, it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter if it was one second. You know, it's not about the length of time that she was starting to, you know, that she was walking on her own. It was that that happened in the first place for me.

Matt:

Right. It's like spanking a kid and it's like, well, it was very light, and still research it doesn't resonate with your values.

Alona:

There are certain things that for me, like spanking a kid, is something that I hope to God I never do. It doesn't resonate with my own values whatsoever. And this one, too, that sense of abandonment doesn't resonate with my values.

Producer:

Right.

Alona:

Yeah. So that's where uh that was my own gift to myself is like that's painful enough. Let me tell you how that impacted me, Alona.

Matt:

Um you know, but uh but I so the the part of you had to give a gift to the other part of you.

Alona:

Oh, yes. And there's many parts of me gave a gift to that one part of me. But yeah.

Matt:

Right. That one part that was feeling frustrated and needing a little bit of relief and accountability, maybe for Kylie's words when she was like letting you off and uh you know, sort of laying into you, and like there's no repercussion or impact on those. You know, treating a mom like you can do it like a punching bag, like you can do whatever you want with them. And there's a part of you that's like, that's not okay. And at the same time, there's another part that's like, even if that's not okay, yes, it's not an integrity. We we want to show up differently. We don't want to let that person determine how we show up.

Alona:

Right. Because the tr I think that was the triggering point, is you know, I they know that I don't want them to hurt. Right. And sometimes it feels like there's uh they will test the boundaries of that because oh, mom won't, mom won't X, Y, and Z. I can say, throw me out of the car. Mom would never do that. You know, I can say Now we know though. Right. Now they know, don't say that. But you know, that moment of like you just can't treat me like that and then throw that at me, and there's no consequence to it. You know, but at the same time, there are many things that I could have done, like turn the car around and take her back home. Right. You know, which would have been an integrity and still would have met my need for that boundary. So, yes. So, regardless of what comes at me, I want to hope that I can still show up in the way that I want to, in integrity with my own values.

Matt:

And the gift allows healing for her heart and allowing you to repair as well. So it's also a very good tool for repair and healing. In fact, Kylie now, I don't get the sense she holds any pain. I think you hold more pain than she does around that. For her, you know, she she was shocked and hurt at it in the moment, but now she jokes about it. And it's something that she's able to talk about without it creating that pain, which to me means that it integrated versus something we can't talk about because it was so traumatic and scarring that she just sort of buries it.

Alona:

Well, here's the thing though, right? I and that's a blessing to me. I have built enough trust with her that that impact did not scar her. But if she and I didn't have that trust, if we had a rocky relationship and that was one more thing, then I don't know. You know, it's not to take for granted that people will just get over your impact.

Matt:

Yeah, it's not like a free pass to hacked without care.

Alona:

But you know, I think the gift you you named it, and I think one of the things that the gift does also is it'll it really sh in that moment it showed her you matter so much, and I want to hear, I can hear all of the pain that was stimulated for me.

Matt:

Right, and we can I can hold space for you.

Alona:

Yes, and I can hold space for you.

Matt:

Because that's the key with the gift is I'm gonna just focus on your pain and hold space. Apologizing is about me, not the not the gift. So if I start going to apologizing, I'm trying to already get forgiveness, which is about my knees. Right. And the person that was hurt wants you to stay with their knees. The gift allows you and gives you some structure to do that.

Alona:

Right.

Matt:

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Alona:

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Matt:

So maybe we can go over the steps. The nice thing about this, though, is because I get to use this myself. So when the kids get mad at me for like forgetting to pick them up at school, I can be like, but at least I never drop you off on the side of the run. So now I have that house back to it. So it's really been helpful to me. It's been a gift for me.

Alona:

Yes, yes. Very funny. You get one, I have ten.

Matt:

Yes, yes, oh wait, well, save that for another episode. All this stuff that I've done.

Alona:

Well, to get in there a little deeper, man. No, I'm just teasing.

Matt:

Yeah. They laugh. I was like, mom feel they're all like, yeah, mom feels worse than anybody. There he is. Like, we're good.

Alona:

Yes.

Matt:

Anyway. So yeah, let's go over the the steps. I think that would be really really helpful. I'm just looking over the the core insights that we I think these are you let's let's actually do a couple of the insights first that we wrote down before. Does that work for you? And then we can go into the practice. So I'm gonna read them and then you tell me if you have any thoughts on them. Okay. So one is that feedback, feedback is an act of love, not an attack.

Alona:

And I think that's really valid because I think um so often feedback is threatening, especially if it's a critique, you know, constructive criticism or an opportunity or, you know, a a space for growth. People see that, people take that personally. Oh, I'm not good enough. I'm not showing I'm not a good parent, I'm not a good wife. Otherwise, you wouldn't have to tell me to do better. Versus, I think feedback, if you see it as a gift, is our opportunity to ever evolve as people, which I know you and I are very committed to doing.

Matt:

Yeah. And when somebody gives you feedback in words that sound very much like an attack, you can choose to translate those words.

Alona:

Right. So or give them a gift back. You know, give them that gift.

Matt:

But I think when someone is saying this is our opportunity, and I like to this empowers me that I don't have to wait for someone else to learn nonviolent communication to already share nonviolence in how I hear, and that gives them no choice but to respond differently. If I get defensive versus do I translate? So if it's like, hey, like the example, hey, when you were, you know, telling me to move along, move along, were you just feeling really overloaded? You know, versus uh, or if or if hearing the attack the other way would be like dad, you you're always late when you pick when you come to pick me up. And be like, oh, is it you're feeling you know feeling really frustrated? So what I'm hearing is their frustration because they need more reliability and predictability around time. And also keeping agreements and trust. If I said, hey, I'm gonna be there. So instead of hearing like I'm a bad dad because I'm I'm always late, I'm hearing that they're needing more trust and more reliability. And that feels more like a gift than there's something wrong with me. So I think that gives us an opportunity to translate that. Next one would be defensiveness protects the ego.

Alona:

Can I just say one more thing about that? I think the more you could practice the gift, the more comfortable feedback will be. Because also I think because people anticipate how feedback will be it's kind of like a cycle, right? A vicious cycle. Because people anticipate how feedback will be received, they brace for how they're coming. Yeah to say, and sometimes it sputters out in a more aggressive way because it's uncomfortable versus if it were comfortable, like the gift. You know, when the girls first started giving the gift, they weren't quite so comfortable because they didn't trust the process yet. Oh, I'm gonna tell them something I didn't like. How are they gonna take it? Now it's very comfortable to then say, ooh, I have a gift for you.

Matt:

Exactly. And now they're pretty sure that we're gonna get excited about it.

Alona:

Right.

Matt:

So um let's see, let's look at the list just so we because I think from time we should probably depart. Any any of the other core insights that you really want to share?

Alona:

Um unmet needs aren't always conflict. They're invitations to be seen. And I think that's really important, is that oftentimes our hurt is because we're not seen for our good intentions or we feel like we were not seen or we're not understood. And so sharing what needs went unmet is that gift. It doesn't have to become a conflict. It's not you did anything wrong, just the strategies that were employed didn't really meet these needs.

Matt:

Right. That's the key. That's the key. And I love this other one. Children learn how to love by watching us, by watching how we repair. That it's it's not what we say, it's what we model, it's what we practice.

Alona:

Yes.

Matt:

And and I like this too, the body hears tone before it hears words. So it's all about the setup and how you're, you know, you're communicating not just by the words, but by your facial expressions, by the softening of your face, by the the sound of your the tone, the pace, all that stuff.

Alona:

Absolutely. You know, you and you've heard it, I'm sure you've heard it in our own tones, but we're saying something, the words are very nice, but the tone is very clear that we are unhappy. Please pick up that plate.

Matt:

Yeah.

Alona:

You know, and it's clear you're not happy, even though you said please.

Matt:

That's that happened to me a lot. That happened this morning with you when you came in. And I'm like, what do you need?

Alona:

Yes. And you're like, Hello to you too.

Matt:

Yeah, but hello. And I was just busy working and you're standing there thinking, and I it's gonna, you know, do I need to stop? Are you gonna go? What do you what do you need? Right. But it could have been my tone came out because I'm intensely focused, and my tone came out a certain way, even though my intention. So I think that's because with a smile, hey, what do you need? Right.

Alona:

Very benign, right? Welcoming.

Matt:

Exactly. So the tone is so important, and sometimes we don't even mean there to be a tone that happens to be there, so we can help by checking.

Alona:

This last one is important too. I know time is an issue, but receiving a gift doesn't mean agreeing, it means staying connected. And I think that's important that parents understand that just because they're receiving a gift doesn't mean they agree with the situation or condone what their child did to get them triggered in the first place.

Matt:

Right. It's not about right or wrong. Right. That's later. It's just now about helping the part heal.

Alona:

Yes.

Matt:

So the gift, the steps. The first step is very important. And this is assuming we're, you know, you're gonna explain how the the gift works, and they're gonna set it up with the kids. But assuming everybody's on board with the gift, the first step is when somebody says, I have a gift, you check in, and if you can't get excited that you're about to get a gift, like if somebody says, I have a present for you, here's a new car, you're gonna be excited. That's the excitement you want to get when somebody's about to give you a gift like this. And I'll say, Oh my god, I'm so excited. I haven't gotten a gift in a long time. I really want a gift. Let me sit down so I can really savor it. So they just know, or I'll say, you know what, I don't really have space for a gift right now, but I'm gonna write it down and circle back with you after dinner when my brain has more space for a gift. So it's very important that you get super excited about a gift.

Alona:

Yes. In fact, and this doesn't have to be the parents' listening strategy, but the strategy that we used to up the ante was if you give me a gift and I am not either excited to receive it or put a time where I will be excited to receive it, you will get $10 every single time. And the idea was we didn't want to fork over $10. So we were also going to practice either being receptive to that gift or creating a time, checking back in on a time where we were going to hear it with um, you know, acceptance and and enthusiasm around it.

Matt:

And to me, that was different than punishment. That was about making gamifying it. Yes. And creating uh yeah, like it really feels like a game like gambling or something like that.

Alona:

And the kids are a win-win. Either I give them a gift and they receive it, or I got ten dollars. So the kids are very low weight. Yeah, either way they win.

Matt:

Which is important when they're a little nervous at first. And they're building trust. So then once they you say I have a gift, then they're gonna tell you all about what's bothering them. And your job is to hear what's bothering them and if you can reflect it back, or if you can, you know, for effective listening, or you can even guess at the feelings and needs that they're sharing. So if uh Jordan says to me, Dad, you know, you said that you were gonna play with me and then you were gonna do something real quick, but then you got distracted and you weren't down for another 20 minutes. I might immediately want to go to defensiveness, which includes explaining myself. And that is not what you do right here. You stay with their pain. And we use the term pain loosely, it's not just physical pain. And and and I would say, Yeah, Jordy, thank you so much for this gift. Super wonderful. I'm so excited to get this. This is wonderful. And then I'll say, Jordan, I'm hearing that you're feeling disappointed and frustrated, and maybe even a little bit angry because my words and what I actually did were not congruent. And that's not meeting needs for trust, and then ultimately care, and then maybe even mattering, like our time together doesn't matter. And maybe you because of all those needs, you're feeling hurt and sad and disappointed and frustrating. Is that what's going on for you, Jordy? And just say, Yeah. And I'll say, Is there more? Yeah, maybe you're feeling a little angry too, and she'll say, Yeah, yeah, I'm feeling or she'll say, No, I'm not angry, Dad. I'm just hurt. Like, okay. I get it. Well, thank you so much for telling me. So now I heard what was going on. Notice how I didn't apologize or explain myself. Then I'll say, Hey, did I get it all? They'll say yes, and and then I'll say, Well, can I share my reaction? That's the next step. And I'll say, My reaction is one, and I always reinforce, one, I'm so happy you gave me the gift. And two, my so I'm feeling happy that you gave me a gift, and then two, I'm feeling regret. This is where you can explain your regret. That I really wish I showed up differently. I really wish that I came down, or if something distracted me, I had consideration for you to tell you before I engage that new activity. So I'm still not explaining what happened. I'm just sharing my regret and how I wished I handled it differently, knowing what I know now. So that's the next step. And then I'll say, Geordie, how does it feel? Or what's your so I always want to make sure I'm staying connected with them. Jordan, what's your reaction when you hear that? I'm just like, oh, thanks, Dad. So I make sure it landed. And I can not just what she says, but her face will soften. And then at that point, I'll say, Do you have space to hear the needs I was trying to meet when I did what I did? And sh maybe she'll say yes, maybe no. She says yes, I'll say, you know what I was trying to do is I I saw this thing that I had to get done real quick, and then this thing that I forgot to do, and I thought I'd do it real fast, and I'm always forgetting about time, and I think it's going to be five minutes, and it turns out it's 20 minutes, and I lost track of time, and and then I reinforce that even though it doesn't excuse that I meant, you know, it's not like I'm saying this is okay. I just want you to see the needs I was trying to meet and the struggles that I had, separate from the fact that I still wish I did it differently. So this way I have a chance to be seeing my good intentions, even though I would have liked to have done it differently. Right. So that's the next step is share the needs I was trying to meet. And then I'll ask her, I'll say, Hey, can you tell me back what you're hearing? Or what's how do you feel when you hear that? She'll tell me back what she's hearing, or she'll just say, Yeah, Dad, I feel like I get it. I get that. So she's able to see me then. But she can only see me after her pain has been heard and she's trusts my regret. So that's the key. When you go in and say sorry early on, you're not going to be heard because they're busy trying to have their pain heard. They can't hear your, you know, they can't hear about you.

Alona:

Right.

Matt:

But if you do these steps, then they can hear about you. So apologizing or explaining yourself now it works.

Alona:

Yes. I love that. And what I love about it is it's not a performance. You're really truly engaged and appreciative of this gift. It's not permissive parenting because you're not in agreement with it. You're just in that space with them, providing that empathy for them to be seen and heard. And it gives you an opportunity to share your truth, which is after they have been heard, after you have expressed your regret about not about what was said, but about how it was said, about how it landed or, you know, the impact that it had. Then you share where, you know, what was coming up for you in that situation.

Matt:

Yeah. And that to me is so there's different types of interactions where your gifts works. So there's where I just sort of fell short. There's also where they did something that stimulated a reaction. So sometimes I might they might say something that doesn't meet my need for respect. And if I yell back at them with disrespect, I'm still gonna hear the gift about how my yelling landed on them. Right. Do all that, and at the end, after I've empathized with the pain of my yelling, then I'll say, Hey, can you also have space to hear, you know, what came up for me when I was yelling? Which was my need for respect, wasn't that? And my body said, Hey, stand up for yourself and and make sure they realize this is not okay. And I was doing that through yelling. But does that and then I asked them to, you know, but you see, I I tend to that afterwards, so it's not permissive, it's just timing.

Alona:

Exactly.

Matt:

So bringing this home, the key is to say, Hey, I want to try these new things called gifts. We use when we first started, we do it at bedtime. And I would always say before bedtime, I would say, Hey, think about today. Anything I did, any gifts, I want to practice getting gifts. And then they'll say, Oh, I don't have anything. I'll be like, What are you talking about? You don't, I couldn't, I didn't do anything today that didn't meet your needs. What about dinner when I was like not paying attention to you because I was on my phone? Oh yeah, Dad, that's right. I was trying to tell you about school and you were on your phone. Oh, sounds like you got a gift. I'm excited. Okay, here we go. And then they start.

Alona:

Yes.

Matt:

And when and that's so really making time to practice that and explaining what it is beforehand, which is hey, you're gonna tell me what you what I did or said that you didn't enjoy. And I'm going to hear it, and we're gonna repair, and I'm gonna show you how it feels, and you're gonna try it out so you can explain it and then try it out within. So I think that that's really important is to discuss it, tell them you're doing it, and then set the stage when you're ready to do ready to do it.

Alona:

And I think always modeling it too, so parents can give each other gifts, yes, in front of the kids. And I also think, you know, you might not want to use money as your strategy to build that trust. It could be, hey, you know, some like our kids love board games. So, okay, if I, you know, if I don't receive the gift, I will play the board game with you for 20 minutes, or I'll, you know, they want to go out to the park or they want to do something sp special that's kind of been bounced off for a while. Right.

Matt:

Or they get to choose, you know, the next event on Saturday afternoon.

Alona:

Right. Something, something that um just bridges that, that invites it in and feels like a win for them. Because if they don't have that trust, it's gonna be hard for them to come with a gift. Because the gift is not gonna always sound so beautiful. It could be, hey, you know, that really hurt my feelings, or you were mean, or whatever that sounds like. And and if we are receiving a gift, we have to have the capacity and space to not only be enthusiastic about it to but to be able to translate that, oh, that landed really early.

Matt:

And that is the key is to practice translating. But I'm telling you, if you do this, you're still gonna get your needs to be heard and met later, and it's gonna work so much better. And then you're gonna build this trust with them that's invaluable. It's like investing in your 401k of your relationship.

Alona:

That's exactly it. You build the trust, you build the trust to be able to give them the feedback at the end of it as well, and for them to be able to receive it. And here's the other part of the valuable, you know, both our girls are entering teen, Kyla's already a teenager, Jordan's almost there. And I hear from so many parents, I don't even know who this kid is anymore. They don't talk to me, they don't share anything with me. It's like they're living in my house, but not living here, you know? And I don't get that feeling from our daughters ever. And I think part of that is how many times I know myself when I was a teenager, how many times did I say in my head, oh, I really don't like my parents, or I hate my parents, or they're they make me so mad, but it was not something that I could share with them. So I held it alone. And I held it alone by creating distance. Right. So the ability to, it's not that your kids are gonna love everything that you do just because they're not sharing it with you doesn't mean they love everything you do. They're afraid to share it with you. Exactly. So giving them the space to share it with you actually brings them closer to you.

Matt:

Yes. If you're not getting gifts and your kids aren't telling you something they don't like, then they're suppressing. Right. You know, it's like it's like the um it happens a lot where people will think, oh, everything's great.

Alona:

Yes, it's an illusion to take silence for happiness.

Matt:

Yeah. Yeah. I would be mining for those gifts.

Alona:

Yes.

Matt:

And I think modeling those in front of the kids and telling the kids, hey, I'm gonna do a gift for mom. Are you ready? Do you want to see? Or I'm gonna I'm gonna ask mom. I think mom has a gift for me because earlier today I said, what do you need? And had tone with mom. And I don't think it I think it stimulated some hurt. So let's get, and even if mom doesn't have a lot of hurt or it's not really a big deal, it's great to practice those in front of the kids.

Alona:

Yes. And sometimes it's even better to start practicing them on things that are low weight, you know, versus something that was really Yeah.

Matt:

So you can even make them up. We call those fire drills, where I'll say fire drills, where I'll say, Alona, you know, pretend I did this, and then in front of the kids, hey, I did this, and you know, I'm gonna give mom a gift. Right. Or I did this and I'm gonna ask mom if she has a gift. Really good practice.

Alona:

Yes.

Matt:

All right, all right. So hit us with one last thing, Alona. After all of that show, thank you, by the way, for sharing vulnerably about your experience. I think it's so important. There's so many people doing all sorts of stuff at home, and they have these inner critics going and they keep it hidden to allow the shame to fester. And shame grows in silence. And I think we all could use a little bit of support for each other.

Alona:

Yeah. There is no problem. I mean, this is how the reason that I'm here talking is because of all the mistakes that I've made and learned from along the way. Yeah.

Matt:

You know, if you're not making mistakes, you're not trying hardness.

Alona:

Yeah, really. Maybe that's the one last thing. Uh no, but you know what? I think the one last thing for me is the gratitude for the gift as an opportunity to build connection and create such a deeper and stronger relationship with anybody that is involved in that dynamic, whether it's you or the girls or my mom or whoever.

Matt:

Love it. All right. Well, everybody, thank you for listening today. Please rate and review the episode. Subscribe if you haven't already. Share this with all of your friends. Helps get the word out. We really appreciate the support.

Alona:

Absolutely. And if you have any questions or you have a topic that you'd like us to discuss, please email us at parents at we beatogether.com. That's parents at weebtogether.com.

Matt:

We should probably tell people that we're rebranding under we be together. So look for that.

Alona:

New name.

Matt:

I have it. Awesome. All right. Well, thank you, everybody.

Alona:

Bye. Thanks, everyone. Bye.